so how do you deal with opposing goyfs and smitters on T2?
The same way I would without Spirit Guides
Usually that means "add a bolt to trade/kill" (Legion Loyalist can help avoid trading, here), "sac Fan(t)a(s)tic to trade/kill" and "drop King to mountainwalk"
I really think you should try running 3 Aether Vial, and a Tuk Tuk. Instead of 4 Simian Spirit Guides.
Reason being is spells like Remand. Say you use a simian spirit guide to get out and aditional goblin, your opponent remands and you lost spirit guide in discard and didnt get to play your other spell because its back in your hand.
This is where spirit guide fails. Now If you had an aeither vial. Youd just put your Goblin into play and not worry. Trick is to leave an aether vial at 1 counter, with all your one drops.
I really think you should try running 3 Aether Vial, and a Tuk Tuk. Instead of 4 Simian Spirit Guides.
Reason being is spells like Remand. Say you use a simian spirit guide to get out and aditional goblin, your opponent remands and you lost spirit guide in discard and didnt get to play your other spell because its back in your hand.
This is where spirit guide fails. Now If you had an aeither vial. Youd just put your Goblin into play and not worry. Trick is to leave an aether vial at 1 counter, with all your one drops.
Im saying he is a bad accelerator, because if your spell that you played using simian spirit guide as a mana source is countered. You lost Card advantage, and because your deck has no form of draw, you can two for one yourself.
Im saying he is a bad accelerator, because if your spell that you played using simian spirit guide as a mana source is countered. You lost Card advantage, and because your deck has no form of draw, you can two for one yourself.
I have to stress again that I have a 4 of Cavern of Souls exactly for that.
Hey there guys! I've been working on my own version of BR goblins with a twist. The goal of the deck is to be as fast as possible and to overwhelm your opponent. I've been playing with this deck for around three months and the results have been very good. It's not a tier 1 deck but it's a solid tier 2 deck that can surprise a lot of established decks. As far as my testing goes against tier 1 decks it does fairly well against pods deck if you get a good hand, same with Jund. Against zoo it depends mostly on who starts and how well we sideboard. The decks that gives us the most problems are Tron (Karn + Wurmcoil is really hard to deal against), UWR control (if we get dragged past turn 6 we are in deep *****) and affinity. BW tokens tests have been inconclusive as the meta I play in doesnt have a lot of those decks.
What do you guys think? What would you remove or add? I've been thinking about removing the Elementals in favor of something else, but I am not sure about what to add.
So what do you think about the manabase? Is the Summit worth playing it, or just to greedy?
The Sideboard is able to outrace Soul Sisters, Living End and Decks with nasty Planeswalker (Karn,...).
Not running Goblin Grenade in a Goblins deck is very very silly. Its really the only reason why you would run this deck over straight burn or other RDW strategies. I've considered running Spirit Guide before but he causes you to run out of cards too quickly. The dream hand of a spirit guide and warren instigator with some chieftains might be worth it though.
Went 3-1 and finished 3rd after cut to top 4 today at the LGS.
Round 1, U/W Miracles brew. He scryed up 3 game 1. Game 2 and 3 I rolled him.
Round 2, Storm. Nut draw of turn 1 two followed by turn 2 Bushwhacker into turn 3 (s). Game two he made a billion sand got me. Game 3 I fought through 2 then drew back to back .
Round 3, R/B Burn/Discard/Good Card brew. Nut draw'd him game one. He got me games 2 and 3 with some good play and good sideboard cards.
Round 4, Some really strange Nivmagus brew. He goes turn one Nivmagus... I am puzzled. sproceed to beat down. Nivmagus sits there until turn 3. I didn't have any burn for the thing. He goes house with some Phyrexian mana spells and a , killing me in one hit. Games 2 and 3 I sided in and sfor that thing. Nivmagus and seared some blood and then combusted. 3-1 in matches at this point.
Top 4 match, my buddy playing Boggles (gw auras). Game 1 I got there with some quick guys and he never drew a lifelink aura. Game 2 he gets a quick Coronet then another Coronet on a boggle and that is game. Game 3 I mulligan to 5 and almost get there. Had a 50/50 shot to draw a win but drew mana instead.
Has anyone tried an approach to Goblins using a resource-denial strategy, kinda like the legacy version? I made a mono-red list the other day that used cards like Crack the Earth and Boom // Buts, then started wondering about using cards like Smallpox if adding black. Whenever I got going in the early game, I steamrolled my opponents with tempo, but the list is still rough and inconsistent.
Has anyone tried an approach to Goblins using a resource-denial strategy, kinda like the legacy version? I made a mono-red list the other day that used cards like Crack the Earth and Boom // Buts, then started wondering about using cards like Smallpox if adding black. Whenever I got going in the early game, I steamrolled my opponents with tempo, but the list is still rough and inconsistent.
I run a few Crack the Earth in my goblin sideboard. At best its a 1 mana land destruction spell and at worst we just end up trading low end creatures. It actually won me a game against burn a few times. Mogg War Marshall plays gets along well with it.
I'm not too keen on Boom//Bust in this deck as it costs us a land as well and we already run pretty low as it is. Same goes for SmallPox and I can see the double black being an issue as well.
On Cockatrice I've been playing a R/B version of Goblins that splashes for Spike jester. He is definitely worth the splash and with added fetch lands the decks consistency feels the same as mono red. I'm not too sure what else I would add with the black splash.
I got tottaly smashed with my list above.
Playing a local tournament in Aachen, with 4 rounds, everybody but a mono green list killed me.
1st round - UWR Kiki Pod
1st match i mulliganed to 4 and still had a bad hand.
When i had a few Gobs he kills everyone with anger of the gods.
2nd game was even worse. I got nothing to get through to him and finally he killed me.
2nd round - Any weird monoG Build
Nothing special. I crushed him with Jester, Guide, Loyalist and Tokens, without anything important he has done.
3rd round - Splinter Twin
Even after boarding he just goes off with Exarch and Twin. I didn't draw one of my charms.
4th round - MonoB
Never seen before build, using Phyrexian Obliterator. I draw Mountains turn after turn only keeping one in my hand, letting my enemy guess i keep a goblin grenade in hand (he was at 8 at that point). i couldn't keep up and the obliterator killed me.
I understand what you mean. I personally think that Command, Marshal and Denizen are way too slow for a goblin deck. I'd personally change them and add some removal or some direct damage spells. It has done wonders for me.
I change the focus back to Mono Red, adding Hellspark Elemental , Rift Bolt and Hellion Crucible to add a bit of reach and Speed. I will also add 2 Dynacharge instead of Goblin King to get use of Hellspark and Crucible.
I understand adding Hellspark as I did too as well. One question, if you don't mind, what went wrong with the jesters? They have been awesome for me thus far so I am really interested in seeing what is not clicking for you.
I understand adding Hellspark as I did too as well. One question, if you don't mind, what went wrong with the jesters? They have been awesome for me thus far so I am really interested in seeing what is not clicking for you.
It is not worth it splashing black.
Imagine every time i played him he just died the next turn, caused by Anger of the gods, Pyroclams or Electrolyze.
the only reason playing Spike Jester over Hellspark is in fact he is a Goblin.
The one Pumper u got is chieftain for Only-gobs. And he just eats removal every time. without any Lord, Krenko's command and all the other tokens do not have any use.
Bushwhacker, Denizen and Dynacharge working great without Gobs.
We should re-think the idea behind the deck:
Is it worth it, pumping Goblins, while most of our pump spells even pump non-Goblin creatures?
Think of the mid-game:
What Goblin really gives value to our midrange-Gameplan? Only Gobs costing >=3CMC and that's exactly what u don't want most of the time.
My idea is to get value from our Cards.
Getting a 3/1 out of yard or dropping a 4/4 haste in turn 4-6 maybe a good deal to consistently deal damage if your early gameplan has been disrupted.
In my opinion it is possible to combine a very agressive start while maintaining a few strategies for the midgame.
And that's the way it should be.
If you are able to deal 5 - 10 damage in round 2 maybe 3 and your enemy is able to stabilize, the deck have to keep the pressure up till looking for a way to win (Grenade, Hellion Crucible, Mutavault...etc.).
Question, would Izzet Goblin colours work? I am noticing that even a few counter spells would help out against decks like MonoUtron, splinter twin, and even countering a creature like Goyf. I would remove goblin war driver (who I think is clunky and I'd rather have a kicked bushwhacker or war marshal) adding in single blue counter spell like spell pierce or mana leak would be beneficial.
I understand that being reactive isn't something that we want to do with goblins, but have 4,of 1,of those cards and splashing with steam vents would be helpful. Thoughts? I'm going to attempt guttural response this week, so if they try to counter my goblin grenade I have a shot at countering their counter.
Question, would Izzet Goblin colours work? I am noticing that even a few counter spells would help out against decks like MonoUtron, splinter twin, and even countering a creature like Goyf. I would remove goblin war driver (who I think is clunky and I'd rather have a kicked bushwhacker or war marshal) adding in single blue counter spell like spell pierce or mana leak would be beneficial.
I understand that being reactive isn't something that we want to do with goblins, but have 4,of 1,of those cards and splashing with steam vents would be helpful. Thoughts? I'm going to attempt guttural response this week, so if they try to counter my goblin grenade I have a shot at countering their counter.
THIS is why I don't play Grenades :/
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The same way I would without Spirit Guides
Usually that means "add a bolt to trade/kill" (Legion Loyalist can help avoid trading, here), "sac Fan(t)a(s)tic to trade/kill" and "drop King to mountainwalk"
Reason being is spells like Remand. Say you use a simian spirit guide to get out and aditional goblin, your opponent remands and you lost spirit guide in discard and didnt get to play your other spell because its back in your hand.
This is where spirit guide fails. Now If you had an aeither vial. Youd just put your Goblin into play and not worry. Trick is to leave an aether vial at 1 counter, with all your one drops.
I don't use the Simian Spirit Guide for an additional 1 drop, I use it to accelerate into a lord, a kicked Goblin Bushwhacker or, when I play it (the decklist is not set in stone), to drop a turn 1 Warren Instigator. To avoid remands I have 4 Cavern of Souls, and Remand is the reason I don't play Goblin Grenade
Im saying he is a bad accelerator, because if your spell that you played using simian spirit guide as a mana source is countered. You lost Card advantage, and because your deck has no form of draw, you can two for one yourself.
I have to stress again that I have a 4 of Cavern of Souls exactly for that.
This is the deck:
8 Mountain
4 Sulfurous Springs
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 Auntie's Hovel
4 Goblin Arsonist
4 Spike Jester
4 Goblin Guide
4 Goblin Chieftain
3 Night's Whisper
3 Hellspark Elemental
4 Legion Loyalist
3 Dismember
4 Goblin Bushwhacker
3 Goblin Grenade
4 Lightning Bolt
The sideboard goes a little bit by
3 Dreadbore
3 Vexing Shusher
3 Illness in the Ranks
3 Shattering Spree
3 Blood Moon
What do you guys think? What would you remove or add? I've been thinking about removing the Elementals in favor of something else, but I am not sure about what to add.
i am also splashing black, most important because of Spike Jester. It looks like this:
3 Blood Crypt
2 Dragonskull Summit
2 Mutavault
4 Goblin Guide
4 Legion Loyalist
4 Foundry Street Denizen
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Goblin Grenade
4 Spike Jester
4 Mogg War Marshal
3 Krenko's Command
4 Goblin Bushwhacker
4 Goblin Chieftain
1 Goblin King
10 Mountain
3 Pyrite Spellbomb
2 Rain of Gore
2 Dreadbore
3 Rakdos Charm
2 Combust
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Goblin King
So what do you think about the manabase? Is the Summit worth playing it, or just to greedy?
The Sideboard is able to outrace Soul Sisters, Living End and Decks with nasty Planeswalker (Karn,...).
Green @ it's best
Not running Goblin Grenade in a Goblins deck is very very silly. Its really the only reason why you would run this deck over straight burn or other RDW strategies. I've considered running Spirit Guide before but he causes you to run out of cards too quickly. The dream hand of a spirit guide and warren instigator with some chieftains might be worth it though.
Round 1, U/W Miracles brew. He scryed up 3 game 1. Game 2 and 3 I rolled him.
Round 2, Storm. Nut draw of turn 1 two followed by turn 2 Bushwhacker into turn 3 (s). Game two he made a billion sand got me. Game 3 I fought through 2 then drew back to back .
Round 3, R/B Burn/Discard/Good Card brew. Nut draw'd him game one. He got me games 2 and 3 with some good play and good sideboard cards.
Round 4, Some really strange Nivmagus brew. He goes turn one Nivmagus... I am puzzled. sproceed to beat down. Nivmagus sits there until turn 3. I didn't have any burn for the thing. He goes house with some Phyrexian mana spells and a , killing me in one hit. Games 2 and 3 I sided in and sfor that thing. Nivmagus and seared some blood and then combusted. 3-1 in matches at this point.
Top 4 match, my buddy playing Boggles (gw auras). Game 1 I got there with some quick guys and he never drew a lifelink aura. Game 2 he gets a quick Coronet then another Coronet on a boggle and that is game. Game 3 I mulligan to 5 and almost get there. Had a 50/50 shot to draw a win but drew mana instead.
Here is my list:
3 Teetering Peaks
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Goblin Guide
4 Legion Loyalist
4 Foundry Street Denizen
3 Mogg Fanatic
4 Goblin Bushwhacker
3 Mogg War Marshal
4 Goblin Chieftain
4 Goblin Grenade
3 Krenko's Command
3 Shared Animosity
4 Molten Rain
4 Searing Blood
3 Smash to Smithereens
2 Tormod's Crypt
2 Combust
I run a few Crack the Earth in my goblin sideboard. At best its a 1 mana land destruction spell and at worst we just end up trading low end creatures. It actually won me a game against burn a few times. Mogg War Marshall plays gets along well with it.
I'm not too keen on Boom//Bust in this deck as it costs us a land as well and we already run pretty low as it is. Same goes for SmallPox and I can see the double black being an issue as well.
On Cockatrice I've been playing a R/B version of Goblins that splashes for Spike jester. He is definitely worth the splash and with added fetch lands the decks consistency feels the same as mono red. I'm not too sure what else I would add with the black splash.
Playing a local tournament in Aachen, with 4 rounds, everybody but a mono green list killed me.
1st round - UWR Kiki Pod
1st match i mulliganed to 4 and still had a bad hand.
When i had a few Gobs he kills everyone with anger of the gods.
2nd game was even worse. I got nothing to get through to him and finally he killed me.
2nd round - Any weird monoG Build
Nothing special. I crushed him with Jester, Guide, Loyalist and Tokens, without anything important he has done.
3rd round - Splinter Twin
Even after boarding he just goes off with Exarch and Twin. I didn't draw one of my charms.
4th round - MonoB
Never seen before build, using Phyrexian Obliterator. I draw Mountains turn after turn only keeping one in my hand, letting my enemy guess i keep a goblin grenade in hand (he was at 8 at that point). i couldn't keep up and the obliterator killed me.
Green @ it's best
Green @ it's best
It is not worth it splashing black.
Imagine every time i played him he just died the next turn, caused by Anger of the gods, Pyroclams or Electrolyze.
the only reason playing Spike Jester over Hellspark is in fact he is a Goblin.
The one Pumper u got is chieftain for Only-gobs. And he just eats removal every time. without any Lord, Krenko's command and all the other tokens do not have any use.
Bushwhacker, Denizen and Dynacharge working great without Gobs.
We should re-think the idea behind the deck:
Is it worth it, pumping Goblins, while most of our pump spells even pump non-Goblin creatures?
Think of the mid-game:
What Goblin really gives value to our midrange-Gameplan? Only Gobs costing >=3CMC and that's exactly what u don't want most of the time.
My idea is to get value from our Cards.
Getting a 3/1 out of yard or dropping a 4/4 haste in turn 4-6 maybe a good deal to consistently deal damage if your early gameplan has been disrupted.
In my opinion it is possible to combine a very agressive start while maintaining a few strategies for the midgame.
And that's the way it should be.
If you are able to deal 5 - 10 damage in round 2 maybe 3 and your enemy is able to stabilize, the deck have to keep the pressure up till looking for a way to win (Grenade, Hellion Crucible, Mutavault...etc.).
Green @ it's best
I understand that being reactive isn't something that we want to do with goblins, but have 4,of 1,of those cards and splashing with steam vents would be helpful. Thoughts? I'm going to attempt guttural response this week, so if they try to counter my goblin grenade I have a shot at countering their counter.
THIS is why I don't play Grenades :/