not for splinter twin, but if you know for a fact they're bringing in spellskite bring it in.
all 4 nture's clim, 2 dismember and 2 pithing needle in some matchups.
4 cathedral of war is too many.
blue green is the ultimate goal, play test 4 misty rainforest, 4 catacombs and 4 breeding pool, then report back with how inefficient U/G infect is. and since you said you were a legacy player, check out the same mana base but with ABU duals...mono-green is less efficient than that because...money.
4 necropede is meh
giant growth is meh in this deck it's too conditional the only reason you run it is for a lightning helix or lightning bolt kind of weak.
giant growth is a substitution for a fetchland. the original play was if they bolt you're dude with mana open (fetchlands are deceptive) you bolt yourself fetching a breeding pool untapped (pay 1 life, sac misty, pay 2 life untapped) and then you play your groundswell (triggering landfall with the fetch) in response.
the newer players here assume they will bolt on your turn because people always bolt on your turn or play removal on your turn [in standard], so they assume you can sneak in 3 extra damage and live through the ordeal. With savvy players, or players who know how to play control really well, its just doesn't work like that.
when playing infect, people know never to pick a fight with a glistener elf on a deck that wants to play counters on its own turn
don't buy decks based on your win rate on cockatrice. people that play there are just messing around half the time, or are just kids playing fantasy decks they can't pilot. i was at a 75% win rate with a jank burn deck just messing around on that, so many iffy players trying to work affinity sacing everything they have before a hit lands and bolt their inkmoth away preior to the counters landing. or just bad plays in general
That is if I even win long Grindy matches. The chances of infect winning past turn 4 plummet to near 0 if your opponent does not misplay. Half the time the infect player is the one that misplays. I know I make play mistakes every game everyday..
Oh my gosh please stop posting in this thread.
My experience is that infect is perfectly capable of winning long grindy games against grindy decks (UWR control and Jund). I am 58-12 in matches with this deck at my LGS, and discounting intentional draws I am 13-4 in matches at the PTQ level. If my chances of winning dropped to 'near 0' after 4 turns, Im sure my win % would be far less than 50%. Going all-in early in the game is often a recipe for disaster in many matchups. My matchups against UWR control (considering kiki-resto UWR as a separate archetype) is 2-0 at the PTQ level, and against jund at PTQs its also 2-0. I only remember 1 game of those 4 matches were I won on or before turn 4.
Yeah, I've been wondering about Pithing Needle too. It's a buck and stops Planeswalkers, Pod, Twin, Viscera Seer, etc...
EDIT: Now I'm a common mage! Woooo!
It doesn't exactly stop Splinter Twin because the creature gains the ability, and since they use 2+ creatures for the combo they can always just enchant the one not named.
mainboard crusader has been pretty good for me with his building pro red and white. if i manage to land him against red white blue, and tokens he usually swings the game in my favor. against blue white red tempo he isn't as strong because they pack vapor snag, but that card is a nussance that isn't solely limited to crusader. but so far it has been his only achille's heel that i've observed. anything else that kills him is usually weak verse the other infect creatures getting through.
i'm not sure where i prefer it, but between mainboard and sideboard i've had mixed results for wild defiance. its a card i think every infect deck needs but i can't decide where the best place is for it. do i always want it game 1 or do really only need it for certain game 2s?
i keep telling myself to bring the card in but i can't decide if its worth attemping to run is this giant growth for 2cc with trample called Predator's Strike??? anyone used it before?
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Decks: "Name one! I probably got it built In one of these boxes."
--------------------------------------------------- Vintage will rise again!Buy a Mox today!
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[I]Some call it dig through time, when really your digging through CRAP!
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Played my deck for the first time in real cards today. I played in between prerelease rounds. I beat BW Tokens pretty easily. Went 1-1 against Hexproof Auras. I also took out Melira Pod 2-0. The second game was a super long one. It took me a while to draw a card to take out his Spellskite, but after I did, I defeated him pretty easily. Whoever said that this deck was no good in the long game obviously had no experience with it. I like it and had a ton of fun!
P.S. I pulled a Chord of Calling and traded it to upgrade my basic forests for Zendikar full arts. My deck is much prettier now.
Yup, I agreed to that by saying a little. Torpor Orb is looking more attractive every second.
Just hammered UB Faeries after siding in Torpor Orb. It's a great tool. Of course I was owned by pod a few games earlier, Abrupt Decay hammered my dudes and I didn't draw well. Inkmoth Nexus is the deck MVP overall. I'm running a RG version that I'm sure folks will deride, but it's fun as hell.
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
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Legacy RB Goblins
P.S. I pulled a Chord of Calling and traded it to upgrade my basic forests for Zendikar full arts. My deck is much prettier now.
got my gears turning now.... would chord of calling be viable as a means to search up infect creatures? it wouldn't be a bad thing to spend your mana on if your flooded and lacking infect creature to finish the job.
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--------------------------------------------------- Vintage will rise again!Buy a Mox today!
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[I]Some call it dig through time, when really your digging through CRAP!
Merfolk! showing magic players what a shower is since Lorwyn!
got my gears turning now.... would chord of calling be viable as a means to search up infect creatures? it wouldn't be a bad thing to spend your mana on if your flooded and lacking infect creature to finish the job.
No. In mono green you have Sylvan Scrying which lets you search Inkmoth Nexus for cheaper. There is no good reason to run chords of calling as it is 4 mana for a 1/1. If you can use the convoke why wouldn't you just be attacking?
Sure, there is a chance of spending $4 on a booster and getting the Mythic Rare $30 super card. There is also a chance of surviving putting your tongue in a light socket.
No. In mono green you have Sylvan Scrying which lets you search Inkmoth Nexus for cheaper. There is no good reason to run chords of calling as it is 4 mana for a 1/1. If you can use the convoke why wouldn't you just be attacking?
Ditto. Why spend 4 mana for a Glistener Elf or 5 mana for a Necropede when you could just spend 2 by playing Sylvan Scrying and search out an Inkmoth Nexus, which is more evasive than the other infect creatures? I guess you would only have to spend 3 mana to get Inkmoth, but three is still more than two. Scrying also helps to find land when you're short on it, but have enough creatures. In my opinion, Sylvan Scrying > Chord of Calling in this particular deck.
haha i run the zendikar forests too, the verionique, all of the match which really irratates me when they don't haha.
aura hexproof is boggles.
i am 0-4 with it too they're faster than infect, that and they have accsess to path to exile, and a number of other removal.
i am also 0-4 with American control with a certain player, and 6-0 with another player. i think a deck like that really needs a proficient pilot, extensive knowlege of the metgame, and a flawless play style. i don't stand a chance.
but if they make mistakes, like not mana leaking a glistener elf, or tec edge an inkmoth when they can then the matchup is easy. also alot of people want to run america control without the fetchlands, cryptic commands or the snapcaster mages. some even do it at SCG IQ level, grave mistake
Advice against Amulet Combo besides aggressively mullaganning to Nature's Claim? A turn 2 Primeval Titan with +2+0, haste, and vigilance seems pretty darn good.
Was playing mono G against UTron last night (casual setting, so we played about 15 games, switching decks every "match") and one thing we noticed was Chalice of the Void on 1 would almost entirely lock out the deck, and Nature's Claim wouldn't be able to stop it, because, well, it's got CMC 1. I'm wondering how to get it out of the way, as people at my LGS playing control do run Chalice, but either haven't drawn it against me or didn't side it in. I was thinking of Deconstruct because it recoups the mana cost, Sundering Vitae for the convoke at instant speed (declare blockers, tap them for convoke, destroy the Chalice, no damage for the turn), Tel-Jilad Justice for the scry, or Viridian Corrupter for the body.
Anybody have experience with this particular silver bullet?
DO NOT aggressive mulligan to Nature's Claim against Amulet. That deck can kill you without getting an Amulet in play, using just Summer Bloom and Azusa to ramp to 6 mana. Furthermore, they will side in Chalice if they have it. Instead, just make sure you keep fast hands. Amulet is almost defenseless against you.
Amulet is known as the "turn 2 Titan" deck, but honestly I find that misleading. Yes, it can get a T2 Titan down, but more often it wins off inevitability (Titan for Tolaria West + bounceland, transmute for Summoner's Pact, Pact for another Titan, repeat). Think of it not as a turn 2 combo deck but as a turn 4 deck that pumps out Titans every turn afterwards. Against turn 4 decks, be fast. Kill them before that.
As for Chalice, Viridian Corrupter is the best choice out of all the other options you listed. You get to destroy their Chalice AND get a body out of it.
Went 3-0 a week ago at a modern event with RUG infect
Match 1 vs Tron, 2-0
Tromped on him G1, G2 he pulls out a spellskite but I keep attacking, he blocks and I ghor-clan rampager to kill+trample, his deck has trouble casting anything amazing and oblivion stone is no good against inkmoth
Match 2 vs Zoo, 2-1
Might have won this match due to the dice roll. G1 I have a nasty curve, G2 he deals a ton of damage and kills me, G3 I barely hold on, do a nice bluff with two Vines of Vastwood (one for hexproof in case of removal) which he did have and come out on top. Deck has tons of cheap removal which doubles as burn and is scary.
Match 3 vs UWx control, 2-0
I didn't get to see his deck take off too much. Game 1 his spot removal wasn't enough and his spreading seas actually fixed me for hinterland harbor, Game 2 I think he upped his removal but somehow I had a great hand with one or two inkmoths and triple apostle's blessing (I think I drew one or two), path my creature -> apostle's blessing -> cryptic command -> apostle's blessing.
I bet BUG is just better because of abrupt decay, spot discard and crusader option but I like Ghor-clan shenanigans, which I probably could just cut for Slaughterhorn if I'm too paranoid about counters/Spellskite. Titan's strength did good but is probably unnecessary for shoving me into red. Anyhow the stack game/bluffing is super fun.
I like red for ghor clan, assault strobe, and various sideboard stuff like bolt and ancient grudge. It also gives you some options like pyroclasm if your meta called for it. Someone earlier mentioned Chalice of the Void being a problem. Adding a little red gives you three different ways to smash it; Claim, Corruptor, and Grudge, all with different CC.
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Modern UB Tezzerator UBW Gifts B 8Rack
Legacy RB Goblins
all 4 nture's clim, 2 dismember and 2 pithing needle in some matchups.
4 cathedral of war is too many.
blue green is the ultimate goal, play test 4 misty rainforest, 4 catacombs and 4 breeding pool, then report back with how inefficient U/G infect is. and since you said you were a legacy player, check out the same mana base but with ABU duals...mono-green is less efficient than that because...money.
4 necropede is meh
giant growth is meh in this deck it's too conditional the only reason you run it is for a lightning helix or lightning bolt kind of weak.
giant growth is a substitution for a fetchland. the original play was if they bolt you're dude with mana open (fetchlands are deceptive) you bolt yourself fetching a breeding pool untapped (pay 1 life, sac misty, pay 2 life untapped) and then you play your groundswell (triggering landfall with the fetch) in response.
the newer players here assume they will bolt on your turn because people always bolt on your turn or play removal on your turn [in standard], so they assume you can sneak in 3 extra damage and live through the ordeal. With savvy players, or players who know how to play control really well, its just doesn't work like that.
when playing infect, people know never to pick a fight with a glistener elf on a deck that wants to play counters on its own turn
don't buy decks based on your win rate on cockatrice. people that play there are just messing around half the time, or are just kids playing fantasy decks they can't pilot. i was at a 75% win rate with a jank burn deck just messing around on that, so many iffy players trying to work affinity sacing everything they have before a hit lands and bolt their inkmoth away preior to the counters landing. or just bad plays in general
My experience is that infect is perfectly capable of winning long grindy games against grindy decks (UWR control and Jund). I am 58-12 in matches with this deck at my LGS, and discounting intentional draws I am 13-4 in matches at the PTQ level. If my chances of winning dropped to 'near 0' after 4 turns, Im sure my win % would be far less than 50%. Going all-in early in the game is often a recipe for disaster in many matchups. My matchups against UWR control (considering kiki-resto UWR as a separate archetype) is 2-0 at the PTQ level, and against jund at PTQs its also 2-0. I only remember 1 game of those 4 matches were I won on or before turn 4.
True, but it helps a little.
UB Tezzerator
UBW Gifts
B 8Rack
Legacy
RB Goblins
4 noble hierarch
4 glistener elf
4 phyrexian crusader
3 rancor
4 might of old krosa
4 groundswell
2 apostle's blessing
4 vines of the vastwood
4 mutagenic growth
3 inquisition of kozilek
4 verdant catacomb
2 misty rainforest
4 overgrown tomb
4 woodland cemetery
2 pendelhaven
mainboard crusader has been pretty good for me with his building pro red and white. if i manage to land him against red white blue, and tokens he usually swings the game in my favor. against blue white red tempo he isn't as strong because they pack vapor snag, but that card is a nussance that isn't solely limited to crusader. but so far it has been his only achille's heel that i've observed. anything else that kills him is usually weak verse the other infect creatures getting through.
i'm not sure where i prefer it, but between mainboard and sideboard i've had mixed results for wild defiance. its a card i think every infect deck needs but i can't decide where the best place is for it. do i always want it game 1 or do really only need it for certain game 2s?
i keep telling myself to bring the card in but i can't decide if its worth attemping to run is this giant growth for 2cc with trample called Predator's Strike??? anyone used it before?
Twitter- RogueSource.
Decks: "Name one! I probably got it built In one of these boxes."
---------------------------------------------------
Vintage will rise again! Buy a Mox today!
---------------------------------------------------
[I]Some call it dig through time, when really your digging through CRAP!
Merfolk! showing magic players what a shower is since Lorwyn!
P.S. I pulled a Chord of Calling and traded it to upgrade my basic forests for Zendikar full arts. My deck is much prettier now.
UG Infect
Modern
UG Infect
GW Infect
EDH
WB Teysa, Orzhov Scion
B Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon
Just hammered UB Faeries after siding in Torpor Orb. It's a great tool. Of course I was owned by pod a few games earlier, Abrupt Decay hammered my dudes and I didn't draw well. Inkmoth Nexus is the deck MVP overall. I'm running a RG version that I'm sure folks will deride, but it's fun as hell.
UB Tezzerator
UBW Gifts
B 8Rack
Legacy
RB Goblins
got my gears turning now.... would chord of calling be viable as a means to search up infect creatures? it wouldn't be a bad thing to spend your mana on if your flooded and lacking infect creature to finish the job.
Twitter- RogueSource.
Decks: "Name one! I probably got it built In one of these boxes."
---------------------------------------------------
Vintage will rise again! Buy a Mox today!
---------------------------------------------------
[I]Some call it dig through time, when really your digging through CRAP!
Merfolk! showing magic players what a shower is since Lorwyn!
No. In mono green you have Sylvan Scrying which lets you search Inkmoth Nexus for cheaper. There is no good reason to run chords of calling as it is 4 mana for a 1/1. If you can use the convoke why wouldn't you just be attacking?
Ditto. Why spend 4 mana for a Glistener Elf or 5 mana for a Necropede when you could just spend 2 by playing Sylvan Scrying and search out an Inkmoth Nexus, which is more evasive than the other infect creatures? I guess you would only have to spend 3 mana to get Inkmoth, but three is still more than two. Scrying also helps to find land when you're short on it, but have enough creatures. In my opinion, Sylvan Scrying > Chord of Calling in this particular deck.
UG Infect
Modern
UG Infect
GW Infect
EDH
WB Teysa, Orzhov Scion
B Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon
aura hexproof is boggles.
i am 0-4 with it too they're faster than infect, that and they have accsess to path to exile, and a number of other removal.
i am also 0-4 with American control with a certain player, and 6-0 with another player. i think a deck like that really needs a proficient pilot, extensive knowlege of the metgame, and a flawless play style. i don't stand a chance.
but if they make mistakes, like not mana leaking a glistener elf, or tec edge an inkmoth when they can then the matchup is easy. also alot of people want to run america control without the fetchlands, cryptic commands or the snapcaster mages. some even do it at SCG IQ level, grave mistake
UG Infect
Modern
UG Infect
GW Infect
EDH
WB Teysa, Orzhov Scion
B Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon
Anybody have experience with this particular silver bullet?
Amulet is known as the "turn 2 Titan" deck, but honestly I find that misleading. Yes, it can get a T2 Titan down, but more often it wins off inevitability (Titan for Tolaria West + bounceland, transmute for Summoner's Pact, Pact for another Titan, repeat). Think of it not as a turn 2 combo deck but as a turn 4 deck that pumps out Titans every turn afterwards. Against turn 4 decks, be fast. Kill them before that.
As for Chalice, Viridian Corrupter is the best choice out of all the other options you listed. You get to destroy their Chalice AND get a body out of it.
| Ad Nauseam
| Infect
Big Johnny.
Match 1 vs Tron, 2-0
Tromped on him G1, G2 he pulls out a spellskite but I keep attacking, he blocks and I ghor-clan rampager to kill+trample, his deck has trouble casting anything amazing and oblivion stone is no good against inkmoth
Match 2 vs Zoo, 2-1
Might have won this match due to the dice roll. G1 I have a nasty curve, G2 he deals a ton of damage and kills me, G3 I barely hold on, do a nice bluff with two Vines of Vastwood (one for hexproof in case of removal) which he did have and come out on top. Deck has tons of cheap removal which doubles as burn and is scary.
Match 3 vs UWx control, 2-0
I didn't get to see his deck take off too much. Game 1 his spot removal wasn't enough and his spreading seas actually fixed me for hinterland harbor, Game 2 I think he upped his removal but somehow I had a great hand with one or two inkmoths and triple apostle's blessing (I think I drew one or two), path my creature -> apostle's blessing -> cryptic command -> apostle's blessing.
I bet BUG is just better because of abrupt decay, spot discard and crusader option but I like Ghor-clan shenanigans, which I probably could just cut for Slaughterhorn if I'm too paranoid about counters/Spellskite. Titan's strength did good but is probably unnecessary for shoving me into red. Anyhow the stack game/bluffing is super fun.
UB Tezzerator
UBW Gifts
B 8Rack
Legacy
RB Goblins