Ugin is random. Homever, It is no more random that all of those crappy cards people tend to play nowadays, like Hornet Queen. Or Thragtusks. Are you really trumping anyone with these Thragtusks? I don't think so, it's still just a speed bump against creature decks, gaining you a bunch of life and blocking two times. Either way you still need to resolve your Titan to start winning. Hornet Queen can outvalue someone from time to time, damn better hope that there are zero copies of Lingering Souls after sideboarding. Ugin homever, just trumps. It just wins sometimes, but it is more of a troll card. I've played Karn Liberated, Numot, the Devastator, Teneb, the Harvester, Intet, the Dreamer, Villainous Wealth, Siege Rhino, Hooded Hydra, Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur, Fiery Gambit, and a few other in this slot already, don't take it too seriously.
I'd say Thragtusk is the best cards in your sideboard, so I really dont know what your talking about. I mean there's a reason most lists play 3. Its pretty good vs BGx decks, but most importantly they are really good vs burn, one of the worst matchups. How can they seriously beat that much life gain? Hornet queen is not a win con. Our late game is so much better than most decks, Hornet Queen is usually a defensive card until we get a t least 1 Titan on board. Starting with a Titan and Tutoring up a Hornet Queen will usually be good enough since we can start double striking for 12 or 16+ with trample while still having hornet queen and her Bees for defense. Unless playing vs tokens, Lingering Souls should start being forced to chump block
I agree with the Thragtusk part.... I cant imagine not having him in the side. Quite a few games I have won, have been on the back of dropping the Hive Mind combo and turning into a more mid-range ramp deck.
Hornet Queen has been on my chopping block for a while, but every time I make up my mind, she stalls a game that would have otherwise been a loss and allowed me to go over the top (Wilted Abzan and Gavony Township is just a pain, but thank god nothing has trample).
Maybe my problem is I am too quick to cut the Hive Mind out of my deck.....
@ everyone. How often do you end up cutting your Hive Minds? In what match ups do you cut them and what match ups do you keep them?
To be honest I find myself rarely siding out the hivemind at all, even against decks that can pay for the summoners pact. Sometimes its just nice to be able to cast whatever my opponent is casting. The only time Hivemind comes out for me is when i feel i need to bring in more sideboard hate than usual This means its usually less that Hivemind is not good in the match up just that for some reason or another i feel i need the hate more. Not saying its the end all answer, or even a good one, its just how I have sideboarded since i started playing the deck.
I run 3 Hivemind in the maindeck and I tend to side out at least one of them quite often. I rarely cut them all, unless I really need to side in a lot of hate cards.
The usual flex spots for me are 1 Hivemind, 1 Azusa, 1 Pact of Negation, 1 or 2 Sleight of Hand, 1 land not useful in the matchup I'm facing (Khalni/Fountain/Cavern...)
Hivemind comes out when the opponent can often pay for the pacts and/or destroy my hand. For the mirror match, I can't tell, I never played it.
For Burn, pretty much everybody agree : it's a quite easy matchup. Like every deck that let us do our thing. The only real danger is Skullcrack when Titan comes in play and then they finish you up on their next turn. It gets easier with Baloth/Thragtusk but it's not really necessary.
hey guys, went 3-1 last night at my LGS modern night. There never is a top 8, just pack payout.
G1 2-0 VS UR Twin. G1 was pretty straight forward, lost a titan to electorlyze and flame slash, but got another. g2 was faster after a slaughterpact on a deceiver after my titan was tapped down.
G2 2-0 vs goryos Griselbrand
G3 0-2 vs infect - just couldnt get a titan down fast enough both games. Think he won on t3/4 both times.
G4 2-0 vs UWR Twin - first game was a long one, maybe around 30 mins. turn 3 path on titan which I pact of negation, in response he paths again. I land another titan two turns after which he snap paths. I land another titan the turn after which eats another path. Manage to win on my last and only titan. G2 Faster titan get him down to 4, he has 3 open mana, so i pact for another titan and give it hast so he can't tap down both or path both for the win.
I am considering replacing a city of brass with another basic forest, just to help with paths/blood moon. It would allow me to still cast titans and pay for summoners pacts. Needs testing.
G4 2-0 vs UWR Twin - first game was a long one, maybe around 30 mins. turn 3 path on titan which I pact of negation, in response he paths again. I land another titan two turns after which he snap paths. I land another titan the turn after which eats another path. Manage to win on my last and only titan. G2 Faster titan get him down to 4, he has 3 open mana, so i pact for another titan and give it hast so he can't tap down both or path both for the win.
This is the kind of match that really makes me think dragonlord dromoka is amazing, letting us attack with titan as soon as he comes out, without fear of path. I will be testing it out 1 in MB along with 4 Titans, when Dragons is released.
On another note, I don't think I've seen this yet but I am willing to try 1 batterskull mainboard as sometimes I'm just dudrling about with plant tokens. Would be good to do something awesome with them!
If you are worried about someone removing your Titan, play more Pact of Negation or Spellskite in the side.
They are better in more match ups and protect the titan better in the long run.
G4 2-0 vs UWR Twin - first game was a long one, maybe around 30 mins. turn 3 path on titan which I pact of negation, in response he paths again. I land another titan two turns after which he snap paths. I land another titan the turn after which eats another path. Manage to win on my last and only titan. G2 Faster titan get him down to 4, he has 3 open mana, so i pact for another titan and give it hast so he can't tap down both or path both for the win.
This is the kind of match that really makes me think dragonlord dromoka is amazing, letting us attack with titan as soon as he comes out, without fear of path. I will be testing it out 1 in MB along with 4 Titans, when Dragons is released.
On another note, I don't think I've seen this yet but I am willing to try 1 batterskull mainboard as sometimes I'm just dudrling about with plant tokens. Would be good to do something awesome with them!
Only issue with dragon is you'd want to drop it first then, so it'd just be path'd on the opponents turn, leaving your titan to still be path'd the turn after. With dropping a titan first at least you still get the two land triggers, to help ramp into further titan or get the tolaria west package. Also you'd need a selesnya sanctuary to cast the dragon. Could work, but I feel like I'd be just a so so card. I still like sigarda though.
stirrings really isn't all that great in this deck, it can use more consistency, but not in the form of stirrings, because it only finds cards you needed a few turns ago.
@artome, I don't run Stirrings because i hate them more than I hate Sleights. I wrote about it a few times in this thread already and provided broader explanation if you are interested in it.
Another thing tha strikes me against Thragtusk, is that he is incredibly useless against two of our actual hard matchups, Twin and Infect.
Infect is hard indeed. If the deck gets more play, a single Melira in the SB could be a solution ? But maybe it's just approaching the problem the wrong way, I don't know.
stirrings really isn't all that great in this deck, it can use more consistency, but not in the form of stirrings, because it only finds cards you needed a few turns ago.
I've loved drawing stirrings. If I don't have an amulet in my starting hand, and had to mull, seeing one or two is great because it will get me one, or another bounceland to accelerate a bit with summer bloom. I'm not a fan of sleights because i tend to use my blue mana on serum or transmuting, so having one green and one blue search is nice on the mana, especially with a simic growth chamber out.
stirrings really isn't all that great in this deck, it can use more consistency, but not in the form of stirrings, because it only finds cards you needed a few turns ago.
We've gone round and round with this argument, but i severely disagree. Ancient Stirrings is amazing in this deck. The only thing it can't find you is Summer Bloom. It finds you literally every other piece you would need though(Amulet, Bounce land, T-West[which can find Pacts, which can find Titan], Cavern of Souls, Engineered Explosives, Wurmcoil/ Karn/ Ugin) and digs 3 cards deeper than Sleight, and doesn't cost (u). Stirrings is amazing here. I truly can't wrap my head around not playing them. Sacrificing all the bonuses Stirrings rewards you, for a slightly better chance at finding Summer Bloom doesn't seem worth it.
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personally I don't run ancient stirrings doesn't ding up titan or hivemind which win me 90% of my games. but it can and could dig up my 9 and 10 wincons which are 2 batterskulls. added 2 lingering souls and you got random chances for flying 5/5 token which messes with people nicely!
9 out of 10 times messing with an opponent is what wins the game!
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stirrings really isn't all that great in this deck, it can use more consistency, but not in the form of stirrings, because it only finds cards you needed a few turns ago.
We've gone round and round with this argument, but i severely disagree. Ancient Stirrings is amazing in this deck. The only thing it can't find you is Summer Bloom. It finds you literally every other piece you would need though(Amulet, Bounce land, T-West[which can find Pacts, which can find Titan], Cavern of Souls, Engineered Explosives, Wurmcoil/ Karn/ Ugin) and digs 3 cards deeper than Sleight, and doesn't cost (u). Stirrings is amazing here. I truly can't wrap my head around not playing them. Sacrificing all the bonuses Stirrings rewards you, for a slightly better chance at finding Summer Bloom doesn't seem worth it.
I don't play them. I have a playset of Spirit guides instead. It speeds up the deck slightly and gets under hate (blood moon etc)
I go back and forth between them and ancient stirrings, but so far I'm sticking with spirit guides. (they go out in slower matchups, but stay in against things like affinity, and infect etc where speed is everything)
At the dallas modern premium IQ this past weekend a Bloom deck top eighted running Melira as a one of in the sideboard. I guess in this deck that's as good as running five. I think I'm gonna drop one of my three pyroclasm/firespout slot for her as infect has been a major problem for me at the LGS.
Whats a good number for the anti enchantment removal in the SB? Also whats a good split for Seal of Primordium and Nature's Claim? I've been running 2 of each since I couldnt decide, and i think 4 is a good number? Whats the consensus?
I've been running 4 Seal for a long time now. I also run an Engineered Explosives in the side as a catch all. Used to be main, but eventually moved it to the side.
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Not just the Tendo King, the power of the Galactic Leyline surpasses that of the Tempa Emperor, No!, It's magnificent power is even greater than that!
I've been running 4 Seal for a long time now. I also run an Engineered Explosives in the side as a catch all. Used to be main, but eventually moved it to the side.
Is nature's claim not good? I fear Seal getting remanded then they drop the Moon
Whats a good number for the anti enchantment removal in the SB? Also whats a good split for Seal of Primordium and Nature's Claim? I've been running 2 of each since I couldnt decide, and i think 4 is a good number? Whats the consensus?
I went to a PPTQ this weekend and went 4-4, with 3 of my match losses against Blood Moon decks. One was a Mardu token/Moon deck, 1 was Twin with main Blood MOon and 1 was Storm. I am just so sick of losing to Blood Moon......
My current sideboard is 3 Seals and 1 Swan Song. I feel like I either draw 1 of those (and neither is a 100% effective) in my opening or I am forced to mulligan. Without one of those to start, you have next to no shot against a Bloom Moon if it lands.
Maybe Reclaimation Sage needs to go in the side? its searchable with Pact, can be cast off of 1 forest and is a blocker?
I agree with the Thragtusk part.... I cant imagine not having him in the side. Quite a few games I have won, have been on the back of dropping the Hive Mind combo and turning into a more mid-range ramp deck.
Hornet Queen has been on my chopping block for a while, but every time I make up my mind, she stalls a game that would have otherwise been a loss and allowed me to go over the top (Wilted Abzan and Gavony Township is just a pain, but thank god nothing has trample).
Maybe my problem is I am too quick to cut the Hive Mind out of my deck.....
@ everyone. How often do you end up cutting your Hive Minds? In what match ups do you cut them and what match ups do you keep them?
The usual flex spots for me are 1 Hivemind, 1 Azusa, 1 Pact of Negation, 1 or 2 Sleight of Hand, 1 land not useful in the matchup I'm facing (Khalni/Fountain/Cavern...)
Hivemind comes out when the opponent can often pay for the pacts and/or destroy my hand. For the mirror match, I can't tell, I never played it.
For Burn, pretty much everybody agree : it's a quite easy matchup. Like every deck that let us do our thing. The only real danger is Skullcrack when Titan comes in play and then they finish you up on their next turn. It gets easier with Baloth/Thragtusk but it's not really necessary.
G1 2-0 VS UR Twin. G1 was pretty straight forward, lost a titan to electorlyze and flame slash, but got another. g2 was faster after a slaughterpact on a deceiver after my titan was tapped down.
G2 2-0 vs goryos Griselbrand
G3 0-2 vs infect - just couldnt get a titan down fast enough both games. Think he won on t3/4 both times.
G4 2-0 vs UWR Twin - first game was a long one, maybe around 30 mins. turn 3 path on titan which I pact of negation, in response he paths again. I land another titan two turns after which he snap paths. I land another titan the turn after which eats another path. Manage to win on my last and only titan. G2 Faster titan get him down to 4, he has 3 open mana, so i pact for another titan and give it hast so he can't tap down both or path both for the win.
I am considering replacing a city of brass with another basic forest, just to help with paths/blood moon. It would allow me to still cast titans and pay for summoners pacts. Needs testing.
Grand Arbiter
Omnath
Skittles
If you are worried about someone removing your Titan, play more Pact of Negation or Spellskite in the side.
They are better in more match ups and protect the titan better in the long run.
Only issue with dragon is you'd want to drop it first then, so it'd just be path'd on the opponents turn, leaving your titan to still be path'd the turn after. With dropping a titan first at least you still get the two land triggers, to help ramp into further titan or get the tolaria west package. Also you'd need a selesnya sanctuary to cast the dragon. Could work, but I feel like I'd be just a so so card. I still like sigarda though.
Grand Arbiter
Omnath
Skittles
Infect is hard indeed. If the deck gets more play, a single Melira in the SB could be a solution ? But maybe it's just approaching the problem the wrong way, I don't know.
I've loved drawing stirrings. If I don't have an amulet in my starting hand, and had to mull, seeing one or two is great because it will get me one, or another bounceland to accelerate a bit with summer bloom. I'm not a fan of sleights because i tend to use my blue mana on serum or transmuting, so having one green and one blue search is nice on the mana, especially with a simic growth chamber out.
Grand Arbiter
Omnath
Skittles
but the titan price though................
titan 32tix
azusa 14
but paper azusa is more expensive.
personally I don't run ancient stirrings doesn't ding up titan or hivemind which win me 90% of my games. but it can and could dig up my 9 and 10 wincons which are 2 batterskulls. added 2 lingering souls and you got random chances for flying 5/5 token which messes with people nicely!
9 out of 10 times messing with an opponent is what wins the game!
Twitter- RogueSource.
Decks: "Name one! I probably got it built In one of these boxes."
---------------------------------------------------
Vintage will rise again! Buy a Mox today!
---------------------------------------------------
[I]Some call it dig through time, when really your digging through CRAP!
Merfolk! showing magic players what a shower is since Lorwyn!
I don't play them. I have a playset of Spirit guides instead. It speeds up the deck slightly and gets under hate (blood moon etc)
I go back and forth between them and ancient stirrings, but so far I'm sticking with spirit guides. (they go out in slower matchups, but stay in against things like affinity, and infect etc where speed is everything)
URStormRU
GRTitanshift[mana]RG/mana]
Is nature's claim not good? I fear Seal getting remanded then they drop the Moon
URStormRU
GRTitanshift[mana]RG/mana]
I have been seriously debating changing the Gruul Turfs into Golgari Rot Farms and putting Abrupt Decay into the deck/sideboard.
I went to a PPTQ this weekend and went 4-4, with 3 of my match losses against Blood Moon decks. One was a Mardu token/Moon deck, 1 was Twin with main Blood MOon and 1 was Storm. I am just so sick of losing to Blood Moon......
My current sideboard is 3 Seals and 1 Swan Song. I feel like I either draw 1 of those (and neither is a 100% effective) in my opening or I am forced to mulligan. Without one of those to start, you have next to no shot against a Bloom Moon if it lands.
Maybe Reclaimation Sage needs to go in the side? its searchable with Pact, can be cast off of 1 forest and is a blocker?