As a general guide, my acceptable opening hand is:
Crack the Earth / Chromatic Star / Fetchland or Red Source Shockland / Flagstones of Trokair / Small Pox / Myth Realized / any other spell
Sequencing:
T1: Red Source Land -> Chromatic Star -> Pass
T2: Flagstones of Trokair (Tap) -> Myth Realized -> Crack the Earth (sac C.Star or Flagstones and trigger Myth) -> Pass
Sequencing is flexible. You can cast Myth Realized on Turn 1 and then cast Crack the Earth and Chromatic Star on turn 2 (for double Myth Trigger). The overall CC for the deck is extremely low and aggressive. Hence you have quite a bit of flexibility with your sequencing. Not that you must plan your mana base carefully if you want to Small Pox on T2 or T3. The deck is generally forgiving as long as you do not take unnecessary risks, like doing a 1 for 1 when you do not have additional/back up resources in hand or on board.
I have locked down many games that resulted in opponents stuck with turn 3 or turn 4 plays that they cannot cast and ran away with the game once any of my planewalkers hit the board.
I am liking it so far. The crucible/ghost quarter lock can shut down games. Myth is a house, not many people expect it, and main board enchantment hate isn't prevalent for me. Souls is great, sac fodder for crack the earth and smallpox, defense, and pressure. Its not uncommon to have 4 or 5 counters on it by turn 3, and can be a great mana sink for even more counters. Mana tithe is kinda jank, but is good out of the sideboard. Its unexpected, but isnt always effective. Might switch to some surgicals, and Kor Firewalker hasnt done much for me. Overall I like it, its a really fun deck.
Turn 1: Urborg > Inquisition/, Turn 2: Flagstones > Smallpox > fetch for sacred foundry is the most fun I have had in modern.
I think everyone should havr a ravens crim3 in this deck too. Tou dont mind if they ditch a t1 land especially game 1 and it turns your flood into more myth pumps and 1 for 1. Plus i would add phrexian arena x2. Card is insane at taking over games that slow to a halt. Consistently my best card in smallpox decks
I agree that at least a single Ravens crime should find a home in each of these builds. It basically turns every land card into something useful. However, how would it do versus the new Eldrazi ramp decks? Did anyone already play vs a version of that deck?
i hadn't had a chance to test against the eldrazi decks but in theory we should come out top. the eldrazi decks do not come on until turn 3 (usually turn 4) and rely on early discard spells like IoK and Thoughtseize for disruption. The B/W version runs Lingering Souls which to me is the key card in the deck for it to be viable in Modern.
on camera i saw a few games the eldrazi deck just fold over to hyper aggro decks like infect and zoo or surgical recurring land destruction via Fuminator Mage. the mono black version of the deck is the weakest variant. i think this modern season we will see the b/w and b/g versions finishing strongly as they are definitely the better variants.
the eldrazi deck's mana base is a lot more easy to disrupt because it doesn't have the redundancy of Tron. their key land cards is eye of ugin and eldrazi temple, followed by urborg tomb of yawgmoth. their natural "tron" drop is usually a fat eldrazi like oblivion sower which is a lot easier to remove than Karn or wurmcoil engine.
played a bunch of games versus r/g tron yesterday.
my main deck was okay and i got very close to finishing the games with a fat myth realized. however, the tron combo is very resilient and all they need is to slap on Karn and run away with the game when they do.
granted, my opponent has a pretty lucky streak and was able to draw into either tron or karn after i blew up the tron land or made him discard karn.
i am thinking of tweaking the deck towards a 24 land mana base and curving into crumble to dust with the option of maindecking hero's downfall (LOL) but i feel its too tailored just against Tron that will water down the deck.
Nope, I didn't bring my sideboard. i don't know what to put in there versus Tron either. Fulminator Mage is an easier to cast Molten Rain, which I have but its a turn 3 spell.
Karn doesn't stay in play after he comes on because he will tick down to remove a threat so i will just bolt him or attack with Lingering Souls. Dreadbore is a reasonable sideboard card but it blanks out against Ulamog and is terrible against Wurmcoil Engine. Path to Exile is good against Tron because they run very little basics and if they already Tron into Wurmcoil, letting them have the basic is a small trade off although it means they will be casting Ugin next turn if they have it.
My friend suggested Stony Silence so his Chromatic Stars, Spheres and Expedition Maps will be slowed down tremendously but it also hits my Chromatic Stars and Nihil Spellbombs. Maybe i can sideboard out the C.Stars and Spellbombs for Stony Silence and Dreadbores.
i still think the match up is in favor of us but i had a string of bad luck and he had a string of good luck. my draws were a blank when i was controlling the game and many times i came within 1 more attack phase of winning, or 1 more bolt.
From my deduction, playing the creature based version might yield similar results. he will just Pyroclasm and search out Ugin to control the board.
I think Naya Zoo is probably the best deck against Tron with no sideboarding. Most of the creatures have 3 toughness which blanks out Pyroclasm and will ignore Kozilek's Return and can finish the game before Ugin hits the board.
I think it will take a bit of out of the box thinking to find a card to shut down Tron from the sideboard.
I haven't played or tested this brew, but could Dark Confidant find a home in a build like this?
I see some peoples talking about Dark Confidant for cards advantage. Beware, the CMC of Boom // Bust is 8 (2 + 6). Lossing 8 lifes at the upkeep isn't a good way to win games.
Played some 'game 1'-games versus Affinity this weekend and it's a pretty hard pre-boarding matchup. The one-for-more cards like Smallpox and Kolaghan’s Command were the stars in most of these matches, as they really slowed down the opponent's game plan. However, getting out a Young Pyromaster followed by a Monestary Mentor got me in the driver seat and basically made it possible for me to race. Most important in that situation was to make sure that Cranial Plating did not stay long on the battlefield.
I think Affinity might get pressed down in the new Modern metagame as delver decks should be making a come back. They usually will bring value instant cards like Electrolyze and lots of burn while paving the way for delver/young pyromancer/stormchaser mage/monastery swiftspear. straight ur or grixis delver decks (kolaghan's cmd) all pack strong cards to suppress aggro decks esp post sideboard.
I haven't played or tested this brew, but could Dark Confidant find a home in a build like this?
I see some peoples talking about Dark Confidant for cards advantage. Beware, the CMC of Boom // Bust is 8 (2 + 6). Lossing 8 lifes at the upkeep isn't a good way to win games.
i never liked dark confidant. i have seen too many players (both pro and non pro) die to it. the card is only good in shells that have very strong life gain. it does its best work in abzan and in some cases jund because of the multiple avenues to gain life as the cushion (scavenging ooze, siege rhino as examples).
What irks me about all those new Eldrazis is that they can come into play as soon as turn 2-3. and thought-knot seer is T4 which makes him unboltable and he exiles the card... you cannot get it back. the cantrip when you kill him is of little consequence when the deck will be dropping more of his kin every turn.
i have been tinkering with my creatureless deck and have settled on 2 hangarback walkers as a both defensive and offensive strategy when all my lingering souls, myth realized and planeswalkers all go into hiding (happened more than once).
i am leaning towards maindecking straight off value planeswalkers like Gideon, ally of zendikar and Elspeth, knight errant. koth of the hammer, chandra pyromaster and sorin, solemn visitor are now on the chopping board of being relegated to the sideboard. i think only koth and sorin might make the cut. but its a toss up betwen chandra and sorin. =/
boom/bust is not a big deal. the deck still can run molten rain, stone rain, crack the earth, rain of tears and small pox.
it be nice if pillage can be reprinted into modern... =P i mean... there is already kolaghan's command so what's the harm?
Let's not forget the trick with Boom//Bust and fetch lands. You can target your Bloodstained Mire and one of their lands. Then retain priority and crack your fetch before Boom resolves. They still lose a land and you get to fetch.
Fulminator and Kolaghan's Command seem to fit nicely into this shell. Also 4 Myth Realized seems like too much, 3 should be sufficient, no? It's unfortunate that none of the new manlands are any good in our colors. Here is a list I whipped up:
I playtested several times against Naya Burn. I wasn't sure it would be a good match up. Finally, is wasn’t that bad. He couldn’t recover from Boom // Bust, Crack the Earth and Smallpox + spot removal for creatures.
What I’m not sure and didn’t draw to test out: -Flame Jab: I often flood, so I think it is a good idea to use extra land to deal damage… Maybe it should be a Raven's Crime… or something else?
Q: What is the worst matchup you had? I would like to playtest against it to see how well the deck is oiled.
EDIT: I wrote fetches beside Crack the Earth, but it's only Boom // Bust that works with fetches. Sorry for that.
How is Crack the Earth good with fetches or Chromatic Star?? I can see Boom//Bust working well with fetches.
Crack the Earth isn't so good with fetches--you lose a fetch no matter what. I suppose it's a decent use for late-game fetches?
Crack the Earth is great with Chromatic Star because whenever Chromatic Star gets put in the graveyard (such as when you sacrifice it to Crack the Earth), you draw a card.
Q: What is the worst matchup you had? I would like to playtest against it to see how well the deck is oiled.
pre-sideboard, my deck (creatureless version), is not very good against swarm lists like merfolk, elves or affinity who are able to almost empty their hand by turn 3. i usually won't be able to pull the game off even if both of us get our mad hands. post sideboard, i usually won't have any issues with pyroclasm, drown in sorrows or anger of the gods (depends what i feel like packing that day).
swarm lists usually have lords so anger of the gods is somewhat a more easier card to hit them all. however, you can work your work around pyroclasm or drown in sorrows if you are able to remove one of the lords first if 2 lords are on the board. naya zoo is resilient to mass removal because they have a tendency of field 3 toughness creatures so... anger of the gods again here lol. i been thinking of sideboarding earthquake but it doesn't hit spirit tokens (both a good thing and bad thing!) but it also hurts our life total especially with such an aggressive mana base.
against combo decks, you need to side in discard like inquisition of kozilek and Duress. in the past it was just stuff like rending volley versus twin. watch out for kiki chord as the new meta of choice. i mainboard nihil spellbomb but it might not be enough. the creatures are usually small enough to get hit by anger of the gods so there you go.
combo decks are a toss up. if you keep their lands to under 3, they usually cannot go off because they need a specific colour and x mana. so learn your combo deck match ups!
grixis delver/ control decks can be hard. as they have more counterspells post sideboard. they will attempt to turn 2/3 a tasigur or gurmag angler and run you on a 4 turn clock backed with counterspell, bolts and snapcaster mage. they also have stronger cantrips with serum visions and gitaxian probe.
How is Crack the Earth good with fetches or Chromatic Star?? I can see Boom//Bust working well with fetches.
Crack the Earth isn't so good with fetches--you lose a fetch no matter what. I suppose it's a decent use for late-game fetches?
Crack the Earth is great with Chromatic Star because whenever Chromatic Star gets put in the graveyard (such as when you sacrifice it to Crack the Earth), you draw a card.
I edited my post. I was confused with Boom // Bust. However, it is also true that fetches and any extra-lands late game are good permanent to sacrifice to Crack the Earth.
Q: What is the worst matchup you had? I would like to playtest against it to see how well the deck is oiled.
pre-sideboard, my deck (creatureless version), is not very good against swarm lists like merfolk, elves or affinity who are able to almost empty their hand by turn 3. i usually won't be able to pull the game off even if both of us get our mad hands. post sideboard, i usually won't have any issues with pyroclasm, drown in sorrows or anger of the gods (depends what i feel like packing that day).
I will try both; Anger of the Gods and Drown in Sorrow. I like the scry 1 of Drown, it surely helps sometime. However, I'm keeping Pyroclasm in head, like 2 CMC can hit a turn sooner. Thank for the advices.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Legacy : RGoblinR Modern BBW SmallpoxB RWBMardu MythBWR UUMerfolkUU
Hey all, this is a cool list that has me interested for several reasons:
[1] Neat microsynergies
[2] Finally a home for Myth Realized
[3] Competitive potential in the elusive Mardu colors
[4] The relevance of mana denial in the current meta against Tron & Eldrazi
I've been looking over recent builds here and I see the return of Boom // Bust and Fulminator Mage after they'd been cut from Kanaoka Yoshihiko's early lists. My guess is that there weren't enough fetches to consistently pull off the Boom // Bust asymmetry trick and that he valued Basic Land destruction over the extra body that Fulminator Mage provided.. but that's just conjecture. Still, I can't help but wonder if we're back-peddling by trying to work those back in? Thoughts? Data?
I've seen a few people mention Young Pyromancer here or in other convos. I'm not sold on this, though, as I'm often underwhelmed at Peezy w/o cheap cantrips, he doesn't trigger off of our artifacts/enchantments, he activates sorcery speed removal, and gets eaten by the sweepers most people want to use here.
However, 1-2x Hangarback Walker per Need_More_DPS's suggestion does sound intriguing. It's sac'able, keeps removal relatively inactive, presents another growing clock while the game is stalled, and scales into the late game.
Hey all, this is a cool list that has me interested for several reasons:
[1] Neat microsynergies
[2] Finally a home for Myth Realized
[3] Competitive potential in the elusive Mardu colors
[4] The relevance of mana denial in the current meta against Tron & Eldrazi
I've been looking over recent builds here and I see the return of Boom // Bust and Fulminator Mage after they'd been cut from Kanaoka Yoshihiko's early lists. My guess is that there weren't enough fetches to consistently pull off the Boom // Bust asymmetry trick and that he valued Basic Land destruction over the extra body that Fulminator Mage provided.. but that's just conjecture. Still, I can't help but wonder if we're back-peddling by trying to work those back in? Thoughts? Data?
I've seen a few people mention Young Pyromancer here or in other convos. I'm not sold on this, though, as I'm often underwhelmed at Peezy w/o cheap cantrips, he doesn't trigger off of our artifacts/enchantments, he activates sorcery speed removal, and gets eaten by the sweepers most people want to use here.
However, 1-2x Hangarback Walker per Need_More_DPS's suggestion does sound intriguing. It's sac'able, keeps removal relatively inactive, presents another growing clock while the game is stalled, and scales into the late game.
I don't know about Young Pyromancer, it can be a bad top deck. Myth Realized can also be, but at lest it can add a lore counter to another myth in play... I would need to playtest Young Pyromancer to further comment.
I would be interested to read about Hangarback Walker. Some people proposed it in BW Smallpox's primer thread... Have you tried it? Is good? On paper it should be: mana sink, great synergy with Smallpox and Crack the Earth...
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Legacy : RGoblinR Modern BBW SmallpoxB RWBMardu MythBWR UUMerfolkUU
While researching this archetype I recently came across Matthew Currie’s Mardu Pox list, which got 4th at the SCG Modern Premeir IQ in Coopersburg and was featured on a Frank Leopore’s Modern Monday series.
Both run the core package of Pox, Liliana, Souls, and 3-drop land destruction, but their approaches diverge significantly from there…
Kanaoka Yoshihiko's Myth Pox
-Low curve, 21 lands, 4 fetches
-Focuses on Myth and its synergy with 1-drops: Star/Spellbomb and Crack the Earth
-Runs main board Inquisition, in part to help protect Myth
-Uses spells for 3-drop land destruction, both to boost Myth and target basics
Matthew Currie's Mardu Pox
-higher curve, 27 lands (!), 8 fetches
-Because of 8 fetches can run 2x Boom with more reliable asymmetry
-Focuses on higher value 2-3 drops for better grinding & top-decking
-With no need to buff Myth he adds more creatures, Fulminator and Finks
-K Command gives lots of value by recurring these creatures
-Gideon, Ally of Zendikar is a versatile monster, like Myth + Sorin in one package
-4x Lightning Helix keeps aggro at bay in conjunction with 2x MB wrath
-3-drop creatures + Gideon + burn make “turning the corner” faster and more reliable
-BUT (a big but) higher curve + occasional self land destruction can sometimes clog your hand with 3 drops while you have only 2 lands.
What are your thoughts on this? I’ve played with Currie’s list more than Yoshihiko’s at this point so I need your insight.
Based on the lists you've played with....
[1] How commonly do you feel constricted by your own land count?
[2] What turn (on average) do you hit 3 lands? 4 lands?
[3] Is that early enough to reliably cast the 4-drop walkers or wraths when they're needed for maximum impact?
[4] How often are your Pox casts breaking symmetry? Are there any guidelines on when its worth accepting a more symmetric pox? Sometimes it just feels like an edict that keeps me from playing my 3-drops.
[5] How else do these approaches compare? Are there other advantages to Yoshihiko’s list that I’m overlooking?
Since they’ve both enjoyed some small amount of tournament success I’m sure they’re both valid, but perhaps we can figure out some optimal approach.
[1] How commonly do you feel constricted by your own land count?
Seldom. My version's curve is extremely low. I top out at 4 spells at 4 CC. 19 spells at 1 cc. I never go down to 1-2 lands unless I have more in my hand or am pressed to aggressively control the board.
[3] Is that early enough to reliably cast the 4-drop walkers or wraths when they're needed for maximum impact?
Yes. I already run a collection of spells that controls the board aggressively enough so that when the Walkers drop, I already am 1 foot into winning the game.
[4] How often are your Pox casts breaking symmetry? Are there any guidelines on when its worth accepting a more symmetric pox? Sometimes it just feels like an edict that keeps me from playing my 3-drops.
Seldom. It does happens when I need to break symmetry and that usually is because I kept a hand that I should have Mulligan-ed.I only have 6 3-drops. Stone Rain and Molten Rain.
[5] How else do these approaches compare? Are there other advantages to Yoshihiko’s list that I’m overlooking?
Yoshi's version is a more blitzkerg list. Nobody expects and turn 2 Crack the Earth (and sometimes turn 1?). People see Land -> Chromatic Star and they think its some junky Tron deck. If they turn 2 into a creature, you Small Pox them. When they are stuck on their turn 3, you cast Lingering Souls during yours and keep pressing after that.
I don't think my style is suited for Currie's version. 27 lands is too durdle-ily and its more of a Mardu Midrange Control deck than a Land Destruction archetype which is Mardu Myth. Granted he is packing 10 Land Destruction spells but none starts at turn 1.
Thanks for the perspective. Would you mind posting your current list?
You've mentioned that the low-to-the-ground Myth Pox decks fold to aggro pre-board, but do well enough once sweepers are sided in. Is the game 2-3 performance vs Affinity & Co. good enough to get a reliable lock on the set, or would Currie's list which is "pre-boarded" with helix, finks, and wraths do better overall in the set in your estimation? Since linear aggro is *everywhere* right now my top priority is on getting a good aggro matchup, followed by disrupting big mana Tron & Eldrazi second.
Additionally, could you offer more guidance on when to run Drown in Sorrow vs. Anger of the Gods vs. Wrath of God? Thank you.
Gurmag Angler is just a placeholder until I get a Gideon, Ally of Zendikar or Elspeth, Knight Errant. Ajani Vengeant is also possible. Do note that this is the paper version of my deck. The one I test online has Elspeth, Knight Errant instead of Gurmag Angler lol.
I think Currie's list is not bad because buffing the life lost from Pox, Fetches and Shocks with Finks and Helix is wise deckbuilding it also keeps you afloat if you face hyper aggro decks. But I feel 27 lands is too many. I think 23-24 is optimal. I guess he wants to pitch extra lands to LotV which justifies the high land count. Whereas I go around the LotV issue with a low land count and more aggressive control cards.
If the current meta is filled with hyper aggressive decks, I would run sweepers like 2 x Pyroclasms in the main. Drown in Sorrows is a good main board to just get the Scry off even if you have no targets(!sekret tech!)
I can't run 4 mana Wraths. I will be dead by then lol. Anger of the Gods and Drown in Sorrow are both very strong sweepers. Drown in Sorrow hits protection creatures too so that is something to think about. Flaying Tendrils is also a very strong card. I generally go for a 2 x Pyroclasm + 2 x Drown in Sorrow mix. I honestly prefer Anger of the Gods because it can sweep the ground when there is 1 - 2 Lords in play. 2 Lords will pump each other to a 3/3. Merfolk is a tough deck so maybe Volcanic Fallout is another option.
My choice of sweepers by preference:
1. Anger of the Gods
2. Pyroclasm
3. Drown in Sorrows
4. Flaying Tendrils
5. Volcanic Fallout
I have two question for you:
1- How is Koth of the Hammer? Which ability do you use more often? I'm skeptical about it. The deck has a low count of Mountain.
2- How is Chandra, Pyromaster? I'm planning to playtest with her and Gideon, Ally of Zendikar. Bringing my planeswalker and 4 CMC drop to a total of 4 (2 x Ajani, 1 x Chandra, 1 x Gideon)
I'm also nervous about running Chandra and Gideon in the same deck, RR and WW... that can be adjust easily by reviewing the manabase...
I'm playing with 2 Ajani Vengeant and, so far, it is really good. I highly recommend it. Great synergy with land destruction (keeping 1 of your opponent land tapped is great addition to Mardu Myth) and it also help against aggro deck, it adds other Lightning Helix to your deck.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Legacy : RGoblinR Modern BBW SmallpoxB RWBMardu MythBWR UUMerfolkUU
I have two question for you:
1- How is Koth of the Hammer? Which ability do you use more often? I'm skeptical about it. The deck has a low count of Mountain.
2- How is Chandra, Pyromaster? I'm planning to playtest with her and Gideon, Ally of Zendikar. Bringing my planeswalker and 4 CMC drop to a total of 4 (2 x Ajani, 1 x Chandra, 1 x Gideon)
I'm also nervous about running Chandra and Gideon in the same deck, RR and WW... that can be adjust easily by reviewing the manabase...
I'm playing with 2 Ajani Vengeant and, so far, it is really good. I highly recommend it. Great synergy with land destruction (keeping 1 of your opponent land tapped is great addition to Mardu Myth) and it also help against aggro deck, it adds other Lightning Helix to your deck.
1) Koth is a powerhouse. I use the +1 all the time, if not to attack but to activate Myth Realize to untap a Sacred Foundry or cast a 1 CC spell. Against an opponent who I know who is not able to put down a threat or have no direct damage, I use his -2 to cast bigger spells to control the board. Blood Crypt and Godless Shrine are shocks I always keep in play, Sacred Foundry is 2nd choice. All the other lands I will sacrifice to Pox / Crack the Earth so keeping them in play is no problem. If I already have 3 lands in play, i have no qualms of sacrificing whatever 4th land it is.
2) Chandra is important for this deck. She is able to control the board with her +1 or give you another chance to press your board when you draw a land instead of a spell. I have ultimated her in stalemate games and finished off the opponent with Bolt / Molten Rain or Lingering Souls.
Ideally, my choice of Planewalkers for this deck is:
1) Elspeth, Knight Errant or Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2) Ajani Vengeant
3) Chandra, Pyromaster
4) Koth of the Hammer
5) Sorin, Solemn Visitor
i have yet to acquire Elspeth or Gideon (modern pro tour spiked the cards quite a bit) and have tested them as proxies and they are the key Planewalkers to have. Ajani and Chandra are next. So the ideal set up is:
Elespeth + Gideon + Ajani + Chandra, one of each with Sorin in the sideboard. Against burn / swarm based decks, I side in Pyroclasm and Sorin.
my current set up is Koth, Ajani, Chandra and Sorin. this by all means is NOT optimum but already very powerful and i never lost a game when i resolved a PW. Majority of the times, when any of the Planewalkers hit the board, you almost have the game because of the state of the board after 4-5 turns of control, if you ever resolve a 2nd PW, its almost impossible to lose unless its some situation when by you were already losing before the 1st one hit.
As a disclaimer, this deck is not easy to pilot. You need to know when to mulligan and what type of opening hand to play. This deck requires you to be very aggressive on the first 3 turns. This deck doesn't really like it when your opponent floods out but you can wait for them to play a creature before Small Poxing them. If you have Chromatic Star or Nihil Spellbomb in play, just Crack the Earth anyways to draw the card to keep their land count low so they cannot play more than 1 spell a turn.
Boom/Bust is 2cc. Crack the Earth is 1cc. its a huge difference.
if they flood out, that means they have less cards to present on board as threats. gives small pox more value when cast.
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo
As a general guide, my acceptable opening hand is:
Crack the Earth / Chromatic Star / Fetchland or Red Source Shockland / Flagstones of Trokair / Small Pox / Myth Realized / any other spell
Sequencing:
T1: Red Source Land -> Chromatic Star -> Pass
T2: Flagstones of Trokair (Tap) -> Myth Realized -> Crack the Earth (sac C.Star or Flagstones and trigger Myth) -> Pass
Sequencing is flexible. You can cast Myth Realized on Turn 1 and then cast Crack the Earth and Chromatic Star on turn 2 (for double Myth Trigger). The overall CC for the deck is extremely low and aggressive. Hence you have quite a bit of flexibility with your sequencing. Not that you must plan your mana base carefully if you want to Small Pox on T2 or T3. The deck is generally forgiving as long as you do not take unnecessary risks, like doing a 1 for 1 when you do not have additional/back up resources in hand or on board.
I have locked down many games that resulted in opponents stuck with turn 3 or turn 4 plays that they cannot cast and ran away with the game once any of my planewalkers hit the board.
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo
2x Blood Crypt
3x Bloodstained Mire
4x Flagstones of Trokair
3x Ghost Quarter
1x Godless Shrine
2x Sacred Foundry
3x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2x Windswept Heath
1x Swamp
1x Plains
1x Mountain
2x Chromatic Star
2x Crucible of worlds
4x Myth Realized
4x Lightning Bolt
3x Liliana of the Veil
2x Anger of the Gods
2x Boom//Bust
3x Crack the earth
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Lingering Souls
4x Smallpox
3x Stone Rain
3x Nihil Spellbomb
2x Kor Firewalker
1x Boil
3x Mana Tithe
3x Wear//Tear
2x Zealous Persecution
1x Wrath of God
I am liking it so far. The crucible/ghost quarter lock can shut down games. Myth is a house, not many people expect it, and main board enchantment hate isn't prevalent for me. Souls is great, sac fodder for crack the earth and smallpox, defense, and pressure. Its not uncommon to have 4 or 5 counters on it by turn 3, and can be a great mana sink for even more counters. Mana tithe is kinda jank, but is good out of the sideboard. Its unexpected, but isnt always effective. Might switch to some surgicals, and Kor Firewalker hasnt done much for me. Overall I like it, its a really fun deck.
Turn 1: Urborg > Inquisition/, Turn 2: Flagstones > Smallpox > fetch for sacred foundry is the most fun I have had in modern.
i hadn't had a chance to test against the eldrazi decks but in theory we should come out top. the eldrazi decks do not come on until turn 3 (usually turn 4) and rely on early discard spells like IoK and Thoughtseize for disruption. The B/W version runs Lingering Souls which to me is the key card in the deck for it to be viable in Modern.
on camera i saw a few games the eldrazi deck just fold over to hyper aggro decks like infect and zoo or surgical recurring land destruction via Fuminator Mage. the mono black version of the deck is the weakest variant. i think this modern season we will see the b/w and b/g versions finishing strongly as they are definitely the better variants.
the eldrazi deck's mana base is a lot more easy to disrupt because it doesn't have the redundancy of Tron. their key land cards is eye of ugin and eldrazi temple, followed by urborg tomb of yawgmoth. their natural "tron" drop is usually a fat eldrazi like oblivion sower which is a lot easier to remove than Karn or wurmcoil engine.
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo
my main deck was okay and i got very close to finishing the games with a fat myth realized. however, the tron combo is very resilient and all they need is to slap on Karn and run away with the game when they do.
granted, my opponent has a pretty lucky streak and was able to draw into either tron or karn after i blew up the tron land or made him discard karn.
i am thinking of tweaking the deck towards a 24 land mana base and curving into crumble to dust with the option of maindecking hero's downfall (LOL) but i feel its too tailored just against Tron that will water down the deck.
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo
Karn doesn't stay in play after he comes on because he will tick down to remove a threat so i will just bolt him or attack with Lingering Souls. Dreadbore is a reasonable sideboard card but it blanks out against Ulamog and is terrible against Wurmcoil Engine. Path to Exile is good against Tron because they run very little basics and if they already Tron into Wurmcoil, letting them have the basic is a small trade off although it means they will be casting Ugin next turn if they have it.
My friend suggested Stony Silence so his Chromatic Stars, Spheres and Expedition Maps will be slowed down tremendously but it also hits my Chromatic Stars and Nihil Spellbombs. Maybe i can sideboard out the C.Stars and Spellbombs for Stony Silence and Dreadbores.
i still think the match up is in favor of us but i had a string of bad luck and he had a string of good luck. my draws were a blank when i was controlling the game and many times i came within 1 more attack phase of winning, or 1 more bolt.
From my deduction, playing the creature based version might yield similar results. he will just Pyroclasm and search out Ugin to control the board.
I think Naya Zoo is probably the best deck against Tron with no sideboarding. Most of the creatures have 3 toughness which blanks out Pyroclasm and will ignore Kozilek's Return and can finish the game before Ugin hits the board.
I think it will take a bit of out of the box thinking to find a card to shut down Tron from the sideboard.
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo
I see some peoples talking about Dark Confidant for cards advantage. Beware, the CMC of Boom // Bust is 8 (2 + 6). Lossing 8 lifes at the upkeep isn't a good way to win games.
EDIT: Here is some reading about split cards.
RGoblinR
Modern
BBW SmallpoxB
RWBMardu MythBWR
UUMerfolkUU
I think Affinity might get pressed down in the new Modern metagame as delver decks should be making a come back. They usually will bring value instant cards like Electrolyze and lots of burn while paving the way for delver/young pyromancer/stormchaser mage/monastery swiftspear. straight ur or grixis delver decks (kolaghan's cmd) all pack strong cards to suppress aggro decks esp post sideboard.
i never liked dark confidant. i have seen too many players (both pro and non pro) die to it. the card is only good in shells that have very strong life gain. it does its best work in abzan and in some cases jund because of the multiple avenues to gain life as the cushion (scavenging ooze, siege rhino as examples).
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo
i have been tinkering with my creatureless deck and have settled on 2 hangarback walkers as a both defensive and offensive strategy when all my lingering souls, myth realized and planeswalkers all go into hiding (happened more than once).
i am leaning towards maindecking straight off value planeswalkers like Gideon, ally of zendikar and Elspeth, knight errant. koth of the hammer, chandra pyromaster and sorin, solemn visitor are now on the chopping board of being relegated to the sideboard. i think only koth and sorin might make the cut. but its a toss up betwen chandra and sorin. =/
boom/bust is not a big deal. the deck still can run molten rain, stone rain, crack the earth, rain of tears and small pox.
it be nice if pillage can be reprinted into modern... =P i mean... there is already kolaghan's command so what's the harm?
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo
Fulminator and Kolaghan's Command seem to fit nicely into this shell. Also 4 Myth Realized seems like too much, 3 should be sufficient, no? It's unfortunate that none of the new manlands are any good in our colors. Here is a list I whipped up:
3 Fulminator Mage
Spells (31):
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Thoughtseize
4 Lightning bolt
4 Boom//Bust
4 Smallpox
4 Lingering Souls
3 Myth Realized
3 Terminate
1 Kolaghan's command
1 Crackling Doom
1 Murderous cut
4 Blackcleave cliffs
4 bloodstained mire
4 Marsh Flats
4 Flagstones of Trokair
2 Arid Mesa
3 Godless shrine
1 Blood crypt
1 Sacred foundry
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Swamp
Draft My Cube!
2 Fulminator Mage
Instant (10):
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Lightning Helix
1 Go for the Throat
1 Murderous Cut
2 Kolaghan's Command
Sorcery (17):
3 Smallpox
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Boom // Bust
4 Lingering Souls
1 Flame Jab
3 Crack the Earth
2 Ajani Vengeant
Artifact/Enchantment (7):
4 Chromatic Star
3 Myth Realized
Land (22)
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Sacred Foundry
2 Godless Shrine
2 Blood Crypt
2 Marsh Flats
3 Bloodstained Mire
1 Arid Mesa
2 Mutavault
4 Flagstones of Trokair
1 Swamp
1 Plains
1 Mountain
All-stars:
- Ajani Vengeant: it kept the Monastery Swiftspear, Goblin Guide or land tapped. It gave me enough time to dig through the deck for spot removal, damage and creatures.
- Crack the Earth: I wasn't sure about Crack the Earth,but like everyone run 4... I tried. Super card. Great synergy with Flagstones of Trokair
, fetchesand Chromatic Star.- Chromatic Star: mana fixing, synergy with Crack the Earth and draw you card.
- Lingering Souls: so good!
- Mutavault: extra damage, mana is fix via Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth or Chromatic Star.
What I’m not sure and didn’t draw to test out:
-Flame Jab: I often flood, so I think it is a good idea to use extra land to deal damage… Maybe it should be a Raven's Crime… or something else?
Q: What is the worst matchup you had? I would like to playtest against it to see how well the deck is oiled.
EDIT: I wrote fetches beside Crack the Earth, but it's only Boom // Bust that works with fetches. Sorry for that.
RGoblinR
Modern
BBW SmallpoxB
RWBMardu MythBWR
UUMerfolkUU
Crack the Earth isn't so good with fetches--you lose a fetch no matter what. I suppose it's a decent use for late-game fetches?
Crack the Earth is great with Chromatic Star because whenever Chromatic Star gets put in the graveyard (such as when you sacrifice it to Crack the Earth), you draw a card.
pre-sideboard, my deck (creatureless version), is not very good against swarm lists like merfolk, elves or affinity who are able to almost empty their hand by turn 3. i usually won't be able to pull the game off even if both of us get our mad hands. post sideboard, i usually won't have any issues with pyroclasm, drown in sorrows or anger of the gods (depends what i feel like packing that day).
swarm lists usually have lords so anger of the gods is somewhat a more easier card to hit them all. however, you can work your work around pyroclasm or drown in sorrows if you are able to remove one of the lords first if 2 lords are on the board. naya zoo is resilient to mass removal because they have a tendency of field 3 toughness creatures so... anger of the gods again here lol. i been thinking of sideboarding earthquake but it doesn't hit spirit tokens (both a good thing and bad thing!) but it also hurts our life total especially with such an aggressive mana base.
against combo decks, you need to side in discard like inquisition of kozilek and Duress. in the past it was just stuff like rending volley versus twin. watch out for kiki chord as the new meta of choice. i mainboard nihil spellbomb but it might not be enough. the creatures are usually small enough to get hit by anger of the gods so there you go.
combo decks are a toss up. if you keep their lands to under 3, they usually cannot go off because they need a specific colour and x mana. so learn your combo deck match ups!
grixis delver/ control decks can be hard. as they have more counterspells post sideboard. they will attempt to turn 2/3 a tasigur or gurmag angler and run you on a 4 turn clock backed with counterspell, bolts and snapcaster mage. they also have stronger cantrips with serum visions and gitaxian probe.
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo
I edited my post. I was confused with Boom // Bust. However, it is also true that fetches and any extra-lands late game are good permanent to sacrifice to Crack the Earth.
I will try both; Anger of the Gods and Drown in Sorrow. I like the scry 1 of Drown, it surely helps sometime. However, I'm keeping Pyroclasm in head, like 2 CMC can hit a turn sooner. Thank for the advices.
RGoblinR
Modern
BBW SmallpoxB
RWBMardu MythBWR
UUMerfolkUU
[1] Neat microsynergies
[2] Finally a home for Myth Realized
[3] Competitive potential in the elusive Mardu colors
[4] The relevance of mana denial in the current meta against Tron & Eldrazi
I've been looking over recent builds here and I see the return of Boom // Bust and Fulminator Mage after they'd been cut from Kanaoka Yoshihiko's early lists. My guess is that there weren't enough fetches to consistently pull off the Boom // Bust asymmetry trick and that he valued Basic Land destruction over the extra body that Fulminator Mage provided.. but that's just conjecture. Still, I can't help but wonder if we're back-peddling by trying to work those back in? Thoughts? Data?
I've seen a few people mention Young Pyromancer here or in other convos. I'm not sold on this, though, as I'm often underwhelmed at Peezy w/o cheap cantrips, he doesn't trigger off of our artifacts/enchantments, he activates sorcery speed removal, and gets eaten by the sweepers most people want to use here.
However, 1-2x Hangarback Walker per Need_More_DPS's suggestion does sound intriguing. It's sac'able, keeps removal relatively inactive, presents another growing clock while the game is stalled, and scales into the late game.
I don't know about Young Pyromancer, it can be a bad top deck. Myth Realized can also be, but at lest it can add a lore counter to another myth in play... I would need to playtest Young Pyromancer to further comment.
I would be interested to read about Hangarback Walker. Some people proposed it in BW Smallpox's primer thread... Have you tried it? Is good? On paper it should be: mana sink, great synergy with Smallpox and Crack the Earth...
RGoblinR
Modern
BBW SmallpoxB
RWBMardu MythBWR
UUMerfolkUU
Both run the core package of Pox, Liliana, Souls, and 3-drop land destruction, but their approaches diverge significantly from there…
Kanaoka Yoshihiko's Myth Pox
-Low curve, 21 lands, 4 fetches
-Focuses on Myth and its synergy with 1-drops: Star/Spellbomb and Crack the Earth
-Runs main board Inquisition, in part to help protect Myth
-Uses spells for 3-drop land destruction, both to boost Myth and target basics
Matthew Currie's Mardu Pox
-higher curve, 27 lands (!), 8 fetches
-Because of 8 fetches can run 2x Boom with more reliable asymmetry
-Focuses on higher value 2-3 drops for better grinding & top-decking
-With no need to buff Myth he adds more creatures, Fulminator and Finks
-K Command gives lots of value by recurring these creatures
-Gideon, Ally of Zendikar is a versatile monster, like Myth + Sorin in one package
-4x Lightning Helix keeps aggro at bay in conjunction with 2x MB wrath
-3-drop creatures + Gideon + burn make “turning the corner” faster and more reliable
-BUT (a big but) higher curve + occasional self land destruction can sometimes clog your hand with 3 drops while you have only 2 lands.
What are your thoughts on this? I’ve played with Currie’s list more than Yoshihiko’s at this point so I need your insight.
Based on the lists you've played with....
[1] How commonly do you feel constricted by your own land count?
[2] What turn (on average) do you hit 3 lands? 4 lands?
[3] Is that early enough to reliably cast the 4-drop walkers or wraths when they're needed for maximum impact?
[4] How often are your Pox casts breaking symmetry? Are there any guidelines on when its worth accepting a more symmetric pox? Sometimes it just feels like an edict that keeps me from playing my 3-drops.
[5] How else do these approaches compare? Are there other advantages to Yoshihiko’s list that I’m overlooking?
Since they’ve both enjoyed some small amount of tournament success I’m sure they’re both valid, but perhaps we can figure out some optimal approach.
Seldom. My version's curve is extremely low. I top out at 4 spells at 4 CC. 19 spells at 1 cc. I never go down to 1-2 lands unless I have more in my hand or am pressed to aggressively control the board.
Turn 4 - 5. I do not want to draw more than 2 lands in my opening hand.
Yes. I already run a collection of spells that controls the board aggressively enough so that when the Walkers drop, I already am 1 foot into winning the game.
Seldom. It does happens when I need to break symmetry and that usually is because I kept a hand that I should have Mulligan-ed.I only have 6 3-drops. Stone Rain and Molten Rain.
Yoshi's version is a more blitzkerg list. Nobody expects and turn 2 Crack the Earth (and sometimes turn 1?). People see Land -> Chromatic Star and they think its some junky Tron deck. If they turn 2 into a creature, you Small Pox them. When they are stuck on their turn 3, you cast Lingering Souls during yours and keep pressing after that.
I don't think my style is suited for Currie's version. 27 lands is too durdle-ily and its more of a Mardu Midrange Control deck than a Land Destruction archetype which is Mardu Myth. Granted he is packing 10 Land Destruction spells but none starts at turn 1.
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo
You've mentioned that the low-to-the-ground Myth Pox decks fold to aggro pre-board, but do well enough once sweepers are sided in. Is the game 2-3 performance vs Affinity & Co. good enough to get a reliable lock on the set, or would Currie's list which is "pre-boarded" with helix, finks, and wraths do better overall in the set in your estimation? Since linear aggro is *everywhere* right now my top priority is on getting a good aggro matchup, followed by disrupting big mana Tron & Eldrazi second.
Additionally, could you offer more guidance on when to run Drown in Sorrow vs. Anger of the Gods vs. Wrath of God? Thank you.
3x Blood Crypt
4x Bloodstained Mire
3x Godless Shrine
1x Plains
2x Sacred Foundry
4x Flagstones of Trokair
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3x Windswept Heath
4x Crack the Earth
4x Lingering Souls
4x Smallpox
4x Stone Rain
2x Molten Rain
2x Despise
1x Raven's Crime
1x Gurmag Angler
Planeswalker (3)
1x Chandra, Pyromaster
1x Koth of the Hammer
1x Sorin, Solemn Visitor
Artifact (6)
4x Chromatic Star
2x Nihil Spellbomb
Instant (4)
4x Lightning Bolt
4x Myth Realized
Gurmag Angler is just a placeholder until I get a Gideon, Ally of Zendikar or Elspeth, Knight Errant. Ajani Vengeant is also possible. Do note that this is the paper version of my deck. The one I test online has Elspeth, Knight Errant instead of Gurmag Angler lol.
I think Currie's list is not bad because buffing the life lost from Pox, Fetches and Shocks with Finks and Helix is wise deckbuilding it also keeps you afloat if you face hyper aggro decks. But I feel 27 lands is too many. I think 23-24 is optimal. I guess he wants to pitch extra lands to LotV which justifies the high land count. Whereas I go around the LotV issue with a low land count and more aggressive control cards.
If the current meta is filled with hyper aggressive decks, I would run sweepers like 2 x Pyroclasms in the main. Drown in Sorrows is a good main board to just get the Scry off even if you have no targets(!sekret tech!)
I can't run 4 mana Wraths. I will be dead by then lol. Anger of the Gods and Drown in Sorrow are both very strong sweepers. Drown in Sorrow hits protection creatures too so that is something to think about. Flaying Tendrils is also a very strong card. I generally go for a 2 x Pyroclasm + 2 x Drown in Sorrow mix. I honestly prefer Anger of the Gods because it can sweep the ground when there is 1 - 2 Lords in play. 2 Lords will pump each other to a 3/3. Merfolk is a tough deck so maybe Volcanic Fallout is another option.
My choice of sweepers by preference:
1. Anger of the Gods
2. Pyroclasm
3. Drown in Sorrows
4. Flaying Tendrils
5. Volcanic Fallout
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo
I have two question for you:
1- How is Koth of the Hammer? Which ability do you use more often? I'm skeptical about it. The deck has a low count of Mountain.
2- How is Chandra, Pyromaster? I'm planning to playtest with her and Gideon, Ally of Zendikar. Bringing my planeswalker and 4 CMC drop to a total of 4 (2 x Ajani, 1 x Chandra, 1 x Gideon)
I'm also nervous about running Chandra and Gideon in the same deck, RR and WW... that can be adjust easily by reviewing the manabase...
I'm playing with 2 Ajani Vengeant and, so far, it is really good. I highly recommend it. Great synergy with land destruction (keeping 1 of your opponent land tapped is great addition to Mardu Myth) and it also help against aggro deck, it adds other Lightning Helix to your deck.
RGoblinR
Modern
BBW SmallpoxB
RWBMardu MythBWR
UUMerfolkUU
1) Koth is a powerhouse. I use the +1 all the time, if not to attack but to activate Myth Realize to untap a Sacred Foundry or cast a 1 CC spell. Against an opponent who I know who is not able to put down a threat or have no direct damage, I use his -2 to cast bigger spells to control the board. Blood Crypt and Godless Shrine are shocks I always keep in play, Sacred Foundry is 2nd choice. All the other lands I will sacrifice to Pox / Crack the Earth so keeping them in play is no problem. If I already have 3 lands in play, i have no qualms of sacrificing whatever 4th land it is.
2) Chandra is important for this deck. She is able to control the board with her +1 or give you another chance to press your board when you draw a land instead of a spell. I have ultimated her in stalemate games and finished off the opponent with Bolt / Molten Rain or Lingering Souls.
Ideally, my choice of Planewalkers for this deck is:
1) Elspeth, Knight Errant or Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2) Ajani Vengeant
3) Chandra, Pyromaster
4) Koth of the Hammer
5) Sorin, Solemn Visitor
i have yet to acquire Elspeth or Gideon (modern pro tour spiked the cards quite a bit) and have tested them as proxies and they are the key Planewalkers to have. Ajani and Chandra are next. So the ideal set up is:
Elespeth + Gideon + Ajani + Chandra, one of each with Sorin in the sideboard. Against burn / swarm based decks, I side in Pyroclasm and Sorin.
my current set up is Koth, Ajani, Chandra and Sorin. this by all means is NOT optimum but already very powerful and i never lost a game when i resolved a PW. Majority of the times, when any of the Planewalkers hit the board, you almost have the game because of the state of the board after 4-5 turns of control, if you ever resolve a 2nd PW, its almost impossible to lose unless its some situation when by you were already losing before the 1st one hit.
As a disclaimer, this deck is not easy to pilot. You need to know when to mulligan and what type of opening hand to play. This deck requires you to be very aggressive on the first 3 turns. This deck doesn't really like it when your opponent floods out but you can wait for them to play a creature before Small Poxing them. If you have Chromatic Star or Nihil Spellbomb in play, just Crack the Earth anyways to draw the card to keep their land count low so they cannot play more than 1 spell a turn.
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo