I believe I stated my opinions on this before. I don't think walkers are bad but it's just that collected company is too good.
In my local meta at least, tapping out for a walker is like a death wish, which is why I've moved away from that path.
I think the ability to play at instant speed is really important. Grixis/jeskai decks are pretty popular over here, tapping out to get a walker countered is real bad, whereas if I had company I could hold up mana to cast it at their EOT and if they counter it, I can then resolve something on my turn instead.
Sticking a walker generates more value over time but currently I value collected company a lot more just because of the way the meta is.
Edit: That being said, if you were to do short write ups about the events you play at, I would be really interested in reading them.
See where I play walkers. It is jund and Jeskai city. I crave midrange decks. I am more ceptable to Tron. I used to do somewhat decent right ups. No one seemed to care, I just stopped. I can give you a report tomorrow. I am probably gonna play tonite and I will play walker. Now if I had to rank atm, walker would be 3rd best whereas gruul whacker is first naya coco is second and the naya burn blitz I 4th
Not a lot. In my testing. My original build had Elspeth and sarkhan vol in it. Ironically I ultited him a lot.but when I was typing my list and after you saying that. It does make since to drop domri. I may go back to original build just that minus 2 is golden for getting a kalitas out of my what when I have a smiter on board
Seems like big zoo decks using neither walkers nor Company have fallen out of popularity recently, but I've been having some success at my LGS with this list, so I thought I'd share.
With loads of cheap removal, plenty of beefy blockers, and Huntmaster of the Fells, the matchup against lower-curve aggro decks like Suicide Zoo seems to be pretty good. Jeskai Nahiri is a bit rough in game 1, but becomes much more even with Thrun and Thalia from the board. Jund seems pretty even as well. Tron is difficult, but thankfully there aren't many Tron players in my local meta; if there were I think I'd change the board a bit to include Crumble to Dust or Blood Moon, and probably also add a Ghost Quarter to the main.
Is anybody else still playing Huntmasters in the 4cmc slot? If so I'd love to hear about your matchups and card choices, how you board, etc.
Cool list. I know it would be a big departure, but could you just cut the huntmasters and rampagers, add 2 black duals (godless and overgrown) and cram 4 siege rhinos in there?
Thank you! I'm very much enjoying it. As for Siege Rhino though... well, I think that would definitely get me some strange looks from my playgroup, that's for sure
I've currently been running a tribal zoo variant it's been doing fine so far but than again run into a hate.
I just decided if I'm gonna be stupid might as well just do it with the most horrendous mana base out there.
I originally thought of putting in Swan song or Stubborn Denial in my sideboard but I can't really find a reason to with suicide Zoo everywhere. I just find Spellskite and Helix does it's job in that match up same with most other decks. The Scavenging ooze and the Anafenza main board was a meta call tons of Dredge and Coco player in my area.
Been trying out Tireless tracker and new thalia in big zoo and I have to say tireless tracker has been really good. No comments on thalia as I haven't got to draw her in a game yet,
Guys please opinions on japanese cards. Lost a 3/3 creature against Japan celestial colonade. This guy played all creatures and spells in english cards, but some cards in his manabase was japanese. I dont registrated this really ( my brain say its all fine and all english to me lets attack his empty board)...and i am sure it is a Kind of legal cheating. It is not ok, but i know legal. I Hate such people. I never forget colonade normally, but with this Tricks it can happen one time in 3 years and such people take advantage of this
If I am a customer spending premium amount of dollars, I expect a premium service. Jund falls into the category of a premium deck costing more dollars than a majority of the rest of the format. I'm not getting the desired performance ratio per dollars spent out of the Jund deck because WOTC decided to make the format more diverse.
i've been trying to build a slightly different looking naya big zoo list (with coco) and for budget reasons/my love of playing rogue decks, i've been trying out a wide variety of creatures.
the three-drop slot is where i seem to have hit a wall, and i wanted to see what you everyone thinks of the following:
I have a question regrading Bushwhacker Zoo. I'm switching between 18 and 19 lands and while I like 18 lands since it allows me to play one more spell or creature but I'm screwed most of the games. I don't know if it's just me or not but when I look at other lists most of them run 18 lands and seem to work just fine with them. I'm wondering what to do here? Keep on playing 18 lands and hope my bad luck will stop at some point or is it just better to play 19 lands? What are your experiences with playing this deck for those who do?
I run 18. Sadly I still get flooded. 18-19 is good just preference. I run 11 fetches, 4 shocks and 3 basics. I always keep 2 lands in opening. ,at ev3 if I sided in finks or molten rain
I have a question regrading Bushwhacker Zoo. I'm switching between 18 and 19 lands and while I like 18 lands since it allows me to play one more spell or creature but I'm screwed most of the games. I don't know if it's just me or not but when I look at other lists most of them run 18 lands and seem to work just fine with them. I'm wondering what to do here? Keep on playing 18 lands and hope my bad luck will stop at some point or is it just better to play 19 lands? What are your experiences with playing this deck for those who do?
Go 18 + Dryad Arbor.
It only get's awkward if you have only Arbor in your opener as land, but if you where running 18 it would be a no-lander anyways.
I feel like tracker is only good if you can pop some clues to put it out of bolt range.
That's the ideal situation of course, but sometimes even though the creature itself doesn't stick on the board for long. The 2 or 3 clue tokens you get out of making land drops become super relevant in the mid-late part of the game when you're top decking in grindier match ups.
But I have to stress that she's not what you want to cast early on. She's more of a mid game card.
And of course she's not really good against aggro decks. My meta is more midrange-controlley so she's great over here.
Guys please opinions on japanese cards. Lost a 3/3 creature against Japan celestial colonade. This guy played all creatures and spells in english cards, but some cards in his manabase was japanese. I dont registrated this really ( my brain say its all fine and all english to me lets attack his empty board)...and i am sure it is a Kind of legal cheating. It is not ok, but i know legal. I Hate such people. I never forget colonade normally, but with this Tricks it can happen one time in 3 years and such people take advantage of this
If I am a customer spending premium amount of dollars, I expect a premium service. Jund falls into the category of a premium deck costing more dollars than a majority of the rest of the format. I'm not getting the desired performance ratio per dollars spent out of the Jund deck because WOTC decided to make the format more diverse.
Thanks for the report. This kind of recounts prove that Naya Company is really good in this kind of meta and the fact that is a dark horse with tons of options post game 1 makes it so much better.
I'm on bushwhacker zoo, and am wondering why nobody is running goblin grenade? Currently I have
4 goblin guide,
4 bushwhacker,
3 goblin war marshal (my favorite target)
and 2 goblin piledriver. (Might be taking these out) suggestions?
The grenades have been great for me and are giving me a ton of reach. Wound up hitting for death turn 3 because of it quite a few times.
I'm on bushwhacker zoo, and am wondering why nobody is running goblin grenade? Currently I have
4 goblin guide,
4 bushwhacker,
3 goblin war marshal (my favorite target)
and 2 goblin piledriver.
The grenades have been great for me and are giving me a ton of reach. Wound up hitting for death turn 3 because of it.
Because no one is running as many goblins as you, opting instead for creatures that are better standalone threats. Piledriver requires other goblins in play to be good and can't be saved from Bolt with Atarka's Command, and Goblin War Marshall & the tokens it creates can't attack through anything. In the two drop slot Flinthoot Boar is a much better threat, and you don't really want that many 2s to be honest.
I am running 3 fire pigs. The deck does need alot of 2 drops so the BTE can lead into other things besides wasted mana. I said the piledrivers are on the chopping block but imo the 5 damage for 1 mana is too good for a deck that needs to win in the 1st 3-4 turns.
I am running 3 fire pigs. The deck does need alot of 2 drops so the BTE can lead into other things besides wasted mana. I said the piledrivers are on the chopping block but imo the 5 damage for 1 mana is too good for a deck that needs to win in the 1st 3-4 turns.
Instead of 2 drops, you could put 1 drops into play with BTE. Going BTE into 2 one drops is way more powerful than BTE into 1 one drop, and not that hard to do in this deck when you draw BTE and don't have something better to do with it.
So past week been trying that land creature meld thing. I got to meld twice. Coco into the hanweir creature and knight on end of turn. Next turn using knight to search up the land. This is great against midrange and control decks. Though the bolt snap bolt decks kinda wreck the "combo". I would of got combo off another 2 times but the Jeskai player knew what was up. Any Argo or combo deck, this is to slow for. It is a cool combo but idk if it is mainstay yet, I am gonna test see naya nahiri toolbox. With nahiri combo and hanweir meld with good ole zoo creatures.
I beat Kiki-chord, Infect, and Mardu Control, and lost to... bigger zoo (a list running Thrun, Huntmasters, and Sigarda). All things considered I am pretty satisfied with this list and probably will keep playing it for awhile. Still vaguely on the fence about Huntmaster of the Fells; it's clunky and bad sometimes but it's good often enough that I feel like it's ok to keep in the mainboard. I might try cutting them + Domri for the 4th knight and a few 4-drop planeswalkers, but for the time being they will stay in.
I'm also considering cutting Ghost Quarter for another Arid Mesa and possibly cutting basic Mountain for a Sacred Foundry. In both my games against Infect I was stuck with 2/2 Nacatls for multiple turns thanks to awkward mana. I ended up winning both games, but had things gone even a little bit differently, that extra point of power might have made an important difference. On the other hand Ghost Quarter is amazing against Tron, which is a very bad matchup for me, and generally good often enough that I hesitate to cut it. Maybe cutting Horizon Canopy for another Temple Garden would be better? I'm really not sure.
Has anyone tested Skarrg, the Rage Pits over Kessig Wolf Run? The scalability of Wolf Run is really awesome in the late game, but I very frequently find myself too tight on mana to activate it with more than X=1 or even 0, just to force my damage through. The fact that the Rage Pits give toughness might also be relevant. I think I might try to get my hands on one and try it out for a bit.
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See where I play walkers. It is jund and Jeskai city. I crave midrange decks. I am more ceptable to Tron. I used to do somewhat decent right ups. No one seemed to care, I just stopped. I can give you a report tomorrow. I am probably gonna play tonite and I will play walker. Now if I had to rank atm, walker would be 3rd best whereas gruul whacker is first naya coco is second and the naya burn blitz I 4th
1 birds of paradise
4x Noble hierarch
4knight of the reliquery
4 tarmogoyf
3 loxodon smiter
2 scavenging ooze
2 stormbreath dragon
1 kitchen finks
Spells -
4 path to exile
4 lightning bolt
2 Arlinn kord
2 domri rade
1 Ajani vengeant
3 arid Mesa
4 wooded foothills
4 windswept Heath
2 stomping ground
1 temple garden
1 sacred foundry
1 ghost quarter
1 kessig wolf run
1 raging revine
2 Forest
1 plains
1 mountain
2 pyroclasm
2 qasali pridemage
2 blood moon
2 stony silence
1 unflinching courage
3 kitchen finks
2 molten rain
1 shatterstorm
My deck with walkers. Side board is always changing. Old list ran just 1 domri rade and Elspeth knight errant. Also ran 1 rugged prairie
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Wild Nacatl
2 Qasali Pridemage
3 Scavenging Ooze
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Loxodon Smiter
2 Ghor-Clan Rampager
2 Huntmaster of the Fells
Spells (11)
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Path to Exile
2 Lightning Helix
1 Domri Rade
2 Arid Mesa
2 Forest
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Kessig Wolf Run
1 Mountain
1 Plains
1 Raging Ravine
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Stirring Wildwood
2 Stomping Ground
1 Temple Garden
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Ancient Grudge
1 Gaddock Teeg
2 Pyroclasm
2 Spellskite
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
2 Kitchen Finks
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
With loads of cheap removal, plenty of beefy blockers, and Huntmaster of the Fells, the matchup against lower-curve aggro decks like Suicide Zoo seems to be pretty good. Jeskai Nahiri is a bit rough in game 1, but becomes much more even with Thrun and Thalia from the board. Jund seems pretty even as well. Tron is difficult, but thankfully there aren't many Tron players in my local meta; if there were I think I'd change the board a bit to include Crumble to Dust or Blood Moon, and probably also add a Ghost Quarter to the main.
Is anybody else still playing Huntmasters in the 4cmc slot? If so I'd love to hear about your matchups and card choices, how you board, etc.
Thank you! I'm very much enjoying it. As for Siege Rhino though... well, I think that would definitely get me some strange looks from my playgroup, that's for sure
I just decided if I'm gonna be stupid might as well just do it with the most horrendous mana base out there.
4 Wild Nacatl
4 Noble Hierarch
1 Bird of Paradise
4 Tarmogoyf
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scavenging Ooze
2 Snapcaster Mage
4 Geist of Saint Traft
1 Anafenza, The Foremost
3 Siege Rhino
Spell
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Tribal Flames
3 Path to Exile
2 Spell Pierce
1 Arlinn Kord
4 Windswept Heaths
4 Arid Mesa
4 Wooded Foothills
1 Stomping Ground
1 Temple Garden
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Steam Vents
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Blood Crypt
1 Forest
1 Plains
2 Aven Mindcensor
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Qasali Pridemage
2 Wear//Tear
1 Ancient Grudge
3 Lightning Helix
1 Gaddoc Teeg
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Stony Silence
1 Spellskite
I originally thought of putting in Swan song or Stubborn Denial in my sideboard but I can't really find a reason to with suicide Zoo everywhere. I just find Spellskite and Helix does it's job in that match up same with most other decks. The Scavenging ooze and the Anafenza main board was a meta call tons of Dredge and Coco player in my area.
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
the three-drop slot is where i seem to have hit a wall, and i wanted to see what you everyone thinks of the following:
(and, i'm already running a playset of knight of the reliquary, for what it's worth.)
thoughts on these cards? any other cards that synergize well here? any other rogue/pet cards you've enjoyed playing in these colors? thanks!
I run 18. Sadly I still get flooded. 18-19 is good just preference. I run 11 fetches, 4 shocks and 3 basics. I always keep 2 lands in opening. ,at ev3 if I sided in finks or molten rain
Go 18 + Dryad Arbor.
It only get's awkward if you have only Arbor in your opener as land, but if you where running 18 it would be a no-lander anyways.
WGUBR 5c Humans
GWR Naya Zoo
Legacy:
GW GW Maverick
R Goblins
That's the ideal situation of course, but sometimes even though the creature itself doesn't stick on the board for long. The 2 or 3 clue tokens you get out of making land drops become super relevant in the mid-late part of the game when you're top decking in grindier match ups.
But I have to stress that she's not what you want to cast early on. She's more of a mid game card.
And of course she's not really good against aggro decks. My meta is more midrange-controlley so she's great over here.
4 goblin guide,
4 bushwhacker,
3 goblin war marshal (my favorite target)
and 2 goblin piledriver. (Might be taking these out) suggestions?
The grenades have been great for me and are giving me a ton of reach. Wound up hitting for death turn 3 because of it quite a few times.
Because no one is running as many goblins as you, opting instead for creatures that are better standalone threats. Piledriver requires other goblins in play to be good and can't be saved from Bolt with Atarka's Command, and Goblin War Marshall & the tokens it creates can't attack through anything. In the two drop slot Flinthoot Boar is a much better threat, and you don't really want that many 2s to be honest.
Instead of 2 drops, you could put 1 drops into play with BTE. Going BTE into 2 one drops is way more powerful than BTE into 1 one drop, and not that hard to do in this deck when you draw BTE and don't have something better to do with it.
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Wild Nacatl
2 Qasali Pridemage
3 Scavenging Ooze
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Loxodon Smiter
2 Ghor-Clan Rampager
2 Huntmaster of the Fells
Spells (11)
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Path to Exile
2 Lightning Helix
1 Domri Rade
2 Arid Mesa
2 Forest
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Kessig Wolf Run
1 Mountain
1 Plains
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Stirring Wildwood
2 Stomping Ground
1 Temple Garden
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Pyroclasm
2 Spellskite
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Kitchen Finks
1 Crumble to Dust
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Stormbreath Dragon
I beat Kiki-chord, Infect, and Mardu Control, and lost to... bigger zoo (a list running Thrun, Huntmasters, and Sigarda). All things considered I am pretty satisfied with this list and probably will keep playing it for awhile. Still vaguely on the fence about Huntmaster of the Fells; it's clunky and bad sometimes but it's good often enough that I feel like it's ok to keep in the mainboard. I might try cutting them + Domri for the 4th knight and a few 4-drop planeswalkers, but for the time being they will stay in.
I'm also considering cutting Ghost Quarter for another Arid Mesa and possibly cutting basic Mountain for a Sacred Foundry. In both my games against Infect I was stuck with 2/2 Nacatls for multiple turns thanks to awkward mana. I ended up winning both games, but had things gone even a little bit differently, that extra point of power might have made an important difference. On the other hand Ghost Quarter is amazing against Tron, which is a very bad matchup for me, and generally good often enough that I hesitate to cut it. Maybe cutting Horizon Canopy for another Temple Garden would be better? I'm really not sure.
Has anyone tested Skarrg, the Rage Pits over Kessig Wolf Run? The scalability of Wolf Run is really awesome in the late game, but I very frequently find myself too tight on mana to activate it with more than X=1 or even 0, just to force my damage through. The fact that the Rage Pits give toughness might also be relevant. I think I might try to get my hands on one and try it out for a bit.