@franx13, how you find spikeshot elder? is his ability effective enough in your build?
as much as i am excited about goblin piledriver, i wonder what will be the change in the core. is mogg warmarshal still have a spot in this deck or token generator should take over his place? green or black splash is better? as much as collected company is good, i find it too slow for goblin when we aim for turn 4 kill not turn 4 collected company. as for black splash, what is the most impactful card we can run? spike jester alone is not enough to justify the black splash. i agree with sodamnlucky's write up. i have put goblin on hold for the time being, with the reprinting of piledriver, i might pick it up again but i need some convincing to invest in the build and not spending on some fringe idea which might not work. as much as i have most of the cards with the exception of pile driver, collected company and caverns of souls, i would like to see some good idea put forth that can put goblin in the limelight.
This must be a joke. Legion Loyalist should be the second/third card in the list after Piledriver/Guide. I swear, more and more, "Pros" are trolling us by holding back then surprise everyone with what they actually take to events.
It's an instant speed 5/5 trampler for 4. Wtf do you people want seriously? It has applications in populate/ above the curve beats decks, or in Bant control/ flash. I seriously think anyone mad at this card for any reason other than losing an attacker to instant speed wurm, should go home and make their own awesome card game and leave the rest of us alone.
This must be a joke. Legion Loyalist should be the second/third card in the list after Piledriver/Guide. I swear, more and more, "Pros" are trolling us by holding back then surprise everyone with what they actually take to events.
Where did Chapin even post this?
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One of these day I have to get myself organizized.
Whats the consensus on which build is the best so far? I want to buy my ards before they spike in price... again. Like is black/red goblins a good build just to run mainboard Spike Jesters? Or would mono red with Mardu Scout dashing in be good also?
from early testing i can say that a deck that wants to squeeze the most out of piledrivers power needs as many haste creatures as possible. best case scenario is that you attack turn 3 with 4 goblins, one of it being piledriver. RB supports this plan because of spike jester but i think that mardu scout could serve in this spot too. but i do not like him that much since you have to waste 2 mana every turn for him which is something i do not want.
you will be able to have draws like this MORE often if you play spike jester simply because there are more combinations of draws like this:
Turn 1: Any 1 Drop Goblin (Guide/Legion Loyalist/Foundry Street Denizen)
Turn 2: Piledriver
Turn 3: Spike Jester + haste one drop Goblin (Guide/Loyalist) OR Any 1 Drop Goblin (Guide, Loyalist, Foundry...) + Kicked Bushwhacker
= 14-20 damage (the cards in fat have to be played in order to deal 20 damage: 2+2+(3+8+3+2)= 20. 14 damage is minimum in case you play loyalist, piledriver, second loyalist and spike jester)
of course this is goldfishing. but have im mind that you have not played any grenade, bolt, atarka's command (if you are 3 colors) yet. even if your oppenent got rid of 1-2 creatures, Command or Grenade will probably win you next turn. Also note that your opponent probably had to fetch and lost some life of this too.
whats goldfishing? Also, isnt the upside of Mardu Scout that he dodges board wipes? I play Burn right now and its always sad when they Pyroclasm my Guides and Swifts
To be honest green gives us Atarka's Command with sideboard, black gives us Spike Jester with sideboard. If people are going the green direction then it would be a token build, see primer. Black seems to go more a Tokenless goblin build.
Mono red is a stable version, unfortunately with enchantments like ghostly prison, there is no answer in mono red to that.
I would go with a splash, currently I am testing both the black splash as well as the green splash with different builds. I'll posts the lists once I tune them a bit more.
In the end StrichnineGaming, it is a meta call. If you have some control that plays enchantments go for the green splash. If you have more abzan and jund decks, I would suggest going for the black splash since it contains a better creature kill package. Or you could mono red if you have a lot of tron/combo in the format since speed is a must.
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Modern: B 8Rack RX Goblins BG Elves (Attempting) UBW Mill G Stompy UB Tezzerator
Legacy: W Stax
I am also really torn about choosing green over black. Green helps with prisons and regular burn hate (although we nicely dodge Leyline of Sanctity already), and black seems to maybe help Goblin Piledriver more with Spike Jester? Ugh I just don't know.
Both:
-work well with lords
make 2 bodies in one turn
Mogg War Marshal:
-More synergistic with Foundry Street Denizen
-Works well with Goblin Grenade
-Gives a chump blocker for their turn
-Half as good with Piledriver
Krenko's/Fodder:
-Two gobs ready to attack next turn with a hasted piledriver (that's the problem)
-Better with Shared Animosity
-Worse before a board wipe
If we use Spike Jester/Mardy Scout, we can actually hope to swing with Piledriver turn 3. But is that worth it compared to turn 4 swing with more gobbos, maybe a kicked Goblin Bushwhacker with it? With hastey one drops, Piledriver is already a turn 2 play and definitely swing on 3. But waiting that extra turn grants way more options. I just can't decide which is better. Possibly the color splash will completely decide this for the deck anyway. Opinions?
After thinking about all kinds of different builts (mono red, rb, rg) i have decided to go RGB. i tried to create the fastest but still consistent modern goblin list possible and test this one first. (of course cards like Simian Spirit Guide could make it even faster but much worse and fragile regarding consistency.) still i do not know if this is any good. i am just brewing like everyone else right now.
Like False_Sheperd said i think that the lord plan might be a little clunky, so my curve ends at 2. this allows me to play 18 lands. i have no token generators, only 24 Goblins of which 16 have haste in order to support piledriver and make him as big as possible as fast as possible. the fact that i play Lava Spike is because it is cheap and i do not know any goblin besides from those that i play that can do guaranteed 3 damage as fast as this card (or has better synergy with my built). also postboard sweepers from our opponents get weaker the more straight burn spells you play (and the more haste creatures you got since you keep applying pressure after a resolved sweeper). my list contains 16 straight burn spells right now. (4 bolts, 4 command, 4 spike, 4 grenade). Titan's Strength is something i want to test out but i think it can be a sweet combat trick or even save our piledriver/guide from removal like Forked Bolt, Pyroclasm or Kolaghan's Command. Another upside of this card is the fact that we can scry 1 of course. That's the fact why i would chose it over Brute Force all day.
Sideboard not final at all. i just know i want to test tasigur. postboard when our opponents board in all cheap removal and sweepers this guy could be surprising and make a difference.
Sorry if this was talked about earlier, but do you guys know the no-lords list? Found it on reddit.
I've been playing it for a few weeks when i need a break from my Control decks and it's a blast.
It is VERY consistent because you curve out at 2, and has some nice little tricks in it like
tap 3 mountains, play Devastating Summons, sac the lands, play Bushwhacker with kicker and suddenly have 8 extra damage on the board.
I never was too sure about my sideboard (normally never play red) but created one on Tromni's advice here, and am very happy with it
@SoDamnLucky how are 3 colors working? Do you get mana problems? Doesn't this make our burn matchup siginficantly worse?
I played around with Atarka's Command and it's sick, I just somewhow can't justifiy taking out more creatures.
oops I just saw the 1st post about seeing it on reddit.
@SoDamnLucky how are 3 colors working? Do you get mana problems? Doesn't this make our burn matchup siginficantly worse?
I played around with Atarka's Command and it's sick, I just somewhow can't justifiy taking out more creatures.
unfortunately i will probably not be able to test for like 10 day at all :/
There's always the new Timetwister. Refill your hand after you vomit all your Goblins on the table. Probably not, but considering Burn in Modern and Legacy were both starting to run Cruise before it was banned, getting 7 new cards may be worth it.
As far as my decks, I'm working just on mono red and have a few different options so far. King & Moon, No King Moon = More Tokens, No King or Moon = +Titan’s Strength, and 2cc max.
Mono Red Piledriver Goblins (King and Moon)
Creatures: 26
4 R Foundry Street Denizen
4 R Goblin Guide
3 R Legion Loyalist
4 R Goblin Bushwhacker
4 1R Goblin Piledriver
4 1RR Goblin Chieftain
3 1RR Goblin King
Spells: 14
4 R Lightning Bolt
4 R Goblin Grenade
3 2R Shared Animosity
3 2R Blood Moon
Mana: 20
20 Mountains
Mono Red Piledriver Goblins (No King or Moon = more tokens)
Creatures: 24
4 R Foundry Street Denizen
4 R Goblin Guide
4 R Legion Loyalist
4 R Goblin Bushwhacker
4 1R Goblin Piledriver
4 1RR Goblin Chieftain
Mono Red Piledriver Goblins (No King or Moon = +Titan’s Strength)
Creatures: 24
4 R Foundry Street Denizen
4 R Goblin Guide
4 R Legion Loyalist
4 R Goblin Bushwhacker
4 1R Goblin Piledriver
4 1RR Goblin Chieftain
Spells: 16
4 R Lightning Bolt
4 R Goblin Grenade
2 R Titan’s Strength
4 1R Dragon Fodder
3 2R Shared Animosity
Mana: 20
20 Mountains
Mono Red Piledriver Goblins (2cc max)
Creatures: 24
4 R Foundry Street Denizen
4 R Goblin Guide
4 R Legion Loyalist
4 R Goblin Bushwhacker
4 1R Goblin Piledriver
4 1R Mogg War Marshall
Spells: 16
4 R Lightning Bolt
4 R Goblin Grenade
4 R Titan’s Strength
4 1R Dragon Fodder
Mana: 20
20 Mountains
Someone asked about a R/W Goblins. I don't have anything like that built for Modern, but I am tweaking a low to the ground R/W deck I ran thru Khans and FRF to be a R/W Goblin deck w/lots of combat tricks. Looks promising.
Manamorphose serves the purpose to make the deck shorter, so that I play 56 instead of 60. I've just started testing this version so I might have to change something. But it looks promising, Atarka's follows the creature plan while giving more reach.
With Goblin Piledriver in the format (the dream came true, at last) I'll start removing the Chieftain as every time I draw it I feel a 1/2-drop would have been better. I'll also remove one Stomping Ground to follow the new mana curve and add a third Grenade (but I'm thinking about a single copy of Kolaghan's Command with a second in the sideboard).
Spike Jester has the subtype God, and it's the only reason I play black. A RB build can sport a lot of very good SB choices, but this build of mine has just a single black mana source for spells. This limits my sideboard options to RG (while there is plenty of mana sources to cast my Jesters as Cavern of Souls is 5C.
I see some merit in going just RB if your meta is full of robots just to include a 2x Kolaghan's in your side, BUT looking at how many times I lost a game to some kind of enchantment I definitely want enchantment hate in my sideboard, not just artifact. 4x Destructive Revelry are my friends, thus I don't need to go just RB: I want B for Jesters and G for Atarka's and sideboard, I'm sold to the Jund build.
Another anooying deck is Twin, and a 4x Rending Volley is something I need in my SB.
As I very often Judge my events and seldom play, it will take some time to have full tests on this build for me, if anyone is willing to test my list faster than I can, feedback is always useful :>
I like the Jund build and the R/G build alot. I've been playtesting the R/G build with Atarka's command and it is pretty awesome. I'm surprised there hasnt been more talk of a R/W build or RWg. Boros Charm maybe the best card for us to get that extra push to be really competitive. Boros charm protects our creatures which is what we need, it also could give piledriver double strike which can be lethal or just finish them off as a extra burn spell. I'm seriously contemplating running the RWg build and keeping the green in for SB cards.
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as much as i am excited about goblin piledriver, i wonder what will be the change in the core. is mogg warmarshal still have a spot in this deck or token generator should take over his place? green or black splash is better? as much as collected company is good, i find it too slow for goblin when we aim for turn 4 kill not turn 4 collected company. as for black splash, what is the most impactful card we can run? spike jester alone is not enough to justify the black splash. i agree with sodamnlucky's write up. i have put goblin on hold for the time being, with the reprinting of piledriver, i might pick it up again but i need some convincing to invest in the build and not spending on some fringe idea which might not work. as much as i have most of the cards with the exception of pile driver, collected company and caverns of souls, i would like to see some good idea put forth that can put goblin in the limelight.
This must be a joke. Legion Loyalist should be the second/third card in the list after Piledriver/Guide. I swear, more and more, "Pros" are trolling us by holding back then surprise everyone with what they actually take to events.
Where did Chapin even post this?
you will be able to have draws like this MORE often if you play spike jester simply because there are more combinations of draws like this:
Turn 1: Any 1 Drop Goblin (Guide/Legion Loyalist/Foundry Street Denizen)
Turn 2: Piledriver
Turn 3: Spike Jester + haste one drop Goblin (Guide/Loyalist) OR Any 1 Drop Goblin (Guide, Loyalist, Foundry...) + Kicked Bushwhacker
= 14-20 damage (the cards in fat have to be played in order to deal 20 damage: 2+2+(3+8+3+2)= 20. 14 damage is minimum in case you play loyalist, piledriver, second loyalist and spike jester)
of course this is goldfishing. but have im mind that you have not played any grenade, bolt, atarka's command (if you are 3 colors) yet. even if your oppenent got rid of 1-2 creatures, Command or Grenade will probably win you next turn. Also note that your opponent probably had to fetch and lost some life of this too.
Mono red is a stable version, unfortunately with enchantments like ghostly prison, there is no answer in mono red to that.
I would go with a splash, currently I am testing both the black splash as well as the green splash with different builds. I'll posts the lists once I tune them a bit more.
In the end StrichnineGaming, it is a meta call. If you have some control that plays enchantments go for the green splash. If you have more abzan and jund decks, I would suggest going for the black splash since it contains a better creature kill package. Or you could mono red if you have a lot of tron/combo in the format since speed is a must.
Modern:
B 8Rack
RX Goblins
BG Elves (Attempting)
UBW Mill
G Stompy
UB Tezzerator
Legacy:
W Stax
Any one here pilot a red/black or red/green build for awhile with input?
But let's get a consensus on Goblin Piledriver in terms of setups. I'm talking Dragon Fodder/Krenko's Command VS Mogg War Marshal. What do we think?
Both:
-work well with lords
make 2 bodies in one turn
Mogg War Marshal:
-More synergistic with Foundry Street Denizen
-Works well with Goblin Grenade
-Gives a chump blocker for their turn
-Half as good with Piledriver
Krenko's/Fodder:
-Two gobs ready to attack next turn with a hasted piledriver (that's the problem)
-Better with Shared Animosity
-Worse before a board wipe
If we use Spike Jester/Mardy Scout, we can actually hope to swing with Piledriver turn 3. But is that worth it compared to turn 4 swing with more gobbos, maybe a kicked Goblin Bushwhacker with it? With hastey one drops, Piledriver is already a turn 2 play and definitely swing on 3. But waiting that extra turn grants way more options. I just can't decide which is better. Possibly the color splash will completely decide this for the deck anyway. Opinions?
This is still the best place for high-power-level cube chat & debate.
Here's to many more years at MTGS *clink*
Like False_Sheperd said i think that the lord plan might be a little clunky, so my curve ends at 2. this allows me to play 18 lands. i have no token generators, only 24 Goblins of which 16 have haste in order to support piledriver and make him as big as possible as fast as possible. the fact that i play Lava Spike is because it is cheap and i do not know any goblin besides from those that i play that can do guaranteed 3 damage as fast as this card (or has better synergy with my built). also postboard sweepers from our opponents get weaker the more straight burn spells you play (and the more haste creatures you got since you keep applying pressure after a resolved sweeper). my list contains 16 straight burn spells right now. (4 bolts, 4 command, 4 spike, 4 grenade). Titan's Strength is something i want to test out but i think it can be a sweet combat trick or even save our piledriver/guide from removal like Forked Bolt, Pyroclasm or Kolaghan's Command. Another upside of this card is the fact that we can scry 1 of course. That's the fact why i would chose it over Brute Force all day.
i will cut on Lava Spike or Titan's Strength for Mogg Fanatic if my meta demands it.
Sideboard not final at all. i just know i want to test tasigur. postboard when our opponents board in all cheap removal and sweepers this guy could be surprising and make a difference.
1x Arid Mesa
1x Auntie's Hovel
2x Blood Crypt
4x Bloodstained Mire
2x Cavern of Souls
2x Mountain
2x Stomping Ground
4x Wooded Foothills
Creature (24)
4x Foundry Street Denizen
4x Goblin Bushwhacker
4x Goblin Guide
4x Goblin Piledriver
4x Legion Loyalist
4x Spike Jester
4x Atarka's Command
4x Lightning Bolt
2x Titan's Strength
Sorcery (8)
4x Goblin Grenade
4x Lava Spike
2x Destructive Revelry
4x Rending Volley
2x Shattering Spree
2x Skullcrack
2x Smash to Smithereens
3x Tasigur, the Golden Fang
dam dude credit me for my deck. at least link to my tappedout. http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/no-lords-goblins/
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
oops I just saw the 1st post about seeing it on reddit.
unfortunately i will probably not be able to test for like 10 day at all :/
There's always the new Timetwister. Refill your hand after you vomit all your Goblins on the table. Probably not, but considering Burn in Modern and Legacy were both starting to run Cruise before it was banned, getting 7 new cards may be worth it.
As far as my decks, I'm working just on mono red and have a few different options so far. King & Moon, No King Moon = More Tokens, No King or Moon = +Titan’s Strength, and 2cc max.
Mono Red Piledriver Goblins (King and Moon)
Creatures: 26
4 R Foundry Street Denizen
4 R Goblin Guide
3 R Legion Loyalist
4 R Goblin Bushwhacker
4 1R Goblin Piledriver
4 1RR Goblin Chieftain
3 1RR Goblin King
Spells: 14
4 R Lightning Bolt
4 R Goblin Grenade
3 2R Shared Animosity
3 2R Blood Moon
Mana: 20
20 Mountains
Mono Red Piledriver Goblins (No King or Moon = more tokens)
Creatures: 24
4 R Foundry Street Denizen
4 R Goblin Guide
4 R Legion Loyalist
4 R Goblin Bushwhacker
4 1R Goblin Piledriver
4 1RR Goblin Chieftain
Spells: 16
4 R Lightning Bolt
4 R Goblin Grenade
4 1R Dragon Fodder
2 1R Krenko’s Command
3 2R Shared Animosity
Mana: 20
20 Mountains
Mono Red Piledriver Goblins (No King or Moon = +Titan’s Strength)
Creatures: 24
4 R Foundry Street Denizen
4 R Goblin Guide
4 R Legion Loyalist
4 R Goblin Bushwhacker
4 1R Goblin Piledriver
4 1RR Goblin Chieftain
Spells: 16
4 R Lightning Bolt
4 R Goblin Grenade
2 R Titan’s Strength
4 1R Dragon Fodder
3 2R Shared Animosity
Mana: 20
20 Mountains
Mono Red Piledriver Goblins (2cc max)
Creatures: 24
4 R Foundry Street Denizen
4 R Goblin Guide
4 R Legion Loyalist
4 R Goblin Bushwhacker
4 1R Goblin Piledriver
4 1R Mogg War Marshall
Spells: 16
4 R Lightning Bolt
4 R Goblin Grenade
4 R Titan’s Strength
4 1R Dragon Fodder
Mana: 20
20 Mountains
Someone asked about a R/W Goblins. I don't have anything like that built for Modern, but I am tweaking a low to the ground R/W deck I ran thru Khans and FRF to be a R/W Goblin deck w/lots of combat tricks. Looks promising.
More to think about, I'll start with my new list:
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Goblin Grenade
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Foundry Street Denizen
4 Goblin Guide
4 Legion Loyalist
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Bushwhacker
4 Atarka's Command
4 Manamorphose
4 Spike Jester
2 Mountain
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Blood Crypt
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Stomping Ground
4 Cavern of Souls
Spike Jester has the subtype God, and it's the only reason I play black. A RB build can sport a lot of very good SB choices, but this build of mine has just a single black mana source for spells. This limits my sideboard options to RG (while there is plenty of mana sources to cast my Jesters as Cavern of Souls is 5C.
I see some merit in going just RB if your meta is full of robots just to include a 2x Kolaghan's in your side, BUT looking at how many times I lost a game to some kind of enchantment I definitely want enchantment hate in my sideboard, not just artifact. 4x Destructive Revelry are my friends, thus I don't need to go just RB: I want B for Jesters and G for Atarka's and sideboard, I'm sold to the Jund build.
Another anooying deck is Twin, and a 4x Rending Volley is something I need in my SB.
As I very often Judge my events and seldom play, it will take some time to have full tests on this build for me, if anyone is willing to test my list faster than I can, feedback is always useful :>