I went 4-0-1 winning the just-for-fun final after IDing, in a ~40+ person FNM a week and a half ago with this deck. I was 10-1 in games that night. Got the promo Push as a door prize and (to the shop's credit but my chagrin) then was passed over for the finals prize because of it. I missed last Friday because I was sick.
This deck feels kinda dumb, but super fun, and flat-out broken in a non-negligible number of games. It has that occasional free-win advantage that allows it to compete in a format where you really almost need to be doing something broken at least some of the time. Obviously, like any deck, it also has nuances that reveal themselves with time, like sequencing, or say naming "Ape" with Cavern against non-blue decks, or say Extracting your own Scourges. Learning how to play the keep/mull is also hugely important for this deck, and it mulls far differently than any other deck does.
If there's one thing I know about Colorless Stompy its this: whatever you do, don't run Expedition Map. For real, that card is just absolutely not what this deck wants to be doing.
My build's a little different (wouldn't say better, but suits me):
I really like the Cavern of Souls, since my shop has plenty of shrewd blue players. My list goes light on Powder and Gemstone Caverns to minimize the topdeck duds; Copter helps ditch redundant Chalices or SSGs as well. I also really like the Copter for the flying clock crewed by cheap manlands or summoning-sick new guys. It might be right to lose Urborg, a GQ, or a Mutavault for the third Wreckage. The deck topdecks badly and card draw is hugely helpful.
[EDIT]Or, and this is probably just dumb, what about a one-of Miren, the Moaning Well to get value out of chump-blocks or an opponent's removal when we have mana but nothing else to spend it on in the mid to late game?
about the land base... I sometimes wonder if urborg is just a bit of an artifact from the eye of ugin days. always the first land i think about cutting when putting the deck back together.
also running the 2 copter main. at least around my meta im seeing a huge down tick in K-command.
im doing a 1 of scrabbling claws in board acting as a 5th relic.
liking my list a lot. its surprising that this deck is not catching on. no matter how much i seem to win with the deck everyone still thinks its trash...
Played this deck again yesterday and went 5-1. Unfortunately in the seventh round (last round before Top 8) MTGO crashed/my Internet stopped/ something happened and I couldn’t continue to play. This was extremly tilting especially since I was playing tight all evening and was up against a favorable MU in the last round. Frustrating end of an otherwise sweet event.
Here are my matches anyway:
R1 against UW control - win
Two good games, his answers just didn’t line up well enough with my threats. Cavern of Souls did a lot of work.
G1 Good hand with Temple, multiple threats, I drew into cavern eventually, TKS took his Wrath.
G2 Hand with Cavern and multiple threats, I drew into Temple and TKS took his Wrath.
R2 5c DS - win
G1 On the play, no t1 discard so t2 Chalice stops him significantly and is the reason I won this game. I grind through Goyf and Liliana. Opp did never find Abrupt Decay for the Chalice.
G2 t1 thoughtseize into t2 thoughtseize and DS into t3 goyf and t4 goyf quickly runs me over.
G3 After Serum Powder I keep a 6 lander with double Temple and Relic with Scourge in exile, opp kept one lander with multiple goyfs, i topdeck running TKS he concedes when he fails to find his second land.
G2 and G3 were very one sided games. Definitely got pretty lucky in G3 there.
R3 Eldrazi Tron - loss
G1 T1 chalice on the play. Opp on natural tron into ballista clearing my double Mimics into smasher. Kept a good hand but matched up not well against his.
G2 Great hand with Mimic, TKS and Temple, he was constricted on mana and I quickly run him over.
G3 Kept an okay 6 but with mimic and temple. Drew poorly for the next 3 turns and fall behind. Endbringer with Collar into Karn finishes the job.
R4 aggressive RB discard hollow one deck - win
G1 I’m on the draw but have an early chalice. It’s a close race. If he would have found a discard effect on his last draw step he would have won the game.
G2 He had t1 Hollow One into t2 Gurmag and Phoenix - he run me over even though I had t1 Chalice.
G3 Slightly reboard after seeing Hollow One / Tasigur (I take out Ratchet bomb). I had t2 Chalice on a medium 6. Opp kept a one lander relying on faithless loothing, but he played a creature t1 so my Chalice could still get him. He stumbled long enough for me to find threats and close out the game.
Opp is on a sweet brew there and it was interesting to play against this deck.
R5 against Creature toolbox combo - win
G1 My opp kept a one lander with double bird on 6. I go t1 Mimic into t2 Smasher into t3 TKS. Opp scoops it up.
G2 Opp kept an unexciting 6 with bird. I went removal into Scourge into Smasher - game
Opp mulliganed twice and kept risky hands and stumbled a little bit. I got great hands both times so the match was over after just a couple of minutes.
R6 Eldrazi Tron - win
G1 Super close game. Opp had the choice to try and stabilize or to try and race me. He tried to race me with Smashers which I was very happy about as I could not have powered through his defense if he had played the game more defensively. We got into a very tight spot in the end and Opp made a slight misstep that cost him the game.
G2 I have the double Temple double TKS and Smasher hand, while Opp did not have the nut draw so I could power out my creatures before him to quickly run him over. He scoops on t3.
I got pretty good draws through most of the event and so eventually my luck had to end at some point. It did here in form of a dead connection to mtgo.
R7 against UW. A bit of early pressure from my side, he can keep the board relatively clean. He was plusing his Jace against my board of 4 lands and a Scourge. He decides to minus Jace reveiling Wrath, Gideon, Ally of Zendikar and Spreading Seas. I split Seas and Wrath against Gideon, he takes the Gideon and plays it. Luckily he decides not to Tec Edge my fourth land.
I topdeck the fifth land for my Smasher. At this point he has one unknown card in hand, if I recall correctly, and I had a Cavern of Souls on Eldrazi so it would have been quite likely for the Smasher to connect, which would have cleared the Gideon (together with Scourge) and leave me in a good spot.
But I never got to play the Smasher as MTGO stopped responding at this exact moment. I don’t know exactly what happened but I couldn’t get it to work in time to continue playing. So I lost the match and couldn't continue in potential Top 8.
Overall I had good draws, good MUs and made no mistakes as far as I am aware of, so had a pretty good run. I am happy with the MD and the lands configuration. There are less grindy decks like BGx at the moment and SGW can be too mana intensive / clunky when you draw multiple lands in a row. I rarely get to activate it nowadays. That’s why I went down to two copies.
Cavern seems great to me atm. It’s really important not to walk into Remand against Storm and to Resolve your creatures against the Control decks which feature more counters atm. So I'm on 3 Cavern of Souls, 2 Tec Edge, 3 Blinkmoth, 2 SGW, 0 Mutavault.
@daviusminimus
Welcome!
Your list seems reasonable for a Budget build. I would go for the third Dismember as the next card to buy. Besides with only two Dismembers Urborg doesn't seem very necessary IMO.
By selling your last deck you don't mean Amulet, do you?
You want overpowered hands, regardless of Powder. Your example hand is fantastic and an easy keep. Your curve is great, you have Temple, and you opened a nice spread of questions (Scourge will beat most midrange decks; TKS will beat most combo decks; Matter will help against the rest). It's also wrong to view it as a 5-carder and not a 6-carder, since the Scourge is far from dead; if anything, the hand you Powder into would be an 8-carder, and not the other way around. It's just that this 6-carder is probably better than the 8-carder you'd get by Powdering, as your odds of drawing Temple are further decreased when you exile one.
If you don't have Temple or T1 Chalice and you have Powder you definitely Powder it away. In fact, you even Powder away most T1 Chalice hands lacking Temple, especially in the dark. If you have lots of cards and no Powder, but your hand doesn't have Temple or T1 Chalice (or three lands, Chalice, a three-drop, and Dismember), you just mulligan it the old-fashioned way.
I didn't watch this full video (turned it off after 1 minute lol) but here's Corbin making two awful mulligan decisions in the first 20 seconds of his game. Hand 1 (which he Powders) is a keep, and hand 2 (which he keeps) is a ship. The deck is designed to find 4-, 5-, 6-, or 7-card hands like his first opener, so having functional dead cards like Powder doesn't matter.
On Copter: it's very useful in matchups that degenerate into board stalls, like CoCo. Pretty lackluster elsewhere. It definitely gets sided out a lot. I'm running one still for help with with CoCo, as well as a Cage and an AID in the side.
On Fountain: Blech. Consider switching out some Dismembers for Spatials instead. I would also max out on Relic and cut Guide if you're playing without Chalice, but know that you are playing a significantly nerfed version of the deck without the artifact.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Thanks for your response Jordan - I kinda knew that about mulligans, but I'm just new to the deck and it is definitely the hardest thing to get right. I'm also the sort of player who just "tries out" a mulligan (Or keep) to see how it goes. That's quite a slow learning process considering the number of different hands you can get with this deck.
In terms of card selection, the Radiant Fountains have felt nice. They've bought me a turn more often than you'd expect, and come at a very small cost (I don't consider Mutavault overly key, since the Blinkmoth doesn't get activated THAT often and the air is usually the reason I'm using the moth). Clearly small sample size, and I haven't actually played with vaults, but fountain has felt good so far.
With regards to Spirit Guide - I realise the full playset makes a lot of sense when you have chalice. But, I have found Spirit Guides to have uses anyway. The speed bump has been key in a bunch of match-ups (it even paid for a condescend in my last match), but is an easy sideboard cut when speed is less key. In my budget build at least, I think 2 copies are extremely reasonable (you don't topdeck them TOO much, they work in the opener, easy to sideboard out). Although I take on board they're better with chalice, I'm happy with 2 mainboard for a budget list.
I have to say, I am loving the deck. It feels weirdly like burn (it either JUST gets there, or won't), but has a mini combo feel to it (since there's so much stock on the mulligans). Add the fact that you have some interaction both main and side, and you just have a very nicely varied deck. It's great to play. In my current game, I've just beaten Dredge Game 1 without a Relic, using Ghost Quarters to take them off green and then red. These are the cool lines that you just don't get with other decks. Big fan
I've completely 2 leagues now (only friendlies unfortunately, dont have the tix to jump into comp league just yet). I've gone 3-2 and 4-1 (still with the budget list). Deck feels very solid for something made on 80 tix!
Yep, mulls are the hardest, hence the extra attention paid to them. Not "more often than I'd expect" since I tested them myself. Have fun with those against linear combo decks like Valakut; vs these you badly want Vaults. Once you get better at life management, and grab some Chalices, I would wager you'll realize the Fountains are a crutch.
Glad you like the deck but I disagree with most of your takes on it (matches vs. midrange decks tend not to be close at all, for instance; the deck attacks from multiple angles, unlike Burn; SSG is lackluster to the point of being unplayable if you aren't reliably accelerating into a broken play on turn one).
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Spyglass not worth i think, i changed my mind and will test instead phyrexian revoker, because same mana but as a creature more agressiv. I need an effect of needle/spyglass/revoker because of eldrazi. Call endbringer/ballista/basilisk collar/kharn/ratchet. It is great vs. Affinity too and lantern. Each of this decks have less removal, so revoker is maybe better then needle and spyglass, because you dont loose to much creatures after siding and dont loose your agrostyle. P.S affinity and lantern is a bad matchup for me, because i cut chalice and play relic. Maybe because of this it is not needed for some of you guys and only for me
One of the main uses for Needle/Spyglass and the reason I put it into the deck at all is dealing with planeswalkers, which usually come out of decks packed with removal (UW, Jeskai, Esper, BGx, etc.). Against Ux, for instance, Relic-Scourge often sets games up so that the only way they can beat us is with Sun's Champ. I can see Revoker being better vs. Lantern or Affinity though. Personally I don't think this deck is playable right now without Chalices; keep in mind my article featuring the 4-Relic version was published during a warped metagame (specifically, just before the Dredge ban).
I have been on 2 Spyglass over the Needles. The upside I noted of hitting lands while being aggressive is largely irrelevant, as Mimic often comes out when Spyglass comes in. But there are some matchups where we want Chalice on 1 AND a Needle (Ux control decks especially, but also Bant Eldrazi, and Affinity on the play), and Spyglass is obviously better there. It is much harder on our curve though. Still watching the slot.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Relic is great and you should try your own article again. Yesterday i played x-mage and i was the one with the most points between 320 players because of this deck only. But forget x-mage, since i play this deck with relic, i NEVER loose more then 1 match on each paper tournament since now 4 months. Let me try to explain with my bad english and bad math....relic is great vs. Several decks, but chalice too against the same decks + affinity and burn...3 points chalice. On the other hand, they are match were both not relevant, but you can cycle relic there...1 point relic. Another 1 point for eternal and relic combo. 1 point for cutting scg because not needed without relic, so we have 4 more slots. 1 point because of the legendary rule for relic and more sideboard options without frightening about your own chalice. Overall (for me) is relic over chalice. 4 points vs. 3
What do you mean I should try my own article? I have written several articles on this deck and only one advocated for mainboard Relics. I have had much more success with Chalice, the card I literally built this deck around. But if you're having success with Relic, by all means, stick with it! Looking forward to seeing you win a big tournament 😁
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
I've tinkered with a couple versions of this deck (on MTGO, where I play), one merged with mono-white D&T and another straight colorless (both without Chalice). A couple of thoughts:
(1) I never missed Chalice, until I did. I played a couple leagues where the extra creature density was enough to carry me through regardless then ran into a league where I spent 3 consecutive matches wishing I had it because I couldn't race the efficiency of one-mana spells. I would say you want it at least in the sideboard, but as Jordan pointed out I'm not sure you can justify the SSG main without it and Chalice is significantly worse when you're not powering it out early. Not sure the final answer -- I may MB it at some point (budget permitting) to see if it's a net positive.
(2) It's been said before, but mulligans are far more important to this deck than you realize. If you're worrying about card advantage, you'll keep a borderline hand that loses to durdling. You should be very aggressive in pitching to Serum Powder and mulling to find Temple. A Mimic, Reshaper, TKS, etc. are fantastic tempo plays a turn early that put your opponent on the back foot. Your best defense is hammering at an opponent's life total; you are (almost) always the beatdown. When you cast those same creatures on curve, you lose that advantage and it's not a great deck at playing the control. Chalice probably helps there, but this deck wants to slam the accelerator and make the opponent get out of the way. Your removal is there to clear the track. If you don't have something broken in your opener, you're very likely taking a light Sunday drive right into a brick wall.
What do you think about this deck with Distended Mind?
*Snip*
The "Distended Mind" is very good versus controls , Scapeshift and Tron decks and two black colors with Cavern of souls and Unclaimed territory is easy to cast.
Honestly...it's bad. In magical Christmas land, you're casting this turn 3 (Mimic and Reshaper off a Temple then sac plus 2 of your black sources) to discard two opponent's cards. That's a decent return but hardly game-breaking -- you still only have 5 power on the board and you're even on cards with your opponent, although you've gotten rid of the best of what they have in their hand. You're losing board presence and increasing the value of removal against you, a terrible decision versus control even if they can't counter Mindbender because of a Cavern. The worst case is you're not casting this until late game when their hand is empty of good stuff and it's a vanilla 5/5 for 8.
Most of the time you'll probably end up somewhere in between those, but the average between decent and awful is...not good. You're sacrificing consistency and power for a janky combo that doesn't have much of a payout. If you're trying to make a splash work, look for something that provides more value on its own. I'm not sure these actually justify inclusion, but options like Wasteland Strangler, Eldrazi Displacer, Drowner of Hope, Eldrazi Skyspawner, or Bearer of Silence would be more defensible choices.
I have tried versions with and without Chalice and I definitely prefer the Chalice & SSG version. Chalice is just such a powerful card on its own. The synergy between Relic and Scourge is great but it is sufficient out of the board IMO. Just as an indicator of Chalices power look at Eldrazi Tron. They play Chalice even though they have Map and Basilisk Collar as well. And it is not just any card they play, it is part of the reason why Eldrazi Tron is actually a powerful deck. This deck here can abuse Chalice even more because of SSG.
This being said, if you have great results with MD relic, mtgnorin, then continue playing them! I also think that Tec Edge makes more sense in a build with Relic as your build will be more grindy than a Chalice version. But I don't think that the surprise factor of Chalice matters. The card is still great even if people know about it.
Besides casually locking down entire decks, Chalice is also good because it is a good tempo card. It protects your expensive threats from cheap removal and therefore helps you to overwhelm your opponent without giving them a good chance to stabilize.
And it is a good T1 play. This is an aggro deck that is slightly light on T1 plays. Chalice helps in this regard as it allows you to be very proactive from the first turn of the game.
In primer eldratron they talk now too about chalice. Todd stevens moved chalice in his sideboard (premium article) because you hit not enough decks now with more big mana. Instead 1 more basilisc collar main, 2 warping wail and 1 mindstone. Collar because of creatures and wail because of titanshift. I repeat only guys in the primer, dont read article myself
This deck is built around Chalice. ETron is not. They don't play Guides or Gemstones or Powders; their Chalices are far worse than ours and unreliable.
For the millionth time if mainboard Relics work for you, by all means, play them. I personally don't recommend them right now and know for a fact that I built this deck around Chalice. You won't convince me, but play what you like.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
I've tried playing them together(in a different version of this deck) and it causes tension -- for example, an opener with both plus a SSG when you want to drop the Chalice on 1. It's not impossible to play around, but it seems unnecessary. Why give up even more CA for a fairly underpowered card in Relic? Makes more sense to pick the one that better suits your meta. In an open meta like MTGO, I'm running Chalice.
@daviusminimus
IMO it really depends on the MU. In your example on the draw you can probably already put your opponent on a deck and act accordingly. Generally the more removal I suspect from my op the more inclined I am to open with Chalice. So for example: opponent goes Polluted Delta - go, I would play Chalice. If he opens with Windswept Heath - go (maybe creature combo without mana dork, Scapeshfit etc.), I would open with Mimic. In the dark on the play I would generally go for Chalice. But it also depends on the rest of your hand. E.g. on the play, your hand is double Temple, Smasher, SSG, Chalice and Mimic I would go for T1 Mimic into T2 Smasher (although this is a cornercase scenario ).
well SCG categorized the deck as eldrazi tron, even though it contains 0 tron lands... but i got 5th in an IQ today. was 1st place going into top 8. my opponent got incredibly lucky as i drew 13 lands 4 serum powders game 3 to somehow lose :/ ... but still a good showing. 5-2 ...11-4 in games. only losses the deck beat itself really... other one being vs jund. I lost game 1 then mulligan'd into oblivion g2....
i won on a mull to 3 at another point in the tournament though. Key to the city was great. I would have played a second tectonic edge over a third cavern but i didnt have one on me.
did not miss a second wastes. affinity and other more aggressive decks play one, it was fine.
TecEdge was a tryout to fight Scapeshift decks mostly, which i found to be rather mediocre. It will slow them down a turn at best, and if you dont aggro them out fast enough, wont make any difference. you can ofcourse destroy one of their mountains if an unexperienced player fetches 6 mountains and a single valakut, but that has yet to happen. On the other hand in some grindy matchups like Jund or UWx and sometimes even against Tron variants, i found TecEdge also to be ok-ish, since it will not give them a land like Quarter does. Still i guess 3 Tec-Edge is too much.
Regarding the rise of the SO many Ceremonious Rejection, im strongly considering adding Cavern of Souls in again, but im really unsure how many and what exactly to cut. I think 1-2 TecEdges for 1-2 Caverns should be right here, or whats your opinion?
Also, i have cut mutavaults, but am still unsure whether i'd rather have Mutavault or Blinkmoth. Mostly i think Blinkmoth's flying is way more relevant on the defense versus affinity and on the offense in long grindy games where the ground gets too crowded, but then again that single ping damage feels really weak.
regarding SeaGate im still thinking 3 is correct, the card is just out of control in this deck
Im Using chalice and spirit, i think i should also post my list for better understanding.
Its pretty much what Jordan was playing, with some minor adjustments
This deck feels kinda dumb, but super fun, and flat-out broken in a non-negligible number of games. It has that occasional free-win advantage that allows it to compete in a format where you really almost need to be doing something broken at least some of the time. Obviously, like any deck, it also has nuances that reveal themselves with time, like sequencing, or say naming "Ape" with Cavern against non-blue decks, or say Extracting your own Scourges. Learning how to play the keep/mull is also hugely important for this deck, and it mulls far differently than any other deck does.
If there's one thing I know about Colorless Stompy its this: whatever you do, don't run Expedition Map. For real, that card is just absolutely not what this deck wants to be doing.
My build's a little different (wouldn't say better, but suits me):
4x Eldrazi Temple
4x Ghost Quarter
4x Blinkmoth Nexus
3x Mutavault
2x Sea Gate Wreckage
2x Gemstone Caverns
2x Wastes
1x Cavern of Souls
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Creatures (24)
4x Eldrazi Mimic
4x Eternal Scourge
4x Matter Reshaper
4x Thought-Knot Seer
4x Reality Smasher
4x Simian Spirit Guide
4x Chalice of the Void
3x Serum Powder
1x Ratchet Bomb
1x Smuggler's Copter
Instants (4)
4x Dismember
4x Spatial Contortion
4x Relic of Progenitus
2x Ratchet Bomb
2x Pithing Needle
2 Surgical Extraction
1x Grafdigger's Cage
[EDIT]Or, and this is probably just dumb, what about a one-of Miren, the Moaning Well to get value out of chump-blocks or an opponent's removal when we have mana but nothing else to spend it on in the mid to late game?
also running the 2 copter main. at least around my meta im seeing a huge down tick in K-command.
im doing a 1 of scrabbling claws in board acting as a 5th relic.
liking my list a lot. its surprising that this deck is not catching on. no matter how much i seem to win with the deck everyone still thinks its trash...
U Mono U Tron
WR Boros Burn with one Stomping Ground
UR Storm
C Eldrazi Powder
G Mono Green Tron
4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Eternal Scourge
2 Matter Reshaper
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
4 Dismember
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Smuggler's Copter
4 Serum Powder
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Mutavault
3 Sea Gate Wreckage
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Wastes
2 Culling Scales
1 Gut Shot
3 Ratchet Bomb
4 Relic of Progenitus
1 Scrabbling Claws
4 Spatial Contortion
Nothing really special here. Just a copy paste from the OP decklist with a few minor tweaks.
Played this deck again yesterday and went 5-1. Unfortunately in the seventh round (last round before Top 8) MTGO crashed/my Internet stopped/ something happened and I couldn’t continue to play. This was extremly tilting especially since I was playing tight all evening and was up against a favorable MU in the last round. Frustrating end of an otherwise sweet event.
Here are my matches anyway:
R1 against UW control - win
Two good games, his answers just didn’t line up well enough with my threats. Cavern of Souls did a lot of work.
G1 Good hand with Temple, multiple threats, I drew into cavern eventually, TKS took his Wrath.
G2 Hand with Cavern and multiple threats, I drew into Temple and TKS took his Wrath.
R2 5c DS - win
G1 On the play, no t1 discard so t2 Chalice stops him significantly and is the reason I won this game. I grind through Goyf and Liliana. Opp did never find Abrupt Decay for the Chalice.
G2 t1 thoughtseize into t2 thoughtseize and DS into t3 goyf and t4 goyf quickly runs me over.
G3 After Serum Powder I keep a 6 lander with double Temple and Relic with Scourge in exile, opp kept one lander with multiple goyfs, i topdeck running TKS he concedes when he fails to find his second land.
G2 and G3 were very one sided games. Definitely got pretty lucky in G3 there.
R3 Eldrazi Tron - loss
G1 T1 chalice on the play. Opp on natural tron into ballista clearing my double Mimics into smasher. Kept a good hand but matched up not well against his.
G2 Great hand with Mimic, TKS and Temple, he was constricted on mana and I quickly run him over.
G3 Kept an okay 6 but with mimic and temple. Drew poorly for the next 3 turns and fall behind. Endbringer with Collar into Karn finishes the job.
R4 aggressive RB discard hollow one deck - win
G1 I’m on the draw but have an early chalice. It’s a close race. If he would have found a discard effect on his last draw step he would have won the game.
G2 He had t1 Hollow One into t2 Gurmag and Phoenix - he run me over even though I had t1 Chalice.
G3 Slightly reboard after seeing Hollow One / Tasigur (I take out Ratchet bomb). I had t2 Chalice on a medium 6. Opp kept a one lander relying on faithless loothing, but he played a creature t1 so my Chalice could still get him. He stumbled long enough for me to find threats and close out the game.
Opp is on a sweet brew there and it was interesting to play against this deck.
R5 against Creature toolbox combo - win
G1 My opp kept a one lander with double bird on 6. I go t1 Mimic into t2 Smasher into t3 TKS. Opp scoops it up.
G2 Opp kept an unexciting 6 with bird. I went removal into Scourge into Smasher - game
Opp mulliganed twice and kept risky hands and stumbled a little bit. I got great hands both times so the match was over after just a couple of minutes.
R6 Eldrazi Tron - win
G1 Super close game. Opp had the choice to try and stabilize or to try and race me. He tried to race me with Smashers which I was very happy about as I could not have powered through his defense if he had played the game more defensively. We got into a very tight spot in the end and Opp made a slight misstep that cost him the game.
G2 I have the double Temple double TKS and Smasher hand, while Opp did not have the nut draw so I could power out my creatures before him to quickly run him over. He scoops on t3.
I got pretty good draws through most of the event and so eventually my luck had to end at some point. It did here in form of a dead connection to mtgo.
R7 against UW. A bit of early pressure from my side, he can keep the board relatively clean. He was plusing his Jace against my board of 4 lands and a Scourge. He decides to minus Jace reveiling Wrath, Gideon, Ally of Zendikar and Spreading Seas. I split Seas and Wrath against Gideon, he takes the Gideon and plays it. Luckily he decides not to Tec Edge my fourth land.
I topdeck the fifth land for my Smasher. At this point he has one unknown card in hand, if I recall correctly, and I had a Cavern of Souls on Eldrazi so it would have been quite likely for the Smasher to connect, which would have cleared the Gideon (together with Scourge) and leave me in a good spot.
But I never got to play the Smasher as MTGO stopped responding at this exact moment. I don’t know exactly what happened but I couldn’t get it to work in time to continue playing. So I lost the match and couldn't continue in potential Top 8.
Overall I had good draws, good MUs and made no mistakes as far as I am aware of, so had a pretty good run. I am happy with the MD and the lands configuration. There are less grindy decks like BGx at the moment and SGW can be too mana intensive / clunky when you draw multiple lands in a row. I rarely get to activate it nowadays. That’s why I went down to two copies.
Cavern seems great to me atm. It’s really important not to walk into Remand against Storm and to Resolve your creatures against the Control decks which feature more counters atm. So I'm on 3 Cavern of Souls, 2 Tec Edge, 3 Blinkmoth, 2 SGW, 0 Mutavault.
https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/mtgo-standings/modern-challenge-2017-09-24#standings
That's the list I played. I'm not going to do a full SB guide, but if you are wondering about how to board against a specific MU I will gladly help.
@daviusminimus
Welcome!
Your list seems reasonable for a Budget build. I would go for the third Dismember as the next card to buy. Besides with only two Dismembers Urborg doesn't seem very necessary IMO.
By selling your last deck you don't mean Amulet, do you?
Keep (7):
Powder, Temple, Chalice, Guide, Dismember, Wastes, Mimic
Keep (5):
Powder, Temple, Sea Gate, Copter, Scourge
If you don't have Temple or T1 Chalice and you have Powder you definitely Powder it away. In fact, you even Powder away most T1 Chalice hands lacking Temple, especially in the dark. If you have lots of cards and no Powder, but your hand doesn't have Temple or T1 Chalice (or three lands, Chalice, a three-drop, and Dismember), you just mulligan it the old-fashioned way.
I didn't watch this full video (turned it off after 1 minute lol) but here's Corbin making two awful mulligan decisions in the first 20 seconds of his game. Hand 1 (which he Powders) is a keep, and hand 2 (which he keeps) is a ship. The deck is designed to find 4-, 5-, 6-, or 7-card hands like his first opener, so having functional dead cards like Powder doesn't matter.
On Copter: it's very useful in matchups that degenerate into board stalls, like CoCo. Pretty lackluster elsewhere. It definitely gets sided out a lot. I'm running one still for help with with CoCo, as well as a Cage and an AID in the side.
On Fountain: Blech. Consider switching out some Dismembers for Spatials instead. I would also max out on Relic and cut Guide if you're playing without Chalice, but know that you are playing a significantly nerfed version of the deck without the artifact.
Hope this helps!
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
Glad you like the deck but I disagree with most of your takes on it (matches vs. midrange decks tend not to be close at all, for instance; the deck attacks from multiple angles, unlike Burn; SSG is lackluster to the point of being unplayable if you aren't reliably accelerating into a broken play on turn one).
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
Beat Eldrazi Tron and Burn. Lost to elves and a Abzan Coco list with no combo.
I do well with the deck, most losses are due to poor mulliganing decisions.
But Elves feels like a very bad matchup. Even after board when I have 4 dismember, 4 spatial, 3 ratchet bomb, 1 all is dust.
Would you mind helping me with the sideboard plan for creature heavy aggro like elves?
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
I have been on 2 Spyglass over the Needles. The upside I noted of hitting lands while being aggressive is largely irrelevant, as Mimic often comes out when Spyglass comes in. But there are some matchups where we want Chalice on 1 AND a Needle (Ux control decks especially, but also Bant Eldrazi, and Affinity on the play), and Spyglass is obviously better there. It is much harder on our curve though. Still watching the slot.
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
(1) I never missed Chalice, until I did. I played a couple leagues where the extra creature density was enough to carry me through regardless then ran into a league where I spent 3 consecutive matches wishing I had it because I couldn't race the efficiency of one-mana spells. I would say you want it at least in the sideboard, but as Jordan pointed out I'm not sure you can justify the SSG main without it and Chalice is significantly worse when you're not powering it out early. Not sure the final answer -- I may MB it at some point (budget permitting) to see if it's a net positive.
(2) It's been said before, but mulligans are far more important to this deck than you realize. If you're worrying about card advantage, you'll keep a borderline hand that loses to durdling. You should be very aggressive in pitching to Serum Powder and mulling to find Temple. A Mimic, Reshaper, TKS, etc. are fantastic tempo plays a turn early that put your opponent on the back foot. Your best defense is hammering at an opponent's life total; you are (almost) always the beatdown. When you cast those same creatures on curve, you lose that advantage and it's not a great deck at playing the control. Chalice probably helps there, but this deck wants to slam the accelerator and make the opponent get out of the way. Your removal is there to clear the track. If you don't have something broken in your opener, you're very likely taking a light Sunday drive right into a brick wall.
Honestly...it's bad. In magical Christmas land, you're casting this turn 3 (Mimic and Reshaper off a Temple then sac plus 2 of your black sources) to discard two opponent's cards. That's a decent return but hardly game-breaking -- you still only have 5 power on the board and you're even on cards with your opponent, although you've gotten rid of the best of what they have in their hand. You're losing board presence and increasing the value of removal against you, a terrible decision versus control even if they can't counter Mindbender because of a Cavern. The worst case is you're not casting this until late game when their hand is empty of good stuff and it's a vanilla 5/5 for 8.
Most of the time you'll probably end up somewhere in between those, but the average between decent and awful is...not good. You're sacrificing consistency and power for a janky combo that doesn't have much of a payout. If you're trying to make a splash work, look for something that provides more value on its own. I'm not sure these actually justify inclusion, but options like Wasteland Strangler, Eldrazi Displacer, Drowner of Hope, Eldrazi Skyspawner, or Bearer of Silence would be more defensible choices.
No chalice either
Includes path arbiter and Thalia. No SSG no man lands.
I have tried versions with and without Chalice and I definitely prefer the Chalice & SSG version. Chalice is just such a powerful card on its own. The synergy between Relic and Scourge is great but it is sufficient out of the board IMO. Just as an indicator of Chalices power look at Eldrazi Tron. They play Chalice even though they have Map and Basilisk Collar as well. And it is not just any card they play, it is part of the reason why Eldrazi Tron is actually a powerful deck. This deck here can abuse Chalice even more because of SSG.
This being said, if you have great results with MD relic, mtgnorin, then continue playing them! I also think that Tec Edge makes more sense in a build with Relic as your build will be more grindy than a Chalice version. But I don't think that the surprise factor of Chalice matters. The card is still great even if people know about it.
Besides casually locking down entire decks, Chalice is also good because it is a good tempo card. It protects your expensive threats from cheap removal and therefore helps you to overwhelm your opponent without giving them a good chance to stabilize.
And it is a good T1 play. This is an aggro deck that is slightly light on T1 plays. Chalice helps in this regard as it allows you to be very proactive from the first turn of the game.
@NuBlkAU
Are you talking about kponceMTG?
If you are interested in a white version of this deck with Arbiter and Thalia: http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/deck-creation-modern/769814-death-and-staxes?page=12
U Mono U Tron
WR Boros Burn with one Stomping Ground
UR Storm
C Eldrazi Powder
G Mono Green Tron
U Mono U Tron
WR Boros Burn with one Stomping Ground
UR Storm
C Eldrazi Powder
G Mono Green Tron
SB:
1 All is Dust
3 Spatial
1 Gut Shot
1 Surgical
4 Relic
1 Needle
1 Cage
3 BombThis deck is built around Chalice. ETron is not. They don't play Guides or Gemstones or Powders; their Chalices are far worse than ours and unreliable.
For the millionth time if mainboard Relics work for you, by all means, play them. I personally don't recommend them right now and know for a fact that I built this deck around Chalice. You won't convince me, but play what you like.
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
IMO it really depends on the MU. In your example on the draw you can probably already put your opponent on a deck and act accordingly. Generally the more removal I suspect from my op the more inclined I am to open with Chalice. So for example: opponent goes Polluted Delta - go, I would play Chalice. If he opens with Windswept Heath - go (maybe creature combo without mana dork, Scapeshfit etc.), I would open with Mimic. In the dark on the play I would generally go for Chalice. But it also depends on the rest of your hand. E.g. on the play, your hand is double Temple, Smasher, SSG, Chalice and Mimic I would go for T1 Mimic into T2 Smasher (although this is a cornercase scenario
i won on a mull to 3 at another point in the tournament though. Key to the city was great. I would have played a second tectonic edge over a third cavern but i didnt have one on me.
did not miss a second wastes. affinity and other more aggressive decks play one, it was fine.
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=116878
my latest tweak includes:
2 Waste
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Tectonic Edge
3 Sea Gate Wreckage
3 Gemstone Caverns
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Blinkmoth Nexus
TecEdge was a tryout to fight Scapeshift decks mostly, which i found to be rather mediocre. It will slow them down a turn at best, and if you dont aggro them out fast enough, wont make any difference. you can ofcourse destroy one of their mountains if an unexperienced player fetches 6 mountains and a single valakut, but that has yet to happen. On the other hand in some grindy matchups like Jund or UWx and sometimes even against Tron variants, i found TecEdge also to be ok-ish, since it will not give them a land like Quarter does. Still i guess 3 Tec-Edge is too much.
Regarding the rise of the SO many Ceremonious Rejection, im strongly considering adding Cavern of Souls in again, but im really unsure how many and what exactly to cut. I think 1-2 TecEdges for 1-2 Caverns should be right here, or whats your opinion?
Also, i have cut mutavaults, but am still unsure whether i'd rather have Mutavault or Blinkmoth. Mostly i think Blinkmoth's flying is way more relevant on the defense versus affinity and on the offense in long grindy games where the ground gets too crowded, but then again that single ping damage feels really weak.
regarding SeaGate im still thinking 3 is correct, the card is just out of control in this deck
would be great to get some input
Its pretty much what Jordan was playing, with some minor adjustments
2 Endless One
4 Eldrazi Mimic
3 Matter Reshaper
4 Eternal Scourge
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Dismember
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Serum Powder
2 Wastes
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Tectonic Edge
3 Sea Gate Wreckage
3 Gemstone Caverns
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Blinkmoth Nexus
So you'd say cut a SeaGate and a TecEdge to include 2 Cavern.