I think the archetype's still got the power level as well as a decent metagame to spike a tournament. As for blue, I'm skeptical still because of the painful mana base and the inability to play Blood Moons, which are 1-hit KOs vs. a lot of decks. I doubt it's going to be worth it, although I'm going to be testing Search for Azcanta and Chart a Course.
I agree with this. Although I have played all versions at some time, I have always come back to the BR version. I think it would literally take an unbanning of Preordain to push me to Blue, even if it is a color that I like so much.
I have also been wanting to go back and try Grishoalbrand, but have been 3-1, 3-0-1, and 4-0ing my FNMs recently with Humans and Knightfall. It's hard to come off decks when you're doing so well.
I wanted to say, congratulations FinalNub! Your list made it to Channelfireball as the list Pascal used for reference on "odd decks in Modern." Gotta love those League 5-0s.
Ha thanks! I've had a few 5-0s with Grishoalbrand and also have had a few 5-0s published by MTGGoldfish with different oddball decks that weren't Grishoalbrand. Good to finally have that out and happy to represent the oddball decks on CB
Comments on the Grixis version would be appreciated. Just fooling around to see if this works. I think Chart a Course is an upgrade on Night's Whisper and Hug/Voice because you draw first. Search for Azcanta really feels lackluster but.. whatever. it looks fun at least!
I think the main deck looks something that I would also go for when trying to fit in Chart a Course and singleton Search for Azcanta (though I would not play the latter).
I am not totally sold on Chalice of the Void in sideboard with 8 important spells in main board to be shut down by chalice = 1, but to be honest I could never even realize why we wanted to play the card in BR either, because we also get hosed on chalice = 2 (vs storm) from our important spells. In which matchups you actually use chalice? Grixis Death Shadow and Burn seems like the only ones where I would side it in.
I would also try to fit Anger of the Gods into sideboard, because it works so well against all creature based decks.
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Modern: BRG Griselbrand reanimator, BUR Grixis Control, UR Blue moon (with Possibility Storm sometimes) Legacy: BU Reanimator, BU Omni-tell, BUW Tin Fins, BUR ANT / TES, <> Eldrazi Stompy
yea search for azcanta looks cool but it's not for this archetype. you don't want to maindeck it because in game 1s you are trying to be faster. you don't want to sideboard this into grindy matchups because it still operates on the same axis as your main gameplan (graveyard)
maybe chalice isn't right for grixis (i would just take out 4 SVs). However, Chalice is pretty useful against a wide range of decks. With regards to Storm, it's a bad enough matchup that you would not mind harming your gameplan a little bit because it's much harder for them to win with chalice on 2 (they're not going to bring in shattering spree unless they know for a fact you are playing chalices. even then, it's debatable) than it is for us (splice a vengeance onto a shoal, breach, etc.). Off the top, I would bring in chalices against:
GDS (half their deck)
Storm (all of their mana, some engine cards)
Burn (on the play)
UW Control (serum, path, condemn, surgical, dispel. This is contextual)
Lantern (cripples them if you can land it)
Ad Nauseam (swings the game hugely in your favor, either on 0 for pacts and blooms or on 1 for spoils, sv, grace, thoughtseize, sleight, opt)
8 rack (cripples them)
Bogles
Living End
It's still debatable to me what the best sweeper suite is. I dislike anger because red is a secondary color in grixis and double red can be pretty tough or painful to obtain
Noxious Revival is a flexible card. You can grab a countered Goryo's Vengeance or Through the Breach with it in your opponent's end step. Or while comboing Nourishing Shoal if you are having a hard time to find another one while having the big wurm in hand for exile effect. It also itself can be exiled for Nourishing Shoal. Or you can mess up your opponent's Snapcaster Mage target with it.
I think the card is on the "fun flex slot" of the deck. I myself use Lightning Axe in that slot and I believe some people have Collective Brutality in that slot. Bob Huang's deck in GP Charlotte 2015 (top64 finish) used Noxious Revival in that slot.
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Modern: BRG Griselbrand reanimator, BUR Grixis Control, UR Blue moon (with Possibility Storm sometimes) Legacy: BU Reanimator, BU Omni-tell, BUW Tin Fins, BUR ANT / TES, <> Eldrazi Stompy
Round 1: 0-2 vs Jeskai Control (0-1)
Won the dice roll. First game I had to mulligan to 4 because my 7-card hand had 5 lands and 2 Goryo's Vengeance, 6-card hand had 4 lands, ramp and Borbobobo, 5-card hand was a no-lander. Well then my draw spells (Night's Whisper, Cathartic Reunion) got countered and lost the game for that. Game 2 I had a pretty decent start by getting Blood Moon at turn 2. However my opponent played turn 2 Snapcaster Mage to get a clock going, and turn before I could cast TTB into Wurmcoil, he played a Vendilion Clique (this was in response to my Defense Grid) and took the TTB out of my hand -> gg. Funny how he drew enough basic islands to do that trick.
Round 2: 2-1 vs Grishoalbrand (1-1)
Won the dice roll and turn 2 killed him in games 1 and 3. Felt kinda bad to face the only other Grishoalbrand deck in the house. We checked each others sideboards at the end of match to compare some stuff, he was playing 3x Chalice of the Void in the sideboard. I asked him if he is following this thread and he responsed that he does not.
Round 3: 2-1 vs Titan Scapeshift (2-1)
Game 1 maindeck Relic of Progenitus slowed me down a bit but TTB a Griselbrand and then while comboing off TTB the Borbobobo to get the win. Game 2 turn 4 TTB into Worldspine Wurm was not fast enough as he was 3 life and comboed off dealing me 54 damage. Game 3 I just turn 2'd him on the play, while his first turn was just to play a land tapped.
Round 4: 0-2 vs UR storm (2-2)
Game 1 I kept a decent hand and then drew only land and could not combo off before he did. Game 2 I mulled to 5, kept a 1-lander, used two scry effects to only trying to find a second land and did not find it. GG. At least the opponent was a friend of mine so we had some laughts about how his combo deck is a turn slower than mine but hell a lot more consistent.
Round 5: 0-2 vs Lantern Control (2-3)
Both games he got Ensnaring Bridge + Leyline of Sanctity lock on me. In game 2 he Thoughtseized my Shattering Spree and even though I could get a Griselbrand onto play, I could not get rid of his Ensnaring Bridge with another Shattering Spree because he had a Welding Jar active.
At this point I became salty and dropped from the tournament. I just hated the Lantern deck so much, I feel like we have to mulligan into turn 2 kill hand to kill him before he can get Ensnaring Bridge active. I'm probably going to take a break from Modern a while and prepare for Finnish Legacy Championships. But yeah all in all, I guess Chalice of the Void could have helped me in games I lost, maybe next time I find room for them in the sideboard.
Modern: BRG Griselbrand reanimator, BUR Grixis Control, UR Blue moon (with Possibility Storm sometimes) Legacy: BU Reanimator, BU Omni-tell, BUW Tin Fins, BUR ANT / TES, <> Eldrazi Stompy
good report and sorry about your losses. Storm is tough and frankly i've come to accept that it's like a 40/60 matchup for us. nothing's going to fix it so I'm going to ignore it.
As for lantern, it's a horrendous matchup and they are pretty much pre-boarded for us. Just remember that for every 100 games where they Extraction our Griselbrand g1 or t2 needle t3 bridge us, there's always 1 of these:)
Round 1: 0-2 vs Jeskai Control (0-1)
Won the dice roll. First game I had to mulligan to 4 because my 7-card hand had 5 lands and 2 Goryo's Vengeance, 6-card hand had 4 lands, ramp and Borbobobo, 5-card hand was a no-lander. Well then my draw spells (Night's Whisper, Cathartic Reunion) got countered and lost the game for that. Game 2 I had a pretty decent start by getting Blood Moon at turn 2. However my opponent played turn 2 Snapcaster Mage to get a clock going, and turn before I could cast TTB into Wurmcoil, he played a Vendilion Clique (this was in response to my Defense Grid) and took the TTB out of my hand -> gg. Funny how he drew enough basic islands to do that trick.
Round 2: 2-1 vs Grishoalbrand (1-1)
Won the dice roll and turn 2 killed him in games 1 and 3. Felt kinda bad to face the only other Grishoalbrand deck in the house. We checked each others sideboards at the end of match to compare some stuff, he was playing 3x Chalice of the Void in the sideboard. I asked him if he is following this thread and he responsed that he does not.
Round 3: 2-1 vs Titan Scapeshift (2-1)
Game 1 maindeck Relic of Progenitus slowed me down a bit but TTB a Griselbrand and then while comboing off TTB the Borbobobo to get the win. Game 2 turn 4 TTB into Worldspine Wurm was not fast enough as he was 3 life and comboed off dealing me 54 damage. Game 3 I just turn 2'd him on the play, while his first turn was just to play a land tapped.
Round 4: 0-2 vs UR storm (2-2)
Game 1 I kept a decent hand and then drew only land and could not combo off before he did. Game 2 I mulled to 5, kept a 1-lander, used two scry effects to only trying to find a second land and did not find it. GG. At least the opponent was a friend of mine so we had some laughts about how his combo deck is a turn slower than mine but hell a lot more consistent.
Round 5: 0-2 vs Lantern Control (2-3)
Both games he got Ensnaring Bridge + Leyline of Sanctity lock on me. In game 2 he Thoughtseized my Shattering Spree and even though I could get a Griselbrand onto play, I could not get rid of his Ensnaring Bridge with another Shattering Spree because he had a Welding Jar active.
At this point I became salty and dropped from the tournament. I just hated the Lantern deck so much, I feel like we have to mulligan into turn 2 kill hand to kill him before he can get Ensnaring Bridge active. I'm probably going to take a break from Modern a while and prepare for Finnish Legacy Championships. But yeah all in all, I guess Chalice of the Void could have helped me in games I lost, maybe next time I find room for them in the sideboard.
Seems pretty unlucky in the matchup department. I wouldn't feel too upset about it, with literally Titanshift the only truly positive matchup you faced. Good luck in Legacy. What do you play there?
good report and sorry about your losses. Storm is tough and frankly i've come to accept that it's like a 40/60 matchup for us. nothing's going to fix it so I'm going to ignore it.
As for lantern, it's a horrendous matchup and they are pretty much pre-boarded for us. Just remember that for every 100 games where they Extraction our Griselbrand g1 or t2 needle t3 bridge us, there's always 1 of these:)
Thanks for the video. I actually hadn't seen it before and loved it (I can get salty about Lantern too, lol).
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
jeskai tempo has been on the rise lately and I'm certain it's not a good matchup. thoughts?
There's a guy at my store that always plays jeskai tempo and honestly, it's not that bad of a matchup. Splicing stuff at their endstep usually gets you there.
i think it's even to slightly bad. unlike your typical uwx matchups which are good they have md quellers which are awesome and can turn on the heat at the right moment with ambush vipers and burn. or we just get wrecked by geist
game 3 vs. UW Control. you won game 1 and lost to a quick geist game 2. I've brought in 2 pacts, 1 brutality and 3 chalices (btw, is chalice really that great vs UW? 1 shuts down SV/path/surgical/dispel, which are whatever. 2 shuts off negates/snapcasters/spreading seas. I'm wondering if we should just be boarding in blood moon instead, as their mana base can actually be volatile)
t2 - wwyd? what considerations would you make in making this decision?
wwyd? no relevant scrys. he's been stuck on 4 lands for a while as you can see. i EoT TTB'd, which met a Negate. I hardcast Griselbrand, which resolved, and now it's getting path'd at my endtep
g1 I'm OTD and he went t1 Vents->sleight, t2 sleight->no land drop. T3 he drew a land and played baral and passed. I start my t3 with 3 lands, Vengeance SSG and Looting so I'm hoping to hit a land in the top 5 cards. Of course I whiff on the Borb trigger and now I've just cast Looting with my SSG and hit a brutality. wwyd?
game 3 vs. UW Control. you won game 1 and lost to a quick geist game 2. I've brought in 2 pacts, 1 brutality and 3 chalices (btw, is chalice really that great vs UW? 1 shuts down SV/path/surgical/dispel, which are whatever. 2 shuts off negates/snapcasters/spreading seas. I'm wondering if we should just be boarding in blood moon instead, as their mana base can actually be volatile)
t2 - wwyd? what considerations would you make in making this decision?
I would just go for it. UW runs 2 dispel in the side which is unlikely for them to draw. The more time you give them the more answers they might have.
wwyd? no relevant scrys. he's been stuck on 4 lands for a while as you can see. i EoT TTB'd, which met a Negate. I hardcast Griselbrand, which resolved, and now it's getting path'd at my endtep
Very unlikely that you are able to combo off. Draw 7 and pass.
g1 I'm OTD and he went t1 Vents->sleight, t2 sleight->no land drop. T3 he drew a land and played baral and passed. I start my t3 with 3 lands, Vengeance SSG and Looting so I'm hoping to hit a land in the top 5 cards. Of course I whiff on the Borb trigger and now I've just cast Looting with my SSG and hit a brutality. wwyd?
Tough one. You can win next turn with the brutality and 3 lands but its very likely he can just go off next turn. I would probably discard a single land to hit baral and pass the turn. Discard griselbrand and a land preferably keeping temple.
in scenario two you've just hard casted griselbrand and passed, then he pathed your griselbrand during your end step. if you draw 7 in response and whiff on either shoal plus something ( or pact plus manamorphose) you'll just to snapcaster. I think the question is can you can resolve a second hardcasted griselbrand next turn often enough
Go off if he fetches eot (no mana available) or in his upkeep if he doesn't fetch (the fetch mana available). The one mana interaction spells are rarer in UW Control than the two mana spells. If he has Path, it doesn't really matter cause you just draw 14+ cards and go off next turn again with Pact backup (most likely due to the amount of drawn cards).
Pic 2)
Let it resolve. The chance is higher that you whiff and than die of Snappy than to draw the Shoal + pitch outlet in seven cards. Even than, this situation sucks big time.
Pic 3)
Pitch Wurm and a land, kill Baral with Borbor, play the scry land and pass. This allows you to have a Brutality for a Mancer (or use it as a Discard) and/or allows you to flashback the Lootings to find a Goryo's/TTB.
I know, that you can ditch three lands and cast Brutality next turn, but imo it is a trap. In his hand he has six spells, so pure gas. The chance, that he kills you is way to high for my liking (he needs 2 Rits and a Gifts and it is gg).
Greetings,
Kathal
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What I play or have:
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
jeskai tempo has been on the rise lately and I'm certain it's not a good matchup. thoughts?
Should be an even match-up. It purely depends on the draws on how it pans out. If he has a fast clock + interaction (so a turn 6 kill), than it is really rough. Otherwise you will most likely than not just steamroll him.
Btw. Queller looks really sad vs TTB and Splice action
Greetings,
Kathal
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What I play or have:
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
1. The only possible interaction I think is a 2-3 of Dispel from the SB (UW doesn't play Snares from what I've seen). I think the best line is Katahl's - wait for him to crack his fetch or do it on his upkeep.
What happened: I went for it in the main phase and promptly got Dispel->RIPd out of the game. I thought after that it could be fine to wait for their t2 play, but what Kathal said is obviously the optimal play
2. Agree that this situation is bad. Him having 4 lands by turn implies his hand is full of gas. I disagree with you here, Kathal. I think we have to think about our path to winning. If path resolves, what is our likely path to winning? Any meaningful business spell that we cast is likely going to be countered because of how the game has played out to the point. He has Logic Knot, Cryptic Command and Path as answers to the next hardcast Griselbrand. IMO it's unlikely letting the path resolve is a winning line. With one mana open only, I think it's best we take the risk, draw 7 and hope to find shoals and business.
What happened: I drew 7 and died a horrible death after whiffing
3. Agree with both of you - this hand is a trap, especially considering the implied texture of his hand. He went t1 land+Sleight, t2 sleight with no land. his hand is likely full of business. The Brutality line is also soft to Remand. As seductive as the hypothetical kill is next turn, I think we need to kill Baral and hope for the best. (also a small point Kathal - I would pitch a mountain and a Griselbrand instead of a wurm, so a Vengeance is also an out)
What happened: I crossed my fingers, threw three lands at the opponent's face and died a horrible death
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Ha thanks! I've had a few 5-0s with Grishoalbrand and also have had a few 5-0s published by MTGGoldfish with different oddball decks that weren't Grishoalbrand. Good to finally have that out and happy to represent the oddball decks on CB
1 Blood Crypt
2 Bloodstained Mire
1 Darkslick Shores
1 Island
1 Mountain
3 Polluted Delta
3 Scalding Tarn
1 Spirebluff Canal
1 Steam Vents
1 Swamp
1 Watery Grave
4 Serum Visions
4 Faithless Looting
3 Chart a Course
1 Search for Azcanta
1 Collective Brutality
4 Goryo's Vengeance
2 Desperate Ritual
1 Izzet Charm
1 Manamorphose
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Through the Breach
4 Griselbrand
2 Borborygmos Enraged
4 Nourishing SHoal
4 Worldspine Wurm
2 Pact of Negation
1 Echoing Truth
2 Collective Brutality
1 Paintful Truths
1 By Force
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Pyroclasm
1 Nihil Spellbomb
3 Chalice of the void
I am not totally sold on Chalice of the Void in sideboard with 8 important spells in main board to be shut down by chalice = 1, but to be honest I could never even realize why we wanted to play the card in BR either, because we also get hosed on chalice = 2 (vs storm) from our important spells. In which matchups you actually use chalice? Grixis Death Shadow and Burn seems like the only ones where I would side it in.
I would also try to fit Anger of the Gods into sideboard, because it works so well against all creature based decks.
BRG Griselbrand reanimator, BUR Grixis Control, UR Blue moon (with Possibility Storm sometimes)
Legacy:
BU Reanimator, BU Omni-tell, BUW Tin Fins, BUR ANT / TES, <> Eldrazi Stompy
maybe chalice isn't right for grixis (i would just take out 4 SVs). However, Chalice is pretty useful against a wide range of decks. With regards to Storm, it's a bad enough matchup that you would not mind harming your gameplan a little bit because it's much harder for them to win with chalice on 2 (they're not going to bring in shattering spree unless they know for a fact you are playing chalices. even then, it's debatable) than it is for us (splice a vengeance onto a shoal, breach, etc.). Off the top, I would bring in chalices against:
GDS (half their deck)
Storm (all of their mana, some engine cards)
Burn (on the play)
UW Control (serum, path, condemn, surgical, dispel. This is contextual)
Lantern (cripples them if you can land it)
Ad Nauseam (swings the game hugely in your favor, either on 0 for pacts and blooms or on 1 for spoils, sv, grace, thoughtseize, sleight, opt)
8 rack (cripples them)
Bogles
Living End
It's still debatable to me what the best sweeper suite is. I dislike anger because red is a secondary color in grixis and double red can be pretty tough or painful to obtain
I think the card is on the "fun flex slot" of the deck. I myself use Lightning Axe in that slot and I believe some people have Collective Brutality in that slot. Bob Huang's deck in GP Charlotte 2015 (top64 finish) used Noxious Revival in that slot.
BRG Griselbrand reanimator, BUR Grixis Control, UR Blue moon (with Possibility Storm sometimes)
Legacy:
BU Reanimator, BU Omni-tell, BUW Tin Fins, BUR ANT / TES, <> Eldrazi Stompy
My decklist:
3x Desperate Ritual
4x Goryo's Vengeance
1x Lightning Axe
1x Manamorphose
4x Nourishing Shoal
4x Through the Breach
Sorcery
2x Cathartic Reunion
4x Faithless Looting
4x Night's Whisper
2x Borborygmos Enraged
4x Griselbrand
4x Simian Spirit Guide
4x Worldspine Wurm
Land
2x Blackcleave Cliffs
1x Blood Crypt
4x Bloodstained Mire
3x Mountain
5x Swamp
4x Temple of Malice
2x Anger of the Gods
3x Blood Moon
2x Collective Brutality
2x Defense Grid
1x Fatal Push
2x Inquisition of Kozilek
2x Shattering Spree
1x Slaughter Games
Round 1: 0-2 vs Jeskai Control (0-1)
Won the dice roll. First game I had to mulligan to 4 because my 7-card hand had 5 lands and 2 Goryo's Vengeance, 6-card hand had 4 lands, ramp and Borbobobo, 5-card hand was a no-lander. Well then my draw spells (Night's Whisper, Cathartic Reunion) got countered and lost the game for that. Game 2 I had a pretty decent start by getting Blood Moon at turn 2. However my opponent played turn 2 Snapcaster Mage to get a clock going, and turn before I could cast TTB into Wurmcoil, he played a Vendilion Clique (this was in response to my Defense Grid) and took the TTB out of my hand -> gg. Funny how he drew enough basic islands to do that trick.
Round 2: 2-1 vs Grishoalbrand (1-1)
Won the dice roll and turn 2 killed him in games 1 and 3. Felt kinda bad to face the only other Grishoalbrand deck in the house. We checked each others sideboards at the end of match to compare some stuff, he was playing 3x Chalice of the Void in the sideboard. I asked him if he is following this thread and he responsed that he does not.
Round 3: 2-1 vs Titan Scapeshift (2-1)
Game 1 maindeck Relic of Progenitus slowed me down a bit but TTB a Griselbrand and then while comboing off TTB the Borbobobo to get the win. Game 2 turn 4 TTB into Worldspine Wurm was not fast enough as he was 3 life and comboed off dealing me 54 damage. Game 3 I just turn 2'd him on the play, while his first turn was just to play a land tapped.
Round 4: 0-2 vs UR storm (2-2)
Game 1 I kept a decent hand and then drew only land and could not combo off before he did. Game 2 I mulled to 5, kept a 1-lander, used two scry effects to only trying to find a second land and did not find it. GG. At least the opponent was a friend of mine so we had some laughts about how his combo deck is a turn slower than mine but hell a lot more consistent.
Round 5: 0-2 vs Lantern Control (2-3)
Both games he got Ensnaring Bridge + Leyline of Sanctity lock on me. In game 2 he Thoughtseized my Shattering Spree and even though I could get a Griselbrand onto play, I could not get rid of his Ensnaring Bridge with another Shattering Spree because he had a Welding Jar active.
At this point I became salty and dropped from the tournament. I just hated the Lantern deck so much, I feel like we have to mulligan into turn 2 kill hand to kill him before he can get Ensnaring Bridge active. I'm probably going to take a break from Modern a while and prepare for Finnish Legacy Championships. But yeah all in all, I guess Chalice of the Void could have helped me in games I lost, maybe next time I find room for them in the sideboard.
BRG Griselbrand reanimator, BUR Grixis Control, UR Blue moon (with Possibility Storm sometimes)
Legacy:
BU Reanimator, BU Omni-tell, BUW Tin Fins, BUR ANT / TES, <> Eldrazi Stompy
As for lantern, it's a horrendous matchup and they are pretty much pre-boarded for us. Just remember that for every 100 games where they Extraction our Griselbrand g1 or t2 needle t3 bridge us, there's always 1 of these:)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqMjzJlCy8U
Seems pretty unlucky in the matchup department. I wouldn't feel too upset about it, with literally Titanshift the only truly positive matchup you faced. Good luck in Legacy. What do you play there?
Thanks for the video. I actually hadn't seen it before and loved it (I can get salty about Lantern too, lol).
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me).. never scoop!
There's a guy at my store that always plays jeskai tempo and honestly, it's not that bad of a matchup. Splicing stuff at their endstep usually gets you there.
t2 - wwyd? what considerations would you make in making this decision?
wwyd? no relevant scrys. he's been stuck on 4 lands for a while as you can see. i EoT TTB'd, which met a Negate. I hardcast Griselbrand, which resolved, and now it's getting path'd at my endtep
g1 I'm OTD and he went t1 Vents->sleight, t2 sleight->no land drop. T3 he drew a land and played baral and passed. I start my t3 with 3 lands, Vengeance SSG and Looting so I'm hoping to hit a land in the top 5 cards. Of course I whiff on the Borb trigger and now I've just cast Looting with my SSG and hit a brutality. wwyd?
I would just go for it. UW runs 2 dispel in the side which is unlikely for them to draw. The more time you give them the more answers they might have.
Very unlikely that you are able to combo off. Draw 7 and pass.
Tough one. You can win next turn with the brutality and 3 lands but its very likely he can just go off next turn. I would probably discard a single land to hit baral and pass the turn. Discard griselbrand and a land preferably keeping temple.
a tl,dr; summery of the first case:
Go off if he fetches eot (no mana available) or in his upkeep if he doesn't fetch (the fetch mana available). The one mana interaction spells are rarer in UW Control than the two mana spells. If he has Path, it doesn't really matter cause you just draw 14+ cards and go off next turn again with Pact backup (most likely due to the amount of drawn cards).
Pic 2)
Let it resolve. The chance is higher that you whiff and than die of Snappy than to draw the Shoal + pitch outlet in seven cards. Even than, this situation sucks big time.
Pic 3)
Pitch Wurm and a land, kill Baral with Borbor, play the scry land and pass. This allows you to have a Brutality for a Mancer (or use it as a Discard) and/or allows you to flashback the Lootings to find a Goryo's/TTB.
I know, that you can ditch three lands and cast Brutality next turn, but imo it is a trap. In his hand he has six spells, so pure gas. The chance, that he kills you is way to high for my liking (he needs 2 Rits and a Gifts and it is gg).
Greetings,
Kathal
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
Should be an even match-up. It purely depends on the draws on how it pans out. If he has a fast clock + interaction (so a turn 6 kill), than it is really rough. Otherwise you will most likely than not just steamroll him.
Btw. Queller looks really sad vs TTB and Splice action
Greetings,
Kathal
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
1. The only possible interaction I think is a 2-3 of Dispel from the SB (UW doesn't play Snares from what I've seen). I think the best line is Katahl's - wait for him to crack his fetch or do it on his upkeep.
What happened: I went for it in the main phase and promptly got Dispel->RIPd out of the game. I thought after that it could be fine to wait for their t2 play, but what Kathal said is obviously the optimal play
2. Agree that this situation is bad. Him having 4 lands by turn implies his hand is full of gas. I disagree with you here, Kathal. I think we have to think about our path to winning. If path resolves, what is our likely path to winning? Any meaningful business spell that we cast is likely going to be countered because of how the game has played out to the point. He has Logic Knot, Cryptic Command and Path as answers to the next hardcast Griselbrand. IMO it's unlikely letting the path resolve is a winning line. With one mana open only, I think it's best we take the risk, draw 7 and hope to find shoals and business.
What happened: I drew 7 and died a horrible death after whiffing
3. Agree with both of you - this hand is a trap, especially considering the implied texture of his hand. He went t1 land+Sleight, t2 sleight with no land. his hand is likely full of business. The Brutality line is also soft to Remand. As seductive as the hypothetical kill is next turn, I think we need to kill Baral and hope for the best. (also a small point Kathal - I would pitch a mountain and a Griselbrand instead of a wurm, so a Vengeance is also an out)
What happened: I crossed my fingers, threw three lands at the opponent's face and died a horrible death