How have you guys felt about Anticipate? Feels way better than Telling Time for me, every single time. The scenario of looking at 3 cards that I only wanted 0-1 of (generally 2+ lands and maybe something else) has actually occurred frequently, making me really happy it was Anticipate instead of Time. I like Anticipate over Peer Through Depths because I can rely on it to hit land drops early game if need be.
My sideboard is a little weird because it's for a Modern League Playoffs I've been playing in, there was about 0% chance any of the Top 4 were going to be playing Affinity, for example, and I was pretty sure at least one would be on Twin hence the Rending Volleys. I took the Destructive Revelry plan from some pro's article, there have actually been a few times the 2 damage has allowed me to go off 1 turn earlier, but I'd probably rather have something higher impact in that slot against a more broad metagame. I do really like Gigadrowse, it's moved back and forth between main and sideboard plenty of times, it's really good against any blue deck. Throwback to Hearbeat in Kamigawa/Ravnica standard haha.
I've considered, in addition to the Baloths (which I believe are very strong against Junk, though some have mixed opinions), adding a couple other heavy hitter finishers: Inferno Titan or Wurmcoil Engine are the big ones, maybe even a Karn or Ugin. Often our opponents are bringing in a ton of Scapeshift hate, for example a game I played yesterday against RW aggro where he started game 2 with two Leyline of Sanctity's in play. I was able to win off Baloth beats but would've been much easier with another huge non Scapeshift threat (I used Scapeshift to wrath his board that game which was sweet).
I was actually testing with a Sarkhan Unbroken and an Ugin maindeck very briefly for a bit -- I think the Ugin is probably bad just because it's way too expensive to have in the main vs fast decks/decks that don't care about Ugin, but the Sarkhan was interesting. I ended up cutting it and tweaking the list, but since he does at worst replace himself, I could see going back to 1 or 2 main/side as a non-Scapeshift finisher. Keranos is another option of course.
How have you guys felt about Anticipate? Feels way better than Telling Time for me, every single time. The scenario of looking at 3 cards that I only wanted 0-1 of (generally 2+ lands and maybe something else) has actually occurred frequently, making me really happy it was Anticipate instead of Time. I like Anticipate over Peer Through Depths because I can rely on it to hit land drops early game if need be.
My sideboard is a little weird because it's for a Modern League Playoffs I've been playing in, there was about 0% chance any of the Top 4 were going to be playing Affinity, for example, and I was pretty sure at least one would be on Twin hence the Rending Volleys. I took the Destructive Revelry plan from some pro's article, there have actually been a few times the 2 damage has allowed me to go off 1 turn earlier, but I'd probably rather have something higher impact in that slot against a more broad metagame. I do really like Gigadrowse, it's moved back and forth between main and sideboard plenty of times, it's really good against any blue deck. Throwback to Hearbeat in Kamigawa/Ravnica standard haha.
I've considered, in addition to the Baloths (which I believe are very strong against Junk, though some have mixed opinions), adding a couple other heavy hitter finishers: Inferno Titan or Wurmcoil Engine are the big ones, maybe even a Karn or Ugin. Often our opponents are bringing in a ton of Scapeshift hate, for example a game I played yesterday against RW aggro where he started game 2 with two Leyline of Sanctity's in play. I was able to win off Baloth beats but would've been much easier with another huge non Scapeshift threat (I used Scapeshift to wrath his board that game which was sweet).
I was actually testing with a Sarkhan Unbroken and an Ugin maindeck very briefly for a bit -- I think the Ugin is probably bad just because it's way too expensive to have in the main vs fast decks/decks that don't care about Ugin, but the Sarkhan was interesting. I ended up cutting it and tweaking the list, but since he does at worst replace himself, I could see going back to 1 or 2 main/side as a non-Scapeshift finisher. Keranos is another option of course.
Anticipate is a pretty great replacement for Telling Time. As has been discussed, the scenarios where you want to take 1 of 3 occurs more often than where you want 2 of 3.
Ugin/Sarkhan maindeck don't seem the place to be, almost ever. Game 1 you won't see a large amount of hate so alternative wincons aren't necessarily wanted. Additionally, I think Ugin, as you have found, to be far too slow. Sarkhan is a potential replacement for Keranos in the board but I'm not sold on the idea.
Destructive Revelry seems....cute? I don't know how to think about it. The 2 damage is fairly irrelevant, faster decks will almost always shock themselves to below 18, possibly even with a lightning helix. My gut tells me that Ancient Grudge/Shatterstorm is a better card in the slot.
I'm shifting away from Baloths, especially now that Burn gets another skullcrack effect, making large one-time life gains more impotent in that MU. The pitch to Liliana is of a far-off tertiary concern, I've rarely seen it matter. I'm shifting towards Feed the clan or Thragtusk (stronger against Jun(d/k) imo). I'm using a Wurmcoil, a Teferi, and a Keranos as my alternative win-cons. They seem to get the job done against the decks they're meant for.
I've considered, in addition to the Baloths (which I believe are very strong against Junk, though some have mixed opinions), adding a couple other heavy hitter finishers: Inferno Titan or Wurmcoil Engine are the big ones, maybe even a Karn or Ugin. Often our opponents are bringing in a ton of Scapeshift hate, for example a game I played yesterday against RW aggro where he started game 2 with two Leyline of Sanctity's in play. I was able to win off Baloth beats but would've been much easier with another huge non Scapeshift threat (I used Scapeshift to wrath his board that game which was sweet).
I was actually testing with a Sarkhan Unbroken and an Ugin maindeck very briefly for a bit -- I think the Ugin is probably bad just because it's way too expensive to have in the main vs fast decks/decks that don't care about Ugin, but the Sarkhan was interesting. I ended up cutting it and tweaking the list, but since he does at worst replace himself, I could see going back to 1 or 2 main/side as a non-Scapeshift finisher. Keranos is another option of course.
I tested Ugin as well... games 2 and 3, simple land destruction aimed at the main combo prevented me from ever getting him out.
creatures tend to be the stronger back up plan.
just putting this out there but Garruk, Primal Hunter is solid as well and dodges the creature hate like you'd want in any of the other options. One of the few walkers who has an ultimate condition that takes advantage of the deck's land core.
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I mean, why Tarmogoyf? He doesn't fit into our main very well. We don't care much about the incremental damage he'd deal. We don't get the T1 discard into T2 2/3-3/4 Goyf, at most we'll likely get a 2/3 Goyf if we serum visions T1, but our ideal play would be T1 suspend Search.
What would be slotted out? Our counter magic is taxed as it is, so I don't see any cuts there. Some cantrips? Good luck finding answers to things Goyf can't, or combo pieces. Bolts/Electrolyzes. Surprise! Infect/Affinty became an even more of a nightmare matchup. Snapcaster? No more utility. Ramp? Enjoy taking longer to combo!
For sideboard? I still don't see it.
Goyf is, obviously, a very strong card. But his strengths and his usefulness aren't things that Scapeshift wants nor can it exploit. SB creatures need to be higher impact that hit the board and demand answers that our deck can then counter. Goyf isn't that in our deck.
This is what I have been playing to reasonable success. My Meta is very heavy infect, affinity and Tron, Hence the heavier burn package. I really like the gift package, I was apprehensive at 1st but I tried it out and have not regretted it. Games where I resolve a Gifts feel like games where I cannot ever lose. I do miss the filtering of serum visions but I think the trade off is worth it.
I am really tempted to try Feed the clans. The instant speed and Snapcaster Value seem like it might be so much better that its worth losing points versus lily decks.
Goyf certainly will get large, but in what length of time? The reason Goyf is a slam jam is that you can slam him T2 in a Jundy-deck and have a 3/4 for 2 that will grow. In Zoo he can be a 2/3 or 3/4 on T2 depending upon your removal and your opponents removal and he will continue to grow larger, likely at 3/4 T3. This is all discounting the fact that he's a fine draw any stage of the game, often landing at 5/6 later in the game when the topdeck wars have begun.
But is Scaepshift really interested in that? Scapeshift has limited creatures, limited removal, and close to no removal. A t2 2/3 (the largest our deck can push a Goyf on T2 without help from the opponent) is simply not that impressive. And that's where Goyf is better than our other options of Inferno Titan/Wurmcoil/Batterskull. T2-T3. With our ramp a T4 Batterskull or Keranos is not uncommon and a t4 Titan/Wurmcoil isn't terribly out of range. So for Goyf to supplant any of them, he has to be strong right out of the gate, which I think Scapeshift would have to bend its deck in order to do.
Let's also not forget that Scapeshift is a control(ish) deck. Often in the early turns our opponents are pushing an aggressive gameplan we really need to interact with. Putting down a t2 or t3 Goyf could expose you, whereas our other creatures are simply powerful enough to where its fine to keep them in hand for a few turns.
I could be wrong. But I don't see Goyf as something attractive for SB options over what's already there. What do you see in Goyf for Scapeshift?
I have a couple of grixis control decks in my metagame wich is equal to sgames from the bench if they know youre showing up. Of course its not the best option but u catch many players off guard. Remember that if u play 1 batterskull u may begin with it or draw it in turn 15. Of course if everyone is playing sgames maybe is better to go shadow of doubt, but if u dont draw it u lose
Eh? That's how I really feel. T4 is still a pivotal turn against many decks, Twin being the most notable. The earliest you're casting it is t3, but sucks up most, if not all of your mana. So you're exposing yourself to some decks in the format, and you really don't have to. Search and STE are pretty damn good in our deck, they fulfill a cheap ramp spell that allows us to leave up mana, and a chumper. So, as ProficientNomad has said, what are you taking out for it?
@Gustavito
Creatures are present in the SB for exactly the matchups where super-hate, like slaughtergames, are brought in. So why do you think Goyf is better than any of the creatures currently used? If he isn't, what SB cards would you sacrifice?
I don't get what you mean about Batterskull, that's the risk you run with any sideboard card. Scapeshift is better positioned to mitigate this problem, even, since it has a fairly robust filtering/cantrips gameplan.
Goyf is a sideboard card. It's terrible main deck since it dies to removal. Good players will side out most/all of their removal against scapeshift after sideboard.
Side note, goyf is pretty depressing in zoo, since zoo plays 0-4 sorceries, and path is awkward. I'd say goyf will be about the same power/toughness in zoo and scapeshift.
Soooooooooooo i just traded in most of my collection to get tarmogoyfs in the hopes that he will actually drop a good amount with the mm2 reprint. The deck i decided to leave whole was scapeshift and i just wanted to share my list. I know it needs some tweaks but i was very happy with it in the one tourney i was able to attend.
4 Scapeshift
4 Anticipate - Definitely is no Dig Through Time, but even with this being my only cantrip I had no issues finding my scapeshifts, which left me with more room for control
3 Snapcaster Mage - There are a millions reasons this is a $50 card
4 Remand - Best spell in the deck
3 Cryptic Command - Im not sure if I'd want four, but this card does everything a deck would want to do
2 Izzet Charm - Very versatile but none of the modes are too spectacular so 2 it is
4 Search for Tomorrow - Not sure if 8 or 10 are the correct number of ramp spells for this deck but SfT and Steve are the two best ramp spells in modern
4 Sakura Tribe Elder
3 Lightning Bolt - 3 felt like the right number, I could see running 2 but dont think four would be correct in most metas
2 Firespout - Still not sure if I like these maindeck but they won be a couple game ones
2 Roast - The one card I am most unsure about. Will definitley have to test it more often
2 Valakut
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Stomping Grounds
4 Steam Vents
2 Breeding Pool
3 Island
2 Forest
2 Mountain
1 Flooded Grove
1 Cascade Bluffs
Im not gonna share my SB since its very meta dependent, But definitely run a Sarruk, Dragonclaw and give Aetherspouts a shot. Ive been very impressed.
Thanks for reading and give me all the criticism you want.
jenkem, I think you're running too many situational cards (roast, bolt, firespout). I would cut 2 of those cards and replace them with peer through depths.
Rickster first off, thanks for the input but i played ptd for the first month and a half of playing scapeshift and will never put it back in. Nothing was worse games 2 and 3 than casting ptd and seeing my inferno titan or batterskull and not being able to grab it. Personally i was thinking of -2 roast +2 spell snare, spell pierce or repeal. There is too much affinity, burn, infect and other small creature decks in my meta to cut bolt and firespout but there is also a good amount of little kid junk, og junk and jund so i did like roast in those. Im very conflicted about my flex slots and sb choices
This is my current list:
4 Steam Vents
3 Island
3 Forest
2 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
2 Mountain
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Breeding Pool
1 Flooded Grove
1 Cascade Bluffs
1 Halimar Depths
2 Snapcaster Mage
4 Serum Visions
4 Search for Tomorrow
4 Scapeshift
4 Remand
4 Cryptic Command
2 Izzet Charm
3 Anticipate
2 Repeal
2 Electrolyze
3 Rending Volley
3 Pyroclasm
2 Destructive Revelry
2 Spellskite
1 Gigadrowse
My sideboard is a little weird because it's for a Modern League Playoffs I've been playing in, there was about 0% chance any of the Top 4 were going to be playing Affinity, for example, and I was pretty sure at least one would be on Twin hence the Rending Volleys. I took the Destructive Revelry plan from some pro's article, there have actually been a few times the 2 damage has allowed me to go off 1 turn earlier, but I'd probably rather have something higher impact in that slot against a more broad metagame. I do really like Gigadrowse, it's moved back and forth between main and sideboard plenty of times, it's really good against any blue deck. Throwback to Hearbeat in Kamigawa/Ravnica standard haha.
I've considered, in addition to the Baloths (which I believe are very strong against Junk, though some have mixed opinions), adding a couple other heavy hitter finishers: Inferno Titan or Wurmcoil Engine are the big ones, maybe even a Karn or Ugin. Often our opponents are bringing in a ton of Scapeshift hate, for example a game I played yesterday against RW aggro where he started game 2 with two Leyline of Sanctity's in play. I was able to win off Baloth beats but would've been much easier with another huge non Scapeshift threat (I used Scapeshift to wrath his board that game which was sweet).
I was actually testing with a Sarkhan Unbroken and an Ugin maindeck very briefly for a bit -- I think the Ugin is probably bad just because it's way too expensive to have in the main vs fast decks/decks that don't care about Ugin, but the Sarkhan was interesting. I ended up cutting it and tweaking the list, but since he does at worst replace himself, I could see going back to 1 or 2 main/side as a non-Scapeshift finisher. Keranos is another option of course.
Anticipate is a pretty great replacement for Telling Time. As has been discussed, the scenarios where you want to take 1 of 3 occurs more often than where you want 2 of 3.
Ugin/Sarkhan maindeck don't seem the place to be, almost ever. Game 1 you won't see a large amount of hate so alternative wincons aren't necessarily wanted. Additionally, I think Ugin, as you have found, to be far too slow. Sarkhan is a potential replacement for Keranos in the board but I'm not sold on the idea.
Destructive Revelry seems....cute? I don't know how to think about it. The 2 damage is fairly irrelevant, faster decks will almost always shock themselves to below 18, possibly even with a lightning helix. My gut tells me that Ancient Grudge/Shatterstorm is a better card in the slot.
I'm shifting away from Baloths, especially now that Burn gets another skullcrack effect, making large one-time life gains more impotent in that MU. The pitch to Liliana is of a far-off tertiary concern, I've rarely seen it matter. I'm shifting towards Feed the clan or Thragtusk (stronger against Jun(d/k) imo). I'm using a Wurmcoil, a Teferi, and a Keranos as my alternative win-cons. They seem to get the job done against the decks they're meant for.
you forgot jace, the mind sculptor.
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I tested Ugin as well... games 2 and 3, simple land destruction aimed at the main combo prevented me from ever getting him out.
creatures tend to be the stronger back up plan.
just putting this out there but Garruk, Primal Hunter is solid as well and dodges the creature hate like you'd want in any of the other options. One of the few walkers who has an ultimate condition that takes advantage of the deck's land core.
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Decks: "Name one! I probably got it built In one of these boxes."
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Vintage will rise again! Buy a Mox today!
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[I]Some call it dig through time, when really your digging through CRAP!
Merfolk! showing magic players what a shower is since Lorwyn!
I mean, why Tarmogoyf? He doesn't fit into our main very well. We don't care much about the incremental damage he'd deal. We don't get the T1 discard into T2 2/3-3/4 Goyf, at most we'll likely get a 2/3 Goyf if we serum visions T1, but our ideal play would be T1 suspend Search.
What would be slotted out? Our counter magic is taxed as it is, so I don't see any cuts there. Some cantrips? Good luck finding answers to things Goyf can't, or combo pieces. Bolts/Electrolyzes. Surprise! Infect/Affinty became an even more of a nightmare matchup. Snapcaster? No more utility. Ramp? Enjoy taking longer to combo!
For sideboard? I still don't see it.
Goyf is, obviously, a very strong card. But his strengths and his usefulness aren't things that Scapeshift wants nor can it exploit. SB creatures need to be higher impact that hit the board and demand answers that our deck can then counter. Goyf isn't that in our deck.
4 Sakura-Tribe Elder
2 Snapcaster Mage
Spells
4 Scapeshift
4 Search for Tomorrow
1 Farseek
4 Cryptic Command
2 Electrolyze
3 Gifts Ungiven
3 Izzet Charm
3 Lightning Bolt
1 Noxious Revival
4 Remand
2 Breeding Pool
1 Temple of Mystery
1 Flooded Grove
2 Forest
3 Island
4 Misty Rainforest
2 Mountain
4 Steam Vents
4 Stomping Ground
2 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
3 Obstinate Baloth (May try Feed the Clans)
2 Kiora, the crashing wave
2 Vendilion Clique
2 Negate
2 Ancient Grudge
1 Sowing Salt
1 Krosan Grip
1 Counterflux
1 Primal command
This is what I have been playing to reasonable success. My Meta is very heavy infect, affinity and Tron, Hence the heavier burn package. I really like the gift package, I was apprehensive at 1st but I tried it out and have not regretted it. Games where I resolve a Gifts feel like games where I cannot ever lose. I do miss the filtering of serum visions but I think the trade off is worth it.
I am really tempted to try Feed the clans. The instant speed and Snapcaster Value seem like it might be so much better that its worth losing points versus lily decks.
But is Scaepshift really interested in that? Scapeshift has limited creatures, limited removal, and close to no removal. A t2 2/3 (the largest our deck can push a Goyf on T2 without help from the opponent) is simply not that impressive. And that's where Goyf is better than our other options of Inferno Titan/Wurmcoil/Batterskull. T2-T3. With our ramp a T4 Batterskull or Keranos is not uncommon and a t4 Titan/Wurmcoil isn't terribly out of range. So for Goyf to supplant any of them, he has to be strong right out of the gate, which I think Scapeshift would have to bend its deck in order to do.
Let's also not forget that Scapeshift is a control(ish) deck. Often in the early turns our opponents are pushing an aggressive gameplan we really need to interact with. Putting down a t2 or t3 Goyf could expose you, whereas our other creatures are simply powerful enough to where its fine to keep them in hand for a few turns.
I could be wrong. But I don't see Goyf as something attractive for SB options over what's already there. What do you see in Goyf for Scapeshift?
What are the thoughts?
What are you replacing with it?
UW Approach UW
EDH
U Azami, Lady of Scrolls U
Eh? That's how I really feel. T4 is still a pivotal turn against many decks, Twin being the most notable. The earliest you're casting it is t3, but sucks up most, if not all of your mana. So you're exposing yourself to some decks in the format, and you really don't have to. Search and STE are pretty damn good in our deck, they fulfill a cheap ramp spell that allows us to leave up mana, and a chumper. So, as ProficientNomad has said, what are you taking out for it?
@Gustavito
Creatures are present in the SB for exactly the matchups where super-hate, like slaughtergames, are brought in. So why do you think Goyf is better than any of the creatures currently used? If he isn't, what SB cards would you sacrifice?
I don't get what you mean about Batterskull, that's the risk you run with any sideboard card. Scapeshift is better positioned to mitigate this problem, even, since it has a fairly robust filtering/cantrips gameplan.
Goyf is a sideboard card. It's terrible main deck since it dies to removal. Good players will side out most/all of their removal against scapeshift after sideboard.
Side note, goyf is pretty depressing in zoo, since zoo plays 0-4 sorceries, and path is awkward. I'd say goyf will be about the same power/toughness in zoo and scapeshift.
4 Scapeshift
4 Anticipate - Definitely is no Dig Through Time, but even with this being my only cantrip I had no issues finding my scapeshifts, which left me with more room for control
3 Snapcaster Mage - There are a millions reasons this is a $50 card
4 Remand - Best spell in the deck
3 Cryptic Command - Im not sure if I'd want four, but this card does everything a deck would want to do
2 Izzet Charm - Very versatile but none of the modes are too spectacular so 2 it is
4 Search for Tomorrow - Not sure if 8 or 10 are the correct number of ramp spells for this deck but SfT and Steve are the two best ramp spells in modern
4 Sakura Tribe Elder
3 Lightning Bolt - 3 felt like the right number, I could see running 2 but dont think four would be correct in most metas
2 Firespout - Still not sure if I like these maindeck but they won be a couple game ones
2 Roast - The one card I am most unsure about. Will definitley have to test it more often
2 Valakut
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Stomping Grounds
4 Steam Vents
2 Breeding Pool
3 Island
2 Forest
2 Mountain
1 Flooded Grove
1 Cascade Bluffs
Im not gonna share my SB since its very meta dependent, But definitely run a Sarruk, Dragonclaw and give Aetherspouts a shot. Ive been very impressed.
Thanks for reading and give me all the criticism you want.
I did an analysis on snare, and I didn't like it. I'd only want it vs burn or affinity.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/tier-2-modern/220244-rug-scapeshift?comment=1863