Been playing Modern for about a year now, and was in love with a 4C Gifts deck. Recently took it apart though and wanted to get into Jeskai Harbinger. However, I invested in Liliana's before my local GP recently and wanted a way to use them with Nahiri... Found Mardu lists, but really liked the feel of Snapcaster recursion in Jeskai... Well, I had played 4 color for a long time now, so why not try something crazy again and splash blue for Snap!
Far from tuned, but don't have some of the other cards I want/need like an Arid Mesa, maybe another Bloodstained... but it worked!
R1 - 1-2 versus UR Storm. This was a weird and tough one. He combo'd out G1 easy, G2 I boarded in Sanctities and managed to Extirpate his Grapeshots. G3 kinda the same thing except he eventually Emptied the Warrens and even though I could survive the one attack I couldn't draw a sweeper.
R2 - 2-0 versus Death Shadow Aggro. I did not expect to crush this deck, but somehow I did. G1 just had all the removal for Goyf and Shadow and discard and eventually Nahiri combo'd. G2 I actually didn't know Death's Shadow too well, and was unsure exactly what to board. I brought all four Leylines, and dropped a Void to start the game. It did a lot of work, and I grinded him out eventually with souls, snap, and tar pit beats.
R3 - 2-0 versus Orzhov life gain/drain. This was a unique deck I hadn't seen before. Basically ran a slew of creatures and enchantments that gain and drain, and there's an infinite combo and some other big combo-win drains in it. Both games I ripped apart his hand early on and killed the creatures I left in his hand and grinded out the wins fairly easily.
R4 - 2-0 versus Death Shadow Aggro. I'm sure it was almost the exact same list as the other guy, and the two games went basically the same way. I guess we just have a lot of mainboard and sideboard answers for this deck?
@redsummers, Mardu also has Kommand and the best removal in modern, the question is: what do you run alongside DS to round out the aggro suite?. Monastery swiftspear is fast and gets rezzed by O charm, but runs into roadblocks quick. We don't have the mana identity to utilize tasigur, Zombie Fish is just a vanilla 5/5, and L Souls, while great in a grind, isn't exactly the fastest out of the gate. I've toyed with the idea of kiln fiend, but it kind of feels like the build is trying to do too many things at once. Maybe D Confidant, K Fiend,D Shadow and Souls while making sure all your DS enablers are instant/sorcery based? I dunno, once again it feels like Mardu is just missing one key piece to being great.
@redsummers, Mardu also has Kommand and the best removal in modern, the question is: what do you run alongside DS to round out the aggro suite?. Monastery swiftspear is fast and gets rezzed by O charm, but runs into roadblocks quick. We don't have the mana identity to utilize tasigur, Zombie Fish is just a vanilla 5/5, and L Souls, while great in a grind, isn't exactly the fastest out of the gate. I've toyed with the idea of kiln fiend, but it kind of feels like the build is trying to do too many things at once. Maybe D Confidant, K Fiend,D Shadow and Souls while making sure all your DS enablers are instant/sorcery based? I dunno, once again it feels like Mardu is just missing one key piece to being great.
Perhaps D shadow, D confidant, Discard suit, and butcher of the horde?
Hmmm, I don't NOT like it.... Butcher being a four drop, land needs to go up to 22 bare minimum (23 being MUCH safer.) Kommand for recursion, Bob as a DS enabler + card draw, maybe I'll map out a rough build and self test against tier 1. As good as O charm is with D shadow, I'd love another valid target for it in the main that's not swiftspear. Oh well.
Painful truths could just as easily become night's whisper to lower your curve, and would be significantly easier to cast (considering truths is essentially RWB). I like boros charm almost as much as battle rage: 4 to the face is GREAT reach on an empty board and the indestructibility is not without use, though the trample WOULD be missed. I was skimming the Google for ideas that might be floating around, and a few people have tried vexing devil. The stats along with enabling ferocious on battle rage AND being a valid target for O charm fought my attention.
Vexing devil would be excellent card in the Mardu suite, since we have also access to Ranger of Eos that could be very relevant late game (much better than Painful truths.
The green package offers a tutor for Trample which is a huge bonus, but since the Mardu variant is so good on the burn plan (Boros Charm, Vexing Devil, Lightning bolt instead of Tarfire) well I think we have a very good upside to having white instead of green.
We also have access to the best sideboard cards in modern!
Here's the decklist I have in mind (based on the cards I own) :
I don't mean to be rude but Vexing is terrible.
I had 4. If the opponent has no answers (bolt, path, terminate, push, decay), it will pay life to permanently kill a threat.
That's why we have Orzhov charm, Ranger of eos and Kologhan's command. If he takes 4 to remove it too often and we have Bolt/Boros charm in hand and a Death's shadow in play, we will be constantly threatning lethal damage.
Boros charm can also be very good for the times that the opponent will not pay the 4 life thinking he has an answer.
There's several cards in the deck has a "Burn" plan and a "Grind" plan which gives us our 2 main lines of play depending on what we're facing.
I think that there's more to building a deck than just "This card is bad, let's put a tarmogoyf instead". Synergies is going to be your friend, look at Cheri0s with a bunch of crappy 0 casting cost equipment but still wins games turn 2 or turn 3 consistantly.
The synergy of cheri0us leads to a combo. Little energies is cool and necessary but it seems that your strategy is shifting towards a burn strategy.
Why not play some version of "mardu burn"?
Despite that I think this is a good idea to test. I hope that I'm terrible mistaken about your strategy.
The synergy of cheri0us leads to a combo. Little energies is cool and necessary but it seems that your strategy is shifting towards a burn strategy.
Why not play some version of "mardu burn"?
Despite that I think this is a good idea to test. I hope that I'm terrible mistaken about your strategy.
You are right, this build leans a lot on the burn side but it has more tricks up it's sleeve than regular burn. Orzhov charm has 3 relevant modes but lava spike, well, we all know what that card does lol.
I'm going back to a Butcher variant after playing an Indomitable Creativity build. I tried out Pain Seer, Smuggler's Copter, and Mardu Strike Leader at FNM last night. Smuggler's Copter and Mardu Strike Leader performed very well, Pain Seer was a spectacular flop and cost me the match win in the last round by revealing Emrakul. The plan now is replace the Pain Seers with more Copters, could use some feedback on my list. I'd love to keep the Mardu Strike Leaders in if at all possible.
I'm interested in this deck, or rather the color combination. Been trying to find something new in Modern that I would enjoy. The Death's Shadow builds seem interesting, I like the use of Orzhov Charm, and always love Ranger of Eos.
On the other hand, midrange is really more my thing and I really just want to jam a strong 2 drop alongside Liliana and Lingering Souls. Been thinking of something like this for a first draft, any thoughts?
Not sure on my land breakdown yet, probably the usual 8 fetch/5 shock, maybe some shambling vents. Orzhov Basilica seems like a good way to help getting to 4 mana reliably without more card draw.
<3 my mardu boys. Here are my builds that I have brewed up. I sold out of MTGO so give me some tips. I plan on buying one/both of these decks offline and starting to play paper magic. Gotta bite the bullet and the cost isn't a big issue for me. 1000 dollars no big deal! Everything is cheap right now for this deck.
@redsummers I think you will love my deck based on your idea. I have built smallpox based decks quite a few times and they grinded(in past metas) to the NEXT level. Here is my first build(no testing) of smallpox control. http://imgur.com/a/bExyW
Random thought I had (which I also mentioned in the Death's Shadow Jund thread). If we want to do a Death's Shadow build, what about using Eidolon of the Great Revel as an enabler?
<3 my mardu boys. Here are my builds that I have brewed up. I sold out of MTGO so give me some tips. I plan on buying one/both of these decks offline and starting to play paper magic. Gotta bite the bullet and the cost isn't a big issue for me. 1000 dollars no big deal! Everything is cheap right now for this deck.
@redsummers I think you will love my deck based on your idea. I have built smallpox based decks quite a few times and they grinded(in past metas) to the NEXT level. Here is my first build(no testing) of smallpox control. http://imgur.com/a/bExyW
Oooohh.... I LIKE reveler as an enabler.... However, Bob drains you AND keeps card advantage up, as well as being easier to cast (generally less relevant in a D shadow build). Confidant is stiff competition for any 2 drop.
Oooohh.... I LIKE reveler as an enabler.... However, Bob drains you AND keeps card advantage up, as well as being easier to cast (generally less relevant in a D shadow build). Confidant is stiff competition for any 2 drop.
I agree, but I think I can make a good case for it. Bob sits there, occasionally gets in for 2, dies to anything, and if he's killed right away produces no value. Eidolon is a race to the bottom (that your opponent generally loses) and hits for 2 per card. I've looked over all flavors of DS decks, and they mostly have curves in the 60 total mana range, meaning Bob flips for just one point per turn.
In terms purely of enabling Shadow, I think Eidolon is superior. It grows it faste, hits the opponent for more, and almost always gets value.
Now for the downside: It's RR and that leads to a really awkward curve because you need to use a lot of red mana. I think I have the solution to that too though. There's two little remembered (these days) heavy red cards that provide CA. Chandra, Pyromaster and Prophetic Flamespeaker (which has recently improved with Push's rise and Bolts decline) They follow the RR curve of Eidolon well, and provide cards, provided you're willing to use them that turn. Chandra also turns on evasion for DS, or if really needed can grow it. I think this package plus DS and Lingering Souls, plus a strong discard theme (because lets face it, discard has become Modern's Brainstorm technique) can be mashed together.
THe one thing I have learned playing Smallpox control is Arena is probably your best card when the game stalls. And since stalling the game is your goal I think 2-3 of is correct. I would honestly ditch LoTV or 1 LS copy before it I think. I do agree one of mardu's big problems is it has SO many good 3 drops and not as many efficient 2 drops like Tarmo.
You are correct though about Expertise.. I think it would be just fine maindeck if it was a different meta. With Deaths shadow the top dog now It might just need to be 2 damnations and 1 YE in the sideboard for the matchups its good.
Been playing Modern for about a year now, and was in love with a 4C Gifts deck. Recently took it apart though and wanted to get into Jeskai Harbinger. However, I invested in Liliana's before my local GP recently and wanted a way to use them with Nahiri... Found Mardu lists, but really liked the feel of Snapcaster recursion in Jeskai... Well, I had played 4 color for a long time now, so why not try something crazy again and splash blue for Snap!
Went 3-1 recently with this list:
1x Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1x Wurmcoil Engine
4x Snapcaster Mage
Planeswalkers
3x Nahiri, the Harbinger
4x Liliana of the Veil
1x Chandra, Torch of Defiance
Sweepers
2x Damnation
1x Engineered Explosives
Removal
2x Terminate
3x Fatal Push
2x Path to Exile
3x Lightning Bolt
Disruption
2x Thoughtseize
2x Inquisition of Kozilek
Other Spells
3x Lingering Souls
2x Kolaghan's Command
1x Watery Grave
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2x Swamp
1x Steam Vents
1x Shambling Vent
1x Sacred Foundry
3x Polluted Delta
1x Plains
1x Mountain
1x Island
1x Hallowed Fountain
1x Godless Shrine
3x Flooded Strand
1x Desolate Lighthouse
2x Creeping Tar Pit
1x Bloodstained Mire
2x Blood Crypt
2 Timely Reinforcements
3 Thing in the Ice
2 Stony Silence
2 Leyline of the Void
2 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Extirpate
1 Crumble to Dust
1 Anger of the Gods
Far from tuned, but don't have some of the other cards I want/need like an Arid Mesa, maybe another Bloodstained... but it worked!
R1 - 1-2 versus UR Storm. This was a weird and tough one. He combo'd out G1 easy, G2 I boarded in Sanctities and managed to Extirpate his Grapeshots. G3 kinda the same thing except he eventually Emptied the Warrens and even though I could survive the one attack I couldn't draw a sweeper.
R2 - 2-0 versus Death Shadow Aggro. I did not expect to crush this deck, but somehow I did. G1 just had all the removal for Goyf and Shadow and discard and eventually Nahiri combo'd. G2 I actually didn't know Death's Shadow too well, and was unsure exactly what to board. I brought all four Leylines, and dropped a Void to start the game. It did a lot of work, and I grinded him out eventually with souls, snap, and tar pit beats.
R3 - 2-0 versus Orzhov life gain/drain. This was a unique deck I hadn't seen before. Basically ran a slew of creatures and enchantments that gain and drain, and there's an infinite combo and some other big combo-win drains in it. Both games I ripped apart his hand early on and killed the creatures I left in his hand and grinded out the wins fairly easily.
R4 - 2-0 versus Death Shadow Aggro. I'm sure it was almost the exact same list as the other guy, and the two games went basically the same way. I guess we just have a lot of mainboard and sideboard answers for this deck?
Let me know what you think!
Perhaps D shadow, D confidant, Discard suit, and butcher of the horde?
I also thought about Pack Rat since it can take over a game by itself, but the synergy of the rest of the deck is not as good as with vexing devil (Orzhov charm + Ranger of Eos).
The green package offers a tutor for Trample which is a huge bonus, but since the Mardu variant is so good on the burn plan (Boros Charm, Vexing Devil, Lightning bolt instead of Tarfire) well I think we have a very good upside to having white instead of green.
We also have access to the best sideboard cards in modern!
Here's the decklist I have in mind (based on the cards I own) :
2x Blood Crypt
4x Bloodstained Mire
1x Godless Shrine
2x Marsh Flats
1x Plains
1x Sacred Foundry
1x Swamp
4x Verdant Catacombs
3x Fatal Push
2x Kolaghan's Command
4x Lightning Bolt
3x Orzhov Charm
2x Temur Battle Rage
2x Liliana of the Veil
2x Ranger of Eos
4x Street Wraith
4x Vexing Devil
1x Collective Brutality
3x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Thoughtseize
BGW - Abzan
Legacy
BG - BG Lands
I had 4. If the opponent has no answers (bolt, path, terminate, push, decay), it will pay life to permanently kill a threat.
Boros charm can also be very good for the times that the opponent will not pay the 4 life thinking he has an answer.
There's several cards in the deck has a "Burn" plan and a "Grind" plan which gives us our 2 main lines of play depending on what we're facing.
I think that there's more to building a deck than just "This card is bad, let's put a tarmogoyf instead". Synergies is going to be your friend, look at Cheri0s with a bunch of crappy 0 casting cost equipment but still wins games turn 2 or turn 3 consistantly.
BGW - Abzan
Legacy
BG - BG Lands
Why not play some version of "mardu burn"?
Despite that I think this is a good idea to test. I hope that I'm terrible mistaken about your strategy.
You are right, this build leans a lot on the burn side but it has more tricks up it's sleeve than regular burn. Orzhov charm has 3 relevant modes but lava spike, well, we all know what that card does lol.
BGW - Abzan
Legacy
BG - BG Lands
3 Marsh Flats
1 Arid Mesa
2 Swamp
2 Plains
1 Mountain
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Godless Shrine
1 Blood Crypt
3 Shambling Vent
1 Concealed Courtyard
1 Inspiring Vantage
1 Blackcleave Cliffs
3 Butcher of the Horde
1 Emrakul, The Aeons Torn
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Lingering Souls
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Bitterblossom
2 Path to Exile
1 Timely Reinforcements
1 Crackling Doom
1 To The Slaughter
1 Blessed Alliance
1 Lightning Helix
1 Whip of Erebos
2 Nahiri, the Harbinger
On the other hand, midrange is really more my thing and I really just want to jam a strong 2 drop alongside Liliana and Lingering Souls. Been thinking of something like this for a first draft, any thoughts?
Not sure on my land breakdown yet, probably the usual 8 fetch/5 shock, maybe some shambling vents. Orzhov Basilica seems like a good way to help getting to 4 mana reliably without more card draw.
Creatures 6
4 Pack Rat
2 Dark Confidant
Enchantment 3
3 Bitterblossom
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Fatal Push
3 Path to Exile
4 Lingering Souls
3 Liliana of the Veil
2 Ajani Vengeant
2 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
@redsummers I think you will love my deck based on your idea. I have built smallpox based decks quite a few times and they grinded(in past metas) to the NEXT level. Here is my first build(no testing) of smallpox control. http://imgur.com/a/bExyW
Why do you have only fatal push as spot removal?
I agree, but I think I can make a good case for it. Bob sits there, occasionally gets in for 2, dies to anything, and if he's killed right away produces no value. Eidolon is a race to the bottom (that your opponent generally loses) and hits for 2 per card. I've looked over all flavors of DS decks, and they mostly have curves in the 60 total mana range, meaning Bob flips for just one point per turn.
In terms purely of enabling Shadow, I think Eidolon is superior. It grows it faste, hits the opponent for more, and almost always gets value.
Now for the downside: It's RR and that leads to a really awkward curve because you need to use a lot of red mana. I think I have the solution to that too though. There's two little remembered (these days) heavy red cards that provide CA. Chandra, Pyromaster and Prophetic Flamespeaker (which has recently improved with Push's rise and Bolts decline) They follow the RR curve of Eidolon well, and provide cards, provided you're willing to use them that turn. Chandra also turns on evasion for DS, or if really needed can grow it. I think this package plus DS and Lingering Souls, plus a strong discard theme (because lets face it, discard has become Modern's Brainstorm technique) can be mashed together.
For a first attempt... something like this:
Creatures 14
4 Death's Shadow
3 Pack Rat
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
3 Prophetic Flamespeaker
3 Thoughtseize
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Collective Brutality
2 Path to Exile
3 Fatal Push
3 Lightning Bolt
4 Lingering Souls
3 Liliana of the Veil
2 Chandra Pyromaster
You are correct though about Expertise.. I think it would be just fine maindeck if it was a different meta. With Deaths shadow the top dog now It might just need to be 2 damnations and 1 YE in the sideboard for the matchups its good.