MTG Salvation

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Congrats on the 5-0 and thank you for the report. I agree that this kind of list is the most competitive and am glad to see it put up some nice results. This is most likely the list I'll be bringing to a big tournament this autumn.

Recently, I have moved the Loams to the side to only bring them in in attrition matchups. That way, I can focus on outracing them g1, which we do better than most decks, anyways. We also have to win g1 or the deck's in a really tough spot, since gravehate is still an issue, albeit less so than for other graveyard-based strategies. What are your thoughts on that?

You're not running Haunted Dead, has that been an issue? Do you think you would have liked a one-of Honored Hydra in any of the matches? What about Insult // Injury?[/quote]

Quote from Killer_Manfred »

Quote from Mykhoncho »

Went 5-0 @ a fairly competitive FNM last with this bad boy:

[...]

I believe this is the best variation of Dredgevine for now. I think it may be as powerful as the T1 dredge, but nobody plays this version. It's so consistent and synergistic and I don't think it folds that bad to gy hate. Conflag + loam were the allstars this evening and it is what gives the deck the reach/removal it desperately needed. I'd love to hear any feedback. Thanks in advance.

Congrats on the 5-0 and thank you for the report. I agree that this kind of list is the most competitive and am glad to see it put up some nice results. This is most likely the list I'll be bringing to a big tournament this autumn.

Recently, I have moved the Loams to the side to only bring them in in attrition matchups. That way, I can focus on outracing them g1, which we do better than most decks, anyways. We also have to win g1 or the deck's in a really tough spot, since gravehate is still an issue, albeit less so than for other graveyard-based strategies. What are your thoughts on that?

You're not running Haunted Dead, has that been an issue? Do you think you would have liked a one-of Honored Hydra in any of the matches? What about Insult // Injury?

Thank you!
As far as Loam on the side, I'd disagree.
If you take Loam out, you may as well not run conflag. It would take too long to bank enough extra cards to discard for the flashback cost. I did run Haunted Dead instead of the 4th thug, but decided to switch it back because thug is one of the most common ways I used to animate vengevine. I suppose you could cut the 2nd loam for it, but then again, you'd be running 1 less dredger. I'll test it and see how it works.

As far as the hydra goes, I haven't tested it, but it seems super cool. Maybe too slow though. And gets hit by push, no? And it doesn't trigger vv. =(

Insult // Injury
Hm, that card seems cool, but I don't know if in this style of deck. Most of the time, you will cast it from the gy and that cast is kind of meh. I think conflag is much better.

I am looking at the sideboard and may replace the abrupt decay for Vengeful Pharaoh

Quote from Killer_Manfred »

Btw, I was wondering about your high dredge count. Since the deck's so packed with staples, I always find it hard to accommodate more than 6 or 7 dredgers in my list. The consensus has been somewhere around 6 to 8 so far. What's your thought on that?

Stinkweed imp is our highest dredge count, so it's a 4 of.
Golgari thug is not only a dredger, but helps recur VV, so 4 of.
Loam is for conflag as stated before, so there's the 2. I might bring it down to one to try the haunted dead out.
Does anyone have any sideboard guidelines they would like to compare?

Have any of you guys considered going 3 Vengevine in the main? Sometimes drawing too many vengevines can get a bit clunky.

I actually think 3 vengevines is not a bad idea since as a free payoff card it has the hardest trigger requirements between the likes of bloodghasts and amalgams.

I agree that cutting vines is not the best decision. Maybe side them out if you know your opponent is going to target them but in my experience it just closes the game on the spot too often. Most of the time there is no opportunity cost to recur it and it can force your opponent to fold on the spot when you hit multiples. It also can act as a blocker if you're in a desperate situation. There is just too much upside to take it out in my opinion. Like @killer_manfred said when you start cutting vines you are heading the direction of traditional dredge, I feel like it's a 4 or 0 card. However I think if you are interested in trying 3 go for it, trying new stuff never hurts and you could see something we are missing.

This deck hss been a blast to play. I also prefer it over traditional dredge. How has Haunted Dead been testing for you guys?

4x Abrupt Decay
4x Birds of Paradise
3x Blood Crypt
4x Death's Shadow
4x Faithless Looting
3x Forest
2x Golgari Brownscale
4x Gravecrawler
3x Grisly Salvage
2x Life from the Loam
4x Lotleth Troll
1x Mountain
4x Overgrown Tomb
4x Stomping Ground
3x Swamp
3x Varolz, the Scar-Striped
4x Vengevine
4x Vexing Devil


This is my current list ive been running for about a year. It works really well it has just enough dredge for your GY option if you are getting burned than you can switch to the death shadow, varolz option.

Yes I am i posted my list here just a few minutes ago.

Check it out its pretty good and can be very explosive.

Hi Vengevine Fans,

what do you think about this new card? Driven // Despair

Quote from Killer_Manfred »

Oh, boy:

http://www.mtgsalvation.com/cards/hour-of-devastation/29018-leave-chance

A lot of the cards lately have felt either too weak or win-more. This card is absolutely great in decks that can utilize their graveyard, let alone our deck which plays the graveyard. On it's own it is extremely powerful but with something like Loam it can go nuts. I also wouldn't be opposed to bumping my land count up if it is needed to consistently play it.

what do you think about this list that appeared at cfb?

https://www.channelfireball.com/articles/hollow-one-might-be-hour-of-devastations-most-broken-card/

the fifth looting its suposed to be a fatal push

personaly i prefer lotleth troll instead of street wraith

Well hello ladies & gentlemen. I have returned. After taking a year or so break away from the War Vegetables to play Lantern Control (it's a different kind of fun, but still fun I swear!) I am making my way back to good ol' Dredgevine. Why you may ask? Well let's just say that seeing Hollow One lit a fire in my belly and I can't help but imagine the magical Christmas-land scenarios good ol' Hollow One has with my long lost friend Vengevine

Here's the list I've come up with, I'm wondering what everyone thinks:



Obviously this is a very rough sketch. I know the number of Drdgers is painfulyl low (only 2 Stickweed Imp) But honestly this list leans more on just drawing a crap ton of cards via Faithless Looting, Cathartic Reunion and through having Hollow One and Street Wraith for Cycling. Hell just getting 1 Lotleth Troll with a single Stinkweed can result in a LOT of Dredging if you have 2 of any combination of those cards mentioned above. Dredge on draw step, dredge via looting, dredge via cycle, that's 15 cards in one turn. Not to mention how your Hollow Ones cost 0 at that point making it easy to recur any Vengevines you may have hit.

Obviously the numbers need some tweaking, but I like to look of the idea of the deck. Honestly with so much card draw I may be able to go down to 17 land to fit in a 3rd Imp.

That's definitely an interesting idea. Personally I see Hollow One as a great card specifically for Dredgevine since to make the deck work we want to be discarding a bunch of cards and such do get creatures like Vengevine and Bloodghast in the graveyard. Since Hollow One becomes free to cast very easily in Dredgevine, it can increase the consistency of the deck as an aggressive Dredge Variant.

For example before I knew I was averaging 14+ power with Dredgevine when I was playing it about a year and a half ago (or however long ago it was before Kaladesh released) on turn 4. Games where I was able to amass that kind of damage before turn 4 were rare because sometimes it was hard to get out 2 creatures while making sure you had enough things coming back from the yard (keep in mind I never got to play with Cathartic Reunion).

Hollow One does take the deck in a different direction, but it doesn't pull it too far off base. You still want to be running the Lotleth Troll + Gravecrawler package to recur your War Cabbage. Along with this you're still going to run all the thing that make your a graveyard aggro deck, Prized Amalgam, Bloodghast, and Stinkweed Imp. And you still have the great red card draw spells that make Dredge insane as all hell, Faithless Looting, and Cathartic Reunion. The change happens with how instead of a lot of Dredgers you run Hollow One and Street Wraith. Wraith let's you get that last mana off of your Hollow One's mana cost if you've played a Looting or Reunion, and it's also great if you have a Dredger like Imp in your yard.

Obviously testing will be required, but I don't think it is it's own archetype or that it needs a separate archetype or anything. I just wish Hollow One was a Zombie Golem

ive been playing with this list

4 looting
4 neonate
4 lightning axe
4 haunted dead
4 lotleth troll
4 hollow one
4 gravecrawler
4 bloodghast
4 amalgam
4 vengevine

4 bloodstained mire
4 wooded foothills
1 arid mesa
2 mountain
1 swamp
2 stomping ground
1 verdant catacombs
1 blood crypt
4 blackcleave cliffs

side
2 thoughtsize
2 abrupt decay
2 collective brutality
2 darkblast
2 ancient grudge
1 golgari brownscale
1 gnaw to the bone
3 molten rain

made a couple of 3-2s and 4-1s, the main feels veeery explosive, but still needs changes, without dredge cards neonates are quite poor

things i noticed
-discard one effects are a bit lacking, i want to be discarding 2 cards at least, lightning axe gets the pass
-i want 3 mana turn 2 to play looting into multiple creatures to reanimate vengevine
-hollow one its great in combination with looting/troll, its 1 mana 4/4

I think I may put the deck together on MTGO and do some play testing. Hell I might even record some games and throw them up on YouTube, who knows. It all depends on what my free time is like (I work 2 jobs, up to like 70ish hours a week, I don't get much time for Magic at the moment :P) as the deck isn't too expensive, my list is only like 150 tix. Though I still need to think up and throw together a sideboard.

Okay question. What are good sideboard cards people are running these days? I feel like I should start my sideboard with some Thoughtseizes and Leyline of the Voids. Maybe a Gnaw to the Bone or two. But I am unsure of what else people are running these days

Eldrazi Tron is the most prevalent Tron variant these days. And honestly, I have been doing a lot of research on the deck since I want to build it in paper. One way to fight the deck would be running something like Blood Moon. With my list being extremely Dredge-lite I probably have a few more options for some sideboard cards that normally you wouldn't want to run in case they get milled.

Against Death's Shadow our mainboard is pretty resilient. We have a lot of recursive threats so their disruption shouldn't do too much. I'd want to bring in Leyline of the Void against them since that turns their Tasigurs and Gurmag Anglers into way too expensive threats, as well as turning off Snapcaster Mage.

Again Eldrazi Tron I'm thinking Gnaw to the Bone to help survive aggro alongisde Vengeful Pharaoh as a way to remove their threats. Bloodghast and Vengevine having haste give the decks already good ways to deal with Planeswalkers.

Ancient Grudge for Affinity and other artifact decks

I can't think of much else at the moment.

Alright so this is what I have come up with for the sideboard:



Thoughts?

I ninja-editted before you posted lol. I removed the SPellbomb for a Maelstrom Pulse basically because I thought of exactly what you mentioned, why do I need it when I have Leylines? And plus is a way for me to fight against opposing Leylines, which is realized previously I had no way to do.

Just played my first Modern League with the deck. Went 3-2 overall, and one of those losses was 100% due to a HUGE play mistake on my part.

I did have one game though where I had the following turn 1:

Cycle Street Wraith
Play Blackcleave Cliffs, cast Faithless Looting.
Discard Vengevine and Bloodghast
Cast 2 Hollow One for 0, recur Vengevine, attack for 4
End turn with 12 Power in play.