Hey guys, been a few months since I posted and checked the thread. I had to take a break from the modern scene for awhile.
I'm curious on opinions about Karn Liberated. I run 2x and it's never really done quite as much as its hype demands. Maybe I'm just not playing it right, but it's always been underwhelming outside of a turn 3 play (and even then, doesn't do much to close out the game).
Questions: Is Karn mandatory in any Tron deck? Specifically E-Tron? I'm considering swapping it for a second Ugin, the Spirit Dragon and a thirdMind Stone mainboard. Thoughts?
Also, I saw a random Skysovereign, Consul Flagship on a list recently as surprise removal. Has anyone tested this? Or is it to absurd? You could potentially pilot with a Ballista on 3, then pop something for extra damage during combat for the kill.
Here's my current list (Which I haven't played in about 3 months):
To be honest... I'm a little underwhelmed. The deck is clearly powerful, but it isn't very smooth. I've had my fair share of clunky hands that just don't get anywhere good in time. That said, I've lost some matches to decks that I know aren't favored against E-Tron, so bad variance may be playing a role. I'll continue testing, because I do see the potential, but the warts made themselves apparent pretty early on.
I've had similar experiences with the deck as well. However, when everything does come together, it's quite sweet. I'm aware of your contributions to Merfolk so I am quite interested in seeing what route your take ETron. Best of luck!
What I am currently thinking about is replacing the Sea Gate Wreckage with Arch of Orazca. However getting to the city's blessing might be too difficult. What do you guys think?
I see either card working. It has been my experience that Sea Gate Wreckage doesn't draw as many cards as one might expect it too. I often find that I am holding multiple lands or a Karn or Ulamg in hand and can never really use the draw ability. At least with Arch of Orazca you can hit council's blessing just on land which is not that hard to hit 7 or 8 land in a match up against mid-range/control.
I would like to test this out and see how it compares.
Well so much for us getting the Tron lands reprinted in Masters 25 with a Modern border or seeing a Karn reprint for that matter. Maybe Dominaria or Core Set 2019.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
Well so much for us getting the Tron lands reprinted in Masters 25 with a Modern border or seeing a Karn reprint for that matter. Maybe Dominaria or Core Set 2019.
I'm not too terribly concerned about the lands themselves but no reprint of Karn Liberated makes me sad. On the bright side Karn is only 80 to 100 unlike Jace, TMS.
Well so much for us getting the Tron lands reprinted in Masters 25 with a Modern border or seeing a Karn reprint for that matter. Maybe Dominaria or Core Set 2019.
I'm not too terribly concerned about the lands themselves but no reprint of Karn Liberated makes me sad. On the bright side Karn is only 80 to 100 unlike Jace, TMS.
At this rate he will pass up Jace soon.
I've got 1 Karn and that's it. It may stay that way until a reprint.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
My brother is looking to build this deck (He likes it more than Eldrazi and Taxes or RG Eldrazi). He currently owns Mono White Death and Taxes as well as burn.
Curious on any recommendations for starting points, buying path from budget version of the deck with upgrade path, or if it is worthwhile to go WB Eldrazi and Taxes and eventually transition over once he has more money to pick up the more expensive cards such as Chalice of the Void. Any advice that you have would be most helpful.
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Current Decks:
Modern
Modern Warp / UR Control / UR Storm / Naya Breachshift / ElectroBalance
Legacy
Solidarity / Lands / Sneak and Show / Grixis Delver / Reanimator / Belcher / Storm / Dredge
I'm being debating with myself the past few days. I'm a new player and looking forward to complete my e-tron setup.
I'm missing only 4 cards (chalices, which I will buy at the end of this month.)
However, I'm trying to make the deck a bit more resiliant VS the 'kitchen table' decks I'm playing against. (I use some more common primers when I'll take this to the LGS in a few weeks.)
The biggest problems are a full fletched ponza LD deck and a Mono W human deck.
Sideboard 1 Basilisk Collar (I don't like the inconsistency of this 'one of', Am i doing something wrong?) 2 Crucible of Worlds (VS the ponza deck, Will be only a one of or even none in LGS) 2 Mind Stone (I want to be able to play the full 4 vs LD) 2 Ratchet Bomb (Want to be able to play the full 4 vs Wide, usually side out mindstone) 2 Relic of Progenitus 2 Sorcerous Spyglass (Not sure if I should go Pithing needle or sorcerous spyglass) 2 Spatial Contortion (good VS wide) 2 Warping Wail (Good vs LD and others)
Next upgrade 4 Chalice of the void (Obvious) 2 Karn Liberated (Later then the chalices, probably after next set) 4 Spellskite (Not sure how many, I'll buy this later, Probably not 'worth' a slot?)
Maybeboard 2 Batterskull (Might be nice, but I have 2 wurmcoils) 3 Basilisk Collar (To make it more 'reliable' But don't want to give up slots) 1 Sanctum of Ugin (Not enough high costs to profit from, Rather play GQ) 2 Spatial Contortion (Should I make this a full playset?) 2 Surgical Extraction (I don't think I need this, Don't have it either) 2 Ugin the spirit dragon (I really like this card, Very usefull VS wide, but Too high cost and no eldrazi?) 2 Ulamog the ceaseless hunger (To costly, not sure what to scrap instead) 1 Waste (I don't think I need one more waste) 2 Wurmcoil engine (I don't think I need more Wurms)
My thoughts and conciderations are in the deck above.
All right then, ladies and gentlemen! If a wizard were under financial constraints, say because he was a single dad, what would the big beater finishers of choice be?
Best BEATS to USD ratio if a guy with not a ton of money wanted to ramp to colorless fatties?
Is it worth it to play a couple of Karn in our 75
as some kind of card advantage engine?
=====================
Legendary Planeswalker : Karn
Mana Cost : 4
Loyalty : 5
+1 Reveal the top two cards of your library. An opponent chooses one of them.
Put that card into your hand and exile the other with a silver counter on it.
-1 Put a card you own with a silver counter on it from exile into your hand.
-2 Create a 0/0 colorless Construct artifact creature token with "This creature gets +1/+1 for each artifact you control."
Is it worth it to play a couple of Karn in our 75
as some kind of card advantage engine?
=====================
Legendary Planeswalker : Karn
Mana Cost : 4
Loyalty : 5
+1 Reveal the top two cards of your library. An opponent chooses one of them.
Put that card into your hand and exile the other with a silver counter on it.
-1 Put a card you own with a silver counter on it from exile into your hand.
-2 Create a 0/0 colorless Construct artifact creature token with "This creature gets +1/+1 for each artifact you control."
I think this is going to be the main deck Karn fits into. Imagine playing a T3 Matter Reshaper or TKS, then following it up with a T4 Karn. Depending on how many copies are played I can see that being a common play. New Karn works better with Eldrazi Temple hands and gives the deck a card advantage engine which it didn't have before. His -2 is going to be useful as it can protect him, and will most likely be a ~2/2-3/3 most of the time. I really want to use it with a large Hangarback Walker that gets killed and suddenly makes all your Constructs giant.
@ Radekas, As for the new Damping Sphere, if the deck goes G to fight it then you can't really play Chalice and Stirrings. People have had success before with non-chalice green lists but that defeats the purpose of the deck. Just getting in a creature ahead of the curve before they play this, then playing on curve for the rest of the game should be enough. If they take off their T2 to play something that won't really affect you (when prepared) for the rest of the game they're going to fall behind.
I could see moving away from the colorless-only version and splashing green for Stirrings and artifact/enchantment hate out of the board.
Chalice would need to go, as would some of the lands in order to fit in things like Hashep Oasis or other lands that produce both Green and Colorless. The Chromatic artifacts could also see play here in order to generate green mana without needing a green-producing land.
Damping Sphere will be seen in Game 2 and 3. Doubt it will be a main deck card. Ratchet Bomb seems to be the most logical answer at the moment.
Baby Karn could be a decent card draw engine. His -2 could be decent as well. Looking forward to testing him out. Only question is how high will his price open at pre-release and release? 20, 30 40 bucks???
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
New e tron player here. Just wanting some input...how necessary these days are 1-2 Karn Liberated in the main? Haven't had the money to pick up Karns yet and it looks like they just jumped 20 bucks. Sigh.
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currently playing
(Modern)
RG RG Titanshift RG WUBR Affinity WUBR x Eldrazi Tron x UG Tropical Merfolk UG
Eldrazi tron moves sure on middle of Tier 2...or hated out complete. If you say it is OK, no Problem...if not, sell your chalice bevor all realize it too
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I'm curious on opinions about Karn Liberated. I run 2x and it's never really done quite as much as its hype demands. Maybe I'm just not playing it right, but it's always been underwhelming outside of a turn 3 play (and even then, doesn't do much to close out the game).
Questions: Is Karn mandatory in any Tron deck? Specifically E-Tron? I'm considering swapping it for a second Ugin, the Spirit Dragon and a thirdMind Stone mainboard. Thoughts?
Also, I saw a random Skysovereign, Consul Flagship on a list recently as surprise removal. Has anyone tested this? Or is it to absurd? You could potentially pilot with a Ballista on 3, then pop something for extra damage during combat for the kill.
Here's my current list (Which I haven't played in about 3 months):
2x Cavern of Souls
4x Eldrazi Temple
3x Ghost Quarter
1x Sea Gate Wreckage
4x Urza's Mine
4x Urza's Power Plant
4x Urza's Tower
2x Wastes
Planeswalker (3)
2x Karn Liberated
1x Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
2x Dismember
2x Endbringer
4x Matter Reshaper
4x Reality Smasher
4x Thought-Knot Seer
4x Walking Ballista
1x Wurmcoil Engine
Artifact (11)
3x Chalice of the Void
4x Expedition Map
2x Mind Stone
2x Relic of Progenitus
Sorcery (1)
1x All Is Dust
1x All Is Dust
2x Basilisk Collar
1x Batterskull
1x Chalice of the Void
1x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Pithing Needle
2x Ratchet Bomb
1x Relic of Progenitus
2x Surgical Extraction
2x Warping Wail
I've had similar experiences with the deck as well. However, when everything does come together, it's quite sweet. I'm aware of your contributions to Merfolk so I am quite interested in seeing what route your take ETron. Best of luck!
I see either card working. It has been my experience that Sea Gate Wreckage doesn't draw as many cards as one might expect it too. I often find that I am holding multiple lands or a Karn or Ulamg in hand and can never really use the draw ability. At least with Arch of Orazca you can hit council's blessing just on land which is not that hard to hit 7 or 8 land in a match up against mid-range/control.
I would like to test this out and see how it compares.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
I'm not too terribly concerned about the lands themselves but no reprint of Karn Liberated makes me sad. On the bright side Karn is only 80 to 100 unlike Jace, TMS.
At this rate he will pass up Jace soon.
I've got 1 Karn and that's it. It may stay that way until a reprint.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
My brother is looking to build this deck (He likes it more than Eldrazi and Taxes or RG Eldrazi). He currently owns Mono White Death and Taxes as well as burn.
Curious on any recommendations for starting points, buying path from budget version of the deck with upgrade path, or if it is worthwhile to go WB Eldrazi and Taxes and eventually transition over once he has more money to pick up the more expensive cards such as Chalice of the Void. Any advice that you have would be most helpful.
Modern Warp / UR Control / UR Storm / Naya Breachshift / ElectroBalance
Solidarity / Lands / Sneak and Show / Grixis Delver / Reanimator / Belcher / Storm / Dredge
I'm missing only 4 cards (chalices, which I will buy at the end of this month.)
However, I'm trying to make the deck a bit more resiliant VS the 'kitchen table' decks I'm playing against. (I use some more common primers when I'll take this to the LGS in a few weeks.)
The biggest problems are a full fletched ponza LD deck and a Mono W human deck.
4 Endbringer (unsure if I should go for 2, 3 or 4)
4 Matter Reshaper
4 Reality Smasher
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Walking Ballista
2 Wurmcoil Engine
Spells
2 All Is Dust
2 Dismember
4 Expedition Map
2 Mind Stone (Might want to take a third in MB)
2 Ratchet Bomb (MB since a lot of wide in my meta)
2 Warping Wail (MB to counter LD and exile small dorks/others)
Lands
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Sea Gate Wreckage
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Power Plant
4 Urza's Tower
3 Wastes
1 Basilisk Collar (I don't like the inconsistency of this 'one of', Am i doing something wrong?)
2 Crucible of Worlds (VS the ponza deck, Will be only a one of or even none in LGS)
2 Mind Stone (I want to be able to play the full 4 vs LD)
2 Ratchet Bomb (Want to be able to play the full 4 vs Wide, usually side out mindstone)
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Sorcerous Spyglass (Not sure if I should go Pithing needle or sorcerous spyglass)
2 Spatial Contortion (good VS wide)
2 Warping Wail (Good vs LD and others)
4 Chalice of the void (Obvious)
2 Karn Liberated (Later then the chalices, probably after next set)
4 Spellskite (Not sure how many, I'll buy this later, Probably not 'worth' a slot?)
Maybeboard
2 Batterskull (Might be nice, but I have 2 wurmcoils)
3 Basilisk Collar (To make it more 'reliable' But don't want to give up slots)
1 Sanctum of Ugin (Not enough high costs to profit from, Rather play GQ)
2 Spatial Contortion (Should I make this a full playset?)
2 Surgical Extraction (I don't think I need this, Don't have it either)
2 Ugin the spirit dragon (I really like this card, Very usefull VS wide, but Too high cost and no eldrazi?)
2 Ulamog the ceaseless hunger (To costly, not sure what to scrap instead)
1 Waste (I don't think I need one more waste)
2 Wurmcoil engine (I don't think I need more Wurms)
My thoughts and conciderations are in the deck above.
Best BEATS to USD ratio if a guy with not a ton of money wanted to ramp to colorless fatties?
Thanks!
as some kind of card advantage engine?
=====================
Legendary Planeswalker : Karn
Mana Cost : 4
Loyalty : 5
+1 Reveal the top two cards of your library. An opponent chooses one of them.
Put that card into your hand and exile the other with a silver counter on it.
-1 Put a card you own with a silver counter on it from exile into your hand.
-2 Create a 0/0 colorless Construct artifact creature token with "This creature gets +1/+1 for each artifact you control."
@ Radekas, As for the new Damping Sphere, if the deck goes G to fight it then you can't really play Chalice and Stirrings. People have had success before with non-chalice green lists but that defeats the purpose of the deck. Just getting in a creature ahead of the curve before they play this, then playing on curve for the rest of the game should be enough. If they take off their T2 to play something that won't really affect you (when prepared) for the rest of the game they're going to fall behind.
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
Chalice would need to go, as would some of the lands in order to fit in things like Hashep Oasis or other lands that produce both Green and Colorless. The Chromatic artifacts could also see play here in order to generate green mana without needing a green-producing land.
Baby Karn could be a decent card draw engine. His -2 could be decent as well. Looking forward to testing him out. Only question is how high will his price open at pre-release and release? 20, 30 40 bucks???
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
(Modern)
RG RG Titanshift RG
WUBR Affinity WUBR
x Eldrazi Tron x
UG Tropical Merfolk UG
(Pauper)
G Elves G
WURG Affinity WURG