On Sunday I saw Round 1 Storm. I took game 1 off the guy that placed 2nd - Paul.
Round 2 G/R Haste... Deck consists of a lot of G and R creatures that have haste, top end blood-braid.
Round 3 Traverse Shadow
Round 4 Bye
Round 5 Humans.... this is the old missed chalice trigger match. I certainly lost my cool in this matchh, but kept myself from committing any cardinal sins.
On Saturday in the Modern Challenge I played in, I went up against a deck I'm sure you're familiar with Russ... that Kiki-As Foretold-Goryo's-Grisal-and on and on combo deck.
Round 1 Kiki-combo thing
Round 2 Temur
Round 3 B/W Tokens
Round 4 Grixis Death Shadow w/ Delve guys
I also saw Affinity doing well. Ad-Naus appearance here and there.
Looking at the final standings, I think we were well matched in this tournament. Often times I had opponents calling out an upcoming Stormbreath, or telling me they sided out their removal after no Rabs in Game 1. Slagstorm was the utility piece that I often needed, second that Abrade.
One thing I was thinking about after the tournament was how little Company combo I saw. Probably because it was in the winning bracket - two companies in the top 16. Maybe this deck is fading, maybe Relic can creep in to the sideboard. I understand that Cage has its place where its lights out, but I saw a lot of Goyfs.
If you look at the top spells for the tournament, push is not in the top 10. Of course path is, but since I started playing modern I was always impressed by the price of Goyf, and I've seemingly watched it tick down over the last 9 months. I was always told, oh the reason Goyf is dead is because of push. It seemed like push wasn't around at this tournament, but Goyf didn't crack the top 10 creatures. The price of Goyf online has spiked, and despite it not being in the top ten I think its going to be growing in popularity - somewhat seemingly signaling that including Relic may be a more profitable decision now.
Recap, I believe the prevalence of Coco combo may be waning. Goyf may be on the rise. Haste is hot, so does this underscore Pyroclasm > Anger. I ran two Boils in the sideboard, and I think that was wrong. I went down an Eidolon to do so.
I think that the strategy we're employing is right at this time. Game 1 is typically a shock to our opponents. When I was turn 1 Thoutsiezed I usually heard.... uhhh I don't know which card to take because they're all miserable for me to deal with. In Thoughtseize/discard style match-ups I learned the value of keeping a land light hand, but not hitting the land the land on my Turn 1 and having the opponent take 1 of 2 Blood Moon effects, AND THEN having to hold your Ritual on turn 1 when you don't get the moon down because you missed on the land, really hurts. I saw Mardu Pyromancer losing twice yesterday, which made me smile.
Hope the info helps. A Prison stream would be nice to have on VOD tomorrow Russ - just sayin' hahha.
I'm with you on Relic, Dev. It feels all better than running Harvest Pyre to kill Goyfs. I have not missed ol' Goyfy one bit! I was enjoying not seeing him as much, but he's definitely back in the game. Relics have been trying to creep in for a while now for me, so I think I'm going to make the switch.
Russ, Nephalia Academy is spicy AF! I'm interested in how it's been working out.
Alright, crazy brew time.....has anyone tested the legacy stompy idea in modern? I'm talking about completely dropping the bridge and planeswalker package for goblins....big goblins....we're talking warren instigator, seige-gang commander, krenko, kiki-jiki goblins! Chalice and moon to provide disruption while using big fat fatties and hordes of dudes to get the job done. turn one instigator demands an answer immediately, otherwise, you just win. Add Trinisphere to the mix and we might be onto something. This idea sounds so crazy, it feels like Ray has tested this in the past (I have no idea if he did, but his original list had Seige Gang Commander). If I have time, I might try to put something together. Hell, I might even try an avalanche riders or even a confusion in the ranks!! get a goblin token, steal a goyf! that's a fair trade, right?play a chalice on one, stead a cranial plating! God I love magic. this is why I like mtgo....get the cards, then brew until your hearts content. Who knows, maybe being all forward leaning would be better in this meta where everyone is main decking K Command, Abrupt Decay, and Maelstrom Pulse. Even Stingscourger might be viable as a bounce spell to clear the way!
Full aggro with disruption. Blood moon is great here, and so is chalice. Don't be tricked by trying to stop the combo after they've drawn the deck. That won't work. Looking at you spellskite and spyglass. Bridges come out as well as slagstorm. Hazoret, eidolons, and sprees come in. Also, gotta be smart with those chalices. They do a lot of cantripping and if you just blindly throw chalices out there, they can play around it. Gotta hold them up until a lotus is coming off suspend. Also, an early chalice on one can stop all their cantripping, focmrcing them to naturally draw their combo. That happens a lot.not unwinnable, but still tough.
Side note, this one of a very few matches where phryxian recoker is better than spyglass. Stopping prism or lotus bloom while applying pressure is really good. We lost a few % points in this match when we switched to apyglass.
Thanks for the follow on twitch. If I have time tonight, I'm gonna try a new direction as eluded to above. Gotta test crazy ideas to confirm they are crazy
I haven't had alot of problems with Ad-Nauseum. Like you said, Russ, playing your Chalices correctly is the key. Chalice on 1 shuts off Angel's Grace and Spoils, which is half the combo not to mention cantrips, and an early Moon followed by a Chalice on 0 can actually keep them off of double black, so we have the tools. Unlike Storm, you don't really have to rush, just be methodical and cut off avenues until they're not really a threat anymore. We're pretty favored, imho.
I'm interested in how your brew works out, Russ. Siege-Gang seems good in this meta. I've actually been running a second P&K because of this line of thinking. Stuff that doesn't die to Bolt and Push might come in handy as well.
Lol I've actually been texting 3 goblin pile driver and 2 siege gang in the side. Surlsingly.. It ain't bad lol. Pile driver followed by rabble is a lot of damage if unanswered. And as ya'll know.. Everybody is confused by this deck game 1 and sides out removal game 2. I wish this deck had more flex spots lol
This is a card that I've been running on and off for the past three months or so. I kinda found it long time ago when browsing through all the nonbasics available. I used to include it in my version of the deck since I have a big dislike over Mutavault. So I have preeeetty extensive testing covered here. Guess it just never occurred to me to mention it here, heh.
Aanyway...I never used it in SB. So Stickballruss might be onto something here - I've only included it MD.
The card. Well. Let's put it this way - when it works, it's awesome. When it doesn't work, it doesn't do anything. The first thing to keep in mind is that nothing, absolutely nothing comes without some assumed cost. If you want to run this card, it requires one of the following:
a) Put it in the maindeck. This affects your out-of-the-box manabase in ways that you might not consider. That OOTB manabase seems to be 17 Mountain, 3 Gemstone Caverns and 1 Mutavault. I'd say you cannot just switch 2 Mountains with 2 Academies. No way - you risk yourself getting color screwed. My suggestion: go 22 lands, with 17 Mountains, 3 Gemstone Caverns and 2 Academies.
b) Put it in the sideboard. No manabase effect, swap them with Caverns. Can use 2-3.
So what do you do? Well here's the thing. This card, is ONLY good against very, very certain matchups - namely those that like Inquisition of Kozilek and Thoughtseize. Now this is exactly what I meant above when I said it's very good sometimes. But what needs to happen so that the card is actually DOES something?
a) Have the opponent play discard. Matchups: Jund, Abzan, 8-Rack.
b) Have the card in play BEFORE the discard hits. Let's be honest here - this means be on play AND have the card in your opening 7.
So if you combine this criteria, it's pretty pretty narrow, yeah? Yup. I'd say the possibility of this cards usability is:
The metagame share of decks using discard x the possibility of being on play x having the card in the starting hand
Let's say the metagame share is 50% which is TOTALLY not the case. But bear with me. Possibility of being on the play is 50% on game 1 and the probability of having it in your 7 is based on the amount of this card you have in your deck.
So in this laughable scenario of having the half of every deck using discard, the total possibility of this card DOING ANYTHING is:
I know what you are thinking: come on, even if you're on the draw, your opponent might have multiple discard spells and hey, the second one he plays has no effect! OK, I'll entertain this idea for a moment. So the metagame share is still the same 50%. Let's rule out the usefulness of being on the play totally. This covers the scenario where we sideboard this card and thus - are ALWAYS on the play. And the draw we draw 8 cards. So the math comes of as:
So even in the PERFECT scenario where over half of the metagame is hit by the card - the odds are very very low. What is the actual metagame share? I don't know, but it's definitely lower than this right? In any case - it's clear by now that the card is extremely narrow.
But the question is, does it matter? Now, here's where things get interesting. The card still produces mana but colorless. So running more than 2 introduces you the world of self hurt. But let's say running 2 is a "free roll". It's still two cards that replace other cards! So in MD - no Mutavault for you AND 22 lands (trust me). In SB - 2 slots, bye bye.
The Magical Christmasland scenario is the following:
T1 you: Nephalia Academy, pass.
T1 opp: Read the card, think for a long time, play Overgrown Tomb tapped, pass.
Sometimes your opponent doesn't even read it and tries to Thoughtseize a Moon and you get to laugh. But let's be honest here. All of this happens EXTEMELY rarely. It feels good I give it that! But that's just cutesy - and we're not cute, we're battle-scarred veterans born in the mountains!
So...considering all these factors - I'd say that no, the card is not worth it. If you want to just have fun, sure, play it. But if you want to be competitive - take it off. You're much better off using those two (or Hazoret forbid - more than that!) slots elsewhere.
Awesome analysis. I'm very interested to see what people think. There's been few times when Mutavault has been useful, but since its effectively a free roll and we need pressure, sure I get it, and with Rabs, I like to love it.
I do hate discard though. And if I could trade Mutavault for dodging discard... I'm very interested.
I agree with your analysis, revenged. I'm not a fan of cards that are terrible top decks, and the land is no exception. Thanks for putting something together that I wasn't able to articulate.
Revenged does not disappoint. It's boss to have so many talents here in the thread. As for tricksy lands, I continually come back to Gemstone Caverns and Mutavault aaaaand that's about it.
I'm ready to endorse the 'back pocket' play of a 4th gemstone caverns in the sideboard for games that start on the DRAW and the need for speed calls for an extra turbo arrow on the track. I'm sure Revenged could statistically understand this 'punch it, margaret' play better than us. But, I'm already sold.
And, I've enjoyed the use of a single Tormenting Voice in the main deck. Too often, it's "we need X, and we're in good shape". Routinely, T. Voice will save a sub-par starting 7-cards, and it regularly gets targeted by thoughtseize or inquisition of kozilek, because an opponent wisely recognizes it as a nearthoughtcast for 2-cmc. Trust me that once you 'dance with the devil' with this unorthodox pact, you'll soon realize that pitching the worst card in your hand for the ability to dig 2 cards deep? Well, that's a bargain worth its cost. Another couple Pyro Prison mages at my LGS are also resolute in their usage of Tormenting Voice - for what it's worth.
Tormenting Voice Unmasked. When it's needed as a Turn-2 play [i.e. mana drought/flood]: boom, it is there. Otherwise, cast this when it's either applicable or the very last card in your hand which pairs with an unfavorable draw. In other words, it's extraordinarily scale-able. What I've learned is not to indulge with too many copies, so for today's meta: just the (1).
Once the meta has settled just a little bit more, I'll re-post my new tournament deck with a sideboard guide. Post #1533.
And, I'd like to extend a hearty, mountain backslap to Stickballruss. I was able to catch his last two streams. I didn't know what to expect he'd be like in real life, but I was very impressed. A fellow 20-year+ player, I knew I was watching a natural talent. Each line of play was evolving to parry the actions and probability of upcoming actions of an opponent. His patience was exemplary, and explanations of strategy were succinct and engaging. Given his recent premier tournament record of wins, this all comes as no surprise. Still, brotha had me laughing and cheering along with his one-liners and commentary. Well done!
Thanks Ray. Means a lot to hear positive words about the stream. Microphone shipped today and should arrive by next week. Got the blue snowball.....I think that's what fluffy uses. Hopefully next week, I won't sound like I'm in a fish bowl.
So, this weekend there are two IQ events near me. I'm definitely going to the Saturday one and might attend the Sunday one. I'm leaning towards this deck for the Saturday event.
Anyway, thanks again for the compliment. Means more to me than you know.
Has anyone tested confusion in the ranks? Seems like it could be good. get a goblin token, trade it with a goyf. cast chalice on whatever, trade it with a cranial plating or a ravager. problem here is the 5cc mana cost. Jund will have us discarding it, affinity will have us dead before it's ever used. Still, could be useful.
@Stickballruss Confusion in the Ranks. It's a cool card, but it could prove problematic if bridge starts getting moved around. Also, I think I'd only run that if I could also run Norin the Wary to really break the symmetry on it. Most definitely meant for sb if it is tested by anyone because it's pretty dead againt non creature decks. Pia would be AMAZING with it given the right circumstances. Steal 3, (1 creature and 2 artifacts or creatures). Could even sac both tokens before they get traded to make more one sided. And like you said, rabblemaster is great with it too. But that's pretty Christmas landish I think.
And speaking of 5 cmc cards. I wish we could use Demigod of Revenge. Have always loved that win con and even makes loot spells a little more appealing. But alas, that would be a whole 4 spots devoted to the 5 slot which we never really do.
You can type out the name of the card (it's not case sensitive). Then highlight it and click the card icon. That will surround it in tags and display the image. HTML! And if clicking the card icon isn't an option for you on a phone, you can just surround the name with tags yourself.
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Alright, you guys know me for my crazy ideas.....would the rack be any good vs jund? Lily tick up would be costly. Almost to the point of them not being able to do it.
Jaya Ballard
2RRR
Legendary Planeswalker Jaya
5
+1 Add RRR. Spend this mana only to cast instant or sorcery spells.
+1 Discard up to three cards, then draw that many cards.
-8 You get an emblem with You may cast instant and sorcery cards from your graveyard. If a card cast this way would be put into your graveyard, exile it instead.
Not what i was hoping to see. Really crushed my hopes for a new big walker for the deck I guess Chandra: TOD reigns supreme still. Maybe new Karn could be possible?
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On Sunday I saw Round 1 Storm. I took game 1 off the guy that placed 2nd - Paul.
Round 2 G/R Haste... Deck consists of a lot of G and R creatures that have haste, top end blood-braid.
Round 3 Traverse Shadow
Round 4 Bye
Round 5 Humans.... this is the old missed chalice trigger match. I certainly lost my cool in this matchh, but kept myself from committing any cardinal sins.
On Saturday in the Modern Challenge I played in, I went up against a deck I'm sure you're familiar with Russ... that Kiki-As Foretold-Goryo's-Grisal-and on and on combo deck.
Round 1 Kiki-combo thing
Round 2 Temur
Round 3 B/W Tokens
Round 4 Grixis Death Shadow w/ Delve guys
I also saw Affinity doing well. Ad-Naus appearance here and there.
Looking at the final standings, I think we were well matched in this tournament. Often times I had opponents calling out an upcoming Stormbreath, or telling me they sided out their removal after no Rabs in Game 1. Slagstorm was the utility piece that I often needed, second that Abrade.
One thing I was thinking about after the tournament was how little Company combo I saw. Probably because it was in the winning bracket - two companies in the top 16. Maybe this deck is fading, maybe Relic can creep in to the sideboard. I understand that Cage has its place where its lights out, but I saw a lot of Goyfs.
If you look at the top spells for the tournament, push is not in the top 10. Of course path is, but since I started playing modern I was always impressed by the price of Goyf, and I've seemingly watched it tick down over the last 9 months. I was always told, oh the reason Goyf is dead is because of push. It seemed like push wasn't around at this tournament, but Goyf didn't crack the top 10 creatures. The price of Goyf online has spiked, and despite it not being in the top ten I think its going to be growing in popularity - somewhat seemingly signaling that including Relic may be a more profitable decision now.
Recap, I believe the prevalence of Coco combo may be waning. Goyf may be on the rise. Haste is hot, so does this underscore Pyroclasm > Anger. I ran two Boils in the sideboard, and I think that was wrong. I went down an Eidolon to do so.
I think that the strategy we're employing is right at this time. Game 1 is typically a shock to our opponents. When I was turn 1 Thoutsiezed I usually heard.... uhhh I don't know which card to take because they're all miserable for me to deal with. In Thoughtseize/discard style match-ups I learned the value of keeping a land light hand, but not hitting the land the land on my Turn 1 and having the opponent take 1 of 2 Blood Moon effects, AND THEN having to hold your Ritual on turn 1 when you don't get the moon down because you missed on the land, really hurts. I saw Mardu Pyromancer losing twice yesterday, which made me smile.
Hope the info helps. A Prison stream would be nice to have on VOD tomorrow Russ - just sayin' hahha.
D
Russ, Nephalia Academy is spicy AF! I'm interested in how it's been working out.
Side note, this one of a very few matches where phryxian recoker is better than spyglass. Stopping prism or lotus bloom while applying pressure is really good. We lost a few % points in this match when we switched to apyglass.
Thanks for the follow on twitch. If I have time tonight, I'm gonna try a new direction as eluded to above. Gotta test crazy ideas to confirm they are crazy
I'm interested in how your brew works out, Russ. Siege-Gang seems good in this meta. I've actually been running a second P&K because of this line of thinking. Stuff that doesn't die to Bolt and Push might come in handy as well.
This is a card that I've been running on and off for the past three months or so. I kinda found it long time ago when browsing through all the nonbasics available. I used to include it in my version of the deck since I have a big dislike over Mutavault. So I have preeeetty extensive testing covered here. Guess it just never occurred to me to mention it here, heh.
Aanyway...I never used it in SB. So Stickballruss might be onto something here - I've only included it MD.
The card. Well. Let's put it this way - when it works, it's awesome. When it doesn't work, it doesn't do anything. The first thing to keep in mind is that nothing, absolutely nothing comes without some assumed cost. If you want to run this card, it requires one of the following:
a) Put it in the maindeck. This affects your out-of-the-box manabase in ways that you might not consider. That OOTB manabase seems to be 17 Mountain, 3 Gemstone Caverns and 1 Mutavault. I'd say you cannot just switch 2 Mountains with 2 Academies. No way - you risk yourself getting color screwed. My suggestion: go 22 lands, with 17 Mountains, 3 Gemstone Caverns and 2 Academies.
b) Put it in the sideboard. No manabase effect, swap them with Caverns. Can use 2-3.
So what do you do? Well here's the thing. This card, is ONLY good against very, very certain matchups - namely those that like Inquisition of Kozilek and Thoughtseize. Now this is exactly what I meant above when I said it's very good sometimes. But what needs to happen so that the card is actually DOES something?
a) Have the opponent play discard. Matchups: Jund, Abzan, 8-Rack.
b) Have the card in play BEFORE the discard hits. Let's be honest here - this means be on play AND have the card in your opening 7.
So if you combine this criteria, it's pretty pretty narrow, yeah? Yup. I'd say the possibility of this cards usability is:
The metagame share of decks using discard x the possibility of being on play x having the card in the starting hand
Let's say the metagame share is 50% which is TOTALLY not the case. But bear with me. Possibility of being on the play is 50% on game 1 and the probability of having it in your 7 is based on the amount of this card you have in your deck.
So in this laughable scenario of having the half of every deck using discard, the total possibility of this card DOING ANYTHING is:
1 Academy: 50%x50%x12% = 3%
2 Academies: 50%x50%x22% = 5,5%
3 Academies: 50%x50%x32% = 8%
4 Academies: 50%x50%x22% = 10%
I know what you are thinking: come on, even if you're on the draw, your opponent might have multiple discard spells and hey, the second one he plays has no effect! OK, I'll entertain this idea for a moment. So the metagame share is still the same 50%. Let's rule out the usefulness of being on the play totally. This covers the scenario where we sideboard this card and thus - are ALWAYS on the play. And the draw we draw 8 cards. So the math comes of as:
1 Academy: 50%x13% = 6,5%
2 Academies: 50%x25% = 12,5%
3 Academies: 50%x35% = 17,5%
4 Academies: 50%x44% = 22%.
So even in the PERFECT scenario where over half of the metagame is hit by the card - the odds are very very low. What is the actual metagame share? I don't know, but it's definitely lower than this right? In any case - it's clear by now that the card is extremely narrow.
But the question is, does it matter? Now, here's where things get interesting. The card still produces mana but colorless. So running more than 2 introduces you the world of self hurt. But let's say running 2 is a "free roll". It's still two cards that replace other cards! So in MD - no Mutavault for you AND 22 lands (trust me). In SB - 2 slots, bye bye.
The Magical Christmasland scenario is the following:
T1 you: Nephalia Academy, pass.
T1 opp: Read the card, think for a long time, play Overgrown Tomb tapped, pass.
Sometimes your opponent doesn't even read it and tries to Thoughtseize a Moon and you get to laugh. But let's be honest here. All of this happens EXTEMELY rarely. It feels good I give it that! But that's just cutesy - and we're not cute, we're battle-scarred veterans born in the mountains!
So...considering all these factors - I'd say that no, the card is not worth it. If you want to just have fun, sure, play it. But if you want to be competitive - take it off. You're much better off using those two (or Hazoret forbid - more than that!) slots elsewhere.
And that concludes my in-depth analysis of Nephalia Academy.
I do hate discard though. And if I could trade Mutavault for dodging discard... I'm very interested.
I'm ready to endorse the 'back pocket' play of a 4th gemstone caverns in the sideboard for games that start on the DRAW and the need for speed calls for an extra turbo arrow on the track. I'm sure Revenged could statistically understand this 'punch it, margaret' play better than us. But, I'm already sold.
And, I've enjoyed the use of a single Tormenting Voice in the main deck. Too often, it's "we need X, and we're in good shape". Routinely, T. Voice will save a sub-par starting 7-cards, and it regularly gets targeted by thoughtseize or inquisition of kozilek, because an opponent wisely recognizes it as a near thoughtcast for 2-cmc. Trust me that once you 'dance with the devil' with this unorthodox pact, you'll soon realize that pitching the worst card in your hand for the ability to dig 2 cards deep? Well, that's a bargain worth its cost. Another couple Pyro Prison mages at my LGS are also resolute in their usage of Tormenting Voice - for what it's worth.
Tormenting Voice Unmasked. When it's needed as a Turn-2 play [i.e. mana drought/flood]: boom, it is there. Otherwise, cast this when it's either applicable or the very last card in your hand which pairs with an unfavorable draw. In other words, it's extraordinarily scale-able. What I've learned is not to indulge with too many copies, so for today's meta: just the (1).
Once the meta has settled just a little bit more, I'll re-post my new tournament deck with a sideboard guide. Post #1533.
And, I'd like to extend a hearty, mountain backslap to Stickballruss. I was able to catch his last two streams. I didn't know what to expect he'd be like in real life, but I was very impressed. A fellow 20-year+ player, I knew I was watching a natural talent. Each line of play was evolving to parry the actions and probability of upcoming actions of an opponent. His patience was exemplary, and explanations of strategy were succinct and engaging. Given his recent premier tournament record of wins, this all comes as no surprise. Still, brotha had me laughing and cheering along with his one-liners and commentary. Well done!
So, this weekend there are two IQ events near me. I'm definitely going to the Saturday one and might attend the Sunday one. I'm leaning towards this deck for the Saturday event.
Anyway, thanks again for the compliment. Means more to me than you know.
Russ
Example:
<card>Name of Card</card>
Instead of <>, you must use []. I had to use those to show as an example.
2RRR
Legendary Planeswalker Jaya
5
+1 Add RRR. Spend this mana only to cast instant or sorcery spells.
+1 Discard up to three cards, then draw that many cards.
-8 You get an emblem with You may cast instant and sorcery cards from your graveyard. If a card cast this way would be put into your graveyard, exile it instead.
Not what i was hoping to see. Really crushed my hopes for a new big walker for the deck I guess Chandra: TOD reigns supreme still. Maybe new Karn could be possible?