Hey everyone, thanks for taking the time to check out my deck!
Now I know what you're thinking... How can it be a mono black deck when it includes Collected Company? Well... Technically it's not, but Collected Company is the only green card in the deck. Everything else is black, from the creatures to the spells it plays.
Why splash green then?
I've played this deck off and on for a while now, and it can definitely be a competitor in certain metas at the very least. It is a strong aggro/midrange deck that has recursion and few tricks to allow it to win even in the grindy matches. Now with the new addition of Relentless Dead and a small green splash for Collected Company, it can finally fill in one of the decks major weaknesses in the past: Sometimes it just ran out of gas, and there were no great cards to get you back in the game once you started slowing down. Thanks to these new cards, I can finally remove Blood Scrivener and it's now entirely possible to bounce back once things start slowing down. Also, it will likely help with sideboard spells like Abrupt Decay and whatnot.
I'm hoping people will see this list, tweak a few cards here and there and, most importantly, help me playtest it! So far I've only been able to play this new version vs Faeries (which is a very favourable match for this deck), but it needs to be tested against much more than this to be considered good of course.
Here are some notes to explain some of the cards and interactions in the deck:
Gravecrawler - A beater that can return from the grave as long as any creature in the deck (Viscera Seer excluded) is on the field. Excellent when paired with a Death Baron because he becomes a 3/2 that the opponent can't even block with something larger effectively. Also, it is a semi-combo enabler.
Viscera Seer - Honourary Zombie; A 1 costed sac outlet that lets us scry as many times as we have mana to cast Gravecrawler. Also enables us to sac Relentless Dead for graveyard card advantage any time.
Relentless Dead - Hard to block for the opponent, and doing so generally results in us getting it back + another zombie onto the field anyway.
Geralf's Messenger - Coming into play tapped is annoying, but much less so at the end of the opponents turn with Collected Company!
Diregraf Colossus - A late game/grind all-star. Often entering the battlefield somewhere between a 3/3 and a 6/6 for 3, the price for the power is decent. However, Diregraf Colossus + Viscera Seer + GraveCrawler = a 2/2 token for 1 mana that can be repeated as many times as you can pay for it. Since it's not unlikely that two of the 3 can be found off of a Collected Company, it's not difficult to do either.
Death Baron - Gives deathtouch to everything, which means our creatures push through or trade at worst, and we can often just replay our threats again on the same turn!
Geth's Verdict - Untargeted removal that's great vs decks playing a small number of powerful creatures, especially vs Infect/Boggles because they can't protect from it.
There are currently 3 spots that are open in the deck, which I think should be used for disruption of some kind. Preferably costing 1 or 2 mana if at all possible. Right now I'm try out Dismember, since it can kill pretty much anything in the format and can be casted for 1 mana in a pinch most times. Often it is cast for 2 though, which minimizes life loss a bit. I'm open to other suggestions as well though of course. I haven't tried using it for discard yet, but it might be just as good or better overall.
One last thing about the mana: Untapped Black mana is the most important thing you can get in the deck. On turn 1, you need B, On turn 2 you need BB, and on turn 3 you need BBB. This is why the deck is mainly basics, and why even a single Forest isn't included (I'd put 1 in sideboard for Path to Exile decks though).
Again, I'm hoping for some feedback on the deck to improve it further, and I hope it interests a few of you enough to do some play testing with it!
I have no issues playing 3x Abrupt Decay as the main board removal as i definitely think it would be useful. it might require taking a bit more damage from the land base though, which could become a little concerning.
I'm not sure I understand the benefits of Lotleth Troll in a deck like this though. aside from Gravecrawlers, you don't actually want to discard any of your creatures. I am a big fan of the card for sure, but i don't see the advantage here. Could you explain?
Overall I would consider the deck more of a midrange deck though than a full on aggro deck. It can't put out super fast damage like the best aggro decks, but it also has more staying power once the innitial rush has been dealt with. out of sideboard, i'm sure we could put together some cards that would help us gain life or otherwise deal with their aggro though. The deck used to have Liliana and Smallpox to help slow things down, but I had removed them for now because they make it difficult to get to the 3 mana needed for the new creatures.
If the meta becomes hyper aggro with Merfolk or Affinity only, the deck may struggle a bit. If it's Infect or Boggles then we're in great shape, and if it slows down a bit now that Eldrazi is weakened a little, then we should be in a good place.
Needs more fleshbag marauder and less geth's verdict. Also, Nykthos I think is mandatory, as well as Mutavaults.
I suspect playing Satyr Wayfinders may also be required or you're going to miss land drops. Consistently hitting your 4th land drop is pretty unlikely in this deck as is (22 lands, no filtering). Life from the Loam is another alternative, and jam 4 ghost quarters or something instead of mutavault.
The biggest issue with this deck is that casting coco on turn 4 is not very good in modern. There's no Zombie llanowar elves unfortunately.
I think casting CoCo on turn 4 is fine as long as you have some disruption before hand at least. It's nice to hold up 4 mana to represend either a CoCo, a removal spell or the ability to bring back something if they kill Relentless Dead for sure.
I have been debating adding another swamp to the deck though to get it up to 23 lands. Since the deck only needs 3 to play anything aside from Co, missing 1 land drop often isn't the end of the word either so far. It would be nice to ensure though. That said, I can't see adding in any mana to the deck that doesn't produce black on its own. Nykthos and Mutavault are both dead lands if you get them before turn 3, which is concerning. I would love to have 4 Mutavaults, but it would prevent me from playing almost every card in the deck on curve...
I think I will try replacing the 3 Dismembers with 1 land and 2 Abrupt Decay. I'm open to removing the Geth's Verdict, but I don't know that another 3 costing creature would be my choice for replacement. Fleshbag Maurader is great when hit with a CoCo, but otherwise kinda clogs up the 3 drop spot further. Other 2 cost removal spells might be better to remove what's important to hit, while keeping the Verdicts in sideboard for certain matchups.
@Imborj - I'm still uncertain on why Lotleth will fit well in this deck. i love the card, but I don't want to discard creatures in this build aside from Gravecrawler, so he'll be a 3/2 with regen at best in most cases. unless I can discard a few cards to get the win or something. Could you eplain it further?
Thanks for the feedback so far guys! i'll make some changes to the decklist tonight. I'm thinking:
-2 Dismember
-2 Geth's Verdict
+3 Abrupt Decay
+1 Swamp
Might have to add an extra green source in as well, which I suppose means the deck is no longer Mono Black...
Playing 2 urborgs is a good way to fix the mutavault problem. I think you're going to need the reach of manlands one way or another, even if it's only a couple hissing quagmires.
Mutavault's ability to let you cast gravecrawler in the event you have an empty board is really stellar.
IMHO, Lotleth Troll is one of the best zombies so far with relevant play roll on the deck for his low-cost abilities. You can clearly benefit from discarding Gravecrawler, Bloodghast (if considering this) or Brain Gorgers and cast it with madness... Now, you can discard any other zombie for counters on the Troll, considering that you'll get the chance put them back to the board with Relentless Dead afterwards!
The thing is, last time zombies were seen in standard, Deathrite Shaman was granting the one mana advantage to pay Troll's regen ability cost on T2... Unable to do this in modern, we're always one turn behind, so we have to work it out, delaying the opponent with Thoughtseize or Inquisition of Kozilek untill the 3ed land is on the board and we get to do "stuff"...
It certainly does seem that the best zombie 2 drops are better played as 3 drops these days sadly. It's a tough spot to fill with creatures, even with Relentless Dead now. I wasn't really considering bloodghast (also a great card though) because it doesn't benefit from any of the zombie synergies that the deck is going for, but the deck can always change a bit. I'm interested in trying Lotleth Troll mainly due to regeneration, although it may also slow down the deck a little. Is anyone able to play test this list?
Playing 2 urborgs is a good way to fix the mutavault problem. I think you're going to need the reach of manlands one way or another, even if it's only a couple hissing quagmires.
Mutavault's ability to let you cast gravecrawler in the event you have an empty board is really stellar.
If I knew I could draw them then it would certainly be worth it. I'm a little hesitate at the moment because I need BB on turn 2 frequently, but it's worth trying at the least.
It also makes Blood Scrivener better because you unload your hand faster. Lotleth Troll can help with that, too.
I'm a Merfolk player, trying to find some similarities and have just about cut out the Lords. 3's a big bump. Getting dmg through with Seas, MoW... I guess there's somethings you can't replicate.
Have you all tried Vial with RD? Or is coco just better?
I played a zombie build last night for fun, kind of similar. It had abrupt decays and lotleth trolls, but also had blood artist in there, which can be so fun for opponents to kill your zombie and watch their life slowly drain away. then for fun, i put in two killing wave (one of my favorite all-time cards) and watch people do a double take and try do to the math. It just makes games fun!
BTW, went 2/2 in a fairly competitive meta last night, and I know there are a couple cards I want to take out, but lotleth troll + diregraf collosus is way fun. I love discarding zombies to troll and swinging, then casting a huge diregraf collosus. Then if any of them happen to be a gravecrawler, recur that bad boy too. so much fun.
BTW, i played ZERO relentless dead, i don't think it is a particularly good card. the hype is real.
This is probably cuckoo (or, at best, fun for casual), but if you're playing mono Zombies and you're already splashing green, what about something like Descendants' Path? Once you're up to three mana you probably don't need many more lands, and if you're cranking out multiple Zombies a turn, that's how you're going to win, right?
This is probably cuckoo (or, at best, fun for casual), but if you're playing mono Zombies and you're already splashing green, what about something like Descendants' Path? Once you're up to three mana you probably don't need many more lands, and if you're cranking out multiple Zombies a turn, that's how you're going to win, right?
That is not a bad suggestion, the card seems great. I recently built a deck with 28 zombie creatures that plays 4 x Descendants' Path. So far in my testing, the card has been too slow and has been hitting lands with it's ability far too often. I will continue to play test it but with so many zombie creatures and 21 lands, how often it hit lands felt like it wasn't doing much for me.
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Now I know what you're thinking... How can it be a mono black deck when it includes Collected Company? Well... Technically it's not, but Collected Company is the only green card in the deck. Everything else is black, from the creatures to the spells it plays.
Why splash green then?
I've played this deck off and on for a while now, and it can definitely be a competitor in certain metas at the very least. It is a strong aggro/midrange deck that has recursion and few tricks to allow it to win even in the grindy matches. Now with the new addition of Relentless Dead and a small green splash for Collected Company, it can finally fill in one of the decks major weaknesses in the past: Sometimes it just ran out of gas, and there were no great cards to get you back in the game once you started slowing down. Thanks to these new cards, I can finally remove Blood Scrivener and it's now entirely possible to bounce back once things start slowing down. Also, it will likely help with sideboard spells like Abrupt Decay and whatnot.
Now then, the deck list:
4x Death Baron
4x Diregraf Colossus
4x Diregraf Ghoul
4x Geralf's Messenger
4x Gravecrawler
4x Relentless Dead
3x Viscera Seer
4x Geth's Verdict
4x Collected Company
3x ??? (Removal)
Land (22)
4x Verdant Catacombs
2x Overgrown Tomb
2x Cavern of Souls
1x Woodland Cemetery
13x Swamp
3x Dismember (Current test)
3x Mortarpod
3x Liliana of the Veil
I'm hoping people will see this list, tweak a few cards here and there and, most importantly, help me playtest it! So far I've only been able to play this new version vs Faeries (which is a very favourable match for this deck), but it needs to be tested against much more than this to be considered good of course.
Here are some notes to explain some of the cards and interactions in the deck:
Gravecrawler - A beater that can return from the grave as long as any creature in the deck (Viscera Seer excluded) is on the field. Excellent when paired with a Death Baron because he becomes a 3/2 that the opponent can't even block with something larger effectively. Also, it is a semi-combo enabler.
Viscera Seer - Honourary Zombie; A 1 costed sac outlet that lets us scry as many times as we have mana to cast Gravecrawler. Also enables us to sac Relentless Dead for graveyard card advantage any time.
Relentless Dead - Hard to block for the opponent, and doing so generally results in us getting it back + another zombie onto the field anyway.
Geralf's Messenger - Coming into play tapped is annoying, but much less so at the end of the opponents turn with Collected Company!
Diregraf Colossus - A late game/grind all-star. Often entering the battlefield somewhere between a 3/3 and a 6/6 for 3, the price for the power is decent. However, Diregraf Colossus + Viscera Seer + GraveCrawler = a 2/2 token for 1 mana that can be repeated as many times as you can pay for it. Since it's not unlikely that two of the 3 can be found off of a Collected Company, it's not difficult to do either.
Death Baron - Gives deathtouch to everything, which means our creatures push through or trade at worst, and we can often just replay our threats again on the same turn!
Geth's Verdict - Untargeted removal that's great vs decks playing a small number of powerful creatures, especially vs Infect/Boggles because they can't protect from it.
There are currently 3 spots that are open in the deck, which I think should be used for disruption of some kind. Preferably costing 1 or 2 mana if at all possible. Right now I'm try out Dismember, since it can kill pretty much anything in the format and can be casted for 1 mana in a pinch most times. Often it is cast for 2 though, which minimizes life loss a bit. I'm open to other suggestions as well though of course. I haven't tried using it for discard yet, but it might be just as good or better overall.
One last thing about the mana: Untapped Black mana is the most important thing you can get in the deck. On turn 1, you need B, On turn 2 you need BB, and on turn 3 you need BBB. This is why the deck is mainly basics, and why even a single Forest isn't included (I'd put 1 in sideboard for Path to Exile decks though).
Again, I'm hoping for some feedback on the deck to improve it further, and I hope it interests a few of you enough to do some play testing with it!
Thanks for reading my wall of text,
SonicKaos
I'm not sure I understand the benefits of Lotleth Troll in a deck like this though. aside from Gravecrawlers, you don't actually want to discard any of your creatures. I am a big fan of the card for sure, but i don't see the advantage here. Could you explain?
Overall I would consider the deck more of a midrange deck though than a full on aggro deck. It can't put out super fast damage like the best aggro decks, but it also has more staying power once the innitial rush has been dealt with. out of sideboard, i'm sure we could put together some cards that would help us gain life or otherwise deal with their aggro though. The deck used to have Liliana and Smallpox to help slow things down, but I had removed them for now because they make it difficult to get to the 3 mana needed for the new creatures.
If the meta becomes hyper aggro with Merfolk or Affinity only, the deck may struggle a bit. If it's Infect or Boggles then we're in great shape, and if it slows down a bit now that Eldrazi is weakened a little, then we should be in a good place.
I suspect playing Satyr Wayfinders may also be required or you're going to miss land drops. Consistently hitting your 4th land drop is pretty unlikely in this deck as is (22 lands, no filtering). Life from the Loam is another alternative, and jam 4 ghost quarters or something instead of mutavault.
The biggest issue with this deck is that casting coco on turn 4 is not very good in modern. There's no Zombie llanowar elves unfortunately.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
I have been debating adding another swamp to the deck though to get it up to 23 lands. Since the deck only needs 3 to play anything aside from Co, missing 1 land drop often isn't the end of the word either so far. It would be nice to ensure though. That said, I can't see adding in any mana to the deck that doesn't produce black on its own. Nykthos and Mutavault are both dead lands if you get them before turn 3, which is concerning. I would love to have 4 Mutavaults, but it would prevent me from playing almost every card in the deck on curve...
I think I will try replacing the 3 Dismembers with 1 land and 2 Abrupt Decay. I'm open to removing the Geth's Verdict, but I don't know that another 3 costing creature would be my choice for replacement. Fleshbag Maurader is great when hit with a CoCo, but otherwise kinda clogs up the 3 drop spot further. Other 2 cost removal spells might be better to remove what's important to hit, while keeping the Verdicts in sideboard for certain matchups.
@Imborj - I'm still uncertain on why Lotleth will fit well in this deck. i love the card, but I don't want to discard creatures in this build aside from Gravecrawler, so he'll be a 3/2 with regen at best in most cases. unless I can discard a few cards to get the win or something. Could you eplain it further?
Thanks for the feedback so far guys! i'll make some changes to the decklist tonight. I'm thinking:
-2 Dismember
-2 Geth's Verdict
+3 Abrupt Decay
+1 Swamp
Might have to add an extra green source in as well, which I suppose means the deck is no longer Mono Black...
Mutavault's ability to let you cast gravecrawler in the event you have an empty board is really stellar.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
It certainly does seem that the best zombie 2 drops are better played as 3 drops these days sadly. It's a tough spot to fill with creatures, even with Relentless Dead now. I wasn't really considering bloodghast (also a great card though) because it doesn't benefit from any of the zombie synergies that the deck is going for, but the deck can always change a bit. I'm interested in trying Lotleth Troll mainly due to regeneration, although it may also slow down the deck a little. Is anyone able to play test this list?
If I knew I could draw them then it would certainly be worth it. I'm a little hesitate at the moment because I need BB on turn 2 frequently, but it's worth trying at the least.
It also makes Blood Scrivener better because you unload your hand faster. Lotleth Troll can help with that, too.
I'm a Merfolk player, trying to find some similarities and have just about cut out the Lords. 3's a big bump. Getting dmg through with Seas, MoW... I guess there's somethings you can't replicate.
Have you all tried Vial with RD? Or is coco just better?
BTW, went 2/2 in a fairly competitive meta last night, and I know there are a couple cards I want to take out, but lotleth troll + diregraf collosus is way fun. I love discarding zombies to troll and swinging, then casting a huge diregraf collosus. Then if any of them happen to be a gravecrawler, recur that bad boy too. so much fun.
BTW, i played ZERO relentless dead, i don't think it is a particularly good card. the hype is real.
That is not a bad suggestion, the card seems great. I recently built a deck with 28 zombie creatures that plays 4 x Descendants' Path. So far in my testing, the card has been too slow and has been hitting lands with it's ability far too often. I will continue to play test it but with so many zombie creatures and 21 lands, how often it hit lands felt like it wasn't doing much for me.