To be fair, I only like Arcanist in Grixis shells where I can also target discard spells. There are some synergies in this list, but it seems a little too farfetched. Yet, I didn’t test it, so no reasons to dismiss it at first glance.
Well arcanist is quite good even in temur. It's a more aggro shell than grixis.
I'm interested too in knowing the results of @Aazadan tests: it's a pretty nice list. Keep us informed.
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Decks played: Modern:
0 Affinity;
URG Delver
URGW Countercats
(Here you can find some video contents about Countercats and Temur Delver decks)
Decided I was going to try this. Not sure if it's good or not, but it seems interesting enough. Thoughts? Biggest concern right now is that I feel like I need a couple more green cards to enable Force postboard as this deck folds hard to Chalice of the Void for 1.
I wouldn’t run flusterstorm main board. This deck is very proactive. Seems silly to run a single flusterstorm. I’d replace it with a more proactive card. Your choice on what you would want to replace it with.
As for SB, why run the new green force at all? Seems like you are just trying to be cute with the new cards. If chalice is such a house against you run ancient grudge, engineered explosives, abrade, etc. there are plenty of artifact removal spells at 2cmc. Even the new Return to Nature is a 2cmc that can hit artifacts, enchantments, and a card from the GY so it has lots of utility.
I think the deck looks sweet. I’m not sold on the izzet charm or the simic charms though. I feel like you should up the electro dominance to 4 and the crashing footfalls to 4. Ancestral maybe at 4 or 3? Just my 2 cents.
Went 0-3 at my last Monday before Horizons legality. Lost 1-2 in tight games to Abzan, got blown out 0-2 against Red Prison, and lost 0-2 to Bant Vizier combo. Prison is a tough matchup, and I view Abzan as basically even, but the Vizier combo deck should be pretty easy. Turns out 3-mana Teferi is really good at protecting combo. Rough week, bad keeps, bad play on my part. Moving on.
Here's my testbed online, and what I'll be playing in paper this coming Monday.
The Narset and Vapor Snag could be anything at this point. And I'm not sure on the cantrips. I haven't been a big fan of Opt before, but I'm trying it out here, and it's been very good for cantrips 7-10 to have a little selection, rather than Thought Scour. The thought behind Narset is that it's a bigger piece for the grindy games. Not sure if it's right. Could easily be another Tarfire, another Magmatic Sinkhole, even a Simic Charm or two. I've also thought about Abrade, and perhaps online I would even play a piece of gravehate in the main here.
Sideboard is up in the air still. I think Hurkyl's is better than Grudge given all the Welding Jars and such the artifact decks are playing these days. Dispel got way worse with the printing of Dovin's Veto, and maybe it could be something else. Disdainful Stroke is a hedge against Tron, which is rampant online right now.
Hexdrinker has been great and I like this build better than the Mandrills build. I don't worry about leveling it up unless I have nothing else to do, but given how removal-light the decks are, it doesn't have much trouble leveling into a 4/4. Being able to put a threat on board turn 1 has been huge, especially in the matchups where you need an immediate clock. And I've won a few games with it being able to swing past everything once it's leveled into a 6/6. I do miss trample a bit, and perhaps I could see playing like 3 Hexdrinkers and 2 Hooting Mandrills, but right now, I want to play with the new toys.
Very intrigued! Have you made any adjustments since last post?
And for what it's worth, Salvation isn't going away anymore. They announced it's being maintained by a different crew. Seems like most of the staff is leaving and starting a new site. Personally, I'm waiting to see what they unveil, and I hope it becomes the spot we all decide to go. The traditional forum model has much to offer that Discord and reddit don't.
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I can't say I'm pleased to see you and must warn you I may have to do something about it.
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: URDelver
Modern: UGRDelver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered
Very curious about Arcanist. It wouldn't work in my current build, but I think it's a sweet build-around.
I'm not super convinced on the Electrodominance package, but I've got a small imagination. Let us know how it goes.
The way it worked in my head was Electrodominance for 0 with the pitch cards is still a good return on investment, and if you get to cast it for X=1 or more, you can generate some value too so you're not taking the 2 for 1. I had to wait for a few Horizons cards to come in, the plan is to play this at FNM this week.
To be fair, I only like Arcanist in Grixis shells where I can also target discard spells. There are some synergies in this list, but it seems a little too farfetched. Yet, I didn’t test it, so no reasons to dismiss it at first glance.
Discard is a nice thing to target, but I was instead hoping to target either burn or card advantage. Something you might not be aware of is that if you cast something without paying it's mana cost, you can still pay additional costs such as buyback, kicker, or other things the spell requires. So, a card like Magmatic Insight lets you filter your hand for 1 mana, but if you cast it twice using the Arcanist for the extra cast you've only had to commit 3 cards and 1 mana to draw 4 cards. That's not the worst rate in the world, assuming you have the lands to pitch.
I wouldn’t run flusterstorm main board. This deck is very proactive. Seems silly to run a single flusterstorm. I’d replace it with a more proactive card. Your choice on what you would want to replace it with.
As for SB, why run the new green force at all? Seems like you are just trying to be cute with the new cards. If chalice is such a house against you run ancient grudge, engineered explosives, abrade, etc. there are plenty of artifact removal spells at 2cmc. Even the new Return to Nature is a 2cmc that can hit artifacts, enchantments, and a card from the GY so it has lots of utility.
I think the deck looks sweet. I’m not sold on the izzet charm or the simic charms though. I feel like you should up the electro dominance to 4 and the crashing footfalls to 4. Ancestral maybe at 4 or 3? Just my 2 cents.
This is a good point. I may make that swap. My thoughts on Flusterstorm were basically that I wanted a cheap way to ensure I could cast cards off of suspend since the opponent has plenty of time to prepare for it and I lack discard to strip the counters ahead of time, and Flusterstorm is only a 1 mana investment for what would be at a minimum, 3 copies (suspend card, their card, flusterstorm). This pretty much guarantees that a card coming off of suspend will resolve. It has some other interaction too potentially with protecting my board, such as for example being a great way to deal with Secure the Wastes or other spells I may be scared of. I'm not interested in a lot of permission but having some seems good here. I find the Izzet Charm to be a more questionable include, but all three modes are what this deck wants so I think the value is there at 2 mana, letting it function as an extra copy of anything.
Simic Charm is interesting in that if it pumps Arcanist, it can then be cast to pump Arcanist a second time, giving you a +6/+6 pump for just 2 mana, while also offering other modes.
Force was basically because I wanted a manaless way to break locks or combos as most combos and locks outside of Storm rely on enchantments or artifacts, but I think Shenanigans may be the better include after reading your commentary, though that's much weaker to Leyline of the Void and Rest in Peace which are both pretty good against this list. I'll definitely consider that swap, but it likely comes down to access to the card for this week.
Very much like the idea of a 4th set of rhinos. Not sure on the cut for it, as I don't want to go too low on interaction and I feel like I'm already straddling that line.
Fry looks like some sweet sideboard tech against UW control, and Emeria Titan decks. But is it worth a sideboard slot? I guess that depends on the meta. I know Emeria is played by two people at my LGS. Haven't seen UW in a while though.
Let's talk about Elvish Reclaimer! A 3/4 Wild Nacatl is nothing to sneeze at, but if we want to get this thing attacking on turn 2, we'll need some kind of engine that helps dump a third land (assuming 2 fetches). Faithless Looting seems like the most effective option, but Thought Scour is better for the deck overall since it enables Mandrills.
Then there's the question of what to include around it. Force of Negation has been pretty cool in my testing, but I think the cards that best suit the new creature make Force a hard sell. Wrenn, Domri, Looting, and Mutagenic Growth are all cards I've wanted in my build so far.
Also I like Veil of Summer as a sideboard card against Push decks or counterspells. Even countered a Mind Funeral earlier today! Which brings us the final question: how many utility lands should we run, and where? The sideboard Bog seems like a shoe-in, but I'm less sold on even the Blast Zone. Having one Fiery for Wrenn shenanigans seems okay though.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
a) the deck can afford another graveyard based creature alongside Goyf and Mandrills,
b) Elvish Reclaimer can consistently be a 3/4 on turn two (and, if it’s not, Hexdrinker is better than this by miles),
c) we can make use of Blast Zone out of the board while playing low cc creatures ourselves,
d) 23 istant/sorcery can be even remotely the right path,
e) doing all of this is worth sacrificing turn 0 counterspells.
Honestly, the build looks cute, but it does little to none compared to where I want to be at in the current Modern.
More testing has led me to similar conclusions, but here's 2000 words of text on Reclaimer and other one-drop combat creatures in case you're looking for the gritty details!
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
a) the deck can afford another graveyard based creature alongside Goyf and Mandrills,
b) Elvish Reclaimer can consistently be a 3/4 on turn two (and, if it’s not, Hexdrinker is better than this by miles),
c) we can make use of Blast Zone out of the board while playing low cc creatures ourselves,
d) 23 istant/sorcery can be even remotely the right path,
e) doing all of this is worth sacrificing turn 0 counterspells.
Honestly, the build looks cute, but it does little to none compared to where I want to be at in the current Modern.
Agree with you here.
Free counters have proven the best thing we can do. We finally have the chance to do something "unfair" we must exploit it.
I like hexdrinker very much since it keeps controls at bay all alone being more than decent against all other decks and (most important thing) it's not gy dependent. In a world of hogaak this is very important imho.
I can't wait to try both fry and veil of summer since both are very promising.
A bit unrelated.
Has anybody played against new Urza thopter sword? How's the match up? I feel it a strong deck, but I never faced it.
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Decks played: Modern:
0 Affinity;
URG Delver
URGW Countercats
(Here you can find some video contents about Countercats and Temur Delver decks)
Also, how do we feel about Mu Yanling, Sky Dancer? Seems interesting. Being able to get rid of flying blockers for Delver as well as creating 4/4 flyers that also are hard to block. I could see that as a 2 of in a list or something.
The Narset, Magmatic Sinkhole, Tarfire, Vapor Snags, and Spell Snare are all flex slots, as I see them. Probably the Snapcasters, too, but it's hard for me to imagine playing this deck without the extra reach and protection they provide.
In the board, the Snare, Grudge, Hazoret, and Dispel are all totally changeable. I've always played some sort of 3 or 4 mana threat out of the board, and often a pair of them, but I think Hexdrinker might make that plan obsolete. I like being able to increase threat density, but then again, in days past, I was often cutting a Mandrills for the Hazoret or Huntmasters or whatever when I was expecting grave hate, and that's not a thing I worry about anymore.
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():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I can't say I'm pleased to see you and must warn you I may have to do something about it.
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: URDelver
Modern: UGRDelver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered
I'm interested too in knowing the results of @Aazadan tests: it's a pretty nice list. Keep us informed.
Modern:
I wouldn’t run flusterstorm main board. This deck is very proactive. Seems silly to run a single flusterstorm. I’d replace it with a more proactive card. Your choice on what you would want to replace it with.
As for SB, why run the new green force at all? Seems like you are just trying to be cute with the new cards. If chalice is such a house against you run ancient grudge, engineered explosives, abrade, etc. there are plenty of artifact removal spells at 2cmc. Even the new Return to Nature is a 2cmc that can hit artifacts, enchantments, and a card from the GY so it has lots of utility.
I think the deck looks sweet. I’m not sold on the izzet charm or the simic charms though. I feel like you should up the electro dominance to 4 and the crashing footfalls to 4. Ancestral maybe at 4 or 3? Just my 2 cents.
Very intrigued! Have you made any adjustments since last post?
And for what it's worth, Salvation isn't going away anymore. They announced it's being maintained by a different crew. Seems like most of the staff is leaving and starting a new site. Personally, I'm waiting to see what they unveil, and I hope it becomes the spot we all decide to go. The traditional forum model has much to offer that Discord and reddit don't.
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: UR Delver
Modern: UGR Delver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered
The way it worked in my head was Electrodominance for 0 with the pitch cards is still a good return on investment, and if you get to cast it for X=1 or more, you can generate some value too so you're not taking the 2 for 1. I had to wait for a few Horizons cards to come in, the plan is to play this at FNM this week.
Discard is a nice thing to target, but I was instead hoping to target either burn or card advantage. Something you might not be aware of is that if you cast something without paying it's mana cost, you can still pay additional costs such as buyback, kicker, or other things the spell requires. So, a card like Magmatic Insight lets you filter your hand for 1 mana, but if you cast it twice using the Arcanist for the extra cast you've only had to commit 3 cards and 1 mana to draw 4 cards. That's not the worst rate in the world, assuming you have the lands to pitch.
This is a good point. I may make that swap. My thoughts on Flusterstorm were basically that I wanted a cheap way to ensure I could cast cards off of suspend since the opponent has plenty of time to prepare for it and I lack discard to strip the counters ahead of time, and Flusterstorm is only a 1 mana investment for what would be at a minimum, 3 copies (suspend card, their card, flusterstorm). This pretty much guarantees that a card coming off of suspend will resolve. It has some other interaction too potentially with protecting my board, such as for example being a great way to deal with Secure the Wastes or other spells I may be scared of. I'm not interested in a lot of permission but having some seems good here. I find the Izzet Charm to be a more questionable include, but all three modes are what this deck wants so I think the value is there at 2 mana, letting it function as an extra copy of anything.
Simic Charm is interesting in that if it pumps Arcanist, it can then be cast to pump Arcanist a second time, giving you a +6/+6 pump for just 2 mana, while also offering other modes.
Force was basically because I wanted a manaless way to break locks or combos as most combos and locks outside of Storm rely on enchantments or artifacts, but I think Shenanigans may be the better include after reading your commentary, though that's much weaker to Leyline of the Void and Rest in Peace which are both pretty good against this list. I'll definitely consider that swap, but it likely comes down to access to the card for this week.
Very much like the idea of a 4th set of rhinos. Not sure on the cut for it, as I don't want to go too low on interaction and I feel like I'm already straddling that line.
Modern: MONKEY GROW & Amulet Titan
Legacy: RG Lands
EDH: Merieke Ri Berit Esper Good stuff
GWUBRDraft my Old Border Nostalgia Cube! and/or The Little Pauper Cube That Could!RBUWG
Modern:WDeath & TaxesW | RUGRUG DelverRUG
Then there's the question of what to include around it. Force of Negation has been pretty cool in my testing, but I think the cards that best suit the new creature make Force a hard sell. Wrenn, Domri, Looting, and Mutagenic Growth are all cards I've wanted in my build so far.
Also I like Veil of Summer as a sideboard card against Push decks or counterspells. Even countered a Mind Funeral earlier today! Which brings us the final question: how many utility lands should we run, and where? The sideboard Bog seems like a shoe-in, but I'm less sold on even the Blast Zone. Having one Fiery for Wrenn shenanigans seems okay though.
Here's my first draft:
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Elvish Reclaimer
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Hooting Mandrills
Instants (17)
4 Thought Scour
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Spell Pierce
2 Mutagenic Growth
1 Mana Leak
1 Dismember
1 Tarfire
Sorceries (6)
4 Serum Visions
2 Faithless Looting
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Misty Rainforest
2 Wooded Foothills
2 Steam Vents
1 Stomping Ground
1 Breeding Pool
1 Fiery Islet
2 Island
1 Forest
Planeswalkers (4)
2 Wrenn and Six
2 Domri, Anarch of Bolas
2 Damping Sphere
2 Blood Moon
2 Pyroclasm
2 Veil of Summer
1 Hazoret the Fervent
1 Snapcaster Mage
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Destructive Revelry
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Blast Zone
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
a) the deck can afford another graveyard based creature alongside Goyf and Mandrills,
b) Elvish Reclaimer can consistently be a 3/4 on turn two (and, if it’s not, Hexdrinker is better than this by miles),
c) we can make use of Blast Zone out of the board while playing low cc creatures ourselves,
d) 23 istant/sorcery can be even remotely the right path,
e) doing all of this is worth sacrificing turn 0 counterspells.
Honestly, the build looks cute, but it does little to none compared to where I want to be at in the current Modern.
http://modernnexus.com/beat-this-evaluating-one-mana-beaters/
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
Agree with you here.
Free counters have proven the best thing we can do. We finally have the chance to do something "unfair" we must exploit it.
I like hexdrinker very much since it keeps controls at bay all alone being more than decent against all other decks and (most important thing) it's not gy dependent. In a world of hogaak this is very important imho.
I can't wait to try both fry and veil of summer since both are very promising.
A bit unrelated.
Has anybody played against new Urza thopter sword? How's the match up? I feel it a strong deck, but I never faced it.
Modern:
Here's what I've been playing:
4x Force of Negation
4x Lightning Bolt
1x Magmatic Sinkhole
2x Mana Leak
4x Opt
2x Spell Pierce
1x Spell Snare
1x Tarfire
2x Vapor Snag
Sorcery (6)
4x Serum Visions
2x Sleight of Hand
Planeswalker (1)
1x Narset, Parter of Veils
1x Breeding Pool
1x Forest
3x Island
4x Misty Rainforest
3x Scalding Tarn
2x Steam Vents
1x Stomping Ground
3x Wooded Foothills
Creature (14)
4x Delver of Secrets
4x Hexdrinker
2x Snapcaster Mage
4x Tarmogoyf
1x Ancient Grudge
1x Anger of the Gods
3x Blood Moon
1x Dispel
1x Engineered Explosives
1x Hazoret the Fervent
1x Pyroclasm
2x Ravenous Trap
1x Return to Nature
1x Spell Snare
2x Surgical Extraction
The Narset, Magmatic Sinkhole, Tarfire, Vapor Snags, and Spell Snare are all flex slots, as I see them. Probably the Snapcasters, too, but it's hard for me to imagine playing this deck without the extra reach and protection they provide.
In the board, the Snare, Grudge, Hazoret, and Dispel are all totally changeable. I've always played some sort of 3 or 4 mana threat out of the board, and often a pair of them, but I think Hexdrinker might make that plan obsolete. I like being able to increase threat density, but then again, in days past, I was often cutting a Mandrills for the Hazoret or Huntmasters or whatever when I was expecting grave hate, and that's not a thing I worry about anymore.
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: UR Delver
Modern: UGR Delver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Hexdrinker
4 Lightning Bolt
1 Tarfire
3 Vapor Snag
2 Mishra's Bauble
4 Serum Visions
3 Sleight of Hand
3 Thought Scour
3 Disrupting Shoal
2 Mana Leak
2 Stubborn Denial
2 Force of Negation
3 Scalding Tarn
2 Wooded Foothills
2 Steam Vents
1 Breeding Pool
1 Stomping Ground
2 Island
1 Forest
1 Mountain
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Hazoret the Fervent
1 Seasoned Pyromancer
1 Collector Ouphe
2 Blood Moon
1 Return to Nature
1 Disdainful Stroke
1 Force of Negation
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Ravenous Trap
2 Flame Slash
1 Pyroclasm
Modern: