I've been playing E-Tron, I would heavily advise against boarding in Fulminator mages against the deck, it's rarely good, the deck is playing 24 lands, 4 maps, 2 mind stones and 4 matter reshapers, you have to be a heavily dedicated land hate deck to disrupt its mana, which basically means its really only Ponza, DnT and 8 sea's merfolk decks which can disrupt it's mana.
The best way to beating E-tron is getting a big ass Goyf out with LOTV and holding mana up for a terminate if they try to thought-knot/smash LOTV.
Topdecking a mage is going to be extremely awful against them in any sort of grind game, jund needs a quick, aggressive and efficient hand.
Just wondering how you guys sideboard against UW Control? I'm inclined to take out Abrupt Decays and Lightning Bolts but they would be useful against Rest in Peace / Planeswalkers. Do you cut terminates or discard?
I'm running Huntmaster and Olivia
Prime targets for Decay are the new Gideon, RIP, Detention Sphere, Spreading Seas, Crucible, Clique - I wouldn't take them out. Bolts are less useful. I like my second Maelstrom Pulse out of the sideboard.
Olivia isn't gonna do much I think, you need to 2-for-1 them. As such, Huntmaster is the better choice for sure.
Thrun with backup regen mana should be huge here. Outside of Cryptic tapdown, new Gideon's 0 mode, and Wall + Jace AOT's plus mode they can't deal with it at all.
On the play I'd be inclined to at least keep my Thoughtseizes in, just so I can deal with problem cards like Walkers / Cryptics. Your life total is fairly irrelevant here anyway.
Not sure on Terminate. It hits Gideon Jura in creature mode and Colonnades, but by the time they're swinging with the latter you're probably dead anyway. Striking that fine balance between putting on pressure and not overextending into a sweeper is key in this matchup.
Just wondering how you guys sideboard against UW Control? I'm inclined to take out Abrupt Decays and Lightning Bolts but they would be useful against Rest in Peace / Planeswalkers. Do you cut terminates or discard?
I'm running Huntmaster and Olivia
Prime targets for Decay are the new Gideon, RIP, Detention Sphere, Spreading Seas, Crucible, Clique - I wouldn't take them out. Bolts are less useful. I like my second Maelstrom Pulse out of the sideboard.
Olivia isn't gonna do much I think, you need to 2-for-1 them. As such, Huntmaster is the better choice for sure.
Thrun with backup regen mana should be huge here. Outside of Cryptic tapdown, new Gideon's 0 mode, and Wall + Jace AOT's plus mode they can't deal with it at all.
On the play I'd be inclined to at least keep my Thoughtseizes in, just so I can deal with problem cards like Walkers / Cryptics. Your life total is fairly irrelevant here anyway.
Not sure on Terminate. It hits Gideon Jura in creature mode and Colonnades, but by the time they're swinging with the latter you're probably dead anyway. Striking that fine balance between putting on pressure and not overextending into a sweeper is key in this matchup.
Are fulminator mages worth it for this matchup? You can beat down with it and force them to use removal on it. Then pop it for value?
It's the Rock. There's not much to say about it. I will say he is to Rock what Reid Duke is to Jund so don't be alarmed if you don't have the same success he does with it.
It's the Rock. There's not much to say about it. I will say he is to Rock what Reid Duke is to Jund so don't be alarmed if you don't have the same success he does with it.
Agree!
I'm going to test the list above for my next PPTQ:
Just wondering how you guys sideboard against UW Control? I'm inclined to take out Abrupt Decays and Lightning Bolts but they would be useful against Rest in Peace / Planeswalkers. Do you cut terminates or discard?
I'm running Huntmaster and Olivia
Prime targets for Decay are the new Gideon, RIP, Detention Sphere, Spreading Seas, Crucible, Clique - I wouldn't take them out. Bolts are less useful. I like my second Maelstrom Pulse out of the sideboard.
Olivia isn't gonna do much I think, you need to 2-for-1 them. As such, Huntmaster is the better choice for sure.
Thrun with backup regen mana should be huge here. Outside of Cryptic tapdown, new Gideon's 0 mode, and Wall + Jace AOT's plus mode they can't deal with it at all.
On the play I'd be inclined to at least keep my Thoughtseizes in, just so I can deal with problem cards like Walkers / Cryptics. Your life total is fairly irrelevant here anyway.
Not sure on Terminate. It hits Gideon Jura in creature mode and Colonnades, but by the time they're swinging with the latter you're probably dead anyway. Striking that fine balance between putting on pressure and not overextending into a sweeper is key in this matchup.
Are fulminator mages worth it for this matchup? You can beat down with it and force them to use removal on it. Then pop it for value?
Please read the thread, we've just discussed Fulminators fairly extensively on the previous page.
My list was imprinted against certain decks as Living End-Dredge, EldraTron, Company, Burn.
I've found all of these decks.
T1: LIVING END 2-1 (1-0)
GAME1: we were on topdeck, I have a Scavenging Ooze 6/6 and he was at 2 life points. He hadn't drawn the cascade spell.
GAME 2: 3 fulminator mage on the other part and I didn't drawn any other land
GAME 3: I had Scavenging Ooze and Tasigur onto the graveyard (the first removed by Beast Within and the second discarded by Liliana of the Veil). He had a lot of creatures in his graveyard, but my Rakdos Charm on his Living End brought home the match.
T2: BW POX 2-1 (2-0)
GAME 1: He played a deck with Bloodghast, Bitterblossom, Lingering Souls, Gideon, Sorin, Discard Spells, Smallpox.An annoying deck. I started on the draw with IoK, Tseize, Push, Bolt, Blackcleave, Terminate, DConfidant. Yes, only one land but I was on the draw with 4 cc1 spells. I didn't draw any other land in the next 5 turns.
GAME 2: Discard, Discad, Confidant, Liliana and then Tarmogoyf + Tasigur. G3
GAME 3: He played Leyline of the Void on the start, but my discard spells and Liliana the Last Hope brought home the match.
SIDEBOARD: +1 Jund Charm, +1 Engineered Explosives, +1 Maelstrom Pulse, +4 Fulminator Mage | -2 Fatal Push, -2 Lightning Bolt, -1 KCommand, -2 Terminate
(I wanted to keep all discard spell because he played a lot of spells which annoying me.
T3: BURN 0-2 (2-1)
GAME 1: Mulligan to 5. 5 lands. Scry 1: land, bottom. I drew other 2 lands.
GAME 2: Mulligan to 5. 4 lands and 1 spell. Scry 1: land, bottom. I drew other 2 lands.......
T4: COMPANY 2-0 (3-1)
GAME 1: He played a strange Company deck with Knight of Reliquary, Voice, Finks, Sigarda, Tracker....This was a very long game, even if Dark Confidant gave me 9-10 additional cards.. Tasigur and Ooze the MVP of the game.
GAME 2: Discard, Removal + Discard, Ooze. Also this game was very long. He had Witness + Bop, + Hierarch, +Token Voice. In my other part Tasigur + Goyf and a Confidant and I had 3 Life Points. Jund Charm in this moment brought home the match.
SIDEBOARD: +3 Kitchen Finks, +1 Damnation, +1 Anger of the Gods, +1 Engineered Explosives, +1 Jund Charm | -4 Liliana of the Veil, -2 KCommand, -1 Liliana the Last Hope (I think that against this type of deck it is useless)
T5: ELDRATRON 2-1 (4-1)
GAME 1: He drew all cards he needed.
GAME 2: Bob + Fulminator + Fulminator + KCommand + Seize. GG. My 2 Goyf were 6/7
GAME 3: Seize + Bob + Fulminator + 2 KCommand. GG with the ultimate of Liliana of the Veil.
T6: ELDRATRON -- (4-2)
I've found my friend and I decided to give the game to him and split all prizes he managed to win. I'm not interested in the RPTQ qualification, instead of my friend.
He arrived in the final match but he lost =(.
T7: RG VALAKUT 2-1 (5-2)
GAME 1: Discard Spell on his Explore/Farseek and he drew the same....2 times. Primeval Titan GG with Valakut.
GAME 2: Seize + Bob + Fulminator Mage + KCommand + Surgical / Fulminator Mage.
GAME 3: Seize, IoK, Fulminator Mage, Fulminator Mage, Liliana. GG.
Some considerations:
-Tasigur, the Golden Fang: I know you wrinkled your nose with Bob + Tasigur hahahaha, but Jund needs a big creature now, and I think that Tasigur is the best choice. I don't like Olivia/Huntmaster for their bodies. Right, 6 damages with Bob are very relevant (for now I have never happened in the tournament. Only in test, and I didn't lose).
-23 Lands: the perfect number right now.
-Jund Charm: it is the best flexibility slot which I won't never cut.
-7 discard spells MD: Now there are a lot of spells that they mustn't enter onto the battlefield. I think that it is the best choice.
-4 Raging Ravine: I will never leave home without them. I always want to have them in hand.
A question: I would have a report about Tireless Tracker in Jund. Anyone have tested him?
Finally, what do u think about my list?
Just wondering how you guys sideboard against UW Control? I'm inclined to take out Abrupt Decays and Lightning Bolts but they would be useful against Rest in Peace / Planeswalkers. Do you cut terminates or discard?
I'm running Huntmaster and Olivia
Prime targets for Decay are the new Gideon, RIP, Detention Sphere, Spreading Seas, Crucible, Clique - I wouldn't take them out. Bolts are less useful. I like my second Maelstrom Pulse out of the sideboard.
Olivia isn't gonna do much I think, you need to 2-for-1 them. As such, Huntmaster is the better choice for sure.
Thrun with backup regen mana should be huge here. Outside of Cryptic tapdown, new Gideon's 0 mode, and Wall + Jace AOT's plus mode they can't deal with it at all.
On the play I'd be inclined to at least keep my Thoughtseizes in, just so I can deal with problem cards like Walkers / Cryptics. Your life total is fairly irrelevant here anyway.
Not sure on Terminate. It hits Gideon Jura in creature mode and Colonnades, but by the time they're swinging with the latter you're probably dead anyway. Striking that fine balance between putting on pressure and not overextending into a sweeper is key in this matchup.
Are fulminator mages worth it for this matchup? You can beat down with it and force them to use removal on it. Then pop it for value?
Please read the thread, we've just discussed Fulminators fairly extensively on the previous page.
I have been following it and many have said it's not worth it against Etron and the general meta. I was asking what their experience is with it against UW control. I'm trying to figure out ways to improve the deck so it's best if you keep negative comments that discourage constructive deck building to yourself
My list was imprinted against certain decks as Living End-Dredge, EldraTron, Company, Burn.
I've found all of these decks.
T1: LIVING END 2-1 (1-0)
GAME1: we were on topdeck, I have a Scavenging Ooze 6/6 and he was at 2 life points. He hadn't drawn the cascade spell.
GAME 2: 3 fulminator mage on the other part and I didn't drawn any other land
GAME 3: I had Scavenging Ooze and Tasigur onto the graveyard (the first removed by Beast Within and the second discarded by Liliana of the Veil). He had a lot of creatures in his graveyard, but my Rakdos Charm on his Living End brought home the match.
T2: BW POX 2-1 (2-0)
GAME 1: He played a deck with Bloodghast, Bitterblossom, Lingering Souls, Gideon, Sorin, Discard Spells, Smallpox.An annoying deck. I started on the draw with IoK, Tseize, Push, Bolt, Blackcleave, Terminate, DConfidant. Yes, only one land but I was on the draw with 4 cc1 spells. I didn't draw any other land in the next 5 turns.
GAME 2: Discard, Discad, Confidant, Liliana and then Tarmogoyf + Tasigur. G3
GAME 3: He played Leyline of the Void on the start, but my discard spells and Liliana the Last Hope brought home the match.
SIDEBOARD: +1 Jund Charm, +1 Engineered Explosives, +1 Maelstrom Pulse, +4 Fulminator Mage | -2 Fatal Push, -2 Lightning Bolt, -1 KCommand, -2 Terminate
(I wanted to keep all discard spell because he played a lot of spells which annoying me.
T3: BURN 0-2 (2-1)
GAME 1: Mulligan to 5. 5 lands. Scry 1: land, bottom. I drew other 2 lands.
GAME 2: Mulligan to 5. 4 lands and 1 spell. Scry 1: land, bottom. I drew other 2 lands.......
T4: COMPANY 2-0 (3-1)
GAME 1: He played a strange Company deck with Knight of Reliquary, Voice, Finks, Sigarda, Tracker....This was a very long game, even if Dark Confidant gave me 9-10 additional cards.. Tasigur and Ooze the MVP of the game.
GAME 2: Discard, Removal + Discard, Ooze. Also this game was very long. He had Witness + Bop, + Hierarch, +Token Voice. In my other part Tasigur + Goyf and a Confidant and I had 3 Life Points. Jund Charm in this moment brought home the match.
SIDEBOARD: +3 Kitchen Finks, +1 Damnation, +1 Anger of the Gods, +1 Engineered Explosives, +1 Jund Charm | -4 Liliana of the Veil, -2 KCommand, -1 Liliana the Last Hope (I think that against this type of deck it is useless)
T5: ELDRATRON 2-1 (4-1)
GAME 1: He drew all cards he needed.
GAME 2: Bob + Fulminator + Fulminator + KCommand + Seize. GG. My 2 Goyf were 6/7
GAME 3: Seize + Bob + Fulminator + 2 KCommand. GG with the ultimate of Liliana of the Veil.
T6: ELDRATRON -- (4-2)
I've found my friend and I decided to give the game to him and split all prizes he managed to win. I'm not interested in the RPTQ qualification, instead of my friend.
He arrived in the final match but he lost =(.
T7: RG VALAKUT 2-1 (5-2)
GAME 1: Discard Spell on his Explore/Farseek and he drew the same....2 times. Primeval Titan GG with Valakut.
GAME 2: Seize + Bob + Fulminator Mage + KCommand + Surgical / Fulminator Mage.
GAME 3: Seize, IoK, Fulminator Mage, Fulminator Mage, Liliana. GG.
Some considerations:
-Tasigur, the Golden Fang: I know you wrinkled your nose with Bob + Tasigur hahahaha, but Jund needs a big creature now, and I think that Tasigur is the best choice. I don't like Olivia/Huntmaster for their bodies. Right, 6 damages with Bob are very relevant (for now I have never happened in the tournament. Only in test, and I didn't lose).
-23 Lands: the perfect number right now.
-Jund Charm: it is the best flexibility slot which I won't never cut.
-7 discard spells MD: Now there are a lot of spells that they mustn't enter onto the battlefield. I think that it is the best choice.
-4 Raging Ravine: I will never leave home without them. I always want to have them in hand.
A question: I would have a report about Tireless Tracker in Jund. Anyone have tested him?
Finally, what do u think about my list?
Congrats on the success and great report!
Very interesting decklist. I have been wanting to play tasigurs but I'm afraid of revealing one off of a Bob trigger. I will probably give them a try because they are very strong with all the fatal pushes in the meta.
Many people on this forum have been discouraged with fulminator mages. It seems like they put in work for you this weekend. I have personally had a difficult time against UW control and Grixis control. Is it good in these matchups? How about the Etron matchup?
How did your graveyard hate work out for you? I have seen less surgicals being played and have not seen many decks with rakdos charm and Jund charm. Can you provide some insight into those choices?
I switch between Jund, Abzan and BG Rock depending on the meta and in my experience Tireless Tracker is best in BG rock with 4 ghost quarters and fetchlands. I have found it difficult squeezing tracker into kinds 75 because BG rock already plays maindeck ghost quarters and Jund/Abzan usually play some fulminators for this type of effect. With that said the card is awesome and can run away with games. It's the perfect card to bring in when you know they are going to bring in graveyard hate against you. The card grows into a monster and provides insane card advantage. If you can find room for it I recommend trying 2-3 in the 75 in order to diversify and mitigate the risk of getting hurt by graveyard hate.
Very interesting decklist. I have been wanting to play tasigurs but I'm afraid of revealing one off of a Bob trigger. I will probably give them a try because they are very strong with all the fatal pushes in the meta.
Many people on this forum have been discouraged with fulminator mages. It seems like they put in work for you this weekend. I have personally had a difficult time against UW control and Grixis control. Is it good in these matchups? How about the Etron matchup?
How did your graveyard hate work out for you? I have seen less surgicals being played and have not seen many decks with rakdos charm and Jund charm. Can you provide some insight into those choices?
I switch between Jund, Abzan and BG Rock depending on the meta and in my experience Tireless Tracker is best in BG rock with 4 ghost quarters and fetchlands. I have found it difficult squeezing tracker into kinds 75 because BG rock already plays maindeck ghost quarters and Jund/Abzan usually play some fulminators for this type of effect. With that said the card is awesome and can run away with games. It's the perfect card to bring in when you know they are going to bring in graveyard hate against you. The card grows into a monster and provides insane card advantage. If you can find room for it I recommend trying 2-3 in the 75 in order to diversify and mitigate the risk of getting hurt by graveyard hate.
Thanks again for your report!
Fulminator Mage: land denial is very strong in my meta with some RG Valakut, Eldrazi, Tron, Control. The choice of the full playset...I want to play it on 3th turn and I want to see in multiple copies as soon as possible. I think or 3 or 4...or none. I know that on the draw isn't the best choice, but with KCommand can do a lot of things.
Jund Charm/Rakdos Charm: In a lot of tests, I've found that removing the graveyard after the trigger of Living End/Dredging is the best choice you can do. I don't like Leyline because of....start or dead card. In addition, in multiple copies is a dead card. Bleah. I prefer Nihil Spellbomb instead. I have chosen JCharm and RCharm for their flexibility.
On the other hand, Surgical Extraction is only for 'combo' and some annoying cards.
In conclusion, the choice of these cards is due only to the fact that they are instants, and therefore play them when I need them most. And very often, if you play at the right time, you win the game, as I did in the tournament.
Alrighty guys, so I had my 75 (posted several pages back) all ready to go and was pretty excited but when I showed up to the event I did my usual walk around the room seeing who is there, which grinders I recognize and what decks it looked like folks might be running on the day. Long and short of it, my PPTQ's metagame was not going to be great for Jund so I audibled to a different deck which I ended up top 8ing with. Now that said, these were my matchups (bear in mind this isn't a totally accurate picture of how it'd have gone if I was playing Jund because I probably would have lost more). Matchups were Abzan, RG Tron, Bushwacker Zoo with Goyf, UW Control, BG Tron and Affinity. There was a traditional Jund deck that lost their win and into top 8 though and I did have a lengthy discussion with him. He said he was also fighting uphill all day.
Long story short: Generally speaking my local metagame is pretty friendly to Jund and I have had great success with it. Jund is no longer the deck you take to a blind metagame however so be sure to scout before the event and have an audible you are confident in playing with just in case because Modern is a wild and crazy format with folks doing pretty much whatever they want.
I am taking Jund to the mkm series in europe this weekend. I don't feel discouraged at all I must say
I am in the middle of testing though, and am unsure whether to bring Fulminators or not. Am also unsure about the amount of GY hate I need. Pretty fixed is my mainboard I think. Any suggestions?
I am taking Jund to the mkm series in europe this weekend. I don't feel discouraged at all I must say
I am in the middle of testing though, and am unsure whether to bring Fulminators or not. Am also unsure about the amount of GY hate I need. Pretty fixed is my mainboard I think. Any suggestions?
I like the idea of cutting Fulminators. Like with everyone else, they've been unimpressive to me and often too slow in the matchups I wanted them. I am considering trying Magus of the Moon again. I have still liked Anathemancer in my traverse version simply because I am almost always playing the beatdown deck when they are being brought in and they help push through those final points of damage but unlike Fulminator, are still great in the grindier matchups as well.
Round 1 - Grixis Shadow Lost 1-2
Game 1, I had hand disruption into Goyf into Lili, and was able to remove anything he played. It was a quick game.
Game 2, he plucked a Nihil Spellbomb out of my hand turn 1, then had every answer imaginable and got a Lili down sooner. I lost without putting up much of a fight.
Game 3, I got to land a turn 2 Spellbomb, but he killed every threat I had, I didn't draw enough removal, and he beat me down fairly easily.
Round 2 - Affinity Won 2-0
Game 1, I keep a hand that is hell for creature decks, hoping he's on a creature deck. He's on the play, leads on Vault Skirge. I lead on Cliffs and Push, and it only got better for me from there. I got to Maelstrom Pulse 2 Signal Pests, and baited a potentially lethal Blinkmoth Nexus swing plus Overseer activation when I had removal, so I was able to swing for lethal on the crackback. All around good game.
Game 2, I have an opening hand of Cliffs, Catacombs, Push, Bolt, Kolaghan's Command, Ancient Grudge, Goyf. I kept him off mana by killing his creatures for Mox Opal's metalcraft, and even got him to sac a Nexus when he had a big creature out. He never cast a Ravager or Etched Champion the whole match, it was rough.
Round 3 - Esper Control Lost 0-2
Games 1 and 2 were the same. I play something and it either gets countered or removed. I got to do some fun things with baiting Spell Quellers while I had removal up, chaining the spells to kill em all, but I did nothing of note either game. This match convinced me to find room for a Thrun in the sideboard.
Round 4 - Living End Lost 0-2
Game 1, I kept a 2 land, 2 Scavenging Ooze, 2 removal spell mulligan to 6. I got to eat a few things out of his Graveyard with Scooze, but turn 3 Living End when I had no more mana up (I didn't find a third one, or even a second green source) was the game.
Game 2, he plays a Leyline of Sanctity before the game starts. It's not a card I ever considered to see because they have no white mana. My IoK/Thoughtseize/Brutality/Nihil Spellbomb in hand are immediately useless before the game even starts. So now I'm hoping his other 6 cards are garbage because I know Leylines can cause people to keep bad hands. Nope. He has the lands, cyclers, a spirit guide, and the cascade spell to go off. I can do nothing, and I never found my singleton Maelstrom Pulse for the Leyline. This match convinced me to find room for a 2nd Pulse in the 75, and I'm very strongly considering buying 4 Leyline of the Void.
Round 5 - Jund Won 2-0
Game 1, we were both empty handed by maybe turn 5, with nothing but 5 lands and a raging ravine for either player. I got to swing with mine first, so I won. Classic Jund mirror. There was a turn where he attacked and killed a LotV instead of attacking me. I don't know if that would have been the game, because if he did that I would have just minused to kill his creature leaving up the Terminate I used on it for his Ravine instead, but he seemed upset about his decision. In the end, I don't think it changed anything.
Game 2, I got to play my sideboard cards (Finks, Lili Last Hope) and outvalued him. I had the SB Lili Last Hope on 6, he has to fetch/shock to double bolt her. I end up winning through Goyf and Ravine beats.
Round 6 - No show
Some stupid jerkface didn't drop after round 5, so I got to sit there and watch my buddy's boring Merfolk mirror match. I'd have rather napped.
So, 3-3 overall. It didn't feel great, to be honest. I'm gonna keep jamming the deck, making changes here and there, but I'm not exactly in love with the deck's position right now.
I am taking Jund to the mkm series in europe this weekend. I don't feel discouraged at all I must say
I am in the middle of testing though, and am unsure whether to bring Fulminators or not. Am also unsure about the amount of GY hate I need. Pretty fixed is my mainboard I think. Any suggestions?
I will be playing in Prague too
About the sideboard: I cut my Fulminators completely from the sidebaord, added 1 Golgari Charm and 1 Thundermaw Hellkite. I like the combination of 2x Spellbomb and 2x Surgical, as both of them are far more flexible than Cage or Leyline imo.
Seriously considering bringing Shadow of Doubt next week, those were some infuriating losses. I never felt completely helpless against Amulet though. Main deck TMaw did great work but I realize it's greedy.
I think a second Pulse might be a fantastic idea right now. It helps with Eldratron, Tron, UW Control and Titanshift alltogether. Its not amazing against all, but I think I want a second copy in my side for that tournament.
My current Jund list has the second pulse in the main, instead of a second K-Command. I've been playing 2 in the 75 for both Jund and Abzan for a couple months now and it's been great, it's exactly the kind of multi-purpose catch-all that we look for.
Totally agree with you!
UR Twin - RIP
Prime targets for Decay are the new Gideon, RIP, Detention Sphere, Spreading Seas, Crucible, Clique - I wouldn't take them out. Bolts are less useful. I like my second Maelstrom Pulse out of the sideboard.
Olivia isn't gonna do much I think, you need to 2-for-1 them. As such, Huntmaster is the better choice for sure.
Thrun with backup regen mana should be huge here. Outside of Cryptic tapdown, new Gideon's 0 mode, and Wall + Jace AOT's plus mode they can't deal with it at all.
On the play I'd be inclined to at least keep my Thoughtseizes in, just so I can deal with problem cards like Walkers / Cryptics. Your life total is fairly irrelevant here anyway.
Not sure on Terminate. It hits Gideon Jura in creature mode and Colonnades, but by the time they're swinging with the latter you're probably dead anyway. Striking that fine balance between putting on pressure and not overextending into a sweeper is key in this matchup.
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
Are fulminator mages worth it for this matchup? You can beat down with it and force them to use removal on it. Then pop it for value?
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=115097
what do you guys think of it?
UR Twin - RIP
It's the Rock. There's not much to say about it. I will say he is to Rock what Reid Duke is to Jund so don't be alarmed if you don't have the same success he does with it.
Agree!
I'm going to test the list above for my next PPTQ:
4 Dark Confidant
3 Scavenging Ooze
1 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2 Tireless Tracker
4 Liliana of the Veil
4 Terminate
2 Abrupt Decay
3 Fatal Push
1 Kolaghan's Command
1 Slaughter Pact
1 Maelstrom Pulse
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Thoughtseize
1 Claim // Fame
1 Wooded Foothills
3 Bloodstained Mire
2 Overgrown Tomb
1 Blood Crypt
1 Stomping Ground
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
2 Raging Ravine
2 Blooming Marsh
2 Swamp
1 Forest
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Kitchen Finks
1 Grim Lavamancer
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
2 Collective Brutality
1 Shatterstorm
1 Thoughtseize
UR Twin - RIP
Please read the thread, we've just discussed Fulminators fairly extensively on the previous page.
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
2 Bloodstained Mire
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Raging Ravine
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
1 Twilight Mire
1 Blood Crypt
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Stomping Ground
2 Swamp
1 Forest
4 Dark Confidant
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Scavenging Ooze
2 Tasigur, the Golden Fang
2 Lightning Bolt
2 Fatal Push
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Kolaghan's Command
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
1 Maelstrom Pulse
4 Liliana of the Veil
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
4 Fulminator Mage
3 Kitchen Finks
1 Kolaghan's Command
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Anger of the Gods
1 Damnation
1 Jund Charm
1 Rakdos Charm
1 Surgical Extraction
My list was imprinted against certain decks as Living End-Dredge, EldraTron, Company, Burn.
I've found all of these decks.
T1: LIVING END 2-1 (1-0)
GAME1: we were on topdeck, I have a Scavenging Ooze 6/6 and he was at 2 life points. He hadn't drawn the cascade spell.
GAME 2: 3 fulminator mage on the other part and I didn't drawn any other land
GAME 3: I had Scavenging Ooze and Tasigur onto the graveyard (the first removed by Beast Within and the second discarded by Liliana of the Veil). He had a lot of creatures in his graveyard, but my Rakdos Charm on his Living End brought home the match.
SIDEBOARD: +4 Fulminator Mage, +1 Damnation, +1 Surgical Extraction, +1 Rakdos Charm, +1 Jund Charm, +3 Kitchen Finks, +1 Maelstrom Pulse | -2 Lighting Bolt, -2 Fatal Push, -2 Abrupt Decay, -1 Liliana, the Last Hope, -2 KCommand, -3 Terminate
T2: BW POX 2-1 (2-0)
GAME 1: He played a deck with Bloodghast, Bitterblossom, Lingering Souls, Gideon, Sorin, Discard Spells, Smallpox.An annoying deck. I started on the draw with IoK, Tseize, Push, Bolt, Blackcleave, Terminate, DConfidant. Yes, only one land but I was on the draw with 4 cc1 spells. I didn't draw any other land in the next 5 turns.
GAME 2: Discard, Discad, Confidant, Liliana and then Tarmogoyf + Tasigur. G3
GAME 3: He played Leyline of the Void on the start, but my discard spells and Liliana the Last Hope brought home the match.
SIDEBOARD: +1 Jund Charm, +1 Engineered Explosives, +1 Maelstrom Pulse, +4 Fulminator Mage | -2 Fatal Push, -2 Lightning Bolt, -1 KCommand, -2 Terminate
(I wanted to keep all discard spell because he played a lot of spells which annoying me.
T3: BURN 0-2 (2-1)
GAME 1: Mulligan to 5. 5 lands. Scry 1: land, bottom. I drew other 2 lands.
GAME 2: Mulligan to 5. 4 lands and 1 spell. Scry 1: land, bottom. I drew other 2 lands.......
SIDEBOARD: +4 Fulminator Mage, +3 Kitchen Finks, +1 KCommand | -4 Dark Confidant -3 Thoughtseize, -1 Maelstrom Pulse
T4: COMPANY 2-0 (3-1)
GAME 1: He played a strange Company deck with Knight of Reliquary, Voice, Finks, Sigarda, Tracker....This was a very long game, even if Dark Confidant gave me 9-10 additional cards.. Tasigur and Ooze the MVP of the game.
GAME 2: Discard, Removal + Discard, Ooze. Also this game was very long. He had Witness + Bop, + Hierarch, +Token Voice. In my other part Tasigur + Goyf and a Confidant and I had 3 Life Points. Jund Charm in this moment brought home the match.
SIDEBOARD: +3 Kitchen Finks, +1 Damnation, +1 Anger of the Gods, +1 Engineered Explosives, +1 Jund Charm | -4 Liliana of the Veil, -2 KCommand, -1 Liliana the Last Hope (I think that against this type of deck it is useless)
T5: ELDRATRON 2-1 (4-1)
GAME 1: He drew all cards he needed.
GAME 2: Bob + Fulminator + Fulminator + KCommand + Seize. GG. My 2 Goyf were 6/7
GAME 3: Seize + Bob + Fulminator + 2 KCommand. GG with the ultimate of Liliana of the Veil.
SIDEBOARD: +4 Fulminator Mage, +1 Maelstrom Pulse, +1 Damnation, +1 KCommand | -1 Liliana the last Hope, -2 Lightning Bolt, -2 Fatal Push, -2 Abrupt Decay
T6: ELDRATRON -- (4-2)
I've found my friend and I decided to give the game to him and split all prizes he managed to win. I'm not interested in the RPTQ qualification, instead of my friend.
He arrived in the final match but he lost =(.
T7: RG VALAKUT 2-1 (5-2)
GAME 1: Discard Spell on his Explore/Farseek and he drew the same....2 times. Primeval Titan GG with Valakut.
GAME 2: Seize + Bob + Fulminator Mage + KCommand + Surgical / Fulminator Mage.
GAME 3: Seize, IoK, Fulminator Mage, Fulminator Mage, Liliana. GG.
SIDEBOARD: +4 Fulminator Mage, +3 Kitchen Finks, +1 Surgical Extraction, +1 Kolaghan's Command | -2 Lightning Bolt, -2 Fatal Push, -2 Abrupt Decay, -1 Liliana the last Hope, -1 Maelstrom Pulse, -1 Terminate
Some considerations:
-Tasigur, the Golden Fang: I know you wrinkled your nose with Bob + Tasigur hahahaha, but Jund needs a big creature now, and I think that Tasigur is the best choice. I don't like Olivia/Huntmaster for their bodies. Right, 6 damages with Bob are very relevant (for now I have never happened in the tournament. Only in test, and I didn't lose).
-23 Lands: the perfect number right now.
-Jund Charm: it is the best flexibility slot which I won't never cut.
-7 discard spells MD: Now there are a lot of spells that they mustn't enter onto the battlefield. I think that it is the best choice.
-4 Raging Ravine: I will never leave home without them. I always want to have them in hand.
A question: I would have a report about Tireless Tracker in Jund. Anyone have tested him?
Finally, what do u think about my list?
I have been following it and many have said it's not worth it against Etron and the general meta. I was asking what their experience is with it against UW control. I'm trying to figure out ways to improve the deck so it's best if you keep negative comments that discourage constructive deck building to yourself
Congrats on the success and great report!
Very interesting decklist. I have been wanting to play tasigurs but I'm afraid of revealing one off of a Bob trigger. I will probably give them a try because they are very strong with all the fatal pushes in the meta.
Many people on this forum have been discouraged with fulminator mages. It seems like they put in work for you this weekend. I have personally had a difficult time against UW control and Grixis control. Is it good in these matchups? How about the Etron matchup?
How did your graveyard hate work out for you? I have seen less surgicals being played and have not seen many decks with rakdos charm and Jund charm. Can you provide some insight into those choices?
I switch between Jund, Abzan and BG Rock depending on the meta and in my experience Tireless Tracker is best in BG rock with 4 ghost quarters and fetchlands. I have found it difficult squeezing tracker into kinds 75 because BG rock already plays maindeck ghost quarters and Jund/Abzan usually play some fulminators for this type of effect. With that said the card is awesome and can run away with games. It's the perfect card to bring in when you know they are going to bring in graveyard hate against you. The card grows into a monster and provides insane card advantage. If you can find room for it I recommend trying 2-3 in the 75 in order to diversify and mitigate the risk of getting hurt by graveyard hate.
Thanks again for your report!
Fulminator Mage: land denial is very strong in my meta with some RG Valakut, Eldrazi, Tron, Control. The choice of the full playset...I want to play it on 3th turn and I want to see in multiple copies as soon as possible. I think or 3 or 4...or none. I know that on the draw isn't the best choice, but with KCommand can do a lot of things.
Jund Charm/Rakdos Charm: In a lot of tests, I've found that removing the graveyard after the trigger of Living End/Dredging is the best choice you can do. I don't like Leyline because of....start or dead card. In addition, in multiple copies is a dead card. Bleah. I prefer Nihil Spellbomb instead. I have chosen JCharm and RCharm for their flexibility.
On the other hand, Surgical Extraction is only for 'combo' and some annoying cards.
In conclusion, the choice of these cards is due only to the fact that they are instants, and therefore play them when I need them most. And very often, if you play at the right time, you win the game, as I did in the tournament.
Long story short: Generally speaking my local metagame is pretty friendly to Jund and I have had great success with it. Jund is no longer the deck you take to a blind metagame however so be sure to scout before the event and have an audible you are confident in playing with just in case because Modern is a wild and crazy format with folks doing pretty much whatever they want.
I am in the middle of testing though, and am unsure whether to bring Fulminators or not. Am also unsure about the amount of GY hate I need. Pretty fixed is my mainboard I think. Any suggestions?
I like the idea of cutting Fulminators. Like with everyone else, they've been unimpressive to me and often too slow in the matchups I wanted them. I am considering trying Magus of the Moon again. I have still liked Anathemancer in my traverse version simply because I am almost always playing the beatdown deck when they are being brought in and they help push through those final points of damage but unlike Fulminator, are still great in the grindier matchups as well.
4x Verdant Catacombs
4x Bloodstained Mire
1x Blooming Marsh
1x Wooded Foothills
1x Blood Crypt
2x Overgrown Tomb
1x Stomping Ground
2x Swamp
1x Forest
3x Raging Ravine
4x Dark Confidant
3x Scavenging Ooze
1x Olivia Voldaren
1x Huntmaster of the Fells
4x Fatal Push
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
2x Thoughtseize
2x Abrupt Decay
2x Lightning Bolt
1x Maelstrom Pulse
1x Kolaghan's Command
3x Terminate
4x Liliana of the Veil
2x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Nihil Spellbomb
2x Collective Brutality
2x Kitchen Finks
2x Ancient Grudge
1x Damnation
1x Grim Lavamancer
1x Liliana, the Last Hope
Round 1 - Grixis Shadow Lost 1-2
Game 1, I had hand disruption into Goyf into Lili, and was able to remove anything he played. It was a quick game.
Game 2, he plucked a Nihil Spellbomb out of my hand turn 1, then had every answer imaginable and got a Lili down sooner. I lost without putting up much of a fight.
Game 3, I got to land a turn 2 Spellbomb, but he killed every threat I had, I didn't draw enough removal, and he beat me down fairly easily.
Round 2 - Affinity Won 2-0
Game 1, I keep a hand that is hell for creature decks, hoping he's on a creature deck. He's on the play, leads on Vault Skirge. I lead on Cliffs and Push, and it only got better for me from there. I got to Maelstrom Pulse 2 Signal Pests, and baited a potentially lethal Blinkmoth Nexus swing plus Overseer activation when I had removal, so I was able to swing for lethal on the crackback. All around good game.
Game 2, I have an opening hand of Cliffs, Catacombs, Push, Bolt, Kolaghan's Command, Ancient Grudge, Goyf. I kept him off mana by killing his creatures for Mox Opal's metalcraft, and even got him to sac a Nexus when he had a big creature out. He never cast a Ravager or Etched Champion the whole match, it was rough.
Round 3 - Esper Control Lost 0-2
Games 1 and 2 were the same. I play something and it either gets countered or removed. I got to do some fun things with baiting Spell Quellers while I had removal up, chaining the spells to kill em all, but I did nothing of note either game. This match convinced me to find room for a Thrun in the sideboard.
Round 4 - Living End Lost 0-2
Game 1, I kept a 2 land, 2 Scavenging Ooze, 2 removal spell mulligan to 6. I got to eat a few things out of his Graveyard with Scooze, but turn 3 Living End when I had no more mana up (I didn't find a third one, or even a second green source) was the game.
Game 2, he plays a Leyline of Sanctity before the game starts. It's not a card I ever considered to see because they have no white mana. My IoK/Thoughtseize/Brutality/Nihil Spellbomb in hand are immediately useless before the game even starts. So now I'm hoping his other 6 cards are garbage because I know Leylines can cause people to keep bad hands. Nope. He has the lands, cyclers, a spirit guide, and the cascade spell to go off. I can do nothing, and I never found my singleton Maelstrom Pulse for the Leyline. This match convinced me to find room for a 2nd Pulse in the 75, and I'm very strongly considering buying 4 Leyline of the Void.
Round 5 - Jund Won 2-0
Game 1, we were both empty handed by maybe turn 5, with nothing but 5 lands and a raging ravine for either player. I got to swing with mine first, so I won. Classic Jund mirror. There was a turn where he attacked and killed a LotV instead of attacking me. I don't know if that would have been the game, because if he did that I would have just minused to kill his creature leaving up the Terminate I used on it for his Ravine instead, but he seemed upset about his decision. In the end, I don't think it changed anything.
Game 2, I got to play my sideboard cards (Finks, Lili Last Hope) and outvalued him. I had the SB Lili Last Hope on 6, he has to fetch/shock to double bolt her. I end up winning through Goyf and Ravine beats.
Round 6 - No show
Some stupid jerkface didn't drop after round 5, so I got to sit there and watch my buddy's boring Merfolk mirror match. I'd have rather napped.
So, 3-3 overall. It didn't feel great, to be honest. I'm gonna keep jamming the deck, making changes here and there, but I'm not exactly in love with the deck's position right now.
I will be playing in Prague too
About the sideboard: I cut my Fulminators completely from the sidebaord, added 1 Golgari Charm and 1 Thundermaw Hellkite. I like the combination of 2x Spellbomb and 2x Surgical, as both of them are far more flexible than Cage or Leyline imo.
Here is my current board:
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
2 Kitchen Finks
1 Thundermaw Hellkite
1 Golgari Charm
2 Collective Brutality
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Collective Brutality
1 Anger of the Gods
1 Damnation
Not yet sold on Golgari Charm, could become a 2nd Maelstrom Pulse for the tournament (currently playing 1 in the mb).
Copycat 2-0
Amulet 1-2
Titanshift 1-2
Seriously considering bringing Shadow of Doubt next week, those were some infuriating losses. I never felt completely helpless against Amulet though. Main deck TMaw did great work but I realize it's greedy.
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki