This is not a fair assessment - There are so few decks that deal less than 5 damage to themselves, and if you can manage even one or two chipshots with Snapcaster it's more like a 3-4 turn clock. Putting pressure on the opponent is "doing something" regardless of whether or not the source of pressure has an ETB effect - Pressure will force your opponent to play a reactive game when they might have wanted to play a proactive game, in either case it will cause them to change up their game plan a little.
My point was that a 3-4 turn clock dropped on turn 3 gives you a turn 6-7 kill. A combo deck that can't go off by then (through disruption, even) must have drawn terribly. You basically have to stop your opponent with [i]other[i] draws and then instead of locking them out by drawing more disruption than they can draw answers (with Revelation), you're expecting to kill your opponent before they can draw into their combo again.
The fact that you automatically pointed to damage from Snapcaster helping shorten the clock should be evidence in support of what we're all saying about "being a bad midrange list". Every successful tempo/midrange deck is running between 12-15 creatures/planeswalkers for a reason. If you're going to go below that number you gotta only play ETB value creatures like Snapcaster/Vendilion Clique.
And finally, in what world is Tasigur's draw ability worse than drawing a card by any other means possible? Its a guaranteed non-land card! That's better than generic "draw a card" by a lot.
Tasigur costs 4 mana to activate, which puts it in Azure Mage territory. His card draw is of the Browbeat style, similar to Steam Augury. You jsut give your opponent a card that can't interact, another copy of Tasigur, or a cantrip. Free is always good, but if you've got a Think Twice or Esper Charm in hand you're probably better off casting those.
I'd much rather have Tasigur in my deck than WSZ against combo decks. The deck all ready plays 1 win-condition. Playing another is actually going to add to your combo win %, not detract. If you're saying that because you play 2 Tas instead of 1 WSZ that you drawing that Tas is going to mean you lose because you don't have enough disruption in the deck, I don't have much more to say on the subject because statistical analysis is not even in the conversation and you're tied to presupposition.
This is not a fair assessment - There are so few decks that deal less than 5 damage to themselves, and if you can manage even one or two chipshots with Snapcaster it's more like a 3-4 turn clock. Putting pressure on the opponent is "doing something" regardless of whether or not the source of pressure has an ETB effect - Pressure will force your opponent to play a reactive game when they might have wanted to play a proactive game, in either case it will cause them to change up their game plan a little.
My point was that a 3-4 turn clock dropped on turn 3 gives you a turn 6-7 kill. A combo deck that can't go off by then (through disruption, even) must have drawn terribly. You basically have to stop your opponent with [i]other[i] draws and then instead of locking them out by drawing more disruption than they can draw answers (with Revelation), you're expecting to kill your opponent before they can draw into their combo again.
The fact that you automatically pointed to damage from Snapcaster helping shorten the clock should be evidence in support of what we're all saying about "being a bad midrange list". Every successful tempo/midrange deck is running between 12-15 creatures/planeswalkers for a reason. If you're going to go below that number you gotta only play ETB value creatures like Snapcaster/Vendilion Clique.
And finally, in what world is Tasigur's draw ability worse than drawing a card by any other means possible? Its a guaranteed non-land card! That's better than generic "draw a card" by a lot.
Tasigur costs 4 mana to activate, which puts it in Azure Mage territory. His card draw is of the Browbeat style, similar to Steam Augury. You jsut give your opponent a card that can't interact, another copy of Tasigur, or a cantrip. Free is always good, but if you've got a Think Twice or Esper Charm in hand you're probably better off casting those.
I'd much rather have Tasigur in my deck than WSZ against combo decks. The deck all ready plays 1 win-condition. Playing another is actually going to add to your combo win %, not detract. If you're saying that because you play 2 Tas instead of 1 WSZ that you drawing that Tas is going to mean you lose because you don't have enough disruption in the deck, I don't have much more to say on the subject because statistical analysis is not even in the conversation and you're tied to presupposition.
Have to agree with Aegraen - If you think you're going to die before turn 7 then adding tasigur helps that match more than hinders it vs other win cons (not vs non-wincons). Maybe not as good as say Clique would, but clique is a much more vulnerable threat.
I understand that the opponent gets the choice of what to give you, but if you've played the card you will know that it's not usually a super easy decision for your opponent. Sometimes they give you back a tasigur, but that can only happen once if you only run 2 and won't happen most of the time. Take a look at your list, imagine the worst non-land card in your deck, and imagine drawing that every turn you have an extra 4 Mana. It's way better than Azure Mage, c'mon.
Tas is worse than WSZ because you're forced to commit to him on your turn. He's rarely going to be B for us, and when he is that means we've either eaten a lot of fetches or we've removed snap targets - both of which removes Logic Knot fuel.
Is playing mana leak stronger than logic Knot? Maybe, but not in a deck that aims to hit turn 6 pretty reliably.
Like I said, Tas changes the fundamental design of the deck to a faster deck with protection rather than disruption.
Tas is worse than WSZ because you're forced to commit to him on your turn. He's rarely going to be B for us, and when he is that means we've either eaten a lot of fetches or we've removed snap targets - both of which removes Logic Knot fuel.
Is playing mana leak stronger than logic Knot? Maybe, but not in a deck that aims to hit turn 6 pretty reliably.
Like I said, Tas changes the fundamental design of the deck to a faster deck with protection rather than disruption.
You keep saying it, but it's just not true. Yes, to optimize him it means changing some cards around, but it doesn't change the draw-go nature of the deck. A card like Opt is imminently playable for the deck. Between Opt/Fetches a Thought Scour or two (which actually does synergize pretty well with the deck), etc. and voiola - it's actually not changing your disruption count (you can play a little less "disruption" and still find as many or more with increased selection - Miracles never had too much trouble finding answers, and the deck played A TON less than any Modern control deck for instance). You can shave some lands because of increased selection/cantrips. WSZ and Tas each have their pros and cons - it's not a sin to admit that Tas is better against combo decks, because he is. WSZ is better against attrition and other control decks (assuming you can ever get it to resolve).
OG miracles never had trouble finding answers because it got to play cards like brainstorm, ponder, and SDT, which are incomparable to opt or serum visions, or thought scour in the control they give you. On top of that, counterbalance was a one-card answer to everything. Once you found it, you had much, much less pressure to find more answers.
Again, I'm still kind of unsure why people think that cantrips inherently synergize well with this deck. IMO, they absolutely do not. They are not answers, they are not lands (we need a critical mass for X-spells), they are not card advantage, and they are not a wincon.
The nature of magic in general kind of demands decks like this to have appropriate answers at appropriate times, and thus cantrips can be a necessary evil, but they are not inherently synergistic.
Also, the major problem with tasigur being better against combo decks is this: Its pretty ballsy to play tasigur as your only wincon (excluding colonnades). Obviously doable, but risky. Meaning if you're playing tasigurs, you're potentially playing them in addition to wsz/secure (probably secure), which means you have to cut something. So then you potentially are worse against combo decks, because you have less disruption, or if you do cut other wincons, you are (IMO, incorrectly) on the "beat down with some disruption" plan, which is much more befitting of a tempo deck than a draw-go deck.
Agree with above. Comparing tasigur to wsz or secure is only relevant if you are actually cutting those for tasigur. If you do that, then the points you gain vs tron, valakut, combo are lost vs decks running path to exile or remand (and some other removal like dismember and vapor snag). Thats not even factoring in what chewing 5 cards out of your gy means for the efectiveness of snap and knot or your overall vulnerability to grave hate.
By all means craft a tasigur list and test it, but I think people are right to be skeptical as the addition/change is not as harmless as it might seem at a glance.
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Modern
* Esper Draw-Go
* Tezzeret Whir
* Blue Tron
As an Abzan or Combo player, I'm much happier to see Tas on the board with an empty GY for my opp on t3 than 3 open mana and a full yard. Just me though
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Has anyone tried field of ruin? I was running one ghost quarter and considering changing it. On one hand I can usually afford the extra mana, but by the same token I can also usually afford losing a land. To the extent I keep running 1-2 shadow of doubt quarter seems to have the upper hand - but otherwise is there any strong reason to pick one over the other?
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Modern
* Esper Draw-Go
* Tezzeret Whir
* Blue Tron
The only major difference I've been able to discern is that Field can take an opponent off Tron before their turn 3 when we are on the play without setting us back a land which then enables us to still have cryptic up the next turn. I've been playing a lot with Field of Ruin in this week to try to feel out the difference, and honestly it's a very hard card to evaluate - I can't make a relative judgement between the LD land options, but in absolute terms Field is certainly playable.
I definitely intend to revisit gq/tec edge/field of the ruin soon. Each one obviously has pros/cons, but I feel like I haven't given a whole lot of thought to why I'm still playing gq until now. (I played it in the past because of inkmoth nexus, but thats not really as significant anymore).
Exactly as jayjay said - we aren't getting set back on mana, which is extremely crucial in some MUs. It does cost 2 mana to activate, so we aren't as live against the fast Affinity infect draws, but how often has that come up for you guys?? For me, not nearly as often as you'd think.
The only thing I dislike is on the draw against Tron. GQ is one of the few ways to stay in the game against nat Tron, and I'd hate to lose that game play just to have an extra mana. On the other hand, T2 counter spell on nat Tron t3 into Fields of Ruin and keep a Plains up? That sounds solid
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Another consideration for field is having to tap a bit lower to kill a manland during combat which gives us less mana for 2nd main phase or eot. For example you have four mana and get hit with a mutavault - ruining it leaves you with two mana up instead of three - so cant flashback tt or esper charm eot. Not sure how often that will matter but in the early game the tempo of going down one mana for the turn could be worse than being up a mana in the long run (vs gq).
Im going to try replacing my single shadow of doubt with search for azcanta and my single gq with field and just see how it goes. I cut my second shadow and one land for two opts as well. Lets me experiment with all 3 new ixalan cards without reinventing the deck
On search for azcanta - I'm having some mediocre results so far. I am just not sure when the deck actually needs this effect. In the early game I can't flip it and/or wouldn't be able to blow mana on the effect anyways. In the mid game I would generally be casting an esper charm or think twice or a small rev anyways so doing this instead is okay - but I still have those other cards in hand - so its kind of moot? And late game is probably the worst because at this point I have probably won the game anyways and am just going through the motions. Reving for 6 and drawing this does not exactly excite me.
In sum - azcanta is repeatable card draw/card advantage in a deck that is already pretty heavily stacked with cantrips and card draw so the effect feels pretty redundant to me. We can't actually cut the other cantrips/card draw and replace with azcanta because its not as reliable - we need the GY stocked, a window to pay 1U at sorcery, and for it to not get quarter/tec edge/seas'd (which would be very bad for us if we were counting on it).
I consider trading 1 think twice for an azcanta to be a harmless swap but I have yet to see the game where I flip a search and feel like it mattered. Maybe that moment is still coming
Try flipping it less. I've been at points in the midgame where it could flip and choose not to because I don't need the extra Mana and don't have time to impulse yet. In the mean time you can continue fixing draws and stocking the yard. Then when you're good and ready, flip it and take over the game.
I will say that when you do flip it and use it there is no comparing it to flashing back think twice anymore. almost without fail your top cards are 1-2 action spells and the rest lands/cantrips. Hitting gas everytime is actually worth a lot.
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Modern
* Esper Draw-Go
* Tezzeret Whir
* Blue Tron
I will say that when you do flip it and use it there is no comparing it to flashing back think twice anymore. almost without fail your top cards are 1-2 action spells and the rest lands/cantrips. Hitting gas everytime is actually worth a lot.
Yea, I ran some basic hypergeometric calculations - you're roughly 95% to hit at least 1 spell, and about 70% to have options between spells.
I don't think it's the same as current draw-go lists (certainly not decks styled in a similar manner to my current and probably outdated build), but I think it might actually be very good.
Something along these lines: Not "proactive" per-se, but much more *aggressive* than most builds. I know at some point I'll take this list, or something similar, out for a spin. Probably with a better mana base, but i'm on mobile atm and don't have my tools. Obviously not the greatest against spell-based decks, but most of the format is playing to the board right now, and the sideboard options in esper are good against anything.
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Primary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
I mean try it if you like but I see no advantage in that list to being esper over jeskai. If you're trying to be low to the ground being able to bolt/helix/electrolyze the face is worth way more than access to esper charm. You have no X spells so trying to get to late game doesnt benefit you as much.
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* Esper Draw-Go
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I mean try it if you like but I see no advantage in that list to being esper over jeskai. If you're trying to be low to the ground being able to bolt/helix/electrolyze the face is worth way more than access to esper charm. You have no X spells so trying to get to late game doesnt benefit you as much.
I mean, it's better to have ECharm against a lot of opponents than to have rando burn spells. Like, I get that Bolt/Helix/Elzye is a plan, but ECharm by itself destroys combo and really helps in the Tron/Shift matchups.
I'm NOT sold on 3 mainboard Gearhulks tho, amalek0. Even with Academy Ruins. It looks like an optimal 1/2x Secure, 2x Clique, and 2+ Azacanta list to me.
So I haven't had nearly as much time to play recently, but just started getting some free time again. Working nights has allowed me to play modo during downtime (yay I guess)
Anyways I'm toying with this list currently
I've liked it so far, but it has a small sample size of matches under it's belt currently. The WSZ should most likely just be a Secure the Wastes. I feel like I'm missing Spell Snare a bit often, so I might look into adding one into my list somewhere. I'm still uncertain on the anticipates, but they performed reasonably well so far. I definitely like them better than Serum Visions currently, but I'm not opposed to playing serum visions at times.
I haven't been able to test the ceremonius rejections. I'm tempted to make one of those a spell snare though specifically because it still hits turn 2 chalice on the draw and has applications in other match ups like the blue mirrors.
Notables from the list:
24 lands because I feel like I flood out too much at times with 25 lands with the traditional build (can't say whether this is right or wrong). I've occasionally been stuck on 5-6 lands for a few turns, but I'm not too concerned about it. It does concede a few percentage points in control matchups.
main deck leylines for inevitability matchups.
when I put the list together I was trying to operate on the concept of card velocity in order to allow myself to run a slightly lower land count. Haven't had any issues pulling ahead in grindy games yet. I haven't really missed my think twices as much as I thought I would, but I'd also be happy finding room for another one.
I've lurked this thread for a long time and played several different versions of the deck (classic builds with Snare, a Ryan Hovis inspired build, and most recently a relatively stock Serum Visions build) since I started playing Modern. Over the years I've run several other decks in the format, but I always come back to Esper Control and I'm always looking to make it better.
I was excited to test with the new cards from Ixalan, and even more excited when my new build seemed to be very strong, so I thought I should share what I came up with. Below is the version of the new build that I've played with the most; earlier versions were 1-2 cards off this 60 and had a more traditional sideboard.
The Theory:
My plan with this list was to see what would happen if I fully committed to the Turbo Xerox plan without sacrificing too much late game power. To do that I lowered the land count significantly, and removed all the Colonnades. The only MU where I really wanted them was Death's Shadow, which was already favorable, and in situations where I needed to cantrip early to hit land drops I thought they would be a liability. To make up for the loss of the back-up wincon, I added Elspeth to the main to ensure at least two different but powerful wincons outside of the flimsy Snapcasters. Cutting Think Twice was another risky move, but I thought that it would be necessary with the addition of all the other cantrips, and that those same cantrips - along with the reduced land count - would provide the card quality to make up for it (ie, why run TT when I can have more effective Esper Charms by making the deck smaller). I went down to one Rev because of the lower land count and because Search for Azcanta could also provide game ending CA without the huge investment up front.
Previously I had found the most success with a mostly Blue/White sideboard focused around hate enchantments and other "lock" pieces like Baneslayer Angel, with Cliques and cheap interaction like Dispel as support. Because Search for Azcanta required me to have a graveyard, I knew I couldn't run Rest in Peace, and so instead I built my sideboard to make better use of Surgical Extraction. The Souls/Sorin package is something I always liked in theory as a way to provide board control and lifegain without going all in on an easily removed creature. It had tested lukewarm in the past, but I thought that the more low-to-the-ground nature of this deck might be a better fit.
The Results:
I was very surprised when this list provided late game power matching and sometimes surpassing previous Esper lists, while having an improved early game due to the card selection and cheap interaction. The card that most over-performed was easily Search for Azcanta. The front half contributes to the critical mass of card selection, and with all the cantrips and fetches it flips easily, even through several Logic Knots. The CA it provides takes over the game more reliably than an average Rev, as it always draws gas (instead of occasionally "wiffing" into 3 lands and a removal spell) and it just keeps churning out cards the longer you stay alive. In awkward situations (like digging for a Cryptic to bounce a PW that's about to ult) a few activations of Azcanta will usually turn up an answer. Even without it though, the density of card selection often allowed me to "go off" by chaining Esper Charms and Snaps into one of the big spells. Overall I feel the deck more reliably reaches that late-game stage of having 15-20 cards in your deck and a full grip, where you can pretty much answer anything given a turn or two of digging though your deck.
However, there's a few drawbacks I've noticed with the Xerox engine. You're more vulnerable to grave hate and land destruction, especially now that there's no Colonnades to draw GQ activations. Chalice on one out of Eldrazi Tron is also a huge pain, where before it could be played through reasonably (although I've won both matchups I've played against ETron so far, it still feels like a miracle). Without Think Twice to bin for value and grind out CA, you can be weaker in grindy MUs unless you get Azcanta going or dig into one of the big spells. This is similar to the problem old lists would have with randomly flooding out. Supporting so many mana and color intensive spells puts a huge strain on a 22 land manabase, so there's really no option to run any utility lands (which sucks because I think Field of Ruin is perfect for Esper). I think this will also make the the UW "mirror" a lot tougher, as a smart player will easily kill our Azcantas and cut us off black, but the one time I played the matchup I was ahead both games until I threw them to stupid misplays.
Going Forward:
The only card I've been unhappy with in the maindeck is Remand. On paper it's the perfect card for its slot (a cantrip that also provides some cheap interaction) but it feels horrible in the meta right now; I constantly find myself holding it up only to counter nothing and screw up my curve, or firing it off at one mana spells just to get it out of my hand. I'm going to test Shadow of Doubt and Censor, but the correct move might be to bring back 2-3 Think Twice, and maybe trim a Push or a Serum Visions to make room.
The Token Package in the sideboard has been great sometimes and terrible other times. I might be boarding it in against the wrong decks, though. It's been tight against Affinity and "small" aggro like Humans and Goblins/8Whack, but against Company decks or BGx decks that can more easily fight through, it might be better to just keep my Cryptics and what not in. The other problem is that while Sorin, Solemn Visitor is amazing with tokens already on the board, he's pretty bad at defending himself. I think I'll test Lord of Innistrad with the Souls and Kitchen Finks alongside some Gideons or something, but it might just be better to load up on more removal for the aggro part of the sideboard. I hate playing a lot of basic interactive spells in my board, though, because then it just feels like I'm shuffling around slots for a small advantage instead of playing hard-hitting cards.
I'd love to hear anyone's thoughts on this build, or on the new cards in general. So far my testing has only been on Xmage, but I'm going to pick up my Search for Azcantas tomorrow so I should be able to start running this at FNM.
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I'd much rather have Tasigur in my deck than WSZ against combo decks. The deck all ready plays 1 win-condition. Playing another is actually going to add to your combo win %, not detract. If you're saying that because you play 2 Tas instead of 1 WSZ that you drawing that Tas is going to mean you lose because you don't have enough disruption in the deck, I don't have much more to say on the subject because statistical analysis is not even in the conversation and you're tied to presupposition.
Have to agree with Aegraen - If you think you're going to die before turn 7 then adding tasigur helps that match more than hinders it vs other win cons (not vs non-wincons). Maybe not as good as say Clique would, but clique is a much more vulnerable threat.
I understand that the opponent gets the choice of what to give you, but if you've played the card you will know that it's not usually a super easy decision for your opponent. Sometimes they give you back a tasigur, but that can only happen once if you only run 2 and won't happen most of the time. Take a look at your list, imagine the worst non-land card in your deck, and imagine drawing that every turn you have an extra 4 Mana. It's way better than Azure Mage, c'mon.
Edit:
Tas is worse than WSZ because you're forced to commit to him on your turn. He's rarely going to be B for us, and when he is that means we've either eaten a lot of fetches or we've removed snap targets - both of which removes Logic Knot fuel.
Is playing mana leak stronger than logic Knot? Maybe, but not in a deck that aims to hit turn 6 pretty reliably.
Like I said, Tas changes the fundamental design of the deck to a faster deck with protection rather than disruption.
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You keep saying it, but it's just not true. Yes, to optimize him it means changing some cards around, but it doesn't change the draw-go nature of the deck. A card like Opt is imminently playable for the deck. Between Opt/Fetches a Thought Scour or two (which actually does synergize pretty well with the deck), etc. and voiola - it's actually not changing your disruption count (you can play a little less "disruption" and still find as many or more with increased selection - Miracles never had too much trouble finding answers, and the deck played A TON less than any Modern control deck for instance). You can shave some lands because of increased selection/cantrips. WSZ and Tas each have their pros and cons - it's not a sin to admit that Tas is better against combo decks, because he is. WSZ is better against attrition and other control decks (assuming you can ever get it to resolve).
Again, I'm still kind of unsure why people think that cantrips inherently synergize well with this deck. IMO, they absolutely do not. They are not answers, they are not lands (we need a critical mass for X-spells), they are not card advantage, and they are not a wincon.
The nature of magic in general kind of demands decks like this to have appropriate answers at appropriate times, and thus cantrips can be a necessary evil, but they are not inherently synergistic.
Also, the major problem with tasigur being better against combo decks is this: Its pretty ballsy to play tasigur as your only wincon (excluding colonnades). Obviously doable, but risky. Meaning if you're playing tasigurs, you're potentially playing them in addition to wsz/secure (probably secure), which means you have to cut something. So then you potentially are worse against combo decks, because you have less disruption, or if you do cut other wincons, you are (IMO, incorrectly) on the "beat down with some disruption" plan, which is much more befitting of a tempo deck than a draw-go deck.
By all means craft a tasigur list and test it, but I think people are right to be skeptical as the addition/change is not as harmless as it might seem at a glance.
* Esper Draw-Go
* Tezzeret Whir
* Blue Tron
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* Esper Draw-Go
* Tezzeret Whir
* Blue Tron
The only thing I dislike is on the draw against Tron. GQ is one of the few ways to stay in the game against nat Tron, and I'd hate to lose that game play just to have an extra mana. On the other hand, T2 counter spell on nat Tron t3 into Fields of Ruin and keep a Plains up? That sounds solid
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Im going to try replacing my single shadow of doubt with search for azcanta and my single gq with field and just see how it goes. I cut my second shadow and one land for two opts as well. Lets me experiment with all 3 new ixalan cards without reinventing the deck
On search for azcanta - I'm having some mediocre results so far. I am just not sure when the deck actually needs this effect. In the early game I can't flip it and/or wouldn't be able to blow mana on the effect anyways. In the mid game I would generally be casting an esper charm or think twice or a small rev anyways so doing this instead is okay - but I still have those other cards in hand - so its kind of moot? And late game is probably the worst because at this point I have probably won the game anyways and am just going through the motions. Reving for 6 and drawing this does not exactly excite me.
In sum - azcanta is repeatable card draw/card advantage in a deck that is already pretty heavily stacked with cantrips and card draw so the effect feels pretty redundant to me. We can't actually cut the other cantrips/card draw and replace with azcanta because its not as reliable - we need the GY stocked, a window to pay 1U at sorcery, and for it to not get quarter/tec edge/seas'd (which would be very bad for us if we were counting on it).
I consider trading 1 think twice for an azcanta to be a harmless swap but I have yet to see the game where I flip a search and feel like it mattered. Maybe that moment is still coming
* Esper Draw-Go
* Tezzeret Whir
* Blue Tron
* Esper Draw-Go
* Tezzeret Whir
* Blue Tron
Yea, I ran some basic hypergeometric calculations - you're roughly 95% to hit at least 1 spell, and about 70% to have options between spells.
If you just consider and compare the structure to Jeskai control circa 2015, we have most of the same tools available.
bolt->push
path->path
snap->snap
electrolyze->esper charm
remand->remand
mana leak->logic knot
cryptic->cryptic
lightning helix->blessed alliance
serum visions->opt
I don't think it's the same as current draw-go lists (certainly not decks styled in a similar manner to my current and probably outdated build), but I think it might actually be very good.
Something along these lines: Not "proactive" per-se, but much more *aggressive* than most builds. I know at some point I'll take this list, or something similar, out for a spin. Probably with a better mana base, but i'm on mobile atm and don't have my tools. Obviously not the greatest against spell-based decks, but most of the format is playing to the board right now, and the sideboard options in esper are good against anything.
4 path to exile
4 fatal push
4 snapcaster mage
3 remand
2 logic knot
2 blessed alliance
2 supreme verdict
3 cryptic command
3 torrential gearhulk
2 academy ruins
2 Creeping Tar Pit
4 flooded strand
4 polluted delta
2 watery grave
2 hallowed fountain
1 godless shrine
2 island
1 plains
1 swamp
2 glacial fortress
2 drowned catacomb
Yes, I am a local area mod.WELP. GOOD LIFE CHANGES ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE AND SOME ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVEPrimary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
* Esper Draw-Go
* Tezzeret Whir
* Blue Tron
I mean, it's better to have ECharm against a lot of opponents than to have rando burn spells. Like, I get that Bolt/Helix/Elzye is a plan, but ECharm by itself destroys combo and really helps in the Tron/Shift matchups.
I'm NOT sold on 3 mainboard Gearhulks tho, amalek0. Even with Academy Ruins.
UWB Esper Draw-Go Control (clicky)
UW Azorius Control (clicky)
Currently pursuing a degree in Biochemistry.
EDH: I've decided I don't like multiplayer formats.
Anyways I'm toying with this list currently
I've liked it so far, but it has a small sample size of matches under it's belt currently. The WSZ should most likely just be a Secure the Wastes. I feel like I'm missing Spell Snare a bit often, so I might look into adding one into my list somewhere. I'm still uncertain on the anticipates, but they performed reasonably well so far. I definitely like them better than Serum Visions currently, but I'm not opposed to playing serum visions at times.
I haven't been able to test the ceremonius rejections. I'm tempted to make one of those a spell snare though specifically because it still hits turn 2 chalice on the draw and has applications in other match ups like the blue mirrors.
Notables from the list:
I was excited to test with the new cards from Ixalan, and even more excited when my new build seemed to be very strong, so I thought I should share what I came up with. Below is the version of the new build that I've played with the most; earlier versions were 1-2 cards off this 60 and had a more traditional sideboard.
4 Opt
4 Serum Visions
2 Remand
Removal: 10
4 Path to Exile
3 Fatal Push
3 Supreme Verdict
Countermagic: 6
3 Logic Knot
3 Cryptic Command
Card Advantage: 10
3 Snapcaster Mage
2 Search for Azcanta
4 Esper Charm
1 Sphinx's Revelation
1 Secure the Wastes
1 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
Lands: 22
4 Flooded Strand
4 Polluted Delta
1 Marsh Flats
2 Hallowed Fountain
1 Watery Grave
3 Island
2 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Glacial Fortress
2 Drowned Catacomb
2 Engineered Explosives
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Thoughtseize
2 Negate
1 Celestial Purge
3 Lingering Souls
2 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
1 Cast Out
The Theory:
My plan with this list was to see what would happen if I fully committed to the Turbo Xerox plan without sacrificing too much late game power. To do that I lowered the land count significantly, and removed all the Colonnades. The only MU where I really wanted them was Death's Shadow, which was already favorable, and in situations where I needed to cantrip early to hit land drops I thought they would be a liability. To make up for the loss of the back-up wincon, I added Elspeth to the main to ensure at least two different but powerful wincons outside of the flimsy Snapcasters. Cutting Think Twice was another risky move, but I thought that it would be necessary with the addition of all the other cantrips, and that those same cantrips - along with the reduced land count - would provide the card quality to make up for it (ie, why run TT when I can have more effective Esper Charms by making the deck smaller). I went down to one Rev because of the lower land count and because Search for Azcanta could also provide game ending CA without the huge investment up front.
Previously I had found the most success with a mostly Blue/White sideboard focused around hate enchantments and other "lock" pieces like Baneslayer Angel, with Cliques and cheap interaction like Dispel as support. Because Search for Azcanta required me to have a graveyard, I knew I couldn't run Rest in Peace, and so instead I built my sideboard to make better use of Surgical Extraction. The Souls/Sorin package is something I always liked in theory as a way to provide board control and lifegain without going all in on an easily removed creature. It had tested lukewarm in the past, but I thought that the more low-to-the-ground nature of this deck might be a better fit.
The Results:
I was very surprised when this list provided late game power matching and sometimes surpassing previous Esper lists, while having an improved early game due to the card selection and cheap interaction. The card that most over-performed was easily Search for Azcanta. The front half contributes to the critical mass of card selection, and with all the cantrips and fetches it flips easily, even through several Logic Knots. The CA it provides takes over the game more reliably than an average Rev, as it always draws gas (instead of occasionally "wiffing" into 3 lands and a removal spell) and it just keeps churning out cards the longer you stay alive. In awkward situations (like digging for a Cryptic to bounce a PW that's about to ult) a few activations of Azcanta will usually turn up an answer. Even without it though, the density of card selection often allowed me to "go off" by chaining Esper Charms and Snaps into one of the big spells. Overall I feel the deck more reliably reaches that late-game stage of having 15-20 cards in your deck and a full grip, where you can pretty much answer anything given a turn or two of digging though your deck.
However, there's a few drawbacks I've noticed with the Xerox engine. You're more vulnerable to grave hate and land destruction, especially now that there's no Colonnades to draw GQ activations. Chalice on one out of Eldrazi Tron is also a huge pain, where before it could be played through reasonably (although I've won both matchups I've played against ETron so far, it still feels like a miracle). Without Think Twice to bin for value and grind out CA, you can be weaker in grindy MUs unless you get Azcanta going or dig into one of the big spells. This is similar to the problem old lists would have with randomly flooding out. Supporting so many mana and color intensive spells puts a huge strain on a 22 land manabase, so there's really no option to run any utility lands (which sucks because I think Field of Ruin is perfect for Esper). I think this will also make the the UW "mirror" a lot tougher, as a smart player will easily kill our Azcantas and cut us off black, but the one time I played the matchup I was ahead both games until I threw them to stupid misplays.
Going Forward:
The only card I've been unhappy with in the maindeck is Remand. On paper it's the perfect card for its slot (a cantrip that also provides some cheap interaction) but it feels horrible in the meta right now; I constantly find myself holding it up only to counter nothing and screw up my curve, or firing it off at one mana spells just to get it out of my hand. I'm going to test Shadow of Doubt and Censor, but the correct move might be to bring back 2-3 Think Twice, and maybe trim a Push or a Serum Visions to make room.
The Token Package in the sideboard has been great sometimes and terrible other times. I might be boarding it in against the wrong decks, though. It's been tight against Affinity and "small" aggro like Humans and Goblins/8Whack, but against Company decks or BGx decks that can more easily fight through, it might be better to just keep my Cryptics and what not in. The other problem is that while Sorin, Solemn Visitor is amazing with tokens already on the board, he's pretty bad at defending himself. I think I'll test Lord of Innistrad with the Souls and Kitchen Finks alongside some Gideons or something, but it might just be better to load up on more removal for the aggro part of the sideboard. I hate playing a lot of basic interactive spells in my board, though, because then it just feels like I'm shuffling around slots for a small advantage instead of playing hard-hitting cards.
I'd love to hear anyone's thoughts on this build, or on the new cards in general. So far my testing has only been on Xmage, but I'm going to pick up my Search for Azcantas tomorrow so I should be able to start running this at FNM.