What really puts Nox over the top are the defensive aspects of being able to interact with the opponents graveyard as well. Since our deck can kill out of the blue, buying another turn can be priceless.
My buddy borrowed my esper deck tonight and went 3-1.
Beat domain zoo 2-0, grixis ds 2-1, and 8 wack 2-1. He lost to esper gifts reanimator 1-2. He doesn't play the deck really so some of his sbing was not ideal.
This is my esper build again as it hasn't been updated in a long time.
Interesting list. You got any more results with it?
This might sound a stupid question, but with Bob have you changed your gameplan? Instead of trying to combo on turn 2 do you play Bob and hope he either eats removal or gives you card advantage.... Or, do you still go with Paladin/SRAM regardless and Bob is a good back up?
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Cheeri0s is the breakfast of championsWRU Everyone loves an angry mobRWG Why so Bloo?RU
Interesting list. You got any more results with it?
This might sound a stupid question, but with Bob have you changed your gameplan? Instead of trying to combo on turn 2 do you play Bob and hope he either eats removal or gives you card advantage.... Or, do you still go with Paladin/SRAM regardless and Bob is a good back up?
If I have bob I almost always cast it first unless opponent is tapped out and there is a decent chance I go off t2. Bob is great at eating removal before I untap while also making it so my opponents have no clue what I'm on. I haven't played more with it no because I'm testing a different deck currently.
I mucked about with this deck online a bunch lately and it's really fun. I've played the standard Gifts Storm and this is a lot more entertaining. Though the thing that's harshing my vibe is that Gifts Storm can win without Baral/Electromancer. It's much more difficult, but possible. When Sram and/or the Paladin go down, it's game over for this deck. Which is definately annoying seeing how much removal is around out there.
It dilutes the 0 theme badly, but I really wonder about the Mask of Avacyn.
The deck, as it was explained to me, did very well at GP's, converting to day 2 at an amazing rate. There, it died horribly, because people had better removal, and could counter Grapeshot.
I'm wondering if we can't shift Cheeri0s off the Grapeshot route. It is harder, but I think it is doable, because Retract works so well.
Replace Grapeshot with Altar of the Brood. With 4 Retract, we have the option to run the table. There's so many ways it can go, Lab Maniac, straight mill with Sphinx's Tutelage, to using Mox Opal and Paradise Mantle to extend to a Paradox Engine to endure we can cast anything, it seems it opens up a lot more options. I'm not worried about a counter, because anything that stops Altar, stops all the other artifacts. Altar is not going to eat a counter T1 or 2, it's viewed as a gimmick card. Yet paired with Paladin and Mentor, it begins doing twice the work. Altar also gets around Leyline of Sanctity
The key then becomes protecting the Sram/Paladin and Mentor. While cards like Alley Evasion and Clutch of Currents and others work admirably to prevent removal, I'm thinking Turn To Mist works best, since we avoid having to burn 2 mana in recasting the card. And we never lose an attack to summoning sickness. My build is a bit of a mess, and I've just sold all my Opals, so my manabase is not adequate (I do expect Opal to be reprinted in the 25th Masters set) but so long as Mantle has a target, we can Retract even just once for a win. I'd also love to give those prowess monks haste, just for flexibility in using them as a wincon. And Soul Warden for all those tokens, and....
I'm thinking this may push past the day 2 doldrums.
The deck, as it was explained to me, did very well at GP's, converting to day 2 at an amazing rate. There, it died horribly, because people had better removal, and could counter Grapeshot.
I'm wondering if we can't shift Cheeri0s off the Grapeshot route. It is harder, but I think it is doable, because Retract works so well.
Replace Grapeshot with Altar of the Brood. With 4 Retract, we have the option to run the table. There's so many ways it can go, Lab Maniac, straight mill with Sphinx's Tutelage, to using Mox Opal and Paradise Mantle to extend to a Paradox Engine to endure we can cast anything, it seems it opens up a lot more options. I'm not worried about a counter, because anything that stops Altar, stops all the other artifacts. Altar is not going to eat a counter T1 or 2, it's viewed as a gimmick card. Yet paired with Paladin and Mentor, it begins doing twice the work. Altar also gets around Leyline of Sanctity
The key then becomes protecting the Sram/Paladin and Mentor. While cards like Alley Evasion and Clutch of Currents and others work admirably to prevent removal, I'm thinking Turn To Mist works best, since we avoid having to burn 2 mana in recasting the card. And we never lose an attack to summoning sickness. My build is a bit of a mess, and I've just sold all my Opals, so my manabase is not adequate (I do expect Opal to be reprinted in the 25th Masters set) but so long as Mantle has a target, we can Retract even just once for a win. I'd also love to give those prowess monks haste, just for flexibility in using them as a wincon. And Soul Warden for all those tokens, and....
I'm thinking this may push past the day 2 doldrums.
Not sure how it'd actually perform, but it sounds pretty sick on paper. I was bummed that the archetype could never really get a foothold in the current meta, but I'll still run my SSG/Rugged Prairie build every now and then at FNM for *****s n gigs when I'm able to execute a T2 win. I think there's a lot of potential with the core concept of the deck, so I totally advocate trying out new win-cons or any tinkering that taps into that potential. If you end up testing it out, I'm definitely interested in updates on how it performs. Cheers, man
Edit: Also, you totally have to capitalize on the fact that Cheerios is a product by 'General Mills' and come up with a killer deck name haha.
I am not convinced by Altar of the Brood, I can see how it can be good tho. I have a similar build, with the mentor plan main to "grind" (often an unanswered mentor gets there in 2 turns). I am still on the mainboard grapeshot cause it is very good in my opinion in killing some incidental hate that destroys us (aka Thalia 1.0, Eidolon, last week I even got rid of Baral!). Furthermore, I don't see the value of milling the opponent, given how many strategies synergies with graveyard (control deck with snapcasters, storm, etc).
Here is my list for reference, admittedly I am not playing much Cheeri0s as of lately but I think the deck has a place, we just miss some cards. Fwiw, I do think that, as more experienced players already pointed out (@Monastery_Dude), we have to play different colors, maybe the esper version with the new Reanimate spell can be good, who knows. The last input I can give you, instead of Turn to Mist you may want to play Apostle's Blessing that is some cases costs only 1 mana. (no sinergy with the altar)
So I've played a list not differing from those in two tournaments.
I've lost to Burn twice despite having 4 Korr Firewalker in the SB (1-2) & (0-2), Jeskai Goodstuffs (0-2), Jund.Removals (1-2) and only won luckily against Grixis Death's Shadow for flooding twice (2-0)
The deck is so fun to play with because its so fast but very fragile.
The problem I keep encountering is when your opponents just try to side in and keep a couple of removals and just try to kill the paladins to keep us from ever combo-ing off. The deck lacks something to make it resilient and more competitive. Also, a huge chunk of the deck are 0 mana equipment that does little or nothing at all. This has to be taken into consideration on what other plans of attack or additional wincon we could think of.
I don't think it will be great, 2UR is a lot and it just let you fire off some paradoxical outcome. I can see it better in a eggish shell with some wheel effect and minamo. That's obv my 2c.
When i was at GP atlanta 2 weeks ago a guy was sitting next to me playing this but he ran 2 leyline of anticipation main board, dropped the Contrabad Kingpin and mainboarded 2 salvage titans... there was a few other differences to, i just wish he posted on here.
Saw this card and wondered whether it was worth considering. After some thought, I think not. It’s too expensive CMC, doesn’t help us combo quicker, doesn’t protect/return our utility pieces, nor does it disrupt our opponent. It’s a no-go for me.
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It’s been awhile since I last played the breakfast of champions, and after t8ing the last iq with affinity, I’m finally going to scratch this itch and unretire this deck.
I know the sb is fairly mainstream, but I usually like to have more of a variety of cards in my board. Being said, just a thought, what are people’s thoughts on a 2-of shapers’ sanctuary in the board, splashing a temple garden explicitly for it? Path/push will likely get us still, but the extra card gets us one step closer to finding an answer(leave/chance or swan song) or a replacement engine. (Sorry for the lack of hyperlinks, my phone apparently can’t link lol)
not needed... your main issue is Chalice. You can win through a Path, generally cause you have silence and swan song in the Sideboard especially for decks that can interrupt your combo
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Beat domain zoo 2-0, grixis ds 2-1, and 8 wack 2-1. He lost to esper gifts reanimator 1-2. He doesn't play the deck really so some of his sbing was not ideal.
This is my esper build again as it hasn't been updated in a long time.
4 Accorder's Shields
4 Bone Saw
4 Cathar's Shield
1 Golem-Skin Gauntlets
4 Mox Opal
4 Paradise Mantle
4 Spidersilk Net
Creature (14)
2 Contraband Kingpin
4 Dark Confidant
4 Puresteel Paladin
4 Sram, Senior Edificer
1 Noxious Revival
4 Retract
Sorcery (1)
1 Grapeshot
Land (15)
1 Arid Mesa
1 Concealed Courtyard
1 Fetid Heath
2 Flooded Strand
2 Godless Shrine
2 Hallowed Fountain
2 Marsh Flats
2 Plains
2 Windswept Heath
1 Echoing Truth
2 Erayo, Soratami Ascendant
2 Fragmentize
3 Herald of Anguish
2 Monastery Mentor
1 Paradoxical Outcome
2 Path to Exile
2 Silence
This might sound a stupid question, but with Bob have you changed your gameplan? Instead of trying to combo on turn 2 do you play Bob and hope he either eats removal or gives you card advantage.... Or, do you still go with Paladin/SRAM regardless and Bob is a good back up?
Everyone loves an angry mob RWG
Why so Bloo? RU
If I have bob I almost always cast it first unless opponent is tapped out and there is a decent chance I go off t2. Bob is great at eating removal before I untap while also making it so my opponents have no clue what I'm on. I haven't played more with it no because I'm testing a different deck currently.
This thread is so dead...
I mucked about with this deck online a bunch lately and it's really fun. I've played the standard Gifts Storm and this is a lot more entertaining. Though the thing that's harshing my vibe is that Gifts Storm can win without Baral/Electromancer. It's much more difficult, but possible. When Sram and/or the Paladin go down, it's game over for this deck. Which is definately annoying seeing how much removal is around out there.
It dilutes the 0 theme badly, but I really wonder about the Mask of Avacyn.
Modern: Storm
Legacy: ANT
The deck, as it was explained to me, did very well at GP's, converting to day 2 at an amazing rate. There, it died horribly, because people had better removal, and could counter Grapeshot.
I'm wondering if we can't shift Cheeri0s off the Grapeshot route. It is harder, but I think it is doable, because Retract works so well.
Replace Grapeshot with Altar of the Brood. With 4 Retract, we have the option to run the table. There's so many ways it can go, Lab Maniac, straight mill with Sphinx's Tutelage, to using Mox Opal and Paradise Mantle to extend to a Paradox Engine to endure we can cast anything, it seems it opens up a lot more options. I'm not worried about a counter, because anything that stops Altar, stops all the other artifacts. Altar is not going to eat a counter T1 or 2, it's viewed as a gimmick card. Yet paired with Paladin and Mentor, it begins doing twice the work. Altar also gets around Leyline of Sanctity
The key then becomes protecting the Sram/Paladin and Mentor. While cards like Alley Evasion and Clutch of Currents and others work admirably to prevent removal, I'm thinking Turn To Mist works best, since we avoid having to burn 2 mana in recasting the card. And we never lose an attack to summoning sickness. My build is a bit of a mess, and I've just sold all my Opals, so my manabase is not adequate (I do expect Opal to be reprinted in the 25th Masters set) but so long as Mantle has a target, we can Retract even just once for a win. I'd also love to give those prowess monks haste, just for flexibility in using them as a wincon. And Soul Warden for all those tokens, and....
I'm thinking this may push past the day 2 doldrums.
Thoughts?
Milling Cheeri0s:
Lands: (15)
4 Flooded Strand
4 Hallowed Fountain
2 Island
2 Plains
3 Windswept Heath
Artifacts: (28)
4 Accorder's Shield
4 Altar of the Brood
4 Bone Saw
4 Cathar's Shield
4 Kite Shield
4 Paradise Mantle
4 Spidersilk Net
Creatures: (11)
4 Puresteel Paladin
3 Monastery Mentor
4 Sram, Senior Edificer
Instants: (6)
3 Retract
3 Turn to Mist
Not sure how it'd actually perform, but it sounds pretty sick on paper. I was bummed that the archetype could never really get a foothold in the current meta, but I'll still run my SSG/Rugged Prairie build every now and then at FNM for *****s n gigs when I'm able to execute a T2 win. I think there's a lot of potential with the core concept of the deck, so I totally advocate trying out new win-cons or any tinkering that taps into that potential. If you end up testing it out, I'm definitely interested in updates on how it performs. Cheers, man
Edit: Also, you totally have to capitalize on the fact that Cheerios is a product by 'General Mills' and come up with a killer deck name haha.
Link to Discord server where anybody from MTGS can keep up with thread topics while everything is being sorted out with the new site.
Here is my list for reference, admittedly I am not playing much Cheeri0s as of lately but I think the deck has a place, we just miss some cards. Fwiw, I do think that, as more experienced players already pointed out (@Monastery_Dude), we have to play different colors, maybe the esper version with the new Reanimate spell can be good, who knows. The last input I can give you, instead of Turn to Mist you may want to play Apostle's Blessing that is some cases costs only 1 mana. (no sinergy with the altar)
2x Cavern of Souls
4x Flooded Strand
2x Hallowed Fountain
1x Island
2x Plains
1x Sacred Foundry
4x Seachrome Coast
1x Noxious Revival
4x Opt
2x Paradoxical Outcome
4x Retract
2x Swan Song
Creature (10)
3x Monastery Mentor
4x Puresteel Paladin
3x Sram, Senior Edificer
4x Accorder's Shield
4x Cathar's Shield
4x Mox Opal
4x Paradise Mantle
4x Spidersilk Net
Sorcery (1)
1x Grapeshot
I am on the opt/swan song package because on turn 1 I can leave one mana open to counter the TS/IoK or cantrip on their end step.
I've lost to Burn twice despite having 4 Korr Firewalker in the SB (1-2) & (0-2), Jeskai Goodstuffs (0-2), Jund.Removals (1-2) and only won luckily against Grixis Death's Shadow for flooding twice (2-0)
The deck is so fun to play with because its so fast but very fragile.
The problem I keep encountering is when your opponents just try to side in and keep a couple of removals and just try to kill the paladins to keep us from ever combo-ing off. The deck lacks something to make it resilient and more competitive. Also, a huge chunk of the deck are 0 mana equipment that does little or nothing at all. This has to be taken into consideration on what other plans of attack or additional wincon we could think of.
I'm digging it; looks similar to the list I last played with. If you're playing SSG, I'd suggest including some number of Rugged Prairie
Link to Discord server where anybody from MTGS can keep up with thread topics while everything is being sorted out with the new site.
What were you thinking of?
Everyone loves an angry mob RWG
Why so Bloo? RU
I know the sb is fairly mainstream, but I usually like to have more of a variety of cards in my board. Being said, just a thought, what are people’s thoughts on a 2-of shapers’ sanctuary in the board, splashing a temple garden explicitly for it? Path/push will likely get us still, but the extra card gets us one step closer to finding an answer(leave/chance or swan song) or a replacement engine. (Sorry for the lack of hyperlinks, my phone apparently can’t link lol)