@mooffz I've felt that way at times as well. I somehow end up playing different variations of death and taxes like every other game lately and DnT has not been playing well even in the new meta, so I'm unsure of why that is. The maindeck ghost quarters are also starting to weigh on me. I'll keep trucking though because I really enjoy playing this deck more than I've enjoyed playing other decks in the past.
@Gm13p I really don't know how that deck wouldn't just get blown out by land hate. I guess the backup plan is to go hard on devotion count. I think you would really need to being playing against a very particular meta for a deck like that to do well.
Completely agree with you, it's surely adapted to a particular meta, I would never play that list. It seems to me that almost all high tier decks would just crush it.
It's an all-in wave, really lacks of wincons to my taste.
Yeah, that's why I switched back to a traditional list. I love Wave, but to be solely focused on it seems like a recipe for disaster, especially when it takes so little to diversify.
As for the meta being hostile: no argument. I think that's part of the reason toolbox and planeswalkers appear to be working at least as well as the X-finishers or T&N right now: they can play the old fashioned way without getting crushed if their Nykthos or Sprawls get removed.
You know what feels worst about this? We're getting hit by Eldrazi-hate that isn't even actually all that good against Eldrazi! We're actually in the same boat as Tron, now that I think about it.
As promised I have another crazy devotion brew to share. I'm kinda excited about this one. It needs more work before I even think of taking it to even a fnm, but it is fun to play. I present to you mono green valakut devotion.
So with this brew there is multiple win conditions. 1) straight creature beats 2) bolts from Valakut 3) animated forests from Life and Limb buffed from Nissa and Garruk.
My concerns right now is lack of life gain and land destruction.
Honestly, I like that list a lot. Very clever. Thoughts:
1. How much life gain do you need? Is Primal Command not going to cut it? If not, well, I think the obvious go-to choice here might be Courser.
2. When you say you're worried about land-destruction, I assume you mean your lands? I wouldn't be quite so worried: you can win without Valakut, and the only dead card will be Prismatic Omen.
3. Speaking of which, you're playing 3x Primeval Titan. There is no reason not to run at least 1x Kessig and 1x Stomping Ground, as an alternate knock-out.
4. Hydra is great in searching out Omen/Titan. It's a shame that, unlike Wave, it doesn't get land. I'm just saying...
5. Life and Limb seems like it could become a potentially dangerous liability, even as it's a potential finisher. While potentially it can blindside an opponent and just win, is it really preferable over just playing more creatures to Overrun with?
Honestly, I like that list a lot. Very clever. Thoughts:
1. How much life gain do you need? Is Primal Command not going to cut it? If not, well, I think the obvious go-to choice here might be Courser.
2. When you say you're worried about land-destruction, I assume you mean your lands? I wouldn't be quite so worried: you can win without Valakut, and the only dead card will be Prismatic Omen.
3. Speaking of which, you're playing 3x Primeval Titan. There is no reason not to run at least 1x Kessig and 1x Stomping Ground, as an alternate knock-out.
4. Hydra is great in searching out Omen/Titan. It's a shame that, unlike Wave, it doesn't get land. I'm just saying...
5. Life and Limb seems like it could become a potentially dangerous liability, even as it's a potential finisher. While potentially it can blindside an opponent and just win, is it really preferable over just playing more creatures to Overrun with?
Thanks for the list love.
1) I should of clarified my life gain concern. I am concerned with hyper agro match ups. Burn , infect ect.
2) As for the concern about land hate I am concerned I don't have enough. Eldrazi, tron, ect. Was thinking maybe splash in red for blood moon main then just bounce it with cloudstone. .. seems like a decent SB option.
3) your right I should add the wolf run and a stomping ground. What do you think about running 4 Stomping Ground. That way wolf run is still playable if the stomping grounds gets ghost quartered. Also opens up more sideboard answers.
4) I was thinking maybe adding 1 wave and 1 amisists Awakening. But I mighit just go 2 waves.
5. I was up late brewing and found life and limb on the gather last night. My thought was get a bunch of forests with either garruk or nissa ready then drop it the turn I plan on alpha striking. Then bounce it back to my hand with cloudstone.
Also a one of banefire for novelty laughs.
Like I said I'm really excited about this list and want to get as much ideas/ thoughts on it before I go back to the brewing lair and Tinker with it some more.
I think the Blood Moon approach is spot on. Yeah, it turns off the land-based wins, but so what? You can still go for Command-Witness lock, or smash face with Titan or Planeswalkers. And you can always surprise them by playing normally under Blood Moon, then hitting it with your own Command, attacking with Titan, fetching up 2 fresh lands to go with your suddenly-active Valakuts...
As for burn, well, Skullcrack/A.Command is always a danger, but P.Command gives you a shot game 1. Games 2-3, you just add some good SB cards, like Kitchen Finks or the like. Life doesn't help much vs Infect, but Fog is always funny.
Seriously, that Valakut idea looks nice. If you can play Titan on T3, then Prismatic Omen and attack on T4, you win immediately (4 Valakuts each triggering twice is 24 damage). That fact makes me think you should consider a 4th Titan, and/or a Pact or two specifically to try and help assure you have a Titan.
The more I look at this, the more it makes Scapeshift seem very, very silly in comparison.
Edit: Two afterthoughts:
1. Fetchlands could be good. They can potentially trigger Valakut twice, as well as fetch your Stomping Grounds for Blood Moon out of the SB.
2. You have insufficient green sources. A bare minimum of 13 should be sought.
Are people still sold on Nissa, voice of zendikar for the walker build? I've been playing with it and it often feels very underwhelming. That 0/1 plant isn't gonna help you much in most situations and the -2 ability is only good if you have a mini army out already. I don't really get why people are/were playing it as a 4 of. To be honest I think I'd rather have Domri Rade if I had to pick a 3 mana walker. Nissa wins in an attrition war, but I think Domri is better in terms of immediate impact despite being kind of hit or miss with his plus 1. I'm still currently playing with Nissa, but I think she might just be a little too slow for my tastes. I'd like to hear what other people's experiences have been.
The problem with Domri Rade is having no protect, giving only 1 devotion, and forcing you to protect him with creatures that give devotion(we don't like blocking).
Nissa is strong in the sense that:
1. she stalls the game out which lets us build/find wincons.
2.In a stalemate scenario she has a looming sphinx's revelation.
3. In the games where you dont see top end, you make a plant and gavony your team twice over the next few turns.
4. She protects your team from pontiff/zealous persecutions due to gavony.
5. multiples of her work due to -2 nissa, recast -2 nissa to buff up the team.
6. makes two targets on turn 2, which makes 1 for 1 difficult.
7. forces control players to lose card advantage due to threat of ultimate, and not dying to bolt after +1
The idea behind her is to lower the variance that this deck suffers from. Eternal witness and courser won't necessarily fix a bad hand, but nissa can turn your mana dorks into valid threats. She provides early game protection, while adding 2 devotion- and more or less gives you more options in any given situation.
the only time where she has felt bad was when I queued into goblins and couldn't chump block stall due to legion loyalist. She has practical applications in near every MU and provides an alternate psuedo-wincon, or the space to get her. Even then the opponent still has incentive to swing her instead of you, due to the threat of gaining life.
With an ideal hand, shes not perfect. For those less than ideal hands, she provides some much needed utility.
I don't know that I'd enjoy playing that build quite as much myself. That said, if you're fighting something like Eldrazi, Pact or Chord is a LOT faster than Command, Wave, or Hydra. If you look at the deck, it's clear he made a conscious decision to that effect. I also think the one maindeck GQ is a nice touch, especially with Eternal Witness to recur it. Honestly, I'd probably just drop Command in that deck: as nice as it might be to have it, really, he'd probably be better served by another Chord. Aside from soft-lock, nothing it does couldn't be accomplished by other cards in his toolbox.
The utility from primal is far more worthwhile than another chord in the main. Its mainboard graveyard hate/artifact hate/wincon with ewit/mill hate/burn hate/everything hate. I'm pretty sure chord is a winmore in this deck.
Great points on Nissa. I agree that she is not the most explosive of our turn-3 options; but she makes up for this by adding utility and resilience to the deck. That, and in the Walker build, she is an additional combo piece...but this is for a specific deck rather than a archetype-wide benefit.
I don't know if I'd call Chord of Calling "win more" (as it can be used when you are ahead to close out a game, from behind when you have only mana and/or maybe a token or dork or two, or to break a stalemate....I do agree that the added utility of Primal Command has to be taken into account when comparing the cards though. It is a Green Devotion staple for a reason
On the topic of Chord of Calling...it is a very specific tutor with very specific uses/targets/ways to abuse it. The only times it is better than our other options are if all of the following are met : (A) your deck goes wide and you can take advantage of having an army of small creatures, (B) you want to be able to tutor for things at instant speed to deal with certain situations, and/or (C) you want to tutor for non-green creatures. I look at Chord like more of sideboard card than a maindeck one. It just allows me to utilize a tutor for true HATE creatures without fundamentally changing the other cards in the deck. If you are looking for general, main-deck tutors for Green Devotion, Summoner's Pact and Primal Command are better in most situations.
I have recently added Burning-Tree Emissary back into my deck as well. It's such a tough call; because BTE is so lightning fast and can do some broken things early in a devotion deck; but late-game it is a poor top deck. The addition of Nissa has helped (as you can turn it into a 3/3 or 4/4 and Curio of course helps (as she becomes a "free" body to bounce or create red mana when needed). I'll post my tuned list ASAP. It's a little different from past lists (as it is more tuned so there are more, 1, 2, and 3-of's) but the core cards are essentially the same.
I also know some have not liked the idea in the past...but I have found that a 1-of Sylvan Scrying has been a very useful tool in my deck. It essentially acts as an additional copy of Nykthos, helps me hit land drops if needed, allows me to tutor for Kessig Wolf Run...it has been quite good. I don't know if I'd play two (as a single copy feels just about right); but I personally have found the card to be useful.
I think the Blood Moon approach is spot on. Yeah, it turns off the land-based wins, but so what? You can still go for Command-Witness lock, or smash face with Titan or Planeswalkers. And you can always surprise them by playing normally under Blood Moon, then hitting it with your own Command, attacking with Titan, fetching up 2 fresh lands to go with your suddenly-active Valakuts...
As for burn, well, Skullcrack/A.Command is always a danger, but P.Command gives you a shot game 1. Games 2-3, you just add some good SB cards, like Kitchen Finks or the like. Life doesn't help much vs Infect, but Fog is always funny.
Seriously, that Valakut idea looks nice. If you can play Titan on T3, then Prismatic Omen and attack on T4, you win immediately (4 Valakuts each triggering twice is 24 damage). That fact makes me think you should consider a 4th Titan, and/or a Pact or two specifically to try and help assure you have a Titan.
The more I look at this, the more it makes Scapeshift seem very, very silly in comparison.
Edit: Two afterthoughts:
1. Fetchlands could be good. They can potentially trigger Valakut twice, as well as fetch your Stomping Grounds for Blood Moon out of the SB.
2. You have insufficient green sources. A bare minimum of 13 should be sought.
So taking some of your input this is what I have for the list as of now.
It's a WIP Walker build. Surprisingly, it can close out quickly by just slamming cheap bodies and using either Garruk, Nissa, or Hoof. Though sometimes it does nothing for turns on end too. The fastest start I've had was:
I'm tempted to make this more midrange, possibly by using more of Kiora's -2 and the graveyard. The original idea was to build it in more of a Legacy Nic Fit style.
Criticism is welcome. And if you can legit squeeze Plow Under in, I'd be thankful. Plow /Witness was one of my favorite Standard decks.
You could maybe try alchemists refuge for spicy-flash in thragtusk end of turn/instant speed primal command tech!
Great idea! I played a deck with Alchemist's Refuge for a little while while playing with blue splashes....it is the most fun I've ever had with a devotion deck. It is SOOO much fun to cast huge creatures on their turn...they never know what to do I didn't test nearly enough to get it to work...but I wouldn't be surprised if it ended up being a powerful/useful utility land in the deck worth it's slot.
I've never been crazy about Curio builds, but that's just me. If you have it, you don't need Sabertooth for the lock, though, right.
I jotted down a build that looks similar to what you have now. I went to 21 land, which had 1 Grounds, 4 Foothills, 8 Forest. Also skipped Wave, and put in Courser for more defense (also helps Valakut in a long game).
But I think it needs some testing at this point to figure it out. My only worry would be consistency and surviving until Titan lands.
I've never been crazy about Curio builds, but that's just me. If you have it, you don't need Sabertooth for the lock, though, right.
I jotted down a build that looks similar to what you have now. I went to 21 land, which had 1 Grounds, 4 Foothills, 8 Forest. Also skipped Wave, and put in Courser for more defense (also helps Valakut in a long game).
But I think it needs some testing at this point to figure it out. My only worry would be consistency and surviving until Titan lands.
The Sabertooth is what makes the lock a hard lock. ( you return the e-wit to your hand and return primal command again and again.) After a little math crunching cloudstone actually will slow down the build. The plan is to play creatures and lands not bounce stuff for combos.
I do feel your right about needing another beater of some kind. Maybe drop the Oaths for 2 Tooth and Nail and two beaters.
With the slots free from cloudstone I can add the 4 fetch lands.
I meant that Cloudstone Curio allows you to recur Eternal Witness the same as Sabertooth, so with Curio you have a perma-lock anyway.
I don't think T&N fits. Yeah, it may get 2 Titans and win, but you need to have Omen or devote 2 more slots to another victory condition beyond T&N itself. Besides, a 9-mana Genesis Hydra might find a Titan or Omens and is threatening anyway regardless of countermagic, while a 9 mana Wave probably gets a bunch of Valakut triggers right there.
I'd say give that builds a try as is. It looks solid, and I'd like to hear how it performs.
I don't know if it pays to develop in parallel. It will be interesting to see if starting from the Nykthos shell rather than the Scapeshift shell yields different, and hopefully better, results. I don't like how dependent we are on Omen but, with Hydras and Titans, that may not matter.
I meant that Cloudstone Curio allows you to recur Eternal Witness the same as Sabertooth, so with Curio you have a perma-lock anyway.
I don't think T&N fits. Yeah, it may get 2 Titans and win, but you need to have Omen or devote 2 more slots to another victory condition beyond T&N itself. Besides, a 9-mana Genesis Hydra might find a Titan or Omens and is threatening anyway regardless of countermagic, while a 9 mana Wave probably gets a bunch of Valakut triggers right there.
I'd say give that builds a try as is. It looks solid, and I'd like to hear how it performs.
I don't know if it pays to develop in parallel. It will be interesting to see if starting from the Nykthos shell rather than the Scapeshift shell yields different, and hopefully better, results. I don't like how dependent we are on Omen but, with Hydras and Titans, that may not matter.
I seen an older list for Scapeshift with titans. My thought is first mono color is real nice mana base. We have multiple different win conditions. Could go back to running a more walker base like I had before and have the Valakut's as a little something extra to watch out for.
I meant that Cloudstone Curio allows you to recur Eternal Witness the same as Sabertooth, so with Curio you have a perma-lock anyway.
I don't think T&N fits. Yeah, it may get 2 Titans and win, but you need to have Omen or devote 2 more slots to another victory condition beyond T&N itself. Besides, a 9-mana Genesis Hydra might find a Titan or Omens and is threatening anyway regardless of countermagic, while a 9 mana Wave probably gets a bunch of Valakut triggers right there.
I'd say give that builds a try as is. It looks solid, and I'd like to hear how it performs.
I don't know if it pays to develop in parallel. It will be interesting to see if starting from the Nykthos shell rather than the Scapeshift shell yields different, and hopefully better, results. I don't like how dependent we are on Omen but, with Hydras and Titans, that may not matter.
Yeah...Titan/Scapeshift/Prismatic Omen has been a thing for a long while (although it fell out of popularity a long while back). I think you guys are on to something though coming at it from a devotion front. It's definitely different enough to be considered your own build (Devotionshift!)...Keep up the cool brewing!
I meant that Cloudstone Curio allows you to recur Eternal Witness the same as Sabertooth, so with Curio you have a perma-lock anyway.
I don't think T&N fits. Yeah, it may get 2 Titans and win, but you need to have Omen or devote 2 more slots to another victory condition beyond T&N itself. Besides, a 9-mana Genesis Hydra might find a Titan or Omens and is threatening anyway regardless of countermagic, while a 9 mana Wave probably gets a bunch of Valakut triggers right there.
I'd say give that builds a try as is. It looks solid, and I'd like to hear how it performs.
I don't know if it pays to develop in parallel. It will be interesting to see if starting from the Nykthos shell rather than the Scapeshift shell yields different, and hopefully better, results. I don't like how dependent we are on Omen but, with Hydras and Titans, that may not matter.
Yeah...Titan/Scapeshift/Prismatic Omen has been a thing for a long while (although it fell out of popularity a long while back). I think you guys are on to something though coming at it from a devotion front. It's definitely different enough to be considered your own build (Devotionshift!)...Keep up the cool brewing!
Not going to lie, I feel really good about the praise and help the both of you are giving this brew. It means a lot. There is just one thing I will disagree with CurdBros on. Devotionshift..... not fan lol(doesn't even run shift lol ). A name will come.
This brew actually started from my infinite landfall brew if you can believe it.
I've only been able to play in 3 leagues in my time on MTGO so far with my latest list. I went 11-4 overall, going 4-1, 3-2, and 4-1 in each. I punted away two of the matches - one against Affinity, another against UW Eldrazi, and I knew what I did wrong on each misclick, which I attribute not being familiar enough with the interface again. The Strangleroot Geists don't have the explosive "I-Win" turns that BTEs give you, but they give us a lot of game in our bad matchups (Control, GB/X). My other two losses are 1-2 to Merfolk, and 1-2 to UW Eldrazi. Focus on tuning the board for your bad matchups, and change maindeck cards to fix weaknesses. We have a ton of room to work within the shell. The cards are there. We just have to make use of them.
Your list is also more "All-In" Combo as you yourself have admitted and I've observed on stream. If you took a slightly different approach, you'd be having better results I think. What deck's giving you trouble in particular?
--
Resolving the same Slaughter Games several times against a Blue Tron player thanks to Temur Sabertooth is good.
Here's what I've been running on MTGO since Genesis Hydra's bugged:
SB slots on the cutting block: Ruric Thar, Fracturing Gust, and the 3rd Bonfire.
I've played in some 2-mans as well, and my record with the deck on MTGO is 14-4 so far, which is a small sample size but it feels good and only has felt hopeless once, when I was drawing dead against Merfolk.
I meant that Cloudstone Curio allows you to recur Eternal Witness the same as Sabertooth, so with Curio you have a perma-lock anyway.
I don't think T&N fits. Yeah, it may get 2 Titans and win, but you need to have Omen or devote 2 more slots to another victory condition beyond T&N itself. Besides, a 9-mana Genesis Hydra might find a Titan or Omens and is threatening anyway regardless of countermagic, while a 9 mana Wave probably gets a bunch of Valakut triggers right there.
I'd say give that builds a try as is. It looks solid, and I'd like to hear how it performs.
I don't know if it pays to develop in parallel. It will be interesting to see if starting from the Nykthos shell rather than the Scapeshift shell yields different, and hopefully better, results. I don't like how dependent we are on Omen but, with Hydras and Titans, that may not matter.
So I am Tinker with two lists. One is the cloudstone list. The other is using lotus cobras and is green with a blue splash for the blue retreat and the alchemists refuge. I will play test both lists and report back in a few days.
I've only been able to play in 3 leagues in my time on MTGO so far with my latest list. I went 11-4 overall, going 4-1, 3-2, and 4-1 in each. I punted away two of the matches - one against Affinity, another against UW Eldrazi, and I knew what I did wrong on each misclick, which I attribute not being familiar enough with the interface again. The Strangleroot Geists don't have the explosive "I-Win" turns that BTEs give you, but they give us a lot of game in our bad matchups (Control, GB/X). My other two losses are 1-2 to Merfolk, and 1-2 to UW Eldrazi. Focus on tuning the board for your bad matchups, and change maindeck cards to fix weaknesses. We have a ton of room to work within the shell. The cards are there. We just have to make use of them.
Your list is also more "All-In" Combo as you yourself have admitted and I've observed on stream. If you took a slightly different approach, you'd be having better results I think. What deck's giving you trouble in particular?
--
Resolving the same Slaughter Games several times against a Blue Tron player thanks to Temur Sabertooth is good.
Here's what I've been running on MTGO since Genesis Hydra's bugged:
SB slots on the cutting block: Ruric Thar, Fracturing Gust, and the 3rd Bonfire.
I've played in some 2-mans as well, and my record with the deck on MTGO is 14-4 so far, which is a small sample size but it feels good and only has felt hopeless once, when I was drawing dead against Merfolk.
What it would look like with genesis hydra not being bugged?
@Gm13p I really don't know how that deck wouldn't just get blown out by land hate. I guess the backup plan is to go hard on devotion count. I think you would really need to being playing against a very particular meta for a deck like that to do well.
It's an all-in wave, really lacks of wincons to my taste.
As for the meta being hostile: no argument. I think that's part of the reason toolbox and planeswalkers appear to be working at least as well as the X-finishers or T&N right now: they can play the old fashioned way without getting crushed if their Nykthos or Sprawls get removed.
You know what feels worst about this? We're getting hit by Eldrazi-hate that isn't even actually all that good against Eldrazi! We're actually in the same boat as Tron, now that I think about it.
Modern: Merfolk UU // Green Devotion GG // SkRed Red RR
Legacy: Death & Taxes WW // Burn RR // Death's Shadow Delver UB
Commander: Brago UW // Karlov WB
As promised I have another crazy devotion brew to share. I'm kinda excited about this one. It needs more work before I even think of taking it to even a fnm, but it is fun to play. I present to you mono green valakut devotion.
4 Utopia Sprawl
4 Oath of Nissa
2 Life and Limb
4 Arbor Elf
4 Genesis Hydra
3 Primeval Titan
3 Eternal Witness
1 Temur Sabertooth
1 Acidic Slime
4 Nissa, Voice of Zendikar
3 Primal Command
4 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
11 Forest
So with this brew there is multiple win conditions. 1) straight creature beats 2) bolts from Valakut 3) animated forests from Life and Limb buffed from Nissa and Garruk.
My concerns right now is lack of life gain and land destruction.
I do have the hard lock primal combo in the deck.
Thoughts?
1. How much life gain do you need? Is Primal Command not going to cut it? If not, well, I think the obvious go-to choice here might be Courser.
2. When you say you're worried about land-destruction, I assume you mean your lands? I wouldn't be quite so worried: you can win without Valakut, and the only dead card will be Prismatic Omen.
3. Speaking of which, you're playing 3x Primeval Titan. There is no reason not to run at least 1x Kessig and 1x Stomping Ground, as an alternate knock-out.
4. Hydra is great in searching out Omen/Titan. It's a shame that, unlike Wave, it doesn't get land. I'm just saying...
5. Life and Limb seems like it could become a potentially dangerous liability, even as it's a potential finisher. While potentially it can blindside an opponent and just win, is it really preferable over just playing more creatures to Overrun with?
Modern: Merfolk UU // Green Devotion GG // SkRed Red RR
Legacy: Death & Taxes WW // Burn RR // Death's Shadow Delver UB
Commander: Brago UW // Karlov WB
Thanks for the list love.
1) I should of clarified my life gain concern. I am concerned with hyper agro match ups. Burn , infect ect.
2) As for the concern about land hate I am concerned I don't have enough. Eldrazi, tron, ect. Was thinking maybe splash in red for blood moon main then just bounce it with cloudstone. .. seems like a decent SB option.
3) your right I should add the wolf run and a stomping ground. What do you think about running 4 Stomping Ground. That way wolf run is still playable if the stomping grounds gets ghost quartered. Also opens up more sideboard answers.
4) I was thinking maybe adding 1 wave and 1 amisists Awakening. But I mighit just go 2 waves.
5. I was up late brewing and found life and limb on the gather last night. My thought was get a bunch of forests with either garruk or nissa ready then drop it the turn I plan on alpha striking. Then bounce it back to my hand with cloudstone.
Also a one of banefire for novelty laughs.
Like I said I'm really excited about this list and want to get as much ideas/ thoughts on it before I go back to the brewing lair and Tinker with it some more.
Thoughts?
As for burn, well, Skullcrack/A.Command is always a danger, but P.Command gives you a shot game 1. Games 2-3, you just add some good SB cards, like Kitchen Finks or the like. Life doesn't help much vs Infect, but Fog is always funny.
Seriously, that Valakut idea looks nice. If you can play Titan on T3, then Prismatic Omen and attack on T4, you win immediately (4 Valakuts each triggering twice is 24 damage). That fact makes me think you should consider a 4th Titan, and/or a Pact or two specifically to try and help assure you have a Titan.
The more I look at this, the more it makes Scapeshift seem very, very silly in comparison.
Edit: Two afterthoughts:
1. Fetchlands could be good. They can potentially trigger Valakut twice, as well as fetch your Stomping Grounds for Blood Moon out of the SB.
2. You have insufficient green sources. A bare minimum of 13 should be sought.
Modern: Merfolk UU // Green Devotion GG // SkRed Red RR
Legacy: Death & Taxes WW // Burn RR // Death's Shadow Delver UB
Commander: Brago UW // Karlov WB
Great points on Nissa. I agree that she is not the most explosive of our turn-3 options; but she makes up for this by adding utility and resilience to the deck. That, and in the Walker build, she is an additional combo piece...but this is for a specific deck rather than a archetype-wide benefit.
I don't know if I'd call Chord of Calling "win more" (as it can be used when you are ahead to close out a game, from behind when you have only mana and/or maybe a token or dork or two, or to break a stalemate....I do agree that the added utility of Primal Command has to be taken into account when comparing the cards though. It is a Green Devotion staple for a reason
On the topic of Chord of Calling...it is a very specific tutor with very specific uses/targets/ways to abuse it. The only times it is better than our other options are if all of the following are met : (A) your deck goes wide and you can take advantage of having an army of small creatures, (B) you want to be able to tutor for things at instant speed to deal with certain situations, and/or (C) you want to tutor for non-green creatures. I look at Chord like more of sideboard card than a maindeck one. It just allows me to utilize a tutor for true HATE creatures without fundamentally changing the other cards in the deck. If you are looking for general, main-deck tutors for Green Devotion, Summoner's Pact and Primal Command are better in most situations.
I have recently added Burning-Tree Emissary back into my deck as well. It's such a tough call; because BTE is so lightning fast and can do some broken things early in a devotion deck; but late-game it is a poor top deck. The addition of Nissa has helped (as you can turn it into a 3/3 or 4/4 and Curio of course helps (as she becomes a "free" body to bounce or create red mana when needed). I'll post my tuned list ASAP. It's a little different from past lists (as it is more tuned so there are more, 1, 2, and 3-of's) but the core cards are essentially the same.
I also know some have not liked the idea in the past...but I have found that a 1-of Sylvan Scrying has been a very useful tool in my deck. It essentially acts as an additional copy of Nykthos, helps me hit land drops if needed, allows me to tutor for Kessig Wolf Run...it has been quite good. I don't know if I'd play two (as a single copy feels just about right); but I personally have found the card to be useful.
So taking some of your input this is what I have for the list as of now.
4 Omen
4 Genesis Hydra
4 Primeval Titan
4 Arbor elf
4 utopia sprawl
3 eternal witness
4 cloudstone
4 oath of nissa
4 garruk Wildspeaker
3 primal command
1 Temur Sabertooth
2 Genesis Wave
2 summoner's pact
4 Valakut
4 nykthos
1 wolf run
4 Stomping Ground
8 forest
~~~~~
I am drawing a blank on what to take out for 4 fetch lands. I am also at 12 green sources.
I am now on the fence about cloudstone. But I feel that it has a spot.
Thoughts
Great idea! I played a deck with Alchemist's Refuge for a little while while playing with blue splashes....it is the most fun I've ever had with a devotion deck. It is SOOO much fun to cast huge creatures on their turn...they never know what to do I didn't test nearly enough to get it to work...but I wouldn't be surprised if it ended up being a powerful/useful utility land in the deck worth it's slot.
I jotted down a build that looks similar to what you have now. I went to 21 land, which had 1 Grounds, 4 Foothills, 8 Forest. Also skipped Wave, and put in Courser for more defense (also helps Valakut in a long game).
But I think it needs some testing at this point to figure it out. My only worry would be consistency and surviving until Titan lands.
Modern: Merfolk UU // Green Devotion GG // SkRed Red RR
Legacy: Death & Taxes WW // Burn RR // Death's Shadow Delver UB
Commander: Brago UW // Karlov WB
The Sabertooth is what makes the lock a hard lock. ( you return the e-wit to your hand and return primal command again and again.) After a little math crunching cloudstone actually will slow down the build. The plan is to play creatures and lands not bounce stuff for combos.
I do feel your right about needing another beater of some kind. Maybe drop the Oaths for 2 Tooth and Nail and two beaters.
With the slots free from cloudstone I can add the 4 fetch lands.
So I'm looking at,
4 Prismatic Omen
4 Genesis Hydra
4 Primeval Titan
4 Arbor elf
4 utopia sprawl
4 garruk
4 oath of nissa
3 eternal witness
3 primal command
1 Temur Sabertooth
2 Genesis Wave
2 summoner's pact
4 Valakut
4 nykthos
4 wooded foot hill
4 Stomping Ground
1 wolf run
8 forest
Thoughts?
I don't think T&N fits. Yeah, it may get 2 Titans and win, but you need to have Omen or devote 2 more slots to another victory condition beyond T&N itself. Besides, a 9-mana Genesis Hydra might find a Titan or Omens and is threatening anyway regardless of countermagic, while a 9 mana Wave probably gets a bunch of Valakut triggers right there.
I'd say give that builds a try as is. It looks solid, and I'd like to hear how it performs.
Edit: bad news, found out we're not so original.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/developing-competitive-modern/654300-rg-titan-scapeshift
I don't know if it pays to develop in parallel. It will be interesting to see if starting from the Nykthos shell rather than the Scapeshift shell yields different, and hopefully better, results. I don't like how dependent we are on Omen but, with Hydras and Titans, that may not matter.
Modern: Merfolk UU // Green Devotion GG // SkRed Red RR
Legacy: Death & Taxes WW // Burn RR // Death's Shadow Delver UB
Commander: Brago UW // Karlov WB
I seen an older list for Scapeshift with titans. My thought is first mono color is real nice mana base. We have multiple different win conditions. Could go back to running a more walker base like I had before and have the Valakut's as a little something extra to watch out for.
Yeah...Titan/Scapeshift/Prismatic Omen has been a thing for a long while (although it fell out of popularity a long while back). I think you guys are on to something though coming at it from a devotion front. It's definitely different enough to be considered your own build (Devotionshift!)...Keep up the cool brewing!
Not going to lie, I feel really good about the praise and help the both of you are giving this brew. It means a lot. There is just one thing I will disagree with CurdBros on. Devotionshift..... not fan lol(doesn't even run shift lol ). A name will come.
This brew actually started from my infinite landfall brew if you can believe it.
Your list is also more "All-In" Combo as you yourself have admitted and I've observed on stream. If you took a slightly different approach, you'd be having better results I think. What deck's giving you trouble in particular?
--
Resolving the same Slaughter Games several times against a Blue Tron player thanks to Temur Sabertooth is good.
Here's what I've been running on MTGO since Genesis Hydra's bugged:
4 Arbor Elf
3 Lotus Cobra
4 Strangleroot Geist
3 Courser of Kruphix
2 Eternal Witness
1 Temur Sabertooth
1 Thrun, The Last Troll
1 Acidic Slime
1 Primeval Titan
1 Hornet Queen
1 Craterhoof Behemoth
Non-Creature Spells (17)
4 Utopia Sprawl
4 Oath of Nissa
3 Summoner's Pact
2 Primal Command
4 Garruk Wildspeaker
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Windswept Heath
3 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
2 Stomping Ground
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Kessig Wolf Run
5 Forest
3 Bonfire of the Damned
1 Ruric Thar, the Unbowed
2 Blood Moon
2 Slaughter Games
1 Nylea's Disciple
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Scavenging Ooze
2 Crumble to Dust
1 Fracturing Gust
SB slots on the cutting block: Ruric Thar, Fracturing Gust, and the 3rd Bonfire.
I've played in some 2-mans as well, and my record with the deck on MTGO is 14-4 so far, which is a small sample size but it feels good and only has felt hopeless once, when I was drawing dead against Merfolk.
So I am Tinker with two lists. One is the cloudstone list. The other is using lotus cobras and is green with a blue splash for the blue retreat and the alchemists refuge. I will play test both lists and report back in a few days.
What it would look like with genesis hydra not being bugged?