Is it normal that people get so salty against this deck (BW Eldrazi & Taxes)?
I get a lot of "just pure luck", "that deck doesnt do that", "go play casual", "what a ***** of non-meta deck", "u are just ruining this format", etc.
Specially when I chain Sculler-Vial Sculler-TKS and things like that.
I also played against a Zoo Burn guy, I won 2-0, said gg and he went all like "pure luck, I have more than 60% winrate against your deck, rematch and I'll crush you"...
I think people have in mind that this deck consists only in land destruction, and they do not expect it to play so many hand (sculler and TKS) and board disruption (flicker, strangler, displacer), while having a lot of board presence (blade splicer, fliers...).
Btw, what SB are you guys playing now with Jace running around? mine was this, but I may have to change it against Jace.
Just keep absorbing the salt. I picked up a pretty standard BW Edrazi & Taxes list about two weeks ago in MTGO and the amount of salt is crazy at times.
I guess what makes people salty is what makes the deck so much fun when playing it. It has some spicy lines which people tend to overlook. Sometimes evaluating the board state from an opponents perspective is quite hard. People tend to get busted because of this. What looks like a winning turn can spiral into a disaster for them with some nice flicker action. In addition to this you can sometimes stall out games for a few turns until they're finally out of gas.
So far I probably punt a few times every game but I cannot remember having such a blast with a deck. The deck is probably not tier 1 right now but it's so much more fun to me than casting burn spells or spinning the wheel with Hollow One (Burn and Hollow One are my other MTGO modern decks atm. Both decks are fun but it feels like you can play them on auto pilot without loosing a lot of power).
The only thing that keeps bothering me (besides punting of course) is the mana base. It's horrible and it feels like you're loosing a serious amount of games because of it.
Do you guys think it's a good time to pick up some paper staples for the deck right now? I was thinking about buying the expensive pieces that don't get a reprint during A25 right now.
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Modern UR Blue Moon UBR Grixis Shadow GWU Amulet Titan BRW Mardu Pyromancer
Do you guys think it's a good time to pick up some paper staples for the deck right now? I was thinking about buying the expensive pieces that don't get a reprint during A25 right now.
Pick up anything related to Eldrazi: there are only 2 spots left for Colorless cards in Masters 25 (they come before white), so they could be either Ugin, Karn or 2 white cards. With Chalice of the Void reprinted, some players who were waiting for it to build Eldrazi Tron might be picking up Eldrazi staples.
There are very few White cards revealed up to now, so I would hold off on those for the moment. Thalia is being reprinted, so buy them later.
Is it normal that people get so salty against this deck (BW Eldrazi & Taxes)?
I get a lot of "just pure luck", "that deck doesnt do that", "go play casual", "what a ***** of non-meta deck", "u are just ruining this format", etc.
Specially when I chain Sculler-Vial Sculler-TKS and things like that.
I also played against a Zoo Burn guy, I won 2-0, said gg and he went all like "pure luck, I have more than 60% winrate against your deck, rematch and I'll crush you"...
I think people have in mind that this deck consists only in land destruction, and they do not expect it to play so many hand (sculler and TKS) and board disruption (flicker, strangler, displacer), while having a lot of board presence (blade splicer, fliers...).
Btw, what SB are you guys playing now with Jace running around? mine was this, but I may have to change it against Jace.
All of DnT splashes makes ppl salty. I'd guess that the salty ones are those who aren't familiar with the deck interactions not only flickering a permanent at the end step (making it entering at the beginning of the next end step, making them realizing how busted Flickerwisp really is. Man I really love this card).
The fact is that online you need to do some things correctly with no chance to do otherwise, like paying 2 for leonin before resolving a fetch land.
Our deck has a lot of absurd interactions when we have an Aether Vial online and we play a lot like a non modern decks when that happens. So the salty isn't what we expect from community, but it's not surprising either, in my opinion.
To be honest, playing any kind of eldrazi a (maybe couple of) turn (s) earlier is really way too powerful and being TKS'ed for your best card pisses even a saint, just like getting Karn'ed at turn 3 (and there is a lot more ppl that get pissed off with it than being stripmine'd). Edit: Formatting
609.7a. If an effect requires a player to choose a source of damage, he or she may choose a permanent; a spell on the stack (including a permanent spell); any object referred to by an object on the stack, by a replacement or prevention effect that's waiting to apply, or by a delayed triggered ability that's waiting to trigger (even if that object is no longer in the zone it used to be in); or a ...
face-up object in the command zone. A source doesn't need to be capable of dealing damage to be a legal choice. The source is chosen when the effect is created. If the player chooses a permanent, the effect will apply to the next damage dealt by that permanent, regardless of whether it's combat damage or damage dealt as the result of a ... ["!next" for page 2/2]
So sadly I cannot do that. That mean do not do that trick with burrenton and snapcaster interaction
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Modern
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Boros/Naya/Mardu Burn Abzan Rhino non Noble Hierach not active Jund Tarmoless not active
DnT White
Living End Jund Restore Balance Non Borderpost/ Borderpost not active U/W Titan Control not active Mardu Nahiri/Control not active
Hey, this is just a rumoured card, so it might be fake, but I wanted to get the input from the D&T community in case it was real:
Its cost is WW, human soldier, 2/2 with vigilance. When it dies on combat you get a 4/4 angel with flying and vigilance.
What do you guys think? A good addition to the deck or just too far from the gameplan we want to implement? Would serra avenger just be a better card?
I was thinking this might be good mainly for these reasons:
1) it costs 2, and our deck could use more creatures on the 2-drop slot (having just thalia and arbiter for the mono-w variant).
2) it is a consistent clock that discourages the opponent from attacking or trying to block it (which works amazingly well with vigilance).
3) it is better than serra avenger in the sense that you can reliably cast it on turn 2 without being dependent on vial
4) it is a huge blowout if you vial this in to block and trade with a creature. Even if it doesn't trade, you would get your angel token.
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I wouldn't play it outside of fnm. If you get the 4/4 for 2 it's great, but unless you are playing against a creature deck, it's a slow clock that is hard to cast. Maybe if the meta gets very aggro then it could be good, but you really need to be able to vial it in or they can just remove it before combat. I mean it will eat removal but so does selfless spirit and spellskite. I don't particularly like it, because the floor on it is pretty low.
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Hey, this is just a rumoured card, so it might be fake, but I wanted to get the input from the D&T community in case it was real:
Its cost is WW, human soldier, 2/2 with vigilance. When it dies on combat you get a 4/4 angel with flying and vigilance.
What do you guys think? A good addition to the deck or just too far from the gameplan we want to implement? Would serra avenger just be a better card?
I was thinking this might be good mainly for these reasons:
1) it costs 2, and our deck could use more creatures on the 2-drop slot (having just thalia and arbiter for the mono-w variant).
2) it is a consistent clock that discourages the opponent from attacking or trying to block it (which works amazingly well with vigilance).
3) it is better than serra avenger in the sense that you can reliably cast it on turn 2 without being dependent on vial
4) it is a huge blowout if you vial this in to block and trade with a creature. Even if it doesn't trade, you would get your angel token.
What do you guys think?
I think it's a great card if it is true, and could easily find a spot in Mono-white D&T. However, the legitimacy of this card is in question (the artwork was already public) and this is not the place to discuss potentially fake, leaked cards.
The lack of 2-drops is by design to make the best use of Vial possible.
The deck runs best at 7-8 and can accommodate up to 10 if the meta calls for extra answers in that range, or cards that happen to fall at that mana cost.
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“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
I wouldn't play it outside of fnm. If you get the 4/4 for 2 it's great, but unless you are playing against a creature deck, it's a slow clock that is hard to cast. Maybe if the meta gets very aggro then it could be good, but you really need to be able to vial it in or they can just remove it before combat. I mean it will eat removal but so does selfless spirit and spellskite. I don't particularly like it, because the floor on it is pretty low.
I understand what you're saying, though I'm not sure that I agree with how low the floor is. A clock of 2 a turn is a clock nonetheless, and it is not gonna be the only source of damage, presumably. As you said, if it eats a removal spell, it is one less removal spell for a flickerwip, eldrazi displacer or thalia. I honestly see this card being potentially more valuable than selfless spirit depending on the meta. The great part of the spirit is to make trades in combat very awkward for the opponent, as well as 'saving' a creature in some situations as a protection spell or, in some more improbable scenarios, protecting from board wipes. All that said, this serra sentinel card looks like it could be much more of a thorn for the opponent than the spirit is, because it makes combat awkward independent of board state and doesn't have that annoying one point of thoughness that makes it vulnerable to lots of random stuff. I understand where you're coming from though, and it is quite possible that it is not that great in the end.
I think it's a great card if it is true, and could easily find a spot in Mono-white D&T. However, the legitimacy of this card is in question (the artwork was already public) and this is not the place to discuss potentially fake, leaked cards.
Hummm, the legitimacy is in question, but it was my understanding that the jury was still out on that. In fact, I just posted because some people over the rumour mill considered quite a real possibility that the card would exist. In any case, didn't know rumoured cards couldn't be discussed.
The lack of 2-drops is by design to make the best use of Vial possible.
The deck runs best at 7-8 and can accommodate up to 10 if the meta calls for extra answers in that range, or cards that happen to fall at that mana cost.
Hummm, not sure if I fully grasp this point. If you have just one vial, yeah, it is great to be able to use it to cast as many creatures as possible. That said, it is fairly common that I draw 2 in a game, especially because most games drag a little. Having one on 2 and the other on 3 once I enter top-deck mode seems like a pretty good deal. Having another early threat on 2 that can annoy the opponent seems like a pretty good deal. I know some lists also run copter on the spot, and the BW has sculler, but I didn't like the BW eldrazi taxes build, the mana felt incredibly awkward. I was thinking more for a pure monowhite or maybe monowhite & eldrazi build.
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It’s been thoroughly explained in previous primers. Most of this was ported into the last one, which is linked to at the top of page 1 of this primer.
It’s the basics of using Vial optimally in any deck: the creature part of the curve is skewed towards a specific number to make sure as many creatures as possible can interact with it.
“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
The lack of 2-drops is by design to make the best use of Vial possible.
Isn't that phrasing a bit cart-before-the-horse? That makes it sound like we park Vial at 3cmc specifically because we get the most virtual-mana-per-Vial-activation that way.
The curve clumps heavily around 3cmc because Wisp has historically been pretty great and there have been far better threats available at 3cmc than 2cmc, the combination of which (heavily?) incentivizes us to keep parking Vial at 3cmc.
If we get a critical mass of more powerful creatures in the 2cmc slot I could definitely see some curves lowering in the way some Merfolk lists (especially the Tropical Fish varieties) have lowered their curve to recenter around Vial-on-2.
We don't just willfully ignore 2-drops to maximize virtual-Vial-mana, right?
Again, covered thoroughly before, refer to previous primers.
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“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
Again, covered thoroughly before, refer to previous primers.
This is the only relevant quote I could find regarding what you're speaking of, from primer v.2:
1. One of the biggest ways that D&T diverges from other decks is in the area of "curve", and the card that shapes this is Aether Vial. Since Vial (unlike a mana pool) can only bring into play a creature with exactly the same cmc as it has counters on it, you want to really push the best value you have. If you spread out your cmc's too much then you create akward turns wherein it is not clear whether it is best to add a counter or keep it where it is, whereas if you lump them together it is pretty clear. We have found that the most valuable cmc (while still being quick enough to achieve) is three, so that is where most of our creatures sit. This means that we generally run 4 one-drop creatures, 7-8 two-drop creatures, and the rest (see exception below) are three drops. All in all you want to be running between 27-29 creatures, giving you 2 possible flex spots for non-creature slots in the list. A common suggestion for this would be additional removal such as dismember or sunlance, meta depending.
I will emphasize that I find this argument not compelling enough to justify a low number of 2-drop threats. Just consider that:
1. You may have additional vials (that you can set to different numbers)
2. You may NOT have a vial, and having early threats in that case is exceptionally valuable
3. You may have just one vial set on 3, but a 2-drop threat might still be castable at 2 lands, allowing you to do 2 things on one turn
As it stands, I see this argument most as a post hoc reasoning as to why it isn't that bad to have the curve inflated at 3, not as thing that you're actually looking to achieve. Note also that the primer that contains this text snip was last editted 2 and a half years ago, and that the resources recommended from pro articles didn't mention such things. I understand that some of the best cards in the deck are at the 3-CMC slot (Flickerwisp, Big Thalia, Blade Splicer, Mindcensor, Displacer, etc.) but that is honestly just an 'unfortunate' coincidence. If our bests threats were all at cmc 2, as x1uo3yd pointed out, we would be playing those and setting the vial at 2. It is cool to cheat more mana with vial, but that does not come for free, it comes at a deckbuilding cost and gameplan cost. Anyway, that's my 2 cents on the matter. If there is another part on articles or primers that I missed, it would be great if you could point it out.
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This is distilled from years of trial and error and literally hundreds of posts by players on this thread, just like the generally accepted belief that 23 lands is optimal in this deck.
You’re welcome to ignore it, just like you’re welcome to ignore any other suggestions and advice posted here. Let us know how that goes for you.
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“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
This is distilled from years of trial and error and literally hundreds of posts by players on this thread, just like the generally accepted belief that 23 lands is optimal in this deck.
You’re welcome to ignore it, just like you’re welcome to ignore any other suggestions and advice posted here. Let us know how that goes for you.
Here is the thing - I'm not saying what I'm saying from a willfull desire to ignore advices on the thread. I'm giving my reasons and suggestions. All that you're giving me in return is "that's how we have always done it", without even bothering to address my points as to why other 2-drop threats might be a welcome choice. I was posting my opinion here because I thought this was a 'discussion' thread, not a 'we follow these obligatory guidelines' thread.
Anyway, for now this is a pointless discussion. The best threats for the deck are indeed in the 3-CMC slot, with fewer interesting options on 2-CMC. I just hope the spoiled card is real so I can see if it finds a room in the deck.
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A big part of this argument (IMO)is also the role that the decks current two drop creature play in classical monowhite builds compared to the three drops.
Currently, the 7-10 two drop creature slots are generally occupied by disruptive elements which we want to be able to deploy early, without the use of vial at all. That we're able to make use of them later on t3 (three drop hard cast, vial on 2), or t4 (double two drop hard cast) is really only a bonus.
Our three drop slot is where the meat of the deck sits, with Wisp, Splicer, Displacer, Big Thalia, and at various meta points whatever flex three drop creature you want. This three drop creature slot is generally what is used to actually close out the game because of the disparity in lethality, and the variety of beaters and utility creatures that are available here.
This Serra Sentinel creature that you are considering would most likely cut into your three drop creature slots (or your four drop slots, if you're running resto or splicer).
The benefit of running it is supposedly that it makes vial on 2 better (sure), and it allows you to deploy a beater on the that sometimes threatens to turn into a 4/4 flyer and maybe ambush something in a trade or double block.
However, as others have mentioned this makes it less clear whether to leave vial on 2 or 3, and while this creature is fine on the, and a decent trick off of vial, I would argue that the power you lose from not of having vial on 3 and adding utility to the three drop creatures we run (which I would say are the most important tools the deck has for closing out the game)is much greater.
Traditionally the two drop slot is a disruptive effect that clears the way for next turn's much higher impact creature, and I'm not seeing that here. Even in black white eldrazi taxes which you mentioned, their choice alternative two drop in those 7-10 slots outside if Thalia and arbiter is tidehollow sculler, a disruptive creature.
As a beater, this creature isn't fantastic either, functioning as a 2/2 unlockable or just a short lived (very fragile) wall against their goyf/angler/X/3 until they find a piece of spot removal.
Also as a last note the creature has WW in its casting cost which can be more difficult to achieve on curve than you might expect, particularly with the high density of ghost qaurter effects.
Regarding the card itself - if it wasjust a 2/2 'unblockable' or a fragile wall I wouldn't think it is a good card. It is the fact that Serra Sentinel is both of these things at the same time that makes me wanna consider and test it.
You mentioned BW eldrazi - their 2-drop slot is usually full, with 12 2-drops, due to the existence of sculler. Which means that, since they have a good card to play as a drop 2, they do it, instead of being concerned about reducing the space for 3 drops in the deck (and their list is even tighter, since they also play wasteland strangler).
I agree that WW is hard on the mana. As a matter of fact, one of the primers quotes a frank carsten article that says that for you to cast a double colored card on curve 90% of the time you would have to play 20(!) white mana sources. Since our default is 23 lands with 4 ghost quarter, we're already at 19 coloured lands at most. If you wanna add eldrazi temples and/or field of ruin, the chance quickly goes down. However, we do have aether vial and we may have other options to cast on 2 in case we don't find double white. I would say that the first thing I would do is test the card in a mono-white eldraziless build, so as to take this problem into consideration. Then, if I find that I'm missing displacer too much, I can test it in an eldrazi build, and see how that goes.
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This is distilled from years of trial and error and literally hundreds of posts by players on this thread, just like the generally accepted belief that 23 lands is optimal in this deck.
With respect to 23 lands being optimal for this deck, your mileage may vary. I have mathematical evidence (i.e., probabilistic evidence) to suggest that 22 or 21 lands would be better, but this depends a lot on your utility land suite, your appetite for mana screw, and your creature curve.
In general, if you: (1) plan on sacrificing a lot of lands throughout the course of a game, (2) have an aversion to losing to your own manabase, or (3) have a 3-drop or 4-drop heavy curve, then you should probably increase your land count to whatever makes you feel the most comfortable. I've seen successful lists with 23 and 24 lands, but I'm no longer surprised by the decks running 21 either.
With respect to the skewing your creature curve to sit on a particular number, I think you're missing the forest for the trees. The creature curve moves around to reflect what it takes to be competitive in the current metagame. Sometimes we have to be aggressive (i.e., have more 1-drops and 2-drops that apply pressure) and sometimes we have to be more controlling (i.e., have more 3-drops and 4-drops that generate value). Historically, Vial always went up to 3 because Flickerwisp is one of the most busted instant-speed interactions in our deck. So to your point, it does make some intuitive sense to run other 3 CMC cards because they can come in at instant speed while you're holding a Flickerwisp in your hand. However, when the metagame is fast, we have to adjust to it. In a fast metagame, Vial becomes a card that generates a tempo advantage (i.e., we get to cheat on mana) rather than a value engine (i.e., we're doing tricks with the stack), and we all saw the list from GP Vancouver that cut the Vials for Windbrisk Heights.
There isn't one right way to use Vial, but there are a lot of wrong ways to use it. If you're letting Vial dictate the kind of creature curve that you have, then it's going to be an uphill battle in the 60% of games when you don't have it in your opening hand (and especially so in a fast metagame). I do think your point is valid, but I don't think its universally applicable. This applies to every deck, but you really have to know what role that each card in your list is playing and adjust your plan accordingly.
Regarding the card itself - if it wasjust a 2/2 'unblockable' or a fragile wall I wouldn't think it is a good card. It is the fact that Serra Sentinel is both of these things at the same time that makes me wanna consider and test it.
As a person who has played a lot of D&T lists with Voice of Resurgence, I can tell you that Serra Sentinel is not very good. Requiring it to die during combat is a major strike against it, because most decks fall into one of the following categories: (1) they will be happy to take 2 damage per turn while they combo out, (2) they would be happy to race your 2/2 because they're an aggro deck, or (3) they run enough creature removal that they will destroy your creature not during combat. In essence, this card has the Grand Abolisher problem; your opponents will just play around it. I see the same thing when I play Voice of Resurgence; if my opponents can avoid it, then they don't want to give me the elemental token. I like the design of Serra Sentinel, but I don't think it's as powerful as you think it is.
Playing millions of cards every turn... Slowly and systematically obliterating any chance my opponent has of winning... Clicking the multitude of locking mechanisms into place... Not even trying to win myself until turn 10+ once I have nigh absolute control... Watching my opponent desperately trying to navigate the labyrinthine prison that I've constructed... Seeing the light of hope fade and ultimately extinguished in an excruciatingly slow manner... THAT'S fun Magic.
We have 2-3 users that are dramatically making this thread incomprehensible and non-productive for anyone else to possibly join in the discussion. This needs to change.
Every time I see [ktkenshinx] post in here, I get the impression of a stern dad walking in on a bunch of kids trying to do something dumb and just shaking his head in disappointment.
Near Mint: The same as Slightly Played, but we threw some Altoids in the box we stored it in to cover up the scent of dead mice. Slightly Played: The base condition for all MTG cards. This card looks OK, but there’s one minor annoying ding in it that will always irritate and distract you whenever you draw it. Moderately Played: This card looks like it survived the Tet Offensive tucked inside the waistband of GI underwear. It may smell like it, too. Heavily Played: This card looks like the remains of Mohammed Atta’s passport after 9/11. It may be playable if you double-sleeve it to stop the chunks from falling out. The condition formerly known as "Washing Machine Grade" Damaged: This card is the unfortunate victim of a Mirrorweave/March of the Machines/Chaos Confetti/Mindslaver combo.
[M]aking counterfeit cards is the absolute height of dishonesty. Ask yourself this question: Since most people...are totally cool with the use of proxies...what purpose do [high] quality counterfeit cards serve?
I get a lot of "just pure luck", "that deck doesnt do that", "go play casual", "what a ***** of non-meta deck", "u are just ruining this format", etc.
Specially when I chain Sculler-Vial Sculler-TKS and things like that.
I also played against a Zoo Burn guy, I won 2-0, said gg and he went all like "pure luck, I have more than 60% winrate against your deck, rematch and I'll crush you"...
I think people have in mind that this deck consists only in land destruction, and they do not expect it to play so many hand (sculler and TKS) and board disruption (flicker, strangler, displacer), while having a lot of board presence (blade splicer, fliers...).
Btw, what SB are you guys playing now with Jace running around? mine was this, but I may have to change it against Jace.
1 Relic of Progenitus
2 Rest in Peace
1 Stony Silence
1 Kataki, War's Wage
1 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Big Game Hunter
1 Zealous Persecution
1 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Sin Collector
2 Gonti, Lord of Luxury
I guess what makes people salty is what makes the deck so much fun when playing it. It has some spicy lines which people tend to overlook. Sometimes evaluating the board state from an opponents perspective is quite hard. People tend to get busted because of this. What looks like a winning turn can spiral into a disaster for them with some nice flicker action. In addition to this you can sometimes stall out games for a few turns until they're finally out of gas.
So far I probably punt a few times every game but I cannot remember having such a blast with a deck. The deck is probably not tier 1 right now but it's so much more fun to me than casting burn spells or spinning the wheel with Hollow One (Burn and Hollow One are my other MTGO modern decks atm. Both decks are fun but it feels like you can play them on auto pilot without loosing a lot of power).
The only thing that keeps bothering me (besides punting of course) is the mana base. It's horrible and it feels like you're loosing a serious amount of games because of it.
Do you guys think it's a good time to pick up some paper staples for the deck right now? I was thinking about buying the expensive pieces that don't get a reprint during A25 right now.
UR Blue Moon
UBR Grixis Shadow
GWU Amulet Titan
BRW Mardu Pyromancer
Pick up anything related to Eldrazi: there are only 2 spots left for Colorless cards in Masters 25 (they come before white), so they could be either Ugin, Karn or 2 white cards. With Chalice of the Void reprinted, some players who were waiting for it to build Eldrazi Tron might be picking up Eldrazi staples.
There are very few White cards revealed up to now, so I would hold off on those for the moment. Thalia is being reprinted, so buy them later.
WBC Eldrazi & Taxes CBW
UR Keep on Cantripin' (UR Phoenix) RU
WU Surprise! It's not UW Control! (UW Midrange) UW
BG The Rock, Straight BG
U Mono-Blue Fish U
RBW Mardu Pyromancer BWR
RG Rabble! Rabble! (GR Blood Moon Aggro) GR
Legacy
W Death & Taxes W
The fact is that online you need to do some things correctly with no chance to do otherwise, like paying 2 for leonin before resolving a fetch land.
Our deck has a lot of absurd interactions when we have an Aether Vial online and we play a lot like a non modern decks when that happens. So the salty isn't what we expect from community, but it's not surprising either, in my opinion.
To be honest, playing any kind of eldrazi a (maybe couple of) turn (s) earlier is really way too powerful and being TKS'ed for your best card pisses even a saint, just like getting Karn'ed at turn 3 (and there is a lot more ppl that get pissed off with it than being stripmine'd).
Edit: Formatting
face-up object in the command zone. A source doesn't need to be capable of dealing damage to be a legal choice. The source is chosen when the effect is created. If the player chooses a permanent, the effect will apply to the next damage dealt by that permanent, regardless of whether it's combat damage or damage dealt as the result of a ... ["!next" for page 2/2]
So sadly I cannot do that. That mean do not do that trick with burrenton and snapcaster interaction
------
Boros/Naya/Mardu Burn
Abzan Rhino non Noble Hierachnot activeJund Tarmolessnot activeDnT White
Living End Jund
Restore Balance Non Borderpost/ Borderpostnot activeU/W Titan Controlnot activeMardu Nahiri/Controlnot activeIts cost is WW, human soldier, 2/2 with vigilance. When it dies on combat you get a 4/4 angel with flying and vigilance.
What do you guys think? A good addition to the deck or just too far from the gameplan we want to implement? Would serra avenger just be a better card?
I was thinking this might be good mainly for these reasons:
1) it costs 2, and our deck could use more creatures on the 2-drop slot (having just thalia and arbiter for the mono-w variant).
2) it is a consistent clock that discourages the opponent from attacking or trying to block it (which works amazingly well with vigilance).
3) it is better than serra avenger in the sense that you can reliably cast it on turn 2 without being dependent on vial
4) it is a huge blowout if you vial this in to block and trade with a creature. Even if it doesn't trade, you would get your angel token.
What do you guys think?
Read my other stories as well (some ongoing):
Reaper King (a horror story), Kaalia of the Vast (an origin story), Sequels for Innistrad (Alternative sequels for Inn), Grey Areas (Odric's fanfic), Royal Succession (goblins),The Tracker's Message (eldrazi on Innistrad) and Ugin and his Eye (the end of OGW).
I think it's a great card if it is true, and could easily find a spot in Mono-white D&T. However, the legitimacy of this card is in question (the artwork was already public) and this is not the place to discuss potentially fake, leaked cards.
WBC Eldrazi & Taxes CBW
UR Keep on Cantripin' (UR Phoenix) RU
WU Surprise! It's not UW Control! (UW Midrange) UW
BG The Rock, Straight BG
U Mono-Blue Fish U
RBW Mardu Pyromancer BWR
RG Rabble! Rabble! (GR Blood Moon Aggro) GR
Legacy
W Death & Taxes W
The deck runs best at 7-8 and can accommodate up to 10 if the meta calls for extra answers in that range, or cards that happen to fall at that mana cost.
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
Read my other stories as well (some ongoing):
Reaper King (a horror story), Kaalia of the Vast (an origin story), Sequels for Innistrad (Alternative sequels for Inn), Grey Areas (Odric's fanfic), Royal Succession (goblins),The Tracker's Message (eldrazi on Innistrad) and Ugin and his Eye (the end of OGW).
It’s the basics of using Vial optimally in any deck: the creature part of the curve is skewed towards a specific number to make sure as many creatures as possible can interact with it.
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
The curve clumps heavily around 3cmc because Wisp has historically been pretty great and there have been far better threats available at 3cmc than 2cmc, the combination of which (heavily?) incentivizes us to keep parking Vial at 3cmc.
If we get a critical mass of more powerful creatures in the 2cmc slot I could definitely see some curves lowering in the way some Merfolk lists (especially the Tropical Fish varieties) have lowered their curve to recenter around Vial-on-2.
We don't just willfully ignore 2-drops to maximize virtual-Vial-mana, right?
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
1. You may have additional vials (that you can set to different numbers)
2. You may NOT have a vial, and having early threats in that case is exceptionally valuable
3. You may have just one vial set on 3, but a 2-drop threat might still be castable at 2 lands, allowing you to do 2 things on one turn
As it stands, I see this argument most as a post hoc reasoning as to why it isn't that bad to have the curve inflated at 3, not as thing that you're actually looking to achieve. Note also that the primer that contains this text snip was last editted 2 and a half years ago, and that the resources recommended from pro articles didn't mention such things. I understand that some of the best cards in the deck are at the 3-CMC slot (Flickerwisp, Big Thalia, Blade Splicer, Mindcensor, Displacer, etc.) but that is honestly just an 'unfortunate' coincidence. If our bests threats were all at cmc 2, as x1uo3yd pointed out, we would be playing those and setting the vial at 2. It is cool to cheat more mana with vial, but that does not come for free, it comes at a deckbuilding cost and gameplan cost. Anyway, that's my 2 cents on the matter. If there is another part on articles or primers that I missed, it would be great if you could point it out.
Read my other stories as well (some ongoing):
Reaper King (a horror story), Kaalia of the Vast (an origin story), Sequels for Innistrad (Alternative sequels for Inn), Grey Areas (Odric's fanfic), Royal Succession (goblins),The Tracker's Message (eldrazi on Innistrad) and Ugin and his Eye (the end of OGW).
You’re welcome to ignore it, just like you’re welcome to ignore any other suggestions and advice posted here. Let us know how that goes for you.
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
Anyway, for now this is a pointless discussion. The best threats for the deck are indeed in the 3-CMC slot, with fewer interesting options on 2-CMC. I just hope the spoiled card is real so I can see if it finds a room in the deck.
Read my other stories as well (some ongoing):
Reaper King (a horror story), Kaalia of the Vast (an origin story), Sequels for Innistrad (Alternative sequels for Inn), Grey Areas (Odric's fanfic), Royal Succession (goblins),The Tracker's Message (eldrazi on Innistrad) and Ugin and his Eye (the end of OGW).
-catmix
WWModern Death And Taxes (w/ Militia Bugler) (JUL '19)
GWModern Maverick (JUL '19)
WBCatmix on Twitch!
WWCatmix on Youtube
Currently, the 7-10 two drop creature slots are generally occupied by disruptive elements which we want to be able to deploy early, without the use of vial at all. That we're able to make use of them later on t3 (three drop hard cast, vial on 2), or t4 (double two drop hard cast) is really only a bonus.
Our three drop slot is where the meat of the deck sits, with Wisp, Splicer, Displacer, Big Thalia, and at various meta points whatever flex three drop creature you want. This three drop creature slot is generally what is used to actually close out the game because of the disparity in lethality, and the variety of beaters and utility creatures that are available here.
This Serra Sentinel creature that you are considering would most likely cut into your three drop creature slots (or your four drop slots, if you're running resto or splicer).
The benefit of running it is supposedly that it makes vial on 2 better (sure), and it allows you to deploy a beater on the that sometimes threatens to turn into a 4/4 flyer and maybe ambush something in a trade or double block.
However, as others have mentioned this makes it less clear whether to leave vial on 2 or 3, and while this creature is fine on the, and a decent trick off of vial, I would argue that the power you lose from not of having vial on 3 and adding utility to the three drop creatures we run (which I would say are the most important tools the deck has for closing out the game)is much greater.
Traditionally the two drop slot is a disruptive effect that clears the way for next turn's much higher impact creature, and I'm not seeing that here. Even in black white eldrazi taxes which you mentioned, their choice alternative two drop in those 7-10 slots outside if Thalia and arbiter is tidehollow sculler, a disruptive creature.
As a beater, this creature isn't fantastic either, functioning as a 2/2 unlockable or just a short lived (very fragile) wall against their goyf/angler/X/3 until they find a piece of spot removal.
Also as a last note the creature has WW in its casting cost which can be more difficult to achieve on curve than you might expect, particularly with the high density of ghost qaurter effects.
Regarding the card itself - if it wasjust a 2/2 'unblockable' or a fragile wall I wouldn't think it is a good card. It is the fact that Serra Sentinel is both of these things at the same time that makes me wanna consider and test it.
You mentioned BW eldrazi - their 2-drop slot is usually full, with 12 2-drops, due to the existence of sculler. Which means that, since they have a good card to play as a drop 2, they do it, instead of being concerned about reducing the space for 3 drops in the deck (and their list is even tighter, since they also play wasteland strangler).
I agree that WW is hard on the mana. As a matter of fact, one of the primers quotes a frank carsten article that says that for you to cast a double colored card on curve 90% of the time you would have to play 20(!) white mana sources. Since our default is 23 lands with 4 ghost quarter, we're already at 19 coloured lands at most. If you wanna add eldrazi temples and/or field of ruin, the chance quickly goes down. However, we do have aether vial and we may have other options to cast on 2 in case we don't find double white. I would say that the first thing I would do is test the card in a mono-white eldraziless build, so as to take this problem into consideration. Then, if I find that I'm missing displacer too much, I can test it in an eldrazi build, and see how that goes.
Read my other stories as well (some ongoing):
Reaper King (a horror story), Kaalia of the Vast (an origin story), Sequels for Innistrad (Alternative sequels for Inn), Grey Areas (Odric's fanfic), Royal Succession (goblins),The Tracker's Message (eldrazi on Innistrad) and Ugin and his Eye (the end of OGW).
In general, if you: (1) plan on sacrificing a lot of lands throughout the course of a game, (2) have an aversion to losing to your own manabase, or (3) have a 3-drop or 4-drop heavy curve, then you should probably increase your land count to whatever makes you feel the most comfortable. I've seen successful lists with 23 and 24 lands, but I'm no longer surprised by the decks running 21 either.
With respect to the skewing your creature curve to sit on a particular number, I think you're missing the forest for the trees. The creature curve moves around to reflect what it takes to be competitive in the current metagame. Sometimes we have to be aggressive (i.e., have more 1-drops and 2-drops that apply pressure) and sometimes we have to be more controlling (i.e., have more 3-drops and 4-drops that generate value). Historically, Vial always went up to 3 because Flickerwisp is one of the most busted instant-speed interactions in our deck. So to your point, it does make some intuitive sense to run other 3 CMC cards because they can come in at instant speed while you're holding a Flickerwisp in your hand. However, when the metagame is fast, we have to adjust to it. In a fast metagame, Vial becomes a card that generates a tempo advantage (i.e., we get to cheat on mana) rather than a value engine (i.e., we're doing tricks with the stack), and we all saw the list from GP Vancouver that cut the Vials for Windbrisk Heights.
There isn't one right way to use Vial, but there are a lot of wrong ways to use it. If you're letting Vial dictate the kind of creature curve that you have, then it's going to be an uphill battle in the 60% of games when you don't have it in your opening hand (and especially so in a fast metagame). I do think your point is valid, but I don't think its universally applicable. This applies to every deck, but you really have to know what role that each card in your list is playing and adjust your plan accordingly.
As a person who has played a lot of D&T lists with Voice of Resurgence, I can tell you that Serra Sentinel is not very good. Requiring it to die during combat is a major strike against it, because most decks fall into one of the following categories: (1) they will be happy to take 2 damage per turn while they combo out, (2) they would be happy to race your 2/2 because they're an aggro deck, or (3) they run enough creature removal that they will destroy your creature not during combat. In essence, this card has the Grand Abolisher problem; your opponents will just play around it. I see the same thing when I play Voice of Resurgence; if my opponents can avoid it, then they don't want to give me the elemental token. I like the design of Serra Sentinel, but I don't think it's as powerful as you think it is.
WUDeath&TaxesWG
Legacy
UBRGDredgeUBRG
UHigh TideU
URGLandsURG
WR Card Choice List
WUR American D&T
WUB Esper D&T
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