Steppe Lynx is still a viable option in the deck, but I feel that it only fits in the most aggressive versions of the deck. Most people like to run some amount of counter magic and disruption in their decks and [c]Steppe Lynx is worse in those situations. I think steppe lynx has been forgotten, but I don't necessarily think that means it's unplayable.
I have to agree with Dennis that I prefer Soul Scar Mage in my personal build because he offers more utility to the deck and works well against some of our worst matchups like GBx and Eldrazi. With that said, if someone is playing a very aggressive style WUR delver deck, steppe lynx might be a better option.
Most people like to run some amount of counter magic and disruption in their decks and [c]Steppe Lynx is worse in those situations.
Can you clarify what you mean here? Steppe Lynx and Delver is good with countermagic because you can just play lands and keep mana open for the opponents turn, as opposed to Swiftspear and soul scar mage, which are very bad with countermagic, because you'll have to play spells before combat damage on your own turn for them to do decent damage and be a decent clock.
Most people like to run some amount of counter magic and disruption in their decks and [c]Steppe Lynx is worse in those situations.
Can you clarify what you mean here? Steppe Lynx and Delver is good with countermagic because you can just play lands and keep mana open for the opponents turn, as opposed to Swiftspear and soul scar mage, which are very bad with countermagic, because you'll have to play spells before combat damage on your own turn for them to do decent damage and be a decent clock.
Sorry for the confusion. I should have elaborated on what I meant and that was a rather clumsy statement. In a nutshell what I was trying to convey is that the prowess creatures (swiftspear and soul scar mage) were a better late game draw than steppe lynx. Typically decks that run counter magic go later in the game than super aggressive versions and the utility offered by swiftspear and soul scar mage make them better in later turns in my opinion. Steppe Lynx as a 0/1 loses some of its effectivness after turn 1,2,3 which are the turns we play most of our lands and fetch lands. Whereas cards like swiftspear with haste and soul scar mage with -1/-1 counters are early drop creatures that offer guaranteed damage in the mid to later turns where we are likely to play multiple spells, where their utility is valuable, and where we will likely miss land drops. With that said, there are very few delver decks that like to go past turn 6-8 so very often Steppe Lynxis likely just as good. I think it really comes down to a matter of preference and deck construction.
I should remove Soul Scar Mage from the conversation because he is a slightly different creature from swiftspear and steppe lynx in some sense. While he is an early drop with prowess, soul scar mage offers additional utility beyond damage that they don't. If we just compare steppe lynx and swiftspear I think the choice really comes down to deck construction and preference. I don't think one is "better" than the other, just that Monastery Swiftspear fits into more decks under the current most popular style of jeskai tempo deck.
In terms of a direct comparison Swiftspear and Steppe Lynx fit very nearly the same role. Both demand an aggressive slant to the deck construction. I totally understand what you are saying about Steppe Lynx being able to grow by just playing lands and holding up spells and to be totally honest I hadn't thought of that when I responded. In my personal preference I find that much of the strength of the jeskai shard in particular is the ability to play a greater number of efficient spells than the opponent while playing fewer lands. Because the newer iterations of jeskai tempo decks often have a lower CMC curve with fewer lands, the prowess mechanic is typically better served throughout the game than the landfall mechanic in style of jeskai tempo/delver that I prefer to play in particular.
As I stated before, I don't think Steppe Lynx is a bad option, moreso a forgotten option. Because my personal deck revolves more around casting more spells than my opponent and versatility, I prefer the prowess one drop creatures over the steppe lynx. It really comes down to deck construction and I do think many people would be suprised with how powerful steppe lynx really is if they gave him a chance. I have been playing this deck since the boremandos days so I have cast my far share of steppe lynx :). I even played Figure of Destiny at one point to get more one drops into the deck. However, with the addition of the prowess creatures I have fallen in love with them and the prowess mechanic in general.
After reading the newest article on Modern Nexus I began to wonder about possible unbannings in modern and how they would affect our deck. The two options the article is going to look at are Preordain and Dig Through Time. I think both would be a massive boost to our deck, but they would fit different functions. Preordain would benefit the more tempo oriented deck and would obviously be put into any deck running serum visions.
Dig Through Time is another issue all together. It would definitely find a spot in the deck, but how many would we run? Possibly two copies. Maybe more in the more midrange style builds with more powerful cards.
On that note I decided I might test each of these cards in my build in my next playtesting group just to see if they seem OP enough to be banned. I thought it would be a fun experiment and I will get back to you guys/gals with the results.
After reading the newest article on Modern Nexus I began to wonder about possible unbannings in modern and how they would affect our deck. The two options the article is going to look at are Preordain and Dig Through Time. I think both would be a massive boost to our deck, but they would fit different functions. Preordain would benefit the more tempo oriented deck and would obviously be put into any deck running serum visions.
Dig Through Time is another issue all together. It would definitely find a spot in the deck, but how many would we run? Possibly two copies. Maybe more in the more midrange style builds with more powerful cards.
On that note I decided I might test each of these cards in my build in my next playtesting group just to see if they seem OP enough to be banned. I thought it would be a fun experiment and I will get back to you guys/gals with the results.
Preordain would slot right into Serum Vision's spot, as it's a pretty solid upgrade. Might even run some Visions to compliment them. Dig Through Time would make me beyond happy. I'd probably test 2-3 copies to start with. I just want Stoneforge Mystic off the banlist and in my life.
Just found out there's an SCG IQ in my town in a few weeks. Time for me to stop messing around with other decks and start tuning UWR Delver, as I plan on running that for the event. I've been toying with a maindeck Negate that's actually been pretty good so far. I swapped my singleton Remand for it. I mostly need to figure out my 1-of creature and 2-of spell flex spots from my main core. Then, I need to start figuring out sideboards. I assume I'll be seeing a good portion of Death's Shadow, Abzan Company, and Tron/Eldrazi. Tron is always a big player in my area, as is Ad Nauseam. Here's how I currently have my sideboard configured.
I'm still unsure on Mindcensor, as I haven't played him in a tournament yet. Meddling Mage is still overperforming for me. I'm interested to hear what SB cards are working for y'all.
At least 2 Stony Silence is mandatory for me, it's one of the big upsides of playing white imo. Affinity is big now, and it can be backbreaking against tron and other mana-rock decks like Ad Nauseam. I want 3 graveyard hosers now because Dredge and Storm is popular. Relic comes in against BG/x and grixis (and other snapcaster decks) too, as well as Celestial Purge, to get Lilianas, shadows, tasigurs etc. Staticaster is house against the new vizier company decks. Blessed alliance is great against +4 toughness and hexproof creatures, as well as burn, so it's pretty flexible. Wear/tear and explosives are also nice, flexible answers.
Aven Mindcensor should be good against scapeshift, but I haven't had much success with it. A bit ureliable. I used to have it in my 75, but took it out.
At least 2 Stony Silence is mandatory for me, it's one of the big upsides of playing white imo. Affinity is big now, and it can be backbreaking against tron and other mana-rock decks like Ad Nauseam. I want 3 graveyard hosers now because Dredge and Storm is popular. Relic comes in against BG/x and grixis (and other snapcaster decks) as well as Celestial Purge, to get Lilianas, shadows, tasigurs etc. Staticaster is house against the new vizier company decks. I like some amount of static. Blessed alliance is great against +4 toughness and hexproof creatures, as well as burn, so it's pretty flexible. Wear/tear and explosives are also nice, flexible answers.
Aven Mindcensor should be good against scapeshift, but I haven't had much success with it. A bit ureliable. I used to have it in my 75, but took it out.
I think I'm starting to lean more towards some of your choices as well. I tested some sideboarded games last night and don't think Mindcensor is very good. I don't feel unfavored against Scapeshift enough to warrant the slot. I'm bouncing between Wear//Tear and Surgical Extraction, or the enchantment package of Stony Silence and RiP.
At least 2 Stony Silence is mandatory for me, it's one of the big upsides of playing white imo. Affinity is big now, and it can be backbreaking against tron and other mana-rock decks like Ad Nauseam. I want 3 graveyard hosers now because Dredge and Storm is popular. Relic comes in against BG/x and grixis (and other snapcaster decks) as well as Celestial Purge, to get Lilianas, shadows, tasigurs etc. Staticaster is house against the new vizier company decks. I like some amount of static. Blessed alliance is great against +4 toughness and hexproof creatures, as well as burn, so it's pretty flexible. Wear/tear and explosives are also nice, flexible answers.
Aven Mindcensor should be good against scapeshift, but I haven't had much success with it. A bit ureliable. I used to have it in my 75, but took it out.
I think I'm starting to lean more towards some of your choices as well. I tested some sideboarded games last night and don't think Mindcensor is very good. I don't feel unfavored against Scapeshift enough to warrant the slot. I'm bouncing between Wear//Tear and Surgical Extraction, or the enchantment package of Stony Silence and RiP.
Against Living End and Death's Shadow, I want RiP every time. But, Surgical and Snapcaster are pretty brutal together against just about everything else. Surgical has the added benefit of being good in matchups that I wouldn't necessarily use RiP.
The Magma Spray is a concession to how popular Abzan Company is getting again, and the Stony Silence is just better against a larger number of decks that run artifacts. Surgical Extraction is being tested over Rest in Peace and I'm going to play a few games against a great local Dredge player to see how it goes.
Do you side in the 2 dispels against vizier company?
Yeah. The beat down plan for the Vizier Company deck is weaker than the old Abzan CoCo, so Dispel is an efficient way to shut down the way they get back into the game.
Do you side in the 2 dispels against vizier company?
Yeah. The beat down plan for the Vizier Company deck is weaker than the old Abzan CoCo, so Dispel is an efficient way to shut down the way they get back into the game.
Okay. I managed to lose a game against the vizier company deck today when I ramped them so much with path and snap+path, that they got to play several companies and comboed off with chord. Couldn't find a counterspell. What do you side out and in in the matchup?
Do you side in the 2 dispels against vizier company?
Yeah. The beat down plan for the Vizier Company deck is weaker than the old Abzan CoCo, so Dispel is an efficient way to shut down the way they get back into the game.
Okay. I managed to lose a game against the vizier company deck today when I ramped them so much with path and snap+path, that they got to play several companies and comboed off with chord. Couldn't find a counterspell. What do you side out and in in the matchup?
From my personal list, I'll usually take out the one-ofs in Cryptic, Remand, and I'll shave a Mana Leak for the two Dispel and a Magma Spray. Flyers are very good at pressuring them, and I think Engineered Explosives is too slow. Cryptic feels way slow as well since their combo can be assembled so quickly. I want to drop my curve some and have as much removal as possible.
Had another good run at our weekly modern tournament last night. Went 4-1 and locked 3rd place. I feel like I could have easily gone 5-0, but I lost to variance in game 3 against Abzan Company.
Rounds were as follows:
Jeskai Control 2-1
Jund 2-0
UW Control 2-1
Abzan Company 1-2
Dredge 2-1
Surgical was great against Dredge, but I got pretty lucky having it in my starting hand games 2 and 3. I might increase the number to three in the sideboard, if I stick with it over RiP.
Gideon continues to dominate the fair matchups. Single-handidly won me the match against Jund. Hope my testing continues to be solid through the IQ in two weeks. Fingers crossed.
Decided to drop Cryptic for another Remand. I think the card is actually well-suited for the meta right now. I also wanted a little more velocity in the early/mid game. Will report back after FNM this Friday.
Surgical was great against Dredge, but I got pretty lucky having it in my starting hand games 2 and 3. I might increase the number to three in the sideboard, if I stick with it over RiP.
RIP feels more solid against Living End, though, affecting all the creatures in their grave. And the forced lifeloss to cast it can be relevant sometimes. It's definitely a better card in grixis, with synergy with discard and fatal push/terminate. We're not that good at getting their cards in the grave with our paths, remands etc.
Surgical was great against Dredge, but I got pretty lucky having it in my starting hand games 2 and 3. I might increase the number to three in the sideboard, if I stick with it over RiP.
RIP feels more solid against Living End, though, affecting all the creatures in their grave. And the forced lifeloss to cast it can be relevant sometimes. It's definitely a better card in grixis, with synergy with discard and fatal push/terminate. We're not that good at getting their cards in the grave with our paths, remands etc.
In certain matchups, RIP is definitely the better choice. For me, it comes down to having more utility in the a greater number of matchups versus the haymaker of RIP. It's not nothing that Surgical flips Delver as well. I can justify either card. It just comes down to what matchups you want to target.
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I have to agree with Dennis that I prefer Soul Scar Mage in my personal build because he offers more utility to the deck and works well against some of our worst matchups like GBx and Eldrazi. With that said, if someone is playing a very aggressive style WUR delver deck, steppe lynx might be a better option.
Can you clarify what you mean here? Steppe Lynx and Delver is good with countermagic because you can just play lands and keep mana open for the opponents turn, as opposed to Swiftspear and soul scar mage, which are very bad with countermagic, because you'll have to play spells before combat damage on your own turn for them to do decent damage and be a decent clock.
UWRUWR Delver/Lynx TempoUWR-------UWRUWR Midrange GeistUWR-------UWRUWR Nahiri ControlUWR-------UWRUWR SaheeliUWR
BGRJund / Jund ShadowBGR-------BGWAbzan / Abzan ShadowBGW
Commander (Leviathan/MTGO): UWGeist of Saint TraftUW
Sorry for the confusion. I should have elaborated on what I meant and that was a rather clumsy statement. In a nutshell what I was trying to convey is that the prowess creatures (swiftspear and soul scar mage) were a better late game draw than steppe lynx. Typically decks that run counter magic go later in the game than super aggressive versions and the utility offered by swiftspear and soul scar mage make them better in later turns in my opinion. Steppe Lynx as a 0/1 loses some of its effectivness after turn 1,2,3 which are the turns we play most of our lands and fetch lands. Whereas cards like swiftspear with haste and soul scar mage with -1/-1 counters are early drop creatures that offer guaranteed damage in the mid to later turns where we are likely to play multiple spells, where their utility is valuable, and where we will likely miss land drops. With that said, there are very few delver decks that like to go past turn 6-8 so very often Steppe Lynxis likely just as good. I think it really comes down to a matter of preference and deck construction.
I should remove Soul Scar Mage from the conversation because he is a slightly different creature from swiftspear and steppe lynx in some sense. While he is an early drop with prowess, soul scar mage offers additional utility beyond damage that they don't. If we just compare steppe lynx and swiftspear I think the choice really comes down to deck construction and preference. I don't think one is "better" than the other, just that Monastery Swiftspear fits into more decks under the current most popular style of jeskai tempo deck.
In terms of a direct comparison Swiftspear and Steppe Lynx fit very nearly the same role. Both demand an aggressive slant to the deck construction. I totally understand what you are saying about Steppe Lynx being able to grow by just playing lands and holding up spells and to be totally honest I hadn't thought of that when I responded. In my personal preference I find that much of the strength of the jeskai shard in particular is the ability to play a greater number of efficient spells than the opponent while playing fewer lands. Because the newer iterations of jeskai tempo decks often have a lower CMC curve with fewer lands, the prowess mechanic is typically better served throughout the game than the landfall mechanic in style of jeskai tempo/delver that I prefer to play in particular.
As I stated before, I don't think Steppe Lynx is a bad option, moreso a forgotten option. Because my personal deck revolves more around casting more spells than my opponent and versatility, I prefer the prowess one drop creatures over the steppe lynx. It really comes down to deck construction and I do think many people would be suprised with how powerful steppe lynx really is if they gave him a chance. I have been playing this deck since the boremandos days so I have cast my far share of steppe lynx :). I even played Figure of Destiny at one point to get more one drops into the deck. However, with the addition of the prowess creatures I have fallen in love with them and the prowess mechanic in general.
Dig Through Time is another issue all together. It would definitely find a spot in the deck, but how many would we run? Possibly two copies. Maybe more in the more midrange style builds with more powerful cards.
On that note I decided I might test each of these cards in my build in my next playtesting group just to see if they seem OP enough to be banned. I thought it would be a fun experiment and I will get back to you guys/gals with the results.
Preordain would slot right into Serum Vision's spot, as it's a pretty solid upgrade. Might even run some Visions to compliment them. Dig Through Time would make me beyond happy. I'd probably test 2-3 copies to start with. I just want Stoneforge Mystic off the banlist and in my life.
Jeskai. Builder: Yasuda Takaaki. — MTG
Top8 in PWC - PPTQ併設午後からGPT神戸 [33 Players] — 13-May-2017
Maindeck (60)
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Mantis Rider
4 Snapcaster Mage
2 Thundermaw Hellkite
Instant [20]
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lightning Helix
4 Path to Exile
2 Remand
2 Vapor Snag
Sorcery [4]
4 Serum Visions
2 Arid Mesa
1 Celestial Colonnade
2 Flooded Strand
1 Hallowed Fountain
2 Island
1 Mountain
1 Plains
1 Sacred Foundry
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Spirebluff Canal
2 Steam Vents
1 Wandering Fumarole
1 Crumble to Dust
1 Grim Lavamancer
2 Harsh Mentor
1 Keranos, God of Storms
2 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
2 Outpost Siege
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Surgical Extraction
2 Wear/Tear
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Meddling Mage
2 Dispel
2 Negate
1 Spell Pierce
2 Wear//Tear
2 Rest In Peace
2 Engineered Explosives
I'm still unsure on Mindcensor, as I haven't played him in a tournament yet. Meddling Mage is still overperforming for me. I'm interested to hear what SB cards are working for y'all.
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Steppe Lynx
4 Snapcaster Mage
3 Geist of Saint Traft
Spells: (23)
4 Serum Visions
4 Path to Exile
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Lightning Helix
2 Electrolyze
3 Remand
1 Mana Leak
1 Spell Snare
2 Cryptic Command
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Flooded Strand
4 Arid Mesa
1 Steam Vents
2 Hallowed Fountain
1 Sacred Foundry
2 Island
1 Plains
1 Mountain
1 Moorland Haunt
1 Celestial Colonnade
2 Rest in Peace
1 Relic of Progenitus
2 Stony Silence
2 Negate
1 Dispel
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Izzet Staticaster
1 Celestial Purge
1 Blessed Alliance
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1 Wear / Tear
At least 2 Stony Silence is mandatory for me, it's one of the big upsides of playing white imo. Affinity is big now, and it can be backbreaking against tron and other mana-rock decks like Ad Nauseam. I want 3 graveyard hosers now because Dredge and Storm is popular. Relic comes in against BG/x and grixis (and other snapcaster decks) too, as well as Celestial Purge, to get Lilianas, shadows, tasigurs etc. Staticaster is house against the new vizier company decks. Blessed alliance is great against +4 toughness and hexproof creatures, as well as burn, so it's pretty flexible. Wear/tear and explosives are also nice, flexible answers.
Aven Mindcensor should be good against scapeshift, but I haven't had much success with it. A bit ureliable. I used to have it in my 75, but took it out.
UWRUWR Delver/Lynx TempoUWR-------UWRUWR Midrange GeistUWR-------UWRUWR Nahiri ControlUWR-------UWRUWR SaheeliUWR
BGRJund / Jund ShadowBGR-------BGWAbzan / Abzan ShadowBGW
Commander (Leviathan/MTGO): UWGeist of Saint TraftUW
I think I'm starting to lean more towards some of your choices as well. I tested some sideboarded games last night and don't think Mindcensor is very good. I don't feel unfavored against Scapeshift enough to warrant the slot. I'm bouncing between Wear//Tear and Surgical Extraction, or the enchantment package of Stony Silence and RiP.
Has surgical been good in your testing?
UWRUWR Delver/Lynx TempoUWR-------UWRUWR Midrange GeistUWR-------UWRUWR Nahiri ControlUWR-------UWRUWR SaheeliUWR
BGRJund / Jund ShadowBGR-------BGWAbzan / Abzan ShadowBGW
Commander (Leviathan/MTGO): UWGeist of Saint TraftUW
1 Meddling Mage
2 Dispel
2 Negate
1 Spell Pierce
1 Magma Spray
2 Stony Silence
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Engineered Explosives
The Magma Spray is a concession to how popular Abzan Company is getting again, and the Stony Silence is just better against a larger number of decks that run artifacts. Surgical Extraction is being tested over Rest in Peace and I'm going to play a few games against a great local Dredge player to see how it goes.
UWRUWR Delver/Lynx TempoUWR-------UWRUWR Midrange GeistUWR-------UWRUWR Nahiri ControlUWR-------UWRUWR SaheeliUWR
BGRJund / Jund ShadowBGR-------BGWAbzan / Abzan ShadowBGW
Commander (Leviathan/MTGO): UWGeist of Saint TraftUW
Yeah. The beat down plan for the Vizier Company deck is weaker than the old Abzan CoCo, so Dispel is an efficient way to shut down the way they get back into the game.
Okay. I managed to lose a game against the vizier company deck today when I ramped them so much with path and snap+path, that they got to play several companies and comboed off with chord. Couldn't find a counterspell. What do you side out and in in the matchup?
UWRUWR Delver/Lynx TempoUWR-------UWRUWR Midrange GeistUWR-------UWRUWR Nahiri ControlUWR-------UWRUWR SaheeliUWR
BGRJund / Jund ShadowBGR-------BGWAbzan / Abzan ShadowBGW
Commander (Leviathan/MTGO): UWGeist of Saint TraftUW
From my personal list, I'll usually take out the one-ofs in Cryptic, Remand, and I'll shave a Mana Leak for the two Dispel and a Magma Spray. Flyers are very good at pressuring them, and I think Engineered Explosives is too slow. Cryptic feels way slow as well since their combo can be assembled so quickly. I want to drop my curve some and have as much removal as possible.
Rounds were as follows:
Jeskai Control 2-1
Jund 2-0
UW Control 2-1
Abzan Company 1-2
Dredge 2-1
Surgical was great against Dredge, but I got pretty lucky having it in my starting hand games 2 and 3. I might increase the number to three in the sideboard, if I stick with it over RiP.
Gideon continues to dominate the fair matchups. Single-handidly won me the match against Jund. Hope my testing continues to be solid through the IQ in two weeks. Fingers crossed.
RIP feels more solid against Living End, though, affecting all the creatures in their grave. And the forced lifeloss to cast it can be relevant sometimes. It's definitely a better card in grixis, with synergy with discard and fatal push/terminate. We're not that good at getting their cards in the grave with our paths, remands etc.
UWRUWR Delver/Lynx TempoUWR-------UWRUWR Midrange GeistUWR-------UWRUWR Nahiri ControlUWR-------UWRUWR SaheeliUWR
BGRJund / Jund ShadowBGR-------BGWAbzan / Abzan ShadowBGW
Commander (Leviathan/MTGO): UWGeist of Saint TraftUW
In certain matchups, RIP is definitely the better choice. For me, it comes down to having more utility in the a greater number of matchups versus the haymaker of RIP. It's not nothing that Surgical flips Delver as well. I can justify either card. It just comes down to what matchups you want to target.