I would never keep discard in in a bgx mirror. Stealing games is not the plan here. It is a grind. And about good topdecks. And having Rabblemaster doesn't change that. It does not turn Jund into an aggro/tempo style of deck. Its still a value midrangy deck and therefore should not be mistaken for and aggro deck. I had the feeling this was gonna happen actually, when Rabblemaster sees more play in Jund.
With rabblemaster you can keep the discard in the bgx mirrors. If he boards out his discard, You can steal games with rabblemasters on the play.
I really disagree on that one. Stealing games is a gameplan which you can apply for bad matchups (Besides the fact that I don't know how you would steal games here). The mirror is 50/50. By keeping in discard, you are trying to be a semi-badly executed aggro or tempo deck. Either go all in on such a plan and play Grixis DS, or do the statistically right thing and cut discard to avoid bad topdecks in a grind war. But I really don't think you should do something in between.
Rabblemaster is great versus LoTV. A token with haste is a great response if she's unprotected after her -2; if you get him down before she appears, the token ruins it.
No I don't think Rabblemaster is a "must play". I would actually lean towards it being a fad that will disappear soon enough. Kind of like other fads of the past: Goblin Dark Dwellers, Grim Flayer, Abbott of Keral Keep, etc.
Yes - maybe fad was the wrong choice of word - experiment then.
If the expectation is that big mana is the enemy - and Tron is the classic example of such, then more Thoughtseize is what is needed. Not a three drop that is still too slow vs a big mana deck.
Even thoughtseize doesnt help vs topdecked karns. Never won any more games vs tron because of more discard.
Once they have their lands assembled, its about utilizing time best to give them as few drawsteps as possible, for which reason rabblemaster sees play.
There's also something that Goblin Rabblemaster does that Jund has been missing for a long time, and that is a go-wide strategy. The 4-cmc cards Jund usually plays handles/answers those go-wide strategies as well. Think Huntmaster, Kalitas, and Olivia.
The key here is that he's a progressive card instead of a reactive card that handles a wide feild. As Jund pilots, we never ever want to be adopting a new game style to answer things. We want to keep the pressure on, but also deal with a wide verity of interactions and play styles.
This is why I personally choose Grim Lavamancer over Anger of the Gods, Fullminator Mage over Blood Moon, never dropping below two Scavenging Ooze, and now our adopting our buddy Rabblemaster. They all fit the *progressive* power of Jund, but also deal with a copious amount of situations in different ways, while the others mentioned don't (in my opinion).
I think Rabblemaster is here to stay as long as bolt is lesser than fatal push in the format. He feels great to play right now because the format is so singularly focused, our 1-2-3 curve (hand disruption, Tarmogoyf, and Rabblemaster) will beat the majority of the field as-is.
The missing of a go-wide factor for us is always an argument which made Huntmaster and Pia and Kiran Nalaar very interesting to me. I think they are always good to have, but PKN rarely sees play. Rabblemaster also helps here, for sure. LoTV was always too good against us, for which reason Rabblemaster was viable.
However, I think that may also change in the near future. Since the bannings we saw an emerge of big fatty creatures killing opponents fast (Jund DS). That went over to Big Mana strategies and those who dodged Fatal Push, since Push took over the format (Grixis DS could emerge). After that and up to now we are at a point, where decks try to go wide now which makes single target removal bad in a general way. Actually, if you look at mtgtop8, the most played removal spells are Path to Exile and Lightning Bolt right now. Push is slightly behind that. I think we can at some point say that Push is not everywhere in the format anymore. In fact, in the top tier decks only Grixis DS (and GB Tron) plays it.
And since Push went down a little in presence, subsequently Tarmogoyf gets better, which makes Jund in general better and may be the reason for a recent success.
In the current meta, what's the ideal gravehate-package? I have been playing 2 Spellbombs/2 Surgical in the last few months, but consider switching to Reids combination of Leyline and Cage, although I guess a 3/1 split might make the Leyline a bit more consistent.
In the current meta, what's the ideal gravehate-package? I have been playing 2 Spellbombs/2 Surgical in the last few months, but consider switching to Reids combination of Leyline and Cage, although I guess a 3/1 split might make the Leyline a bit more consistent.
I usually devote three slots to grave hate. Leyline has been sweet for me in the past when packing three in the sideboard as the "dedicated" grave-hate package. Though, now I'm on a Sugrical Extraction, a SpellBomb, and a Cage. This covers all graveyard strategies by attacking them in different ways. Plus, they don't overlap when you see them all at once (my main reason for this package). It sucks when you see multiple Cages, Surgical's, or Leylines.
It really depends on your meta, generally much GY hate is not really needed right now. I have 2 slots in the SB actually alongisde the maindecked Oozes. But if you want more, you can add more ofc.
Which one you want greatly depends on the matchups you target. For a more flexible purpose, Spellbombs are the best and can't be beaten by any card in that regard. For Leylines you need multiples (at least 3) and are horrible topdecks. Cage can be removed and then the whole GY is active again. Surgical does hit specific cards (that need to get into the yard first) but is weak against decks which use big amounts of cards in the yard.
I personally always go for Spellbombs, and rarely for Cages/Surgicals. Basically Cage is needed if there is many Company decks and Surgicals needed if there is heavy Tron/Valakut and Combo decks. Leyline I would only play if I saw many Living End and Dredge decks.
In the current meta, what's the ideal gravehate-package? I have been playing 2 Spellbombs/2 Surgical in the last few months, but consider switching to Reids combination of Leyline and Cage, although I guess a 3/1 split might make the Leyline a bit more consistent.
I usually devote three slots to grave hate. Leyline has been sweet for me in the past when packing three in the sideboard as the "dedicated" grave-hate package. Though, now I'm on a Sugrical Extraction, a SpellBomb, and a Cage. This covers all graveyard strategies by attacking them in different ways. Plus, they don't overlap when you see them all at once (my main reason for this package). It sucks when you see multiple Cages, Surgical's, or Leylines.
Thats an option. But here again Spellbombs shine, they cantrip and are never bad to draw in multiples.
The more I play with Surgical, the more I feel it's better against combo than gy-strategies. I would even say it is a sideboard card against combo with utility against gy-strategies. For me, it is often not efficient enough when I have to deal with an opposing graveyard. Leyline, on the other hand, is a clean answer but of course also way more clunky in certain situations.
The more I play with Surgical, the more I feel it's better against combo than gy-strategies. I would even say it is a sideboard card against combo with utility against gy-strategies. For me, it is often not efficient enough when I have to deal with an opposing graveyard. Leyline, on the other hand, is a clean answer but of course also way more clunky in certain situations.
It is. I can't tell how often I see people even bring in the card in attrition based matchups to potentially exile Lingering Souls or whatever. Its just plain wrong. Surgical only should be sided in when its really good, like against combo/big mana and valakut.
What do you think the best four drops are in the current meta?
Hard to say. Many are viable options. Huntmaster is the most flexible, olivia is great and hazoret might be an option. I also think kalitas is better again now due to those humans.
I really disagree on that one. Stealing games is a gameplan which you can apply for bad matchups (Besides the fact that I don't know how you would steal games here). The mirror is 50/50. By keeping in discard, you are trying to be a semi-badly executed aggro or tempo deck. Either go all in on such a plan and play Grixis DS, or do the statistically right thing and cut discard to avoid bad topdecks in a grind war. But I really don't think you should do something in between.
That is why siding out discard is the best option.
Grim was more an experiment, I mean, it was worth testing. The card is so hot and cold for me in Abzan
Goblin was just a response to the big mana decks, we may be moving to a meta that's big on creatures and regular jund can thrive.
If the expectation is that big mana is the enemy - and Tron is the classic example of such, then more Thoughtseize is what is needed. Not a three drop that is still too slow vs a big mana deck.
Once they have their lands assembled, its about utilizing time best to give them as few drawsteps as possible, for which reason rabblemaster sees play.
The key here is that he's a progressive card instead of a reactive card that handles a wide feild. As Jund pilots, we never ever want to be adopting a new game style to answer things. We want to keep the pressure on, but also deal with a wide verity of interactions and play styles.
This is why I personally choose Grim Lavamancer over Anger of the Gods, Fullminator Mage over Blood Moon, never dropping below two Scavenging Ooze, and now our adopting our buddy Rabblemaster. They all fit the *progressive* power of Jund, but also deal with a copious amount of situations in different ways, while the others mentioned don't (in my opinion).
I think Rabblemaster is here to stay as long as bolt is lesser than fatal push in the format. He feels great to play right now because the format is so singularly focused, our 1-2-3 curve (hand disruption, Tarmogoyf, and Rabblemaster) will beat the majority of the field as-is.
However, I think that may also change in the near future. Since the bannings we saw an emerge of big fatty creatures killing opponents fast (Jund DS). That went over to Big Mana strategies and those who dodged Fatal Push, since Push took over the format (Grixis DS could emerge). After that and up to now we are at a point, where decks try to go wide now which makes single target removal bad in a general way. Actually, if you look at mtgtop8, the most played removal spells are Path to Exile and Lightning Bolt right now. Push is slightly behind that. I think we can at some point say that Push is not everywhere in the format anymore. In fact, in the top tier decks only Grixis DS (and GB Tron) plays it.
And since Push went down a little in presence, subsequently Tarmogoyf gets better, which makes Jund in general better and may be the reason for a recent success.
I usually devote three slots to grave hate. Leyline has been sweet for me in the past when packing three in the sideboard as the "dedicated" grave-hate package. Though, now I'm on a Sugrical Extraction, a SpellBomb, and a Cage. This covers all graveyard strategies by attacking them in different ways. Plus, they don't overlap when you see them all at once (my main reason for this package). It sucks when you see multiple Cages, Surgical's, or Leylines.
Which one you want greatly depends on the matchups you target. For a more flexible purpose, Spellbombs are the best and can't be beaten by any card in that regard. For Leylines you need multiples (at least 3) and are horrible topdecks. Cage can be removed and then the whole GY is active again. Surgical does hit specific cards (that need to get into the yard first) but is weak against decks which use big amounts of cards in the yard.
I personally always go for Spellbombs, and rarely for Cages/Surgicals. Basically Cage is needed if there is many Company decks and Surgicals needed if there is heavy Tron/Valakut and Combo decks. Leyline I would only play if I saw many Living End and Dredge decks.
Thats an option. But here again Spellbombs shine, they cantrip and are never bad to draw in multiples.
It is. I can't tell how often I see people even bring in the card in attrition based matchups to potentially exile Lingering Souls or whatever. Its just plain wrong. Surgical only should be sided in when its really good, like against combo/big mana and valakut.
Hard to say. Many are viable options. Huntmaster is the most flexible, olivia is great and hazoret might be an option. I also think kalitas is better again now due to those humans.