You guys need to run 4 color for speed. Jund is just too clunky and slow right now. Hedron crab and maindeck stubborn denials might be necessary right now
Is it worth the slots or too cute to put some effort on it?
There was a lot of discussion about this in the old thread. It seems to be very good and puts up good results, especially with birds and troll for evasion/trample. Yes it's viable and no it's not too cute. If you're interested in it go for it. Pizzap used to play it a lot (maybe he still is?) so he could probably give you a good idea of what to do.
Value is good. But Dredgevine isn't supposed to be about value. It's supposed to be about V-8; 2000 pounds of nitro boosted war vegetables. The more velocity, the better.
Modern:
DredgeVine EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima Standard:
Thanks for all the info!
I started this with a kitchen table deck based around Varolz and Death's Shadow combo. While trying to improve it I ended up transforming it into a Dredgevine deck. I'm still assembling the last pieces, I hope to soon be able to post a list here and play the deck in a event!
One thing that I've been testing is a Life from the Loam to help combat the eldrazi decks on the rise. I want to be able to trigger as many bloodghast landfall triggers to keep on the pressure. It also lets me have more lands in play when they start casting ulamogs. Granted this tech wasn't the sole reason for recent success, but it did contribute to my first victory vs the version that runs the eight copies of graveyard hate in the main.
Has anyone else piloted any other tweaks to success?
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Modern decks: BGRDredgevineBGR UWRJeskai ControlUWR
How do you think today's banlist changes affect our position in the meta? IMO twin was a tough matchup to win through before, but tron might get more popular after OGW which is an even worse matchup
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Modern
Dredge (117-70 W/L in games) (Pre-GGT ban: 103-70 W/L in games)
How do you think today's banlist changes affect our position in the meta? IMO twin was a tough matchup to win through before, but tron might get more popular after OGW which is an even worse matchup
Tron lost a good matchup, but got more tools in the new set. I expect it to stick around. I think Twin was an OK matchup. But if Twin players trade into Grixis/UR Midrange, then the meta would be looking better for us.
Does this significantly change anything about our list? For Jund, Lightning Axe gave us a 1-mana answer to Exarch, while also being able to hit Rhinos, Anglers, Goyfs in BGx decks. Still might be worth it, but its targets certainly decreased. What about sideboard? Spellskite is probably still awesome. Rakdos Charm is probably unplayable now (not like it was really playable before). Other thoughts now that we lost 2 big decks in the format?
Now that two of the tougher matchups have been neutered, I expect the only changes to happen in the sideboard. Thoughtseize is definitely a great card vs combo decks such as Scapeshift, Podless Pod, etc. I will be switching out my Twin slots for a more general meta until the new meta is established.
I will update the primer and remove the Twin matchups from the sideboard guide as well as include the new Eldrazi deck. I could use some help with this, so if anyone has any tips, please PM the details on the specific Eldrazi matchups.
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Modern decks: BGRDredgevineBGR UWRJeskai ControlUWR
Now that two of the tougher matchups have been neutered, I expect the only changes to happen in the sideboard. Thoughtseize is definitely a great card vs combo decks such as Scapeshift, Podless Pod, etc. I will be switching out my Twin slots for a more general meta until the new meta is established.
I will update the primer and remove the Twin matchups from the sideboard guide as well as include the new Eldrazi deck. I could use some help with this, so if anyone has any tips, please PM the details on the specific Eldrazi matchups.
Agreed. I assume some sideboard cards that were OK against twin and a few other matchups lose stock as well. Off the top of my head, I can think of Essence Warden, Illness in the Ranks, Curse of Death's Hold, etc. In general, it will be interesting to see what happens to Snapcaster decks. Most Grixis/Delver decks were partially successful because of the fact that they had good Twin matchups. Depends on where the metagame shifts at the Pro Tour, cards like Choke might be less good as well.
Also, with Bloom banned, we can shape up our sideboard slots for other difficult matchups. Maybe some more slots for aggro? Engineered Explosives has worked well for me against Boggles, Elves, Merfolk, Zoo, Tokens (also Lantern) etc. With how good Tron/Eldrazi are shaping up to be, the Loam/Ghost Quarter package might become a requirement. QC wasnt that great against Bloom anyways. Against Bx Eldrazi, we might want to go more heavy on the Delve-aggro strategy and completely forget about Vengevines. 5/5 Anglers matchup well against the Wasteland Stranger, Thought knot Seers, and Blight Herders. Lotleth Troll lines up way better against Eldrazi Scions/Lingering Souls than VV does.
I would want to rely less on Hedron Crab for the near future until we see the new meta. With all the Eldrazi running around, I'm trying to be more aggro and less graveyard reliant.
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Modern decks: BGRDredgevineBGR UWRJeskai ControlUWR
Thought I'd post here one more time and get input before I finalize my list for an unknown meta at SCG Regionals. By the way, who else will be at Regionals with Dredgevine?
Since the last time I posted this, I added the Varolz, the Scar-Striped and Death's Shadow combo. I was looking for something to make my deck faster against Burn and Zoo and I think this is what I need. The sideboard is untested, but the rest of the combo is for Burn, Tron, and Zoo, the Bloodghasts, Thoughtseizes, and the Murderous Cuts come in for the combo during grindier matchups. Radiant Flames are for the swarmier matchups (Small zoo and Company decks especially, and everything else is explainable.
Why is no one playing Vexing Devils in the Varolz list? I mean, I get that Death's Shadow is also good, but the devils also gives you some conditional reach. Any thoughts?
What is the consensus about Fauna Shaman as a dredge enabler?
Fauna Shaman was too slow before the ban update. Now it's even slower. We don't use Grove because we want black mana, so Stomping Ground is the only card that gets used as a 1-of semi-regularly. The reanimator deck is not what we do. You should be trying for alternative versions of gifts ungiven perhaps.
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Modern decks: BGRDredgevineBGR UWRJeskai ControlUWR
What is the consensus about Fauna Shaman as a dredge enabler?
I feel like you can't really compare the decks. Grove of the burnwillows would be horrible in my version, and I probably play a more heavy amount of G/R lands than most people. The extra life is tough to beat back. That version is really just graveyard combo, not so much dredgevine. You could try crossing the two, craterhoof with all our 2/1 beaters could be fun. But I really think out of stomping ground, copperline gorge, and grove, grove is by far the worst.
Value is good. But Dredgevine isn't supposed to be about value. It's supposed to be about V-8; 2000 pounds of nitro boosted war vegetables. The more velocity, the better.
Modern:
DredgeVine EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima Standard:
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BGRDredgevineBGR
UWRJeskai ControlUWR
Pauper:
GMono-Green AggroG
MTGO Username: creamy99
Twitch Stream: www.twitch.tv/coachcreamy
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/Cherokee3210
Check it out for the latest testing, gameplay, and dailies!
My decks:
Modern
B[url=http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/developing-competitive/220250-dredgevine?page=89#c2235]Dredgevine[/url]G
Amulet Bloom
Is it worth the slots or too cute to put some effort on it?
Commander: WUBRG Superfriends, GW Rhys Tokens, WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon
Kitchen Table (now that's real Magic): WUBRG Domain, GU Biovisionary, UB Korlash Grandeur, UW Merfolk Mill
There was a lot of discussion about this in the old thread. It seems to be very good and puts up good results, especially with birds and troll for evasion/trample. Yes it's viable and no it's not too cute. If you're interested in it go for it. Pizzap used to play it a lot (maybe he still is?) so he could probably give you a good idea of what to do.
Modern:
DredgeVine
EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima
Standard:
I started this with a kitchen table deck based around Varolz and Death's Shadow combo. While trying to improve it I ended up transforming it into a Dredgevine deck. I'm still assembling the last pieces, I hope to soon be able to post a list here and play the deck in a event!
Commander: WUBRG Superfriends, GW Rhys Tokens, WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon
Kitchen Table (now that's real Magic): WUBRG Domain, GU Biovisionary, UB Korlash Grandeur, UW Merfolk Mill
Has anyone else piloted any other tweaks to success?
BGRDredgevineBGR
UWRJeskai ControlUWR
Pauper:
GMono-Green AggroG
MTGO Username: creamy99
Twitch Stream: www.twitch.tv/coachcreamy
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/Cherokee3210
Check it out for the latest testing, gameplay, and dailies!
Dredge (117-70 W/L in games) (Pre-GGT ban: 103-70 W/L in games)
Tron lost a good matchup, but got more tools in the new set. I expect it to stick around. I think Twin was an OK matchup. But if Twin players trade into Grixis/UR Midrange, then the meta would be looking better for us.
Does this significantly change anything about our list? For Jund, Lightning Axe gave us a 1-mana answer to Exarch, while also being able to hit Rhinos, Anglers, Goyfs in BGx decks. Still might be worth it, but its targets certainly decreased. What about sideboard? Spellskite is probably still awesome. Rakdos Charm is probably unplayable now (not like it was really playable before). Other thoughts now that we lost 2 big decks in the format?
I will update the primer and remove the Twin matchups from the sideboard guide as well as include the new Eldrazi deck. I could use some help with this, so if anyone has any tips, please PM the details on the specific Eldrazi matchups.
BGRDredgevineBGR
UWRJeskai ControlUWR
Pauper:
GMono-Green AggroG
MTGO Username: creamy99
Twitch Stream: www.twitch.tv/coachcreamy
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/Cherokee3210
Check it out for the latest testing, gameplay, and dailies!
Agreed. I assume some sideboard cards that were OK against twin and a few other matchups lose stock as well. Off the top of my head, I can think of Essence Warden, Illness in the Ranks, Curse of Death's Hold, etc. In general, it will be interesting to see what happens to Snapcaster decks. Most Grixis/Delver decks were partially successful because of the fact that they had good Twin matchups. Depends on where the metagame shifts at the Pro Tour, cards like Choke might be less good as well.
Also, with Bloom banned, we can shape up our sideboard slots for other difficult matchups. Maybe some more slots for aggro? Engineered Explosives has worked well for me against Boggles, Elves, Merfolk, Zoo, Tokens (also Lantern) etc. With how good Tron/Eldrazi are shaping up to be, the Loam/Ghost Quarter package might become a requirement. QC wasnt that great against Bloom anyways. Against Bx Eldrazi, we might want to go more heavy on the Delve-aggro strategy and completely forget about Vengevines. 5/5 Anglers matchup well against the Wasteland Stranger, Thought knot Seers, and Blight Herders. Lotleth Troll lines up way better against Eldrazi Scions/Lingering Souls than VV does.
Removed: Splinter Twin, Grixis Twin
Added: BW Eldrazi, Bx Eldrazi, UWx Midrange, Mono Green Devotion, Ad Nauseum
Note: Amulet Bloom remains until future notice
BGRDredgevineBGR
UWRJeskai ControlUWR
Pauper:
GMono-Green AggroG
MTGO Username: creamy99
Twitch Stream: www.twitch.tv/coachcreamy
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/Cherokee3210
Check it out for the latest testing, gameplay, and dailies!
BGRDredgevineBGR
UWRJeskai ControlUWR
Pauper:
GMono-Green AggroG
MTGO Username: creamy99
Twitch Stream: www.twitch.tv/coachcreamy
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/Cherokee3210
Check it out for the latest testing, gameplay, and dailies!
Since the last time I posted this, I added the Varolz, the Scar-Striped and Death's Shadow combo. I was looking for something to make my deck faster against Burn and Zoo and I think this is what I need. The sideboard is untested, but the rest of the combo is for Burn, Tron, and Zoo, the Bloodghasts, Thoughtseizes, and the Murderous Cuts come in for the combo during grindier matchups. Radiant Flames are for the swarmier matchups (Small zoo and Company decks especially, and everything else is explainable.
4 Faithless Looting
4 Gravecrawler
3 Grisly Salvage
3 Gurmag Angler
4 Lotleth Troll
4 Vengevine
Combo
3 Death's Shadow
2 Varolz, the Scar-Striped
Control
4 Abrupt Decay
1 Darkblast
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Liliana of the Veil
2 Murderous Cut
1 Blood Crypt
2 Bloodstained Mire
2 Forest
3 Overgrown Tomb
4 Swamp
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Wooded Foothills
3 Woodland Cemetery
2 Bloodghast
1 Death's Shadow
2 Fulminator Mage
3 Gnaw to the Bone
1 Murderous Cut
2 Radiant Flames
2 Thoughtseize
2 Varolz, the Scar-Striped
My decks:
Modern
B[url=http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/developing-competitive/220250-dredgevine?page=89#c2235]Dredgevine[/url]G
Amulet Bloom
Why is no one playing Vexing Devils in the Varolz list? I mean, I get that Death's Shadow is also good, but the devils also gives you some conditional reach. Any thoughts?
BGRDredgevineBGR
UWRJeskai ControlUWR
Pauper:
GMono-Green AggroG
MTGO Username: creamy99
Twitch Stream: www.twitch.tv/coachcreamy
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/Cherokee3210
Check it out for the latest testing, gameplay, and dailies!
4C Reanimator
What i'm really impressed by is Llanowar Mentor and Greenseeker.
Does Copperline Gorge replace Grove of the Burnwillows in an OK'ish way?
What is the consensus about Fauna Shaman as a dredge enabler?
Green @ it's best
BGRDredgevineBGR
UWRJeskai ControlUWR
Pauper:
GMono-Green AggroG
MTGO Username: creamy99
Twitch Stream: www.twitch.tv/coachcreamy
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/Cherokee3210
Check it out for the latest testing, gameplay, and dailies!
I feel like you can't really compare the decks. Grove of the burnwillows would be horrible in my version, and I probably play a more heavy amount of G/R lands than most people. The extra life is tough to beat back. That version is really just graveyard combo, not so much dredgevine. You could try crossing the two, craterhoof with all our 2/1 beaters could be fun. But I really think out of stomping ground, copperline gorge, and grove, grove is by far the worst.
Modern:
DredgeVine
EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima
Standard: