Relic's synergy with Eternal Scourge is too good to pass up, imo. I'd only run Leylines in a meta with a lot of Dredge. Plus getting stuck with Leylines in hand feels real bad.
Doesn't Batterskull count as generic target? Seems like a good card in matchups where Karn is relevant to me. If you want an actual artifact creature, I think Walking Balista or Hangerback Walker are the best ones to choose from in Modern.
Unfortunately, most of the artifacts that are playable in modern are either hate cards or narrow archetype specific cards. I'm crossing my fingers that Modern Horizons gives Karn some new toys.
Do you side in the hate rocks in G2/3, or not? If so, do you side out Karn? How do you accommodate the fact that he only tutors from exile?
I've been testing Karn and I really don't know how to side yet. If I side out Karn, the hate rocks obviously go in, but in other cases, I side in all but one of a hate rock, so Karn can get one from the side and isn't completely dead. My 1x hate rocks don't ever really get sided in if Karn stays in.
Right now as placeholders until I get Greaves, I'm using Walking B and God-Pharaoh's Statue as sideboard cards. I really like the Batterskull suggestion though, def gonn try that.
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Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
I tried out a list with two new Karns and one Blast Zone (wanted more but couldnt find any) at my LGS. Unfortunately, my opponents had the nuts two rounds and I got a bye, but here's my first impressions.
Karn did not feel good. I sided it out most of the time and never drew it but I also never wanted to. I kept it in againt affinity but that deck was way too fast for Karn to matter anyways. Meh.
Blast Zone single-handedly won me a game against humans. Was able to nab 4 (!) 1 drops with it. Would recommend.
I tried out a list with two new Karns and one Blast Zone (wanted more but couldnt find any) at my LGS. Unfortunately, my opponents had the nuts two rounds and I got a bye, but here's my first impressions.
Karn did not feel good. I sided it out most of the time and never drew it but I also never wanted to. I kept it in againt affinity but that deck was way too fast for Karn to matter anyways. Meh.
Blast Zone single-handedly won me a game against humans. Was able to nab 4 (!) 1 drops with it. Would recommend.
The idea is that our good MUs are good enough that having Karn in game 1 isn't so bad. Think of it as drawing a Serum Powder against decks like Burn. But having Karn in the main makes previously unwinnable (Bridge prison, Hardened Scales) or difficult (UW) much better if not outright favorable. It's well worth the tradeoff when it comes to increasing percentage points across the board, but you will definitely have lots of outlier-type, anecdotal events of it being "bad" to cherry pick from if that's the case you want to make. In any case, run what you like 😌
Think I will go to 3 Blast Zone. Pretty much always want it, even against like, control decks.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
I have two right now and blowing up Planeswalkers/Bridge have been hilarious to see, although the Red Prison player I've never beaten has also hopped on the Karn band wagon.
What's your manabase looking like now? I'm having a difficult time trying to figure out the optimal split between man lands, Caverns, Void, and now Blast Zone.
Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
Before WAR I was feeling that red Eldrazi was the better choice, but the addition of blast zone makes me question that a bit. There just isn't space for it in red Eldrazi, and the advantages of red just don't feel as worth it now.
I have two right now and blowing up Blood Moon/Bridge have been hilarious to see,
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I dont think Blast Zone does anything to stop Blood Moon. By the time it's in play, Blast Zone is a Mountain
If you want to fit Blast Zone in the red version from the Mythic Championship, I would drop the aweful Blood Moon plan and cut two wastes for two Blast Zones.
Sorry I was posting on two different forums. I meant Bridge and other stuff. It's hilarious to wipe out an Affinity player's board of everything except an Ornithopter and lands.
Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
What's your manabase looking like now? I'm having a difficult time trying to figure out the optimal split between man lands, Caverns, Void, and now Blast Zone.
I played yesterday on a 6 round tournament with 2 karn + 3 blast zone. Finished 3:3. Karn is good versus affinity/artifacts, but useless versus rest. So I am unsure about him. Playing 1-2 in main I think it is OK, but not changing many slots in your side because him. Karn in hands of opponents seems stronger as in our hand. Blast zone was great. Killed shadow, Infekt and helps versus Affinity. Observation of day: karn is everywhere, really everywhere. 38 player and 10 of this used karn. Lost round 1 versus karn into bridge next turn. Tron is now really hard, because even if you ghost quarter him or surgical his lands, they can bring in karn easy and bridge will stop you. Maybe you can attack another time, but you need to do this against karn so he could not search again. It is now really strong and a real problem
I tried Karn again at FNM last week and still wasnt impressed. I think I'll give him one or two more chances but its not looking good. Right now it feels like there are too many matchups where Karn does absolutely nothing.
I'm not sure about the manabase. I feel pinched between all of the utility lands. Maybe Zhalfirin Void is the one we can most afford to lose? Maybe I want more manlands? I don't know.
And I'm genuinely unsure about Karn, either Karn. I like Karn, the Great Creator in certain matches, and to just go get something. I like Karn, Scion of Urza against mid-range and control.
I've only played 10 rounds with it so far, but I never felt like there was an issue arising from the spread of utility lands, at most I've considered cutting one Blinkmoth for a third Blast Zone.
I've only played 10 rounds with it so far, but I never felt like there was an issue arising from the spread of utility lands, at most I've considered cutting one Blinkmoth for a third Blast Zone.
For the record that would be my exact current manabase. I've gone to 2 Blink 3 Zone. Only difference is I run 23 lands, not 24, so -1 Quarter. To weigh in on the recent discussion, pretty sure Void is always insane in this deck, and would probably never go below 4. Karn is here to address previously unwinnable and difficult MUs because it doesn't much hurt our good MUs. We are definitely a worse "Karn deck" than Tron, but who cares?
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
I second running a full set of Void. The scrying helps an unbelievable amount for a deck that can't draw any cards (at least that I'm aware of).
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Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
I can't wait to get my blast zones in the mail. I think that the biggest impact this card will have is finally shifting grixis death's shadow to a favored matchup. It's pretty 50/50 in my experience and can change depending on the shadow's list. Chalice almost always gets countered, discarded, or hit with kolaghan's command. And while we can chump block for days the TBR will eventually get us. But having this card at 3 copies, I feel like it would be very difficult to lose because shadow itself is all that we really care about from them.
Also, Damping Sphere has been MVP for me. I was skeptical at first about it but honestly it's better against tron than Spyglass and it eats amulet titan alive too. Mimic into Damping Sphere is probably the best thing the deck can do against either of those strategies.
This is the sideboard I run at my shop. My shop is heavy on rock variants, death's shadow, and control. I think the dredge matchup is pretty easy with this setup and wouldn't recommend leylines over relic because of what you lose against rock. I think two damping sphere is necessary for its effects on tron, amulet, and phoenix. I think the flex spots here are the spyglasses. Tron's threat diversity is too wide imo for this to be effective. O-stone is the best card to name but I think you're better off damping them or cheesing them with quarter or surgical. It's also good against control but I feel like U/W Terminus is just too bad of a matchup anymore that you just gotta hope they don't have it. It's also such a small portion of the metagame that I just hope to dodge. Jeskai you don't need them. Whenever I take this to a big event I just swap out the spyglasses for something else depending on what I expect to face. I'm not on karn yet simply because I don't really face the problem decks (bridge, scales, etc) that karn is going to help against. Once he comes into the picture I'm not sure what I'll do.
I'll be bringing this to battle in Louisville at the SCG Open unless disaster strikes. The saddest part of it all is Hareruya backlogged a lot of their shipping because of oversales (at least, that's what I've heard), my remaining Jpn Foils won't be in before the event, so I'll have to suffer with English Karns, Blast Zones, and SB wish targets.
I know, a troubled life I lead, definitely.
Regardless, the next 9 days or so will be testing with various wishboard targets and land configurations, I'm still not sure if I want to hold on 24 lands or trim to 23 like Jordan is running, and a few of the spots in the SB still need to be shored up, but as long as I get to dodge UW at the Open I feel very positive about the matches.
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Didn't take long to see that there needs to be a very generic target for Karn in the sideboard.
Something that is good in every match. I immediately turned to looking for a creature as an easy beater. Maybe the best option is heart of Kiran.
Any other ideas for 1 slot in the sideboard for a generically decent artifact?
Unfortunately, most of the artifacts that are playable in modern are either hate cards or narrow archetype specific cards. I'm crossing my fingers that Modern Horizons gives Karn some new toys.
win tournament (4 round, prize prerelease war of spark)
Creatures
3 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Eternal Scourge
4 Matter Reshaper
4 Reality Smasher
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Thought-Knot Seer
Lands
3 Blinkmoth Nexus
4 Eldrazi Temple
2 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Mutavault
1 Scavenger Grounds
3 Field of Ruin
3 Wastes
Other
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Dismember
4 Serum Powder
2 Smuggler's Copter
Sideboard
2 Warping Wail
2 damping sphere (SLOW SIDEBOARD)
2 Ratchet Bomb
3 Relic of Progenitus
2 Spatial Contortion
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Endless One
match 1.
1-1 vs BUG, slow play.
match 2.
2-1 vs tron, chalice X=1 and field win
match 3.
2-1 vs tron,
match 4.
2-1 vs eldrazi white, copter turn 1 = win
Do you side in the hate rocks in G2/3, or not? If so, do you side out Karn? How do you accommodate the fact that he only tutors from exile?
I've been testing Karn and I really don't know how to side yet. If I side out Karn, the hate rocks obviously go in, but in other cases, I side in all but one of a hate rock, so Karn can get one from the side and isn't completely dead. My 1x hate rocks don't ever really get sided in if Karn stays in.
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
https://discord.gg/DXTEpGn
U Mono U Tron
WR Boros Burn with one Stomping Ground
UR Storm
C Eldrazi Powder
G Mono Green Tron
Karn did not feel good. I sided it out most of the time and never drew it but I also never wanted to. I kept it in againt affinity but that deck was way too fast for Karn to matter anyways. Meh.
Blast Zone single-handedly won me a game against humans. Was able to nab 4 (!) 1 drops with it. Would recommend.
Think I will go to 3 Blast Zone. Pretty much always want it, even against like, control decks.
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
What's your manabase looking like now? I'm having a difficult time trying to figure out the optimal split between man lands, Caverns, Void, and now Blast Zone.
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I dont think Blast Zone does anything to stop Blood Moon. By the time it's in play, Blast Zone is a Mountain
If you want to fit Blast Zone in the red version from the Mythic Championship, I would drop the aweful Blood Moon plan and cut two wastes for two Blast Zones.
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
This is what I want to try:
23 lands
4 Temples
2 Wastes
2 Caverns
5 Manlands
3 Ghost Quarter
4 Zhalfrin Void
2 Blast Zone
1 Scavenger Grounds
I think the 4th Void could be another copy of any of the utility lands. If the London mulligan rule happens I'll prob cut down to 2-3 Voids.
3 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Eternal Scourge
4 Matter Reshaper
4 Reality Smasher
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Thought-Knot Seer
Lands 23
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Blast Zone
3 Zhalfirin Void
2 Gemstone Caverns
2 Blinkmoth Nexus
2 Mutavault
2 Wastes
1 Scavenger Grounds
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Dismember
4 Serum Powder
2 Smuggler's Copter
3 Relic of Progenitus
2 Warping Wail
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 Spatial Contortion
I'm not sure about the manabase. I feel pinched between all of the utility lands. Maybe Zhalfirin Void is the one we can most afford to lose? Maybe I want more manlands? I don't know.
And I'm genuinely unsure about Karn, either Karn. I like Karn, the Great Creator in certain matches, and to just go get something. I like Karn, Scion of Urza against mid-range and control.
Then again, despite being 6 mana, I like me some Ugin, the Ineffable.
Tempo
Modern
Eldrazi and Staxes
Whir Prison
Legacy
5c Humans
DnT
"I'm a lead farmer... !" Quote ruined due to policy.
4: Ghost Quarter
4: Eldrazi Temple
4: Zhalfirin Void
3: Mutavault
3: Blinkmoth Nexus
2: Blast Zone
2: Wastes
2: Gemstone Caverns
I've only played 10 rounds with it so far, but I never felt like there was an issue arising from the spread of utility lands, at most I've considered cutting one Blinkmoth for a third Blast Zone.
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
Also, Damping Sphere has been MVP for me. I was skeptical at first about it but honestly it's better against tron than Spyglass and it eats amulet titan alive too. Mimic into Damping Sphere is probably the best thing the deck can do against either of those strategies.
4 Relic of Progenitus
2 Ravenous Trap
1 Surgical Extraction
3 Spatial Contortion
1 Gut Shot
2 Sorcerous Spyglass
2 Damping Sphere
This is the sideboard I run at my shop. My shop is heavy on rock variants, death's shadow, and control. I think the dredge matchup is pretty easy with this setup and wouldn't recommend leylines over relic because of what you lose against rock. I think two damping sphere is necessary for its effects on tron, amulet, and phoenix. I think the flex spots here are the spyglasses. Tron's threat diversity is too wide imo for this to be effective. O-stone is the best card to name but I think you're better off damping them or cheesing them with quarter or surgical. It's also good against control but I feel like U/W Terminus is just too bad of a matchup anymore that you just gotta hope they don't have it. It's also such a small portion of the metagame that I just hope to dodge. Jeskai you don't need them. Whenever I take this to a big event I just swap out the spyglasses for something else depending on what I expect to face. I'm not on karn yet simply because I don't really face the problem decks (bridge, scales, etc) that karn is going to help against. Once he comes into the picture I'm not sure what I'll do.
I know, a troubled life I lead, definitely.
Regardless, the next 9 days or so will be testing with various wishboard targets and land configurations, I'm still not sure if I want to hold on 24 lands or trim to 23 like Jordan is running, and a few of the spots in the SB still need to be shored up, but as long as I get to dodge UW at the Open I feel very positive about the matches.