You usually plays one thing each turn, a bigger each time (bird, voice, witness, chord, etc...)
when all your things get countered, you just wait and die slowly.
It's very frustrating. IMO blue is broken as ****, because you are denying every plays and win the mana war.
When you spend 2 mana to beat 4-5 mana, you can only win.
The more I play, the more I understand why the meta is very aggro based, because blue decks are so hard to beat, that you can only play a very fast consistent deck to manage them because all your things get countered and killed past turn 2-3 and you can't play anymore...
So yeah, back to the topic.
With a darwin chord/chord list, how do you beat blue decks? especially the one who plays delver of secret.
I usually do not beat counterspells. Mostly because I do not meet them. Vs the serius decks I meet that play counterspells I do not find it such a big problem.
The following goes for chord/nahiri and chord/evolution versions of the deck:
If you can stick a mana dork, you can usually resolve 2 spells on turn 3, getting you ahead. If you can land a Voice of Resrugency turn 2 (on the play) or turn 3 on a mana dork after baiting with another 2 drop you are good. The fact that your deck runs 3 to 4 Voices is a nightmare for the opposing deck.
If you have a chord or restoration angel you can usually play it eot (or during combat vs delver) this means they have to respond and tap out on their turn. Then on your turn you can make a play. Usually this play is weaker then the chord or the angel, but it does not have to be. Playing an eternal witness to get back the card they reacted to is usually pretty sweet. That being said, eldrict evolution is a very sad card vs any form of counterspell.
Depending on their winn condition you can have a lot of time. Getting cards remanded is anoying, but not terrible. I am much more scared against mana leak. If they runn 2 to 4 Cryptic Command and can loop it with snapcaster mages the game can become difficult. Especially if you are meeting the grixis version where snapcaster gives flashback to cryptic and counter/taps on the first mode and retun the mage on second mode you have problems. The same can be said for cycling kholigans command into return snapcaster mage from the gravyeard.
I general I feel that playing against counters is not so bad once you learn when to bait, when to gamle and when to attrision up. If rhewelark resolves you are generally winning the game. Scavenging Ooze can be and allstar lategame. The manlands can kill blue if they do not get a crazy delver starts.
I am asuming some form of midrange tempo deck here. And not something like monkey grow that rarly go above 2 mana cc on their spells.
If you have a friends who is playing the controll deck I would ask to borrow the deck and switch it up. Then you will know when to dodge and when to jabb so to speak.
Edit: I would say that the more instant/flash spells you have that stays on the board after you cast it, the more favorable this match is. And again, evolution is sad vs counterspells. Perhaps even side them out if there are to many of them in the opponents deck.
I am sorry for all of those of you who are tierd of sub-par builds with the following post, but I would just like to get the kink out of my brainstorming. Is it possible to do a deck with Tokens and Monestery Mentor in this deck?
A maindeck with something like this. I would not mind sleewing it up only to see it crash and burn. But I am not a good deckbuilder or tweaker so of anybody has any suggestion to the list before I do some testing on it I would apreciate it.
This is the decklist I have been playing lately. Seems to be working well.
I have seen a few builds of collective brutality in main and kind of wanting to go back to 4x chords.
I still like the split. This deck has been all over the place as of late.
Jeff did won a SCG with 4 chords, 4 path, 2 brutality and 3 bolts. (he removed the walls of omen)
What do you think about it?
While I like the 2 CB, 3 bolts without omen seems pretty cocky.
Wall is slow, CB and Bolt are proactive. Not much to say except Jeff knows his deck inside and out - nobody else could have piloted it to a number 1 spot but him.
Jeff did won a SCG with 4 chords, 4 path, 2 brutality and 3 bolts. (he removed the walls of omen)
What do you think about it?
While I like the 2 CB, 3 bolts without omen seems pretty cocky.
Wall is slow, CB and Bolt are proactive. Not much to say except Jeff knows his deck inside and out - nobody else could have piloted it to a number 1 spot but him.
I liked Jeff's Choice to go with 3x Surgical Extraction in the board along side 2 MD Scavenging Ooze but not sure I can get behind Slaughter Games in the current Meta.
Looking that the weekend there's 0% Affinity in the SCG Classic top 16 or GP DFW top 64. Infect is still right at the top and Dredge isn't going away.. Not sure what I'm playing yet for Columbus next weekend but looking at some of the changes Jeff's made here is a good place to start.
is anyone still playing the version of the list with Nahiri and Emrakul or is that really outdated now? is the eldritch evolution version the best version right now?
I kinda started building the deck as a side project when I didn't feel like playing chord but never really learned the deck. I've come to the point where I wanna try learning the deck
To sommarice, that version of the deck is stil good. It is considered better in a slow meta with little infect, burn, zoo or affinaty. If you meta only has those 4, play one of the other versions. If not, Nahiri is superior. She is also very forgivving for mistakes so the chances of playing the deck more correctly increases a lot. Have fun.
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I have dyslexia, no I am not going to spell check for you, yes you have to live with the horrors of it.
It depends on your meta. With how fast the meta is right now, Nahiri builds are pretty weak. The eldritch builds are even getting blown out. This deck is constantly changing to the meta.
It depends on your meta. With how fast the meta is right now, Nahiri builds are pretty weak. The eldritch builds are even getting blown out. This deck is constantly changing to the meta.
I might just test both in my meta. I actually enjoy playing the deck so I might see which version I like more. My meta is kind of weird I'd say.
the main store I play modern at is kind of half casual, with a lot of home brew, tabletop decks. The other, more competitive half has a few UR breach decks, Grixis/Rakdos Grishoalbrand, Kiki evo chord, merfolk , living end and a few other players who just started showing up with burn and elves
then a few other modern players I play with have burn, slivers, titan shift, abzan/junk and bant eldrazi
It depends on your meta. With how fast the meta is right now, Nahiri builds are pretty weak. The eldritch builds are even getting blown out. This deck is constantly changing to the meta.
I might just test both in my meta. I actually enjoy playing the deck so I might see which version I like more. My meta is kind of weird I'd say.
the main store I play modern at is kind of half casual, with a lot of home brew, tabletop decks. The other, more competitive half has a few UR breach decks, Grixis/Rakdos Grishoalbrand, Kiki evo chord, merfolk , living end and a few other players who just started showing up with burn and elves
then a few other modern players I play with have burn, slivers, titan shift, abzan/junk and bant eldrazi
which version do people recommend?
I would actually suggest trying all of them if you can.. the pieces that vary between them are relatively cheap allowing you get a feel for each variant on your own.
It depends on your meta. With how fast the meta is right now, Nahiri builds are pretty weak. The eldritch builds are even getting blown out. This deck is constantly changing to the meta.
I might just test both in my meta. I actually enjoy playing the deck so I might see which version I like more. My meta is kind of weird I'd say.
the main store I play modern at is kind of half casual, with a lot of home brew, tabletop decks. The other, more competitive half has a few UR breach decks, Grixis/Rakdos Grishoalbrand, Kiki evo chord, merfolk , living end and a few other players who just started showing up with burn and elves
then a few other modern players I play with have burn, slivers, titan shift, abzan/junk and bant eldrazi
which version do people recommend?
I would actually suggest trying all of them if you can.. the pieces that vary between them are relatively cheap allowing you get a feel for each variant on your own.
yeah I didn't realize that eldritch evolution was so cheap now, and I already have traverses so I don't need to get them. I'll just have to test the deck a lot
I think it has legs, but the more I tested the variants the more I felt like it was missing something.. I would find myself having to bolt my own creature in some instances just to get delirium online. It definitely deserves more testing though and I feel could potentially prove to be a role player in the archetype.
I think it has legs, but the more I tested the variants the more I felt like it was missing something.. I would find myself having to bolt my own creature in some instances just to get delirium online. It definitely deserves more testing though and I feel could potentially prove to be a role player in the archetype.
yeah it seems like it might be hard to get delirium online in this deck, lands and creatures will be easy but we barely run instants and sorceries
Yeah, Traverse is a lot more potent in matches where you're trading resources with your opponent. If your opponent is trying to kill your creatures, Traverse seems better than Chord. Traverse is also the only of our 3 tutors that dodges Grafdigger's Cage, though it rarely seems like an issue.
If your opponent is determined to kill you without interacting then you're probably better off with the more traditional lists with lots of ramp and Chord. Here you can develop a large board quickly and Chord becomes a real threat. You also have a lot more tricks at instant speed and often a better toolbox.
Evolution feels somewhere in the middle of the two.
Inb4 I start testing 4 Traverse, 4 Chord.
let me know how that goes, I'm interested to see how it goes
Sometimes when I'm brewing my mind wanders far. I love toolboxes. I've probably brewed a deck for every tutor in modern. And they're awful. But I keep brewing. You think this deck is being pulled in too many directions lately? We haven't even scratched the surface. I want to play all the tutors:
vs control deck, it's a nightmare.
You usually plays one thing each turn, a bigger each time (bird, voice, witness, chord, etc...)
when all your things get countered, you just wait and die slowly.
It's very frustrating. IMO blue is broken as ****, because you are denying every plays and win the mana war.
When you spend 2 mana to beat 4-5 mana, you can only win.
The more I play, the more I understand why the meta is very aggro based, because blue decks are so hard to beat, that you can only play a very fast consistent deck to manage them because all your things get countered and killed past turn 2-3 and you can't play anymore...
So yeah, back to the topic.
With a darwin chord/chord list, how do you beat blue decks? especially the one who plays delver of secret.
The following goes for chord/nahiri and chord/evolution versions of the deck:
If you can stick a mana dork, you can usually resolve 2 spells on turn 3, getting you ahead. If you can land a Voice of Resrugency turn 2 (on the play) or turn 3 on a mana dork after baiting with another 2 drop you are good. The fact that your deck runs 3 to 4 Voices is a nightmare for the opposing deck.
If you have a chord or restoration angel you can usually play it eot (or during combat vs delver) this means they have to respond and tap out on their turn. Then on your turn you can make a play. Usually this play is weaker then the chord or the angel, but it does not have to be. Playing an eternal witness to get back the card they reacted to is usually pretty sweet. That being said, eldrict evolution is a very sad card vs any form of counterspell.
Depending on their winn condition you can have a lot of time. Getting cards remanded is anoying, but not terrible. I am much more scared against mana leak. If they runn 2 to 4 Cryptic Command and can loop it with snapcaster mages the game can become difficult. Especially if you are meeting the grixis version where snapcaster gives flashback to cryptic and counter/taps on the first mode and retun the mage on second mode you have problems. The same can be said for cycling kholigans command into return snapcaster mage from the gravyeard.
I general I feel that playing against counters is not so bad once you learn when to bait, when to gamle and when to attrision up. If rhewelark resolves you are generally winning the game. Scavenging Ooze can be and allstar lategame. The manlands can kill blue if they do not get a crazy delver starts.
I am asuming some form of midrange tempo deck here. And not something like monkey grow that rarly go above 2 mana cc on their spells.
If you have a friends who is playing the controll deck I would ask to borrow the deck and switch it up. Then you will know when to dodge and when to jabb so to speak.
Edit: I would say that the more instant/flash spells you have that stays on the board after you cast it, the more favorable this match is. And again, evolution is sad vs counterspells. Perhaps even side them out if there are to many of them in the opponents deck.
A maindeck with something like this. I would not mind sleewing it up only to see it crash and burn. But I am not a good deckbuilder or tweaker so of anybody has any suggestion to the list before I do some testing on it I would apreciate it.
2 Noble Hierarch
4 Voice of Resurgence
4 Monastery Mentor
2 Eternal Witness
2 Restoration Angel
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
4 Mishra's Bauble
4 Traverse the Ulvenwald
4 Path to Exile
2 Manamorphose
4 Lingering Souls
2 Chord of Calling
3 Forest
1 Plains
1 Mountain
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Stomping Ground
1 Temple Garden
2 Razorverge Thicket
2 Gavony township
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
I have seen a few builds of collective brutality in main and kind of wanting to go back to 4x chords.
I still like the split. This deck has been all over the place as of late.
4 Birds of Paradise
2 Eternal Witness
1 Selfless Spirit
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Orzhov Pontiff
4 Voice of Resurgence
3 Wall of Omens
2 Pia and Kiran Nalaar
1 Qasali Pridemage
2 Restoration Angel
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Siege Rhino
1 Spellskite
1 Reveillark
Lands
1 Fire-Lit Thicket
2 Forest
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Plains
1 Raging Ravine
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
1 Temple Garden
1 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Chord of Calling
4 Eldritch Evolution
4 Path to Exile
3 Lightning Bolt
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Kataki, War's Wage
2 Lightning Helix
1 Melira, Sylvok Outcast
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Thragtusk
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
1 Anafenza, the Foremost
1 Fulminator Mage
1 Sin Collector
2 Collective Brutality
Jeff did won a SCG with 4 chords, 4 path, 2 brutality and 3 bolts. (he removed the walls of omen)
What do you think about it?
While I like the 2 CB, 3 bolts without omen seems pretty cocky.
Wall is slow, CB and Bolt are proactive. Not much to say except Jeff knows his deck inside and out - nobody else could have piloted it to a number 1 spot but him.
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
I liked Jeff's Choice to go with 3x Surgical Extraction in the board along side 2 MD Scavenging Ooze but not sure I can get behind Slaughter Games in the current Meta.
Looking that the weekend there's 0% Affinity in the SCG Classic top 16 or GP DFW top 64. Infect is still right at the top and Dredge isn't going away.. Not sure what I'm playing yet for Columbus next weekend but looking at some of the changes Jeff's made here is a good place to start.
I kinda started building the deck as a side project when I didn't feel like playing chord but never really learned the deck. I've come to the point where I wanna try learning the deck
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
I might just test both in my meta. I actually enjoy playing the deck so I might see which version I like more. My meta is kind of weird I'd say.
the main store I play modern at is kind of half casual, with a lot of home brew, tabletop decks. The other, more competitive half has a few UR breach decks, Grixis/Rakdos Grishoalbrand, Kiki evo chord, merfolk , living end and a few other players who just started showing up with burn and elves
then a few other modern players I play with have burn, slivers, titan shift, abzan/junk and bant eldrazi
which version do people recommend?
I would actually suggest trying all of them if you can.. the pieces that vary between them are relatively cheap allowing you get a feel for each variant on your own.
yeah I didn't realize that eldritch evolution was so cheap now, and I already have traverses so I don't need to get them. I'll just have to test the deck a lot
how do people feel about traverse the ulvenwald in the deck?
yeah it seems like it might be hard to get delirium online in this deck, lands and creatures will be easy but we barely run instants and sorceries
what about tireless tracker and thalia, heretic cathar?
let me know how that goes, I'm interested to see how it goes
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/506268#online - 38th - Abzan Chord
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/506281#online - 51st - Kiki-Chord
Im not sure the best way to import the decklists. Nice to have some to look at again though
Yes please don't play this, for the love of god. Bury it.