I decided on Skullcrack for sideboard. It isn't that good against Soul Sisters, but it is useful for every kind of life-gain deck. Anyone with me?
Sideboard material for life gain is really tricky. I'll agree that Skullcrack is a great choice for lifegain match-ups but I'm also interested in your previous mentioning of how Everlasting Torment fairs against soul sisters.
I decided on Skullcrack for sideboard. It isn't that good against Soul Sisters, but it is useful for every kind of life-gain deck. Anyone with me?
Sideboard material for life gain is really tricky. I'll agree that Skullcrack is a great choice for lifegain match-ups but I'm also interested in your previous mentioning of how Everlasting Torment fairs against soul sisters.
The wither that Evelasting Torment grants to every creature is bad for this deck in a Soul Sisters matchup. Souls sisters will chump block with all their tockens and with wither they will affect the goblin's power and toughness for the rest of the game. Without wither the effects of the damage from Soul Sister chump blockers would be reversed the next turn.
I decided on Skullcrack for sideboard. It isn't that good against Soul Sisters, but it is useful for every kind of life-gain deck. Anyone with me?
Sideboard material for life gain is really tricky. I'll agree that Skullcrack is a great choice for lifegain match-ups but I'm also interested in your previous mentioning of how Everlasting Torment fairs against soul sisters.
The wither that Evelasting Torment grants to every creature is bad for this deck in a Soul Sisters matchup. Souls sisters will chump block with all their tockens and with wither they will affect the goblin's power and toughness for the rest of the game. Without wither the effects of the damage from Soul Sister chump blockers would be reversed the next turn.
To be fair the wither effect will come under our influence more often as we not only utilize creatures but burn spells too. This at least gives us better control as a soul sister deck plans on using creatures like Serra Ascendant and enchantments like honor of the pure to establish some sort of creature presence. By cutting off lifegain indefinitely and establishing wither which on average comes in our favor more often the game becomes an endurance test where our deck is in favor of or until the enchantment itself is taken out by removal. Yes, our goblin forces will take a hit and our momentum will be hindered, but soul sisters will take an even heavier hit on their strategy.
Rain of Gore is the best sideboard choice against lifegain (turns helix into a bolt self)if you are splashing black. Everlasting Torment is the second best because it fits into our 3cmc range and its great for mono red since RoG is out of the question
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Modern: B 8Rack RX Goblins BG Elves (Attempting) UBW Mill G Stompy UB Tezzerator
Legacy: W Stax
So, I attended my local Modern Monday tournament again, and this time, I tried something different. It's not really a goblin deck as those we're used to, but you might be able to extract some info regarding Mardu Scout at least, and I must say that my opponents were more scared of him than Spike Jester. Why, I don't really know, and maybe it was a mistake from their side, but the little surfing goblin did well in a "RB Burning Goblin" deck. For those that are interested in what I played, and whom I beat and lost to, feel free to check out my blog post.
TL:DR - I used 12 goblins and a playset of Goblin Grenades in a quasi-Burn deck. I only used goblin creatures, and I even had two Cavern of Souls set to "Goblins". Was it a truly Goblin tribal deck? Not really. But it was close, as close as it gets, and it was fun to use goblins without the fear of sweepers killing my game
I can't believe this deck got promoted to "developing competitive". Personally, I never thought of this deck as anything more than a fun, tribal deck to play at FNM.
Hey! I feel a little better about the deck's power level. A little...
But in all seriousness, this section of the forum is pretty varied. We've got decks ranging from U Tron to Soul Sisters to Possibility Storm combo. We're not that near the bottom of the food chain, in actuality. We have some really, really good matchups and some really, really, bad ones, too. We need a lot to go to Tier 1 (haha as if), but we're definitely not pushovers.
I'm a scout advocate as it dodges sorcery speed removal, which is slang for sweepers. It's gas after a wipe, and in top deck mode, anything with Haste is golden.
So, I attended my local Modern Monday tournament again, and this time, I tried something different. It's not really a goblin deck as those we're used to, but you might be able to extract some info regarding Mardu Scout at least, and I must say that my opponents were more scared of him than Spike Jester. Why, I don't really know, and maybe it was a mistake from their side, but the little surfing goblin did well in a "RB Burning Goblin" deck. For those that are interested in what I played, and whom I beat and lost to, feel free to check out my blog post.
Its a relevant idea. A few times in the past i tried play with a goblin-burn version. Hadnt the best polished list, but its a surprising deck. Just a few changes to make a almost ortodhox burn in a game 2, but have huge help of goblin grenade, yet i used mogg fanatic too
I can't believe this deck got promoted to "developing competitive". Personally, I never thought of this deck as anything more than a fun, tribal deck to play at FNM.
Developing competitive huh? Similarly, I always thought of Modern Goblins as a fun deck to bring to FNM that nets most of its wins by being lucky and a surprise to a bulk of LGS metagames dominated by more popular deck archetypes. Glad to see we don't have to suffer performance in its entirety to have some goblin-related fun. Now if we could only get some decent card draw...
On a separate note, it's good to see people testing out our sand-surfing friend, Mardu Scout. Time will tell if he's worth a deckslot and if so at what capacity.
I am anxious to report my Monday modern event result later today when I get off work! Posting this via cell now.
2-0 vs abzan
2-1 vs URW delver
0-2 vs rg from
2-1 vs merfolk
Details to come.
Ok so I will start with my chaotic list that I am going to tinker with before next monday (finally found a store that consistently plays modern events on scheduled days.
Ok some explanation of rounds as I recall them..
Round 1
2-0 vs abzan
Game 1 - I was on the play, started with T1 Goblin Guide. T2 I play Wardriver, he Decays it on my T3. I play War Marshal, he follows up with liliana of the viel, I sack the marshal. He plays a goyf then I dismember it. Eventually just over run with bushwhackers and tokens.
Game 2 - Only SB was -1 Instigator +1 Rain of Gore (incase there was kitchen finks etc)
He aggressively dealt 5 damage to himself early for fetch into shock for thoughtsieze and I was - he plays a goyf that was terminated. He played a rhino. I massed a couple turns into an obelisk and again over ran.
*He showed me he had drown in sorrow that obelisk protected me from.
Round 2
2v1 vs delver
Game 1- I killed delver with a fanatic first chance. Over ran him with goblins including legion loyalist.
Game 2- SB I think was +2 Chalice +2 Relic -2 Bolt -2 Dismember
He dropped a staticaster on my T3 that sealed game for him lol.
Game 3- SB -2 Chalice +2 Bolt (regretted not having removal)
T3 Had feeling he had Izzet Staticaster in hand again, thankfully he waited until my turn and I was able to convoke my obelisk and he flashed her in to kill 2 legion loyalist in response but damage was done. The lowly 1/1s were coming in as 3/3s now. Then came a chieftain and rabblemaster.
*Again obelisk was such a game changer for me
Round 3
0-2 vs RG Tron
Game 1- I kept a meh hand on play, didnt pan out and wasnt sure what I was up against. He had turn 3 tron without even using a land tutor.
Game 2- SB -3 Instigators +3 Smash -2 bolt +2 chalice
Guess I didnt mulligan enough, had an aggressive hand vs any other deck, but he was able to pyroclasm t2 to wipe my field into t3 tron again without land tutor. I havent been owned by tron in awhile, consistently own that deck at my lgs, though that was with a previous build using goblin grenades and simian spirit guides...but even still I typically never seen them get tron on T3 without using a tutor for one of pieces and this guy did it back to back...I asked him does that happen often after the match probably in a salty tone lol I resisted any further accusations, but I will make sure to shuffle his deck next time rather than just cut like I typically do. He said that was not normal for him. I also may put blood moon in the side, definately will be making changes.
Round 4
2-1 vs merfolk
Game 1- Was able to be aggressive enough and remove some of creatures to secure early win on the play.
Game 2- SB +2 Combust +2 Engineered -2 dismember -2 instigator
He just over ran the board faster than me, didnt even use vial that game, also he had that creature out that countered spells/abilities that targeted his creatures which made bolt in my hand dead.
Game 3- +1 dismember (remembered they have that pro red merfolk) -1 terminate
This was the most fun match I had in awhile. I got in like 10 damage early on before his board started to get to big to attack in. I drop an obelisk but his merfolk are like 4/4s at that time, but he cant quite attack in since I could block enough to live and kill him on counter swing lol. I think I played all my war marshals. I had like 10 goblins on the field and he had like 7 merfolk, most were lords. It was draw pass for few turns, he was looking for enchantment to make me an island for islandwalk, I was looking for a removal or another goblin to give me enough to attack lethal even if he had a vapor snag in hand. I eventually get there, we were laughing at the suspense. Almost felt like an EDH match
1. I found myself not really impressed with instigator, mostly because he never had opportunity to 'go off' and put like a cheiftain and krenko into play for example. One time he hit he put in a war marshal in for free and thats all I had lol.
2. I found myself missing the swingyness of goblin grenades a couple times, but that doesnt synergize well with my obelisk plan that I was impressed with as a surprise tech.
3. I will come back later, I need sleep
Nice report, two things though. One Master of Waves, is the one you are thinking, so having dismember is a good idea which i am putting in against goyfs in my BR gobo deck. Good job to you sir. Second, Obelisk of Urd is a very interesting idea. This has never been brought to the table as far as testing goes. It seems more of a sideboard card to be honest but i will be testing this in the future, so thank you for bringing something new in here. I'm starting to feel gobo grenade is almost a staple in every goblin deck. The card does so much for so little. Now, it is better in a token version, but at the same time, i feel that if i had to sac a warchief to win the game, i wouldn't care in the slightest.
Instigator is good in a vial version because you are bringing out siege commanders etc etc. It's also way better for legacy gobos(piledriver, matron, ring leader, kiki), modern hasn't really found a place for it yet.
Either way good job on the report and i will start testing that artifact soon.
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Modern: B 8Rack RX Goblins BG Elves (Attempting) UBW Mill G Stompy UB Tezzerator
Legacy: W Stax
I goldfished a bit with obeliks but never tried it in an actual game. It's great that u did, and I might follow the lead in the near future when I decide to go with a token heavy deck. I cant say if its better in main or sideboard tho..
I think it at least warrants two slots in my sideboard. The Chalice in the board makes no sense to me, but my list also has Foundry Street Denizen. Now with the bannings, Terminate and Combust seem better. I want to test mono red with Mardu Scout and upping the Caverns, but I also want to try RB with Terminate/Rain of Gore/Spike Jester.
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One of these day I have to get myself organizized.
When I was testing Obelisk (out of the sideboard) and Rabblemaster (in the main) this summer I found them both to be too slow. It didn't help that one of my first experiences with Obelisk was convoking it out and getting it Reclamation Saged by Pod. But Pod is dead and maybe it's got a shot now.
Too bad the list it would be best against (zoo) will almost certainly still have Qasali Pridemage even post-SB due to Animosities. At least it dodges Abrupt Decay out of Jund/Junk.
Mardu Scout ought to be better than Hellspark Elemental. Running a non-goblin, and no token generators like Marshall, Fodder, or Command, makes Shared Animosity probably pretty bad. I would run Rabble in that spot just as something that needs to be answered. And without Pod around, I'm not sure what Cage is really good against besides Past in Flames and there are better things to run against that.
I see Obelisk coming out of the board to get our guys out of Electrickery, Pyroclasm, Drown in Sorrow, and even a few out of Anger range.
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One of these day I have to get myself organizized.
When I was testing Obelisk (out of the sideboard) and Rabblemaster (in the main) this summer I found them both to be too slow. It didn't help that one of my first experiences with Obelisk was convoking it out and getting it Reclamation Saged by Pod. But Pod is dead and maybe it's got a shot now.
Too bad the list it would be best against (zoo) will almost certainly still have Qasali Pridemage even post-SB due to Animosities. At least it dodges Abrupt Decay out of Jund/Junk.
Through your testing Tromni, would you say that Obelisk's impact on the board was worth the time and mana investment barring situations such as getting Reclamation Saged?
A point of skepticism I have with Obelisk is that it could just be either a win-more card (only effective when played on an already powerful board state) or it doesn't provide the necessary kick to make a difference justifying the momentum lost to cast it.
Sideboard material for life gain is really tricky. I'll agree that Skullcrack is a great choice for lifegain match-ups but I'm also interested in your previous mentioning of how Everlasting Torment fairs against soul sisters.
The wither that Evelasting Torment grants to every creature is bad for this deck in a Soul Sisters matchup. Souls sisters will chump block with all their tockens and with wither they will affect the goblin's power and toughness for the rest of the game. Without wither the effects of the damage from Soul Sister chump blockers would be reversed the next turn.
To be fair the wither effect will come under our influence more often as we not only utilize creatures but burn spells too. This at least gives us better control as a soul sister deck plans on using creatures like Serra Ascendant and enchantments like honor of the pure to establish some sort of creature presence. By cutting off lifegain indefinitely and establishing wither which on average comes in our favor more often the game becomes an endurance test where our deck is in favor of or until the enchantment itself is taken out by removal. Yes, our goblin forces will take a hit and our momentum will be hindered, but soul sisters will take an even heavier hit on their strategy.
Modern:
B 8Rack
RX Goblins
BG Elves (Attempting)
UBW Mill
G Stompy
UB Tezzerator
Legacy:
W Stax
TL:DR - I used 12 goblins and a playset of Goblin Grenades in a quasi-Burn deck. I only used goblin creatures, and I even had two Cavern of Souls set to "Goblins". Was it a truly Goblin tribal deck? Not really. But it was close, as close as it gets, and it was fun to use goblins without the fear of sweepers killing my game
But in all seriousness, this section of the forum is pretty varied. We've got decks ranging from U Tron to Soul Sisters to Possibility Storm combo. We're not that near the bottom of the food chain, in actuality. We have some really, really good matchups and some really, really, bad ones, too. We need a lot to go to Tier 1 (haha as if), but we're definitely not pushovers.
Its a relevant idea. A few times in the past i tried play with a goblin-burn version. Hadnt the best polished list, but its a surprising deck. Just a few changes to make a almost ortodhox burn in a game 2, but have huge help of goblin grenade, yet i used mogg fanatic too
Modern
RBW Goblins
XU ArcMUD
Developing competitive huh? Similarly, I always thought of Modern Goblins as a fun deck to bring to FNM that nets most of its wins by being lucky and a surprise to a bulk of LGS metagames dominated by more popular deck archetypes. Glad to see we don't have to suffer performance in its entirety to have some goblin-related fun. Now if we could only get some decent card draw...
On a separate note, it's good to see people testing out our sand-surfing friend, Mardu Scout. Time will tell if he's worth a deckslot and if so at what capacity.
2-0 vs abzan
2-1 vs URW delver
0-2 vs rg from
2-1 vs merfolk
Details to come.
Ok so I will start with my chaotic list that I am going to tinker with before next monday (finally found a store that consistently plays modern events on scheduled days.
9 Mountain
4 Auntie's Hovel
3 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 Cavern of Souls
Creatures 31
4 Goblin Guide
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Legion Loyalist
4 Goblin Bushwhacker
4 Mogg War Marshal
3 Warren Instigator
1 Goblin Wardriver
4 Goblin Chieftain
2 Goblin Rabblemaster
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
2 Dismember
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Obelisk of Urd
1 Terminate
2 Engineered Explosives
2 Combust
2 Warren Weirding
3 Smash to Smithereens
1 Shatterstorm
2 Chalice of the Void
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Rain of Gore
Ok some explanation of rounds as I recall them..
Round 1
2-0 vs abzan
Game 1 - I was on the play, started with T1 Goblin Guide. T2 I play Wardriver, he Decays it on my T3. I play War Marshal, he follows up with liliana of the viel, I sack the marshal. He plays a goyf then I dismember it. Eventually just over run with bushwhackers and tokens.
Game 2 - Only SB was -1 Instigator +1 Rain of Gore (incase there was kitchen finks etc)
He aggressively dealt 5 damage to himself early for fetch into shock for thoughtsieze and I was - he plays a goyf that was terminated. He played a rhino. I massed a couple turns into an obelisk and again over ran.
*He showed me he had drown in sorrow that obelisk protected me from.
Round 2
2v1 vs delver
Game 1- I killed delver with a fanatic first chance. Over ran him with goblins including legion loyalist.
Game 2- SB I think was +2 Chalice +2 Relic -2 Bolt -2 Dismember
He dropped a staticaster on my T3 that sealed game for him lol.
Game 3- SB -2 Chalice +2 Bolt (regretted not having removal)
T3 Had feeling he had Izzet Staticaster in hand again, thankfully he waited until my turn and I was able to convoke my obelisk and he flashed her in to kill 2 legion loyalist in response but damage was done. The lowly 1/1s were coming in as 3/3s now. Then came a chieftain and rabblemaster.
*Again obelisk was such a game changer for me
Round 3
0-2 vs RG Tron
Game 1- I kept a meh hand on play, didnt pan out and wasnt sure what I was up against. He had turn 3 tron without even using a land tutor.
Game 2- SB -3 Instigators +3 Smash -2 bolt +2 chalice
Guess I didnt mulligan enough, had an aggressive hand vs any other deck, but he was able to pyroclasm t2 to wipe my field into t3 tron again without land tutor. I havent been owned by tron in awhile, consistently own that deck at my lgs, though that was with a previous build using goblin grenades and simian spirit guides...but even still I typically never seen them get tron on T3 without using a tutor for one of pieces and this guy did it back to back...I asked him does that happen often after the match probably in a salty tone lol I resisted any further accusations, but I will make sure to shuffle his deck next time rather than just cut like I typically do. He said that was not normal for him. I also may put blood moon in the side, definately will be making changes.
Round 4
2-1 vs merfolk
Game 1- Was able to be aggressive enough and remove some of creatures to secure early win on the play.
Game 2- SB +2 Combust +2 Engineered -2 dismember -2 instigator
He just over ran the board faster than me, didnt even use vial that game, also he had that creature out that countered spells/abilities that targeted his creatures which made bolt in my hand dead.
Game 3- +1 dismember (remembered they have that pro red merfolk) -1 terminate
This was the most fun match I had in awhile. I got in like 10 damage early on before his board started to get to big to attack in. I drop an obelisk but his merfolk are like 4/4s at that time, but he cant quite attack in since I could block enough to live and kill him on counter swing lol. I think I played all my war marshals. I had like 10 goblins on the field and he had like 7 merfolk, most were lords. It was draw pass for few turns, he was looking for enchantment to make me an island for islandwalk, I was looking for a removal or another goblin to give me enough to attack lethal even if he had a vapor snag in hand. I eventually get there, we were laughing at the suspense. Almost felt like an EDH match
1. I found myself not really impressed with instigator, mostly because he never had opportunity to 'go off' and put like a cheiftain and krenko into play for example. One time he hit he put in a war marshal in for free and thats all I had lol.
2. I found myself missing the swingyness of goblin grenades a couple times, but that doesnt synergize well with my obelisk plan that I was impressed with as a surprise tech.
3. I will come back later, I need sleep
Instigator is good in a vial version because you are bringing out siege commanders etc etc. It's also way better for legacy gobos(piledriver, matron, ring leader, kiki), modern hasn't really found a place for it yet.
Either way good job on the report and i will start testing that artifact soon.
Modern:
B 8Rack
RX Goblins
BG Elves (Attempting)
UBW Mill
G Stompy
UB Tezzerator
Legacy:
W Stax
Tromni mentioned it a while back last year. But I believe no real testing took place as it was buried in posts.
Too bad the list it would be best against (zoo) will almost certainly still have Qasali Pridemage even post-SB due to Animosities. At least it dodges Abrupt Decay out of Jund/Junk.
3 Cavern of Souls
5 Mountain
3 Blood Crypt
2 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 Auntie's Hovel
2 Bloodstained Mire
2 Mogg Fanatic
2 Shared Animosity (not liking it thus far)
4 Spike Jester
4 Goblin Guide
4 Goblin Chieftain
3 Night's Whisper
4 Hellspark Elemental
4 Legion Loyalist
3 Dismember
4 Goblin Bushwhacker
3 Goblin Grenade
4 Lightning Bolt
SB:
2 Earwig Squad
3 Eidolon of the Great Revel
2 Ratchet Bomb
3 Shattering Spree
3 Blood Moon
2 Grafdigger's Cage
Last FNM I went 3-1, beating defender combo, mono green stompy and living end. Lost against Affinity 0-2. I'll let you know how I do next one.
I see Obelisk coming out of the board to get our guys out of Electrickery, Pyroclasm, Drown in Sorrow, and even a few out of Anger range.
Through your testing Tromni, would you say that Obelisk's impact on the board was worth the time and mana investment barring situations such as getting Reclamation Saged?
A point of skepticism I have with Obelisk is that it could just be either a win-more card (only effective when played on an already powerful board state) or it doesn't provide the necessary kick to make a difference justifying the momentum lost to cast it.