So Devoted Druid + Vizier of Remedies makes infinite mana. Some smart people have already come up with deck ideas involving that combo with CoCo, Trinket Mage and Walking Ballista.
Is there any way we can work that into our deck? We would need some way to take advantage of infinite mana. Thoughts?
I seem to be a bit late to the conversation, but I think you folks may be underestimating the new Nissa a bit. Treating her as a 3 cmc spell, she plays nicely as part of a curve. Cast for 1, activate the +2 setting up your next turn, then she's sitting pretty at 3 loyalty for her 0. In a deck with 4 coco, 4 path, 2 retreat, and 1 Nissa that leaves space for 27 creatures and 22 lands. Knightfall doesn't normally play 4 cost creatures so we can safely assume her 0 hits off of all the creatures. This tells us that 49/60 or 81% of the deck are hits for her ability. If you're only interested in creatures, she hits the same % of cards as coco (though is admittedly much worse at finding specific cards), and can keep doing it. Treating her as a 4 drop lets her do the same thing while being bolt resistant, treating her as a 5 drop lets her 0 right away, treating her as a 6 drop does the same thing but she's bolt resistant, and casting her for 8 lets us hit for 10 immediately. Most of those modes aren't likely to matter, but I think the fact that they exist is valuable. regardless having her 0 essentially read "put the top card of your library into play" looks pretty strong to me. She can also just stick around and try yo plus to dig for whatever you need each turn, which is actually pretty crazy as well.
I agree, she's worth a test. For me I get uncomfortable with 27 creatures so i'd likely be cutting a path or go down to one coralhelm to run her. I'm certainly going to heavily test with her as she seems made for this kind of deck.
3 Guys including myself showed up to a 37 man GPT. 2 of us top 8'd, but we both lose in quarters unfortunately. Deck was great. Lost my quarters matchup to burn as a result of horrendous flooding sadly
How are you guys all feeling on gideon? I played against a gauntlet of decks yesterday and the one i couldn't break through was eldra tron, basically couldn't get the damage through before all is dust, karn or ugin showed up and some of the guys were suggesting gideon to add more muscle and a clock. (I actually had to restart a game with a karn ultimate giving them two lands to start- they preceded to temple into a TKS on turn one. Yay!)
Tron is just a crap match up. We are a mid range/ control deck, they eat our gameplan for breakfast. Are you playing gaddock teeg in the side? Him + another GQ are the best sideboard hate we have against them.
He's not that good against Eldrazi Tron as compared to regular G/X Tron. They have between 5-8 non creature 'pay off' cards depending on whether player likes main deck chalice, and the pay off cards are not that essential to their game plan vs Bant.
Teeg shutting off your own CoCo is worse for you than shutting off their karn, AiD, Batterskull when their creatures are mostly better than yours card for card unless you manage to get multiple big knights on the board.
Guys please opinions on japanese cards. Lost a 3/3 creature against Japan celestial colonade. This guy played all creatures and spells in english cards, but some cards in his manabase was japanese. I dont registrated this really ( my brain say its all fine and all english to me lets attack his empty board)...and i am sure it is a Kind of legal cheating. It is not ok, but i know legal. I Hate such people. I never forget colonade normally, but with this Tricks it can happen one time in 3 years and such people take advantage of this
If I am a customer spending premium amount of dollars, I expect a premium service. Jund falls into the category of a premium deck costing more dollars than a majority of the rest of the format. I'm not getting the desired performance ratio per dollars spent out of the Jund deck because WOTC decided to make the format more diverse.
As to Krallenhorde Howler, it's good but I can't imagine it fitting this deck. Frequently enough, I would imagine it to be slightly awkward. I say this because a little less than half the creatures we play wouldn't benefit from his effect (IE Voice of Resurgence). Even then though, imagine having a Birds of Paradise, a Forest, a Gavony Township, and Krallenhorde Howler out. In that example, you could cast Knight of the Reliquary for one less mana, but you still couldn't cast anything else. Our manabase and creatures simply aren't designed to support him.
Good to see that list. Super interesting with the 3 trackers, but i kind of like it because i makes our deck have more of a clock. Courser also feels very defensive to me, but it is still a very nice card and Eli Kassis my inspiration to get into this played the full playlet in his list. Just goes to show it's very much up to personal preference how you want to structure your attack.
I have a question, I noticed most of SB's play a split of counters (2 Negate and 2 Unified Will.
Why we don't just play 3 or 4 Unified Will? Aren't we already losing if we have less creatures than the opponent?
Aren't counters brought in only against combo, big mana and control?
For instance, against Tron sometimes they drop a big creature instead of a planeswalker, or against titanshift we need to counter the green Titan...
Hypothetically, yes. However, it's not that simple. There are matchups where you have the chance at having an even number of creatures (Burn) when you need to counter stuff. For example, I played against Tron and I had to flash in a Spell Queller (for no value) in order to counter Ugin, the Spirit Dragon because he had two Wurmcoil Engine tokens out.
Additionally, sometimes you don't have a mana-dork and need to counter something on turn 2. For example, I beat Tron in game 3 of the last round on Friday. However, I only won because I topdecked a Negate. I had a Unified Will in my hand, but as I didn't have a dork and he had a turn 3 Karn Liberated, he would have won if I didn't have that Negate. Instead, I combo killed him on turn 4.
@silverironman
What do you think of running Disdainful Stroke instead of 1 (or even both) Negate? The CMC requirement covers everything Queller doesn't, and hits all card types. The only things it doesn't stop are counterspells and burn.
Kelvin Chew's 5-0 list from yesterday. He'd posted the other day that he was 34-6 (85% WR) in matches over the last few days with a few updates. Most notable changes are the full 8x Dorks & 3x Unified Wills from the board.
Is there any way we can work that into our deck? We would need some way to take advantage of infinite mana. Thoughts?
GWU Knightfall Spirit Company GWU
GWB Abzan Evolution GWB
Also, don't side out the combo.
Tron: can't play their pay off cards
Abzan company: without company's and chord it's hard for them to combo off. Without the combo their cards are just bears.
Eggs: shuts off faith's reward, whir of invention, and banefire
Control: shuts off all the sweepers (besides anger) and makes it so they cant cryptic. (or sphinx's rev, which is rare)
Ad nauseum: can't ad nauseum
Thats off the top of my head
Teeg shutting off your own CoCo is worse for you than shutting off their karn, AiD, Batterskull when their creatures are mostly better than yours card for card unless you manage to get multiple big knights on the board.
Here is the top 8
As to Krallenhorde Howler, it's good but I can't imagine it fitting this deck. Frequently enough, I would imagine it to be slightly awkward. I say this because a little less than half the creatures we play wouldn't benefit from his effect (IE Voice of Resurgence). Even then though, imagine having a Birds of Paradise, a Forest, a Gavony Township, and Krallenhorde Howler out. In that example, you could cast Knight of the Reliquary for one less mana, but you still couldn't cast anything else. Our manabase and creatures simply aren't designed to support him.
Additionally, sometimes you don't have a mana-dork and need to counter something on turn 2. For example, I beat Tron in game 3 of the last round on Friday. However, I only won because I topdecked a Negate. I had a Unified Will in my hand, but as I didn't have a dork and he had a turn 3 Karn Liberated, he would have won if I didn't have that Negate. Instead, I combo killed him on turn 4.
Frequently enough, Unified Will is a worse version of Negate.
What do you think of running Disdainful Stroke instead of 1 (or even both) Negate? The CMC requirement covers everything Queller doesn't, and hits all card types. The only things it doesn't stop are counterspells and burn.
4 Birds of Paradise
2 Courser of Kruphix
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Noble Hierarch
2 Qasali Pridemage
3 Scavenging Ooze
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Spell Queller
1 Tireless Tracker
3 Voice of Resurgence
Instant (8)
4 Collected Company
4 Path to Exile
Enchantment (2)
2 Retreat to Coralhelm
1 Botanical Sanctum
1 Breeding Pool
1 Flooded Strand
3 Forest
1 Gavony Township
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Kessig Wolf Run
4 Misty Rainforest
1 Plains
1 Stomping Ground
1 Temple Garden
4 Windswept Heath
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Eldritch Evolution
1 Izzet Staticaster
2 Kitchen Finks
2 Negate
3 Reflector Mage
3 Unified Will
1 Vendilion Clique