In exactly 4 weeks I'm going to a big tournament in Hamburg, Germany. This sadly means that I have to settle on a final list in the next one or two weeks, so that I can get all the cards I need in time. I'm planning on running a Jund list with Bloodghasts and Gravecrawler. Do any of you have final recommendations for me before I order the missing pieces? Is Lili worth a shot?
Any update on that list?
Also trying a jund list with bloodghasts right now.
I tested again today and will do a couple of gauntlets against all the relevant decks during the weekend.
What I noticed is that I don't have enough zombies for Gravecrawler anymore. As mentioned before, I've been looking for a replacement, but have not settled on one yet. I'm going to start testing Flameblade Adept. I've also been super happy with the mb interaction because we need to deal with some threats to not get combo'ed out or overrun sometimes. Running black for removal and potent sb options feels great and I encourage everyone to at least try it.
Looks good! I like the MB interaction too, especially collective brutality as it is really a "catch all" card that can help in almost any matchup.
I had a bit of the same problem with my zombies, and tested cryptbreaker as a cheap 1 drop to help with gravecrawler. I'm not impressed. I thought his ability might help, but at two mana its way too slow. Tapping 3 zombies to draw a card is not really what we want to be doing either. rotting rats is something I might try instead. On paper its great because it also help us discard while hitting the opponent too. Then can be unearthed later if needed. Will need to test it, it might be too cute, and the 1/1 body is pretty bad.
Have you tried switching tasigur for gurmag angler? Tasigur has a great ability, but you lose on the zombie subtype. I think it might be more relevant and will improve your consistency in recurring the vines.
Also, is Flamewake Phoenix a good enough recursive threat ?
It might be easier to get back than Prized Amalgam but isn't free and has the same problem of Bloodghast as being unable to block (an occasionally suiciding itself into bigger flyers).
What I noticed is that I don't have enough zombies for Gravecrawler anymore. As mentioned before, I've been looking for a replacement, but have not settled on one yet. I'm going to start testing Flameblade Adept. I've also been super happy with the mb interaction because we need to deal with some threats to not get combo'ed out or overrun sometimes. Running black for removal and potent sb options feels great and I encourage everyone to at least try it.
While I wouldn't run a playset of them, Legion Loyalist seems hilarious as a 1-drop for the deck if you're looking to add more. Adding the Trample and First Strike to the Vengevines is definitely relevant, and making our opponents unable to block with random Lingering Souls tokens just seems like added gravy. Honestly I'd probably run max of 2, but hey, worth a try am I right?
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Second update:
After some more playtesting, I decided to cut the Gravecrawlers as the list doesn't run enough zombies anymore. This also makes Lotleth Troll worse, so I cut one of these as well. LolTroll is still good, imo, because chaining them with a one-drop while also discarding Vines is a common line of play. Additionally, they're simply great in Modern rn and only really 'bad' in white matchups. I like running a couple.
With 4 Crawlers and a single Troll out, I'm now running 2 Legion Loyalists and 3 Flameblade Adepts. The Adepts might be a little too cute, so maybe I'll try out Goblin Guides if I find enough time until the tournament. Adept looks promising, though. 1-4 power on a menacing one-drop should be decent in this deck.
It's weird, part of me feels like cutting all the Gravecrawlers is a mistake. Maybe go from 4 down to 2? The Lotleth Troll + Gravecrawler Vengevine recursion plan just seems too good to completely cut out, especially if you're going to keep in at least 3 of the Trolls.
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With snapcaster mages would claim/fame be a valuable option?
Basically paying 2 for snapcaster and 1 one for claim to cast a 2 drop from the yard triggering vines.
I have to come up with a solid list for starters, with not too many variables (as many 4 offs as possible) and work the rest out via playtesting.
Thought scour is really dependent on how many delve creatures I decide to run, but with claim/fame and snapcaster thought scour gets more valuable.
I am going to try and come up with a list to start with and post it when I am satisfied with it.
Cutting green entirely is definitely an option, but loosing access to cards like abrupt decay, for RiP and other problematic hate cards, as well as maelstrom pulse.
With blue giving us access to stubborn Denial it is very tempting to splash it.
Using Claim // Fame does not count as casting a creature for Vengevine, keep that in mind.
Snapcaster Mage is best in decks that want to be able to make full use of it being able to flash things back at Instant speed. At best, our lists would use it to flash back Lightning Bolt, which just makes Snappy overall an Ambush Viper without Deathtouch. There would be a 0% chance of me ever considering it for the deck, even if I wanted to make blue a main colour (which I definitely don't).
I don't know if I've said this before, but blue as a colour for this deck is a trap. It looks good on paper, but in practice it does't do nearly enough. Take this from someone who went out of his way to get a foil playset of Hedron Crabs back in the day because I thought blue was amazing for this deck.
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I misread claim and thought it was cast from the yard without paying the manacost, that's a bummer.
You would not even consider splashing blue for Denial, to stop things like RiP and other problematic permanents and Spells?
And Baby Jace with the looting ability + a potential planeswalker could be good as well. But I can see him not being as potent with some amount of delve creatures.
Jund is probably still the way to go but I am really tempted to just splash blue for denial.
I'll probably stick to a jund list and try to fit in denial, either main but most likely in the side.
Splashing blue for Stubborn Denial is one of the two reasons I would want blue. The second reason is Izzet Charm. In the sideboard blue could also give you access to Ceremonious Rejection for when you're against E-Tron and Affinity. But other than those 3 cards, I see no reason to run blue.
So then the question becomes, is it worth it to splash just for these 3 cards? It might be, and honestly I want to try it, but the problem is the changes I would need to make to the mana base are a lot more costly than just throwing these cards in. Adding blue would make me want to make sure I had some Steam Vents, as well as Spirebluff Canal. And then I would 100% want a playset of Scalding Tarn to replace the Bloodstained Mires in the list because you'd want to probably have a single basic Island to fetch.
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Splashing blue for Stubborn Denial is one of the two reasons I would want blue. The second reason is Izzet Charm. In the sideboard blue could also give you access to Ceremonious Rejection for when you're against E-Tron and Affinity. But other than those 3 cards, I see no reason to run blue.
So then the question becomes, is it worth it to splash just for these 3 cards? It might be, and honestly I want to try it, but the problem is the changes I would need to make to the mana base are a lot more costly than just throwing these cards in. Adding blue would make me want to make sure I had some Steam Vents, as well as Spirebluff Canal. And then I would 100% want a playset of Scalding Tarn to replace the Bloodstained Mires in the list because you'd want to probably have a single basic Island to fetch.
Hopefully my deck can give some data on whether baby Jace can be added to your list of cards. I would admit however, that I would want one more reason to splash blue to my UBR recipe (other than sideboard options). Perhaps a good looter or aggressive creature. If only Oath of Jace was 2 mana... Or single-symboled Skaab Ruinator.
Mana base, on the other hand, using more fetches may justify the use of Death's Shadow, and consequently Claim // Fame. At worst, more fetches can improve our draws from loot-spells, make delve creatures easier to cast, and make Jace easier to flip. Who knows, maybe Jace will start casting Visions of Beyond from the graveyard (omitting delve creatures of course).
Hi all. I've been away from Magic for a while (3-4 years) and haven't kept up with any new cards really but I've decided to come back.
Before I left I had a great interest in Dredgevine and built a copy of it. I think my deck is probably pretty outdated but I was curious if anyone could take a look and see if there's any glaring issues/good replacements for anything.
Thank you kindly!
Also, my mana base is very wonky. I was working with what I had at the time. Open to suggestions everywhere!
Glad you found your way back here. The meta obviously has completely changed, so I suggest you watch some GP Top8s or just browse through the Modern Forum here on Salvation. If you want to know what this deck currently looks like, read through the couple dozen or so pages of this primer.
I did look up some of the cards being thrown around this thread. Kind of unsure about wanting to keep with a dredge version really. It just doesn't do what I like enough. Probably going to look into a Jund version. What's the significance of this Tasigur, the Golden Fang? Is it just the delve or what?
So first, I'll answer the most obvious question. Where the hell is Cathartic Reunion? While Reunion is a great card, I am replacing it with Gather the Pack for the time being. This is merely a test, as I am honestly not sure which is better for the list. Obviously Reunion looks better because of its interaction with Hollow One, but it also has a lot of situations where it isn't a great card. Conversely, Gather is good or at least decent in every situation Reunion is bad, while also being fair to great where Reunion is good. It doesn't synergize with Hollow One, but instead is a card that synergizes with Vengevine. Being able to grab 2 creatures essentially sets us up to reanimate Vengevine, which is great for us if we are in a grindy game.
Next, I am testing out the Burning-Tree Emissary + Reckless Bushwhacker package in the list. This list is first and foremost an aggressive way to reanimate Vengevine on turn 2, as well as a way t just turn some of our non-Vengevine draws into aggro plays. Imagine a Turn 3 where through Faithless Looting and a Street Wraith we get 1 or 2 free Hollow Ones into play, and then give them +1/+0 and haste with Bushwhacker. Our opponent's will shudder with fear. One other interesting thing this package does, it is lets us actually cast our green spells after casting a Blood Moon because of the mana from Emissary. As with Gather the Pack, these are in as a test, so we'll see how they do.
Finally, I have a question for everyone. I may be able to record and upload some video of MTGO while I am at school, but those videos will not have commentary to them. Would you still be interested in watching? Would you want me to put music or something in the background? Or should I just record it with silence and you can add background noise yourself?
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Finally, I have a question for everyone. I may be able to record and upload some video of MTGO while I am at school, but those videos will not have commentary to them. Would you still be interested in watching? Would you want me to put music or something in the background? Or should I just record it with silence and you can add background noise yourself?
For me what is interesting is really the commentary. I like to understand the reasoning behind each plays, sideboard decisions, etc. Maybe you could record and then add quick commentary here and there before uploading? Just an idea.
I've been crushing in TP on MTGO. And have 3-2 and 4-1 records in the 2 league runs I did with this deck.
Since there's a few differences with mine. I'll talk about some of those selections:
First, I'll address that it's 4 Colors... When I put it together - I thought it might be ambitious to have cards of 4 different colors in the 75. But in 30-40 matches - I've yet to run into issues casting cards (and i've faced some land destruction decks as well as people who stupidly bring in blood moon). I guess part of the reason is only 7 of the 75 require a color other than red.
Second, Champion of Wits. Is basically just a flashed back Faithless Looting with a body and it's own flash back like ability. In one match - I've been able to become immense it as it came into play which will almost never happen again; but when it does - it's nice to draw 8 cards lol
Third, Skaab Ruinator. Is not as light on casting cost as a Delve creature. However, the fact it can be cast from the graveyard (and thus a pitch target), and that it has flying, is what makes me currently value it over a Delve Creature.
Fourth, Flamewake Phoenix. I've seen this suggested here. So I don't think I have to cover it much. With all the 4+ bodies - it's very easy to recur. And I've won more games with 1-3 Flamewake doing the beatdown work than any other card in the deck.
Fifth, Bloodrage Brawler. Another 4+ body to recu the Flamewake that I just pitched to cast it. Or maybe we pitched Vengevine to him and faithless loot and get Hollow one for Free to recur Vengevine. Etc.
Sixth, Greater Gargadon. The good thing about suspend cards is that they are "cast" for free once the last time counter is removed. The bad thing about them is almost none of them become free of their suspend chains until turn 5. Greater Gargadon isn't much different (I don't think I've ever cast him before turn 5). But he has a few interesting interactions with this deck. 1) He allows us to save our creatures from Path/Anger or any removal (just sac them to his ability.) 2) He fills the graveyard with lands/creatures as needed. 3) If we draw more than 1 - the additional copies become easy discard fodder. 4) He interacts great with Flamewake or even Vengevine (if you have enough to recur him).
Seventh, Mogg Fanatic. Taking the place of Guide here. Outside of a Trigger for Vine - Can get rid of x/1's and fill the graveyard with another body if needed.
Eighth, Slaughter Games. I added this to the deck after my 4-1 run. I lost the final match to Ad Nauseam. I also lost one of the 3-2 matches against UR Storm. Slaughter Games is effective in both matchups (probably one of the most effective cards against both decks; especially since it can't be countered).
Just another deck; and a few more ideas to consider. I've been playing pretty much all versions though (including the Griselbrand/Vengeance version.)
I'm really in love with HollowVine decks right now. They're in such a good place in a meta full of removal and discard (both of which lose a lot of their effectiveness against us). And the fact I'm able to win games through graveyard hate isn't bad either. I played a match last night against a Grixis Delver deck. And I could feel the guys rage generating through the computer.... He threw everything he had my way; but absolutely nothing he did worked or mattered.
Quote from Skitzafreak »
Finally, I have a question for everyone. I may be able to record and upload some video of MTGO while I am at school, but those videos will not have commentary to them. Would you still be interested in watching? Would you want me to put music or something in the background? Or should I just record it with silence and you can add background noise yourself?
I don't know what your reasoning for not doing commentary is - but in general - videos without commentary get a lot less views. Even if obvious - people enjoy hearing why you're making moves you are and your thoughts while sideboarding, etc. If going the silent route - I'd go with example videos (of interactions, etc) instead of full matches (exception is if you 5-0 a tournament or something). That might be better to watch for viewers.
I don't know what your reasoning for not doing commentary is - but in general - videos without commentary get a lot less views. Even if obvious - people enjoy hearing why you're making moves you are and your thoughts while sideboarding, etc. If going the silent route - I'd go with example videos (of interactions, etc) instead of full matches (exception is if you 5-0 a tournament or something). That might be better to watch for viewers.
The key part of my quote was "while I am at school". The reason I wouldn't be doing commentary would be because the only real place for me to record would be in either a lunch area or the library. In a lunch area there would be too much background noise, and in the library, I am worried about being too loud
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So I have a "tournament" report from FNM tonight. Before I go on though, let me clear up two things:
1) This is FNM, not something like a GP. So obviously the play level is a bit lower. However....
2) The people who play at this store for FNM at PPTQ and GP grinders, so it makes the play environment somewhere between your average FNM and average GP
With that said, what was the list I played tonight?
That's right, I didn't lose a single game. Yes, I am proud of myself. This is the first time I played this deck off of Magic Online, so getting this good of a performance out of it makes me ecstatic. Anyway, let's go over what I played against tonight:
Round 1 - VS Burn
Round 2 - VS Eldrazi Tron
Round 3 - VS RG Tron
Round 4 - VS Bant Spirits
Top 4 - VS Eldrazi Tron
Top 2 - Prize Split
So you'll notice that I beat 3 Tron decks. Honestly, I feel unless you draw incredibly horribly, Tron is an extremely favorable match up for this deck, especially the Eldrazi variants. The list is fast enough where unless they get their amazing draws going double Temple into TKS on turn 2. On average we are fast enough to put their life total low enough, fast enough, that we should be able to just snatch games out of nowhere.
A notable game for me was my Game 1 VS Bant Spirits, which literally lasted maybe a minute. I was on the draw and had the following sequence happen:
Congrats on the victories and good job on going 10-0! That's insane!
I'm curious how the burning-tree emissaries and reckless bushwhackers did for you, though. Were they a major factor in any games?
Congrats on the victories and good job on going 10-0! That's insane!
I'm curious how the burning-tree emissaries and reckless bushwhackers did for you, though. Were they a major factor in any games?
BTE and Bushwhacker mattered in a few games. My Game 2 against the Bant Spirits deck had me do this on turn 2:
There were also times where just going Emissary into Bushwhacker gave me enough aggression and I didn't even need to recur my Vengevines. Also a fun interaction to note, is if you recur Vengevine off of Bushwhacker, your Vengevines are in play before Bushwhacker resolves and gives the +1/+0 team buff, so your Vines are 5/3's for the turn. Sometimes this extra damage is enough to win you matches.
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Congrats on the victories and good job on going 10-0! That's insane!
I'm curious how the burning-tree emissaries and reckless bushwhackers did for you, though. Were they a major factor in any games?
BTE and Bushwhacker mattered in a few games. My Game 2 against the Bant Spirits deck had me do this on turn 2:
There were also times where just going Emissary into Bushwhacker gave me enough aggression and I didn't even need to recur my Vengevines. Also a fun interaction to note, is if you recur Vengevine off of Bushwhacker, your Vengevines are in play before Bushwhacker resolves and gives the +1/+0 team buff, so your Vines are 5/3's for the turn. Sometimes this extra damage is enough to win you matches.
Another silly question, would not Goblin Bushwhacker work better than Reckless Bushwhacker because it can come down as a 1 CMC card when needed and they're functionally similar? Or is that 2/1 body just enough to make it better?
How well did Gather the Pack perform? How often did you cast it with/without Spell Mastery? Do you think they were important to your gameplan/better than other cycle/discard spells you could be running?
You only played one game against burn, but were you able to reliably trigger Life Goes On? Do you think it performed/should perform better than Feed the Clan?
Another silly question, would not Goblin Bushwhacker work better than Reckless Bushwhacker because it can come down as a 1 CMC card when needed and they're functionally similar? Or is that 2/1 body just enough to make it better?
Answering for him, I'm pretty sure it's because you can't kick it off of Burning-Tree Emissary. Turn 1 Faithless Looting discarding a Vine or 2 into turn 2 Emissary+Reckless is a pretty strong play that isn't possible with the Goblin version.
How well did Gather the Pack perform? How often did you cast it with/without Spell Mastery? Do you think they were important to your gameplan/better than other cycle/discard spells you could be running?
You only played one game against burn, but were you able to reliably trigger Life Goes On? Do you think it performed/should perform better than Feed the Clan?
Another silly question, would not Goblin Bushwhacker work better than Reckless Bushwhacker because it can come down as a 1 CMC card when needed and they're functionally similar? Or is that 2/1 body just enough to make it better?
Answering for him, I'm pretty sure it's because you can't kick it off of Burning-Tree Emissary. Turn 1 Faithless Looting discarding a Vine or 2 into turn 2 Emissary+Reckless is a pretty strong play that isn't possible with the Goblin version.
That would most certainly explain it. I was operating under the assumption earlier that BTE gave R/G and R/G rather than RG. Makes more sense now.
How well did Gather the Pack perform? How often did you cast it with/without Spell Mastery? Do you think they were important to your gameplan/better than other cycle/discard spells you could be running?
Gather the Pack was honestly pretty good. I'd need to play more games with it to be sure how much I like it, but overall it's being doing better work that Cathartic Reunion was, as weird as that sounds.
You only played one game against burn, but were you able to reliably trigger Life Goes On? Do you think it performed/should perform better than Feed the Clan?
The Life Goes Ons in my sideboard were there because I couldn't find any Feed the Clans to use. I checked 5 different card shops in my city and none of them had copies of Feed the Clan. So Life Goes On was my best replacement. Honestly, Feed the Clan is a better card, and when I actually find copies of them, they will be swapped into the list.
Another silly question, would not Goblin Bushwhacker work better than Reckless Bushwhacker because it can come down as a 1 CMC card when needed and they're functionally similar? Or is that 2/1 body just enough to make it better?
Answering for him, I'm pretty sure it's because you can't kick it off of Burning-Tree Emissary. Turn 1 Faithless Looting discarding a Vine or 2 into turn 2 Emissary+Reckless is a pretty strong play that isn't possible with the Goblin version.
Exactly this. You unfortuantely can't kick Goblin Bushwhacker off of Burning-Tree, or else I would 100% be running them instead of Reckless Bushwhacker. Another interesting thing with Burning-Tree Emissary that I found while playing, is having them in your deck lets you cast your green spells even while you have a Blood Moon in play with no Basic Forests.
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Looks good! I like the MB interaction too, especially collective brutality as it is really a "catch all" card that can help in almost any matchup.
I had a bit of the same problem with my zombies, and tested cryptbreaker as a cheap 1 drop to help with gravecrawler. I'm not impressed. I thought his ability might help, but at two mana its way too slow. Tapping 3 zombies to draw a card is not really what we want to be doing either. rotting rats is something I might try instead. On paper its great because it also help us discard while hitting the opponent too. Then can be unearthed later if needed. Will need to test it, it might be too cute, and the 1/1 body is pretty bad.
Have you tried switching tasigur for gurmag angler? Tasigur has a great ability, but you lose on the zombie subtype. I think it might be more relevant and will improve your consistency in recurring the vines.
It is trickier to get back compared to Bloodghast but offers more support for Gravecrawler and is also triggered by Vengevine.
Also, is Flamewake Phoenix a good enough recursive threat ?
It might be easier to get back than Prized Amalgam but isn't free and has the same problem of Bloodghast as being unable to block (an occasionally suiciding itself into bigger flyers).
While I wouldn't run a playset of them, Legion Loyalist seems hilarious as a 1-drop for the deck if you're looking to add more. Adding the Trample and First Strike to the Vengevines is definitely relevant, and making our opponents unable to block with random Lingering Souls tokens just seems like added gravy. Honestly I'd probably run max of 2, but hey, worth a try am I right?
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It's weird, part of me feels like cutting all the Gravecrawlers is a mistake. Maybe go from 4 down to 2? The Lotleth Troll + Gravecrawler Vengevine recursion plan just seems too good to completely cut out, especially if you're going to keep in at least 3 of the Trolls.
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Using Claim // Fame does not count as casting a creature for Vengevine, keep that in mind.
Snapcaster Mage is best in decks that want to be able to make full use of it being able to flash things back at Instant speed. At best, our lists would use it to flash back Lightning Bolt, which just makes Snappy overall an Ambush Viper without Deathtouch. There would be a 0% chance of me ever considering it for the deck, even if I wanted to make blue a main colour (which I definitely don't).
I don't know if I've said this before, but blue as a colour for this deck is a trap. It looks good on paper, but in practice it does't do nearly enough. Take this from someone who went out of his way to get a foil playset of Hedron Crabs back in the day because I thought blue was amazing for this deck.
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UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
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BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
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Splashing blue for Stubborn Denial is one of the two reasons I would want blue. The second reason is Izzet Charm. In the sideboard blue could also give you access to Ceremonious Rejection for when you're against E-Tron and Affinity. But other than those 3 cards, I see no reason to run blue.
So then the question becomes, is it worth it to splash just for these 3 cards? It might be, and honestly I want to try it, but the problem is the changes I would need to make to the mana base are a lot more costly than just throwing these cards in. Adding blue would make me want to make sure I had some Steam Vents, as well as Spirebluff Canal. And then I would 100% want a playset of Scalding Tarn to replace the Bloodstained Mires in the list because you'd want to probably have a single basic Island to fetch.
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
Hopefully my deck can give some data on whether baby Jace can be added to your list of cards. I would admit however, that I would want one more reason to splash blue to my UBR recipe (other than sideboard options). Perhaps a good looter or aggressive creature. If only Oath of Jace was 2 mana... Or single-symboled Skaab Ruinator.
Mana base, on the other hand, using more fetches may justify the use of Death's Shadow, and consequently Claim // Fame. At worst, more fetches can improve our draws from loot-spells, make delve creatures easier to cast, and make Jace easier to flip. Who knows, maybe Jace will start casting Visions of Beyond from the graveyard (omitting delve creatures of course).
Before I left I had a great interest in Dredgevine and built a copy of it. I think my deck is probably pretty outdated but I was curious if anyone could take a look and see if there's any glaring issues/good replacements for anything.
Thank you kindly!
Also, my mana base is very wonky. I was working with what I had at the time. Open to suggestions everywhere!
4 Bloodghast
3 Goblin Bushwhacker
4 Gravecrawler
1 Haakon, Stromgald Scourge
2 Legion Loyalist
4 Lotleth Troll
3 Stinkweed Imp
4 Vengevine
Instants (7)
1 Darkblast
1 Gnaw to the Bone
3 Grisly Salvage
2 Lightning Axe
Sorceries (7)
4 Faithless Looting
2 Life from the Loam
1 Raven's Crime
2 Blackcleave Cliffs
1 Blood Crypt
3 Copperline Gorge
3 Forest
1 Godless Shrine
1 Marsh Flats
4 Overgrown Tomb
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Stomping Ground
2 Swamp
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Woodland Cemetery
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Back to Nature
1 Dismember
2 Golgari Charm
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Lingering Souls
Thanks for the info!
I did look up some of the cards being thrown around this thread. Kind of unsure about wanting to keep with a dredge version really. It just doesn't do what I like enough. Probably going to look into a Jund version. What's the significance of this Tasigur, the Golden Fang? Is it just the delve or what?
4x Bloodstained Mire
4x Wooded Foothills
3x Stomping Ground
2x Copperline Gorge
5x Mountain
Spells - 15
4x Faithless Looting
3x Become Immense
3x Gather the Pack
3x Lightning Bolt
2x Temur Battle Rage
4x Burning-Tree Emissary
4x Goblin Guide
4x Hollow One
4x Insolent Neonate
4x Street Wraith
4x Vengevine
3x Reckless Bushwhacker
3x Leyline of the Void
2x Ancient Grudge
2x Blood Moon
2x Destructive Revelry
2x Grim Lavamancer
2x Life Goes On
2x Lightning Axe
So first, I'll answer the most obvious question. Where the hell is Cathartic Reunion? While Reunion is a great card, I am replacing it with Gather the Pack for the time being. This is merely a test, as I am honestly not sure which is better for the list. Obviously Reunion looks better because of its interaction with Hollow One, but it also has a lot of situations where it isn't a great card. Conversely, Gather is good or at least decent in every situation Reunion is bad, while also being fair to great where Reunion is good. It doesn't synergize with Hollow One, but instead is a card that synergizes with Vengevine. Being able to grab 2 creatures essentially sets us up to reanimate Vengevine, which is great for us if we are in a grindy game.
Next, I am testing out the Burning-Tree Emissary + Reckless Bushwhacker package in the list. This list is first and foremost an aggressive way to reanimate Vengevine on turn 2, as well as a way t just turn some of our non-Vengevine draws into aggro plays. Imagine a Turn 3 where through Faithless Looting and a Street Wraith we get 1 or 2 free Hollow Ones into play, and then give them +1/+0 and haste with Bushwhacker. Our opponent's will shudder with fear. One other interesting thing this package does, it is lets us actually cast our green spells after casting a Blood Moon because of the mana from Emissary. As with Gather the Pack, these are in as a test, so we'll see how they do.
Finally, I have a question for everyone. I may be able to record and upload some video of MTGO while I am at school, but those videos will not have commentary to them. Would you still be interested in watching? Would you want me to put music or something in the background? Or should I just record it with silence and you can add background noise yourself?
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
For me what is interesting is really the commentary. I like to understand the reasoning behind each plays, sideboard decisions, etc. Maybe you could record and then add quick commentary here and there before uploading? Just an idea.
1 Blood Crypt
2 Bloodstained Mire
1 Desolate Lighthouse
1 Island
1 Mountain
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Steam Vents
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
SPELLS
1 Become Immense
3 Cathartic Reunion
4 Faithless Looting
3 Lightning Bolt
1 Temur Battle Rage
2 Bloodrage Brawler
1 Champion of Wits
3 Flamewake Phoenix
4 Greater Gargadon
4 Hollow One
4 Insolent Neonate
3 Mogg Fanatic
1 Skaab Ruinator
4 Street Wraith
4 Vengevine
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Destructive Revelry
2 Feed the Clan
1 Forest
1 Grim Lavamancer
2 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Slaughter Games
1 Stubborn Denial
I've been crushing in TP on MTGO. And have 3-2 and 4-1 records in the 2 league runs I did with this deck.
Since there's a few differences with mine. I'll talk about some of those selections:
First, I'll address that it's 4 Colors... When I put it together - I thought it might be ambitious to have cards of 4 different colors in the 75. But in 30-40 matches - I've yet to run into issues casting cards (and i've faced some land destruction decks as well as people who stupidly bring in blood moon). I guess part of the reason is only 7 of the 75 require a color other than red.
Second, Champion of Wits. Is basically just a flashed back Faithless Looting with a body and it's own flash back like ability. In one match - I've been able to become immense it as it came into play which will almost never happen again; but when it does - it's nice to draw 8 cards lol
Third, Skaab Ruinator. Is not as light on casting cost as a Delve creature. However, the fact it can be cast from the graveyard (and thus a pitch target), and that it has flying, is what makes me currently value it over a Delve Creature.
Fourth, Flamewake Phoenix. I've seen this suggested here. So I don't think I have to cover it much. With all the 4+ bodies - it's very easy to recur. And I've won more games with 1-3 Flamewake doing the beatdown work than any other card in the deck.
Fifth, Bloodrage Brawler. Another 4+ body to recu the Flamewake that I just pitched to cast it. Or maybe we pitched Vengevine to him and faithless loot and get Hollow one for Free to recur Vengevine. Etc.
Sixth, Greater Gargadon. The good thing about suspend cards is that they are "cast" for free once the last time counter is removed. The bad thing about them is almost none of them become free of their suspend chains until turn 5. Greater Gargadon isn't much different (I don't think I've ever cast him before turn 5). But he has a few interesting interactions with this deck. 1) He allows us to save our creatures from Path/Anger or any removal (just sac them to his ability.) 2) He fills the graveyard with lands/creatures as needed. 3) If we draw more than 1 - the additional copies become easy discard fodder. 4) He interacts great with Flamewake or even Vengevine (if you have enough to recur him).
Seventh, Mogg Fanatic. Taking the place of Guide here. Outside of a Trigger for Vine - Can get rid of x/1's and fill the graveyard with another body if needed.
Eighth, Slaughter Games. I added this to the deck after my 4-1 run. I lost the final match to Ad Nauseam. I also lost one of the 3-2 matches against UR Storm. Slaughter Games is effective in both matchups (probably one of the most effective cards against both decks; especially since it can't be countered).
Just another deck; and a few more ideas to consider. I've been playing pretty much all versions though (including the Griselbrand/Vengeance version.)
I'm really in love with HollowVine decks right now. They're in such a good place in a meta full of removal and discard (both of which lose a lot of their effectiveness against us). And the fact I'm able to win games through graveyard hate isn't bad either. I played a match last night against a Grixis Delver deck. And I could feel the guys rage generating through the computer.... He threw everything he had my way; but absolutely nothing he did worked or mattered.
I don't know what your reasoning for not doing commentary is - but in general - videos without commentary get a lot less views. Even if obvious - people enjoy hearing why you're making moves you are and your thoughts while sideboarding, etc. If going the silent route - I'd go with example videos (of interactions, etc) instead of full matches (exception is if you 5-0 a tournament or something). That might be better to watch for viewers.
The key part of my quote was "while I am at school". The reason I wouldn't be doing commentary would be because the only real place for me to record would be in either a lunch area or the library. In a lunch area there would be too much background noise, and in the library, I am worried about being too loud
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
1) This is FNM, not something like a GP. So obviously the play level is a bit lower. However....
2) The people who play at this store for FNM at PPTQ and GP grinders, so it makes the play environment somewhere between your average FNM and average GP
With that said, what was the list I played tonight?
4x Bloodstained Mire
4x Wooded Foothills
3x Stomping Ground
2x Copperline Gorge
5x Mountain
Creatures - 27
4x Burning-Tree Emissary
4x Goblin Guide
4x Hollow One
4x Insolent Neonate
4x Street Wraith
4x Vengevine
3x Reckless Bushwhacker
4x Faithless Looting
3x Become Immense
3x Gather the Pack
3x Lightning Bolt
2x Temur Battle Rage
2x Ancient Grudge
2x Blood Moon
2x Destructive Revelry
2x Grim Lavamancer
2x Life Goes On
2x Lightning Axe
3x Leyline of the Void
Now then, how did I do? Well....
NOT ONLY DID I GO 5-0, I WENT 10-0!!
That's right, I didn't lose a single game. Yes, I am proud of myself. This is the first time I played this deck off of Magic Online, so getting this good of a performance out of it makes me ecstatic. Anyway, let's go over what I played against tonight:
Round 1 - VS Burn
Round 2 - VS Eldrazi Tron
Round 3 - VS RG Tron
Round 4 - VS Bant Spirits
Top 4 - VS Eldrazi Tron
Top 2 - Prize Split
So you'll notice that I beat 3 Tron decks. Honestly, I feel unless you draw incredibly horribly, Tron is an extremely favorable match up for this deck, especially the Eldrazi variants. The list is fast enough where unless they get their amazing draws going double Temple into TKS on turn 2. On average we are fast enough to put their life total low enough, fast enough, that we should be able to just snatch games out of nowhere.
A notable game for me was my Game 1 VS Bant Spirits, which literally lasted maybe a minute. I was on the draw and had the following sequence happen:
Hand: Vengevine, Bloodstained Mire, Goblin Guide, Street Wraith, Hollow One, Faithless Looting, Mountain
Draw: 2nd Hollow One
Play Bloodstained Mire, fetch a Mountain
Cycle Street Wraith, draw a Mountain
Cast Looting, drawing a 2nd Vengevine, and a Temur Battle Rage. Discard 2 Vengevines.
Cast 2 Hollow Ones, reanimating both Vengevines.
Attack for 8.
Opponent concedes.
I am so happy I was able to do that in paper
Feel free to ask me any questions
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
Congrats on the victories and good job on going 10-0! That's insane!
I'm curious how the burning-tree emissaries and reckless bushwhackers did for you, though. Were they a major factor in any games?
BTE and Bushwhacker mattered in a few games. My Game 2 against the Bant Spirits deck had me do this on turn 2:
Cycle 3 Street Wraith, cast 2 Hollow One, Surge Reckless Bushwhacker, attack for 12.
There were also times where just going Emissary into Bushwhacker gave me enough aggression and I didn't even need to recur my Vengevines. Also a fun interaction to note, is if you recur Vengevine off of Bushwhacker, your Vengevines are in play before Bushwhacker resolves and gives the +1/+0 team buff, so your Vines are 5/3's for the turn. Sometimes this extra damage is enough to win you matches.
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
Another silly question, would not Goblin Bushwhacker work better than Reckless Bushwhacker because it can come down as a 1 CMC card when needed and they're functionally similar? Or is that 2/1 body just enough to make it better?
You only played one game against burn, but were you able to reliably trigger Life Goes On? Do you think it performed/should perform better than Feed the Clan?
Answering for him, I'm pretty sure it's because you can't kick it off of Burning-Tree Emissary. Turn 1 Faithless Looting discarding a Vine or 2 into turn 2 Emissary+Reckless is a pretty strong play that isn't possible with the Goblin version.
That would most certainly explain it. I was operating under the assumption earlier that BTE gave R/G and R/G rather than RG. Makes more sense now.
Gather the Pack was honestly pretty good. I'd need to play more games with it to be sure how much I like it, but overall it's being doing better work that Cathartic Reunion was, as weird as that sounds.
The Life Goes Ons in my sideboard were there because I couldn't find any Feed the Clans to use. I checked 5 different card shops in my city and none of them had copies of Feed the Clan. So Life Goes On was my best replacement. Honestly, Feed the Clan is a better card, and when I actually find copies of them, they will be swapped into the list.
Exactly this. You unfortuantely can't kick Goblin Bushwhacker off of Burning-Tree, or else I would 100% be running them instead of Reckless Bushwhacker. Another interesting thing with Burning-Tree Emissary that I found while playing, is having them in your deck lets you cast your green spells even while you have a Blood Moon in play with no Basic Forests.
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros