Looking over the ManUFan list it strikes me that perhaps it is lacking in alternate win-con/instant-win payoff for generating infinite green.
You're in great shape with: 1) Chord of Calling in hand 2) Eternal Witness in hand with Chord in yard 3) Duskwatch Recruiter in hand with EWit in library and Chord in yard (and I'm sure other ways to get to Kiki-Resto). Perhaps shaving a Fiery Justice in favor of the one of the usual instant-win buttons accessible via Recruiter from Counters Company builds e.g Rhonas or Ballista? Just to add another angle of attack? Ballista can even pinch-hit as a limited board wipe to mitigate the loss of a Fiery Justice.
When goldfishing the list it sure its satisfying to get that Blood Moon out there and keep on trucking'...
I haven't personally tried Damping Sphere in the deck. I would be careful with how many copies you SB in any version of the deck. Drawing 2 against Tron probably slows us down too much to kill them before they naturally start casting their threats.
Hey all, it's been a while since I posted, I have been at college and am only just undusting my old kiki cards. I been grinding with the bant shell and have been extremely impressed! The mana is much smoother, but I truly think that coiling oracle is a huge gain for this deck. The games where a land is flipped on turn 2 convert to a much higher winrate, especially when off of a bird you can deploy another 2 drop. Sequencing hierarch into oracle and voice is your most powerful setup. I started at 2 jace, moved to 1, and have now completely cut the planeswalker. As powerful as he is, I have found that your ability to stabilize at this point of the game is not improved terribly, while having a ton of 4 drops has continued clunkiness. My current build is here: https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/bant-kiki-4/?cb=1527564835
I have tried to lower the curve substantially, relying on tireless tracker for midrange value. My list and board are skewed for a burn and storm heavy meta, as well as a decent amount of jund. I have not tested damping sphere yet, but have found the tron and storm matchups to be better with the blue heavy build.
Last FNM report:
Game 1 - BW Tokens - Win
This mathup was pretty trivial. I win game 1 by quickly setting up tracker plus courser, a timely path for gideon and then winning with chord for resto eot chord for kiki in upkeep. Game 2 we are in a boardstall in which I am drawing 3+ cards a turn with tracker, restos and oracles. I grind out a win by ewitting an overgrown tomb to play my pontiff and swing for lethal.
Game 2 - Dredge - Loss
Game 1 I mull to 6 on the play. I have hierarch into scooze, he sacks neonite in response, dredges an imp into a thug and imp. I pass in case a conflagrate is dredged, he dredges over 2, I scoop quickly after. Game 2 I mull to 5, keep a solid hand with razorverge, hierarch, island, courser, resto. He has darkblast for the hierarch and I scoop after missing land 3.
Game 3 - Grixis Shadow - Win
Game 1 he only ever finds 1 threat which I am able to path. We trade 1 for 1 until he dies to resto beats. Game 2 an eot chord draws his stub and I untap and play out EE to kill 3 DS.
Game 4 - Storm - Win
Game 1 I lose t4. Had a very kiki chord hand, not much to say. Game 2 he keeps a hand that is very all in on blood moon, I have basic plains in my opener. Am able to steal the game of the back of multiple restos as he struggles to shape his hand. Game 3 I have evo for eidolon on 3, he has the blood moon again, yet once again I have basic plains and am able to kill him with Restos.
Overall was pretty happy to be chording again. I want to try out mystic snake, and possibly try to squeeze in a shalai somewhere. Would love to hear yall's thoughts on the list!
Put this together and was a bit surprised as I think it's 61 cards?
Still, it's a fun list =)
Of note:
I'm seeing a bunch of good 4-mana targets for eldritch evolution but no evolution in the deck. It definitely feels like this build was designed with that card in mind but then it was removed at the last minute. I played with the deck last night and it was actually very good, but i do feel you'd benefit strongly from one or two evolution (I ran one in the sideboard to bring in where the toolbox hate-creatures were more important).
Chainwhirler was good though. As was magus of the moon.
Hi all, im looking into building kiki chord, and i was wondering the merits of splashing blue versus splashing black and how this deck handles tron, it seems like on of the tougher match-ups, i saw that people were saying blue had a decent match-up but what about black or just regular naya
I have played both versions and agree that the bant version (which is different than naya splashing blue obviously for anyone confused) has a better tron matchup against tron. Getting access to more instant speed threats is surprisingly powerful against many of their threats, especially karn. Furthermore, it is an age-old myth imo that blood moon is good against blood moon. Mono green tron is very resilient to moon (see emma handy's article on SCG http://www.starcitygames.com/articles/37455_Understanding-Moderns-Top-Tier.html) and I would much rather try to keep them off a few key spells with counterspells while I work towards combo then try to go all in on blood moon then lose to a turn 5 cracked oblivion stone.
After going to my new lgs to learn what the meta is there, i mainly noticed a lot of mid-range and control, so what would you say is some of the better creatures in that type of meta, ive mainly been looking at creatures such as thragtusk and the like, but i have about 3 more slots to fill with utility creatures, im playing bant while splashing black, any suggestions would be greatly appreciated
Hey, guys! Just started testing out this list after seeing Hoogland play something similar to pretty good effect. Seems hella fun, and has a bunch of different vectors to attack on, so I'll keep testing, and if you guys have any feedback, I'd love to hear it!
Actually, Blood Moon is good vs Tron. Problem is it just slows them down, but it doesn't stop them. They'll eventually get rid of it, or just ignore it and hard cast their unbeatable threats anyways. So, just playing Blood Moon isn't enough. You need to beat them as fast as possible after deploying the Moon. It does buy you a reasonable time, however.
I think that you'll find reveillark is pretty underpowered. In the current metagame its pretty lackluster against most of the top decks, and your particular list doesn't optimize it (lack of Pia and Kiran, more 3 power creatures in Finks, Rallier, Chainwhirler, instead of coursers and orzhov pontiff). I love the card though so if you think it is worth the spot, definitely keep it. Lastly I have found 4 tutors to be slightly clunky, and when on the full 4 chords I usually trim an evolution. Drawing evolution in multiples can be good, but often if your hand is too flush with chord and evolution, you lack the requisite creature board to actually utilize them. In the board I think you may want some number of damping sphere, most likely in place of cards like loaming shaman. I think graveyard hate is important, but shaman is wayyyyyy too slow to play in impact in a matchup like hollow one most games. Lastly, this one is pure preference, but in a world where humans and hollow one are prevalent decks, I much rather see paths in my hand than bolts. As always, this is all my ideas on an archetype that is all about personal preferences and metagame reads so take it with a grain of salt!
Has anyone tried a BGR kiki chord decklist, and dropped white entirely?
We lose some of our hate, but pickup things like Inquisition and now Assassin's Trophy. The quality of BG creatures has been going up as well. Combo pieces can be 1x each of combat celebrant and zealous conscripts. I've been searching around for a creature toolbox deck after being dissatisfied with the control options in my naya kiki chord, and thought exploring black might be the way to go.
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4 Birds of Paradise
2 Noble Hierarch
4 Devoted Druid
3 Vizier of Remedies
2 Duskwatch Recruiter
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Selfless Spirit
1 Eternal Witness
1 Kitchen Finks
1 Magus of the Moon
2 Restoration Angel
1 Shalai, Voice of Plenty
1 Pia and Kiran Nalaar
1 Avalanche Riders
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
3 Fiery Justice
4 Chord of Calling
2 Eldritch Evolution
2 Blood Moon
Land (23)
1 Copperline Gorge
1 Fire-Lit Thicket
3 Forest
2 Horizon Canopy
2 Plains
1 Razorverge Thicket
1 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
2 Temple Garden
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
1 Kitchen Finks
1 Pia and Kiran Nalaar
1 Fiery Justice
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Kataki, War's Wage
1 Loaming Shaman
2 Obstinate Baloth
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Tireless Tracker
2 Worship
You're in great shape with: 1) Chord of Calling in hand 2) Eternal Witness in hand with Chord in yard 3) Duskwatch Recruiter in hand with EWit in library and Chord in yard (and I'm sure other ways to get to Kiki-Resto). Perhaps shaving a Fiery Justice in favor of the one of the usual instant-win buttons accessible via Recruiter from Counters Company builds e.g Rhonas or Ballista? Just to add another angle of attack? Ballista can even pinch-hit as a limited board wipe to mitigate the loss of a Fiery Justice.
When goldfishing the list it sure its satisfying to get that Blood Moon out there and keep on trucking'...
Here's a rough list off the top of my head.
4 Coiling Oracle
4 Voice of Resurgence
3 Wall of Omens
2 Eternal Witness
2 Restoration Angel
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Reveillark
1 Thragtusk
1 Kambal, Consul of Allocation
1 Mystic Snake
1 Shalai, Voice of Plenty
1 Selfless Spirit
1 Qasali Pridemage
4 Chord of Calling
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Windswepth Heath
2 Flooded Strand
2 Breeding Pool
2 Temple Garden
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Overgrown Tomb
2 Forest
1 Island
1 Plains
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Celestial Colonnade
1 Gavony Township
2 Unified Will
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Stony Silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Glen Elandra Archmage
1 Burrenton-Forge Tender
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Orzhov Pontiff
1 Negate
1 Kataki, War's Wage
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Worship
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/developing-competitive-modern/598381-kiki-chord-kiki-company
Bring to Niv
https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/deck-creation-modern/814060-bring-to-niv-the-golden-deck
Legacy - Lands
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/legacy-type-1-5/established-legacy/control/535484-primer-lands
I have tried to lower the curve substantially, relying on tireless tracker for midrange value. My list and board are skewed for a burn and storm heavy meta, as well as a decent amount of jund. I have not tested damping sphere yet, but have found the tron and storm matchups to be better with the blue heavy build.
Last FNM report:
Game 1 - BW Tokens - Win
This mathup was pretty trivial. I win game 1 by quickly setting up tracker plus courser, a timely path for gideon and then winning with chord for resto eot chord for kiki in upkeep. Game 2 we are in a boardstall in which I am drawing 3+ cards a turn with tracker, restos and oracles. I grind out a win by ewitting an overgrown tomb to play my pontiff and swing for lethal.
Game 2 - Dredge - Loss
Game 1 I mull to 6 on the play. I have hierarch into scooze, he sacks neonite in response, dredges an imp into a thug and imp. I pass in case a conflagrate is dredged, he dredges over 2, I scoop quickly after. Game 2 I mull to 5, keep a solid hand with razorverge, hierarch, island, courser, resto. He has darkblast for the hierarch and I scoop after missing land 3.
Game 3 - Grixis Shadow - Win
Game 1 he only ever finds 1 threat which I am able to path. We trade 1 for 1 until he dies to resto beats. Game 2 an eot chord draws his stub and I untap and play out EE to kill 3 DS.
Game 4 - Storm - Win
Game 1 I lose t4. Had a very kiki chord hand, not much to say. Game 2 he keeps a hand that is very all in on blood moon, I have basic plains in my opener. Am able to steal the game of the back of multiple restos as he struggles to shape his hand. Game 3 I have evo for eidolon on 3, he has the blood moon again, yet once again I have basic plains and am able to kill him with Restos.
Overall was pretty happy to be chording again. I want to try out mystic snake, and possibly try to squeeze in a shalai somewhere. Would love to hear yall's thoughts on the list!
2 Eternal Witness
1 Goblin Chainwhirler
1 Huntmaster of The Fells
1 Magus of The Moon
3 Noble Hierarch
1 Qasali Pridemage
2 Restoration Angel
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Selfless Spirit
1 Tireless Tracker
4 Voice of Resurgence
1 Courser of Kruphix
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Pia and Kiran Nalaar
1 Shalai, Voice of Plenty
3 Lightning Helix
4 Path to Exile
3 Forest
1 Mountain
2 Plains
2 Arid Mesa
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Fire-Lit Thicket
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Raging Ravine
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Temple Garden
2 Stomping Ground
1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Fulminator Mage
1 Lone Missionary
1 Obstinate Baloth
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Reveillark
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Windborn Muse
2 Stony Silence
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
1 Kataki, War's Wage
2 Fiery Justice
Put this together and was a bit surprised as I think it's 61 cards?
Still, it's a fun list =)
Of note:
I'm seeing a bunch of good 4-mana targets for eldritch evolution but no evolution in the deck. It definitely feels like this build was designed with that card in mind but then it was removed at the last minute. I played with the deck last night and it was actually very good, but i do feel you'd benefit strongly from one or two evolution (I ran one in the sideboard to bring in where the toolbox hate-creatures were more important).
Chainwhirler was good though. As was magus of the moon.
Kiki Chord Facebook Group - https://www.facebook.com/groups/199307817160140/
Modern Toolbox Deck Group - https://www.facebook.com/groups/creaturetoolbox/
RBW
Mardu PyromancerR.I.P.BG The Rock
Commander
W Nahiri, the Lithomancer
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Windswept Heath
2 Temple Garden
2 Stomping Ground
1 Sacred Foundry
3 Raging Ravine
1 Fire-lit Thicket
1 Gavony Township
3 Forest
1 Plains
1 Mountain
Creatures
4 Birds of Paradise
3 Wall of Omens
2 Wall of Roots
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Qasali Pridemage
3 Voice of Resurgence
1 Magus of the Moon
1 Goblin Chainwhirler
2 Kitchen Finks
2 Eternal Witness
1 Renegade Rallier
2 Restoration Angel
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Reveillark
1 Nahiri, the Harbinger
Spells
3 Lightning Bolt
4 Eldritch Evolution
4 Chord of Calling
1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Kor Firewalker
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1 Cataclysmic Gearhulk
2 Stony Silence
2 Path to Exile
1 Celestial Purge
1 Wear/Tear
1 Fulminator Mage
1 Loaming Shaman
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Acidic Slime
Any thoughts?
RBW
Mardu PyromancerR.I.P.BG The Rock
Commander
W Nahiri, the Lithomancer
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/developing-competitive-modern/598381-kiki-chord-kiki-company
Bring to Niv
https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/deck-creation-modern/814060-bring-to-niv-the-golden-deck
Legacy - Lands
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/legacy-type-1-5/established-legacy/control/535484-primer-lands
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/developing-competitive-modern/598381-kiki-chord-kiki-company
Bring to Niv
https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/deck-creation-modern/814060-bring-to-niv-the-golden-deck
Legacy - Lands
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/legacy-type-1-5/established-legacy/control/535484-primer-lands
We lose some of our hate, but pickup things like Inquisition and now Assassin's Trophy. The quality of BG creatures has been going up as well. Combo pieces can be 1x each of combat celebrant and zealous conscripts. I've been searching around for a creature toolbox deck after being dissatisfied with the control options in my naya kiki chord, and thought exploring black might be the way to go.