Can anyone give their thoughts on my deck, haven't tested it since I haven't been able to buy the onslaught fetches. Would like to hear your thoughts. TIA.
I'd cut the grim lavamancers for electrickery's and maybe the pillar of flames for magma spray's. You can get away with pillars since you're running swiftspears, but against pod the instant speed can be nice. It's up to you. The grims are too slow in the current meta and electrickery is a beast against the mirror.
A classic UWr control deck or something like blood moon can beat this deck, especially the aggro version. They counter your stuff, draw a bunch of cards, bolt your delver, sweep the board, smash with colonnade, shackles your pyro, sphinx rev for life, all the stuff they love doing. I've actually had real solid success against UR delver with a time warp/taking turns deck.
I've been Spell Piercing and Snaring those control decks for a few weeks now.
A classic UWr control deck or something like blood moon can beat this deck, especially the aggro version. They counter your stuff, draw a bunch of cards, bolt your delver, sweep the board, smash with colonnade, shackles your pyro, sphinx rev for life, all the stuff they love doing. I've actually had real solid success against UR delver with a time warp/taking turns deck.
I've been Spell Piercing and Snaring those control decks for a few weeks now.
Sure, just like delver has always done. It's just a matter of getting some control. But here's the Minneapolis SCG top 16:
1. Blue Moon
2. UR Delver
3. UR Delver
4. Burn (Swiftspear, No TC)
5. Burn (Swiftspear and TC)
6. Infect
7. Bogles
8. UR Delver (Swiftspear and TC)
A classic UWr control deck or something like blood moon can beat this deck, especially the aggro version. They counter your stuff, draw a bunch of cards, bolt your delver, sweep the board, smash with colonnade, shackles your pyro, sphinx rev for life, all the stuff they love doing. I've actually had real solid success against UR delver with a time warp/taking turns deck.
I've been Spell Piercing and Snaring those control decks for a few weeks now.
Sure, just like delver has always done. It's just a matter of getting some control. But here's the Minneapolis SCG top 16:
1. Blue Moon
2. UR Delver
3. UR Delver
4. Burn (Swiftspear, No TC)
5. Burn (Swiftspear and TC)
6. Infect
7. Bogles
8. UR Delver (Swiftspear and TC)
A classic UWr control deck or something like blood moon can beat this deck, especially the aggro version. They counter your stuff, draw a bunch of cards, bolt your delver, sweep the board, smash with colonnade, shackles your pyro, sphinx rev for life, all the stuff they love doing. I've actually had real solid success against UR delver with a time warp/taking turns deck.
Aggro beat control that beat tempo that beat aggro.
Magic is just like rock paper scissor, you have to be the built with medium appearance to shine in an event.
The circle of life: the most common deck (aggro/burn/fast combo) beats the least common (control/combo control) but loses to the average (tempo), which loses to the least common, giving the deck that stays in between the spot to shine for some week before the new meta change.
When a card breaks this circle we have a ban.
- L
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"The problem isn't when Scissors says Rock is overpowered, it's when Paper says it is."
-Mark Rosewater
@Ym1r. Most of them played Monastery Swiftspear...but not always the full set. Many went onto the LSV train, bringing in only one copy of the spear (See the last posted decklist, which basically is an LSV-derivate). The winning list in Leiden also was an LSV-derivate, with some very clever adjustments. It includes 4 snapcaster mages.
After some testing I decided to play the Snapcaster/counters version. Not saying it’s definitely better but I think it has better matchups now that all the decks have adapted into TC , also fits my playstyle better . Still need to experiment with the mix of TC/DTT , probably 3 TC 1 DTT is not the best. Sideboard was also a bit weird since the metagame was a bit different from what I expected.
Game 1: 2-1 vs UWR Delver
Not sure what list he was on , he had delver and pyro but I didn’t get to see any swiftspears or geists. Also had colonnade. Game 1 he flooded , game 2 I got stuck on 1 land , game 3 I landed a turn 1 delver that he had to path which put me quite ahead and I managed to get an early pyro and counter his stuff.
Game 2: 2-0 vs UR Delver
He was on the 4 swiftspear list , didn’t get to see any snapcasters. Game 1 we both played our early threads but I managed to remand his cruise and play mine which just put me ahead. Game 2 he got stuck on 2 island and I managed to protect a turn 1 delver until he was in burn range.
Game 3: 2-1 vs RW Burn w/ Treasure Cruise
His draws were just too good for me to race game 1 , games 2 and 3 Young Pyromancer just took away the game. The card is insane in the matchup if they don't kill them instantly. Also remanding TC is awesome when you're opponent can't do anything about it. Felt very lucky to win as I had no specific sideboard for this , just boarded in a bunch of counterspells.
Game 4: 2-0 vs Scapeshift
Game 1 was the good old turn 1 delver into remand , remand , remand , bolt+snap+bolt. Pretty easy. Sideboarding was +1 Negate +1 Counterflux +2 Spell Pierce +2 Blood Moon , not sure what went out. Game 2 went really slow as I was more interested in being reactive and stopping him , got him down to 7 but he managed to kill my threads and we played draw-go for a while. He ended up misplaying badly , Mana Leak was the only counter in my hand and he had Scapeshift , Izzet Charm and Remand with 10 lands in play. He cast spaceshift , I leaked it (wich is why you never concede in those spots) , he charmed it , I paid the 2 mana , he remanded my leak and I just played it again , with him having only 2 mana left. Not sure why he went with that instead of paying the 3 mana or remanding his own scapeshift or izzet charm. He had no cards left and I managed to find a busrt lightning and a bolt with a DTT. The more controlling version feels better in this matchup as Swiftspear gets chumped by Tribe Elder and Snapcasters and they just win if you don't kill them before they get to 7 lands.
Pretty satisfied with this list , still need more testing though. Also need to get the cards for my sideboard as I just used what I had around. Suggestions that don’t include “just play the aggro version” are welcome.
Instead of smash to smithereens you might consider shattering spree. The only reason is chalice of the void. If they set it to 2 smash can't get rid of it. If it's set to one you can replicate spree and still bust it. Or maybe shatterstorm, but at 4cc it might be more expensive than you want. Other than that the side looks fine. A card I've been running with much satisfaction is flame jab. I don't often flood with the deck but it's nice to be able to point redundant lands at the opponent or his stuff.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern UB Tezzerator UBW Gifts B 8Rack
Legacy RB Goblins
There are a lot of flex spots, I also really want to experiment with 1 Flame Jab to further improve the mirror and ameliorate flooding with a hand full of fetchlands.
Interesting. I'm also on the DTT bandwagon now, though in RUG w/ Goyf instead of YP, and Ooze to fight other Cruise/DTT decks. I like 4-5 DTT + Cruise though, but RUG is positioned a little more midrangey than UR, so there might not be any real disagreement.
Edit: I also 100% agree that Swiftspear and Cruise go together, while Snapcaster and DTT go together. There are two different builds here (more once you start adding a 3rd color) and those are the defining features of each build.
So here's a question for the DTT users, and this has been the major hold up for me on using it. Has Blood Moon been an issue for you? UU is the hardest cost we have under Blood Moon as we have to fetch two Islands for it ahead of time and then still need red.
Am I out of my mind thinking this and it's a non issue?
It's sometimes an issue (as is/was Snap + any blue spell), but if you're blood mooning, you're probably winning anyway. I play RUG and I still pack my blood moons and MD DTT. If it really is an issue, I think Blood Moon is the card to go, not DTT.
Can anyone give their thoughts on my deck, haven't tested it since I haven't been able to buy the onslaught fetches. Would like to hear your thoughts. TIA.
I'd cut the grim lavamancers for electrickery's and maybe the pillar of flames for magma spray's. You can get away with pillars since you're running swiftspears, but against pod the instant speed can be nice. It's up to you. The grims are too slow in the current meta and electrickery is a beast against the mirror.
Thanks but I prefer pillar, wouldn't be casting the magma spray during their turn anyway. how about I change the grims to dispel?
Can anyone give their thoughts on my deck, haven't tested it since I haven't been able to buy the onslaught fetches. Would like to hear your thoughts. TIA.
I'd cut the for electrickery's and maybe the for magma spray's. You can get away with pillars since you're running swiftspears, but against pod the instant speed can be nice. It's up to you. The grims are too slow in the current meta and electrickery is a beast against the mirror.
Thanks but I prefer pillar, wouldn't be casting the during their turn anyway. how about I change the grims to dispel?
The issue of Magma Spray being better than Pillar of Flame in the Pod match up is because they can get their persist creatures in their turn and then just combo/sac for Pod while Pillar is just sitting in your hand...
In addition, I'd not run Hurkyl's Recall in this deck, Shattering Spree has done a lot more for me. Also Echoing Truth seems better than it really is... I've never got to use it for what we expect from it, so I cut it from my deck a long time ago. And I'd increase the Dragon's Claws' count, since Burn is so common and such a painful match up. Dispel and Negate are also really good here.
The issue of Magma Spray being better than Pillar of Flame in the Pod match up is because they can get their persist creatures in their turn and then just combo/sac for Pod while Pillar is just sitting in your hand...
Once their persist creature resolves they'll have priority to do whatever they want with it. You'd be able to Spray it if they mis-sequence though.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Noted, i'll just drop a Swiftspear.
I'd cut the grim lavamancers for electrickery's and maybe the pillar of flames for magma spray's. You can get away with pillars since you're running swiftspears, but against pod the instant speed can be nice. It's up to you. The grims are too slow in the current meta and electrickery is a beast against the mirror.
DECKS:
UB Faeries [Midrange/Tempo]
RWUGB Affinity[Aggro]
FAERIES TOO STRONK!!!1111
- Fae Prophecy, 201
5678I've been Spell Piercing and Snaring those control decks for a few weeks now.
RBGLiving EndRBG
EDH
UFblthpU
BRXantchaRB
BGVarolzGB
URWZedruuWRU
Sure, just like delver has always done. It's just a matter of getting some control. But here's the Minneapolis SCG top 16:
1. Blue Moon
2. UR Delver
3. UR Delver
4. Burn (Swiftspear, No TC)
5. Burn (Swiftspear and TC)
6. Infect
7. Bogles
8. UR Delver (Swiftspear and TC)
9. Affinity
10. BGw Souls
11. GW Summoning Trap (Trap, Emrakul, dorks, Wurmcoil, etc.)
12. Burn (Swiftspear, no TC)
13. Naya Zoo
14. UWR Midrange (more midrange than control elements)
15. Bogles
16. Affinity
Delver represented well, but a control deck won, which is sort of what I'd expect. Maybe that's not the expectations for other folks.
UB Tezzerator
UBW Gifts
B 8Rack
Legacy
RB Goblins
The delver list in 3rd place ran 14 lands O.o granted he only ran 6 2 drops.
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
Aggro beat control that beat tempo that beat aggro.
Magic is just like rock paper scissor, you have to be the built with medium appearance to shine in an event.
The circle of life: the most common deck (aggro/burn/fast combo) beats the least common (control/combo control) but loses to the average (tempo), which loses to the least common, giving the deck that stays in between the spot to shine for some week before the new meta change.
When a card breaks this circle we have a ban.
- L
"The problem isn't when Scissors says Rock is overpowered, it's when Paper says it is."
-Mark Rosewater
DECKS:
UB Faeries [Midrange/Tempo]
RWUGB Affinity[Aggro]
FAERIES TOO STRONK!!!1111
- Fae Prophecy, 201
56784 Misty Rainforest
4 Steam Vents
4 Island
3 Mountain
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Young Pyromancer
3 Snapcaster Mage
1 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Serum Visions
1 Sleight of Hand
3 Treasure Cruise
1 Dig Through Time
2 Forked Bolt
1 Pillar of Flame
1 Burst Lightning
2 Electrolyze
2 Mana Leak
3 Remand
2 Spell Snare
2 Vapor Snag
2 Spell Pierce
2 Combust
2 Smash to Smithereens
1 Counterflux
1 Negate
1 Pillar of Flame
1 Electrickery
1 Izzet Staticaster
1 Twisted Image
1 Spellskite
After some testing I decided to play the Snapcaster/counters version. Not saying it’s definitely better but I think it has better matchups now that all the decks have adapted into TC , also fits my playstyle better . Still need to experiment with the mix of TC/DTT , probably 3 TC 1 DTT is not the best. Sideboard was also a bit weird since the metagame was a bit different from what I expected.
Game 1: 2-1 vs UWR Delver
Not sure what list he was on , he had delver and pyro but I didn’t get to see any swiftspears or geists. Also had colonnade. Game 1 he flooded , game 2 I got stuck on 1 land , game 3 I landed a turn 1 delver that he had to path which put me quite ahead and I managed to get an early pyro and counter his stuff.
Game 2: 2-0 vs UR Delver
He was on the 4 swiftspear list , didn’t get to see any snapcasters. Game 1 we both played our early threads but I managed to remand his cruise and play mine which just put me ahead. Game 2 he got stuck on 2 island and I managed to protect a turn 1 delver until he was in burn range.
Game 3: 2-1 vs RW Burn w/ Treasure Cruise
His draws were just too good for me to race game 1 , games 2 and 3 Young Pyromancer just took away the game. The card is insane in the matchup if they don't kill them instantly. Also remanding TC is awesome when you're opponent can't do anything about it. Felt very lucky to win as I had no specific sideboard for this , just boarded in a bunch of counterspells.
Game 4: 2-0 vs Scapeshift
Game 1 was the good old turn 1 delver into remand , remand , remand , bolt+snap+bolt. Pretty easy. Sideboarding was +1 Negate +1 Counterflux +2 Spell Pierce +2 Blood Moon , not sure what went out. Game 2 went really slow as I was more interested in being reactive and stopping him , got him down to 7 but he managed to kill my threads and we played draw-go for a while. He ended up misplaying badly , Mana Leak was the only counter in my hand and he had Scapeshift , Izzet Charm and Remand with 10 lands in play. He cast spaceshift , I leaked it (wich is why you never concede in those spots) , he charmed it , I paid the 2 mana , he remanded my leak and I just played it again , with him having only 2 mana left. Not sure why he went with that instead of paying the 3 mana or remanding his own scapeshift or izzet charm. He had no cards left and I managed to find a busrt lightning and a bolt with a DTT. The more controlling version feels better in this matchup as Swiftspear gets chumped by Tribe Elder and Snapcasters and they just win if you don't kill them before they get to 7 lands.
Pretty satisfied with this list , still need more testing though. Also need to get the cards for my sideboard as I just used what I had around. Suggestions that don’t include “just play the aggro version” are welcome.
UB Tezzerator
UBW Gifts
B 8Rack
Legacy
RB Goblins
Do you have a link to the results of that event? A gameshop page, a Facebook page, etc.?
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Young Pyromancer
Instants
2 Burst Lightning
3 Dig Through Time
2 Electrolyze
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Mana Leak
4 Remand
1 Spell Pierce
3 Spell Snare
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
Lands
4 Flooded Strand
5 Island
1 Mountain
1 Polluted Delta
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Steam Vents
There are a lot of flex spots, I also really want to experiment with 1 Flame Jab to further improve the mirror and ameliorate flooding with a hand full of fetchlands.
Edit: I also 100% agree that Swiftspear and Cruise go together, while Snapcaster and DTT go together. There are two different builds here (more once you start adding a 3rd color) and those are the defining features of each build.
Am I out of my mind thinking this and it's a non issue?
Thanks but I prefer pillar, wouldn't be casting the magma spray during their turn anyway. how about I change the grims to dispel?
The issue of Magma Spray being better than Pillar of Flame in the Pod match up is because they can get their persist creatures in their turn and then just combo/sac for Pod while Pillar is just sitting in your hand...
In addition, I'd not run Hurkyl's Recall in this deck, Shattering Spree has done a lot more for me. Also Echoing Truth seems better than it really is... I've never got to use it for what we expect from it, so I cut it from my deck a long time ago. And I'd increase the Dragon's Claws' count, since Burn is so common and such a painful match up. Dispel and Negate are also really good here.
Looks like a typo
For some reason, Salvation ate all the card's names in my post o_o
Thanks for pointing out!
Once their persist creature resolves they'll have priority to do whatever they want with it. You'd be able to Spray it if they mis-sequence though.