Had a conversation last night about playing a few copies of Geist of Saint traft in this deck. I think I'll be giving him a shot in the sideboard against decks that can't really deal with Geist, maybe the main deck. Not sure yet. He sticks with the idea that 'All your spot removal is bad' though.
Managed to go 3-1 Today at the shop. Beat burn, grixis delver and affinty and lost to suicide zoo. Lost to suicide zoo in the finals. It is a tough matchup so not too worried. Any cards from origins that we care about? I havent seen anything myself
I posted a list, and I ave found them very useful, and don't really miss things like dismember and such, plus there are so many matchups they help in such as Twin, Bogels, Affinity, Anything running Blood Moon, The various B/Gx Decks, Tron a little as well. I personally like the decays alot.
Why aren't four anthems enough? When you're running BB without Hero of Bladehold, a majority of your tokens aren't white for Honor of the Pure to even matter, no?
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If you don't draw an anthem you are hard-pressed to win. Anthems are a core part of this deck's strategy. Anthems are also vulnerable to removal and their abilitied can stack which means that it is beneficial to draw 2 within the span of the game.
Hard-pressed to win what matchups? I would argue that they are most crucial in unfair matchups where you are trying to race. The extra damage just becomes important as you're sometimes limited in how you can interact with combo decks. But against the more fair matchups, I feel like the combination of Vault and the sheer number of tokens that the deck produces, you can leverage these to the point in which you draw an anthem and can begin taking over the game. I haven't posted my list in a while, but assuming that you're looking at Honor of the Pure as the fifth and sixth anthems, I have games where it would be a dead card. Unless there is another anthem I am missing, or you're encouraging that I run Glorious Anthem, or I guess, Spear of Heliod might be just better.
Is Leyline of the Meek worth testing?
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Interesting. 4 Windbrisk Heights with only 21 lands? I play 23 lands and I am going to go down to 3.
I am still not keen on Bitterblossom; 1 life a turn just adds up too fast if you aren't the aggressor. I personally prefer some number of Honor of the Pure since our token makers are all white tokens (with the exception of Sorin tokens).
That's why you have Sorin, Timely, and Vault to gain life back. I don't know about that list. I have no idea how it can run on that few of land, unless it is content with being on two lands for a good part of most games.
I think running Raise the Alarm AND Bitterblossom is a pretty compelling direction to go. I've even been considering cutting a copy of Spectral Procession to do so.
No clue how this deck won a single match. I started testing something similar and can't run on 22 lands and tried 23 and it was just as bad. Blegh. Don't know how folks run less than 24.
I like Raise the Alarm for now. I'm impatient in testing Ajani Goldmane, but I'm going to stick with it.
This is what I'm going to be testing for the rest of the night:
I wonder if Dark Dabbling will be a good sideboard option for us. It can save us from Oblivion stone, Anger of The Gods, Pyroclasm... I love it
Sweet card, I hadnt noticed it before. Besides Tron, I cant think of any matchups where we want it though?
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Quote from Phil
Have a helicopter drop you off out front. Light your cigar with a small Indonesian boy holding a black lotus. Then bust out a craw wurm deck with no sleeves. Raw dog shuffle, loose terribly, flip the table, leave in a hovercraft.
That list makes no sense. If you're curve is topping out at three, you don't need 24 lands. And I have no idea where folks got running extraction effects in the main is a good idea, like pros learned that mistake after Cranial Extraction was in standard. 8Rack doesn't even run Extraction in the main and that could operate as discard for them if it snags something out of their hand. When you have twelve discard effects, what happens when you start topdecking those spells late in the game? And with all of those discard spells going in the graveyard, couldn't you make some room for Murderous Cut, over perhaps two of the Duress?
Do folks that run Liliana like her in the deck? I now have two and am thinking about just throwing them in the sideboard, assuming I bring her in against discard decks. Really looking forward to this deck being well positioned if the bannings slam Amulet. The other day I was able to discard a Grishoalbrand's Through the Breach turn 1, turn 2 Surgical the Breach and cast Rest in Peace for the old turn two win lol.
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I ran my Tokens deck splashing green again at a local modern tourney went 4-0 1st place, small sample size so far but since splashing green fro decays and a township I am 7-1 in matches with this deck, with the 1 loss to Bloom titan which I think is a bad match up for this deck. Anyway a brief summary of the tourney
Round 1 Vs Bogles (2-0) (1-0)
He punted hard game 1, game 2 believe it or not sideboarding 2 smallpoxes was huge against his rancored, armored dude, drop tokens and sorin, virtue gg
Round 2 Restore balance thing (2-0)(2-0)
He mulled to 4 game 1, gg
game 2 I was able to seize him, decay 2 boderposts, while he did balnce away my tokens, holding a lingering souls still, with virtue in play was enough to recover for the win
Round 3 Merfolk (2-1) (3-0)
Game 1 he goes first gets me wit shadow of doubt vials double lord, into lord into master I get crushed
game 2 I decay his t1 vial, virtue out and honor he tries to attack with double cursecatcher,with lord out, I have 5 lands secure the wastes for 2, block blow him out after that as I path lord as well
Game 3 I Abrupt decay a lord at the right time, he wants to counter but can't gets me the win
Round 4 Elves (2-1) (4-0)
Game 1 I mull into a good hand vurtue into spectral, souls, virtue flash, he had a lot of mana dorks and druid, but never hit ezuri or company before I got him
Game 2, he steamrolls me double CC, shrine ezuri
Game 3 I IOK his Ezuri, abrupt the second, persecution several dorks, timley and spectral with virtue wins it.
Abrupt decay was my mvp in almost every match, I'm glad I added these as I feel it gives the deck a lot more game against several decks. And the townsip is useful, I did use it a couple times throught the night it is like an extra anthem on crack and gives you a mana dump in games where flooding a bit could be doom, except now your flyers grow every turn.
Abrupt decay was my mvp in almost every match, I'm glad I added these as I feel it gives the deck a lot more game against several decks. And the townsip is useful, I did use it a couple times throught the night it is like an extra anthem on crack and gives you a mana dump in games where flooding a bit could be doom, except now your flyers grow every turn.
so do you think abrupt decay and green splash is worth the cut of windbrisk heights? and how was Smallpox performing? isn't liliana just better in this slot? (or the white edict that sacrifices an attacking creature - as BB might be sometimes a problem without at least 2-3 filterlands).
I'm not the biggest advocate of Heights, I have always felt to cost of it coming into play tapped when you really needed an untapped land outweighed the times when it was great since half those times or more it was a win more cards for me, but yes it also can do some great things for the deck, That being said I have found the utility of AD and Township to just be way more consistently useful with almost no drawback ever. As far as smallpox that is an experiment in the sideboard I just tried this week to help against bloom titan and Tron mostly, however it happen to also serve a purpose against boggles, is lily a stronger card overall no question yes, but against those 2 decks I want Land D that can hurt them fairly quickly disrupt there hand a bit as well however it is possible this is a bad idea but would like to try it in those matches before just discarding the idea. Also with 9 fetches 4 shrines 2 chapels and a filter land, it's pretty rare I don't have BB on t2 if I want it. Another not in general by the way this deck is no more vulnerable to Blood Moon than the regular BW versions since I don't run heights, but Spreading seas was a big pain in my but in game 1 against merfolk as well but can be played around with the proper draws.
Also, do not play Bitterblossom without Auriok Champion. Having a strong blocker / life gain + soft combo with BB isn't something u should ignore. Along with Honor the Pure she can also make swings when necessary.
4x Spectral Procession
4x Lingering Souls
4x Raise the Alarm
2x Secure the Wastes
3x Thoughtseize
3x Inquistion of Kozilek
4x Path to Exile
4x Abrupt Decay
1x Zealous Persecution
4x Intangible Virtue
1x Honor of the Pure
4x Godless Shrine
2x Temple Garden
4x Marsh Flats
4x Windswept Heat
1x Verdant Catacombs
1x Gavony Township
1x Vault of the Archangel
2x Isolated Chapel
1x Fetid Heath
3x Plains
1x Swamp
2x Rest in Peace
2x Sundering Growth
2x Kor Firewalker
1x Leyline of Sanctity
1x Timley Reinforcements
1x Zealous Persecution
2x Small Pox
2x Spellskite
Why aren't four anthems enough? When you're running BB without Hero of Bladehold, a majority of your tokens aren't white for Honor of the Pure to even matter, no?
Hard-pressed to win what matchups? I would argue that they are most crucial in unfair matchups where you are trying to race. The extra damage just becomes important as you're sometimes limited in how you can interact with combo decks. But against the more fair matchups, I feel like the combination of Vault and the sheer number of tokens that the deck produces, you can leverage these to the point in which you draw an anthem and can begin taking over the game. I haven't posted my list in a while, but assuming that you're looking at Honor of the Pure as the fifth and sixth anthems, I have games where it would be a dead card. Unless there is another anthem I am missing, or you're encouraging that I run Glorious Anthem, or I guess, Spear of Heliod might be just better.
Is Leyline of the Meek worth testing?
I think running Raise the Alarm AND Bitterblossom is a pretty compelling direction to go. I've even been considering cutting a copy of Spectral Procession to do so.
No clue how this deck won a single match. I started testing something similar and can't run on 22 lands and tried 23 and it was just as bad. Blegh. Don't know how folks run less than 24.
I like Raise the Alarm for now. I'm impatient in testing Ajani Goldmane, but I'm going to stick with it.
This is what I'm going to be testing for the rest of the night:
1 Ajani Goldmane
4 Thoughtseize
4 Lingering Souls
4 Intangible Virtue
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Spectral Procession
3 Bitterblossom
4 Path to Exile
3 Raise the Alarm
1 Timely Reinforcements
4 Godless Shrine
4 Windswept Heath
1 Swamp
1 Fetid Heath
4 Plains
2 Vault of the Archangel
3 Windbrisk Heights
2 Marsh Flats
1 Flooded Strand
2 Auriok Champion
2 Stony Silence
3 Duress
2 Rest in Peace
1 Go for the Throat
1 Kor Firewalker
2 Disenchant
1 Murderous Cut
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Timely Reinforcements
1 Hour of Reckoning
Fetches are off-color because of the limitations of my online collection.
Sweet card, I hadnt noticed it before. Besides Tron, I cant think of any matchups where we want it though?
Have a helicopter drop you off out front. Light your cigar with a small Indonesian boy holding a black lotus. Then bust out a craw wurm deck with no sleeves. Raw dog shuffle, loose terribly, flip the table, leave in a hovercraft.
WBTokensWB
When is this ever a reasonable plan for any deck?
Do folks that run Liliana like her in the deck? I now have two and am thinking about just throwing them in the sideboard, assuming I bring her in against discard decks. Really looking forward to this deck being well positioned if the bannings slam Amulet. The other day I was able to discard a Grishoalbrand's Through the Breach turn 1, turn 2 Surgical the Breach and cast Rest in Peace for the old turn two win lol.
Round 1 Vs Bogles (2-0) (1-0)
He punted hard game 1, game 2 believe it or not sideboarding 2 smallpoxes was huge against his rancored, armored dude, drop tokens and sorin, virtue gg
Round 2 Restore balance thing (2-0)(2-0)
He mulled to 4 game 1, gg
game 2 I was able to seize him, decay 2 boderposts, while he did balnce away my tokens, holding a lingering souls still, with virtue in play was enough to recover for the win
Round 3 Merfolk (2-1) (3-0)
Game 1 he goes first gets me wit shadow of doubt vials double lord, into lord into master I get crushed
game 2 I decay his t1 vial, virtue out and honor he tries to attack with double cursecatcher,with lord out, I have 5 lands secure the wastes for 2, block blow him out after that as I path lord as well
Game 3 I Abrupt decay a lord at the right time, he wants to counter but can't gets me the win
Round 4 Elves (2-1) (4-0)
Game 1 I mull into a good hand vurtue into spectral, souls, virtue flash, he had a lot of mana dorks and druid, but never hit ezuri or company before I got him
Game 2, he steamrolls me double CC, shrine ezuri
Game 3 I IOK his Ezuri, abrupt the second, persecution several dorks, timley and spectral with virtue wins it.
Abrupt decay was my mvp in almost every match, I'm glad I added these as I feel it gives the deck a lot more game against several decks. And the townsip is useful, I did use it a couple times throught the night it is like an extra anthem on crack and gives you a mana dump in games where flooding a bit could be doom, except now your flyers grow every turn.
I'm not the biggest advocate of Heights, I have always felt to cost of it coming into play tapped when you really needed an untapped land outweighed the times when it was great since half those times or more it was a win more cards for me, but yes it also can do some great things for the deck, That being said I have found the utility of AD and Township to just be way more consistently useful with almost no drawback ever. As far as smallpox that is an experiment in the sideboard I just tried this week to help against bloom titan and Tron mostly, however it happen to also serve a purpose against boggles, is lily a stronger card overall no question yes, but against those 2 decks I want Land D that can hurt them fairly quickly disrupt there hand a bit as well however it is possible this is a bad idea but would like to try it in those matches before just discarding the idea. Also with 9 fetches 4 shrines 2 chapels and a filter land, it's pretty rare I don't have BB on t2 if I want it. Another not in general by the way this deck is no more vulnerable to Blood Moon than the regular BW versions since I don't run heights, but Spreading seas was a big pain in my but in game 1 against merfolk as well but can be played around with the proper draws.
Nope. They should ban hive mind instead.
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