MTG Salvation

Went to a modern FNM last night, trying some minor changes to the deck list, and I did alright. Aside from terrible draws, the matches were all fairly good.



Match 1: RG Land Destruction: (0-2)

Match 2: Lantern Control: (2-1)

Match 3: Jund (0-2)

Match 4: Naya Burn (2-1)

Match 5: Something?
Opponent was a no show, so I won this one in 2.

Overall record 3-2; 6-6; placed 9th out of 18.

I never got to cast Epiphany, which was what I wanted to test, but I put it in last minute, swapping out a Signet. Not sure if that was the right swap nor what the right swap is.

The matches I lost, I lost mostly due to poor luck, so I'm still pretty happy with the deck list as is. Ratchet Bomb was an all-star out of the board in the Lantern matchup, so I think that slot is going to stay, because of its versatility.

For those running Epiphany, do you find yourself wanting to run two Academy Ruins?

Is anyone else getting wrecked by Nahiri? Had squelch for the -8 backed up with negate and still lost the counter war. Ran into the deck 3 straight times and every time I see her, I lose. Seems to have given UWR some inevitability. Not greatly experienced with U-Tron. Need help!!!

Edit: Now 4th straight match. Flavor of the month? Lost 1-2 again. Grafdigger's cage wasn't an answer either. Worked for a while but fell to a sideboarded Wear//Tear. RoP'd my graveyard, turning off Academy Ruins. Pushed through O-Stone. Feels bad right now. Game 2 Jester's Cap for all 3 Nahiri's felt sooooo good though. Ugin, -4 to exile Nahiri at 6, then losing it to bolt, only to see Nahiri #2 come down 1 turn later. Twice today.

I've gone 3-0 against her thus far, and frankly it's been pretty easy. She never resolves against me, and sometimes she isn't even cast because I'm landing a Sundering Titan with counterspell backup to end the game on the spot.

Quote from valentine69a »

Quote from Tolaria2021 »

A big thank you to pierakor, I watched all of the matches you have published and think you have the best list.

NOO WAY MAN! shoktroopas list is sick as hell man! i play shoktroopas list on paper and i crush my local meta with it! and most of my local meta is actually bad matchups for me. Burn, Affinity, Death and taxes, UG Infect, there are only a few good ones in my meta like UR delver. american control. esper control. Jund, Abzan, RG tron. solemn is definitely better in a control deck then tks he lets your opponent draw a card ffs. not only that but kharniverous/Shoktroopa hand crafted this bad boy himself. yes pierakors an awesome guy and has a good win percentage. but its still not as good as troopas win percentage and going around saying that you think he has the best list is a mistake in my opinion. he has a good list. but troopas is far more solid and i have literally won thousands of magic games with it. I won a local tournament with mono U tron in australia on friday. didnt lose a single game. I came 1st out of 52 players. and most of them were playing "Tier 1 Decks" troopas list crushes.

If the shoktroopas style is more powerful than pierakor's list, what makes it more powerful? Can you provide any analysis that demonstrates some sort of power increase of shoktroopas list? You come across as rather biased.

I feel that a person who writes: "I watched all of the matches you have published" may also be biased. At the end of the day, each list is valid and has strengths where the other has weaknesses. It's up to play preference. Both players are great players and deck builders. Can we not just leave it at that? I tire of hearing this stupid argument.

Evidence: shoktroopa consistently 5-0's and 4-1's leagues with an equal if not better overall win percentage. He is, however, more quiet about it.

Yeah the guy who expressed such originally also seemed bias. I'm honestly not interested in how well individuals perform. There's too many variables at play, and also sample size stuff, for that sort of data to pose significance on questions like "how many Talismans should I run?".

Haven't actually read much regarding this, besides pierakors FAQ.

I have watched all of the matches pierakor has published/posted. What is your problem? Okay cool shoktroopa's list is the best! Can we talk about other things now?

Not sure why such a fundamental decision for building this deck is dismissed like so, I guess people have heard enough of this topic already.

Wouldn't certain deck configurations be stronger under certain meta considerations, and with different pilot playstyle/strengths? If one is playing in a meta that has a stronger affinity presence, and much artifact hate because of so, wouldn't Talismans be not as strong here? Not necessairly saying that using a Talismans would be bad in this meta, but that it might be a contributing factor for them not being as strong as perhaps another variant. I'd imagine in a slower meta, Talismans would be stronger due to them facilitating a "faster, rampier" list.

You all have some really good points. I have played Shoktroopas list on paper for a very long time and i win atleast 70% of the time if not more. In saying that though. there are only a couple of affinity decks in my local meta. and there isnt as much artifact hate. most of the decks in my meta are things like jund, abzan, american control, U/G infect, kiki chord, gifts, R/G tron, death and taxes, living end, a ton of stuff. but yeah i think omnimirage has a good point. if i were in a meta that had more artifact hate then maybe talismans wouldnt be as good and going the extra lands would be better. Like i said earlier. i think Pierakor is awesome. he has great win percentages and a good decklist. i just think that troopas list is more solid and just didnt like someone saying that pierakors list is "the best" because shoktroopa actually invented this deck and he has very good reasons for literally every single card in his deck and has talked about it at some length. none of us would even play this deck if he hadn't invented it. but yeah im biased. i run his list on paper and feel it to be the most solid.

Quote from omnimirage »

Wouldn't certain deck configurations be stronger under certain meta considerations, and with different pilot playstyle/strengths? If one is playing in a meta that has a stronger affinity presence, and much artifact hate because of so, wouldn't Talismans be not as strong here? Not necessairly saying that using a Talismans would be bad in this meta, but that it might be a contributing factor for them not being as strong as perhaps another variant. I'd imagine in a slower meta, Talismans would be stronger due to them facilitating a "faster, rampier" list.

I 100% agree with you on this.

Any links to places where Shoktroopa has been talking about his list indepth? I'm quite interested in reading about this sort of analysis.

he has talked about certain cards on this forum. and he sometimes talks about cards when he streams.

Troopa talks about his card choices all the time on this forum.

Things like this:
Reasons I have not ran Thought-knot Seer.
1. It doesn't say Solemn Simulacrum.
2. It doesn't find me a basic, and lacks the blocking abilities of solemn simulacrum. Solemn essentially sacrifices himself to block 99% of the time.. So the free draw for us is better than your opponent drawing a card.
3. I'm not going to look at TKS as a "win condition". Nor do I ever want my opponent to draw a card when they destroy it.
4. The "look at opponents hand and take a card" and 4/4 body isn't what this deck needs. this would be Resources, chump blocks to prolong the game, and draw cards. TKS doesn't make us an aggressive deck.
5. Essentially he is 4/4 painless thoughtseize that can come down t3 with tron or in most the lists i've seen which baffles my mind is turn 4.
If you are trying to use TKS as a tempo card please for love of basic fundamentals and philosophies run talismans in your list.
6. Solemn simulacrum is AWESOME t3 with tron because you are ramping into a U.. having 7UU or 9U up t4 opens up the world, and having a free blocker that you draws you card is very threatening in itself. Or you can visit rampville, play solemn t3 off a talisman and have 6 mana up for that wurmcoil engine for thrist / counter.. whatever options up from having a guaranteed blue or in most cases multiple Blue.
7. TKS does not pitch to Thirst for knowledge.

This is what im talking about when troopa talks about what cards he uses. this is a direct quote of his from the forum.

I can see where he's coming from on these points, honestly. I tried to use Thought-Knot Seer as a way to fend off aggro and have some earlier interaction in the midrange game, and it's been close, but no cigar. It can do something Solemn Simulacrum can't, and that's close out a game while you have shields up to catch whatever your opponent throws at it. On the other hand, it doesn't get you U when you need it, it doesn't let you trade it in for a fresh card in bad situations (in fact, it gives your opponent a card), and it isn't fetchable. Furthermore, I've had what feels like a dozen games now where I've whiffed on its ETB Thoughtseize ability, because my opponent had already emptied out their hand before I cast it (which makes it a 4/4 with a strict drawback). I think I'm going back to the sad little robot.

I watched all of Pierakors games and I think his list is the best

Quote from pierakor »

I watched all of Pierakors games and I think his list is the best

Of course your not biased at all right?

Quote from cowboycoco »

Is anyone else getting wrecked by Nahiri? Had squelch for the -8 backed up with negate and still lost the counter war. Ran into the deck 3 straight times and every time I see her, I lose. Seems to have given UWR some inevitability. Not greatly experienced with U-Tron. Need help!!!

Edit: Now 4th straight match. Flavor of the month? Lost 1-2 again. Grafdigger's cage wasn't an answer either. Worked for a while but fell to a sideboarded Wear//Tear. RoP'd my graveyard, turning off Academy Ruins. Pushed through O-Stone. Feels bad right now. Game 2 Jester's Cap for all 3 Nahiri's felt sooooo good though. Ugin, -4 to exile Nahiri at 6, then losing it to bolt, only to see Nahiri #2 come down 1 turn later. Twice today.

The other option with Ugin is to +2 him and bolt the Nahiri, which eventually would take her down. Then once out of bolt range it would be safe to -4 him. Or keep +2ing Ugin up for Ult.

So, I've been playing Mono U Tron for a long time and I have to ask . . . do you guys ever actually board in Aetherize? I think I only bring it in in the Zoo matchups where I'm probably dead before I have 4 mana anyway and against Merfolk where it's done some work. No other matchups really make me want it. Against Bogle and Infect there are much better cards and there just aren't many decks that go wide in the format nowadays.

Yeah, the problem is that the decks it'd be good against are killing you unless you have a great mana start, and if it's that good you can frequently put down an Ugin, the Spirit Dragon and sweep them all away. I prefer Cyclonic Rift, to be honest.