I have been trying to build towards Bant Eldrazi because I see it as the best midrange deck in the modern format, but couldn't wait for the Hierarchs and the mana base. However, I was a Grixis Delver and Control player, so I already had a good amount of the mana base for a B/R shell, so I brewed up this pile of cards.
Advantages of this deck over Bant Eldrazi: I find that the curve can be so savage for your opponent to deal with. Going turn 1 Hand Disruption into turn 2 Matter Reshaper into turn 3 Thought-Knot Seer can be game ending. The deck in theory is better in the combo matchup, particularly Infect. I have not had a chance to play the matchup yet, but Bant Eldrazi has Hand Disruption no earlier than turn 2 which can be too late against infect, and never more than 6 removal spells Mainboard. My BR Eldrazi list, on the other hand, has turn 1 and turn 3 hand disruption in most games, as well as a turn 2 creature or turn 2 removal.
In the one tournament I've played at with this list, I went 2-2.
Round 1: Burn, 2-0 Win.
In both games I curved perfectly. He had no chances game one. Game two, I go turn 1 Inquisition of Kozilek, turn 2 Matter Reshaper, turn 3 Reality Smasher, attack with Smasher, and on my opponent's fourth turn he bolts my Matter Reshaper which I left back to defend against his Eidolon of the Great Revel and Goblin Guide, I let the bolt resolve and flip another Matter Reshaper off the trigger. He Scoops. My opponent is also a very active member in my Magic Community, a very good Magic player, and a level 1 Judge (maybe 2, I can't remember).
Round 2: Bant Knightfall, 1-2 Loss.
These were some unfortunate games. I felt favored in the matchup, but never drew the right cards at the right times. If I saw a single Flaying Tendrils in either of the second or the third games, it is likely that I would have won. There isn't much to learn from this match; I simply got out topdecked.
Round 3: UW Control, 0-2 Loss.
Two more very unfortunate games. My opponent was playing a good chunk of removal. He had 4 Path to Exile, 2 Condemn, 2 Blessed Alliance, 1 Wrath of God, 1 Supreme Verdict, and 3 Snapcaster Mage to recast some of these. I was never able to get to the point where I was truly in control and never saw the cards I needed. Game 2 I got stuck on 5 lands for probably 10 or 15 turns with two oblivion sowers in hand and just never drew action.
Overall, this deck feels relatively competitive for a reasonable price. It feels a bit like Jund, but without efficient life gain cards.
Options I would consider would be adding some number of Graven Cairns to make it easier to cast Terminate and Flaying Tendrils. I Would also like to add a card like Read the Bones as maybe a two-of to help me draw more gas and less lands late. I could also see putting in some number of Liliana of the Veil, but I don't own any of them, plus I think her plus one would actually hurt this deck a lot since it doesn't have any good discard fodder. I would also like to add Collective Brutality after watching Andrea Mengucci play Blood Jund on Channel Fireball's Youtube channel. I would also like to take out matter reshaper since this deck plays more like a control deck and replace it with some larger bombs. If I do this, I would also consider running Heartless Summoning, but probably won't because making Thought-Knot Seer die to 3 damage burn spells seems very bad. I would consider playing maybe 2 Conduit of Ruin, 1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger, and 1 Kozilek, the Great Distortion. I will probably move the two mainboard copies of Flaying Tendrils to the sideboard. All is Dust would also be a good addition to the deck, but 7 mana seems a bit steep to me.
Feel free to reply with thoughts or questions! I'll try my best to check this somewhat regularly and see if there are comments.
Personally, I would definitely add Kalitas in this deck and put more powerful creatures with converted mana cost 2 in it. You can check the 9th deck of GP Guangzhou (about one month ago), it is a BR Eldrazi deck that is similar with yours. Also, Wasteland Strangler probably fits in this deck, I suppose.
Has anyone been testing/playing this deck recently ?
I've taken my build to cockatrice and am really liking it so far as it seems to have game against almost anything I face and can be aggressive or more controlling depending on the match-up and the draw.
Here are my impressions of the deck so far:
#The Relics and Eternal Scourge have been very solid so far, grinding out games nicely and fighting graveyard using decks.
#Wasteland Strangler can be a bit akward without a Relic/TKS and gets sided-out against creature light decks or decks with beefy creatures but are pretty decent otherwise and 2-for-1 aggressive decks.
#Talisman of Indulgence was rather useful but I'm still not sure how neccessary it really is to the deck, the same goes to Distended Mindbender which I didn't get to cast that much (it won me a game against Tron once) but consider siding it out for Endbringer.
#Kozilek's Return is pretty good but a bit situational (and kills most of my 3-drops) so I decided to SB it and bring in Terminate instead, I didn't get to flash it back by casting Distended Mindbender which seems to be very hard to do.
#In the SB Pithing Needle wasn't used very much so I decided to replace it with Lost Legacy which not only has uses against combo decks but can also effectively "draw" my Eternal Scourge from the deck.
#Sea Gate Wreckage has been very good for me drawing multiple cards in the late game and helping me outgrind opponents and win top-deck wars, I consider adding another one over 1x Cavern of Souls which was less useful so far.
I'm most likely going to cut the 2x Distended Mindbender which means the 2x Talisman of Indulgence are probably less neccessary and would probably be cut as well.
I could go either:
1) More aggro by adding 4x Forerunner of Slaughter which is an aggressive creature and a pretty good topdeck (a 2-drop that this deck lacks at the moment), it can also give haste to other creatures which can be useful.
2) More midrange by adding 2x Blight Herder (or Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet/Pia and Kiran Nalaar) and some more removal/discard.
The second option seems better to me at the moment.
Yes, but it would be mean going lower on interaction, I've tried this with Talisman of Indulgence (which also provides color fixing) and eventually decided that it only dillutes the deck further as I see this as more of a (grindy/interactive) midrange deck with big creatures rather than a ramp or aggro deck.
It is rather similar to the older lists that placed well but the card choices seem rather questionable to me, especially the Hangarback Walkers which I have no idea why they are in there.
Here's what I am currently building. Note that I'm still pretty green to modern and I realize this list looks a lot like the one posted above, but I still think Distended Mindbender and Endbringer deserve more testing. Enbringer, in particular, seems very strong and has the potential to warp board states.
Hello. would it be possible to make a primer for this deck? I really want to make a primer for the black red eldrazi grixis. Terry Soh does a great write up of the deck that came in 9th:
I would like to get up a primer some time fast so that people can jump on this deck before it spikes in prices. It costs 305 tix or $ 529, compared to 937 tix $ 2,030 for jund. That is MUCH cheaper. And the deck plays very similar to jund, so this would be 'budget jund' that stil performs quite well. If we get up a good primer more people will brew on this deck. Also, this deck could run alternatives for red.
Adrenaline1Rush your sugested deck is much more like 'big eldrazi' that we saw about a year ago that performed well online before 'eldrazi winter' sett in. Could we do a primer? And by we I think mostly me. But I do not own this thread, and I do not want to start a new one and undrmine the work you have done here.
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I think that the deck has potential, I played a BR version for a while, but he plays too much do-nothings (Talisman is unnecessary) and spells there (Ratchet Bomb and Dreadbore should be in the SB) and not enough creatures imho.
The white splash doesn't seem worth it to me over straight BR imho as it really stretches the manabase. Eldrazi Displacer is good but it doesn't have that many good targets in the deck, PtE is good but can be easily replaced by Terminate.
I don't think that Fatal Push can replace Terminate which is just better (and there is bolt for the early game), replacing Slaughter Pact makes more sense indeed (you can also take out the Rachet Bomb which is rather slow).
I don't think that the price Thought-Knot Seer has anything to do with Standard as it is played in Modern much more (there are no "Top Tier" Eldrazi decks in Standard).
I have some questions about the card choices in your deck:
2. Don't you get color-screwed sometimes (playing color-intensive spells like: Kalitas, P&K, Terminate, K-Command) without fetchlands ?
I prefer Bloodstained Mire over Blackcleave Cliffs for this deck (also "fastlands" coming into play tapped later in the game can be a problem).
3. Why Pia and Kiran Nalaar over something like Blight Herder ? The Eldrazi is easier to cast (no colors needed and is virtually a 4-drop with E.Temple) and turning on processing is rather easy.
4. What is Rakdos Charm for in the SB ?
You already have Relic for GY and K-Command/Ratchet Bomb for artifacts.
Endbringer is good against grindy decks like Jund/Abzan. Also good against other Eldrazi decks to lock down opposing Reality Smashers. Its especially good now since it dodges Fatal Push.
IMO, Bloodstained Mire is the better card anyways...
Speaking of Fatal Push, it's the card that's really got me thinking about this deck (I currently play Bant Eldrazi). Does the deck really even need the Relic+Strangler package now that Push is a thing? I feel like they could be replaced with Pushes and Mind Stone/Talismans. Plus maindeck GY hate is less needed with Dredge nerf and Fatal Push for Tarmogoyfs.
Batterskull is always a good option but the things that "Kalitas" does are to provide addional bodies when you remove the opponent's creatures and more processing fuel in addition to the lifegain.
Bloodstained Mire is better for this deck than Blackcleave Cliffs imho as it can always get you an untapped colored source (if you include enough of them in your deck, I go with: 2 "shocks" and 2 "basics" of each color).
LotV is rather difficult to cast in this deck with all the colorless lands and activating her can be rather difficult if there are no cards that are good as discard fodder (except for Eternal Scourge maybe with an active Relic).
Liliana, the Last Hope might be better for this deck with the option to bring back dead TKS/Smashers and pick off small creatures.
Mutavault is a good option for this deck though I prefer some combination of Ghost Quarter and Sea Gate Wrackage as my colorless utility lands as I run more creatures than other lists (20 instead of 16).
Speaking of Fatal Push, it's the card that's really got me thinking about this deck (I currently play Bant Eldrazi). Does the deck really even need the Relic+Strangler package now that Push is a thing? I feel like they could be replaced with Pushes and Mind Stone/Talismans. Plus maindeck GY hate is less needed with Dredge nerf and Fatal Push for Tarmogoyfs.
I'm thinking the same. While we don't get the (conditional) creature+removal, FP's ability to clear instant speed and hit land creatures are just too good. Keeping the Relics though.
I've decided to get on board the Fatal Push train and post my idea for a new version of B/R Eldrazi. I know that its going to be a bit different than what has been posted here but I believe that Push can really change the way the deck functions (and the format as a whole). I've designed this deck to be both great at using Fatal Push and a deck that is highly resistant to Fatal Push. I don't really see the point of running a bunch of Terminates/Dreadbores anymore as the only creatures those kill that Push doesn't is opposing Eldrazi and Wurmcoil Engine (and I suppose Tasigur but I dont think this deck gives a damn about Tasigur anyways).
For some context, I've been playing a bit of Bant Eldrazi and I think the deck is good, but I think that Fatal Push + bannings will give B/R Eldrazi the edge in the noodle wars. I really like the game-plan of Bant Eldrazi and I've tried to incorporate more elements of it into B/R. This is a more aggressive creature heavy version than before. Basically, we want to kill early stuff with cheap removal, play noodles, then apply said noodles to the face of our opponent. Fatal Push makes playing mana dorks like Noble Hierarch riskier than ever so I've decided that going B/R and playing mana rocks is much safer. I know that people have maligned mana rocks in this thread, but I know from experience that a reliable turn 3 Though-Knot is just too good to pass up. I've decided to go with a 2-2 split of Talisman of Indulgence and Mind Stone. The Talisman allows us to keep up Bolt/Push mana while ramping and Mind Stone lets us trigger revolt and lower the amount of dead draws in the late game. Not insta losing to Blood Moon is nice too.
Another reason I like this deck is that we get to play with 3 Ghost Quarters. If the format slows down as much as people are predicting, then tron is going to see a big resurgence. Bant Eldrazi really has no good way to stop Tron other than Stoney Silence, which is another nod to B/R I'm also starting with two Crumble to Dust in the board as a hedge.
I've decided to trim the Relic of Progenitus + Wasteland Stranger package slightly but still keep it (and threw in a single Eternal Scourge to test). Relic enables revolt and hosing Snapcasters and Goyfs is never a bad thing. Plus Dredge will definitely still be a deck. TBH I'm not sure what I would run instead anyways.
Lastly, I'm not running any Inquisition of Kozileks as I believe Fatal Push covers much of the same ground. I also don't want too many dead late game cards. In the current configuration, the only terrible top decks are the two Thoughseizes and two Talismans.
The SB is (obviously) still a work in progress. Not really sure where I want to go with it yet.
Right now, the only things I'm not too sure on are the Endbringers, the Eternal Scourge, and Collective Brutality. I like how Drowner of Hope makes combat impossible in Bant Eldrazi and Endbringer can do a reasonable job of that while providing card advantage and yet another push-proof body. it can also shut down opposing Reality Smashers which is one of the few cards this deck would theoretically have a hard time with. The Scourge is a test as mentioned before but I guess it could also be another Strangler or removal spell. I ran Collective Brutality over IoK as I wanted as few dead draws as possible. Having a card that sticks it burn can't be too bad either.
I see B/R Eldrazi as a nice middle ground between Bant Eldrazi and Jund. All three are technically midrange decks, but they exist on a spectrum of aggressiveness going from Bant->B/R->Jund. I think the deck does a good job of providing good pressure like Bant while still being able to control the game like Jund.
After having tested this deck I found it very prone to bad draws. The deck features a suit of removal, and I am very sad when playing aginst something where spot removal is not good. Or when I do not draw threats. I have moved away from this deck.
With the printing of fatal push I am planing on playng a blue version of the deck. What does red offer us? Koligans command, lightning bolt and terminate/dreadbore. Just change them out for snapcast mage, fatal push, and some variation of spot removal like go for the throat.
Change relic of progenitus for serum vision.
Change the wasteland stranglers for matter reshaper.
Also, the mana is very shacky. I would like to have 14 sources of each mana source, including colourless. Therefore we would need to play of colour painlands (that can tap for blue or black and a colour we do not play.)
Far to often I would not draw a discard spell, so I think a 5th discard spell would be good.
I also think tasigur is a natural inclusion once you play black with blue or green. Thirst for Knowledge for carddraw and filtering seems good.
I think this deck will be much more consistent then the red version. Yes we can not get 'lucky' and chain the right spells in an obsurd way. But Serum Vision to dig for card and Snapcaster Mage gives us more removal, card draw or discard depending on what our oponent is playing. We should still trad very favorable.
Hangerback walker and 3 mandlands give us some chance vs planewalkers.
We do not have the reach of bolt to face in this draft, but I will rather have this then being evry draw luck dependant.
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If you want a more consistent Eldrazi deck then I suggest playing green for Ancient Stirrings. I think Fatal Push could open the door for a G/B version but I really can't see U/B being a thing. Your deck seems very unfocused in trying to jam Eldrazi along with stuff like Tasigur, Kalitas, and Snapcaster.
I've also thought about trying to splash Ancient Stirring in B/R but I just don't think the mana base can handle it. I was goldfishing a bit today and was really wishing I could have it.
I also don't undertand why people in this thread are so afraid of planeswalkers. 5/5 trample hasters tend to eat them pretty well.
2 Blood Crypt
1 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Cavern of Souls
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Swamp
1 Mountain
1 Wastes
1 Westvale Abbey
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Matter Reshaper
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
3 Oblivion Sower
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Terminate
2 Dreadbore
2 Kolaghan's Command
2 Flaying Tendrils
Advantages of this deck over Bant Eldrazi: I find that the curve can be so savage for your opponent to deal with. Going turn 1 Hand Disruption into turn 2 Matter Reshaper into turn 3 Thought-Knot Seer can be game ending. The deck in theory is better in the combo matchup, particularly Infect. I have not had a chance to play the matchup yet, but Bant Eldrazi has Hand Disruption no earlier than turn 2 which can be too late against infect, and never more than 6 removal spells Mainboard. My BR Eldrazi list, on the other hand, has turn 1 and turn 3 hand disruption in most games, as well as a turn 2 creature or turn 2 removal.
In the one tournament I've played at with this list, I went 2-2.
Round 1: Burn, 2-0 Win.
In both games I curved perfectly. He had no chances game one. Game two, I go turn 1 Inquisition of Kozilek, turn 2 Matter Reshaper, turn 3 Reality Smasher, attack with Smasher, and on my opponent's fourth turn he bolts my Matter Reshaper which I left back to defend against his Eidolon of the Great Revel and Goblin Guide, I let the bolt resolve and flip another Matter Reshaper off the trigger. He Scoops. My opponent is also a very active member in my Magic Community, a very good Magic player, and a level 1 Judge (maybe 2, I can't remember).
Round 2: Bant Knightfall, 1-2 Loss.
These were some unfortunate games. I felt favored in the matchup, but never drew the right cards at the right times. If I saw a single Flaying Tendrils in either of the second or the third games, it is likely that I would have won. There isn't much to learn from this match; I simply got out topdecked.
Round 3: UW Control, 0-2 Loss.
Two more very unfortunate games. My opponent was playing a good chunk of removal. He had 4 Path to Exile, 2 Condemn, 2 Blessed Alliance, 1 Wrath of God, 1 Supreme Verdict, and 3 Snapcaster Mage to recast some of these. I was never able to get to the point where I was truly in control and never saw the cards I needed. Game 2 I got stuck on 5 lands for probably 10 or 15 turns with two oblivion sowers in hand and just never drew action.
Round 4: Tron, 2-0 Win
I just curved both games fairly well and just face rolled my opponent. I know him, and he is a good Tron player (if there is such a thing :P). Game two he Mulled to 6 and kept a hand with (if I remember correctly) 1 Urza's Tower, 1 Urza's Mine, 1 Grove of the Burnwillows, 2 Wurmcoil Engine, and 1 Kozilek's Return. I was on the draw, and go turn 1 Thoughtseize, take Wurmcoil Engine, turn 2 Matter Reshaper, and on turn 3 attack. He plays Kozilek's Return which gives me a third land. I play Thought-Knot Seer, and rip the other Wurmcoil Engine. My opponent draws Urza's Power Plant on turn 4, turning on tron, then draws no gas.
Overall, this deck feels relatively competitive for a reasonable price. It feels a bit like Jund, but without efficient life gain cards.
Options I would consider would be adding some number of Graven Cairns to make it easier to cast Terminate and Flaying Tendrils. I Would also like to add a card like Read the Bones as maybe a two-of to help me draw more gas and less lands late. I could also see putting in some number of Liliana of the Veil, but I don't own any of them, plus I think her plus one would actually hurt this deck a lot since it doesn't have any good discard fodder. I would also like to add Collective Brutality after watching Andrea Mengucci play Blood Jund on Channel Fireball's Youtube channel. I would also like to take out matter reshaper since this deck plays more like a control deck and replace it with some larger bombs. If I do this, I would also consider running Heartless Summoning, but probably won't because making Thought-Knot Seer die to 3 damage burn spells seems very bad. I would consider playing maybe 2 Conduit of Ruin, 1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger, and 1 Kozilek, the Great Distortion. I will probably move the two mainboard copies of Flaying Tendrils to the sideboard. All is Dust would also be a good addition to the deck, but 7 mana seems a bit steep to me.
Feel free to reply with thoughts or questions! I'll try my best to check this somewhat regularly and see if there are comments.
I would also add Wasteland Strangler but you would need some enablers (besides TKS) for him to consistently process:
Relic of Progenitus, Pillar of Flame/Incendiary Flow or Transgress the Mind/Extirpate/Surgical Extraction (Appetite for Brains).
Also Kozilek's Return can be a good alternative to Flaying Tendrils and triggers of Distended Mindbender.
Some Talisman of Indulgence might be a good idea for ramping and having another colorless source.
4 Hangarback Walker
4 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Reality Smasher
3 Wasteland Strangler
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
Sorcery (5)
1 Dreadbore
1 Thoughtseize
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
Instant (10)
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Terminate
2 Kolaghan's Command
1 Slaughter Pact
4 Relic of Progenitus
2 Ratchet Bomb
Land (23)
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 Sulfurous Springs
2 Blood Crypt
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Mutavault
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Swamp
1 Mountain
1 Dreadbore
1 Kolaghan's Command
2 Thoughtseize
1 Ghost Quarter
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Slaughter Games
1 Shatterstorm
1 Shriekmaw
2 Endbringer
2 Magma Spray
I have been super tempted to put it together myself put I need to pick up the rest of the Reality Smashers
In the yard: RUG Delver, Kiki-Chord, Grixis Twin, Mardu Control, Smallpox, Jeskai Control, Jeskai Delver, Assault Loam, Elves, Deathcloud, Eggs, Storm
Here is that deck tech - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GNFBbZHrCU
http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/deck.asp?deck_id=1269493
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/465915
Here is how I would build a B/R Eldrazi deck:
4x Matter Reshaper
4x Eternal Scourge
4x Wasteland Strangler
4x Thought-Knot Seer
4x Reality Smasher
2x Distended Mindbender
Instant (6)
4x Lightning Bolt
2x Kozilek's Return
Artifact (6)
4x Relic of Progenitus
2x Talisman of Indulgence
3x Inquisition of Kozilek
Land (23)
4x Sulfurous Springs
4x Eldrazi Temple
4x Bloodstained Mire
2x Blood Crypt
3x Cavern of Souls
2x Ghost Quarter
1x Sea Gate Wreckage
2x Swamp
1x Mountain
3x Endbringer
3x Terminate
3x Thoughtseize
2x Kolaghan's Command
2x Ratchet Bomb
1x Pithing Needle
1x Kozilek's Return
# The 4x maindeck Relic of Progenitus are very good against all the GY interaction in the format (Dredge in particular) and synergise very well with Eternal Scourge and Wasteland Strangler.
# The 2x Talisman of Indulgence provide some ramp/fixing and can help against Blood Moon, not sure if I should add more.
# Distended Mindbender can be emerged of Matter Reshaper/Eternal Scourge and trigger Kozilek's Return (a decent instant speed sweeper).
I've taken my build to cockatrice and am really liking it so far as it seems to have game against almost anything I face and can be aggressive or more controlling depending on the match-up and the draw.
Here are my impressions of the deck so far:
#The Relics and Eternal Scourge have been very solid so far, grinding out games nicely and fighting graveyard using decks.
#Wasteland Strangler can be a bit akward without a Relic/TKS and gets sided-out against creature light decks or decks with beefy creatures but are pretty decent otherwise and 2-for-1 aggressive decks.
#Talisman of Indulgence was rather useful but I'm still not sure how neccessary it really is to the deck, the same goes to Distended Mindbender which I didn't get to cast that much (it won me a game against Tron once) but consider siding it out for Endbringer.
#Kozilek's Return is pretty good but a bit situational (and kills most of my 3-drops) so I decided to SB it and bring in Terminate instead, I didn't get to flash it back by casting Distended Mindbender which seems to be very hard to do.
#In the SB Pithing Needle wasn't used very much so I decided to replace it with Lost Legacy which not only has uses against combo decks but can also effectively "draw" my Eternal Scourge from the deck.
#Sea Gate Wreckage has been very good for me drawing multiple cards in the late game and helping me outgrind opponents and win top-deck wars, I consider adding another one over 1x Cavern of Souls which was less useful so far.
I'm most likely going to cut the 2x Distended Mindbender which means the 2x Talisman of Indulgence are probably less neccessary and would probably be cut as well.
I could go either:
1) More aggro by adding 4x Forerunner of Slaughter which is an aggressive creature and a pretty good topdeck (a 2-drop that this deck lacks at the moment), it can also give haste to other creatures which can be useful.
2) More midrange by adding 2x Blight Herder (or Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet/Pia and Kiran Nalaar) and some more removal/discard.
The second option seems better to me at the moment.
Here is my updated build:
4x Matter Reshaper
4x Eternal Scourge
4x Wasteland Strangler
4x Thought-Knot Seer
4x Reality Smasher
2x Blight Herder
Instant (7)
4x Lightning Bolt
3x Terminate
Artifact (4)
4x Relic of Progenitus
Sorcery (4)
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Sulfurous Springs
4x Eldrazi Temple
4x Bloodstained Mire
2x Blood Crypt
3x Cavern of Souls
2x Ghost Quarter
1x Sea Gate Wreckage
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1x Swamp
1x Mountain
3x Kozilek's Return
3x Thoughtseize
2x Kolaghan's Command
2x Lost Legacy
2x Endbringer
1x Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2x Ratchet Bomb
Would Dismember work better than Terminate in this deck ?
Here it is - https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/506273
It is rather similar to the older lists that placed well but the card choices seem rather questionable to me, especially the Hangarback Walkers which I have no idea why they are in there.
I am building the deck atm, will see how it goes, I think it is actually positioned in today's metagame were graveyard is a thing.
EDH: Xenagos, God of Revels.
2x Blood Crypt
4x Bloodstained Mire
4x Eldrazi Temple
3x Ghost Quarter
2x Mountain
4x Sulfurous Springs
3x Swamp
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Creature (22)
3x Distended Mindbender
2x Endbringer
2x Eternal Scourge
4x Matter Reshaper
3x Reality Smasher
4x Thought-Knot Seer
3x Wasteland Strangler
3x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Lightning Bolt
2x Magma Spray
3x Terminate
Artifact (4)
3x Relic of Progenitus
1x Talisman of Indulgence
1x Relic of Progenitus
2x Rakdos Charm
1x Slaughter Games
1x Crumble to Dust
1x Ratchet Bomb
2x Dreadbore
2x Pyroclasm
1x Surgical Extraction
http://www.mtgmintcard.com/articles/writers/terry-soh/a-guide-to-black-red-eldrazi
Here the mansource talks about it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GNFBbZHrCU
Here TCGplayer does a playthrough of the Kori Winkelback 43st place GP deck.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxM5aCWc0eM&t=236s
I would like to get up a primer some time fast so that people can jump on this deck before it spikes in prices. It costs 305 tix or $ 529, compared to 937 tix $ 2,030 for jund. That is MUCH cheaper. And the deck plays very similar to jund, so this would be 'budget jund' that stil performs quite well. If we get up a good primer more people will brew on this deck. Also, this deck could run alternatives for red.
Adrenaline1Rush your sugested deck is much more like 'big eldrazi' that we saw about a year ago that performed well online before 'eldrazi winter' sett in. Could we do a primer? And by we I think mostly me. But I do not own this thread, and I do not want to start a new one and undrmine the work you have done here.
Any progress on the Primer ? I would really like to see one and contribute with some ideas.
Btw, Tcgplayer have published a follow-up article with a White splash that I don't think is necessary:
I don't think that the price Thought-Knot Seer has anything to do with Standard as it is played in Modern much more (there are no "Top Tier" Eldrazi decks in Standard).
I have some questions about the card choices in your deck:
1. Why Hangarback Walker over Matter Reshaper/Eternal Scourge ?
Matter Reshaper is pure value and can be a turn 2 play with E.Temple.
Same goes for Eternal Scourge which has a slightly better body and and an amazing synergy with Relic of Progenitus.
2. Don't you get color-screwed sometimes (playing color-intensive spells like: Kalitas, P&K, Terminate, K-Command) without fetchlands ?
I prefer Bloodstained Mire over Blackcleave Cliffs for this deck (also "fastlands" coming into play tapped later in the game can be a problem).
3. Why Pia and Kiran Nalaar over something like Blight Herder ? The Eldrazi is easier to cast (no colors needed and is virtually a 4-drop with E.Temple) and turning on processing is rather easy.
4. What is Rakdos Charm for in the SB ?
You already have Relic for GY and K-Command/Ratchet Bomb for artifacts.
IMO, Bloodstained Mire is the better card anyways...
Speaking of Fatal Push, it's the card that's really got me thinking about this deck (I currently play Bant Eldrazi). Does the deck really even need the Relic+Strangler package now that Push is a thing? I feel like they could be replaced with Pushes and Mind Stone/Talismans. Plus maindeck GY hate is less needed with Dredge nerf and Fatal Push for Tarmogoyfs.
Relic also works very well with Eternal Scourge and Blight Herder (which I prefer to Endbringer against midrange decks as it is easier to cast).
Batterskull is always a good option but the things that "Kalitas" does are to provide addional bodies when you remove the opponent's creatures and more processing fuel in addition to the lifegain.
Bloodstained Mire is better for this deck than Blackcleave Cliffs imho as it can always get you an untapped colored source (if you include enough of them in your deck, I go with: 2 "shocks" and 2 "basics" of each color).
I woudldn't consider removing Wasteland Strangler as it is often a 2-for-1 as a creature+removal.
With Lightning Bolt+Terminate I don't really see the need for Fatal Push in this deck, in the SB I have Dreadbore to hit PW's as well.
I don't think that Hangarback is good enough.
Liliana, the Last Hope might be better for this deck with the option to bring back dead TKS/Smashers and pick off small creatures.
Mutavault is a good option for this deck though I prefer some combination of Ghost Quarter and Sea Gate Wrackage as my colorless utility lands as I run more creatures than other lists (20 instead of 16).
I'm thinking the same. While we don't get the (conditional) creature+removal, FP's ability to clear instant speed and hit land creatures are just too good. Keeping the Relics though.
Will try
-3 Wasteland Strangler
-1 Terminate
+3 Fatal Push
+1 Dreadbore
For some context, I've been playing a bit of Bant Eldrazi and I think the deck is good, but I think that Fatal Push + bannings will give B/R Eldrazi the edge in the noodle wars. I really like the game-plan of Bant Eldrazi and I've tried to incorporate more elements of it into B/R. This is a more aggressive creature heavy version than before. Basically, we want to kill early stuff with cheap removal, play noodles, then apply said noodles to the face of our opponent. Fatal Push makes playing mana dorks like Noble Hierarch riskier than ever so I've decided that going B/R and playing mana rocks is much safer. I know that people have maligned mana rocks in this thread, but I know from experience that a reliable turn 3 Though-Knot is just too good to pass up. I've decided to go with a 2-2 split of Talisman of Indulgence and Mind Stone. The Talisman allows us to keep up Bolt/Push mana while ramping and Mind Stone lets us trigger revolt and lower the amount of dead draws in the late game. Not insta losing to Blood Moon is nice too.
Another reason I like this deck is that we get to play with 3 Ghost Quarters. If the format slows down as much as people are predicting, then tron is going to see a big resurgence. Bant Eldrazi really has no good way to stop Tron other than Stoney Silence, which is another nod to B/R I'm also starting with two Crumble to Dust in the board as a hedge.
I've decided to trim the Relic of Progenitus + Wasteland Stranger package slightly but still keep it (and threw in a single Eternal Scourge to test). Relic enables revolt and hosing Snapcasters and Goyfs is never a bad thing. Plus Dredge will definitely still be a deck. TBH I'm not sure what I would run instead anyways.
Lastly, I'm not running any Inquisition of Kozileks as I believe Fatal Push covers much of the same ground. I also don't want too many dead late game cards. In the current configuration, the only terrible top decks are the two Thoughseizes and two Talismans.
2 Blood Crypt
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Cavern of Souls
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Ghost Quarter
1 Mountain
4 Sulfurous Springs
2 Swamp
1 Verdant Catacombs
//Spells
1 Collective Brutality
4 Fatal Push
2 Kolaghan's Command
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Mind Stone
3 Relic of Progenitus
2 Talisman of Indulgence
2 Thoughtseize
2 Endbringer
1 Eternal Scourge
4 Matter Reshaper
4 Reality Smasher
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Wasteland Strangler
2 Collective Brutality
2 Crumble to Dust
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Kolaghan's Command
1 Surgical Extraction
2 Terminate
1 Thoughtseize
4 ????
The SB is (obviously) still a work in progress. Not really sure where I want to go with it yet.
Right now, the only things I'm not too sure on are the Endbringers, the Eternal Scourge, and Collective Brutality. I like how Drowner of Hope makes combat impossible in Bant Eldrazi and Endbringer can do a reasonable job of that while providing card advantage and yet another push-proof body. it can also shut down opposing Reality Smashers which is one of the few cards this deck would theoretically have a hard time with. The Scourge is a test as mentioned before but I guess it could also be another Strangler or removal spell. I ran Collective Brutality over IoK as I wanted as few dead draws as possible. Having a card that sticks it burn can't be too bad either.
After having tested this deck I found it very prone to bad draws. The deck features a suit of removal, and I am very sad when playing aginst something where spot removal is not good. Or when I do not draw threats. I have moved away from this deck.
With the printing of fatal push I am planing on playng a blue version of the deck. What does red offer us? Koligans command, lightning bolt and terminate/dreadbore. Just change them out for snapcast mage, fatal push, and some variation of spot removal like go for the throat.
Change relic of progenitus for serum vision.
Change the wasteland stranglers for matter reshaper.
Also, the mana is very shacky. I would like to have 14 sources of each mana source, including colourless. Therefore we would need to play of colour painlands (that can tap for blue or black and a colour we do not play.)
Far to often I would not draw a discard spell, so I think a 5th discard spell would be good.
I also think tasigur is a natural inclusion once you play black with blue or green. Thirst for Knowledge for carddraw and filtering seems good.
2 Watery Grave
4 Eldrazi Temple
2 Ghost Quarter
1 Island
2 Mutavault
4 Underground River
2 Swamp
1 Polluted Delta
1 Creeping Tar Pit
1 Yavimaya Coast
24 land
3 Snapcaster Mage
3 Matter Reshaper
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1 Reality Smasher
1 Tasigur, the Golden Fang
16 creature
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Thoughtseize
4 Serum Visions
4 Fatal Push
1 Collective Brutality
2 Ratchet Bomb
1 Go for the Throat
1 Slaughter Pact
1 Thirst for Knowledge
16 other spell
I think this deck will be much more consistent then the red version. Yes we can not get 'lucky' and chain the right spells in an obsurd way. But Serum Vision to dig for card and Snapcaster Mage gives us more removal, card draw or discard depending on what our oponent is playing. We should still trad very favorable.
Hangerback walker and 3 mandlands give us some chance vs planewalkers.
We do not have the reach of bolt to face in this draft, but I will rather have this then being evry draw luck dependant.
I've also thought about trying to splash Ancient Stirring in B/R but I just don't think the mana base can handle it. I was goldfishing a bit today and was really wishing I could have it.
I also don't undertand why people in this thread are so afraid of planeswalkers. 5/5 trample hasters tend to eat them pretty well.
Snapcaster Mage isn't good in this deck (especially once you dropped Lightning Bolt) and Kolaghan's Command is better as a value-generating card here.
#Matter Reshaper should be in the deck (as a 4x-of) anyway and not as the replacement of Wasteland Strangler.
#Not playing 4x Reality Smasher doesn't make much sense to me as it is the best threat we have access to (which is also very hard to deal with).
#I still think that in a deck with 4x Relic+E.Temple Eternal Scourge is (far) superior to Hangarback Walker.
#In B/R with Lightning Bolt + Terminate (and also Kolaghan's Command + Wasteland Strangler) I don't think that Fatal Push is even necessary
(in the SB I prefer Dreadbore).