MTG Salvation

Has Stain the mind worked good for someone? I feel like it's to clunky. It's great for decks like Ad nauseam and Grishoalbrand, but other than that? Can it be sided against the UW control matchup?

If you want to take advantage of beast whisperer, I wonder if throne of the god-pharaoh might be of use? Getting lots of draw with a heritage druid out you can ensure you do a lot of damage on the same turn as your 'elf storm'. Just a thought.

PS. Far out is there any word harder to spell than pharaoh?

How are you guys doing recently with Elves? I am considering ditching Cragganwick Cremator for Elves tomorrow. Big Staples tournament...

Nobody answered, so I played a pretty crappy SB.

26 person FNM. 4 rounds.

Round 1 vs. Abzan Company. He plays turn 2 Tireless Tracker. I play turn 2 a million things. He plays a turn 3 Kitchen Finks and loses to the crack back from Ezuri and dudes. In the next game, he can't find the combo, does a Company for a Noble Hierarch, and gets crunched by a bunch of Lords. We played a game 3 for fun and I kept on Dork, 2 lands, 3 Shaman of the Pack, and something else. I go off and double Shaman on a turn, while people watched in disgust. They probably thought it was the actual match. Intimidation. 2-0.

Round 2 vs. Grixis Control. Game 1, she fetches, but no shock. Tap out for Azcanta, the Sunken Ruin. I go off and play a million dudes, including 2 Shaman of the Pack. She scoops. The next game has Shaper's Sanctuary late, but I just couldn't find my 4th land until it was too late, as I got tempoed out by Anger of the Gods, Liliana the Last Hope, Izzet Staticaster, and removal. In the last game, I go Llanowar Elf into double Llanowar Elf into Lords. They got killed, but they hit for a bunch and the Swamp that got Thought Scoured prevented me from facing Damnation and LotH. Got there. 2-1.

Round 3 vs. Dredge. In the first game, I go off with a lot of Lords and dodge Conflagrate. This was the 2nd nut hand I've had this tournament. Felt good. In the next game, it is super close, but he made a small mistake of not dredging and casting Stinkweed Imp. I only had another Lord, so it would have put me dead next turn. I also made a mistake of not realizing that, but I did not get punished. 2-0.

Round 4 vs. Tron. I consider playing it out, but decide not to. I thought about turn 4 Ugin and O Stones and potential poor draws by me. He just beat the Tron mirror last round, so luck was on his side. 0-0-3.

I go 3-0-1. I pussied out in Round 4 because I hadn't won store credit in the past 3 times here, a low for me. Kind of wanted to 4-0, but I also wanted to watch my 2 friends that I drove with battle it out with Tron vs. Amu-Lit. Tron got it, Boooo!!!

Yeah, I had 4 Damping Sphere in the SB. I should have played. I think I forgot about that. I got too caught up with the fact that my 2 friends were playing.

Haven't played the deck in a while but was wondering the strategy to beat Terminus in UW Control? Is the goal to just hold cards in hand and not go all out?
Seems really hard to beat!

Hello everyone! I'm just about finished up picking up this deck and I've been thinking about what you normally board out. (I.E. what are the easy board outs based on any matchup). I've been having issues deciding what to actually board out, especially against control.



I've been considering just dropping stain the mind for a 3rd damping sphere and potentially a surgical extraction or the 4th Lead the Stampede.

Quote from ketoglutarate »

would you mind sharing your list?

I could play 4 Cavern of Souls. The whole deck is foil although I am using them in another deck, I could switch it over. I just don't think that it is necessary. Our opponent literally just wants to counter CoCo or Lead the Stampede (or a SB card like Shaper's Sanctuary), so for them to leave in Countermagic or counter an Elf in game 1 is pretty bad for them usually.

*Vs. UW Control, I found that the strategy is mostly to go all out and try to dodge turn 2, 3, or 4 Terminus. If you have a hand that can rebuild with Lead the Stampede or Collected Company, do that route. But you need to put massive pressure on their life total so that it's Miracle Terminus (or something like Path X 2, Snap X Path X 2) or die. My win percentage went up when I realized this. There's really no point in saving a 2/2 and a 1/1 for after a Terminus, of course in very niche situations (like your opponent is at 1 or 2 life).

Awesome thanks, I appreciate the quick feedback too.

I would probably only board in Scavenging Ooze against Control; possibly Assassin's Trophy, but I don't have any in Elves anyway. I did side in Shaper's Sanctuary, but that was against Grixis or Jeskai. UW is different in my opinion.

Anyone here playing around with the mono green Beastmaster and Craterhoof deck SaffronOlive put together this week? I wasn't aware of it until I got run over by Craterhoof and pals to -34 or something turn 4, preventing me from a 5-0. Looks more like Legacy Elves than anything, with Beastmaster replacing Glimpse.

@MikePemulis ..the list is really interesting and funny, but not really tried by myself.
Maybe I buy a craterhoof and build that together and try it for fun.

since i thought with the uprising of phoenix decks elves isnt in a good shape, I didnt played them, but SCG Indianapolis had elves in top16 https://mtgdecks.net/Modern/elves-decklist-by-branson-schlemmer-779243

the SB with so many removal I find.. mh interesting. These removals are good vs many decks, but the midrange game with so many removals seem clunky? What you think? (VS izzet phoenix, boarding in leads and the removals would blank the CC and LEad targets?)

Quote from MikePemulis »

Anyone here playing around with the mono green Beastmaster and Craterhoof deck SaffronOlive put together this week? I wasn't aware of it until I got run over by Craterhoof and pals to -34 or something turn 4, preventing me from a 5-0. Looks more like Legacy Elves than anything, with Beastmaster replacing Glimpse.

Well, the list was already being tested by Elves players, I guess. Seth just increased the value of Heritage Druid to 4 tix, preventing me to buying it now (I just joined MTGO). But hey, the list seems good. But I believe it's rather a budget version for GB or GW. Relying on Beast Whisperer to win, with no CoCos and stuff to reach Ezuri... I don't know, it seems too fragile.

So, I have finally decided, after finishing my primary deck, to move onto another deck. I have chosen elves! But, only because the art has improved. I never understood why punk rock and withered old men seemed to be MTGs vision of what elves looked like. With that out of the way, I most defiantly want to go Golgari for Shaman of the Pack and Stain the Mind to close out asap and counter Terminus.

Now, being new to elves, but having played against them many times, I have a question. How come Throne of the God-Pharaoh is not abused. It seems, at least to this untrained elf player, that it would add a lot of pressure to the opponent since elves seem to tap a shard of elves every turn. You can't tell me it is a win more card when it helps close games quicker and works in conjunction with SotP.

Quote from spec.ops »

So, I have finally decided, after finishing my primary deck, to move onto another deck. I have chosen elves! But, only because the art has improved. I never understood why punk rock and withered old men seemed to be MTGs vision of what elves looked like. With that out of the way, I most defiantly want to go Golgari for Shaman of the Pack and Stain the Mind to close out asap and counter Terminus.

Now, being new to elves, but having played against them many times, I have a question. How come Throne of the God-Pharaoh is not abused. It seems, at least to this untrained elf player, that it would add a lot of pressure to the opponent since elves seem to tap a shard of elves every turn. You can't tell me it is a win more card when it helps close games quicker and works in conjunction with SotP.

Welcome to the elvish society, my friend. I have always hated the old Llanowar Elves art, too.

Anyway, about Throne of the God-Pharaoh... by the time it was released in Amonkhet, everybody was testing it and it felt like a great option. When Bloodbraid Elf was unbanned though, it seemed like Kolaghan's Command became a nightmare, specially because at the same time Death's Shadow became a very popular deck. On the other hand, it is very good against control still. Cryptic Command becomes a lot less powerful when the Throne is on the battlefield. It also plays around Ensnaring Bridge when you have a Heritage Druid on the field and no Shaman of the Packs available to cast/search. Overall, it is still playble of course, but not as good as it seemed to be when released. An interesting otpion, I would say. Maybe it's kinda personal. You should definitely try it if you can.


Just a tip: if you're playing on MTGO, wait a bit before getting Heritage Druid. It spiked suddently for certain reasons in the end of january, but it will surely go back to normal soon (around 2 tickets).

Quote from Will-98 »

Welcome to the elvish society, my friend. I have always hated the old Llanowar Elves art, too.

Anyway, about Throne of the God-Pharaoh... by the time it was released in Amonkhet, everybody was testing it and it felt like a great option. When Bloodbraid Elf was unbanned though, it seemed like Kolaghan's Command became a nightmare, specially because at the same time Death's Shadow became a very popular deck. On the other hand, it is very good against control still. Cryptic Command becomes a lot less powerful when the Throne is on the battlefield. It also plays around Ensnaring Bridge when you have a Heritage Druid on the field and no Shaman of the Packs available to cast/search. Overall, it is still playble of course, but not as good as it seemed to be when released. An interesting otpion, I would say. Maybe it's kinda personal. You should definitely try it if you can.


Just a tip: if you're playing on MTGO, wait a bit before getting Heritage Druid. It spiked suddently for certain reasons in the end of january, but it will surely go back to normal soon (around 2 tickets).

Good stuff there and it feels good to be part of the shard! I come from a Robots and Goblin background so of course I gravitate to an artifact. Haha

I’m buying elves foil, but one slot at a time. I just got the full art llanowars for 6 bucks each so it was a steal.

What is the deal with Sentinel? I read an article where one guy said they were a win more card and would rather have a mana dork in staring hand. Any truth to this?

@spec.ops ..the discussion about nettle sentinel vs mana dork isn't a closed thing.
In comboish/toolbox (devoted druid, viizier) chord versions I would say you dont need the Nettle sentinel and dork provides better keepable hands.
In aggroish decklists it's difficult to say. Pro and cons. haven't figured out by myself. Played a gb elves list with elves of deep shadow, but wanted to test nettle sentinels. It' s better to hit colors for the assassin's tropy when you play some in the sideboard. or stain the mind in your case.

Stormy elf list with beast whisperer I would go for nettle sentinel for the heritage druid and nettle sentinel synergy

This is my standpoint on the issue

Quote from spec.ops »

Good stuff there and it feels good to be part of the shard! I come from a Robots and Goblin background so of course I gravitate to an artifact. Haha

I’m buying elves foil, but one slot at a time. I just got the full art llanowars for 6 bucks each so it was a steal.

What is the deal with Sentinel? I read an article where one guy said they were a win more card and would rather have a mana dork in staring hand. Any truth to this?

Good question. Well, although it may seem obvious that Nettle Sentinel is a "must" on Elves, this is actually very discussed between Elves players. Reid Duke, for example, plays Boreal Druids instead of Sentinels, quoting: "All builds of Elves are going to win an extremely high portion of the games in which they have a good draw including Heritage Druid, other cheap Elves, and enough action to spend the mana on. Because of this, all cards that were only good alongside Heritage Druid quickly got the axe. This includes Cloudstone Curio and, notably, Nettle Sentinel. Sentinel does painfully little in your less-than-perfect draws, and is often overkill in your good draws anyway".

As we all know, Modern isn't very flexible. It's very common to get Thoughtseized turn 1 and suddently your hand with two Sentinels, a Heritage Druid, a Elvish Archdruid and a Chord of Calling becomes significantly worse. We can describe a lot of similar scenarios. Drawing Sentinel even mid-game feels really weird. I'm one of the guys that prefer to play mana dorks, although playing Nettle Sentinel can lead you to quick victories with a bit of luck, so you essentially start the game 1-0.

My point is that mana dorks do a similar job compared to Sentinels when you play them instead, and sometimes are even more useful. For example, let us compare a scenario with and without the Sentinel:
Scenario 1
Turn 1 Land and Mana Dork; Turn 2 Land, Heritage Druid, Dwynen's Elite, 3-drop.
Scenario 2
If we had Nettle Sentinel instead of that first Mana Dork, for example, the play would've been Heritage Druid on turn 1 and Dwynen's Elite + 3-drop on turn 2. We wouldn't even have played Sentinel there.

The difference is that in Scenario 1 we would have in the folowing turn more power and mana. Nettle Sentinel is good when you play like... Land, Sentinel -> Land, Heritage Druid, Sentinel, 3-drop, 3-drop --> I win. But thats kind of a dream scenario. There are also scenarios that you tap them to convoke a Chord of Calling and then, as they untap, you convoke them to Chord again or you Collected Company if you have Heritage Druid on the field. But those are also dream scenarios. In general, I believe Mana Dorks are indeed more efficient. Look at this other scenario, when you don't have Heritage Druid in your hand: Land, Mana Dork --> Land, 3-drop. This is much simpler, more efficient and easier to achieve. A Nettle Sentinel there would've done nothing having no Heritage Druids in hand.

It's hard to tell what's the correct call, though. I believe it's another personal matter. The only way is to keep testing, hehe.

Of course, the discussion doesn't exist when you're playing the Combo Elves version with Beast Whisperer, as Asmodeus666 mentioned above, or with Beck // Call. Sentinel is fundamental there.

Personally, I really like Sentinel in my B/G Elves, since that list is all about chipping down the opponent and then killing them off with Shaman of the Pack. Nettle Sentinel does a great job at getting in early, and sometimes you get the nut draw of 2 Sentinels and a Heritage Druid where you just win through chaining Elves and Lead the Stampede. I do run a list with Elvish Clancaller, tho, so I think he's maybe a bit better there since you can go t1 Sentinel t2 Clancaller swing for 3.

I see I see. I see many different builds and explosive options in elves which will all need to be played out on MTGO.