I suspect this is a match up where we want to hit Living End ASAP. Cycle as fast as you can and Living End as soon as you've got the mana, you want this to be over in about two swings if possible. This may actually be more important than LD given their land inevitability,
This has been my experience vs scapeshift. They get too much land too quickly. I've had t3 fulminator vs t2 khalni heart expedition and it just flops as they crack a fetchland, crack khalni and get right back into position shrugging off the fulminator. They don't pack a tonne of counters but I feel like my first living end attempt is usually going to eat a remand or something, so I have to plan on forcing through the second one right after. Even then, we're unlikely to 1-shot them so the 2 turn clock has to come online before they can combo out.
I'm not sure if beast within on the prismatic omen would/could hurt them at all.
On another note - I really struggle vs RG tron with their 4 maindeck relic of progenitus and billion ways to fetch out lands and dig for more relics. What are the dedicated hate cards that can shore this up? Is damping matrix the silver bullet? Can we just board it in and board out the fulminators or are we then at too high risk of something like t3 tron into karn? Do we just punt game 1 and then bring in a bunch of ingot chewers and krosan grips and more LD and try again?
This has been my experience vs scapeshift. They get too much land too quickly. I've had t3 fulminator vs t2 khalni heart expedition and it just flops as they crack a fetchland, crack khalni and get right back into position shrugging off the fulminator. They don't pack a tonne of counters but I feel like my first living end attempt is usually going to eat a remand or something, so I have to plan on forcing through the second one right after. Even then, we're unlikely to 1-shot them so the 2 turn clock has to come online before they can combo out.
I'm not sure if beast within on the prismatic omen would/could hurt them at all.
On another note - I really struggle vs RG tron with their 4 maindeck relic of progenitus and billion ways to fetch out lands and dig for more relics. What are the dedicated hate cards that can shore this up? Is damping matrix the silver bullet? Can we just board it in and board out the fulminators or are we then at too high risk of something like t3 tron into karn? Do we just punt game 1 and then bring in a bunch of ingot chewers and krosan grips and more LD and try again?
Yeah, one-shotting them before they can go off is seriously unlikely unless they stumble on land drops.
Prismatic Omen is by no means a staple of Scapeshift, but often a consideration. It's frightening how easily they can go off even without it.
RG Tron is always going to be a problem. Sowing Salt keeps them off of Tron permanently, but it's such a narrow sideboard card that you'd really have to expect RG Tron for it to be worth it. I don't see Damping Matrix being our answer either. It's just a really bad match up.
URGImperial AnimarGRU BRGProssh, Tokenmaker of KherGRB WURNarset NostalgicRUW UBR"I like your deck better" JelevaRBU UBlue BraidsU GAzusa, Lost but RampingG
WUHanna, Pillowfort's NavigatorUW WBRAleshacratsBRW UBRGrixis Pew PewRBU URGYasova the ThreateningGRU BGGlissa the ArticiferGB WUSygg MerfolkUW RSquee, Value NabobR
RG Tron is always going to be a problem. Sowing Salt keeps them off of Tron permanently, but it's such a narrow sideboard card that you'd really have to expect RG Tron for it to be worth it. I don't see Damping Matrix being our answer either. It's just a really bad match up.
Yeah and I understand some/most builds will actually run ghost quarter to protect against sowing salts even if you go there :S
Not having played modern a lot - is it normal for decks to have one matchup they just cannot win? Or is that the difference between "proven" decks and "established" decks. If everyone's got an achilles heel I can live with just knowing this is ours.
The biggest trend I see among the tier 1 modern decks is that none of their matchups are considered "unwinnable." Against the bad matchups, they're simply "unfavored."
Living End is in a position where it rides the extremes. While there are some matchups where we're pretty much a lock, others (like RG Tron and Burn) are going to be an absolute mess no matter which way you look at it.
RE: Sowing Salt
Yeah, much too narrow, especially considering we'd never have to bring it in against anything else. I'd just add more Fulminator Mages if I wanted more LD.
RE: Damping Matrix
I actually hadn't thought of how much this helps against RG Tron. Shutting down their cantrip artifacts and Expedition Maps is pretty nice in conjunction with Fulminator Mage. I might have to experiment with that one again.
I like the deck as it is but I'm not sure whether I want Faerie Macabre or Avalanche Riders MB. From experience, which adds the most value to our game?
I like the deck as it is but I'm not sure whether I want Faerie Macabre or Avalanche Riders MB. From experience, which adds the most value to our game?
I picked DasNekros' list for the primer because it was the most straightforward - it provides a good foundation for people looking to build the "normal" version of the deck. That way, the deck can be tweaked toward a particular meta more effectively.
In your case, maccaaus, I would start out with just the Faeries. They're relevant in more matchups game 1 (sometimes Avalanche Riders is just too damn slow). Your sideboard has a bit more grave-hate than most, so I think you'd be able to get away with swapping a Jund Charm and maybe a Shriekmaw or two for some Riders, if that's still a card you want to have available to you.
u mad?
No need for hostility. Are you that upset at the comment? I glanced too quickly and thought the deck 4-0'd a daily. Just chill out.
I know I've argued against Ricochet Trap several times; it's not a bad card. However, as time draws near, I'm starting to see more and more of my local meta sleeve up UW or Splinter-Twin. Going into a unknown meta, I wouldn't use the Trap. But if I could be playing against several UW or Twin match-ups at a PTQ, it's going to be a long ass day. I don't mind playing the long, grinding match once or even twice. But the amount of people resorting to these decks is absurd.
So I sleeved up 3 for now. I'll probably take them out when I go to a PTQ in a few weeks in a city I've never played in.
Oh Ricochet Trap, you necessary evil.
Look at his list THAT'S why we play 4 Fullminator, 4 Beast Within, and at least 3 Avalanche Riders in the side. It's absolutely killer for them.
In his entire 75 he only had 4 Fullminator and 2 Beast Within. Very lacking for that match-up.
edit
PTQ Granada in Spain this past weekend: 125 players
Top 8? Wait... TOP 4? Not one but TWO Living End decks.
If you draw 2 living ends in your opener I'd assume that's an automull since we're basically down 2 cards anyways?
But if you draw 1 that's not necessarily a toss if the rest looks good?
Yeah, pretty much. You want to mull a double Living End hand not only because it's kind of like being down cards, but having only one Living End in the deck is a bad thing in a lot of match ups. It means you can only cascade once, and you also run the risk of drawing the third. That would be pretty devastating...
URGImperial AnimarGRU BRGProssh, Tokenmaker of KherGRB WURNarset NostalgicRUW UBR"I like your deck better" JelevaRBU UBlue BraidsU GAzusa, Lost but RampingG
WUHanna, Pillowfort's NavigatorUW WBRAleshacratsBRW UBRGrixis Pew PewRBU URGYasova the ThreateningGRU BGGlissa the ArticiferGB WUSygg MerfolkUW RSquee, Value NabobR
I picked DasNekros' list for the primer because it was the most straightforward - it provides a good foundation for people looking to build the "normal" version of the deck. That way, the deck can be tweaked toward a particular meta more effectively.
Yeah, that sums up my decision. I figured the most basic/ vinilla version would be the best way to learn/start playing the deck.
In your case, maccaaus, I would start out with just the Faeries.
Makes sense, ill test them out.
Your sideboard has a bit more grave-hate than most, so I think you'd be able to get away with swapping a Jund Charm and maybe a Shriekmaw or two for some Riders, if that's still a card you want to have available to you.
The SB is still a work in progress as I'm still not sure about my local meta. I know that my friends play robots, u/w angel/flash and a weird landfall/ combo deck and there's also a dredgevine and jund floating around? I think ill put the riders in sb for testing anyways
For graveyard hate does anyone actually use leyline of the void over faerie/jund charm?
I was trying it online and it seems really awkward... you want it in your opening hand, but you never want multiples and you never want to draw it. If you don't mull into it you basically have 4 useless dead cards in your deck, and you might toss good hands only to hit a weak hand with a leyline in it...
Charms and faeries are okay in multiples, and do work whenever you draw them. Is the advantage of having a leyline out on turn 0 and having it stop everything that goes in (as opposed to just 2 cards or 1-shotting the graveyard at one point) worth the pain of having to mull into it and then have 3 dead slots?
For graveyard hate does anyone actually use leyline of the void over faerie/jund charm?
I was trying it online and it seems really awkward... you want it in your opening hand, but you never want multiples and you never want to draw it. If you don't mull into it you basically have 4 useless dead cards in your deck, and you might toss good hands only to hit a weak hand with a leyline in it...
Charms and faeries are okay in multiples, and do work whenever you draw them. Is the advantage of having a leyline out on turn 0 and having it stop everything that goes in (as opposed to just 2 cards or 1-shotting the graveyard at one point) worth the pain of having to mull into it and then have 3 dead slots?
I only used it for the first time just tonight in a mirror match. I ended up winning that game, mostly off of getting a little ahead on cyclers then beating him down with the Beast Within token he gave me off of destroying the turn 0 Leyline. While he was scrambling to catch up on his graveyard (he did an admirable job), I was hitting him hard with a 3/3 backed up by Kessig Wolf Run (which I'm now in love with).
Faerie Macabres and Jund Charms, those can go back and forth. People can recover from them by refilling their graveyard in whatever way, but Leyline needs to actually be destroyed before they can even start addressing the problem.
URGImperial AnimarGRU BRGProssh, Tokenmaker of KherGRB WURNarset NostalgicRUW UBR"I like your deck better" JelevaRBU UBlue BraidsU GAzusa, Lost but RampingG
WUHanna, Pillowfort's NavigatorUW WBRAleshacratsBRW UBRGrixis Pew PewRBU URGYasova the ThreateningGRU BGGlissa the ArticiferGB WUSygg MerfolkUW RSquee, Value NabobR
For graveyard hate does anyone actually use leyline of the void over faerie/jund charm?
Yeah, I don't really like Leyline. I don't want to weaken the threat density any more than it already is. Plus, I'm not sure if I'm just incredibly unlucky or if this deck mulls badly. Maybe I'm just not skilled with it yet. I find myself keeping a lot of 1-land hands with cycling creatures, especially at 4-5 cards, and then never finding another land, or never finding a cascade spell, or just generally not getting anything worthwhile.
Yeah, I don't really like Leyline. I don't want to weaken the threat density any more than it already is. Plus, I'm not sure if I'm just incredibly unlucky or if this deck mulls badly. Maybe I'm just not skilled with it yet. I find myself keeping a lot of 1-land hands with cycling creatures, especially at 4-5 cards, and then never finding another land, or never finding a cascade spell, or just generally not getting anything worthwhile.
Any deck with only 19-20 lands is going to have a little trouble with mulling. You see people get land screwed with 20% more lands than we have, we just rely on cycling to help pull us out of it. I find that the third land can be a little hard to hit on some hands, with occasionally missing that land drop and not getting it until turn four. Streaks of bad luck happen.
PS: I finally got around to building this thing on MTGO, so I'm accessible on there now. Planning to test some of the ideas that haven't gotten fully fleshed out yet as well as some weird goofy ideas of my own.
URGImperial AnimarGRU BRGProssh, Tokenmaker of KherGRB WURNarset NostalgicRUW UBR"I like your deck better" JelevaRBU UBlue BraidsU GAzusa, Lost but RampingG
WUHanna, Pillowfort's NavigatorUW WBRAleshacratsBRW UBRGrixis Pew PewRBU URGYasova the ThreateningGRU BGGlissa the ArticiferGB WUSygg MerfolkUW RSquee, Value NabobR
Faerie Macabres and Jund Charms, those can go back and forth. People can recover from them by refilling their graveyard in whatever way, but Leyline needs to actually be destroyed before they can even start addressing the problem.
Yes leyline is clearly much better at doing the job IF you get it on turn 0. But on turn 4 when you can hardcast it probably does nothing because the opponent has already leveraged their graveyard enough that a leyline will barely hurt them (I'm assuming graveyard strategies still aim to win on t4/5).
The question is whether leyline is still a valid option compared to faerie or charm even if you have to mulligan into it for it to be effective, and even though drawing multiples is bad.
Yes leyline is clearly much better at doing the job IF you get it on turn 0. But on turn 4 when you can hardcast it probably does nothing because the opponent has already leveraged their graveyard enough that a leyline will barely hurt them (I'm assuming graveyard strategies still aim to win on t4/5).
The question is whether leyline is still a valid option compared to faerie or charm even if you have to mulligan into it for it to be effective, and even though drawing multiples is bad.
Well, so far I find that even when I side in Leyline, I don't side out Faerie. Even if I don't cheat it in turn 0, I use Faerie to handle them early then drop a Leyline to hard lock them out of their graveyard. Faerie is always good.
Jund Charm is a little more of a challenging question, because I tend to think of it as a sideboard card thus more directly comparable to Leyline; it comes down to one or the other. Thing is, I don't see myself ever ditching the Faerie from my mainboard, and she does very similar things (graveyard-wise) to Charm. Faerie and Charm are both temporary answers, so you have to ask yourself if you want more temporary answers or just Faerie plus a hard lock answer to the graveyard situation.
Ultimately, in a vacuum, Charm seems better than Leyline, but I think that the additional support that Faerie gives means that Charm is less good. Granted, my argument completely circumvents Charm's additional modes. I haven't formed much of an opinion on them, but I have been in situations where the two +1 counters would actually make a difference.
URGImperial AnimarGRU BRGProssh, Tokenmaker of KherGRB WURNarset NostalgicRUW UBR"I like your deck better" JelevaRBU UBlue BraidsU GAzusa, Lost but RampingG
WUHanna, Pillowfort's NavigatorUW WBRAleshacratsBRW UBRGrixis Pew PewRBU URGYasova the ThreateningGRU BGGlissa the ArticiferGB WUSygg MerfolkUW RSquee, Value NabobR
Ultimately, in a vacuum, Charm seems better than Leyline, but I think that the additional support that Faerie gives means that Charm is less good. Granted, my argument completely circumvents Charm's additional modes. I haven't formed much of an opinion on them, but I have been in situations where the two +1 counters would actually make a difference.
In my own experience, a lot of the time people will try to drop some weenies to chump you after a living end resolves. If you haven't had to use it to clear their gy, then you can use it as a 1-sided wrath to make your alpha strike really count.
I've only been able to test against a few friends decks - Merfolk, Goblins, Martyr and Burn. Nothing too spectacular. I can say that Burn and Goblins were rough if I did not hit a 3rd land drop on turn 3. There's a GPT on Saturday, but I don't feel comfortable not having tested against any top tier decks.
I have been messing around with the deck a lot though - can't really decide if I want to MB 3 or 2 Faerie Macabre or if I want to MB 2 or 3 or 0 Avalanche Riders
2 questions for y'all:
Anyone actually running Kitchen Finks over Brindle Boar?
Anyone adding blue-making lands to hard cast Architects of Thought? I am currently not running this card at all, but was wondering.
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This has been my experience vs scapeshift. They get too much land too quickly. I've had t3 fulminator vs t2 khalni heart expedition and it just flops as they crack a fetchland, crack khalni and get right back into position shrugging off the fulminator. They don't pack a tonne of counters but I feel like my first living end attempt is usually going to eat a remand or something, so I have to plan on forcing through the second one right after. Even then, we're unlikely to 1-shot them so the 2 turn clock has to come online before they can combo out.
I'm not sure if beast within on the prismatic omen would/could hurt them at all.
On another note - I really struggle vs RG tron with their 4 maindeck relic of progenitus and billion ways to fetch out lands and dig for more relics. What are the dedicated hate cards that can shore this up? Is damping matrix the silver bullet? Can we just board it in and board out the fulminators or are we then at too high risk of something like t3 tron into karn? Do we just punt game 1 and then bring in a bunch of ingot chewers and krosan grips and more LD and try again?
Yeah, one-shotting them before they can go off is seriously unlikely unless they stumble on land drops.
Prismatic Omen is by no means a staple of Scapeshift, but often a consideration. It's frightening how easily they can go off even without it.
RG Tron is always going to be a problem. Sowing Salt keeps them off of Tron permanently, but it's such a narrow sideboard card that you'd really have to expect RG Tron for it to be worth it. I don't see Damping Matrix being our answer either. It's just a really bad match up.
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Modern: BRGLiving EndGRB
Legacy: UBGShardless BUGGBU
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WURNarset NostalgicRUW
UBR"I like your deck better" JelevaRBU
UBlue BraidsU
GAzusa, Lost but RampingG
WBRAleshacratsBRW
UBRGrixis Pew PewRBU
URGYasova the ThreateningGRU
BGGlissa the ArticiferGB
WUSygg MerfolkUW
RSquee, Value NabobR
Yeah and I understand some/most builds will actually run ghost quarter to protect against sowing salts even if you go there :S
Not having played modern a lot - is it normal for decks to have one matchup they just cannot win? Or is that the difference between "proven" decks and "established" decks. If everyone's got an achilles heel I can live with just knowing this is ours.
Living End is in a position where it rides the extremes. While there are some matchups where we're pretty much a lock, others (like RG Tron and Burn) are going to be an absolute mess no matter which way you look at it.
RE: Sowing Salt
Yeah, much too narrow, especially considering we'd never have to bring it in against anything else. I'd just add more Fulminator Mages if I wanted more LD.
RE: Damping Matrix
I actually hadn't thought of how much this helps against RG Tron. Shutting down their cantrip artifacts and Expedition Maps is pretty nice in conjunction with Fulminator Mage. I might have to experiment with that one again.
Thank you for the kind words
as you advised, i had a read through the old primer and ive come up with my first list, based of yours DasNekros on page 1.
3x Blackcleave Cliffs
1x Blood Crypt
3x Copperline Gorge
2x Forest
2x Mountain
1x Overgrown Tomb
2x Swamp
1x Temple Garden
4x Verdant Catacombs
4x Violent Outburst
2x Architects of Will
4x Deadshot Minotaur
2x Faerie Macabre
4x Fulminator Mage
2x Jungle Weaver
4x Monstrous Carabid
4x Pale Recluse
4x Street Wraith
3x Living End
3x Brindle Boar
3x Ingot Chewer
2x Jund Charm
4x Leyline of the Void
3x Shriekmaw
I like the deck as it is but I'm not sure whether I want Faerie Macabre or Avalanche Riders MB. From experience, which adds the most value to our game?
Top 8 was a bit of an anomaly, don't you think? 2-0 vs. some kind of 4-color Gifts toolbox, then 0-2 vs. KikiTwin? =/
I picked DasNekros' list for the primer because it was the most straightforward - it provides a good foundation for people looking to build the "normal" version of the deck. That way, the deck can be tweaked toward a particular meta more effectively.
In your case, maccaaus, I would start out with just the Faeries. They're relevant in more matchups game 1 (sometimes Avalanche Riders is just too damn slow). Your sideboard has a bit more grave-hate than most, so I think you'd be able to get away with swapping a Jund Charm and maybe a Shriekmaw or two for some Riders, if that's still a card you want to have available to you.
u mad?
No need for hostility. Are you that upset at the comment? I glanced too quickly and thought the deck 4-0'd a daily. Just chill out.
I know I've argued against Ricochet Trap several times; it's not a bad card. However, as time draws near, I'm starting to see more and more of my local meta sleeve up UW or Splinter-Twin. Going into a unknown meta, I wouldn't use the Trap. But if I could be playing against several UW or Twin match-ups at a PTQ, it's going to be a long ass day. I don't mind playing the long, grinding match once or even twice. But the amount of people resorting to these decks is absurd.
So I sleeved up 3 for now. I'll probably take them out when I go to a PTQ in a few weeks in a city I've never played in.
Oh Ricochet Trap, you necessary evil.
Look at his list THAT'S why we play 4 Fullminator, 4 Beast Within, and at least 3 Avalanche Riders in the side. It's absolutely killer for them.
In his entire 75 he only had 4 Fullminator and 2 Beast Within. Very lacking for that match-up.
edit
PTQ Granada in Spain this past weekend: 125 players
Top 8? Wait... TOP 4? Not one but TWO Living End decks.
ex-Moderator
Legacy love.
And I like how they both beat Lingering Jund to get into the semis. Serves them right.
Sad that there was a Fae deck there too, though... you knew the dream was going to end there. What an awful matchup for us.
UTron
BRGWLiving End
Commander
WRGBUSliver
If you draw 2 living ends in your opener I'd assume that's an automull since we're basically down 2 cards anyways?
But if you draw 1 that's not necessarily a toss if the rest looks good?
Yeah, pretty much. You want to mull a double Living End hand not only because it's kind of like being down cards, but having only one Living End in the deck is a bad thing in a lot of match ups. It means you can only cascade once, and you also run the risk of drawing the third. That would be pretty devastating...
One in hand is okay, though.
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Modern: BRGLiving EndGRB
Legacy: UBGShardless BUGGBU
BRGProssh, Tokenmaker of KherGRB
WURNarset NostalgicRUW
UBR"I like your deck better" JelevaRBU
UBlue BraidsU
GAzusa, Lost but RampingG
WBRAleshacratsBRW
UBRGrixis Pew PewRBU
URGYasova the ThreateningGRU
BGGlissa the ArticiferGB
WUSygg MerfolkUW
RSquee, Value NabobR
Yeah, that sums up my decision. I figured the most basic/ vinilla version would be the best way to learn/start playing the deck.
Makes sense, ill test them out.
The SB is still a work in progress as I'm still not sure about my local meta. I know that my friends play robots, u/w angel/flash and a weird landfall/ combo deck and there's also a dredgevine and jund floating around? I think ill put the riders in sb for testing anyways
I was trying it online and it seems really awkward... you want it in your opening hand, but you never want multiples and you never want to draw it. If you don't mull into it you basically have 4 useless dead cards in your deck, and you might toss good hands only to hit a weak hand with a leyline in it...
Charms and faeries are okay in multiples, and do work whenever you draw them. Is the advantage of having a leyline out on turn 0 and having it stop everything that goes in (as opposed to just 2 cards or 1-shotting the graveyard at one point) worth the pain of having to mull into it and then have 3 dead slots?
I only used it for the first time just tonight in a mirror match. I ended up winning that game, mostly off of getting a little ahead on cyclers then beating him down with the Beast Within token he gave me off of destroying the turn 0 Leyline. While he was scrambling to catch up on his graveyard (he did an admirable job), I was hitting him hard with a 3/3 backed up by Kessig Wolf Run (which I'm now in love with).
Faerie Macabres and Jund Charms, those can go back and forth. People can recover from them by refilling their graveyard in whatever way, but Leyline needs to actually be destroyed before they can even start addressing the problem.
Living End Contributor and Enthusiast
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Rules Advisor
Modern: BRGLiving EndGRB
Legacy: UBGShardless BUGGBU
BRGProssh, Tokenmaker of KherGRB
WURNarset NostalgicRUW
UBR"I like your deck better" JelevaRBU
UBlue BraidsU
GAzusa, Lost but RampingG
WBRAleshacratsBRW
UBRGrixis Pew PewRBU
URGYasova the ThreateningGRU
BGGlissa the ArticiferGB
WUSygg MerfolkUW
RSquee, Value NabobR
Yeah, I don't really like Leyline. I don't want to weaken the threat density any more than it already is. Plus, I'm not sure if I'm just incredibly unlucky or if this deck mulls badly. Maybe I'm just not skilled with it yet. I find myself keeping a lot of 1-land hands with cycling creatures, especially at 4-5 cards, and then never finding another land, or never finding a cascade spell, or just generally not getting anything worthwhile.
[edit] like this hand I just got (goldfishing in mws) - Blood Crypt, Deadshot Minotaur, Violent Outburst, Demonic Dread, Pale Recluse. Seems pretty decent for a mulligan into 5, but I draw Faerie Macabre, Violent Outburst, Beast Withinx2 & Avalanche Riders before I get my 2nd land on turn 6. This happens to me ALL THE TIME.
Any deck with only 19-20 lands is going to have a little trouble with mulling. You see people get land screwed with 20% more lands than we have, we just rely on cycling to help pull us out of it. I find that the third land can be a little hard to hit on some hands, with occasionally missing that land drop and not getting it until turn four. Streaks of bad luck happen.
PS: I finally got around to building this thing on MTGO, so I'm accessible on there now. Planning to test some of the ideas that haven't gotten fully fleshed out yet as well as some weird goofy ideas of my own.
Living End Contributor and Enthusiast
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Rules Advisor
Modern: BRGLiving EndGRB
Legacy: UBGShardless BUGGBU
BRGProssh, Tokenmaker of KherGRB
WURNarset NostalgicRUW
UBR"I like your deck better" JelevaRBU
UBlue BraidsU
GAzusa, Lost but RampingG
WBRAleshacratsBRW
UBRGrixis Pew PewRBU
URGYasova the ThreateningGRU
BGGlissa the ArticiferGB
WUSygg MerfolkUW
RSquee, Value NabobR
Yes leyline is clearly much better at doing the job IF you get it on turn 0. But on turn 4 when you can hardcast it probably does nothing because the opponent has already leveraged their graveyard enough that a leyline will barely hurt them (I'm assuming graveyard strategies still aim to win on t4/5).
The question is whether leyline is still a valid option compared to faerie or charm even if you have to mulligan into it for it to be effective, and even though drawing multiples is bad.
Well, so far I find that even when I side in Leyline, I don't side out Faerie. Even if I don't cheat it in turn 0, I use Faerie to handle them early then drop a Leyline to hard lock them out of their graveyard. Faerie is always good.
Jund Charm is a little more of a challenging question, because I tend to think of it as a sideboard card thus more directly comparable to Leyline; it comes down to one or the other. Thing is, I don't see myself ever ditching the Faerie from my mainboard, and she does very similar things (graveyard-wise) to Charm. Faerie and Charm are both temporary answers, so you have to ask yourself if you want more temporary answers or just Faerie plus a hard lock answer to the graveyard situation.
Ultimately, in a vacuum, Charm seems better than Leyline, but I think that the additional support that Faerie gives means that Charm is less good. Granted, my argument completely circumvents Charm's additional modes. I haven't formed much of an opinion on them, but I have been in situations where the two +1 counters would actually make a difference.
Living End Contributor and Enthusiast
Come Pucatrade with me
Rules Advisor
Modern: BRGLiving EndGRB
Legacy: UBGShardless BUGGBU
BRGProssh, Tokenmaker of KherGRB
WURNarset NostalgicRUW
UBR"I like your deck better" JelevaRBU
UBlue BraidsU
GAzusa, Lost but RampingG
WBRAleshacratsBRW
UBRGrixis Pew PewRBU
URGYasova the ThreateningGRU
BGGlissa the ArticiferGB
WUSygg MerfolkUW
RSquee, Value NabobR
In my own experience, a lot of the time people will try to drop some weenies to chump you after a living end resolves. If you haven't had to use it to clear their gy, then you can use it as a 1-sided wrath to make your alpha strike really count.
I have been messing around with the deck a lot though - can't really decide if I want to MB 3 or 2 Faerie Macabre or if I want to MB 2 or 3 or 0 Avalanche Riders
2 questions for y'all:
Anyone actually running Kitchen Finks over Brindle Boar?
Anyone adding blue-making lands to hard cast Architects of Thought? I am currently not running this card at all, but was wondering.