Hi, sorry for my English, I'm kind of new of this archetipe and wanna try the deck at the gp Bilbao next week, i tested for 2 month and I think is really strong in this meta.
My problems are 22 or 23 lands (prefer 23 in testing) and more nexus/muta over zhafir void.
Find a right sideboard is really hard for me, this is probably the configuration i have in mind for it:
4 relic of the progenitus
4 spatial contorntion
2 ratchet bomb
2 gut shot
1 karn??
2 damping sphere??
Not sure of this 3 slot
Prefer the relic because needed in uw and BGx match up, but is very slow against Phoenix and shadow, and bad with chalice...
If i play leyline need some space for some card against this 2 mu
Any tips?
So how do people approach big mana matchups? Tron's a little more clear cut, but my LGS has two Amulet Titan players and I always seem to get matched up with at least one of them. Any things in particular to keep in mind against an Amulet Titan player?
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Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
So how do people approach big mana matchups? Tron's a little more clear cut, but my LGS has two Amulet Titan players and I always seem to get matched up with at least one of them. Any things in particular to keep in mind against an Amulet Titan player?
I have found this matchup to be very easy. Fast Chalice on 1 is great; on 0 is also powerful. TKS wrecks them as does Ghost Quarter. Ratchet fine to bring in post-board to deal with stray Amulets but mostly to power through Hornet Queen tokens if it comes to that; otherwise, the mainboard is well-equipped.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
So how do people approach big mana matchups? Tron's a little more clear cut, but my LGS has two Amulet Titan players and I always seem to get matched up with at least one of them. Any things in particular to keep in mind against an Amulet Titan player?
I have found this matchup to be very easy. Fast Chalice on 1 is great; on 0 is also powerful. TKS wrecks them as does Ghost Quarter. Ratchet fine to bring in post-board to deal with stray Amulets but mostly to power through Hornet Queen tokens if it comes to that; otherwise, the mainboard is well-equipped.
Thanks for the info! Random question, without hand info, which is better, Chalice on 0 or 1?
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Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
So how do people approach big mana matchups? Tron's a little more clear cut, but my LGS has two Amulet Titan players and I always seem to get matched up with at least one of them. Any things in particular to keep in mind against an Amulet Titan player?
I have found this matchup to be very easy. Fast Chalice on 1 is great; on 0 is also powerful. TKS wrecks them as does Ghost Quarter. Ratchet fine to bring in post-board to deal with stray Amulets but mostly to power through Hornet Queen tokens if it comes to that; otherwise, the mainboard is well-equipped.
Thanks for the info! Random question, without hand info, which is better, Chalice on 0 or 1?
1 firs then 0. 1 Turns off Stirrings and Amulet which are their primary enablers. 0 counters Pact which is a payoff, and Explosives which removes Chalice, so you can wait a little before deploying it.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Sweeeeeeet. I'm guessing I should focus on taking Titans in their hands with Thought-Knot before Pacts/Azusas?
Also been getting my reps in with the deck, got my two Scourges coming in the mail soon to complete my set. Playing a turn 2 Smasher is hilarious. Hitting for 13 on turn 3 is disgustingly funny.
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Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
I went 1-2 against Rock, and 2-1 against Burn and Mono-Red Phoenix.
Rock
I lost the first round due to him having tons of discard and not finding replacement threats quickly enough. Second game, I stick a Chalice on 1 and 2, and eventually win the top deck war with Smasher. Game three was very close but he played around my Ratchet Bomb and smashed me with man lands, multiple Goyfs, and a Scooze.
Burn
Won the first game by sticking Chalice on 1 and 2, followed by Mimic and Smasher. Second game I couldn't pay 4 life to counter Risk Factor and he hardcast a Rift Bolt followed by a Lightning Helix to end me. Game three was a repeat of the first.
Phoenix
Game 1 he had a near nut-hand and presented me with a turn 3 Phoenix and 4/5 Soul Scar Mages. Game 2, I turn 3 Thought'd him and took Blood Moon, which made him immediately concede. Game 3 was one of the funniest wins I've had in awhile and was very memorable: I Surgical'd myself to exile all copies of Scourge, and managed to eventually block his entire team of six creatures after he had resolved 5 prowess triggers for each of them. Four Scourges and a Reshaper chumped 5 of them, and I took 5 damage, bringing me to 5. I then topdecked a Reality Smasher and swung for 14 with it, a 5/5 Mimic, another Reshaper, and a 1/1 Thought-Knot (weakened by Soul-Scar Mage) and hit him for 14 to close the match. He was incredibly salty about the fact that using Surgical on myself won me the game, but we both laughed it off. Good times.
Loving the deck so far, gonna bring it to the next event on Tuesday Night~
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Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
My friend, who always plays his Amulet Titan deck, stubbornly believes that Amulet has a great matchup against Eldrazi and that the fact he has never taken a match from me at the store's events is just bad luck, such as last Tuesday when he couldn't cast any of his one drops through Chalice. Sometimes life makes me laugh.
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Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
Seems like it's toeing the line with E-Tron, fun build tho. 65 cards is weird but I guess it matters less with Powder?
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Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
Noticing a few lists popping up with only three Powders, something I've tried myself in the past but never drew any conclusions about.
I feel better about maxing out Powder with my playset of Zhalfirin Void, and wonder at these lists that pass on that land, seems like a huge boost to me.
Noticing a few lists popping up with only three Powders, something I've tried myself in the past but never drew any conclusions about.
I feel better about maxing out Powder with my playset of Zhalfirin Void, and wonder at these lists that pass on that land, seems like a huge boost to me.
I am extremely new to this deck, but I’m not clear on why people aren’t running a play set of Void with a play set of Powder, and something like 3x scavenging grounds. Void is a free cantrip for a deck that IME runs into top-decking issues, and scavenging is free mainboard hate against T1 decks.
With 4x chalice, 4x ghost quarter, and 3-4x scavenging ground, you’ve got MB hate against all of the T1 decks just by hitting your land drops.
I love me some Zhalfirin Void, but I'm not really on board with 4x Ghost Quarter and 3-4x Scavenging Grounds. I'm on 3 GQ and 2 SG right now. Gotta have those manlands! This is an aggro deck we're playing here, not a control deck, and the Mutavaults and Blinkmoth Nexuses are often the best way to close out those last few points of damage for the win.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Creative, but my gut is telling me that Karn is too slow and (as you note) points us away from the deck's fast-aggro game plan. I know I'd miss the T2 Reshaper play. Also there's this weird tension in G2/3 where if you side in the hate rock, then you can't use Karn to go get it anymore. If Karn does work out, though, I wonder if Thorn of Amethyst might have a role to play in some matchups.
Speaking of tax effects, Jordan, have you played (or played against) the WC Thalia/Arbiter deck at all? I'd love a knowledgeable and experienced perspective on the relative pros and cons of the two builds as they play out in practice. And W buys us peerless hate, in Stony and RiP, that are just better at what they do than what the Colorless decks can put together.
Thanks for continuing to tinker with and post up about this fun aggro deck.
Creative, but my gut is telling me that Karn is too slow and (as you note) points us away from the deck's fast-aggro game plan. I know I'd miss the T2 Reshaper play. Also there's this weird tension in G2/3 where if you side in the hate rock, then you can't use Karn to go get it anymore. If Karn does work out, though, I wonder if Thorn of Amethyst might have a role to play in some matchups.
Speaking of tax effects, Jordan, have you played (or played against) the WC Thalia/Arbiter deck at all? I'd love a knowledgeable and experienced perspective on the relative pros and cons of the two builds as they play out in practice. And W buys us peerless hate, in Stony and RiP, that are just better at what they do than what the Colorless decks can put together.
Thanks for continuing to tinker with and post up about this fun aggro deck.
So far I think the utility of accessing the sideboard G1 (as well as the threat of the Mycosynth combo) is worth having 2 non-aggro cards in the deck. On Taxes, see this article:
It seems White Eldrazi Stompy is rivaling posted Colorless finishes for the first time in months. If it is indeed time to metagame against Phoenix and Dredge, this development makes perfect sense. Temple into big threats is good against every deck, while the white cards are only useful in certain matchups, so the added consistency makes CES a better call in an open field. WES wins out over Colorless when cards like Thalia, Guardian of Thraben, Rest in Peace, Leonin Arbiter, and Eldrazi Displacer are in high demand, as they are now.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
Current Modern Decks BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends." BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved." RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros." BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?" C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
Hey, thanks for the article. I'm wondering about the Gut Shot. You said you want one to be able to randomly hit planeswalkers. How often does that actually come up/which planeswalkers are you targeting with it? Seems kinda narrow to me.
Hey, thanks for the article. I'm wondering about the Gut Shot. You said you want one to be able to randomly hit planeswalkers. How often does that actually come up/which planeswalkers are you targeting with it? Seems kinda narrow to me.
Gut Shot is pretty much the single most effective card in the deck during the turn cycle in which an opponents resolves a planeswalker. So against decks with lots of planeswalkers (UW, Jund, Tron, Skred, etc.), it comes up a lot. It's also one of our best cards against decks hinging on x/1s, e.g. Humans, Spirits. And sometimes it does both things, like against Dark Confidant, Young Pyromancer, or Vendilion Clique decks. Against everyone else, just don't bring it in. "Randomly" because there's only one copy, but that copy is still amazing where it's relevant; especially at lower numbers, Gut is never really a card that rots in hand against the decks you bring it in for.
I am not impressed with the Orb so far and have cut it for a second Gut.
the card itself really isn't worth the card board its printed on...does it serve a purpose? Sure its a blue 1 drop that might not be a 1/1. I would not put it in a list and expect to win a PTQ or GP though.
My problems are 22 or 23 lands (prefer 23 in testing) and more nexus/muta over zhafir void.
Find a right sideboard is really hard for me, this is probably the configuration i have in mind for it:
4 relic of the progenitus
4 spatial contorntion
2 ratchet bomb
2 gut shot
1 karn??
2 damping sphere??
Not sure of this 3 slot
Prefer the relic because needed in uw and BGx match up, but is very slow against Phoenix and shadow, and bad with chalice...
If i play leyline need some space for some card against this 2 mu
Any tips?
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
Thanks for the info! Random question, without hand info, which is better, Chalice on 0 or 1?
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
Also been getting my reps in with the deck, got my two Scourges coming in the mail soon to complete my set. Playing a turn 2 Smasher is hilarious. Hitting for 13 on turn 3 is disgustingly funny.
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
4 leyline of the void
2 warping wail
2 ratchet bomb
1 all is dust
3 spatial contortion
1 gemstone caverns ( only 2 main)
1 torpor orb
1 crook of condemnation
I bring crook in against BGx and UW. Also dredge/Phoenix.
4 Eldrazi Mimic
1 Endless One
4 Eternal Scourge
3 Matter Reshaper
4 Reality Smasher
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Thought-Knot Seer
Lands
3 Blinkmoth Nexus
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Mutavault
3 Scavenger Grounds
2 Sea Gate Wreckage
2 Wastes
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Dismember
4 Serum Powder
1 Smuggler's Copter
1 All Is Dust
1 Karn, Scion of Urza
2 Pithing Needle
3 Ratchet Bomb
3 Relic of Progenitus
3 Spatial Contortion
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Witchbane Orb
I went 1-2 against Rock, and 2-1 against Burn and Mono-Red Phoenix.
Rock
I lost the first round due to him having tons of discard and not finding replacement threats quickly enough. Second game, I stick a Chalice on 1 and 2, and eventually win the top deck war with Smasher. Game three was very close but he played around my Ratchet Bomb and smashed me with man lands, multiple Goyfs, and a Scooze.
Burn
Won the first game by sticking Chalice on 1 and 2, followed by Mimic and Smasher. Second game I couldn't pay 4 life to counter Risk Factor and he hardcast a Rift Bolt followed by a Lightning Helix to end me. Game three was a repeat of the first.
Phoenix
Game 1 he had a near nut-hand and presented me with a turn 3 Phoenix and 4/5 Soul Scar Mages. Game 2, I turn 3 Thought'd him and took Blood Moon, which made him immediately concede. Game 3 was one of the funniest wins I've had in awhile and was very memorable: I Surgical'd myself to exile all copies of Scourge, and managed to eventually block his entire team of six creatures after he had resolved 5 prowess triggers for each of them. Four Scourges and a Reshaper chumped 5 of them, and I took 5 damage, bringing me to 5. I then topdecked a Reality Smasher and swung for 14 with it, a 5/5 Mimic, another Reshaper, and a 1/1 Thought-Knot (weakened by Soul-Scar Mage) and hit him for 14 to close the match. He was incredibly salty about the fact that using Surgical on myself won me the game, but we both laughed it off. Good times.
Loving the deck so far, gonna bring it to the next event on Tuesday Night~
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
2 Walking Ballista
4 Eldrazi Mimic0
4 Eternal Scourge
4 Matter Reshaper
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
2 Endbringer
Spells (5)
2 Warping Wail
3 Dismember
Artifacts (10)
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Basilisk Collar
2 Smuggler's Copter
3 Serum Powder
3 Blinkmoth Nexus
3 Cavern of Souls
4 Eldrazi Temple
2 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Mutavault
1 Scavenger Grounds
2 Wastes
3 Relic of Progenitus
3 Ratchet Bomb
2 Sorcerous Spyglass
3 Spatial Contortion
1 Karn, Scion of Urza
3 Leyline of the Void
Here's a weird one winning SCG Modern IQ Bernardsville. Running 65 cards main of all things. The rest of the top 8 looks pretty benign though.
U Mono U Tron
WR Boros Burn with one Stomping Ground
UR Storm
C Eldrazi Powder
G Mono Green Tron
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
I feel better about maxing out Powder with my playset of Zhalfirin Void, and wonder at these lists that pass on that land, seems like a huge boost to me.
I am extremely new to this deck, but I’m not clear on why people aren’t running a play set of Void with a play set of Powder, and something like 3x scavenging grounds. Void is a free cantrip for a deck that IME runs into top-decking issues, and scavenging is free mainboard hate against T1 decks.
With 4x chalice, 4x ghost quarter, and 3-4x scavenging ground, you’ve got MB hate against all of the T1 decks just by hitting your land drops.
http://modernnexus.com/karn-great-creator-colorless-eldrazi
And in case you just want to scroll to the decklist, here's that:
4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Eternal Scourge
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
3 Endless One
4 Simian Spirit Guide
Planeswalkers (2)
2 Karn, the Great Creator
Artifacts (8)
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Serum Powder
4 Dismember
Lands (23)
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Gemstone Caverns
4 Zhalfirin Void
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Mutavault
3 Blinkmoth Nexus
2 Wastes
4 Relic of Progenitus
1 Ratchet Bomb
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Mycosynth Lattice
1 Torpor Orb
1 Lightning Greaves
3 Spatial Contortion
1 Gut Shot
1 Surgical Extraction
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
Speaking of tax effects, Jordan, have you played (or played against) the WC Thalia/Arbiter deck at all? I'd love a knowledgeable and experienced perspective on the relative pros and cons of the two builds as they play out in practice. And W buys us peerless hate, in Stony and RiP, that are just better at what they do than what the Colorless decks can put together.
Thanks for continuing to tinker with and post up about this fun aggro deck.
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
I noticed in your article you didn't mention in the new karn article none of the swords were mentioned possibly to slow but they can break dead locks.
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy
Modern:
do you somebody has uptodate sideboarding plan willing to share? Plan to play the deck again....
BG Elves // "He's back. And he brought his friends. And their friends."
BG The Rock // "Dwayne Johnson approved."
RU Izzet Phoenix // "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."
UGW Bant Spirits // "Super Ghost Bros."
BUG Sultai Wildnerness Teachings // "How many turns did I just take again?"
C Colorless Eldrazi // "Smash you."
I am not impressed with the Orb so far and have cut it for a second Gut.
Counter-Cat
Colorless Eldrazi Stompy