Hey RUG Delverers, been awhile. I've been working hard on my "other brew," which is nearing completion I think, but with GP Charlotte fast approaching, I decided it was time to get back on the bugs. First I'll post my current list and then I'll explain the numerous changes I've made, and then I'll write up a tournament report from tonight (3-1, loss to Abzan).
At the moment, the list is tuned to beat Abzan. While the matchup is still unfavorable, it's become much fairer with the recent additions. The changes I've made have incidentally helped vs. Affinity and other Aggro decks (namely, the fourth Huntmaster in the SB), and I'm not really worried about any other matchups.
- Curiosity: Here's the big one. I cut the Baubles to just 2 since it's a really, really horrible card (sorry Spooly!). But making Goyf 5/6 is just necessary in this meta. You need a threat bigger than Rhino, Tasigur, and Angler if you want to have any kind of shot in today's Modern, and Bauble seemed like the most low-cost option as a 0-mana cantrip that pumps Goyf when Scoured. But in my testing, it was often clunky, and topdecking it absolutely sucks. So I went to just 2, figuring for the matchups where you need that extra point of p/t you can dig for the Bauble pretty effectively. But then I realized I board them out against Abzan every single time, since they pump enemy Goyfs and ours are already big enough thanks to Liliana of the Veil (and Blood Moon). I needed to shore up that matchup without giving up the option of a 5/6 Tarmogoyf in game 1 against other decks, and Curiosity fit the bill as an Enchantment that serves as a cantrip when you play it at the right time. It also turns any of your threats into must-answer Ophidians, forcing removal on Wolf tokens and 2/1 Wizards alike. Against Junk, it wins you a topdeck war in a hurry, and the synergy with Gitaxian Probe is awesome - if you see removal, you wait; if you don't, you strap it to a threat and start drawing cards. I'll remind you that Curiosity saw play as a 4-of in Comer's original Miracle Gro list, which has much in common with the Mandrill deck. Granted, times have changed, but just as we have 8 threats that turn on Ferocious for Stubborn Denial, we have 8 threats that carry a Curiosity exceedingly well. Mandrills takes the cake here with his Trample, but the more fragile Insectile Aberration does come out swinging in the air as early as turn 2. I did try a single Bauble over that 17th land, but with the 4 Huntmasters in the SB I decided having the land was probably better. That, and you just don't really need 6/7.
- Snapcaster #2: Supports Curiosity and helps grind out Abzan. Gives me access to a whopping 18 threats post-board against them. I also really love the synergy with Thought Scour in game 1, and it's easier to accommodate another Snapcaster Mage with 17 lands and 14 cantrips (previous iterations saw me with 12 cantrips and 17 lands, or 14-15 cantrips via Mishra's Bauble and 16 lands).
- No Deprive: I used to play one in the main and one in the board, and it's a really sweet card. But 3 Moons makes it hard to cast in the matchups I want it for, and it's a pain to bounce a land with the 4 Huntmaster plan.
- No Pyroclasm: Guess we're in the Sideboard now. Pyroclasm seriously underwhelmed me every time I brought it in. I'd justified two in the board for Affinity, but it's not even THAT GOOD against Affinity - more Grudges are better, and even Huntmaster is better. I can't think of any other Aggro matchups in which I'd want it.
- 4 Huntmasters: It's our best anti-Abzan card, bar-none. Huntmaster provides a burst of value and threatens a stream of it if not dealt with immediately; think of it as Snapcaster Mage meets Dark Confidant. The fourth one also helps the Aggro matchups since he's often the best card there, too. He doesn't come in all the time, but he almost does; games 2 and 3 often revolve around finding lands to start dropping Huntmasters, and if he's winning the game as frequently as he has been in testing, letting Delver ride backseat is fine with me.
- 3 Blood Moon: Why were we only playing 2? Because we don't want multiples? We only bring it in against decks that get wrecked by it (Abzan, Bloom) or otherwise severely stalled (Tron). We do want multiples. Abzan strips them from your hand at its earliest convenience. And yeah, that's really the only matchup I care about.
- Flashfreeze: More anti-Abzan tech. Also randomly good against Burn, Skred Red, whatever. Bad decks. Another counterspell for Rhino is super relevant without Deprive.
- Dismember: Kills Siege Rhino, Angler, Germ, Exarch... everything. Tried 2; was too many. This is more of a flex slot right now but so far I think it's the best option. The card is very versatile and powerful and doesn't see enough play in this format IMO. Miles better than Roast, and Roast is a pretty strong effect in this kind of deck (obviously 2 CMC sucks).
- All these Simic Charms: Simic Charm is the real deal. I was often elated to draw my single copy in game 1s. Every mode is stellar in this deck. The +3/+3 saves your guy, bolts their face, or does both; Hexproof even stops Sower of Temptation (see tournament report). And I don't need to tell you how much Delver loves Vapor Snag. But yeah, all the #basic Snags are gone; the utility Charm offers us, especially against Abzan (trampling over a Rhino is insane), is just better. Games 2 and 3 are longer anyway so it's not so bad to have a 2CMC spell, and it strengthens the Shoal-for-2 plan (relevant vs. some decks like Affinity).
So yeah, a lot of innovations here. I've been testing nonstop and am very happy with the direction the list is headed. While I'm a little sad to have these gorgeous foil Baubles doing nothing, the thrill of getting close to beating Abzan - and, by extension, breaking the format - keeps me going. I played in a local tonight (Massachusetts for the summer, so new stores!) and went 3-1, beating BUG Infect, Merfolk, Blue Moon, and losing to Abzan. THAT SAID, I couldn't find 2 SB Simic Charm or 2 MB Curiosity on time for the event, so I ran 2 Snag SB and 2 Bauble MB as replacements. No doubt the new tech would have helped me out a fair bit.
Round 1 vs. BUG Infect (2-1): Game 1 I mulligan two zero-landers into a 5 of Goyf, Visions, Probe, Misty, Tarn. Probe sees no threats save an Inkmoth Nexus, but he rips Hierarch into Agent and races me with Pendelhaven. I don't see a Bolt all game. Game 2 my opponent mulligans and I decimate him. I start by removing threats; Bolt the turn 1 Elf, Shoal exile Shoal for the Agent, Mandrills and Leak the other Agent on turn 3. I draw Bolts and Dismember as he casts nothing and Mandrills eats him. Game 3 he mulligans to 6 again. Turn 2 he plays a Spellskite and I Thought Scour an Ancient Grudge into my GY with another in hand. I kill the Skite and later the Inkmoth, Bolt the Elf, and land a Goyf, Shoaling his Agent while I'm tapped out. A second Goyf and a Mandrills hit him for exactly lethal (14!) on the next turn. I boarded horribly for these games, and I'm not 100% on our SB plan for this MU. That said, I think we're so highly favored that there's no real reason to work on it. Probably I would cut the other two Thought Scours and keep a Mandrills and a Denial main in the future.
Plan:
-2 Mishra's Bauble
-3 Hooting Mandrills
-2 Thought Scour
-1 Stubborn Denial
+2 Ancient Grudge
+2 Destructive Revelry
+1 Dismember
+1 Flashfreeze
+2 Vapor Snag (should be Simic Charm)
Round 2 vs. Merfolk (2-0): Another easy matchup, though not quite as easy. It's very important not to get tempo'd out by their threats or try to race them on the board; removing their threats, then committing your own threats, is generally very good against Merfolk since they have no way to reload and find themselves drawing duds like Aether Vial or lonely Lords. Game 1 he has Cursecatcher into Lord into Lord and takes me down to 6 as I set up. He sacrifices Cursecatcher to counter my Serum Visions after I Scour, Visions, Visions in a turn, which is totally fine by me. I land Delver and Mandrills on the following turn, Bolt-Snap-Bolting his Lord and Silvergill. He gets a Spellskite but is forced to chump my Mandrills; I leak his Phantasmal Image for a concession. Game 2 he has a ton of Vapor Snag (thanks, Probe) to keep my Goyf at bay and save his Lord from my removal. Doesn't matter; I just want to stall him and drop a Huntmaster. I never find one, but I do eventually force through two Goyfs and a Mandrills. We race and he almost has it, but I plan just right and end up going to 1 life. Green guys close out the game. An early Destructive Revelry targeting Skite (I had cast Ancient Grudge instead) would have shaved a turn off my clock, all while baiting more Artifacts; lesson learned.
Plan
-4 Thought Scour
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-2 Mishra's Bauble
-1 Gitaxian Probe
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+2 Ancient Grudge
+2 Destructive Revelry
+1 Dismember
+2 Vapor Snag (should be Simic Charm)
Round 3 vs. Abzan Midrange (1-2): Hey, at least I won a game. G1 he has every threat, casting IoK into Finks into Tasigur into Goyf into Rhino and there's no way I can keep up. Vault of the Archangel lifelinks his team for 7. Game 2 I ride a Delver all the way to 0. He has lots of Goyfs, which I shrink with Mandrills, and a Liliana of the Veil, which nabs that Mandrills. He gets to 9 life and casts Goyf and Tasigur, but I EOT Bolt-Snap-Bolt and attack in the air for lethal. G3 he's again on the assault with Goyf, Finks, and Stirring Wildwood. I end up with a hand full of bounce and no threats (Simic Charm would notably have saved my Goyf and Mandrills), and the single Huntmaster I rip off the top doesn't quite get me there.
Plan:
-4 Thought Scour
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-2 Mishra's Bauble
-1 Lightning Bolt
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+3 Blood Moon
+1 Dismember
+1 Flashfreeze
+2 Vapor Snag (should be Simic Charm)
Round 4 vs. Blue Moon (2-0): I thought this guy was on Twin since I'd seen a little bit of his matches while circling but never finished them. Was pretty surprised by a Blood Moon turn 3 but I had a Delver and an Island. I start digging for Forest so I could cast the two Goyfs and the Mandrills in my hand. My opponent has no idea what's going on as I cast three Thought Scours and three Serum Visions. Delver eventually died, but I also eventually found that Forest. Vedalken Shackles stole a Snapcaster Mage and gave it up to take a Mandrills, but opponent failed to draw that fourth Island, instead playing copies of "Flooded Mountain" (not one of his best jokes) every turn. I get two Mandrills on the table and he passes to me before activating the Shackles, letting me Hexproof my team with a Simic Charm in response to the target at Start of Combat. I'm ready for his Cryptic Command with a Mana Leak and take him from 7 to 0. Game 2 my Probe sees Sower of Temptation, Electrolyze, and a lot of lands. I seize the opportunity to play Goyf, Snapcaster-Visions; he plays Sower on turn 4 to steal my tapped 2/3 Goyf. I untap and Vapor Snag his sower, coming for 2 with my Snapcaster Mage before fetching and emptying my Graveyard for Hooting Mandrills with UG up. He plays a land, casts Serum Visions, and tries Sower. It resolves and I Hexproof my team with Charm when he targets the Mandrills. I untap and swing, and Sower trades with Snapcaster Mage, bringing my opponent to 9. I play a Huntmaster of the Fells and a fetchland, and he untaps, plays a land, and tries Batterskull with one mana up. I Denial with Ferocious from the Mandrills for the handshake.
Plan:
-4 Thought Scour
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-2 Mishra's Bauble
-1 Lightning Bolt
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+2 Ancient Grudge
+2 Destructive Revelry
+1 Dismember
+2 Vapor Snag
Closing thoughts: the deck is still really good. It would have been even better (much better?) with Charms and Curiosity; I hated the Snags and Baubles all night. Even though the Snags were sweet for me, they just would have been much stronger as Charms. Since it's a complete non-entity, nobody expects this deck or even knows how to board/play against it. If I can improve the Abzan matchup beyond where I've gotten, which I believe is possible, I think it will do really well at the GP. Matchup-wise, we're a much better version of Grixis Delver (since instead of losing to Burn, we stomp Burn, and we average better against Junk than they do), and that deck's getting a lot of attention lately for its supposed viability. But I don't really care if nobody else plays DSQUARED2 JUNGLE; I'm happy being the only one winning with a Mandrills. Even if it means getting kicked from a ton of sore losers hosting "Competitive" rooms on Cockatrice.
On that note, I'm firmly convinced the monkeys are better than either Tasigur or Angler, especially when supplemented with Simic Charm. Trample is ultra-relevant in this strategy since getting walled by Lingering Souls and company (not Collected Company) is a very real problem faced by our Grixis cousins. It also enables Curiosity, which I'm really hoping proves as good as it's seemed.
Unrelated: have you guys seen the new Serum Visions art? L O L
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Hey thanks for the report. I'm a bit confused by the decklist as it appears to have 62 cards and no baubles but in your changes it seems you kept 2 baubles as well, so there are either 2 or 4 cards too many in the list?
I got curb stomped by abzan WITH goyf at a gpt and also tron, but the tron player misplayed horribly so I still managed to win. Our modern GP is not until November so for now I'm just playing weeklies in the same meta.
Hey thanks for the report. I'm a bit confused by the decklist as it appears to have 62 cards and no baubles but in your changes it seems you kept 2 baubles as well, so there are either 2 or 4 cards too many in the list?
I got curb stomped by abzan WITH goyf at a gpt and also tron, but the tron player misplayed horribly so I still managed to win. Our modern GP is not until November so for now I'm just playing weeklies in the same meta.
Sorry about that, fixed it. The issue was that there are 19 Instants now and not 21, but I forgot to change the number at the top. The decklist is fine it was just badly formatted. And no, I don't run any Baubles, as explained in the changes.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Yes, I have. Huntmaster is sweet against them, and even though they're mostly creatures, I keep all the Denials because if you stop their namesake Instant they're just a bad Aggro deck. Tarmogoyf also does a nice job walling their threats and killing dorks lets you tempo them out with Simic Charm. Also like Dismember and Flashfreeze in this MU.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Sorry for the double post, but just got back from another local at a new store and went 4-0, beating 8Rack, Affinity, Storm, and Jund. This store had 2 Curiosity and a Simic Charm for me, but unfortunately I had to play Vapor Snag over the third Charm since they didn't have two. So the Snag should be a Charm. Still, Curiosity was insane and I felt ahead in every match I drew it.
Round 1 vs. 8Rack (2-0): Game 1 I put a lot of pressure on him with a flipped Delver and a Snapcaster Mage (flashed in on two lands in response to a Wrench Mind that took my lonely Simic Charm). I’m in topdeck mode discarding the lands I draw to his own topdecked discard effects, but he never draws a rack and dies to my beaters. Game 2 I Serum Visions and keep Goyf, Curiosity on top. Instead of playing a Goyf turn 2 (I have another in hand), I play a land and pass, saving my Curiosity for next turn and hiding it from discard. I play a Goyf but it eats Victim of Night; the second one carries the Curiosity, which draws me Simic Charm, Mana Leak, Stubborn Denial… I have counterspells for everything, including Ensnaring Bridge.
Plan:
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-4 Thought Scour
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+2 Ancient Grudge
+2 Destructive Revelry
Round 2 vs. Affinity (2-1): Her list looks exactly like mine; I never see a card I don’t run. Game 1 I put double Curiosity on a Tarmogoyf and draw a total of 4 cards, which lets me deal with her whole board. She has nothing but draws a Champion from the top to wall me and then kill me with a topdecked Plating. Game 2 I keep a one-lander with 2 Delvers and they both blind flip off a Bolt and a Dismember, respectively. The Aberrations race Etched Champion, Signal Pest, Ornithopter, Inkmoth Nexus, and a late Steel Overseer pretty handily. I do find a second land the turn before I push through lethal, but it enters tapped. Game 3 I plant another turn 1 Delver and she drops Opal -> Opal into turn 2 Champion, who doesn’t do much on the ground. I blind flip off a Simic Charm and start swinging. She taps out turn 3 for a Blood Moon (lol?) but I have Island in play, so I crack Misty for a Forest and have perfect mana all game. Simic saves Delver next turn from a Galvanic Blast and my turn 4 Huntmaster, backed by a pair of Bolts in hand, seals the deal.
Plan:
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-4 Thought Scour
-2 Curiosity
-1 Stubborn Denial
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+2 Ancient Grudge
+2 Destructive Revelry
+1 Simic Charm
+1 Dismember
+1 Vapor Snag (should be Simic Charm)
Round 3 vs. UR Storm (2-0): This match is a massacre. Game 1 I Probe and see some Ascensions and rituals, so I play turn 2 Goyf and follow it with Mandrills + Mana Leak. I Leak his Manamorphose and come in for an exactly lethal 8. Game 2 he mulligans three times and can’t really deal with my turn 1 Delver. He lands a Pyromancer Ascension but I shoal his Pyretic Ritual and Snapcaster a Bolt in response to his fetch to bring him from 3 to 0.
Round 4 vs. Jund (2-0): Game 1 my turn 1 Delver dies to a Lightning Bolt. I have another one, and it gets a Curiosity after Probe shows me no removal outside of Terminate and Maelstrom Pulse, which I can tempo out via countermagic. The Delver never flips (!!!), but it connects 8 times and draws me that many cards. Jund player rapidly goes to 0 cards to my invariable 5 and scoops to a Tarmogoyf. Game 2 begins the same way: his Raging Ravine, my Delver, his Lightning Bolt. My Probe that sees Confidant, Confidant, Fulminator Mage, Fulminator Mage, land. I cast Serum Visions and keep a land on top, since I only have two; I play the second one and pass. He Fulminates my Steam Vents. I draw the land, cast Mandrills with a Curiosity. He plays Confidant. I Bolt it, put another Curiosity on the Mandrills, and drown my opponent in cards. He plays a second Confidant after that and I swing into it, but he Bolts Mandrills before damage. I Simic Charm for +3/+3 and deal him 6. At one point I even have to discard 2 to go to size. My opponent fetched around Blood Moon both games, but I still brought in one copy since I was missing the third Simic Charm.
Plan:
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-4 Thought Scour
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+1 Simic Charm
+1 Dismember
+1 Flashfreeze
+1 Blood Moon (should have been a Simic Charm)
So yeah. Feels great to be back with this deck. I think Curiosity is indeed good enough; it's just so crazy against attrition decks, which are the decks that give us a hard time (namely, Decay decks). I do want to reiterate, though, that the list is not complete without that Simic Charm. There were a number of situations tonight where Simic Charm saved me, and had it been a Vapor Snag, it wouldn't have.
Thanks to those of you, by the way, who thank me for my reports. When I said awhile back that I wouldn't do them anymore if nobody read them, I really meant just that, and I didn't mean to like cry out for attention or anything. I'm glad they're helpful to the rest of you in the thread and always look forward to reading yours!
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Awesome report. I definitely love your reports because it gives me hope that I might be able to do well with this deck!
I have to ask. What gave you the idea to use curiosity??? How aggressively do you use it? Say if you don't have a probe and your Abzan opponent has a fetch or plains up, and you have no countermagic, do you risk
the 2 for 1? How often have you been 2 for 1'd without at least drawing one card?
Awesome report. I definitely love your reports because it gives me hope that I might be able to do well with this deck!
I have to ask. What gave you the idea to use curiosity??? How aggressively do you use it? Say if you don't have a probe and your Abzan opponent has a fetch or plains up, and you have no countermagic, do you risk
the 2 for 1? How often have you been 2 for 1'd without at least drawing one card?
I explained my decision to try Curiosity above - I needed a card to come in for Mishra's Bauble in the main that a) boosted Tarmogoyf to that crucial 5/6 and b) had at least some game 1 relevance against Junk. It's also an old favorite of mine and I love its application in UG Threshold (more on this above as well).
Curiosity isn't just good for drawing cards. I use it sometimes to force removal on something like Snapcaster Mage or to divert opponents from my real threat; against Jund, I forgot to mention, I was able to Mana Leak his Terminate and then play a Goyf, which ended up eating the Maelstrom Pulse. Had my opponent spent that turn Pulsing my 1/1 Delver, Goyf would have come in for 5 the next turn and put him in a very tight spot; plus, if he topdecked a Lightning Bolt, he wouldn't be able to deal with the Goyf, whereas Bolt does kill Delver. Of course, Curiosity on a Delver is just as debilitating if he doesn't find an answer, and with all the counterspells I was drawing off the Enchantment, nothing he'd have found would have stuck anyway.
It's very strong against discard effects because in those matchups, like I said, I go all-in on threats, running a whopping 18 in the main (and 4 of those are Huntmasters, which kind of count as double). With this plan, I'll almost always have a body for Curiosity. Opponents generally want to take threats from your hand with discard, but if I run 18 of them, that plan isn't so great, since one threat with Curiosity draws me many more; instead, they're forced to lose tempo by stripping my Curiosity, giving me not just a turn to play my threat, but another threat. And if that threat is a Tarmogoyf, he's already bigger than Siege Rhino!
If I don't have Probe or countermagic, I'll try to assess how dire my situation is. Am I very behind on the board? Do I need to be drawing cards right now? Do I lose if I don't quickly find a specific answer to, say, the Tasigur across from me? If I answer YES to any of these questions, I'll try my luck with Curiosity. But I'll often ask myself some other questions first. How many cards does my opponent have? What removal spells have I seen this game? What are the odds he has one? Can I afford to wait? If I'm ahead on the board or trying to dodge and out-tempo removal spells, I won't even bother with Curiosity. There's no reason to win-more with this deck (any deck?). I find it's best reserved as a bomb for once you've exhausted your opponent's removal and know it's safe to cast, because in that scenario it just wins the game against attrition strategies.
I do frequently have either Probe or countermagic, but it does come up that I don't, and knowing when to take the risk with Curiosity is really important. Ideally, if I have Curiosity and Probe and something else to do on each turn with all my mana, I'll wait to Probe (even if I don't have turn 1 Delver) until the turn I want to strap Curiosity to my threat (generally turn 3 or 4). That way I have perfect info and can at least break parity with my threat. It's just gravy that the odds my opponent topdecks an answer in his 22+-land Midrange deck work against him, so Curiosity usually draws me more cards than 1 here. That way, once he has the Bolt for my Delver, I have the Shoal for his Bolt.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Hello people! yesterday i played a little tournament with 8 people ( 3 matches + Top4, total of 5 games ) with the same list posted by ashtonkutcher ( modified only 1 mountain for 1 wooded foothills and the 61st card NOXIOUS REVIVAL )
the deck is extremely funny and unexpected ( when the opponents see Mandrills they make a strange face )
i write for you a little report:
2-1 vs RW NORIN
1st game i lose, probably due to the unknowing of the deck i was playing. i made some mistakes and i drew 13 lands...g2 i won with double mandrills with curiosity: counter everything! g3 he flooded and i counter everything waiting for tarmogoyf and mandrills to beat down.
2-1 vs RG TRON
i was playing with my friend but we made mistakes each other. 1st game was insane, he stopped at 3 lands ( not in tron ) and i beated him with a tarmogoyf 2/3 enchanted by double curiosity!. g2 he won, i did not find counterspells and answers to his threats ( 3rd turn KARN ). g3 i finally saw blood moon but i did not have the basic forest to play mandrills & tarmogoyf. after few turns he destroyed blood moon and i fetched for basics again. here i make a huge mistakes before draw: i had noxious revival in hand and i did not cast it to put on the top blood moon... instead i draw cast mandrills and star beatings with counter back up.
1-2 vs BW TOKENS
new guy, 1st tournament, hard deck. BW tokens seems bad for all matchups and with 1 spells, 2-3 creatures makes board that this deck can't manage... Electrolyze where are you??? g1 was horrible and i lost pretty fast. g2 mandrills beat him and counterspells on lingering and spectral procession makes the difference. g3 was hard finishing bad for me where my opponent where at 2 life and i did not see a single lightning bolt on the entire match. he makes a group of spirits and he beated me.
TOP4
2-1 vs rg tron
again, my friend. some mistakes made by him let me pass the 3 matches. blood moon is always a big thing with them. sideboard plans are becoming burn and destructive revelry took the 3rd match destroying the oblivion stone making the last 2 damage.
2-1 bw tokens
this time, revenge! ask the guy for intentional draw to split the prize but he denied. bad choiche... g1 counter, mandrils, tarmogoyf etc, see everything...g2 i did not see anything and an army of spirits takes me down ( blood moon arrived in the last turn ). g3 blood moon blocked him at the 3rd turn, mandrills beat him and tarmogoyf idem... spectral procession is the big card here, can be cast out of blood moon since it is a 6 cmc colorless spell if he want...
now i am the first and i won 35 euro of cards.
i noticed the absence of electrolyze and izzet staticaster that can make the difference. the 4 copies of huntmaster are probably too much, maybe only for abzan/jund matchups. for burn i prefer feed the clan.
on sideboarding i have a lot of questions: i always board out disrupting shoal + thought scour. is that okay? also, disrupting here counter only at 1 or 2. maybe adding electrolyze is not so bad?
simic charm is indeed a very good card, saving, pumping, bouncing creatures! very unexpected and good in all the matchups!
great deck that i will play again. let me know more about the sideboarding!
I've answered all these questions in the last few pages and have written some SB guides that will probably help you, so I suggest you check them out. Huntmaster is far and away the most important SB card as he beats a lot of matchups (including BW Tokens) by himself. Lyze and Staticaster are actually pretty bad against Tokens since they run so many anthem effects; you really want Revelry here to shrink their guys and to race with Mandrills/Huntmaster. If it's still giving you trouble, try Engineered Explosives instead. Shoal comes out a lot but stays in against most linear decks. No Feed the Clan because losing to Burn is already impossible. I wish there was room for more mainboard Simic Charm, but as it is I can only fit one. Besides the core, the deck allows you five flex spots (six if you cut the Foothills, which you should only do if at least 2 of the flex spots are cantrips), and mine are taken up by Snapcaster x2, Curiosity x1, Simic Charm x1. Foothills is much better than Mountain; we don't mind shocking ourselves for Red and it's very important to have access to UG off two lands since we only play 16-17. Lastly, cut that 61st card! Revival is way too slow for this deck; Snapcaster Mage is a lot better. If you really want to play Revival, cut one one of the flex cards for it. Never play more than 60 Welcome to the thread!
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Yep, none of the vendors had a Simic Charm so I had to play that horrible Vapor Snag again. 1st in Swiss with 8-1 and then undefeated in Top 8 for an 11-1 record. Report on the way.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
just saw you get first at worcester, congrats man putting this deck on the radar
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To see the world in a grain of sand, and to see heaven in a wild flower, hold infinity in the palm of your hands, and eternity in an hour. - William Blake
It was not delight, not wonder that arose among us, it was the peace of heaven. He who has thought most deeply loves what is most alive. - Friedrich Holderlin
Big congrats sir Ashton! I will definitely move back to this deck again thanks to your success I already ordered some Shoals ! I was just thinking that what are the answers to resolved Tarmogoyfs and/or Rhinos since outside of one Simic Charm you don't have any kind of bounce or removal? Is the idea just to play fast and counter all must answer cards?
Congrats Ashton! Someone in my extended magic community saw your finish and now we have an interesting discussion going on about the merits of the deck.
Ashton, first let me just say congrats on the finish. It must be very rewarding to work so hard on a new brew and then get validation on the national stage.
A few questions:
You would run 3 charm in the 75?
Have you considered any of these counters: izzet charm, spell pierce, or spell snare? I mean, I'm sure you have, just wondering why none are worth playing. In this vein, why also no more deprive?
Did you like the fourth Huntmaster?
Given how often the shoals come out, why do you not start them in the board?
Are you always cutting scour if you cut shoal? If not, which matchups do the scours stay in for?
Thanks again in advance. Also, if you could be so kind as to provide a current board plan vs the major decks, that would be awesome. PPTQ coming up this weekend for modern, your list is my top contender right now. Hope to bring it home.
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Hooting Mandrills
2 Snapcaster Mage
Other permanents (2)
2 Curiosity
Sorcery (8)
4 Serum Visions
4 Gitaxian Probe
Instant (19)
4 Thought Scour
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Disrupting Shoal
3 Stubborn Denial
3 Mana Leak
1 Simic Charm
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Wooded Foothills
2 Steam Vents
1 Breeding Pool
1 Stomping Ground
3 Island
1 Forest
4 Huntmaster of the Fells
3 Blood Moon
2 Destructive Revelry
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Simic Charm
1 Flashfreeze
1 Dismember
At the moment, the list is tuned to beat Abzan. While the matchup is still unfavorable, it's become much fairer with the recent additions. The changes I've made have incidentally helped vs. Affinity and other Aggro decks (namely, the fourth Huntmaster in the SB), and I'm not really worried about any other matchups.
- Curiosity: Here's the big one. I cut the Baubles to just 2 since it's a really, really horrible card (sorry Spooly!). But making Goyf 5/6 is just necessary in this meta. You need a threat bigger than Rhino, Tasigur, and Angler if you want to have any kind of shot in today's Modern, and Bauble seemed like the most low-cost option as a 0-mana cantrip that pumps Goyf when Scoured. But in my testing, it was often clunky, and topdecking it absolutely sucks. So I went to just 2, figuring for the matchups where you need that extra point of p/t you can dig for the Bauble pretty effectively. But then I realized I board them out against Abzan every single time, since they pump enemy Goyfs and ours are already big enough thanks to Liliana of the Veil (and Blood Moon). I needed to shore up that matchup without giving up the option of a 5/6 Tarmogoyf in game 1 against other decks, and Curiosity fit the bill as an Enchantment that serves as a cantrip when you play it at the right time. It also turns any of your threats into must-answer Ophidians, forcing removal on Wolf tokens and 2/1 Wizards alike. Against Junk, it wins you a topdeck war in a hurry, and the synergy with Gitaxian Probe is awesome - if you see removal, you wait; if you don't, you strap it to a threat and start drawing cards. I'll remind you that Curiosity saw play as a 4-of in Comer's original Miracle Gro list, which has much in common with the Mandrill deck. Granted, times have changed, but just as we have 8 threats that turn on Ferocious for Stubborn Denial, we have 8 threats that carry a Curiosity exceedingly well. Mandrills takes the cake here with his Trample, but the more fragile Insectile Aberration does come out swinging in the air as early as turn 2. I did try a single Bauble over that 17th land, but with the 4 Huntmasters in the SB I decided having the land was probably better. That, and you just don't really need 6/7.
- Snapcaster #2: Supports Curiosity and helps grind out Abzan. Gives me access to a whopping 18 threats post-board against them. I also really love the synergy with Thought Scour in game 1, and it's easier to accommodate another Snapcaster Mage with 17 lands and 14 cantrips (previous iterations saw me with 12 cantrips and 17 lands, or 14-15 cantrips via Mishra's Bauble and 16 lands).
- No Deprive: I used to play one in the main and one in the board, and it's a really sweet card. But 3 Moons makes it hard to cast in the matchups I want it for, and it's a pain to bounce a land with the 4 Huntmaster plan.
- No Pyroclasm: Guess we're in the Sideboard now. Pyroclasm seriously underwhelmed me every time I brought it in. I'd justified two in the board for Affinity, but it's not even THAT GOOD against Affinity - more Grudges are better, and even Huntmaster is better. I can't think of any other Aggro matchups in which I'd want it.
- 4 Huntmasters: It's our best anti-Abzan card, bar-none. Huntmaster provides a burst of value and threatens a stream of it if not dealt with immediately; think of it as Snapcaster Mage meets Dark Confidant. The fourth one also helps the Aggro matchups since he's often the best card there, too. He doesn't come in all the time, but he almost does; games 2 and 3 often revolve around finding lands to start dropping Huntmasters, and if he's winning the game as frequently as he has been in testing, letting Delver ride backseat is fine with me.
- 3 Blood Moon: Why were we only playing 2? Because we don't want multiples? We only bring it in against decks that get wrecked by it (Abzan, Bloom) or otherwise severely stalled (Tron). We do want multiples. Abzan strips them from your hand at its earliest convenience. And yeah, that's really the only matchup I care about.
- Flashfreeze: More anti-Abzan tech. Also randomly good against Burn, Skred Red, whatever. Bad decks. Another counterspell for Rhino is super relevant without Deprive.
- Dismember: Kills Siege Rhino, Angler, Germ, Exarch... everything. Tried 2; was too many. This is more of a flex slot right now but so far I think it's the best option. The card is very versatile and powerful and doesn't see enough play in this format IMO. Miles better than Roast, and Roast is a pretty strong effect in this kind of deck (obviously 2 CMC sucks).
- All these Simic Charms: Simic Charm is the real deal. I was often elated to draw my single copy in game 1s. Every mode is stellar in this deck. The +3/+3 saves your guy, bolts their face, or does both; Hexproof even stops Sower of Temptation (see tournament report). And I don't need to tell you how much Delver loves Vapor Snag. But yeah, all the #basic Snags are gone; the utility Charm offers us, especially against Abzan (trampling over a Rhino is insane), is just better. Games 2 and 3 are longer anyway so it's not so bad to have a 2CMC spell, and it strengthens the Shoal-for-2 plan (relevant vs. some decks like Affinity).
So yeah, a lot of innovations here. I've been testing nonstop and am very happy with the direction the list is headed. While I'm a little sad to have these gorgeous foil Baubles doing nothing, the thrill of getting close to beating Abzan - and, by extension, breaking the format - keeps me going. I played in a local tonight (Massachusetts for the summer, so new stores!) and went 3-1, beating BUG Infect, Merfolk, Blue Moon, and losing to Abzan. THAT SAID, I couldn't find 2 SB Simic Charm or 2 MB Curiosity on time for the event, so I ran 2 Snag SB and 2 Bauble MB as replacements. No doubt the new tech would have helped me out a fair bit.
Plan:
-2 Mishra's Bauble
-3 Hooting Mandrills
-2 Thought Scour
-1 Stubborn Denial
+2 Ancient Grudge
+2 Destructive Revelry
+1 Dismember
+1 Flashfreeze
+2 Vapor Snag (should be Simic Charm)
Round 2 vs. Merfolk (2-0): Another easy matchup, though not quite as easy. It's very important not to get tempo'd out by their threats or try to race them on the board; removing their threats, then committing your own threats, is generally very good against Merfolk since they have no way to reload and find themselves drawing duds like Aether Vial or lonely Lords. Game 1 he has Cursecatcher into Lord into Lord and takes me down to 6 as I set up. He sacrifices Cursecatcher to counter my Serum Visions after I Scour, Visions, Visions in a turn, which is totally fine by me. I land Delver and Mandrills on the following turn, Bolt-Snap-Bolting his Lord and Silvergill. He gets a Spellskite but is forced to chump my Mandrills; I leak his Phantasmal Image for a concession. Game 2 he has a ton of Vapor Snag (thanks, Probe) to keep my Goyf at bay and save his Lord from my removal. Doesn't matter; I just want to stall him and drop a Huntmaster. I never find one, but I do eventually force through two Goyfs and a Mandrills. We race and he almost has it, but I plan just right and end up going to 1 life. Green guys close out the game. An early Destructive Revelry targeting Skite (I had cast Ancient Grudge instead) would have shaved a turn off my clock, all while baiting more Artifacts; lesson learned.
Plan
-4 Thought Scour
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-2 Mishra's Bauble
-1 Gitaxian Probe
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+2 Ancient Grudge
+2 Destructive Revelry
+1 Dismember
+2 Vapor Snag (should be Simic Charm)
Round 3 vs. Abzan Midrange (1-2): Hey, at least I won a game. G1 he has every threat, casting IoK into Finks into Tasigur into Goyf into Rhino and there's no way I can keep up. Vault of the Archangel lifelinks his team for 7. Game 2 I ride a Delver all the way to 0. He has lots of Goyfs, which I shrink with Mandrills, and a Liliana of the Veil, which nabs that Mandrills. He gets to 9 life and casts Goyf and Tasigur, but I EOT Bolt-Snap-Bolt and attack in the air for lethal. G3 he's again on the assault with Goyf, Finks, and Stirring Wildwood. I end up with a hand full of bounce and no threats (Simic Charm would notably have saved my Goyf and Mandrills), and the single Huntmaster I rip off the top doesn't quite get me there.
Plan:
-4 Thought Scour
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-2 Mishra's Bauble
-1 Lightning Bolt
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+3 Blood Moon
+1 Dismember
+1 Flashfreeze
+2 Vapor Snag (should be Simic Charm)
Round 4 vs. Blue Moon (2-0): I thought this guy was on Twin since I'd seen a little bit of his matches while circling but never finished them. Was pretty surprised by a Blood Moon turn 3 but I had a Delver and an Island. I start digging for Forest so I could cast the two Goyfs and the Mandrills in my hand. My opponent has no idea what's going on as I cast three Thought Scours and three Serum Visions. Delver eventually died, but I also eventually found that Forest. Vedalken Shackles stole a Snapcaster Mage and gave it up to take a Mandrills, but opponent failed to draw that fourth Island, instead playing copies of "Flooded Mountain" (not one of his best jokes) every turn. I get two Mandrills on the table and he passes to me before activating the Shackles, letting me Hexproof my team with a Simic Charm in response to the target at Start of Combat. I'm ready for his Cryptic Command with a Mana Leak and take him from 7 to 0. Game 2 my Probe sees Sower of Temptation, Electrolyze, and a lot of lands. I seize the opportunity to play Goyf, Snapcaster-Visions; he plays Sower on turn 4 to steal my tapped 2/3 Goyf. I untap and Vapor Snag his sower, coming for 2 with my Snapcaster Mage before fetching and emptying my Graveyard for Hooting Mandrills with UG up. He plays a land, casts Serum Visions, and tries Sower. It resolves and I Hexproof my team with Charm when he targets the Mandrills. I untap and swing, and Sower trades with Snapcaster Mage, bringing my opponent to 9. I play a Huntmaster of the Fells and a fetchland, and he untaps, plays a land, and tries Batterskull with one mana up. I Denial with Ferocious from the Mandrills for the handshake.
Plan:
-4 Thought Scour
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-2 Mishra's Bauble
-1 Lightning Bolt
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+2 Ancient Grudge
+2 Destructive Revelry
+1 Dismember
+2 Vapor Snag
On that note, I'm firmly convinced the monkeys are better than either Tasigur or Angler, especially when supplemented with Simic Charm. Trample is ultra-relevant in this strategy since getting walled by Lingering Souls and company (not Collected Company) is a very real problem faced by our Grixis cousins. It also enables Curiosity, which I'm really hoping proves as good as it's seemed.
Unrelated: have you guys seen the new Serum Visions art? L O L
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
I got curb stomped by abzan WITH goyf at a gpt and also tron, but the tron player misplayed horribly so I still managed to win. Our modern GP is not until November so for now I'm just playing weeklies in the same meta.
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
Thanks for the list. I'll give it a shot.
Have you tested the list against the new collected company decks?
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
My list:
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Hooting Mandrills
2 Snapcaster Mage
Other permanents (2)
2 Curiosity
Sorcery (8)
4 Serum Visions
4 Gitaxian Probe
Instant (19)
4 Thought Scour
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Disrupting Shoal
3 Stubborn Denial
3 Mana Leak
1 Simic Charm
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Wooded Foothills
2 Steam Vents
1 Breeding Pool
1 Stomping Ground
3 Island
1 Forest
4 Huntmaster of the Fells
3 Blood Moon
2 Destructive Revelry
2 Ancient Grudge
1 Simic Charm
1 Vapor Snag
1 Flashfreeze
1 Dismember
Plan:
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-4 Thought Scour
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+2 Ancient Grudge
+2 Destructive Revelry
Round 2 vs. Affinity (2-1): Her list looks exactly like mine; I never see a card I don’t run. Game 1 I put double Curiosity on a Tarmogoyf and draw a total of 4 cards, which lets me deal with her whole board. She has nothing but draws a Champion from the top to wall me and then kill me with a topdecked Plating. Game 2 I keep a one-lander with 2 Delvers and they both blind flip off a Bolt and a Dismember, respectively. The Aberrations race Etched Champion, Signal Pest, Ornithopter, Inkmoth Nexus, and a late Steel Overseer pretty handily. I do find a second land the turn before I push through lethal, but it enters tapped. Game 3 I plant another turn 1 Delver and she drops Opal -> Opal into turn 2 Champion, who doesn’t do much on the ground. I blind flip off a Simic Charm and start swinging. She taps out turn 3 for a Blood Moon (lol?) but I have Island in play, so I crack Misty for a Forest and have perfect mana all game. Simic saves Delver next turn from a Galvanic Blast and my turn 4 Huntmaster, backed by a pair of Bolts in hand, seals the deal.
Plan:
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-4 Thought Scour
-2 Curiosity
-1 Stubborn Denial
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+2 Ancient Grudge
+2 Destructive Revelry
+1 Simic Charm
+1 Dismember
+1 Vapor Snag (should be Simic Charm)
Round 3 vs. UR Storm (2-0): This match is a massacre. Game 1 I Probe and see some Ascensions and rituals, so I play turn 2 Goyf and follow it with Mandrills + Mana Leak. I Leak his Manamorphose and come in for an exactly lethal 8. Game 2 he mulligans three times and can’t really deal with my turn 1 Delver. He lands a Pyromancer Ascension but I shoal his Pyretic Ritual and Snapcaster a Bolt in response to his fetch to bring him from 3 to 0.
Plan:
-2 Thought Scour
-1 Simic Charm
+2 Destructive Revelry
+1 Flashfreeze
Round 4 vs. Jund (2-0): Game 1 my turn 1 Delver dies to a Lightning Bolt. I have another one, and it gets a Curiosity after Probe shows me no removal outside of Terminate and Maelstrom Pulse, which I can tempo out via countermagic. The Delver never flips (!!!), but it connects 8 times and draws me that many cards. Jund player rapidly goes to 0 cards to my invariable 5 and scoops to a Tarmogoyf. Game 2 begins the same way: his Raging Ravine, my Delver, his Lightning Bolt. My Probe that sees Confidant, Confidant, Fulminator Mage, Fulminator Mage, land. I cast Serum Visions and keep a land on top, since I only have two; I play the second one and pass. He Fulminates my Steam Vents. I draw the land, cast Mandrills with a Curiosity. He plays Confidant. I Bolt it, put another Curiosity on the Mandrills, and drown my opponent in cards. He plays a second Confidant after that and I swing into it, but he Bolts Mandrills before damage. I Simic Charm for +3/+3 and deal him 6. At one point I even have to discard 2 to go to size. My opponent fetched around Blood Moon both games, but I still brought in one copy since I was missing the third Simic Charm.
Plan:
-4 Disrupting Shoal
-4 Thought Scour
+4 Huntmaster of the Fells
+1 Simic Charm
+1 Dismember
+1 Flashfreeze
+1 Blood Moon (should have been a Simic Charm)
Thanks to those of you, by the way, who thank me for my reports. When I said awhile back that I wouldn't do them anymore if nobody read them, I really meant just that, and I didn't mean to like cry out for attention or anything. I'm glad they're helpful to the rest of you in the thread and always look forward to reading yours!
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
I have to ask. What gave you the idea to use curiosity??? How aggressively do you use it? Say if you don't have a probe and your Abzan opponent has a fetch or plains up, and you have no countermagic, do you risk
the 2 for 1? How often have you been 2 for 1'd without at least drawing one card?
Curiosity isn't just good for drawing cards. I use it sometimes to force removal on something like Snapcaster Mage or to divert opponents from my real threat; against Jund, I forgot to mention, I was able to Mana Leak his Terminate and then play a Goyf, which ended up eating the Maelstrom Pulse. Had my opponent spent that turn Pulsing my 1/1 Delver, Goyf would have come in for 5 the next turn and put him in a very tight spot; plus, if he topdecked a Lightning Bolt, he wouldn't be able to deal with the Goyf, whereas Bolt does kill Delver. Of course, Curiosity on a Delver is just as debilitating if he doesn't find an answer, and with all the counterspells I was drawing off the Enchantment, nothing he'd have found would have stuck anyway.
It's very strong against discard effects because in those matchups, like I said, I go all-in on threats, running a whopping 18 in the main (and 4 of those are Huntmasters, which kind of count as double). With this plan, I'll almost always have a body for Curiosity. Opponents generally want to take threats from your hand with discard, but if I run 18 of them, that plan isn't so great, since one threat with Curiosity draws me many more; instead, they're forced to lose tempo by stripping my Curiosity, giving me not just a turn to play my threat, but another threat. And if that threat is a Tarmogoyf, he's already bigger than Siege Rhino!
If I don't have Probe or countermagic, I'll try to assess how dire my situation is. Am I very behind on the board? Do I need to be drawing cards right now? Do I lose if I don't quickly find a specific answer to, say, the Tasigur across from me? If I answer YES to any of these questions, I'll try my luck with Curiosity. But I'll often ask myself some other questions first. How many cards does my opponent have? What removal spells have I seen this game? What are the odds he has one? Can I afford to wait? If I'm ahead on the board or trying to dodge and out-tempo removal spells, I won't even bother with Curiosity. There's no reason to win-more with this deck (any deck?). I find it's best reserved as a bomb for once you've exhausted your opponent's removal and know it's safe to cast, because in that scenario it just wins the game against attrition strategies.
I do frequently have either Probe or countermagic, but it does come up that I don't, and knowing when to take the risk with Curiosity is really important. Ideally, if I have Curiosity and Probe and something else to do on each turn with all my mana, I'll wait to Probe (even if I don't have turn 1 Delver) until the turn I want to strap Curiosity to my threat (generally turn 3 or 4). That way I have perfect info and can at least break parity with my threat. It's just gravy that the odds my opponent topdecks an answer in his 22+-land Midrange deck work against him, so Curiosity usually draws me more cards than 1 here. That way, once he has the Bolt for my Delver, I have the Shoal for his Bolt.
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=85214
Congrats friend, you earned it.
OLD SCHOOL 93/94 «The Pain Train» Black Sligh, Esper «Machine Gun» Artifacts, Jund «Psycho» Ponza-Disko.
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
Can't wait for the report.
It was not delight, not wonder that arose among us, it was the peace of heaven. He who has thought most deeply loves what is most alive. - Friedrich Holderlin
1907 Constructed Rating on Magic Online.
Modern
WUBRG
A few questions:
You would run 3 charm in the 75?
Have you considered any of these counters: izzet charm, spell pierce, or spell snare? I mean, I'm sure you have, just wondering why none are worth playing. In this vein, why also no more deprive?
Did you like the fourth Huntmaster?
Given how often the shoals come out, why do you not start them in the board?
Are you always cutting scour if you cut shoal? If not, which matchups do the scours stay in for?
Thanks again in advance. Also, if you could be so kind as to provide a current board plan vs the major decks, that would be awesome. PPTQ coming up this weekend for modern, your list is my top contender right now. Hope to bring it home.
ORIGINALITY CAN WIN
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=85214
Standard
UB UB Midrange UB
Modern
GRWUBTribal Flames ZooGRWUB
RUGTemur DelverRUG
Legacy
UW Stoneblade UW
http://www.twitch.tv/calebdmtg