I don't see what the plan for that GR is. Draw a bunch of cards and then draw more cards apparently. Afterwards you can draw more cards....
Has no defense or offense.
IMO RG is better/designed against death shadow decks. they will lose a lot of life points by theyrselves, and will not be able to take damage from pia revolution, allowing you to do whatever you want. You can win even without KCI if they play recklessly.
Against inifinite life decks like vizier + Kitchen Finks,you can´t relly on pia's revolution, but you can beat them with Station + KCI + huge Hangerback...
Main deck ghirapur can make shoot small creatures, and make your lock quicker against shadow decks, as well you can finish them off with it.
I've kept playing the deck I played in Vegas, with +2 Myr Retriever, -1 Mind Stone, -1 Thoughtcast in the main. I fixed up the sideboard a bit and like it now. I went 6-2 in a MOCS Monthly qualifier, and recently won 19 straight matches in the Competitive Modern Leagues, which was silly.
Hey guys. I have been testing this for about 2 weeks now, and every time I try Hangarback Walker it has been lackluster for me. The only way I have noticed it to be useful is for those "aggro" matchups to play it for 1 or 2, and use those tokens to survive until you combo out. Would it be better to just cut Hangarback completely and add more digging/ramp to get yourself going and try to combo faster? Or am I missing something?
Depends on the build. In the Pia's revolution build, you can easily net mana once they can no longer take 3.
It's also been a solid way to end a turn where I don't quite go off but end up with 8-12 mana. Going to their turn with a 4/4 or better creature that can instantly turn into 4 or more thopters has bought me several turns to actually win the game.
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Modern: -UBG Lantern Control-GW or RG or R Tron - G Stompy - C KCI Combo-
EDH: -UG Ezuri-UGZegana-BRMogis-WUBRGRamos-WBREdgar-URLocust God-WUBRBreya-BMacar-WUBrago-WEvra-
Hey guys. I have been testing this for about 2 weeks now, and every time I try Hangarback Walker it has been lackluster for me. The only way I have noticed it to be useful is for those "aggro" matchups to play it for 1 or 2, and use those tokens to survive until you combo out. Would it be better to just cut Hangarback completely and add more digging/ramp to get yourself going and try to combo faster? Or am I missing something?
Well really the hangarback is a way to 1) net you mana and provide a recurrable board presence and 2) let you find emrakul with sanctum of Ugin.
Point 2 is the primary reason for having hangarback (previously myr battlesphere) in the deck. We aren't an infinite combo, and we can't reliably draw our whole deck, so hangarback is there to provide a way to circumvent all the twiddling and time-wasting while digging for emrakul. Got the sanctum in play and 9 mana? Boom, that's probably game (hangarback for 8 nets you 10 mana, sac trawler, sac kci and one floating for 15, GG)
That's also the line that lets you comfortably win on turn two. It's technically possible to win on turn 2 without hangarback, but far less likely. You can string wins out of nowhere with the walker-sac-sanctum line when you're almost fizzled out on digging through your deck.
It also makes the combo quicker, which is a very real concern in tournaments when rounds are timed.
And finally hangarback is actually really good against a lot of the top tier decks as effectively infinite blockers for their chunky death's shadows or whatever.
I don't think the deck wants to drop the hangarback, honestly. There could however be a decent alternative (battlesphere was played and has its own advantages and disadvantages, and there may be other playable options as well in the modern card-pool that net you mana and trigger sanctum).
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Modern: G Tron, Vannifar, Jund, Druid/Vizier combo, Humans, Eldrazi Stompy (Serum Powder), Amulet, Grishoalbrand, Breach Titan, Turns, Eternal Command, As Foretold Living End, Elves, Cheerios, RUG Scapeshift
What you guys are using to represent your floating mana? in Real life games?
I have a set of signed unhinged basics, and a full-art wastes. I have these six cards in different coloured sleeves in my deckbox (along with wurmcoil tokens and 10 pegasus tokens to represent Thopter). E.g. Deck/sideboard is in purple KMCs, wurmcoil tokens in sky blue, pegasus tokens in clear KMCs and the basic lands for representing mana are in creature-collection art sleeves.
When I start going off (but not before), I reach in my deckbox and ask my opponent if they agree with me showing my mana by putting D20s on these basics lands to illustrate the colours floating. Never had any issues with judges or players that way. Mainly I just use the wastes and the forest for obvious reasons but the other colours do happen on occasion.
What you guys are using to represent your floating mana? in Real life games?
I put dice on these dividers for my colored mana count, and I put the colorless on the actual KCI in play. I usually ask opponent if that is ok, and they usually have no problems. I do own the sand colored Ultimate Guard card dividers as well, and I use one to separate my deck from my sideboard, so I have that as a backup in case the opponent does not want to put dice on a card in play (Engineered Explosives or Everflowing Chalice might have a die on it to represent counters.)
I have had many issues in the past with (petty) people attempting to get me disqualified from having basic lands in my deck box, even though they were in different color sleeves. Some people are just super salty and will try any desperate measure to win a game. There was even one time in an tournament where a guy had an issue with me printing out Cat tokens for Firecat Blitz and putting them in sleeves in front of basic lands, because there were no official tokens at the time. He said I had extra lands in my deck box, so I talked to the LGS owner and he gave me extra Goblin tokens from their stock, and I replaced the basic lands with Goblin tokens in the sleeves. Opponent was trying to pull a fast one, because he knew he was going to die that turn, which he did.
How can I save time when I start to combo... I got a warning from a judge yesterday... I´m pretty sure I've done only what the deck was supposed to do... Could someone describe how you play, announce, count manas in a real game situation, I´ve only see people playing in this deck in magic online... so I don´t know if there are better ways to represent floating mana, to announce things..
It´s very sad... Generally my opponents don´t know any of my cards, because we don´t play tarmogoyf or death shadows.. So they stop to read every card.. Scrap Thrawler has a very confusing text... so wee need to explain... People barely read things until the end, so when they kill your thrawler, you need to explain that the card triggers for itself... We becomes to be know as "the boring player" in our Local stores, nobody wants to play with us, and now I think judges just don´t sympathize with us... they look our opponents bored and just think we're doing something wrong.
People act as get destroyd by death shadow with a lot of cheap stuff is very fun..
Well, it depends on if you're taking a long time to make your decisions in between actions or not. If you've practiced the deck and you understand what you're trying to do, then it shouldn't take too long. If you're playing really slowly, and your combo turn takes lets say, 15 minutes, then I would be inclined to agree with the judge for playing slowly. If you can combo out in less than 5 minutes, and you can see the lines of play in a reasonable amount of time, then you should be fine.
Remember, there are two players at the table, with 50 minutes for both of them to split. If one person takes 20 minutes in game 1, and then you have to wait another 20 minutes for them to play slowly in game 2, then you're not going to finish the round. Just practice more and play faster for yourself. If your opponent cannot understand your lines of play, but you're playing quickly and properly, then it's your opponents fault, not yours.
It's a shame this thread is losing activity because it's so fun to play. I've been thinking about how to make the deck more consistent and I've been doing well with the following list:
The main difference between my list and the usual is that I'm only running 7 eggs with 0 Chromatic Spheres. I only need 1 egg to start comboing so I don't see the need to run so many eggs, and drawing into multiple eggs means I'm wasting turns cycling through them to draw into the other pieces instead of winning. Instead I am running more search and draw effects with 3 Glint-Nest Crane and 3 Thoughtcast to add consistency. A common complaint of Thoughtcast is that it's too slow, but casting Thoughtcast by turn 3 or 4 for 1 or 2 mana hasn't really been a problem and having more cards means I can find the sideboard answers more easily and force spells through counter magic.
The main issue I find with the deck is that it's near impossible to win through Stony Silence and to a lesser extent, Rest in Peace, if I don't draw the Nature's Claim, or if they just draw more Stony Silence/Rest in Peace than I do Nature's Claim. Currently tinkering with a transformational sideboard to beat the down with Eldrazi's instead of trying to counter their enchantments.
Is this deck playable without moxs?
Looks heaps of fun but in not willing to drop $270 on a set
In a word, no.
There unfortunately isn't an equivalent card in modern. It's *possible* to combo off with everflowing chalice and engineered explosives as your 0-drops, and you could win a few games that way, but you'd lose so much consistency it's not worth it. It's a mox-fuelled deck I'm afraid.
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Modern: G Tron, Vannifar, Jund, Druid/Vizier combo, Humans, Eldrazi Stompy (Serum Powder), Amulet, Grishoalbrand, Breach Titan, Turns, Eternal Command, As Foretold Living End, Elves, Cheerios, RUG Scapeshift
The deck can be played quite well without the moxes. I use four mishra's bauble and they work great as a replacement, the additional draw is in my opinion better since I never need the mana and baubles aren't legendary.
I also play an 18th land though, a basic island.
Hello everyone! First time poster but long time lurker on this forum I bought into this deck couple of months ago (trawler version), so fun! it is such a pity that it fell of the radar lately.
Implements are better than Spheres when you've got KCI out, but when you're digging for it, they're far inferior. This is one of the reasons I prefer the Faith's Reward/Reshape/Lotus Bloom setup over the new Scrap Trawler versions - with Lotus Blooms, the deck can muddle along for a good while before hitting KCI if it has to, whereas the new versions seem much more reliant on hitting or searching for it quickly.
How does the Faith's Reward List look like nowadays? I think the trawler list is very consistent & resilient since all your engine are artifacts and you are also able to rely on Ancient Stirring and Inventor's Fair (also sanctum of ugin really speed up things sometimes) but I don't consider myself very experienced with this archetype.
This is my (very very standard) list. Sideboard is still a mess but currently it is like that:
1x Blood Moon (Eldrazi, Tron, somewhat Valakut)
2x Defense Grid (counterspell deck)
1x Grafdigger's Cage (Part one of my GY hate package, hits company as well!)
2x Nihil Spellbomb (Part two of GY hate)
2x Kozilek's Return (Answer to creature, fetchable by stirrings)
4x Nature's Claim (Pesky enchantment answer)
2x Wurmcoil Engine (alt win con package)
1x Ghirapur AEther Grid (alt win con package vs stony silence)
Considering switching groves for industry Spire, and change the package 4 Natural State + 2 Kozilek Return to 3 Nature Claim + 2 Abrupt Decay + 1 Krosan Grip. Any insights and suggestions?
*****
I've been playing this deck for awhile now. A few things I would like to point out after learning the ins and outs of the deck and why I came up with this list:
2. The decks that I have encountered wherein I always lose to is Burn and any deck that runs counter spells. Burn is so hard to fight against mainly because of Eidolon of the Great Revel. This is where the idea of playing Galvanic Blast came into mind because we play a good chunk of artifacts for the bonus metalcraft.
3. Instead of dumping artifacts every turn and cracking them up to get a land most of the time I experienced, I just increased the land count to 19. I maybe wrong on this.
What are your thoughts?
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Not seen an RG version?
Source please
Has no defense or offense.
Against inifinite life decks like vizier + Kitchen Finks,you can´t relly on pia's revolution, but you can beat them with Station + KCI + huge Hangerback...
Main deck ghirapur can make shoot small creatures, and make your lock quicker against shadow decks, as well you can finish them off with it.
1 Academy Ruins
1 Aether Hub
1 Forest
4 Darksteel Citadel
2 Inventors' Fair
4 Sanctum of Ugin
4 Spire of Industry
Spells
4 Ancient Stirrings
1 Thoughtcast
Artifacts
4 Chromatic Sphere
4 Chromatic Star
2 Engineered Explosives
2 Everflowing Chalice
2 Hangarback Walker
4 Ichor Wellspring
4 Krark-Clan Ironworks
1 Mind Stone
4 Mox Opal
4 Terrarion
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
2 Myr Retriever
4 Scrap Trawler
1 Battle at the Bridge
3 Defense Grid
2 Ghirapur Aether Grid
1 Hangarback Walker
4 Nature's Claim
2 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Thought-Knot Seer
It's also been a solid way to end a turn where I don't quite go off but end up with 8-12 mana. Going to their turn with a 4/4 or better creature that can instantly turn into 4 or more thopters has bought me several turns to actually win the game.
EDH: -UG Ezuri-UGZegana-BRMogis-WUBRGRamos-WBREdgar-URLocust God-WUBRBreya-BMacar-WUBrago-WEvra-
Well really the hangarback is a way to 1) net you mana and provide a recurrable board presence and 2) let you find emrakul with sanctum of Ugin.
Point 2 is the primary reason for having hangarback (previously myr battlesphere) in the deck. We aren't an infinite combo, and we can't reliably draw our whole deck, so hangarback is there to provide a way to circumvent all the twiddling and time-wasting while digging for emrakul. Got the sanctum in play and 9 mana? Boom, that's probably game (hangarback for 8 nets you 10 mana, sac trawler, sac kci and one floating for 15, GG)
That's also the line that lets you comfortably win on turn two. It's technically possible to win on turn 2 without hangarback, but far less likely. You can string wins out of nowhere with the walker-sac-sanctum line when you're almost fizzled out on digging through your deck.
It also makes the combo quicker, which is a very real concern in tournaments when rounds are timed.
And finally hangarback is actually really good against a lot of the top tier decks as effectively infinite blockers for their chunky death's shadows or whatever.
I don't think the deck wants to drop the hangarback, honestly. There could however be a decent alternative (battlesphere was played and has its own advantages and disadvantages, and there may be other playable options as well in the modern card-pool that net you mana and trigger sanctum).
I have a set of signed unhinged basics, and a full-art wastes. I have these six cards in different coloured sleeves in my deckbox (along with wurmcoil tokens and 10 pegasus tokens to represent Thopter). E.g. Deck/sideboard is in purple KMCs, wurmcoil tokens in sky blue, pegasus tokens in clear KMCs and the basic lands for representing mana are in creature-collection art sleeves.
When I start going off (but not before), I reach in my deckbox and ask my opponent if they agree with me showing my mana by putting D20s on these basics lands to illustrate the colours floating. Never had any issues with judges or players that way. Mainly I just use the wastes and the forest for obvious reasons but the other colours do happen on occasion.
IF you mean the new artifact from Ixalan, I think it's too slow. Takes too long to get it going.
I put dice on these dividers for my colored mana count, and I put the colorless on the actual KCI in play. I usually ask opponent if that is ok, and they usually have no problems. I do own the sand colored Ultimate Guard card dividers as well, and I use one to separate my deck from my sideboard, so I have that as a backup in case the opponent does not want to put dice on a card in play (Engineered Explosives or Everflowing Chalice might have a die on it to represent counters.)
I have had many issues in the past with (petty) people attempting to get me disqualified from having basic lands in my deck box, even though they were in different color sleeves. Some people are just super salty and will try any desperate measure to win a game. There was even one time in an tournament where a guy had an issue with me printing out Cat tokens for Firecat Blitz and putting them in sleeves in front of basic lands, because there were no official tokens at the time. He said I had extra lands in my deck box, so I talked to the LGS owner and he gave me extra Goblin tokens from their stock, and I replaced the basic lands with Goblin tokens in the sleeves. Opponent was trying to pull a fast one, because he knew he was going to die that turn, which he did.
It´s very sad... Generally my opponents don´t know any of my cards, because we don´t play tarmogoyf or death shadows.. So they stop to read every card.. Scrap Thrawler has a very confusing text... so wee need to explain... People barely read things until the end, so when they kill your thrawler, you need to explain that the card triggers for itself... We becomes to be know as "the boring player" in our Local stores, nobody wants to play with us, and now I think judges just don´t sympathize with us... they look our opponents bored and just think we're doing something wrong.
People act as get destroyd by death shadow with a lot of cheap stuff is very fun..
Remember, there are two players at the table, with 50 minutes for both of them to split. If one person takes 20 minutes in game 1, and then you have to wait another 20 minutes for them to play slowly in game 2, then you're not going to finish the round. Just practice more and play faster for yourself. If your opponent cannot understand your lines of play, but you're playing quickly and properly, then it's your opponents fault, not yours.
4 Krark-Clan Ironworks
4 Chromatic Star
4 Ichor Wellspring
3 Terrarion
3 Mox Opal
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Mind Stone
1 Everflowing Chalice
4 Scrap Trawler
3 Glint-Nest Crane
2 Hangarback Walker
2 Myr Retriever
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
Spells
4 Ancient Stirrings
3 Thoughtcast
Lands
4 Darksteel Citadel
4 Spire of Industry
2 Inventors' Fair
2 Glimmervoid
2 Sanctum of Ugin
1 Academy Ruins
1 Grove of the Burnwillows
1 Tendo Ice Bridge
1 Forest
1 Island
The main difference between my list and the usual is that I'm only running 7 eggs with 0 Chromatic Spheres. I only need 1 egg to start comboing so I don't see the need to run so many eggs, and drawing into multiple eggs means I'm wasting turns cycling through them to draw into the other pieces instead of winning. Instead I am running more search and draw effects with 3 Glint-Nest Crane and 3 Thoughtcast to add consistency. A common complaint of Thoughtcast is that it's too slow, but casting Thoughtcast by turn 3 or 4 for 1 or 2 mana hasn't really been a problem and having more cards means I can find the sideboard answers more easily and force spells through counter magic.
The main issue I find with the deck is that it's near impossible to win through Stony Silence and to a lesser extent, Rest in Peace, if I don't draw the Nature's Claim, or if they just draw more Stony Silence/Rest in Peace than I do Nature's Claim. Currently tinkering with a transformational sideboard to beat the down with Eldrazi's instead of trying to counter their enchantments.
Looks heaps of fun but in not willing to drop $270 on a set
In a word, no.
There unfortunately isn't an equivalent card in modern. It's *possible* to combo off with everflowing chalice and engineered explosives as your 0-drops, and you could win a few games that way, but you'd lose so much consistency it's not worth it. It's a mox-fuelled deck I'm afraid.
Guess my cheapest buy in to modern will be esper spirits
I also play an 18th land though, a basic island.
How does the Faith's Reward List look like nowadays? I think the trawler list is very consistent & resilient since all your engine are artifacts and you are also able to rely on Ancient Stirring and Inventor's Fair (also sanctum of ugin really speed up things sometimes) but I don't consider myself very experienced with this archetype.
4x Chromatic Sphere
4x Chromatic Star
2x Engineered Explosives
2x Everflowing Chalice
4x Ichor Wellspring
4x Krark-Clan Ironworks
1x Mind Stone
4x Mox Opal
4x Terrarion
1x Academy Ruins
4x Darksteel Citadel
1x Forest
4x Grove of the Burnwillows
3x Inventors' Fair
3x Sanctum of Ugin
1x Tendo Ice Bridge
1x Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
2x Hangarback Walker
2x Myr Retriever
4x Scrap Trawler
Sorcery (5)
4x Ancient Stirrings
1x Thoughtcast
This is my (very very standard) list. Sideboard is still a mess but currently it is like that:
1x Blood Moon (Eldrazi, Tron, somewhat Valakut)
2x Defense Grid (counterspell deck)
1x Grafdigger's Cage (Part one of my GY hate package, hits company as well!)
2x Nihil Spellbomb (Part two of GY hate)
2x Kozilek's Return (Answer to creature, fetchable by stirrings)
4x Nature's Claim (Pesky enchantment answer)
2x Wurmcoil Engine (alt win con package)
1x Ghirapur AEther Grid (alt win con package vs stony silence)
Considering switching groves for industry Spire, and change the package 4 Natural State + 2 Kozilek Return to 3 Nature Claim + 2 Abrupt Decay + 1 Krosan Grip. Any insights and suggestions?
Krark-Clan Ironworks
24 Artifacts
8 Sorcery/Instant:
9 Creatures:
19 Lands:
15 Sideboard:
*****
I've been playing this deck for awhile now. A few things I would like to point out after learning the ins and outs of the deck and why I came up with this list:
1. The fastest, most efficient and only route to victory is to cast Emrakul, the Aeons Torn and attack next turn. Thus, keep in mind the lands {Sanctum of Ugin and Darksteel Citadel} that you play to fetch and cast the spaghetti out via Scrap Trawler and Hangarback Walker. I removed Academy Ruin because Buried ruin is better in this deck because you can still recur the essential artifacts the very turn it was countered or destroyed and still combo out. I also removed the mana producing cards like Mind Stone and Everflowing Chalice and replaced them with the Buried Ruins and a full playset of Galvanic Blast.
2. The decks that I have encountered wherein I always lose to is Burn and any deck that runs counter spells. Burn is so hard to fight against mainly because of Eidolon of the Great Revel. This is where the idea of playing Galvanic Blast came into mind because we play a good chunk of artifacts for the bonus metalcraft.
3. Instead of dumping artifacts every turn and cracking them up to get a land most of the time I experienced, I just increased the land count to 19. I maybe wrong on this.
What are your thoughts?