Not running the Loxodon Smiters and Dromoka's Command maindeck really eases up the mana base quite a bit. I wanted to give MD Linvala a test after seeing lots of Affinity and some Elves, Company, and Twin decks at my last tournament. I'm not sure it's better than a Restoration Angel or second Eternal Witness. I may also still be sore by how badly I was beat by Elves
I'm thinking my Sideboard may be a little weak to Grixis Delver which is easily the most prevalent deck in my meta. Advice?
Playing millions of cards every turn... Slowly and systematically obliterating any chance my opponent has of winning... Clicking the multitude of locking mechanisms into place... Not even trying to win myself until turn 10+ once I have nigh absolute control... Watching my opponent desperately trying to navigate the labyrinthine prison that I've constructed... Seeing the light of hope fade and ultimately extinguished in an excruciatingly slow manner... THAT'S fun Magic.
We have 2-3 users that are dramatically making this thread incomprehensible and non-productive for anyone else to possibly join in the discussion. This needs to change.
Every time I see [ktkenshinx] post in here, I get the impression of a stern dad walking in on a bunch of kids trying to do something dumb and just shaking his head in disappointment.
Near Mint: The same as Slightly Played, but we threw some Altoids in the box we stored it in to cover up the scent of dead mice. Slightly Played: The base condition for all MTG cards. This card looks OK, but there’s one minor annoying ding in it that will always irritate and distract you whenever you draw it. Moderately Played: This card looks like it survived the Tet Offensive tucked inside the waistband of GI underwear. It may smell like it, too. Heavily Played: This card looks like the remains of Mohammed Atta’s passport after 9/11. It may be playable if you double-sleeve it to stop the chunks from falling out. The condition formerly known as "Washing Machine Grade" Damaged: This card is the unfortunate victim of a Mirrorweave/March of the Machines/Chaos Confetti/Mindslaver combo.
[M]aking counterfeit cards is the absolute height of dishonesty. Ask yourself this question: Since most people...are totally cool with the use of proxies...what purpose do [high] quality counterfeit cards serve?
Meddling mage works very well with Gitaxian probe and vendilion clique to allow you to look at their hand.
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My Modern decks: Death and Taxes, Hatebears, Well Oiled Machine, Merfolk, Nyx Wave, Soul Sisters, Stompy, Matyr Proc, Naya Zoo, Robots (I refuse to call it affinity!), Bogles, Kiki Chord
@inscho:
Hey man. When a list looks a lot like mine, I tend to like it xP.
But as far as SB, it seems like not many decks run enchantment hate. I'd give mark of asylum a shot. Also, what's revoker for? I've always felt like it didn't pull nearly as much weight in modern as in legacy.
MD: I believe 23 is the right number. Even in GW. Also, I'd swap a canopy for a tectonic. You really need those against decks like tron and the lifeloss from the 3rd canopy is gonna hurt. I'm pretty sure 2 is the right amount for canopy in any given version of D&T.
@inscho:
Hey man. When a list looks a lot like mine, I tend to like it xP.
But as far as SB, it seems like not many decks run enchantment hate. I'd give mark of asylum a shot. Also, what's revoker for? I've always felt like it didn't pull nearly as much weight in modern as in legacy.
MD: I believe 23 is the right number. Even in GW. Also, I'd swap a canopy for a tectonic. You really need those against decks like tron and the lifeloss from the 3rd canopy is gonna hurt. I'm pretty sure 2 is the right amount for canopy in any given version of D&T.
Revoker is theoretically for elves, affinity, company, and tron. It's not the most flexible sideboard card I admit.
I thought about mark of asylum, but against URx don't you want to keep company in? That's why I slotted burrenton instead. I don't doubt that mark is much better though. How many would you run? 2?
I haven't had any issues with 3 canopies so far, but an extra tec-edge would be welcomed. What to cut?
So the biggest issue I see with this is PtE. Essentially, they are going to get a land every time you use it. That's pretty counter-intuitive with taxers even if they are doing good work against a mostly noncreature deck. If that's the direction you want to take the deck, you absolutely need some other form of removal. Personally, I don't think 4 wingmare is the way to go at all.
I disagree with this, i've been running a build with 4 wingmare/ 4 thalia/ 3 familiar and it completely halts any sort of combo or control deck. Control decks like having end of turn mana but they don't have the opportunity with all of the taxers being up, so I get to hard cast beaters like Brimaz or Finks all the time because they can't put anything down in fear that the familiar will counter it. Combo decks like Tron decks are also at our whim because in between destroying their lands, we are keeping them from casting their search cards until it is way too late. Plus wingmare is a flyer and that evasion is big!
I think it all depends on what your build is going for and what your splash means to the deck, but for me running mono w it's all about mana/combo disruption and vial/flickerwisp tricks all day long. There is a very simple deck that runs mono w that has gone 3-1 and 4-0 that costs 100 tickets or less because it is very simplistic in its goals and sticks too them. One of the worst things we can do with the D&T archtype is bring it too much into the hatebear scenario because that deck is trying to accomplish a different strategy in winning.
And Arbiter is pretty much the engine that makes this deck run, it keeps PTE from having any upside to the opponent while decimating a lot of decks that rely on searching for mana/wincons. I can understand siding him out but I can't fathom running any less than 4 of.
This deck is also very impressive on the sideboard also because white is probably the most versatile color when it comes to answers.
Trying to rank if WG, WB, or Mono-white is stronger/better is pretty pointless because it is so dependent on the build and the meta. Each have their strengths and weaknesses and all of them have put up results.
WR and WU are still pretty much untested with no real results, but obviously have huge potential with key cards that add to the D&T strategy.
I personally prefer monowhite but have also played the green and blue splashes as well. And like I said above, there are many, many variations within each color group. For example, I have started running what I call "Big" D&T. I don't play any one drops besides vial, and instead add 1-2 extra lands and play extra four drops. The midrange power it gives against many decks (including the mirror match) has been impressive.
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My Modern decks: Death and Taxes, Hatebears, Well Oiled Machine, Merfolk, Nyx Wave, Soul Sisters, Stompy, Matyr Proc, Naya Zoo, Robots (I refuse to call it affinity!), Bogles, Kiki Chord
I agree with calvinNhobbes about the variation between builds, and their utility in each meta.
I've played monoW, WU, WG, and Bant D&T. In my meta, WG and monoW have worked out the best, with an honorable mention going to Bant. WU underperformed, most because it didn't have as many taxing elements. The most consistent manabase was WG, followed by Bant. That's not intuitive, because one would expect that monoW would be more reliable.
I've given some serious thought to other atypical builds, including American (WUR) and Junk (WGB) lists. And although I think there is some untapped power in either an American, or a WR combo list, I'm sure that both of those lists would be matchup and meta dependent.
I think that this deck is one of the hardest to build and pilot properly in Modern. It requires an extensive knowledge of the metagame, and there are so many flex slots that no two decks look alike. The best thing that we can do, is pretty much the same thing that we already do, which is to share our knowledge and experiences, and to give other Modern D&T players access to lines of play that they didn't know they had.
Playing millions of cards every turn... Slowly and systematically obliterating any chance my opponent has of winning... Clicking the multitude of locking mechanisms into place... Not even trying to win myself until turn 10+ once I have nigh absolute control... Watching my opponent desperately trying to navigate the labyrinthine prison that I've constructed... Seeing the light of hope fade and ultimately extinguished in an excruciatingly slow manner... THAT'S fun Magic.
We have 2-3 users that are dramatically making this thread incomprehensible and non-productive for anyone else to possibly join in the discussion. This needs to change.
Every time I see [ktkenshinx] post in here, I get the impression of a stern dad walking in on a bunch of kids trying to do something dumb and just shaking his head in disappointment.
Near Mint: The same as Slightly Played, but we threw some Altoids in the box we stored it in to cover up the scent of dead mice. Slightly Played: The base condition for all MTG cards. This card looks OK, but there’s one minor annoying ding in it that will always irritate and distract you whenever you draw it. Moderately Played: This card looks like it survived the Tet Offensive tucked inside the waistband of GI underwear. It may smell like it, too. Heavily Played: This card looks like the remains of Mohammed Atta’s passport after 9/11. It may be playable if you double-sleeve it to stop the chunks from falling out. The condition formerly known as "Washing Machine Grade" Damaged: This card is the unfortunate victim of a Mirrorweave/March of the Machines/Chaos Confetti/Mindslaver combo.
[M]aking counterfeit cards is the absolute height of dishonesty. Ask yourself this question: Since most people...are totally cool with the use of proxies...what purpose do [high] quality counterfeit cards serve?
Regarding Arbiter (and mindcensor to an extent), stripmine is banned in legacy and restricted in vintage for a reason. Being able to make our ghostquarters into strip mines should not be underestimated. It is one of the most powerful things we can do.
EDIT: I want to echo CharonsObol. Death and Taxes is an extremely interactive deck (both directly and indirectly) in a metagame filled with mostly linear aggro and combo decks. This makes it very difficult to play and play against. Like many decks in modern, the most important part is pilot skill and familiarity with the deck (and metagame) and not necessarily the exact list of cards. Nothing is better than your opponent sitting there doing all the tax math in their head, finally making a play and half way through realizing they still miscalculated!
My Modern decks: Death and Taxes, Hatebears, Well Oiled Machine, Merfolk, Nyx Wave, Soul Sisters, Stompy, Matyr Proc, Naya Zoo, Robots (I refuse to call it affinity!), Bogles, Kiki Chord
So the biggest issue I see with this is PtE. Essentially, they are going to get a land every time you use it. That's pretty counter-intuitive with taxers even if they are doing good work against a mostly noncreature deck. If that's the direction you want to take the deck, you absolutely need some other form of removal. Personally, I don't think 4 wingmare is the way to go at all.
I disagree with this, i've been running a build with 4 wingmare/ 4 thalia/ 3 familiar and it completely halts any sort of combo or control deck. Control decks like having end of turn mana but they don't have the opportunity with all of the taxers being up, so I get to hard cast beaters like Brimaz or Finks all the time because they can't put anything down in fear that the familiar will counter it. Combo decks like Tron decks are also at our whim because in between destroying their lands, we are keeping them from casting their search cards until it is way too late. Plus wingmare is a flyer and that evasion is big!
I think it all depends on what your build is going for and what your splash means to the deck, but for me running mono w it's all about mana/combo disruption and vial/flickerwisp tricks all day long. There is a very simple deck that runs mono w that has gone 3-1 and 4-0 that costs 100 tickets or less because it is very simplistic in its goals and sticks too them. One of the worst things we can do with the D&T archtype is bring it too much into the hatebear scenario because that deck is trying to accomplish a different strategy in winning.
And Arbiter is pretty much the engine that makes this deck run, it keeps PTE from having any upside to the opponent while decimating a lot of decks that rely on searching for mana/wincons. I can understand siding him out but I can't fathom running any less than 4 of.
This deck is also very impressive on the sideboard also because white is probably the most versatile color when it comes to answers.
Creature are going to destroy you with that sort of build. Sure you're great against grixis, but you will absolutely be trashed by elves (a lot of us are, so maybe that's not the best example, but you get my point). Really what I was saying was in regards to him not running arbiter. It's a very different story with arbiter's tax.
Trying to rank if WG, WB, or Mono-white is stronger/better is pretty pointless because it is so dependent on the build and the meta. Each have their strengths and weaknesses and all of them have put up results.
WR and WU are still pretty much untested with no real results, but obviously have huge potential with key cards that add to the D&T strategy.
I personally prefer monowhite but have also played the green and blue splashes as well. And like I said above, there are many, many variations within each color group. For example, I have started running what I call "Big" D&T. I don't play any one drops besides vial, and instead add 1-2 extra lands and play extra four drops. The midrange power it gives against many decks (including the mirror match) has been impressive.
(also @Charons) I agree that the meta does heavily change which version feels right, but consistency is really important. Also there very much has been testing in WU and I think WR too. I personally have does extensive testing in WU and there was a fair bit on WU in the previous version of this forum. I believe this is true of WR as well for the previous version. Also, LtGlitter I believe has done quite a bit in WR.
More so @Charons
tri color D&T is usually considered less competitive. I assume Bant had decent consistency in no small part due to noble hierarch and the like. I know Metalsomething (I forget his full name) did a lot of Junk D&T. However, I'm not aware of a ton of results with tricolor D&T. I may have asked you this before, but what do you think the main weakness to tri color D&T is? Just land consistency?
@inscho:
Hey man. When a list looks a lot like mine, I tend to like it xP.
But as far as SB, it seems like not many decks run enchantment hate. I'd give mark of asylum a shot. Also, what's revoker for? I've always felt like it didn't pull nearly as much weight in modern as in legacy.
MD: I believe 23 is the right number. Even in GW. Also, I'd swap a canopy for a tectonic. You really need those against decks like tron and the lifeloss from the 3rd canopy is gonna hurt. I'm pretty sure 2 is the right amount for canopy in any given version of D&T.
Revoker is theoretically for elves, affinity, company, and tron. It's not the most flexible sideboard card I admit.
I thought about mark of asylum, but against URx don't you want to keep company in? That's why I slotted burrenton instead. I don't doubt that mark is much better though. How many would you run? 2?
I haven't had any issues with 3 canopies so far, but an extra tec-edge would be welcomed. What to cut?
Hmm... I'm just not sure on revoker. I might prefer pithing needle, but even so that might not be the most desired effect.
I get that. That was one of the issue I was running into with my GW in that I had too many nonland cards in the SB. Sometimes I did side out Company, but it is nice to keep in. However, you can still keep it in as long as you have a certain amount of creatures. I'm trying to remember, 24 (3 cmc or below of course)? I might keep the forge tenders and do 1 mark? Not sure. I've only recently started testing mark recently. Side note: I am never dissapointed by having 2 spellskite in the board. Some even like it main.
If you want to keep 22 lands, you could cut a gavony. If you keep the 2, I definitely would want 23 lands. If you need to cut a card...maybe Brimaz? He isn't necessary and I'd rather have finks as a 2 of than a one of, but I could see cutting a finks instead if King Kitty is good in your meta.
I am testing revoker right now and it's "better" than before. Still testing, so I'm not certain yet. I'm actually a fan of what he's done for me so far. The games that he's vanilla are also games where the removed cards are just as vanilla. Only major downside Ive seen so far is his inability to fly. He's pretty good against decks using birds/hierarchs/ etc because it's the equivalent to arbiter against them.
I really liked revoker back in the day when deathrite shaman ruled the meta. Was good against all of Pods manadorks too.
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My Modern decks: Death and Taxes, Hatebears, Well Oiled Machine, Merfolk, Nyx Wave, Soul Sisters, Stompy, Matyr Proc, Naya Zoo, Robots (I refuse to call it affinity!), Bogles, Kiki Chord
After working on and acquiring the necessary cards for the deck, I have found out that the bigger decks in the meta that I am about to enter is full of Merfolk and Tron. What are the cards I should sideboard if this is the case, and what are some recommendations for the main deck here.
2x Aven Mindcensor
3x Blade Splicer
1x Brimaz, King of Oreskos
1x Eternal Witness
4x Flickerwisp
2x Kitchen Finks
4x Leonin Arbiter
1x Linvala, Keeper of Silence
4x Noble Hierarch
2x Qasali Pridemage
1x Scavenging Ooze
3x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4x AEther Vial
Instant (6)
2x Collected Company
4x Path to Exile
Land (22)
1x Eiganjo Castle
1x Forest
2x Gavony Township
4x Ghost Quarter
3x Horizon Canopy
2x Plains
4x Razorverge Thicket
1x Tectonic Edge
4x Temple Garden
1x Dromoka's Command
2x Engineered Explosives
1x Celestial Purge
2x Burrenton Forge-Tender
2x Mirran Crusader
2x Phyrexian Revoker
2x Rest in Peace
1x Spellskite
2x Stony Silence
Not running the Loxodon Smiters and Dromoka's Command maindeck really eases up the mana base quite a bit. I wanted to give MD Linvala a test after seeing lots of Affinity and some Elves, Company, and Twin decks at my last tournament. I'm not sure it's better than a Restoration Angel or second Eternal Witness. I may also still be sore by how badly I was beat by Elves
I'm thinking my Sideboard may be a little weak to Grixis Delver which is easily the most prevalent deck in my meta. Advice?
GW Death and Taxes WG
Geist of saint traft, glen elendra archmage, vendilion clique, kira, great glass-spinner, minamo, school at water's edge with mangara of corondor, snapcaster mage, lyev skyknight, harbinger of the tides, momentary blink, venser, shaper savant.
I sighed when I read this. Yes, there are plenty of cards worth playing in the blue splash.
This was the best thing that I've read all day. LtGlitter, you're my hero.
WUDeath&TaxesWG
Legacy
UBRGDredgeUBRG
UHigh TideU
URGLandsURG
WR Card Choice List
WUR American D&T
WUB Esper D&T
The Reserved List
Heat Maps
Hey man. When a list looks a lot like mine, I tend to like it xP.
But as far as SB, it seems like not many decks run enchantment hate. I'd give mark of asylum a shot. Also, what's revoker for? I've always felt like it didn't pull nearly as much weight in modern as in legacy.
MD: I believe 23 is the right number. Even in GW. Also, I'd swap a canopy for a tectonic. You really need those against decks like tron and the lifeloss from the 3rd canopy is gonna hurt. I'm pretty sure 2 is the right amount for canopy in any given version of D&T.
4 tectonic edge
4 ghost quarter
2 sea gate wreckage
2 horizon canopy
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Eiganjo Castle
9 Plains
8 non creature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 blade splicer
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sundering Growth
2 Plains
1 Forest
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Temple Garden
2 Brushland
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Ghost Quarter
2 stirring wildwood
2 Gavony Township
1 tectonic edge
1 gemstone caverns
10 noncreature spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Aether Vial
2 Collected Company
28 creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Spellskite
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Flickerwisp
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Courser of Kruphix
1 Eternal Witness
1 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Restoration Angel
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
1 Shambling Vent
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Plains
1 Gemstone Caverns
8 Noncreature Spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Spellskite
2 Selfless Spirit
3 Wasteland Strangler
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sin Collector
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Worship
3 Brushland
3 Eldrazi Temple
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
3 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
10 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Path to exile
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Leonin Arbiter
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Spellskite
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Eternal Witness
4 Thought-knot seer
2 Reality Smasher
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Worship
1 Spellskite
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
4 Seachrome Coast
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Mutavault
1 Island
2 Plains
2 Horizon Canopy
1 adarkar wastes
1 flooded strand
9 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 detention sphere
28 creatures
3 Spell Queller
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 eldrazi displacer
3 Reflector Mage
4 Flickerwisp
2 Phyrexian Revoker
3 leonin arbiter
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
2 spellskite
2 Rest in Peace
2 stony silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 ghostly prison
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 Surgical Extraction
1 kira, great glass-spinner
1 blessed alliance
Revoker is theoretically for elves, affinity, company, and tron. It's not the most flexible sideboard card I admit.
I thought about mark of asylum, but against URx don't you want to keep company in? That's why I slotted burrenton instead. I don't doubt that mark is much better though. How many would you run? 2?
I haven't had any issues with 3 canopies so far, but an extra tec-edge would be welcomed. What to cut?
I disagree with this, i've been running a build with 4 wingmare/ 4 thalia/ 3 familiar and it completely halts any sort of combo or control deck. Control decks like having end of turn mana but they don't have the opportunity with all of the taxers being up, so I get to hard cast beaters like Brimaz or Finks all the time because they can't put anything down in fear that the familiar will counter it. Combo decks like Tron decks are also at our whim because in between destroying their lands, we are keeping them from casting their search cards until it is way too late. Plus wingmare is a flyer and that evasion is big!
I think it all depends on what your build is going for and what your splash means to the deck, but for me running mono w it's all about mana/combo disruption and vial/flickerwisp tricks all day long. There is a very simple deck that runs mono w that has gone 3-1 and 4-0 that costs 100 tickets or less because it is very simplistic in its goals and sticks too them. One of the worst things we can do with the D&T archtype is bring it too much into the hatebear scenario because that deck is trying to accomplish a different strategy in winning.
And Arbiter is pretty much the engine that makes this deck run, it keeps PTE from having any upside to the opponent while decimating a lot of decks that rely on searching for mana/wincons. I can understand siding him out but I can't fathom running any less than 4 of.
This deck is also very impressive on the sideboard also because white is probably the most versatile color when it comes to answers.
WR and WU are still pretty much untested with no real results, but obviously have huge potential with key cards that add to the D&T strategy.
I personally prefer monowhite but have also played the green and blue splashes as well. And like I said above, there are many, many variations within each color group. For example, I have started running what I call "Big" D&T. I don't play any one drops besides vial, and instead add 1-2 extra lands and play extra four drops. The midrange power it gives against many decks (including the mirror match) has been impressive.
I've played monoW, WU, WG, and Bant D&T. In my meta, WG and monoW have worked out the best, with an honorable mention going to Bant. WU underperformed, most because it didn't have as many taxing elements. The most consistent manabase was WG, followed by Bant. That's not intuitive, because one would expect that monoW would be more reliable.
I've given some serious thought to other atypical builds, including American (WUR) and Junk (WGB) lists. And although I think there is some untapped power in either an American, or a WR combo list, I'm sure that both of those lists would be matchup and meta dependent.
I think that this deck is one of the hardest to build and pilot properly in Modern. It requires an extensive knowledge of the metagame, and there are so many flex slots that no two decks look alike. The best thing that we can do, is pretty much the same thing that we already do, which is to share our knowledge and experiences, and to give other Modern D&T players access to lines of play that they didn't know they had.
WUDeath&TaxesWG
Legacy
UBRGDredgeUBRG
UHigh TideU
URGLandsURG
WR Card Choice List
WUR American D&T
WUB Esper D&T
The Reserved List
Heat Maps
WWModern Death And Taxes (w/ Militia Bugler) (JUL '19)
GWModern Maverick (JUL '19)
WBCatmix on Twitch!
WWCatmix on Youtube
EDIT: I want to echo CharonsObol. Death and Taxes is an extremely interactive deck (both directly and indirectly) in a metagame filled with mostly linear aggro and combo decks. This makes it very difficult to play and play against. Like many decks in modern, the most important part is pilot skill and familiarity with the deck (and metagame) and not necessarily the exact list of cards. Nothing is better than your opponent sitting there doing all the tax math in their head, finally making a play and half way through realizing they still miscalculated!
Creature are going to destroy you with that sort of build. Sure you're great against grixis, but you will absolutely be trashed by elves (a lot of us are, so maybe that's not the best example, but you get my point). Really what I was saying was in regards to him not running arbiter. It's a very different story with arbiter's tax.
4 tectonic edge
4 ghost quarter
2 sea gate wreckage
2 horizon canopy
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Eiganjo Castle
9 Plains
8 non creature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 blade splicer
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sundering Growth
2 Plains
1 Forest
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Temple Garden
2 Brushland
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Ghost Quarter
2 stirring wildwood
2 Gavony Township
1 tectonic edge
1 gemstone caverns
10 noncreature spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Aether Vial
2 Collected Company
28 creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Spellskite
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Flickerwisp
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Courser of Kruphix
1 Eternal Witness
1 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Restoration Angel
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
1 Shambling Vent
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Plains
1 Gemstone Caverns
8 Noncreature Spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Spellskite
2 Selfless Spirit
3 Wasteland Strangler
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sin Collector
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Worship
3 Brushland
3 Eldrazi Temple
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
3 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
10 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Path to exile
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Leonin Arbiter
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Spellskite
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Eternal Witness
4 Thought-knot seer
2 Reality Smasher
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Worship
1 Spellskite
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
4 Seachrome Coast
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Mutavault
1 Island
2 Plains
2 Horizon Canopy
1 adarkar wastes
1 flooded strand
9 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 detention sphere
28 creatures
3 Spell Queller
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 eldrazi displacer
3 Reflector Mage
4 Flickerwisp
2 Phyrexian Revoker
3 leonin arbiter
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
2 spellskite
2 Rest in Peace
2 stony silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 ghostly prison
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 Surgical Extraction
1 kira, great glass-spinner
1 blessed alliance
(also @Charons) I agree that the meta does heavily change which version feels right, but consistency is really important. Also there very much has been testing in WU and I think WR too. I personally have does extensive testing in WU and there was a fair bit on WU in the previous version of this forum. I believe this is true of WR as well for the previous version. Also, LtGlitter I believe has done quite a bit in WR.
More so @Charons
tri color D&T is usually considered less competitive. I assume Bant had decent consistency in no small part due to noble hierarch and the like. I know Metalsomething (I forget his full name) did a lot of Junk D&T. However, I'm not aware of a ton of results with tricolor D&T. I may have asked you this before, but what do you think the main weakness to tri color D&T is? Just land consistency?
4 tectonic edge
4 ghost quarter
2 sea gate wreckage
2 horizon canopy
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Eiganjo Castle
9 Plains
8 non creature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 blade splicer
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sundering Growth
2 Plains
1 Forest
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Temple Garden
2 Brushland
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Ghost Quarter
2 stirring wildwood
2 Gavony Township
1 tectonic edge
1 gemstone caverns
10 noncreature spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Aether Vial
2 Collected Company
28 creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Spellskite
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Flickerwisp
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Courser of Kruphix
1 Eternal Witness
1 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Restoration Angel
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
1 Shambling Vent
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Plains
1 Gemstone Caverns
8 Noncreature Spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Spellskite
2 Selfless Spirit
3 Wasteland Strangler
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sin Collector
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Worship
3 Brushland
3 Eldrazi Temple
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
3 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
10 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Path to exile
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Leonin Arbiter
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Spellskite
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Eternal Witness
4 Thought-knot seer
2 Reality Smasher
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Worship
1 Spellskite
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
4 Seachrome Coast
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Mutavault
1 Island
2 Plains
2 Horizon Canopy
1 adarkar wastes
1 flooded strand
9 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 detention sphere
28 creatures
3 Spell Queller
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 eldrazi displacer
3 Reflector Mage
4 Flickerwisp
2 Phyrexian Revoker
3 leonin arbiter
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
2 spellskite
2 Rest in Peace
2 stony silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 ghostly prison
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 Surgical Extraction
1 kira, great glass-spinner
1 blessed alliance
Hmm... I'm just not sure on revoker. I might prefer pithing needle, but even so that might not be the most desired effect.
I get that. That was one of the issue I was running into with my GW in that I had too many nonland cards in the SB. Sometimes I did side out Company, but it is nice to keep in. However, you can still keep it in as long as you have a certain amount of creatures. I'm trying to remember, 24 (3 cmc or below of course)? I might keep the forge tenders and do 1 mark? Not sure. I've only recently started testing mark recently. Side note: I am never dissapointed by having 2 spellskite in the board. Some even like it main.
If you want to keep 22 lands, you could cut a gavony. If you keep the 2, I definitely would want 23 lands. If you need to cut a card...maybe Brimaz? He isn't necessary and I'd rather have finks as a 2 of than a one of, but I could see cutting a finks instead if King Kitty is good in your meta.
4 tectonic edge
4 ghost quarter
2 sea gate wreckage
2 horizon canopy
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Eiganjo Castle
9 Plains
8 non creature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 blade splicer
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sundering Growth
2 Plains
1 Forest
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Temple Garden
2 Brushland
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Ghost Quarter
2 stirring wildwood
2 Gavony Township
1 tectonic edge
1 gemstone caverns
10 noncreature spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Aether Vial
2 Collected Company
28 creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Spellskite
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Flickerwisp
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Courser of Kruphix
1 Eternal Witness
1 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Restoration Angel
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
1 Shambling Vent
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Plains
1 Gemstone Caverns
8 Noncreature Spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Spellskite
2 Selfless Spirit
3 Wasteland Strangler
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sin Collector
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Worship
3 Brushland
3 Eldrazi Temple
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
3 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
10 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Path to exile
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Leonin Arbiter
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Spellskite
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Eternal Witness
4 Thought-knot seer
2 Reality Smasher
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Worship
1 Spellskite
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
4 Seachrome Coast
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Mutavault
1 Island
2 Plains
2 Horizon Canopy
1 adarkar wastes
1 flooded strand
9 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 detention sphere
28 creatures
3 Spell Queller
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 eldrazi displacer
3 Reflector Mage
4 Flickerwisp
2 Phyrexian Revoker
3 leonin arbiter
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
2 spellskite
2 Rest in Peace
2 stony silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 ghostly prison
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 Surgical Extraction
1 kira, great glass-spinner
1 blessed alliance
I reserve the right to be horriy wrong still.
WWModern Death And Taxes (w/ Militia Bugler) (JUL '19)
GWModern Maverick (JUL '19)
WBCatmix on Twitch!
WWCatmix on Youtube
This is what I am looking at currently.
1x Archangel of Tithes
3x Blade Splicer
2x Brimaz, King of Oreskos
1x Dryad Militant
4x Flickerwisp
2x Kytheon, Hero of Akros
4x Leonin Arbiter
1x Linvala, Keeper of Silence
2x Restoration Angel
1x Spellskite
4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2x Vryn Wingmare
1x Dismember
4x Path to Exile
Artifacts
4x AEther Vial
Lands
1x Eiganjo Castle
4x Ghost Quarter
1x Horizon Canopy
15x Plains
3x Tectonic Edge
1x Archangel of Tithes
1x Dismember
3x Kor Firewalker
1x Mark of Asylum
2x Mirran Crusader
2x Rest in Peace
1x Spellskite
2x Stony Silence
2x Sundering Growth
I've been playing 4 of it in my main deck for months!!! MONTHS!!!!