What results? Winning a pptq is about as hard as winning an FNM and we both know it.
Your last point was about chandra and the state of our other 4 drops, that was just my 10 cents our best '4' drop is secretly a 3 drop that you play before your land for turn, just like in old standard. I agree Huntmaster is great, that's why I play it. But walking into a blind meta is not something I would do without P&K, even with Deathshadow on the downshift.
Probably going to ruin the four drop debate entirely now, but I actually main-board Thrun, the Last Troll. Part of that is my local meta - where removal and counterspells are both frequently found - but also just because I like consistency in my cards. Thrun does not die to Push, Path, or Bolt. Regeneration also makes him exceptionally good at blocking Deathshadow if I need him to. P&K just feel a bit too risky for the reasons frozencajun mentions above, though if you are main boarding other artifacts I could see them having much more lasting value. I run 2 Thrun, 3 Huntmaster, and 2 Chandra in the 4-drop slot.
I wouldn't leave the house without the king of trolls in my SB, and if my local meta shifted I would probably feel comfortable maining it. I beat blue moon t death with it the other week, and because control runs Verdict over wrath Thrun is just a house againt them.
Spell Queller is a real problem, actually. Ponza tends not to main much removal and the removal I do have in the side kills my dorks as well, or in the case of Beast Within gives them a beat-stick. Might be a good time to post my most recent list, for the communities judgement. Do I want to get rid of the one Thragtusk? And if so what would you all switch around? I am really interested in experimenting with Crumble to Dust and possibly putting in a third Trinisphere.
The reason I've been told that we don't already run Crumble to Dust is that it improves matchups that are already really good - our Tron matchup, for example - while being a worse Stone Rain against our difficult matchups.
I would add to that, Crumble to Dust although kind of win-more, also does not prevent the Tron opponent from winning through a moon. For example they get their basic Waste and keep it, so are able to still play Thought-Knot and Reality Smash you to death. Crumble does not help with that at all.
A question for those with experience in the match-up. How do we fight against Dredge... many of the spells that they cast are red, so do we board out all blood moon?
A question for those with experience in the match-up. How do we fight against Dredge... many of the spells that they cast are red, so do we board out all blood moon?
I have a different experience. KEEP MOONS IN!!!! They play almost no basics. Takes them off casting loam to pump their conflags, and keeps them off casting stink weed imps to block your fatties.
I have a main board Scooze, and bring in 3 relics and 2 angers. I am yet to drop a game to dredge in 4 games. But in both pre board games I saw my scooze
I lost to breach titan again last night. Game 1 I brought the beatdown and he had 5 cards in hand and 4 land. Those 5 cards were breach, breach, emrakul, woodfall primus and ssg. I didn't even care about the emrakul, took 15 and went to 7, saccing clues and lands, then primus took my moon, provided a big blocker and his next draws were lands and a primetime. GG
Game 2 he just got me with inevatibility with my moon getting back to natured and him having a bigger late game.
The dark dwellers build was much better performing in this matchup, I think in my current build I actually do want a crumble or 2.
A question for those with experience in the match-up. How do we fight against Dredge... many of the spells that they cast are red, so do we board out all blood moon?
I have a different experience. KEEP MOONS IN!!!! They play almost no basics. Takes them off casting loam to pump their conflags, and keeps them off casting stink weed imps to block your fatties.
I have a main board Scooze, and bring in 3 relics and 2 angers. I am yet to drop a game to dredge in 4 games. But in both pre board games I saw my scooze
I've faced Dredge only in Legacy... I sort of expect the Modern version to be a little bit weaker than the legacy one.. they don't have the zombies + Fkz combo here.
Hmm, so different experiences in the Dredge match-up? Ok, I'll leave two Blood Moon in on game 2 against them. Thanks for reminding me about the imp, I suppose our titan etb ability and attack trigger can get rid of the stinkweed imp, so I'll leave the titan in too.
I am also a big fan of Tracker. She has earned her spot as far as I am concerned. The fact the deck runs 8'ish fetches gives us a lot of clues, plus she can easily become a game-winning beat-stick in the right environment. The combo with Pia and Kiran is quite exciting to be sure (if you're running them). The clues are also useful against Emrakul.
Regards this not being a T2 deck: Soon! It won't be long. In my opinion - and clearly yours - we're already there, but just need a few more results. From a perfectly selfish point of view, I am kinda glad. I don't own the full deck in paper yet and wouldn't want to see any price spike as a result of a Tier jump.
Hmm, we're still a pinned thread even though the thread did not graduate to tier 2.. this deck is still strong.
Anyway, I own most of the deck on paper now... just ordered another batch from SCG today. Going to try a single Thundermaw Hellkite in place of the third stormbreath. Chose the thundermaw since he kills some annoying fliers in my meta, like flickerwisp and souls tokens.
Just need to save up some cash to buy the last pieces... 4 sprawl, 2 trinisphere, and one more moon.
Can someone briefly clue me in to the difference between "regular" Ponza and Monster Ponza? Which cards are different/what are current prototypic lists and what is the result in terms of gameplay and matchup? I've read through most of the recent pages but I'm afraid I'm missing the forest for the trees, as it were.
Tireless Tracker is probably the 2nd best creature card in the deck behind Stormbreath Dragon. So much value in one card. A decent topdeck as it makes every topdeck land after actually relevant. Self pumping while drawing cards is worth the 3 mana investment. I have had GDS players push him after I crack a fetch to prevent more clue tokens. T2 Tracker into T3 into Acid Moss feels great. I would run 4 copies but we already run so many 3 drops that we need to still fill out the remainder of our curve so I just run 3.
Tireless Tracker is probably the 2nd best creature card in the deck behind Stormbreath Dragon. So much value in one card. A decent topdeck as it makes every topdeck land after actually relevant. Self pumping while drawing cards is worth the 3 mana investment. I have had GDS players push him after I crack a fetch to prevent more clue tokens. T2 Tracker into T3 into Acid Moss feels great. I would run 4 copies but we already run so many 3 drops that we need to still fill out the remainder of our curve so I just run 3.
Once I am comfortable with my lands on board in a long game I tend to sandbag a fetch or 2 lands, just so long as I am not screwing myself out of something ( like monstrosity 3) Makes that top deck tracker an absolute back breaker.
Your last point was about chandra and the state of our other 4 drops, that was just my 10 cents our best '4' drop is secretly a 3 drop that you play before your land for turn, just like in old standard. I agree Huntmaster is great, that's why I play it. But walking into a blind meta is not something I would do without P&K, even with Deathshadow on the downshift.
Watch out for Spella Quella tho.
2 Trinisphere
Creature
4 Arbor Elf
1 Thragtusk
2 Inferno Titan
3 Stormbreath Dragon
2 Thrun, the Last Troll
3 Huntmaster of the Fells
3 Tireless Tracker
Enchantment
4 Utopia Sprawl
4 Blood Moon
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
3 Stomping Ground
10 Forest
1 Mountain
Planeswalker
2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
Sorcery
1 Primal Command
3 Mwonvuli Acid-Moss
4 Stone Rain
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Obstinate Baloth
2 Abrade
1 Boil
1 Fracturing Gust
2 Beast Within
3 Anger of the Gods
I would add to that, Crumble to Dust although kind of win-more, also does not prevent the Tron opponent from winning through a moon. For example they get their basic Waste and keep it, so are able to still play Thought-Knot and Reality Smash you to death. Crumble does not help with that at all.
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Want to play a UW control deck in modern, but don't have jace or snaps?
Please come visit us at the Emeria Titan control thread
Yup Bloodmoons are useless against dredge. Do not stone rain Dakmor Salvage. Postboard, beware of Darkblast and Collective Brutality.
I have a main board Scooze, and bring in 3 relics and 2 angers. I am yet to drop a game to dredge in 4 games. But in both pre board games I saw my scooze
I lost to breach titan again last night. Game 1 I brought the beatdown and he had 5 cards in hand and 4 land. Those 5 cards were breach, breach, emrakul, woodfall primus and ssg. I didn't even care about the emrakul, took 15 and went to 7, saccing clues and lands, then primus took my moon, provided a big blocker and his next draws were lands and a primetime. GG
Game 2 he just got me with inevatibility with my moon getting back to natured and him having a bigger late game.
The dark dwellers build was much better performing in this matchup, I think in my current build I actually do want a crumble or 2.
I've faced Dredge only in Legacy... I sort of expect the Modern version to be a little bit weaker than the legacy one.. they don't have the zombies + Fkz combo here.
Hmm, so different experiences in the Dredge match-up? Ok, I'll leave two Blood Moon in on game 2 against them. Thanks for reminding me about the imp, I suppose our titan etb ability and attack trigger can get rid of the stinkweed imp, so I'll leave the titan in too.
Nexus MTG News // Nexus - Magic Art Gallery // MTG Dual Land Color Ratios Analyzer // MTG Card Drawing Odds Calculator
Want to play a UW control deck in modern, but don't have jace or snaps?
Please come visit us at the Emeria Titan control thread
Salty. If Modo wasn't going to die I might buy this deck and grind. Hell, might anyway after I finish moving.
Any thoughts on what to say about Tireless Tracker, your personal inclusions, or other things you consider fundamental nowadays?
Regards this not being a T2 deck: Soon! It won't be long. In my opinion - and clearly yours - we're already there, but just need a few more results. From a perfectly selfish point of view, I am kinda glad. I don't own the full deck in paper yet and wouldn't want to see any price spike as a result of a Tier jump.
Anyway, I own most of the deck on paper now... just ordered another batch from SCG today. Going to try a single Thundermaw Hellkite in place of the third stormbreath. Chose the thundermaw since he kills some annoying fliers in my meta, like flickerwisp and souls tokens.
Just need to save up some cash to buy the last pieces... 4 sprawl, 2 trinisphere, and one more moon.
Nexus MTG News // Nexus - Magic Art Gallery // MTG Dual Land Color Ratios Analyzer // MTG Card Drawing Odds Calculator
Want to play a UW control deck in modern, but don't have jace or snaps?
Please come visit us at the Emeria Titan control thread
Once I am comfortable with my lands on board in a long game I tend to sandbag a fetch or 2 lands, just so long as I am not screwing myself out of something ( like monstrosity 3) Makes that top deck tracker an absolute back breaker.
I pretty much only play on MTGO, so I'm not sure what the most efficient build would be