It's a slight nonbo yeah but it's still very much net positive for us. They have 4 Seas in their deck but 8 Islands to shut off, and we have answers to Seas if necessary. I'm curious what matchups you had in mind when you put it in the sideboard if not for decks with 8 Islands
Whats your rationale for 1 Ugin/1 All is Dust and 3 Ostone? It gives you diversification for the Humans matchup but also less total sweepers than the average list. When Humans was super popular I was on 2 Ugin/1 Dust/3 Ostone - the extra sweeper and the diversification. But the mania has died down a bit and I'm pretty set on 2 Ugin/4 Ostone main and no Dust. I like having the 2nd Ugin for the control matchups and Ostone kills a lot more things than Dust.
I personally don't like stretching the manabase down to 3 Forests because that ends up hurting in the matchups with lots of Field/GQ/Path, but if you don't see much of those then you can get paid off by the extra tech land.
I'm not sold on Broken Bond. I haven't tested it too much but it seems a bit clunky/gimmicky to me. Costing an extra mana and being a sorcery as opposed to Nature's Claim are real drawbacks. Getting an extra land that you may or may not even have in your hand at the time is not worth it IMO. But I've been on only 2 Claims for months now and I haven't missed having the 3rd. I think the slot is better used elsewhere.
Graveyard hate - you've got 5 pieces which is a solid number. I'm on 4 (2 Relic main, 2 Surgical side) and that's my minimum number to respect Dredge existing and that's all I would bring to the GP. BUT I also play a maindeck Scavenger Grounds which has been consistently great for me and acts as a 5th hate card. I think Cage is kinda weak right now because there's almost no Collected Company decks at the moment. It is good against Hollow One but they just blow it up with Grudge easily. Surgical has a lot more applications against the degenerate decks right now and Relic is just a really versatile card you don't want to leave home without.
Pithing Needle is a solid role-player but not something I really consider necessary in the sideboard these days. What are you aiming to name with it?
Except now I have +1 Relic, -1 Dismember main, and -1 Relic, -1 Thragtusk, +2 Karn, Scion of Urza side. I'm just starting to test this. I've had 3 Thragtusks for a long time now and have been very happy with it but Karn comes in in a lot of the same matchups and is even better in many cases. I've been playing Baby Karn in Eldrazi Tron and the fact that you can play it for only 4 generic mana against decks that are attacking your mana/in grindy matchups is very strong. It shines against Jund for example which has become too close for comfort lately.
I've been playing a similar list over the last couple of days, trying to figure out if I'm going to bring this or RG Eldrazi to the Vegas GP. Jund seems tough post board. The combination of Thoughtsize, Fulminator mage and damping sphere are challenging to overcome. Even BBE has been somewhat of a pain.
Sicsmoo - Are you running two Relics main and only 1 Dismember? I've been gathering information about the most recent sideboard options/favorable matchups. Is there an updated SB guide on the forums? Thanks.
yep currently on 2 Relic/1 Dismember main. It's nice to have a Dismember as a catch-all but I think Spatial Contortion is the better removal spell overall which I why I have 3 side.
I'd be willing to do a sideboard guide if people are interested that.
OK, I'll consider doing that if I get some time. I'll be more motivated to do so if others show interest. And no, the Surgicals are still in the board. As I said before I have +1 Relic, -1 Dismember main, and -1 Relic, -1 Thragtusk, +2 Karn, Scion of Urza side based on the list I posted.
I would be interested in a SB guide as well, I have my usuals that I board out but some matchups I am not sure.
The main reason for needle is to name pesky things, like fulminator, field of ruin, GQ, and colonnade, and any other planeswalkers or abilities that are annoying.
I took the 2nd ugin out because it just seemed really clunky to me, costing 8 forcing you to drop it turn 4 at the earliest when there is so much hate out there kind of hurts.
Yes the all is dust is for the humans MU, I have 4 at my LGS and it was very prevalent at regionals in Texas, but also put the hurt on other decks as well. It was the replacement for the 4th O-stone because o-stone can only pop on turn 4 and AID can come down on turn 3.
That's my thought process, not saying anyone's is right, just how I have noticed the deck run against certain MUs.
On Needle: Jund is really the only deck that's bringing in Fulminator, and I don't like Needle against them because they can kill it with half an Ancient Grudge that they're already bringing in against us. If it sticks it's nice, but it can be a blowout if they have Grudge.
It is good against UW, but I prefer to just ignore what they're doing and bring in tons of lower-curve threats (Thragtusks, TKS, baby Karn) which get around the land destruction.
I'd be willing to do a sideboard guide if people are interested that.
We've been chatting, but I would certainly be interested in something like that.
As an aside, I was listening to the GAM podcast the other day and Bryan was discussing using Warping Wail in the board over Spatial Contortion. His argument was that Wail kills all the really annoying creatures and helps vs Scapeshift at the same time. Which he believed was much more helpful then Spatial Contortion's targetted removal of slightly stronger creatures. Thoughts?
Wail is definitely a solid sideboard option right now. It's reasonably common to see a 2/2 split between Wail and Contortion. Against Humans though its reaally important to be able to kill a Meddling Mage that has your sweeper locked down which Wail can't do. I'm not really seeing much Scapeshift or other decks with important sorceries right now but if you are then it's worth finding room for Wails. I actually had 1 as my 15th card recently before I started experimenting with Karn.
Infernal Judgment seems annoying for us, but mainly for the fact that it cleanly answers Wurmcoil. Everything else we play generates value on cast or battlefield entry, or sacs like Ballista. Thragtusk of course ignores this completely out of the board.
Hollow One might really like this against us because Wurmcoil is enemy #1 and they're trying to race hard. Jund and Grixis can use it too since it hits Affinity pretty hard as well.
At first glance it seems a lot like Ceremonious Rejection to me - strong card against us but even more narrow which makes it hard to justify the sideboard slot for our opponents. I'm not an expert on Jund but it seems like this is just a worse Ancient Grudge for them. Hollow One same story.
I must admit it's a bit frustrating that they seem to feel the need to print hoser cards for Tron every set though.
Just wondering, what would the 4karn be brought in against? Trying to justify paying all dat $$ for them haha
Basically all the midrange and control matchups where you're looking to grind, especially post-board when they're bringing in land destruction, Blood Moon, Damping Sphere. The fact that it only costs 4 is crazy good in those scenarios. The less board presence they have, the better it is, so its best against UW, Jeskai, Mardu, Blue Moon. Also great against Jund, Eldrazi Tron, Ponza, Eldrazi Taxes, Lantern, and solid against Humans too because you can make a small army to buy time with.
That being said, if you're on the fence about shelling out the cash, it's certainly not necessary by any means. It's a hedge against fair decks that are popular now and have gotten better tools lately to grind us in the postboard games. But you can also do this by just playing a 3rd Thragtusk and using the other slot for something else.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
So I am taking this to gp vegas, what do yall think is the optimal sideboard to take?
2 Walking Ballista
1 World Breaker
3 Wurmcoil Engine
4 Chromatic Sphere
4 Chromatic Star
4 Ancient Stirrings
4 Expedition Map
4 Karn, Liberated
1 Ugin, The Spirit Dragon
4 Sylvan Scrying
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Dismember
3 Oblivion Stone
1 All Is Dust
4 Urza's Power Plant
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Tower
3 Forest
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Urza's Factory
1 Sanctum of Ugin
1 Emrakul, The Promised End
2 Nature's Claim
2 Thragtusk
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Surgical Extraction
3 Thought-Knot Seet
1 Broken Bond
1 Pithing Needle
I personally don't like stretching the manabase down to 3 Forests because that ends up hurting in the matchups with lots of Field/GQ/Path, but if you don't see much of those then you can get paid off by the extra tech land.
I'm not sold on Broken Bond. I haven't tested it too much but it seems a bit clunky/gimmicky to me. Costing an extra mana and being a sorcery as opposed to Nature's Claim are real drawbacks. Getting an extra land that you may or may not even have in your hand at the time is not worth it IMO. But I've been on only 2 Claims for months now and I haven't missed having the 3rd. I think the slot is better used elsewhere.
Graveyard hate - you've got 5 pieces which is a solid number. I'm on 4 (2 Relic main, 2 Surgical side) and that's my minimum number to respect Dredge existing and that's all I would bring to the GP. BUT I also play a maindeck Scavenger Grounds which has been consistently great for me and acts as a 5th hate card. I think Cage is kinda weak right now because there's almost no Collected Company decks at the moment. It is good against Hollow One but they just blow it up with Grudge easily. Surgical has a lot more applications against the degenerate decks right now and Relic is just a really versatile card you don't want to leave home without.
Pithing Needle is a solid role-player but not something I really consider necessary in the sideboard these days. What are you aiming to name with it?
My current list is pretty close to this: https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1116950#online
Except now I have +1 Relic, -1 Dismember main, and -1 Relic, -1 Thragtusk, +2 Karn, Scion of Urza side. I'm just starting to test this. I've had 3 Thragtusks for a long time now and have been very happy with it but Karn comes in in a lot of the same matchups and is even better in many cases. I've been playing Baby Karn in Eldrazi Tron and the fact that you can play it for only 4 generic mana against decks that are attacking your mana/in grindy matchups is very strong. It shines against Jund for example which has become too close for comfort lately.
I've been playing a similar list over the last couple of days, trying to figure out if I'm going to bring this or RG Eldrazi to the Vegas GP. Jund seems tough post board. The combination of Thoughtsize, Fulminator mage and damping sphere are challenging to overcome. Even BBE has been somewhat of a pain.
Sicsmoo - Are you running two Relics main and only 1 Dismember? I've been gathering information about the most recent sideboard options/favorable matchups. Is there an updated SB guide on the forums? Thanks.
yep currently on 2 Relic/1 Dismember main. It's nice to have a Dismember as a catch-all but I think Spatial Contortion is the better removal spell overall which I why I have 3 side.
I'd be willing to do a sideboard guide if people are interested that.
My sideboard currently
+2 Nature's Claim
+2 Surgical Extractions
+3 Contortion
+2 Warping Wail's
+3 TKS
+3 Thragtusk
The main reason for needle is to name pesky things, like fulminator, field of ruin, GQ, and colonnade, and any other planeswalkers or abilities that are annoying.
I took the 2nd ugin out because it just seemed really clunky to me, costing 8 forcing you to drop it turn 4 at the earliest when there is so much hate out there kind of hurts.
Yes the all is dust is for the humans MU, I have 4 at my LGS and it was very prevalent at regionals in Texas, but also put the hurt on other decks as well. It was the replacement for the 4th O-stone because o-stone can only pop on turn 4 and AID can come down on turn 3.
That's my thought process, not saying anyone's is right, just how I have noticed the deck run against certain MUs.
On Needle: Jund is really the only deck that's bringing in Fulminator, and I don't like Needle against them because they can kill it with half an Ancient Grudge that they're already bringing in against us. If it sticks it's nice, but it can be a blowout if they have Grudge.
It is good against UW, but I prefer to just ignore what they're doing and bring in tons of lower-curve threats (Thragtusks, TKS, baby Karn) which get around the land destruction.
We've been chatting, but I would certainly be interested in something like that.
As an aside, I was listening to the GAM podcast the other day and Bryan was discussing using Warping Wail in the board over Spatial Contortion. His argument was that Wail kills all the really annoying creatures and helps vs Scapeshift at the same time. Which he believed was much more helpful then Spatial Contortion's targetted removal of slightly stronger creatures. Thoughts?
Modern: Storm
Legacy: ANT
Instant
Exile target colorless creature, you gain life equal to its power.
GXTronGX
RWxBurnRWx
Hollow One might really like this against us because Wurmcoil is enemy #1 and they're trying to race hard. Jund and Grixis can use it too since it hits Affinity pretty hard as well.
I must admit it's a bit frustrating that they seem to feel the need to print hoser cards for Tron every set though.
That being said, if you're on the fence about shelling out the cash, it's certainly not necessary by any means. It's a hedge against fair decks that are popular now and have gotten better tools lately to grind us in the postboard games. But you can also do this by just playing a 3rd Thragtusk and using the other slot for something else.