@Curdbros,
As for the planeswalkers with multiple nongreen-colored mana requirements (Ashiok, Narset) I think they are too difficult to reliably cast on t2/3 without having an Oath of Nissa. I think it's liable to get stuck in hand often and still be too slow to come out to be really helpful. Dovin only has 1 colored mana requirement and presuming you're running Breeding Pool, he should be castable in a timely manner.
@Curbros,
As for the planeswalkers with multiple nongreen-colored mana requirements (Ashiok, Narset) I think they are too difficult to reliably cast on t2/3 without having an Oath of Nissa. I think it's liable to get stuck in hand often and still be too slow to come out to be really helpful. Dovin only has 1 colored mana requirement and presuming you're running Breeding Pool, he should be castable in a timely manner.
Pretty much my thoughts also. I am slightly more inclined to include ashiok as the effect is very strong. I think Narset is not what we want to be doing. And Dovin is fine. I think damping sphere is better even if it hurts us too.
Narset is by far the most powerful non-rare planeswalker spoiled so far. I can see it being played in Legacy. I already had a Mono-blue Chalice Proliferate deck in Legacy.
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LEGACY: Soldier Stompy WW // Blue Stompy UU // Fit Variants BGRW // Sol Land Brews BGRUWC MODERN: Pure Pili-ness GU // Red Devotion RR // Green Devotion Variants GRWUG // U/G Emerge CGU // Lots and Lots of Brews BGRUWC
Yeah...Narset has some strength only because of its effect on decks like Storm, Phoenix, Cheerios, Control, etc. which actually are some of our tougher match ups... and the fact that I can actually use her ability (as she can search for Walkers, Curio, Wave, and/or enchantments.). Having said that; I do see what you are saying about the cost restrictions. I did utilize only the blue ones (given that my current deck is splashing Blue only.) I'm sure there are other cards that are just as strong against some or most of those archetypes. I will try to test them a little just to provide the experience.
Hi there, So I've been a long time lurker of this primer Like year and a half. since I decided I wanted to play the best damn big mana deck ever and I can honestly say that green devotion is probably the most fun deck I've played. It just feels super satisfying to play and when it has some nut hands feels really unfair vs decks that it can just go over top of. I've been trying to really streamline a Summoner's Pact List for a while but Im not entirely sure if it can be done, I think we are missing just a couple of really good interaction creatures in order to effectively run a Silver bullet list. This is the current deck list I've been tinkering with.
So far I've enjoyed this list but I feel Im lacking interaction. I've also cut Primal Command & Eternal Witness honestly because during play they are really good cards but something needed to be trimmed out to make the list 60, not sure if it was the right call considering it is probably the best interaction we have but with both kiora and gurrak I've no had any problems with generating the mana to make a turn 4 bullet happen. actually had a game where it went as followed
T1: Breeding Pool + Arbor Elf
T2: Forest tap cast Utopia Sprawl tap out for 4 with 2u 2g, play Kiora, Master of the Depths use her +1 cast Garruk Wildspeaker +1 Into Steel Leaf Champion
T3: PLay Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx tap out for 14 mana using Kiora +1' into Chorded Craterhoof Behemoth and then Ulted Garruk Wildspeaker For metric crapton of damages.
So Im very much enjoying the ramp portion of this deck even with only 1 dork and a sprawl Im just wanting to see what you guys think about it. I also needed to run Chord of Calling for instant speed and can pull Creature cards not just green for Wurmcoil. But what you guys think.
I like how you brought your own flavor into the deck. I think it's well made, but I do have some questions/inputs:
Scavenging Ooze in the mainboard. Packing mainboard graveyard hate is vital in a bullet list imo.
Eternal Witness: You took it out as part of the Primal Command softlock packet, but as a 1 of it can be a great tutor target if your 1-of bullet gets discarded or countered.
What an awesome nut draw you had. Making 11 mana on turn 2 isn't normal, but on green devotion it is ;).
I've been experimenting with Kiora's Follower recently And havent been in a situation I wasnt able to cast it with the right mana combo's, I have however been able to make more defensive plays with attack then untapping things like Wurmcoil Engine To stall out more games, Taking out Eternal Witness so far I cant tell if Im liking it or not, I've been thinking about tweaking my list more, Been thinking about things like Beast Within. As far as scooze goes, I often find it just dies before actually making an impact, Im probably just going to run cage/relic for graveyard hate. The list is still very much being tweaked. I can say the one card that just keeps suprising me with how good its preforming Steel Leaf Champion. This card has straight up won me games just by creating either a solid early offense that goes over alot of creatures or makes trading unfavorable for them and if it sticks around for even 1 turn with the added devotion of 3g makes for some really really nice setups, I've had games where I simply go
T1: land. arbor/utopia
T2: land. Steel-leaf and if it doesnt die it puts in serious work. Opens up alot of very nice T3 plays with a nykthos drop.
I also play alot on cockatrice and Im really really enjoying the new finale of devastation. Very very solid tutor, I didnt think it would be as good as it is. On cockatrice Im fighting tier 1 decks most of the time, things like phoenix, tron, dredge, affinity. and I've found that if Im allowed to ramp normally the first 3 turns and I can make 14+ mana that the new tutor just ends games, even if the creature isnt craterhoof. I managed to make 14 mana on turn 4 vs affinity and just tutored up a Craterhoof Behemoth With only an arbor elf in play and swung for 19 points of trample damage and he just conceded. Ima have to do more testing but the new finale so far has been great. I've also been able to play around removal with it like Eternal Witness would be able to since it pulls from the graveyard, I had a game where I chorded up a wurmcoil to stabilize and it got Kolaghan's Command As soon as it hit. Chump blocked with the tokens then used the finale to pull it back and it went unanswered. I've only gotten to test about 5 matches with it so far but its preforming well. Overall Im still trying to tweak things cause I really think the deck type has potential to be a tier 1 deck we just are not quite there yet. Maybe one or so cards to really streamline the speed of the deck and we are golden. Im starting to look at other nongreen bullets with the chord/finale package. been looking at some oldschool reanimate lists and thinking about things like Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur, Griselbrand, Iona, Shield of Emeria as bullet cards but the only problem is I dont want them to be dead cards in hand. I think the list could change heavily when war of the spark/Modern horizon comes out, such an exciting time to play this deck.
Well...I read some of the rules info WOTC out out today. A little bad news for us wanting to use Bioessence Hydra and Genesis Wave
It looks like if the Hydra and the walkers enter at the same time you don’t get the counters for the loyalty of the walkers (essentially they have to have been there before the wave). Takes away some of the fun :). Still a fun card.
Well...I read some of the rules info WOTC out out today. A little bad news for us wanting to use Bioessence Hydra and Genesis Wave
It looks like if the Hydra and the walkers enter at the same time you don’t get the counters for the loyalty of the walkers (essentially they have to have been there before the wave). Takes away some of the fun :). Still a fun card.
"... but they will cause its last ability to trigger." Yes, you'll still get the loyalty counters that go on planeswalkers entering along with the Hydra, you just won't get to double-dip.
Sup guys, I've been testing the following list, and I must say Hydroid Krasis is REALLY GOOD. I've taken out the Tooth and Nail plan for Genesis Wave strat. I just hated to draw Emrakul or Xenagos in my opening. Kiora's Follower is also great, but you need to fetch accordingly to avoid surprises.
I have not thought or gathered all the cards uses but here are some thoughts:
- Vivien s longbow seems sweet although I am not sure it would help in difficult match ups like storm or Phoenix (too slow). Although it could help to play around sweepers or conflagrate and ensure we have some devotion the turn after too produce something big (and elbow could help if we have nothing in hand). I don t know what the optimal configuration between enablers and finishers or specific targets should be but it seems worth testing. Probably more of a sideboard option. Also against death shadow or bg that strip or hand apart, recycling or bad remaining cards coule use full.
- dormi is a cheap permanent that provides up to two mana and can act as a removal. I don t think that there are that many cards with these criteria set available in modern. Imagine turn 2 bte into domri fight baral: maybe we have a chance! The older domri is more ca oriented so belongs to the ab only. This one maybe slightly more linear so I am curious to see if he can belong to the main plan.
- I don t really see the new green sun s zenith except for craterhoof or maybe the miser dryad arbor. I have not considered the other colors and there are for sure potential inclusions. If so, I wonder if you should then keep playing a nykthos deck. Maybe it gives you access to a 2nd thalia, eidolon, etc out of the board. It seems too expensive, but given all the possibilities I may have missed some of them. Also, with cards that say "as an additional cost" like myr superior...
Well with the printing of Neoform and Finale of Devastation, I think this could be a new era for Green Devotion and green decks in general. These two cards have mega potential. I haven’t been playing much Magic, but I want to try again to test these cards. I think the Devoted Vizier Devotion plan just got better since Finale can fetch both pieces. Turn 3 wins with this are much easier than before. Finale also allows the potential to splash more colors.
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LEGACY: Soldier Stompy WW // Blue Stompy UU // Fit Variants BGRW // Sol Land Brews BGRUWC MODERN: Pure Pili-ness GU // Red Devotion RR // Green Devotion Variants GRWUG // U/G Emerge CGU // Lots and Lots of Brews BGRUWC
Rule Edit: I read very often Finale of Devastation in combination with Craterhoof Behemoth. I think the better choice in this case is Hornet Queen. Ok, X=10 the CMC doesn't matter, but 5 fliers with +10/+10 with haste and you didn't need other creatures for the Hoof effect is a good argument. With a second thought, the game is over if you can cast it. Edit: no matter which finisher you choose
I really like the toolbox style with the Finale and the Neoform together. Finally no color retrictions and with both in your deck you can play even cards you didn't got the lands.
The possibilities are overwhelming. Here a tip with Neoform: Skaab Ruinator. A flying 5/6 is not a joke and is something like a flying Tarmogoyf (and unbounceable from TitI because Skaab is a Horror) or any other Silberbullets or more common threats like Knight of the Reliquary.
With those Tutors you can playing Phyrexian Obliterator in a simic colored deck. It's an extreme example of course, but hopefully, it show how powerful those new cards are. Imho Rendroc is 100% right about the mega potential.
Green had some cards with "reveal the top card of your Library" in combination Tamiyo, Colllector of Tales and/or Nissa, Steward of Elements you can flood the board. Ok, these would be not fast enough to be T1, but i will brew a copy Deck with the new Tamiyo.
@Fulgence/Noname
Write a Mod-(team) about your account . Maybe in this forum is a thread for those cases.
It was Fulgence/Noname. I don't know why the website gave me this name...
That is strange...you may be able to chance your name back in the settings (or possibly with aid of the Mods).
I do agree with a lot of what you said. I do think the Domri is a great fit in many decks (the mana-ability makes it a perfect fit while also being removal in a pinch and an anthem effect. Just enough value to make it worth it.
I have been playing Kiora, but that is because she works well in the Combo Wave build. I do think she can also fit in other decks however.
Well with the printing of Neoform and Finale of Devastation, I think this could be a new era for Green Devotion and green decks in general. These two cards have mega potential. I haven’t been playing much Magic, but I want to try again to test these cards. I think the Devoted Vizier Devotion plan just got better since Finale can fetch both pieces. Turn 3 wins with this are much easier than before. Finale also allows the potential to splash more colors.
I think you are on to something here. It is nice to have a tutor that can either grab the combo; grab a sink if you have the combo, or act as a finisher if they "shut off" the combo. Very interesting idea indeed.
_____
As with some of the more powerful sets (when we receive 3-5 cards that have potential) the archetype has many cards to test out. I look at it as a positive! Should be a fun few weeks!
I was testing some lists with Finale of Devastation and finally just decided that it was better to get to 9 mana and entwine Tooth and Nail for Emmy/Xenagos than try for 12 with Finale, even in a more traditional style Devotion shell (i.e. not running Overgrowth or Voyaging Satyr). The only pro for running Finale is that you can use it at x=anything, but Summoner's Pact already does that for free at instant speed. You have to really want a non-green finisher to run Finale over Pact, I think.
Finale of Devastation is basically a Chord of Calling. For one less G you lose Convoke and Instantspeed, that is very hard. On the other hand you got the x=10 text, that is imho more like a bonus AND you can optional tutor from the graveyard that is pretty good if you really need yout puzzle piece.
Like Chord is Devastation a card for a (nongreen)Toolbox/Combo Deck. For a classic Devotion Deck , Summoner's Pact and Primal Command are sligtly better.
Maybe with a heavy untap Deck (all sorts of Kiora cards) with Rosheen Meanderer and big load of X cards. After every new idea you can evaluate which Tutor is the best for your concept.
Any advice for how I could improve this without adding much extra cost or cut cost without dropping the effectiveness by much? Any advice is greatly appreciated! I've been loving the look of devotion deck and recently decided to go with genesis wave as I've never liked the emrakul t3 kill combo nor summoning pact into craterhoof.
Edit: Also I based this off GurmagAngler1234 as I really liked the look of their list. Just cut stuff that I don't own and are too expensive at the moment.
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As for the planeswalkers with multiple nongreen-colored mana requirements (Ashiok, Narset) I think they are too difficult to reliably cast on t2/3 without having an Oath of Nissa. I think it's liable to get stuck in hand often and still be too slow to come out to be really helpful. Dovin only has 1 colored mana requirement and presuming you're running Breeding Pool, he should be castable in a timely manner.
Pretty much my thoughts also. I am slightly more inclined to include ashiok as the effect is very strong. I think Narset is not what we want to be doing. And Dovin is fine. I think damping sphere is better even if it hurts us too.
MODERN: Pure Pili-ness GU // Red Devotion RR // Green Devotion Variants GRWUG // U/G Emerge CGU // Lots and Lots of Brews BGRUWC
I like how you brought your own flavor into the deck. I think it's well made, but I do have some questions/inputs:
What an awesome nut draw you had. Making 11 mana on turn 2 isn't normal, but on green devotion it is ;).
T1: land. arbor/utopia
T2: land. Steel-leaf and if it doesnt die it puts in serious work. Opens up alot of very nice T3 plays with a nykthos drop.
I also play alot on cockatrice and Im really really enjoying the new finale of devastation. Very very solid tutor, I didnt think it would be as good as it is. On cockatrice Im fighting tier 1 decks most of the time, things like phoenix, tron, dredge, affinity. and I've found that if Im allowed to ramp normally the first 3 turns and I can make 14+ mana that the new tutor just ends games, even if the creature isnt craterhoof. I managed to make 14 mana on turn 4 vs affinity and just tutored up a Craterhoof Behemoth With only an arbor elf in play and swung for 19 points of trample damage and he just conceded. Ima have to do more testing but the new finale so far has been great. I've also been able to play around removal with it like Eternal Witness would be able to since it pulls from the graveyard, I had a game where I chorded up a wurmcoil to stabilize and it got Kolaghan's Command As soon as it hit. Chump blocked with the tokens then used the finale to pull it back and it went unanswered. I've only gotten to test about 5 matches with it so far but its preforming well. Overall Im still trying to tweak things cause I really think the deck type has potential to be a tier 1 deck we just are not quite there yet. Maybe one or so cards to really streamline the speed of the deck and we are golden. Im starting to look at other nongreen bullets with the chord/finale package. been looking at some oldschool reanimate lists and thinking about things like Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur, Griselbrand, Iona, Shield of Emeria as bullet cards but the only problem is I dont want them to be dead cards in hand. I think the list could change heavily when war of the spark/Modern horizon comes out, such an exciting time to play this deck.
It looks like if the Hydra and the walkers enter at the same time you don’t get the counters for the loyalty of the walkers (essentially they have to have been there before the wave). Takes away some of the fun :). Still a fun card.
"... but they will cause its last ability to trigger." Yes, you'll still get the loyalty counters that go on planeswalkers entering along with the Hydra, you just won't get to double-dip.
3 Wooded Foothills
6 Forest
2 Stomping Ground
2 Breeding Pool
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Kessig Wolf Run
4 Arbor Elf
3 Birds of Paradise
3 Kiora's Follower
1 Scavenging Ooze
4 Steel Leaf Champion
2 Eternal Witness
2 Tireless Tracker
2 Primeval Titan
1 Ruric-Thar, the Unbowed
2 Hydroid Krasis
2 Overgrowth
1 Rhythm of the Wild
2 Garruk Wildspeaker
1 Kiora, Master of the Depths
2 Genesis Wave
2 Primal Command
2 Negate
2 Crumble to Dust
1 Alpine Moon
2 Obstinate Baloth
1 Scavenging Ooze
2 Ravenous Trap
1 Creeping Corrosion
1 Trinisphere
2 Dismember
1 Firespout
- Vivien s longbow seems sweet although I am not sure it would help in difficult match ups like storm or Phoenix (too slow). Although it could help to play around sweepers or conflagrate and ensure we have some devotion the turn after too produce something big (and elbow could help if we have nothing in hand). I don t know what the optimal configuration between enablers and finishers or specific targets should be but it seems worth testing. Probably more of a sideboard option. Also against death shadow or bg that strip or hand apart, recycling or bad remaining cards coule use full.
- dormi is a cheap permanent that provides up to two mana and can act as a removal. I don t think that there are that many cards with these criteria set available in modern. Imagine turn 2 bte into domri fight baral: maybe we have a chance! The older domri is more ca oriented so belongs to the ab only. This one maybe slightly more linear so I am curious to see if he can belong to the main plan.
- I don t really see the new green sun s zenith except for craterhoof or maybe the miser dryad arbor. I have not considered the other colors and there are for sure potential inclusions. If so, I wonder if you should then keep playing a nykthos deck. Maybe it gives you access to a 2nd thalia, eidolon, etc out of the board. It seems too expensive, but given all the possibilities I may have missed some of them. Also, with cards that say "as an additional cost" like myr superior...
MODERN: Pure Pili-ness GU // Red Devotion RR // Green Devotion Variants GRWUG // U/G Emerge CGU // Lots and Lots of Brews BGRUWC
I read very often Finale of Devastation in combination with Craterhoof Behemoth. I think the better choice in this case is Hornet Queen. Ok, X=10 the CMC doesn't matter, but 5 fliers with +10/+10 with haste and you didn't need other creatures for the Hoof effect is a good argument. With a second thought, the game is over if you can cast it. Edit: no matter which finisher you chooseI really like the toolbox style with the Finale and the Neoform together. Finally no color retrictions and with both in your deck you can play even cards you didn't got the lands.
The possibilities are overwhelming. Here a tip with Neoform: Skaab Ruinator. A flying 5/6 is not a joke and is something like a flying Tarmogoyf (and unbounceable from TitI because Skaab is a Horror) or any other Silberbullets or more common threats like Knight of the Reliquary.
With those Tutors you can playing Phyrexian Obliterator in a simic colored deck. It's an extreme example of course, but hopefully, it show how powerful those new cards are. Imho Rendroc is 100% right about the mega potential.
Green had some cards with "reveal the top card of your Library" in combination Tamiyo, Colllector of Tales and/or Nissa, Steward of Elements you can flood the board. Ok, these would be not fast enough to be T1, but i will brew a copy Deck with the new Tamiyo.
@Fulgence/Noname
Write a Mod-(team) about your account . Maybe in this forum is a thread for those cases.
Hmmm.....56 hasty DEATHTOUCH BEES damage - Maybe
(Hornet Queen itself is a 2/2)
My point was, if you can cast a 12 ManaSorcery it doesn't matter if you cast Craterhoof or the Hornet Queen, but the Queen has far more style.
That is strange...you may be able to chance your name back in the settings (or possibly with aid of the Mods).
I do agree with a lot of what you said. I do think the Domri is a great fit in many decks (the mana-ability makes it a perfect fit while also being removal in a pinch and an anthem effect. Just enough value to make it worth it.
I have been playing Kiora, but that is because she works well in the Combo Wave build. I do think she can also fit in other decks however.
I think you are on to something here. It is nice to have a tutor that can either grab the combo; grab a sink if you have the combo, or act as a finisher if they "shut off" the combo. Very interesting idea indeed.
_____
As with some of the more powerful sets (when we receive 3-5 cards that have potential) the archetype has many cards to test out. I look at it as a positive! Should be a fun few weeks!
Like Chord is Devastation a card for a (nongreen)Toolbox/Combo Deck. For a classic Devotion Deck , Summoner's Pact and Primal Command are sligtly better.
...until someone build something complete different.
Maybe with a heavy untap Deck (all sorts of Kiora cards) with Rosheen Meanderer and big load of X cards. After every new idea you can evaluate which Tutor is the best for your concept.
3 Birds of Paradise
4 Arbor Elf
2 Eternal Witness
3 Kiora's Follower
1 Hornet Queen
1 Scavenging Ooze
4 Steel Leaf Champion
1 Stormtide Leviathan
4 Utopia Sprawl
3 Overgrowth
Land
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
4 Botanical Sanctum
4 Breeding Pool
10 Forest
3 Genesis Wave
3 Primal Command
Planeswalker
3 Garruk Wildspeaker
1 Kiora, Master of the Depths
2 Kiora, Behemoth Beckoner
Any advice for how I could improve this without adding much extra cost or cut cost without dropping the effectiveness by much? Any advice is greatly appreciated! I've been loving the look of devotion deck and recently decided to go with genesis wave as I've never liked the emrakul t3 kill combo nor summoning pact into craterhoof.
Edit: Also I based this off GurmagAngler1234 as I really liked the look of their list. Just cut stuff that I don't own and are too expensive at the moment.