Unfortunately you'd need a minimum of seven mana to cast this new wrath, animate a Mutavault (all your other creatures are, by definition, dead), and equip the sword to make it worthwhile. At that point you're better off just casting Damnation.
Have folks reached a consensus as to whether maindeck discard spells are needed in this meta? Most, if not all, of the 5-0 decks in recent months have packed between 5 and 6 Thoughtseize/Inquisition of Kozilek in the main. I've been partial to Ancestral Vision, but the discard and card draw spells don't fit well in the same deck.
Unfortunately you'd need a minimum of seven mana to cast this new wrath, animate a Mutavault (all your other creatures are, by definition, dead), and equip the sword to make it worthwhile. At that point you're better off just casting Damnation.
Have folks reached a consensus as to whether maindeck discard spells are needed in this meta? Most, if not all, of the 5-0 decks in recent months have packed between 5 and 6 Thoughtseize/Inquisition of Kozilek in the main. I've been partial to Ancestral Vision, but the discard and card draw spells don't fit well in the same deck.
With combo decks and burn on the rise, yes, I'd rather want the discard package. Your analysis about the new wrath is correct, too .
So I`ve been playing UB Faeries for a long time (Standard, Extended, now Modern). It feels really good in the current Meta besides Eldrazi Tron, which gets me every time.
In the past 2 months I was playing with the list most people here play but felt that it is either to slow (dying with my opponent at 1 or 2 Life) or not good enough in a though control-matchup.
So I decided going more on the tempo-plan with adding 3 Scion of Oona instead of Snapcaster Mage which always underwhelmed me. Felt quite good to flash in a Lord and it gives you some combat-tricks,
What are you guys thinking?
Scion of Oona doesnt improve any matchups so I think its bad tbh. You are better off running land hate such as blood moon/fulm mage/spreading seas then running scion since it just dies to the ping creatures that eldrazi tron runs.
I've played Scion of Oona from standard till now, Scion is only bad vs most hyper agreesive decks, and the only two that are played are zoo blitz and burn. Vs every midrange and control deck scion is amazing. Vs affinity scion is better because it pumps fae up a point not to die to 1/1's. Vs cord and commpany it lets you hold up counter spells then lets you alpha strike. If your playing scion over snapcastermage that lets you play Grafdiggers cage in side with no drawbacks. vs white eldrazi your faries can't be blinked and thats very big in helping bitterblossom do its thing. mid game scion plus countersquall or mana leak to stop removal then drop 2nd scion of oona on your next main faze you'll likly hit a ton even without bitterblossom as long as you have some other fae. Playing scion of oona lets you play less damaging mana bases by making Darkslick Shores, and Secluded Glen more viable. If playing scion of onnas I would reccommend playing a certain amount of draw cards or filters to make sure you hit your curve mainly smuggler's copter, serum visons, and Anticipate. I would allso play less removal because playing a lord you want more creatures of that type, and I'm big into that one of pestermite.
Scion of oona plays well with extra counter spells making it a very viable budget if you can't afford lili's and snap casters. I would reccommed scion of onna if your meta is combo, White eldrazi, affinity just make sure to play doomblades, over go for the t, cords decks, deathshadow Varients. even tron you can play counter squalls maindeck as 2 of just dont play any colorless lands other then mutavault, and play them Ceremonious rejection is sideboard.
Now that my meta is away from Scavaging ooze its time to dust off the old Rune Snag. This deck is allso good with two Sword of Feast and Famine over the scion of onna, just add 1 pestermite and ad a murderous cut, over the 2 other scions.
ceatures (14)
3 Mistbind Clique
4 Scion of Oona
4 Spellstutter Sprite
3 Vendilion Clique
rune snag is amusing. pet card of yours? I prefer familiar's ruse. You play 4, so you have a 40% chance getting it in your hand, and a 57% probability getting it turn 4. Not bad odds, but not excellent. How is it working out so far?
So I`ve been playing UB Faeries for a long time (Standard, Extended, now Modern). It feels really good in the current Meta besides Eldrazi Tron, which gets me every time.
In the past 2 months I was playing with the list most people here play but felt that it is either to slow (dying with my opponent at 1 or 2 Life) or not good enough in a though control-matchup.
So I decided going more on the tempo-plan with adding 3 Scion of Oona instead of Snapcaster Mage which always underwhelmed me. Felt quite good to flash in a Lord and it gives you some combat-tricks,
What are you guys thinking?
Scion of Oona doesnt improve any matchups so I think its bad tbh. You are better off running land hate such as blood moon/fulm mage/spreading seas then running scion since it just dies to the ping creatures that eldrazi tron runs.
I've played Scion of Oona from standard till now, Scion is only bad vs most hyper agreesive decks, and the only two that are played are zoo blitz and burn. Vs every midrange and control deck scion is amazing. Vs affinity scion is better because it pumps fae up a point not to die to 1/1's. Vs cord and commpany it lets you hold up counter spells then lets you alpha strike. If your playing scion over snapcastermage that lets you play Grafdiggers cage in side with no drawbacks. vs white eldrazi your faries can't be blinked and thats very big in helping bitterblossom do its thing. mid game scion plus countersquall or mana leak to stop removal then drop 2nd scion of oona on your next main faze you'll likly hit a ton even without bitterblossom as long as you have some other fae. Playing scion of oona lets you play less damaging mana bases by making Darkslick Shores, and Secluded Glen more viable. If playing scion of onnas I would reccommend playing a certain amount of draw cards or filters to make sure you hit your curve mainly smuggler's copter, serum visons, and Anticipate. I would allso play less removal because playing a lord you want more creatures of that type, and I'm big into that one of pestermite.
Scion of oona plays well with extra counter spells making it a very viable budget if you can't afford lili's and snap casters. I would reccommed scion of onna if your meta is combo, White eldrazi, affinity just make sure to play doomblades, over go for the t, cords decks, deathshadow Varients. even tron you can play counter squalls maindeck as 2 of just dont play any colorless lands other then mutavault, and play them Ceremonious rejection is sideboard.
And we are bad against hyper aggressive decks so why make the matchup worse by playing Scion? We are favored against slower decks (minus eldrazi/tron) in modern due to ancestral vision and bitterblossom being great grind cards already.
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On mtgsalvation people don't want to discuss ideas, so I give people something else to discuss: my controversial opinions.
Now that my meta is away from Scavaging ooze its time to dust off the old Rune Snag. This deck is allso good with two Sword of Feast and Famine over the scion of onna, just add 1 pestermite and ad a murderous cut, over the 2 other scions.
ceatures (14)
3 Mistbind Clique
4 Scion of Oona
4 Spellstutter Sprite
3 Vendilion Clique
Equinox2793 What hyper agreesive decks are you worryed about Scion of onna can do work even vs burn 2 scion usually stays maindeck after side. I normaly cut 4 bitterblossom, 1 land, for removal and counters. With fatal push printed hyper agreesive decks dont worry me anymore even if I run scion of onna. scion is better in centain matchs ups that I would recommend playing them in a local meta.
So I`ve been playing UB Faeries for a long time (Standard, Extended, now Modern). It feels really good in the current Meta besides Eldrazi Tron, which gets me every time.
In the past 2 months I was playing with the list most people here play but felt that it is either to slow (dying with my opponent at 1 or 2 Life) or not good enough in a though control-matchup.
So I decided going more on the tempo-plan with adding 3 Scion of Oona instead of Snapcaster Mage which always underwhelmed me. Felt quite good to flash in a Lord and it gives you some combat-tricks,
What are you guys thinking?
Scion of Oona doesnt improve any matchups so I think its bad tbh. You are better off running land hate such as blood moon/fulm mage/spreading seas then running scion since it just dies to the ping creatures that eldrazi tron runs.
I've played Scion of Oona from standard till now, Scion is only bad vs most hyper agreesive decks, and the only two that are played are zoo blitz and burn. Vs every midrange and control deck scion is amazing. Vs affinity scion is better because it pumps fae up a point not to die to 1/1's. Vs cord and commpany it lets you hold up counter spells then lets you alpha strike. If your playing scion over snapcastermage that lets you play Grafdiggers cage in side with no drawbacks. vs white eldrazi your faries can't be blinked and thats very big in helping bitterblossom do its thing. mid game scion plus countersquall or mana leak to stop removal then drop 2nd scion of oona on your next main faze you'll likly hit a ton even without bitterblossom as long as you have some other fae. Playing scion of oona lets you play less damaging mana bases by making Darkslick Shores, and Secluded Glen more viable. If playing scion of onnas I would reccommend playing a certain amount of draw cards or filters to make sure you hit your curve mainly smuggler's copter, serum visons, and Anticipate. I would allso play less removal because playing a lord you want more creatures of that type, and I'm big into that one of pestermite.
Scion of oona plays well with extra counter spells making it a very viable budget if you can't afford lili's and snap casters. I would reccommed scion of onna if your meta is combo, White eldrazi, affinity just make sure to play doomblades, over go for the t, cords decks, deathshadow Varients. even tron you can play counter squalls maindeck as 2 of just dont play any colorless lands other then mutavault, and play them Ceremonious rejection is sideboard.
And we are bad against hyper aggressive decks so why make the matchup worse by playing Scion? We are favored against slower decks (minus eldrazi/tron) in modern due to ancestral vision and bitterblossom being great grind cards already.
Hyper what? We are at least 50/50 or better against burn. We are more than decent versus Infect. Some of the forum-posters claim a positive score against Affinity (which I personally can not confirm, but fair enough). The only aggro decks we struggle against are the Creature-based aggro decks that do not care about 1/1 flying blockers. Burn and Infect, and as said to a certain extent Affinity although I personally would not rely on that, all meet these criteria. I can definitely see Scion being a bonus against Affinity and Infect.
So I`ve been playing UB Faeries for a long time (Standard, Extended, now Modern). It feels really good in the current Meta besides Eldrazi Tron, which gets me every time.
In the past 2 months I was playing with the list most people here play but felt that it is either to slow (dying with my opponent at 1 or 2 Life) or not good enough in a though control-matchup.
So I decided going more on the tempo-plan with adding 3 Scion of Oona instead of Snapcaster Mage which always underwhelmed me. Felt quite good to flash in a Lord and it gives you some combat-tricks,
What are you guys thinking?
Scion of Oona doesnt improve any matchups so I think its bad tbh. You are better off running land hate such as blood moon/fulm mage/spreading seas then running scion since it just dies to the ping creatures that eldrazi tron runs.
I've played Scion of Oona from standard till now, Scion is only bad vs most hyper agreesive decks, and the only two that are played are zoo blitz and burn. Vs every midrange and control deck scion is amazing. Vs affinity scion is better because it pumps fae up a point not to die to 1/1's. Vs cord and commpany it lets you hold up counter spells then lets you alpha strike. If your playing scion over snapcastermage that lets you play Grafdiggers cage in side with no drawbacks. vs white eldrazi your faries can't be blinked and thats very big in helping bitterblossom do its thing. mid game scion plus countersquall or mana leak to stop removal then drop 2nd scion of oona on your next main faze you'll likly hit a ton even without bitterblossom as long as you have some other fae. Playing scion of oona lets you play less damaging mana bases by making Darkslick Shores, and Secluded Glen more viable. If playing scion of onnas I would reccommend playing a certain amount of draw cards or filters to make sure you hit your curve mainly smuggler's copter, serum visons, and Anticipate. I would allso play less removal because playing a lord you want more creatures of that type, and I'm big into that one of pestermite.
Scion of oona plays well with extra counter spells making it a very viable budget if you can't afford lili's and snap casters. I would reccommed scion of onna if your meta is combo, White eldrazi, affinity just make sure to play doomblades, over go for the t, cords decks, deathshadow Varients. even tron you can play counter squalls maindeck as 2 of just dont play any colorless lands other then mutavault, and play them Ceremonious rejection is sideboard.
And we are bad against hyper aggressive decks so why make the matchup worse by playing Scion? We are favored against slower decks (minus eldrazi/tron) in modern due to ancestral vision and bitterblossom being great grind cards already.
Hyper what? We are at least 50/50 or better against burn. We are more than decent versus Infect. Some of the forum-posters claim a positive score against Affinity (which I personally can not confirm, but fair enough). The only aggro decks we struggle against are the Creature-based aggro decks that do not care about 1/1 flying blockers. Burn and Infect, and as said to a certain extent Affinity although I personally would not rely on that, all meet these criteria. I can definitely see Scion being a bonus against Affinity and Infect.
What matchups does it improve? It should say something that every fae list that has placed doesn't use the card. Scion hasn't been relevant since twin was meta and I don't expect that to change unless they print a new faerie.
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On mtgsalvation people don't want to discuss ideas, so I give people something else to discuss: my controversial opinions.
Well as stated above I took a trip yesterday to an IQ in dalton Georgia, there were 44 people at the event so 6 rounds of magic to be played. Some of you may have seen my list I played to 36th at the ATL Classic and for this event I decided to run Faeries again as in testing this deck has felt great. I played Faeries a ton in standard and extended so I have a decent amount of experience with the deck. So on to the list:
4 spellstutter sprite
3 vendilion clique
2 Snapcaster Mage
2 Mistbind clique
3 cryptic command
2 mana leak
2 thoughtseize
4 inquisition of kozilek
4 fatal push
2 go for the throat
1 dismember
3 Liliana of the veil
4 bitterblossom
3 secluded glen
4 polluted delta
2 watery grave
4 Mutavault
3 creeping tar pit
4 darkslick shores
3 island
1 swamp
Pretty similar list I played in ATL with the only changes being made were to the sideboard.
Rounds as follow
Grixis shadow 2-1
Junk 2-0
Merfolk 1-2 all because I punted the hardest I've probably ever punted game one, this should have been 2-0 me
Four color shadow 2-1
Infect 2-1
Draw
Top 8 Grixis shadow loss 0-2 mulled to 6 game one and got triple shadowed early and never could get my feet under me and then a mull to 5 game 2.
I still think we are heavily favored against shadow variants.
I'm not much into writing match descriptions as I tend to forget most of the details. If anyone has any questions about the list I'll be happy to answer.
Well as stated above I took a trip yesterday to an IQ in dalton Georgia, there were 44 people at the event so 6 rounds of magic to be played. Some of you may have seen my list I played to 36th at the ATL Classic and for this event I decided to run Faeries again as in testing this deck has felt great. I played Faeries a ton in standard and extended so I have a decent amount of experience with the deck. So on to the list:
4 spellstutter sprite
3 vendilion clique
2 Snapcaster Mage
2 Mistbind clique
3 cryptic command
2 mana leak
2 thoughtseize
4 inquisition of kozilek
4 fatal push
2 go for the throat
1 dismember
3 Liliana of the veil
4 bitterblossom
3 secluded glen
4 polluted delta
2 watery grave
4 Mutavault
3 creeping tar pit
4 darkslick shores
3 island
1 swamp
Pretty similar list I played in ATL with the only changes being made were to the sideboard.
Rounds as follow
Grixis shadow 2-1
Junk 2-0
Merfolk 1-2 all because I punted the hardest I've probably ever punted game one, this should have been 2-0 me
Four color shadow 2-1
Infect 2-1
Draw
Top 8 Grixis shadow loss 0-2 mulled to 6 game one and got triple shadowed early and never could get my feet under me and then a mull to 5 game 2.
I still think we are heavily favored against shadow variants.
I'm not much into writing match descriptions as I tend to forget most of the details. If anyone has any questions about the list I'll be happy to answer.
All the Shadow, haha.
It seems your list is relatively weak to Dredge. Did you just drop the matchup?
Another fresh take on faeries lists to throw onto the pile. I have a few different additions to my list that have been preforming quite well so I wanted to put this out there to keep the discussions interesting.
Faerie Conclave - I replaced the 4th basic island with an extra manland here and have been incredibly happy with it. Flying basically reads unblockable against the overwhelming majority of decks and the cheap activation cost has allowed me to keep attacking while holding up some form of interaction almost every time it's in play. I highly recommend trying a copy in your lists. Also of note is that it becoming a faerie does come up a decent amount as one might expect.
Fetid Pools - Currently testing with a pair of these so I don't have any strong opinions on them just yet, but here are some initial impressions. For a long time I was on a solid 25 land count and would see so many one land hands that would be a snap keep if any random card was replaced with a mana source. So I was wanting an extra land that "did something" and another blue source since cryptic can be difficult with 5 colorless lands. They mostly replaced other possible duals that we typically consider like river of tears or secluded glenn and in my list I replaced a countersquall with the extra land. And, of course, the ability to cycle them has been very handy. It will never be amazing, but it will always be good. Last note on them is that the extra pair of always tapped lands haven't been an issue yet. Even with decks that are heavy on early game action I've been happy with a total of 4-6 ETB tap lands so only having 5 here has been acceptable still.
Ancestral vision - With so many decks heavy on discard I absolutely want to run a set of these main, they are just far too important against the fair decks of any archetype.
Collective Brutality - Unquestionably great card in the sideboard, but rarely seen in the main. I was never a huge fan of them main in the past, but right now I do like them a lot. It's not uncommon for shadow players to run one out asap that you can tag with the disfigure mode. Against the CoCo decks it has been a god send for me by being able to kill their 2-Drop du jour and escalate it to tag the company that was coming out soon. Obviously it's amazing against burn which is suuuper annoying for us and still being serviceable against merfolk which, at least personally, has always been a problem. I do agree that we want some form of discard (and ideally life gain) in the main on top of vendillion cliques and I believe that this is a great option while still being a fine removal spell. It ticks all the boxes I want and has preformed very well.
Pendelhaven - Seriously, just play it and stop complaining.
One snapcaster - I never ever wanted to see the second copy in virtually every game I have played since I lack a pile of 1 CMC discard spells and serum visions, but a single copy to rebuy a kill spell or later a cryptic is an important effect to have available.
Logic knot - I really want some form of cheap permission aside from the sprites, but am not a fan of negates in the list because I want to be able to tag early creatures as well and absolutely hate mana leak outside of a super aggressive deck. For completion's sake, I did try censor and just never liked it in any game or match I tried. I have had extensive play with decks that only had a few fetchlands, very few 1 mana plays and even in those decks logic knot was still a great tool to have so I can assure you that with only 5 fetches and no 1 drop cantrips the card is still solid.
Hero's downfall - I put one in the side primarily for the shadow decks and wanted another way to answer a fast planeswalker like Lili last hope or, shudder, Ugin. I can easily see it turning into another GftT or Dark Betrayal if you really, really want more 1 cmc interaction against grixis shadow.
Missing Kalitas - I'm heavily considering cutting the third mistbind in favor of a kalitas. I always like having a lifelink threat in a deck that wants to race, it's awesome against a good number of decks, and mistbinds can get really clunky without a blossom in play. I know the card is good and is great against a lot of decks and just fine against many others, but I'm not sure if it's better than the massive tempo swing you get from the mistbinds.
EDIT: One other thought that I've been having is trimming down to 3 mutavaults, sacrilege I know. But the colorless land is a problem from time to time, I'm not cutting pendelhaven, and it's so hard for them to attack profitably. Thoughts?
All the Shadow, haha.
It seems your list is relatively weak to Dredge. Did you just drop the matchup?[/quote]
Yea, this matchup is terrible without boarding probably to many cards. I think dredge is still very good but very underplayed at the same time, I don't think anyone was even on it at the IQ.
3 Creeping Tar Pit
3 Darkslick Shores
4 Polluted Delta
4 Mutavault
3 Island
1 Swamp
1 Watery Grave
2 Secluded Glen
2 Scalding Tarn
1 River of Tears
3 Liliana of the Veil
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Thoughtseize
-------------------------
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Damnation
2 Negate
2 Ceremonious Rejection
1 Dispel
1 ColBrut
1 Kalitas
1 GftT
1 Engineered Explosives
Yeah, I am currently at this. With Dredge and Living End, I felt the need of Leylines . We can discard it with Liliana anyway. It feels pretty streamlined.
Luckily we can always SSS a living end and also can't be ricochet trapped which is quite funny, I would be on more hate if I expected dredge but like I said earlier, that deck doesn't see as much play as it probably should
Scion of Oona doesnt improve any matchups so I think its bad tbh. You are better off running land hate such as blood moon/fulm mage/spreading seas then running scion since it just dies to the ping creatures that eldrazi tron runs.
I've played Scion of Oona from standard till now, Scion is only bad vs most hyper agreesive decks, and the only two that are played are zoo blitz and burn. Vs every midrange and control deck scion is amazing. Vs affinity scion is better because it pumps fae up a point not to die to 1/1's. Vs cord and commpany it lets you hold up counter spells then lets you alpha strike. If your playing scion over snapcastermage that lets you play Grafdiggers cage in side with no drawbacks. vs white eldrazi your faries can't be blinked and thats very big in helping bitterblossom do its thing. mid game scion plus countersquall or mana leak to stop removal then drop 2nd scion of oona on your next main faze you'll likly hit a ton even without bitterblossom as long as you have some other fae. Playing scion of oona lets you play less damaging mana bases by making Darkslick Shores, and Secluded Glen more viable. If playing scion of onnas I would reccommend playing a certain amount of draw cards or filters to make sure you hit your curve mainly smuggler's copter, serum visons, and Anticipate. I would allso play less removal because playing a lord you want more creatures of that type, and I'm big into that one of pestermite.
Scion of oona plays well with extra counter spells making it a very viable budget if you can't afford lili's and snap casters. I would reccommed scion of onna if your meta is combo, White eldrazi, affinity just make sure to play doomblades, over go for the t, cords decks, deathshadow Varients. even tron you can play counter squalls maindeck as 2 of just dont play any colorless lands other then mutavault, and play them Ceremonious rejection is sideboard.
And we are bad against hyper aggressive decks so why make the matchup worse by playing Scion? We are favored against slower decks (minus eldrazi/tron) in modern due to ancestral vision and bitterblossom being great grind cards already.
Hyper what? We are at least 50/50 or better against burn. We are more than decent versus Infect. Some of the forum-posters claim a positive score against Affinity (which I personally can not confirm, but fair enough). The only aggro decks we struggle against are the Creature-based aggro decks that do not care about 1/1 flying blockers. Burn and Infect, and as said to a certain extent Affinity although I personally would not rely on that, all meet these criteria. I can definitely see Scion being a bonus against Affinity and Infect.
What matchups does it improve? It should say something that every fae list that has placed doesn't use the card. Scion hasn't been relevant since twin was meta and I don't expect that to change unless they print a new faerie.
Oh come on, you don't even read what I write...I call on the merits of Scion against aggressive decks and I get a ramble in return why it never shows up in lists. I never ever claimed that it is viable in the general meta.
Interestingly, I'm at a pretty similar point as stokpile.
I don't think I've shared a list in a while (if ever) because I don't play this deck all that often, but figured now was as good as any other time.
In looking at stokpile's deck, I'm going to try cutting a snapcaster mage (I play more flashback-able spells, but its still been rather weak) for a cycling land.
I may also swap out a land for a pendelhaven (sunken ruins, likely)
I will echo the AV thoughts. Its been really important, despite the awkwardness is causes sometimes. As I see it, faeries traditionally suffers with no early bitterblossom.
With a build like this, we have 3 potential strong starts, with either AV, bitterblossom, or discard + more interaction.
This came about because I realized that I pretty much never won a game when I started out very far behind (game 1, anyhow). I had to have some kind of early foothold to leverage.
This is also why I like mistbind: it keeps the pressure up, deals good damage, and taking another turn away from them can often be enough after a reasonably disruptive start (or enough to turn a AV into the game).
The tradeoffs, of course, are the fact that there is very little removal/counterspells. Again, even with far more controlling builds, I felt like I just didn't have the tools to win games that went belly up early. As opposed to something like esper control, which doesn't have the problem of drawing weird faeries when you're trying to stay afloat, that build never felt quite right.
With this build, its almost impossible to win games (game 1s) that you start really far behind, which makes mulliganing especially difficult, but you've got enough tools to make sure you're starting with something most games.
Mana leak is also one of my least favorite cards (can you tell we both play esper?), but with 7 manlands, 3 mistbinds, 3 vendilion clique, etc, we've got the finishing power to force spells out before it becomes dead. Definitely hurts sometimes, but logic knot has never felt good in this deck.
Someone several pages back mentioned something about using lilianas/collective brutalities to play bad/high costed cards, because discarding them for other effects essentially gave them "alternate modes" at cheaper costs. This has definitely been correct, IMO, props to the person who brought that up. AV and mistbinds in particular benefit from them greatly.
Its possible I'm just caught up in the past, but LoTV has always felt so lackluster in this deck, and I've always been of the opinion that if you're playing faeries, you should be playing faeries, not bitterblossom + spire in a UB control deck.
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Legacy - LED Dredge, ANT & WDnT
Unfortunately you'd need a minimum of seven mana to cast this new wrath, animate a Mutavault (all your other creatures are, by definition, dead), and equip the sword to make it worthwhile. At that point you're better off just casting Damnation.
Have folks reached a consensus as to whether maindeck discard spells are needed in this meta? Most, if not all, of the 5-0 decks in recent months have packed between 5 and 6 Thoughtseize/Inquisition of Kozilek in the main. I've been partial to Ancestral Vision, but the discard and card draw spells don't fit well in the same deck.
With combo decks and burn on the rise, yes, I'd rather want the discard package. Your analysis about the new wrath is correct, too
DECKS:
UB Faeries [Midrange/Tempo]
RWUGB Affinity[Aggro]
FAERIES TOO STRONK!!!1111
- Fae Prophecy, 201
5678I've played Scion of Oona from standard till now, Scion is only bad vs most hyper agreesive decks, and the only two that are played are zoo blitz and burn. Vs every midrange and control deck scion is amazing. Vs affinity scion is better because it pumps fae up a point not to die to 1/1's. Vs cord and commpany it lets you hold up counter spells then lets you alpha strike. If your playing scion over snapcastermage that lets you play Grafdiggers cage in side with no drawbacks. vs white eldrazi your faries can't be blinked and thats very big in helping bitterblossom do its thing. mid game scion plus countersquall or mana leak to stop removal then drop 2nd scion of oona on your next main faze you'll likly hit a ton even without bitterblossom as long as you have some other fae. Playing scion of oona lets you play less damaging mana bases by making Darkslick Shores, and Secluded Glen more viable. If playing scion of onnas I would reccommend playing a certain amount of draw cards or filters to make sure you hit your curve mainly smuggler's copter, serum visons, and Anticipate. I would allso play less removal because playing a lord you want more creatures of that type, and I'm big into that one of pestermite.
Scion of oona plays well with extra counter spells making it a very viable budget if you can't afford lili's and snap casters. I would reccommed scion of onna if your meta is combo, White eldrazi, affinity just make sure to play doomblades, over go for the t, cords decks, deathshadow Varients. even tron you can play counter squalls maindeck as 2 of just dont play any colorless lands other then mutavault, and play them Ceremonious rejection is sideboard.
ceatures (14)
3 Mistbind Clique
4 Scion of Oona
4 Spellstutter Sprite
3 Vendilion Clique
Enchantments (4)
4 Bitterblossom
Instants (14)
4 Cryptic Command
4 Fatal Push
4 Rune Snag
2 Countersquall
Sorceries (3)
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
Lands (25)
1 Watery Grave
3 Creeping Tar Pit
4 Polluted Delta
4 Island
4 Mutavault
2 River of Tears
4 Secluded Glen
2 Swamp
1 Faerie Conclave
Sideboard
2 Spell Snare
2 go for the throat
1 Countersquall
1 Dispel
2 Engineered Explosives
3 Ceremonious Rejection
2 Grafdigger's cage
2 Collective Brutality
And we are bad against hyper aggressive decks so why make the matchup worse by playing Scion? We are favored against slower decks (minus eldrazi/tron) in modern due to ancestral vision and bitterblossom being great grind cards already.
Decks I'm playing in Modern right now:
URB Grixis Reveler (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-grixis-reveler/)
UB Faeries (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/ub-fae-2/)
UW Azorious Control (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-ojutai-control-2/)
if you qant rune snag to work i would recommend running thought scour to turn it on
Decks I'm playing in Modern right now:
URB Grixis Reveler (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-grixis-reveler/)
UB Faeries (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/ub-fae-2/)
UW Azorious Control (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-ojutai-control-2/)
Hyper what? We are at least 50/50 or better against burn. We are more than decent versus Infect. Some of the forum-posters claim a positive score against Affinity (which I personally can not confirm, but fair enough). The only aggro decks we struggle against are the Creature-based aggro decks that do not care about 1/1 flying blockers. Burn and Infect, and as said to a certain extent Affinity although I personally would not rely on that, all meet these criteria. I can definitely see Scion being a bonus against Affinity and Infect.
DECKS:
UB Faeries [Midrange/Tempo]
RWUGB Affinity[Aggro]
FAERIES TOO STRONK!!!1111
- Fae Prophecy, 201
5678What matchups does it improve? It should say something that every fae list that has placed doesn't use the card. Scion hasn't been relevant since twin was meta and I don't expect that to change unless they print a new faerie.
Decks I'm playing in Modern right now:
URB Grixis Reveler (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-grixis-reveler/)
UB Faeries (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/ub-fae-2/)
UW Azorious Control (http://www.mtgvault.com/supast4r7/decks/modern-ojutai-control-2/)
4 spellstutter sprite
3 vendilion clique
2 Snapcaster Mage
2 Mistbind clique
3 cryptic command
2 mana leak
2 thoughtseize
4 inquisition of kozilek
4 fatal push
2 go for the throat
1 dismember
3 Liliana of the veil
4 bitterblossom
3 secluded glen
4 polluted delta
2 watery grave
4 Mutavault
3 creeping tar pit
4 darkslick shores
3 island
1 swamp
Sideboard
2 Smother
2 damnation
4 ancestral vision
1 dispel
1 sower of temptation
2 collective brutality
1 negate
2 graffdiggers cage
Pretty similar list I played in ATL with the only changes being made were to the sideboard.
Rounds as follow
Grixis shadow 2-1
Junk 2-0
Merfolk 1-2 all because I punted the hardest I've probably ever punted game one, this should have been 2-0 me
Four color shadow 2-1
Infect 2-1
Draw
Top 8 Grixis shadow loss 0-2 mulled to 6 game one and got triple shadowed early and never could get my feet under me and then a mull to 5 game 2.
I still think we are heavily favored against shadow variants.
I'm not much into writing match descriptions as I tend to forget most of the details. If anyone has any questions about the list I'll be happy to answer.
All the Shadow, haha.
It seems your list is relatively weak to Dredge. Did you just drop the matchup?
DECKS:
UB Faeries [Midrange/Tempo]
RWUGB Affinity[Aggro]
FAERIES TOO STRONK!!!1111
- Fae Prophecy, 201
56783 Mistbind Clique
1 Snapcaster Mage
4 Spellstutter Sprite
2 Vendilion Clique
Permission
2 Logic Knot
2 Spell Snare
4 Cryptic Command
Removal
4 Fatal Push
2 Go for the Throat
Value
4 Ancestral Vision
2 Collective Brutality
4 Bitterblossom
3 Creeping Tar Pit
4 Darkslick Shores
1 Faerie Conclave
2 Fetid Pools
1 Flooded Strand
3 Island
4 Mutavault
1 Pendelhaven
4 Polluted Delta
1 Swamp
2 Watery Grave
1 Collective Brutality
1 Countersquall
2 Damnation
1 Dispel
3 Fulminator Mage
1 Hero's Downfall
2 Ratchet Bomb
1 Relic of Progenitus
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Thoughtseize
So my thoughts on "The Weird."
Faerie Conclave - I replaced the 4th basic island with an extra manland here and have been incredibly happy with it. Flying basically reads unblockable against the overwhelming majority of decks and the cheap activation cost has allowed me to keep attacking while holding up some form of interaction almost every time it's in play. I highly recommend trying a copy in your lists. Also of note is that it becoming a faerie does come up a decent amount as one might expect.
Fetid Pools - Currently testing with a pair of these so I don't have any strong opinions on them just yet, but here are some initial impressions. For a long time I was on a solid 25 land count and would see so many one land hands that would be a snap keep if any random card was replaced with a mana source. So I was wanting an extra land that "did something" and another blue source since cryptic can be difficult with 5 colorless lands. They mostly replaced other possible duals that we typically consider like river of tears or secluded glenn and in my list I replaced a countersquall with the extra land. And, of course, the ability to cycle them has been very handy. It will never be amazing, but it will always be good. Last note on them is that the extra pair of always tapped lands haven't been an issue yet. Even with decks that are heavy on early game action I've been happy with a total of 4-6 ETB tap lands so only having 5 here has been acceptable still.
Ancestral vision - With so many decks heavy on discard I absolutely want to run a set of these main, they are just far too important against the fair decks of any archetype.
Collective Brutality - Unquestionably great card in the sideboard, but rarely seen in the main. I was never a huge fan of them main in the past, but right now I do like them a lot. It's not uncommon for shadow players to run one out asap that you can tag with the disfigure mode. Against the CoCo decks it has been a god send for me by being able to kill their 2-Drop du jour and escalate it to tag the company that was coming out soon. Obviously it's amazing against burn which is suuuper annoying for us and still being serviceable against merfolk which, at least personally, has always been a problem. I do agree that we want some form of discard (and ideally life gain) in the main on top of vendillion cliques and I believe that this is a great option while still being a fine removal spell. It ticks all the boxes I want and has preformed very well.
Pendelhaven - Seriously, just play it and stop complaining.
One snapcaster - I never ever wanted to see the second copy in virtually every game I have played since I lack a pile of 1 CMC discard spells and serum visions, but a single copy to rebuy a kill spell or later a cryptic is an important effect to have available.
Logic knot - I really want some form of cheap permission aside from the sprites, but am not a fan of negates in the list because I want to be able to tag early creatures as well and absolutely hate mana leak outside of a super aggressive deck. For completion's sake, I did try censor and just never liked it in any game or match I tried. I have had extensive play with decks that only had a few fetchlands, very few 1 mana plays and even in those decks logic knot was still a great tool to have so I can assure you that with only 5 fetches and no 1 drop cantrips the card is still solid.
Hero's downfall - I put one in the side primarily for the shadow decks and wanted another way to answer a fast planeswalker like Lili last hope or, shudder, Ugin. I can easily see it turning into another GftT or Dark Betrayal if you really, really want more 1 cmc interaction against grixis shadow.
Missing Kalitas - I'm heavily considering cutting the third mistbind in favor of a kalitas. I always like having a lifelink threat in a deck that wants to race, it's awesome against a good number of decks, and mistbinds can get really clunky without a blossom in play. I know the card is good and is great against a lot of decks and just fine against many others, but I'm not sure if it's better than the massive tempo swing you get from the mistbinds.
EDIT: One other thought that I've been having is trimming down to 3 mutavaults, sacrilege I know. But the colorless land is a problem from time to time, I'm not cutting pendelhaven, and it's so hard for them to attack profitably. Thoughts?
It seems your list is relatively weak to Dredge. Did you just drop the matchup?[/quote]
Yea, this matchup is terrible without boarding probably to many cards. I think dredge is still very good but very underplayed at the same time, I don't think anyone was even on it at the IQ.
3 Mistbind Clique
3 Vendilion Clique
2 Snapcaster Mage
4 Spellstutter Sprite
4 Bitterblossom
3 Cryptic Command
2 Mana Leak
4 Fatal Push
2 Murderous Cut
3 Creeping Tar Pit
3 Darkslick Shores
4 Polluted Delta
4 Mutavault
3 Island
1 Swamp
1 Watery Grave
2 Secluded Glen
2 Scalding Tarn
1 River of Tears
3 Liliana of the Veil
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Thoughtseize
-------------------------
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Damnation
2 Negate
2 Ceremonious Rejection
1 Dispel
1 ColBrut
1 Kalitas
1 GftT
1 Engineered Explosives
Yeah, I am currently at this. With Dredge and Living End, I felt the need of Leylines
DECKS:
UB Faeries [Midrange/Tempo]
RWUGB Affinity[Aggro]
FAERIES TOO STRONK!!!1111
- Fae Prophecy, 201
5678Oh come on, you don't even read what I write...I call on the merits of Scion against aggressive decks and I get a ramble in return why it never shows up in lists. I never ever claimed that it is viable in the general meta.
DECKS:
UB Faeries [Midrange/Tempo]
RWUGB Affinity[Aggro]
FAERIES TOO STRONK!!!1111
- Fae Prophecy, 201
5678I don't think I've shared a list in a while (if ever) because I don't play this deck all that often, but figured now was as good as any other time.
2 snapcaster mage
4 spellstutter sprite
3 vendilion clique
4 bitterblossom
3 cryptic command
3 mana leak
1 murderous cut
3 fatal push
2 collective brutality
4 thoughtseize
4 ancestral vision
4 polluted delta
2 watery grave
3 island
1 swamp
1 sunken ruins
4 secluded glen
2 river of tears
4 mutavault
1 engineered explosives
1 sword of light and shadow
2 kalitas, traitor of ghet
2 countersquall
2 dispel
1 slaughter pact
2 surgical extraction
2 damnation
2 rain of tears
In looking at stokpile's deck, I'm going to try cutting a snapcaster mage (I play more flashback-able spells, but its still been rather weak) for a cycling land.
I may also swap out a land for a pendelhaven (sunken ruins, likely)
I will echo the AV thoughts. Its been really important, despite the awkwardness is causes sometimes. As I see it, faeries traditionally suffers with no early bitterblossom.
With a build like this, we have 3 potential strong starts, with either AV, bitterblossom, or discard + more interaction.
This came about because I realized that I pretty much never won a game when I started out very far behind (game 1, anyhow). I had to have some kind of early foothold to leverage.
This is also why I like mistbind: it keeps the pressure up, deals good damage, and taking another turn away from them can often be enough after a reasonably disruptive start (or enough to turn a AV into the game).
The tradeoffs, of course, are the fact that there is very little removal/counterspells. Again, even with far more controlling builds, I felt like I just didn't have the tools to win games that went belly up early. As opposed to something like esper control, which doesn't have the problem of drawing weird faeries when you're trying to stay afloat, that build never felt quite right.
With this build, its almost impossible to win games (game 1s) that you start really far behind, which makes mulliganing especially difficult, but you've got enough tools to make sure you're starting with something most games.
Mana leak is also one of my least favorite cards (can you tell we both play esper?), but with 7 manlands, 3 mistbinds, 3 vendilion clique, etc, we've got the finishing power to force spells out before it becomes dead. Definitely hurts sometimes, but logic knot has never felt good in this deck.
Someone several pages back mentioned something about using lilianas/collective brutalities to play bad/high costed cards, because discarding them for other effects essentially gave them "alternate modes" at cheaper costs. This has definitely been correct, IMO, props to the person who brought that up. AV and mistbinds in particular benefit from them greatly.
Its possible I'm just caught up in the past, but LoTV has always felt so lackluster in this deck, and I've always been of the opinion that if you're playing faeries, you should be playing faeries, not bitterblossom + spire in a UB control deck.