I've found that Merfolk is tough to sideboard against. It feels like every card is good against them we have. But how do most of you sideboard in the matchup? Is it more appropriate to take out Removal like K. Command or Terminate, or should discard be coming out for sideboard cards? Every time I take out my discard in the matchup I seem to really miss them even if it seems like the right thing to do.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern UMerfolk WDeath and Taxes BRBliztkrieg GStompy
- - -
"Rock is overpowered. Paper is fine."
-Scissors
what do you think ? I've been testing this afternoon. It is doing pretty well. Each time I like it more. this week'll try my luck upload videos of games. I am to add young pyromante. but does not convince me at all. They accept criticism
I like it. Looks very similar to the list I may have settled on, main difference being that I've got less discard and a slightly bigger curve.
EDIT: I'm still not sure about my mana base. Have as many white sources as red even though twice as much red in casting costs, but I also really need double white in order to activate a Shambling Vent.
I dont think you need the Vent's. Would cut them and 1 Command for 2 Lightning Helix and another blackcleave cliff.
I'll try that. Do you think it would be better to go with a lone Lavaclaw Reaches instead of the Blackcleave Cliffs? Or just bail on manlands all together? The Steam Vents have been useful, so not sure if abandoning manlands will be ok or not. So far mtgo testing has been going pretty well, only loss in 7 matches was to Abzan Company and got mana screwed so hoping to see it again so I can get a better feel for the matchup. Beat Jund even though games 2 and 3 both started with an opponent playing a Leyline of the Void on turn 0.
I've seen some Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet pop up here and there, but is it really any good? Committing four mana to something that gets path'd right away feels bad.
(without zombies to sac I should mention)
If Kalitas sticks it will often win the game on its own. Chump blocking it gets you a zombie, that you then sac to make it bigger. It can very quickly get out of control.
Edit: You can also sac the Bloodghasts, then play a land and bring them back to sac again.
Great thread and deck. I've been playing versions of it for the last few weeks with moderate success. If played properly, it's pretty explosive and intimidating. The look on peoples' faces when I stick an Obliterator is priceless, and he's a great attack deterrent.
What are some opinions on Demigod of Revenge or Asylum Visitor having a place in the deck? They both interact well with Liliana and provide explosive finishes and card draw, respectively.
Thoughts on Asylum Visitor -- It hit the scene with immediate attention being paid to it, but testing was a different story. It's dead hard to keep an opponent hellbent, and you can't count on getting to that state yourself unless your deck gets very tricksy. That said, the most impressive thing about that card may be the Madness mechanic. I'm not a Standard player, but think that peeking over the fence to their side might give us some ideas about using that technique.
At the end of the day, I think your better off going with a stout, tried-and-true construction like DelveroftheMany. Looks tight. Kalitas does so much more than you'd think. The only time it gets grumpy is when faced with a wall of omens or wall of roots...or a spellskite. That's when 3 power kind of sucks, but it will swing a game with life gain and graveyard shutdown tricks. I had it in a paper tourney against an Aristocrats deck (as well as a Torpor Orb), and the dude pretty much had to scoop.
As for the main deck, what stands out at me is the (4) Kolaghan's Command, but hey I've gone up to 3. The early removal and discard can easily put you in a place where you've got advantage and your insta-discarding the opponent on his drawstep. Darkblast in main deck is inspired! Hello Infect and Affinity!
As for thoughts on changes:
Go to 2 Engineered Explosives as there are just so many 2-cmc permanents out there that won't get swept away by a pyroclasm. I'd love to see Anger of the gods, but get that such an inclusion will kill bloodghasts. You may want to consider a Torpor Orb. With such a low to the ground and fast attack deck, I can definitely see why you went away from the 2-for-1 discard. Good Luck!!!
Also, on deck postings, type [deck.] and then [/deck.] at the end of it. But, don't type the period.
Hey all. I'm a Skred Red expat. Got tired of the art on Snow-Covered Mountains. Wanted to play normal Mountains and decided to use Terminate as a replacement for Skred. So, that brings me to ya'lls thread since I'm in BR. My deck is more Red slanted, Black being a splash; Koth was a house for me in Skred, I'm planning to have him do the same here.
Thoughts on Asylum Visitor -- It hit the scene with immediate attention being paid to it, but testing was a different story. It's dead hard to keep an opponent hellbent, and you can't count on getting to that state yourself unless your deck gets very tricksy. That said, the most impressive thing about that card may be the Madness mechanic. I'm not a Standard player, but think that peeking over the fence to their side might give us some ideas about using that technique.
At the end of the day, I think your better off going with a stout, tried-and-true construction like DelveroftheMany. Looks tight. Kalitas does so much more than you'd think. The only time it gets grumpy is when faced with a wall of omens or wall of roots...or a spellskite. That's when 3 power kind of sucks, but it will swing a game with life gain and graveyard shutdown tricks. I had it in a paper tourney against an Aristocrats deck (as well as a Torpor Orb), and the dude pretty much had to scoop.
As for the main deck, what stands out at me is the (4) Kolaghan's Command, but hey I've gone up to 3. The early removal and discard can easily put you in a place where you've got advantage and your insta-discarding the opponent on his drawstep. Darkblast in main deck is inspired! Hello Infect and Affinity!
As for thoughts on changes:
Go to 2 Engineered Explosives as there are just so many 2-cmc permanents out there that won't get swept away by a pyroclasm. I'd love to see Anger of the gods, but get that such an inclusion will kill bloodghasts. You may want to consider a Torpor Orb. With such a low to the ground and fast attack deck, I can definitely see why you went away from the 2-for-1 discard. Good Luck!!!
Also, on deck postings, type [deck.] and then [/deck.] at the end of it. But, don't type the period.
I accidentialy build a BR(w) Midrange-esque Deck and suddenly recognized that i ended up building a "Blitzkrieg"-Deck.
My Lists differ a bit from the common card choices because i try to abuse FAtihless Looting + Tormenting Voice and pack a bunch of Value Cards to keep this engine running:
In this kinda deck i wanna try Asylum Visitor because it has a lot of synergy with all my discard outlets:
Pitch Visitor to Rotting RAts or Faithless Looting is perfectly fine.
Visitor just gives a single Card, but that's totally ok.
Whether you head for the beatdown plan or the Discard Plan, this dude is totally ok'ish as a Dark Confidant Budget replacement.
Just don't expect too much. He nets a single card and is a beater on an empty board.
The Deck has to be build around him to ensure he gets a bit of value.
For reference, here's the list i'm testing right now:
Your card choices remind me of some of my own theorycraft posts, Polymorph, and I gotta say it's nice to see someone concur with my thoughts on Rotting Rats.
On my end of things, I'm going to try replacing my 2-of Young Pyromancer. Great card, but not necessarily as a 2-of. It needs to get out early to play best. Instead, I'm bringing out Kalastria Highborn. Given the Bloodghast antics I'm already undertaking with or without Kalitas, it seems a natural complement. Really, Bloodghast and Highborn are really mean in concert, and with the landfall trigger (especially via Drownyard Temple) I can loop them pretty relentlessly.
Imagine having Highborn and Bloodghast out, then casting Smallpox. Sac Bloodghast and Drownyard Temple, discard another Bloodghast, pay extra B to drain 2 life. Next turn, pay 3 generic to get Drownyard Temple back, which returns both Bloodghasts. My opponents' salt will season my feast!
It occurs to me that returning a bunch of Bloodghasts to the table is perfect for devotion/Nykthos, and my permanents all have BB symbols except for Gurmag Angler, with only one. Worth examining later.
Your card choices remind me of some of my own theorycraft posts, Polymorph, and I gotta say it's nice to see someone concur with my thoughts on Rotting Rats.
On my end of things, I'm going to try replacing my 2-of Young Pyromancer. Great card, but not necessarily as a 2-of. It needs to get out early to play best. Instead, I'm bringing out Kalastria Highborn. Given the Bloodghast antics I'm already undertaking with or without Kalitas, it seems a natural complement. Really, Bloodghast and Highborn are really mean in concert, and with the landfall trigger (especially via Drownyard Temple) I can loop them pretty relentlessly.
Imagine having Highborn and Bloodghast out, then casting Smallpox. Sac Bloodghast and Drownyard Temple, discard another Bloodghast, pay extra B to drain 2 life. Next turn, pay 3 generic to get Drownyard Temple back, which returns both Bloodghasts. My opponents' salt will season my feast!
It occurs to me that returning a bunch of Bloodghasts to the table is perfect for devotion/Nykthos, and my permanents all have BB symbols except for Gurmag Angler, with only one. Worth examining later.
The idea is great at all, but expect to see 0 Bloodghast in your opening 7 so your plan is pretty much dead. Highborn does nothing at all if you got no ghast...and you only ran 6 vampires at all. Your overall gameplan is not viable until Turn 3 or 4 at least and then does really nothing to improve your board state.
You got a whole bunch of shenanigans, but no reliable Gameplan.
Ask yourself the following questions:
What is the overall deck gameplan?
Do i push for the aggressive win or rather go the long distance?
Does the deck have a bunch of synergies or is each Card poewrful by itself?
What does the deck do if some pieces get blown out? ( Path to Exile on 'ghast?)
So first put some serious thoughts into this and then put up a decklist
It's tough i know, but a deck relying on a handful shenanigans isn't doing a lot of work these days.
Basically just trying to maximize value from Faithless Looting, Liliana, and Nahiri. Thoughts? Does this deck even belong in this thread anymore?
It looks like a Mardu Midrange list where Dark Confidant is replaced with Asylum Visitor.
This doesn't work at all. You need to be heavy on discard - 3 Inquisition of Kozilek are certainly not enough.
Also Faithless Looting is not super great here. You need around 15 Cards in your deck to pitch constantly something to Looting.
Your list hasn't got any relevant Turn 2 play - that's why i ran Tormenting Voice and Terminate. Some Decks doesn't give me a target for my removal, so reconsider what your T2 play should be.
Your manabase is a bit greedy. Expect to loose vs. Blood Moon - that's the reason why i decremented my W Cards to an absolute minimum. If you haven't got the right fetches - don't join them.
Include some Manlands!
Sometimes you'll need a Beater on an empty Board. Which one is up to you and your testings. Vents is great because of lifelink, others maybe viable too.
You need to develop an overall gameplan and stick to it.
A good pile of cards doesn't necessarily summarize into a good deck
It isn't a contender for YP at all, but needs no protection and no more investment for putting up Value.
His concern is that he doesn't do much in the long run except stalling the board for some turns.
From time to time i do also re-think the following "Value Package":
Hello there guys, it's been a while... So, I ran Living End during Eldrazi Winter and then took the AV hype train with UB Faeries first and Jeskai Control now. However, I kept checking the thread out now and then. Nice to see new faces btw!
Is anyone here going to the GP? I wish I could, but oh well. Anyway, I'm switching back to Blitzkrieg Save for Tron, the deck can handle the top tier pretty well. Jund, Affinity and Infect are still great MUs, Jeskai Control is our new U-deck to prey upon (like Twin was) and both Burn and Company are manageable with the right SB cards.
Also, I tested a vampire-ish deck back when SOI came out. It was my stock list, running Falkenrath Gorger, Assylum Vistor and Kalitas instead of Abbot, Pyromancer and Angler. It was OK and I like Visitor the most, but it felt like a win-more card and my stock list felt just a lot better overall. Heh, better late than never they say. I'll keep you guys informed about future tests and results
Hello there guys, it's been a while... So, I ran Living End during Eldrazi Winter and then took the AV hype train with UB Faeries first and Jeskai Control now. However, I kept checking the thread out now and then. Nice to see new faces btw!
Is anyone here going to the GP? I wish I could, but oh well. Anyway, I'm switching back to Blitzkrieg Save for Tron, the deck can handle the top tier pretty well. Jund, Affinity and Infect are still great MUs, Jeskai Control is our new U-deck to prey upon (like Twin was) and both Burn and Company are manageable with the right SB cards.
Also, I tested a vampire-ish deck back when SOI came out. It was my stock list, running Falkenrath Gorger, Assylum Vistor and Kalitas instead of Abbot, Pyromancer and Angler. It was OK and I like Visitor the most, but it felt like a win-more card and my stock list felt just a lot better overall. Heh, better late than never they say. I'll keep you guys informed about future tests and results
May we see your full deck list, acc95?
I'm planning on going to GP L.A., but I'm not sure which iteration of the deck I wanna run. I'm liking either Raystack's most current list which is heavier on the discard and runs Obliterator(my pet card), or Delverofthemany's more streamlined list.
I wish you good luck at the GP then, Unholy Strenght. I also like Obliterator, which to me fits better in the more controlling versions. Honestly, I like red wipes better, since they are cheaper/faster, but Obliterator doesn't go well with them. I strongly recommend Night of Souls' Betrayal in Oblitzkrieg - huge trump card against Affinity, Infect and Snapcaster decks.
I wish you good luck at the GP then, Unholy Strenght. I also like Obliterator, which to me fits better in the more controlling versions. Honestly, I like red wipes better, since they are cheaper/faster, but Obliterator doesn't go well with them. I strongly recommend Night of Souls' Betrayal in Oblitzkrieg - huge trump card against Affinity, Infect and Snapcaster decks.
Thanks, man. I like the list. Tons of value. Anger AND Pyroclasm in the side, huh?
this deck looks amazing! I was looking for a deck to start playing modern with (mostly FNM's for now) and this suits all my needs.
Except for one, my budget won't allow for many of the allstars (like the obliterator or lily). Which direction would be the way to go for me (aka which direction would be a more budget way)? I've got some dragonskull summits and blood crypts so hopefully that'll save me some money.Let's say that I've got a budget of about 100 euros (and the crypts and summits). Which build would you suggest?
this deck looks amazing! I was looking for a deck to start playing modern with (mostly FNM's for now) and this suits all my needs.
Except for one, my budget won't allow for many of the allstars (like the obliterator or lily). Which direction would be the way to go for me (aka which direction would be a more budget way)? I've got some dragonskull summits and blood crypts so hopefully that'll save me some money.Let's say that I've got a budget of about 100 euros (and the crypts and summits). Which build would you suggest?
Thanks but no thanks. Maybe I deserved that as my post was written quickly and maybe a little bit lazy. Oh and 100 euros might be a stretch
However, I do feel that this deck is very friendly for those who want to buy in to modern for the first time (like me). Especially when you ignore the splashes. At the moment here's where I'm at:
Angler / YP / Wrench Mind / Bolt / Terminate are pretty cheap and a good start. Thoughtseize / IoK you can't go without. That leaves 8-10 spots?
But I'm not too sure where to take it from there. Going hard on the discard with Blightning (or Kommand?) and Nyxathid seems like the cheapest way but I want to know if there are other options. Do Bloodghast and Looting need Lily in order to work? Does Angler need the looting?
And after that deciding on those packages where to go? Just go with what the meta needs?
Abbot? Visitor? Affliction?
Landwise;
4 Summit, 4 Crypt, 4 Mire
Rix Maadi?
How many fetchlands does Angler need? Would 4 fetchlands suffice for a start?
Do I need cliffs to start with?
Thanks but no thanks. Maybe I deserved that as my post was written quickly and maybe a little bit lazy. Oh and 100 euros might be a stretch
However, I do feel that this deck is very friendly for those who want to buy in to modern for the first time (like me). Especially when you ignore the splashes. At the moment here's where I'm at:
Angler / YP / Wrench Mind / Bolt / Terminate are pretty cheap and a good start. Thoughtseize / IoK you can't go without. That leaves 8-10 spots?
But I'm not too sure where to take it from there. Going hard on the discard with Blightning (or Kommand?) and Nyxathid seems like the cheapest way but I want to know if there are other options. Do Bloodghast and Looting need Lily in order to work? Does Angler need the looting?
And after that deciding on those packages where to go? Just go with what the meta needs?
Abbot? Visitor? Affliction?
Landwise;
4 Summit, 4 Crypt, 4 Mire
Rix Maadi?
How many fetchlands does Angler need? Would 4 fetchlands suffice for a start?
Do I need cliffs to start with?
Would love some input from you all
I'll field this one from the "value" standpoint of the easiest/hardest ways to get started for the landbase.
The cheapest lands, in order, that you can get away with playing:
If you are staying strictly BR and not splashing a third color, then fetch lands are ONLY necessary if you are playing copies of Gurmag Angler or Murderous Cut
There is nothing wrong with large amounts of basic lands. Path to Exile is everywhere right now.
Moving on from the landbase, here are some 'budget' replacements for some of the more expensive cards:
Liliana of the Veil is pricy.
Her sacrifice effect and discard effects are not the most necessary things in the game at the moment, but I would highly recommend a stable number of planeswalkers. I am a big fan of Koth of the Hammer in the BR budget versions as a replacement, especially with high numbers of Mountains in the deck.
Ensnaring Bridge is pricy.
You still have the option of playing with Shrieking Affliction and even Liliana's Caress without needing bridges. Just make sure you have enough strong removal cards. Terminate, Go For The Throat, Murderous Cut, and even Doom Blade are all good options. If you are on the discard plan, be careful with the Wrench Mind plan because of Thopter Sword being in the format, and stick to the Blightning effects for good measure without being afraid to sideboard out Wrench Minds.
If I wanted to get into Modern and only had maybe 100 bucks to spend, my list would probably look something like this:
Thanks so much for all the information! Makes sense that the 'cheap' Angler costs a lot more due to the fetchlands. I'm kinda curious as to why you opted out of Young Pyromancer.
The list looks pretty good. I will definitely look at that as a starting point. Thanks again!
First off, I love the low to the ground version of Blitzkreig with Young Pyromancer that I last posted. But after playing the deck a bit more and getting more matches in I've realized that some of my worst match ups could be tremendously improved by playing Blood Moon in the main. And so I give you my first rendition of "Black Moon" or "Kreig Moon". I haven't got to test it as much I would like so far but the lines of play it has seems to be very strong(namely Spellskite into Blood Moon or Lotv into Kalitas) Let me know your first impressions.
4x- Bloodghast
3x- Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1x- Goblin Dark Dwellers
2x- Spellskite
UMerfolk
WDeath and Taxes
BRBliztkrieg
GStompy
- - -
"Rock is overpowered. Paper is fine."
-Scissors
I like it. Looks very similar to the list I may have settled on, main difference being that I've got less discard and a slightly bigger curve.
2x Arid Mesa
2x Blackcleave Cliffs
2x Blood Crypt
4x Bloodstained Mire
2x Godless Shrine
4x Marsh Flats
1x Mountain
1x Plains
1x Sacred Foundry
2x Shambling Vent
2x Swamp
4x Bloodghast
2x Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
4x Gurmag Angler
Instant: 11
4x Lightning Bolt
3x Terminate
3x Kolaghan's Command
1x Murderous Cut
4x Faithless Looting
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
2x Thoughtseize
4x Lingering Souls
Planeswalker: 2
2x Ajani Vengeant
EDIT: I'm still not sure about my mana base. Have as many white sources as red even though twice as much red in casting costs, but I also really need double white in order to activate a Shambling Vent.
I'll try that. Do you think it would be better to go with a lone Lavaclaw Reaches instead of the Blackcleave Cliffs? Or just bail on manlands all together? The Steam Vents have been useful, so not sure if abandoning manlands will be ok or not. So far mtgo testing has been going pretty well, only loss in 7 matches was to Abzan Company and got mana screwed so hoping to see it again so I can get a better feel for the matchup. Beat Jund even though games 2 and 3 both started with an opponent playing a Leyline of the Void on turn 0.
If Kalitas sticks it will often win the game on its own. Chump blocking it gets you a zombie, that you then sac to make it bigger. It can very quickly get out of control.
Edit: You can also sac the Bloodghasts, then play a land and bring them back to sac again.
What are some opinions on Demigod of Revenge or Asylum Visitor having a place in the deck? They both interact well with Liliana and provide explosive finishes and card draw, respectively.
4x- Young Pyromancer
4x- Bloodghast
3x- Gurmag Angler
2x- Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
4x- Lightning Bolt
4x- Inquisition of Kozilek
4x- Faithless Looting
4x- Terminate
4x- Kolaghan's Command
2x- Thoughtseize
1x- Darkblast
1x- Murderous Cut
2x Liliana of the Veil
3x- Bloodcrypt
1x- Godless Shrine
4x- Bloodstained Mire
4x- Polluted Delta
3x- Dragonskull Summit
4x- Swamp
2x- Mountain
------
3x- Pyroclasm
3x- Blood Moon
2x- Nihil Spellbomb
2x- Wear/ Tear
2x- Timely Reinforcements
1x- Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1x- Pia and Kiran Nalaar
1x- Engineered Explosives
UMerfolk
WDeath and Taxes
BRBliztkrieg
GStompy
- - -
"Rock is overpowered. Paper is fine."
-Scissors
At the end of the day, I think your better off going with a stout, tried-and-true construction like DelveroftheMany. Looks tight. Kalitas does so much more than you'd think. The only time it gets grumpy is when faced with a wall of omens or wall of roots...or a spellskite. That's when 3 power kind of sucks, but it will swing a game with life gain and graveyard shutdown tricks. I had it in a paper tourney against an Aristocrats deck (as well as a Torpor Orb), and the dude pretty much had to scoop.
As for the main deck, what stands out at me is the (4) Kolaghan's Command, but hey I've gone up to 3. The early removal and discard can easily put you in a place where you've got advantage and your insta-discarding the opponent on his drawstep. Darkblast in main deck is inspired! Hello Infect and Affinity!
As for thoughts on changes:
Go to 2 Engineered Explosives as there are just so many 2-cmc permanents out there that won't get swept away by a pyroclasm. I'd love to see Anger of the gods, but get that such an inclusion will kill bloodghasts. You may want to consider a Torpor Orb. With such a low to the ground and fast attack deck, I can definitely see why you went away from the 2-for-1 discard. Good Luck!!!
Also, on deck postings, type [deck.] and then [/deck.] at the end of it. But, don't type the period.
4 Thunderbreak Regent
3 Stormbreath Dragon
Planeswalkers
4 Koth of the Hammer
1 Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker
1 Chandra, Flamecaller
Artifacts
4 Rakdos Signet
3 Relic of Progenitus
1 Pyrite Spellbomb
Instants/Sorceries
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Terminate
1 Roast
1 Draconic Roar
3 Anger of the Gods
2 Kolaghan's Command
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Blood Crypt
4 Smoldering Marsh
10 Mountain
1 Swamp
3 Fulminator Mage
2 Rending Volley
3 Thoughtseize
1 Dismember
1 Kolaghan's Command
2 Slaughter Games
3 Dragon's Claw
Also, this was somewhat inspired by those Azorius Midrange decks that were in vogue for a while.
I accidentialy build a BR(w) Midrange-esque Deck and suddenly recognized that i ended up building a "Blitzkrieg"-Deck.
My Lists differ a bit from the common card choices because i try to abuse FAtihless Looting + Tormenting Voice and pack a bunch of Value Cards to keep this engine running:
- Lingering Souls
- Rotting RAts
- Bloodghast
- Drownyard temple
- Faithless Looting
for pitching to Voice and Looting.I ran Rix Maadi, Dungeon Palace which is a fine Budget-Replacement for Liliana
In this kinda deck i wanna try Asylum Visitor because it has a lot of synergy with all my discard outlets:
Pitch Visitor to Rotting RAts or Faithless Looting is perfectly fine.
Visitor just gives a single Card, but that's totally ok.
Whether you head for the beatdown plan or the Discard Plan, this dude is totally ok'ish as a Dark Confidant Budget replacement.
Just don't expect too much. He nets a single card and is a beater on an empty board.
The Deck has to be build around him to ensure he gets a bit of value.
For reference, here's the list i'm testing right now:
4 Polluted Delta
2 Blood Crypt
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Godless Shrine
3 Blackcleave Cliffs
2 Swamp
1 Mountain
2 Rix Maadi, Dungeon Palace
2 Shambling Vents
1 Drownyard Temple
23 Lands
2 Thoughtseize
2 Rotting Rats
2 Kolaghan's Command
9 Discard
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Terminate
7 Removal
4 Faithless Looting
3 Tormenting Voice
4 Lingering Souls
4 Bloodghast
1 Tymaret, the Murder King
16 Draw & Value
3 Ajani Vengeant
5 Late-game Beater
Green @ it's best
On my end of things, I'm going to try replacing my 2-of Young Pyromancer. Great card, but not necessarily as a 2-of. It needs to get out early to play best. Instead, I'm bringing out Kalastria Highborn. Given the Bloodghast antics I'm already undertaking with or without Kalitas, it seems a natural complement. Really, Bloodghast and Highborn are really mean in concert, and with the landfall trigger (especially via Drownyard Temple) I can loop them pretty relentlessly.
Imagine having Highborn and Bloodghast out, then casting Smallpox. Sac Bloodghast and Drownyard Temple, discard another Bloodghast, pay extra B to drain 2 life. Next turn, pay 3 generic to get Drownyard Temple back, which returns both Bloodghasts. My opponents' salt will season my feast!
It occurs to me that returning a bunch of Bloodghasts to the table is perfect for devotion/Nykthos, and my permanents all have BB symbols except for Gurmag Angler, with only one. Worth examining later.
4 Faithless Looting
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Lightning Helix
4 Lingering Souls
3 Kolaghan's Command
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
4 Bloodghast
4 Asylum Visitor
3 Gurmag Angler
2 Liliana of the Veil
1 Nahiri, the Harbinger
1 Ajani Vengeant
3 Blood Crypt
3 Godless Shrine
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Polluted Delta
4 Swamp
2 Mountain
2 Dragonskull Summit
2 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Pyroclasm
2 Dreadbore
1 Kolaghan's Command
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Wear // Tear
2 Fulminator Mage
1 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
Basically just trying to maximize value from Faithless Looting, Liliana, and Nahiri. Thoughts? Does this deck even belong in this thread anymore?
The idea is great at all, but expect to see 0 Bloodghast in your opening 7 so your plan is pretty much dead. Highborn does nothing at all if you got no ghast...and you only ran 6 vampires at all. Your overall gameplan is not viable until Turn 3 or 4 at least and then does really nothing to improve your board state.
You got a whole bunch of shenanigans, but no reliable Gameplan.
Ask yourself the following questions:
What is the overall deck gameplan?
Do i push for the aggressive win or rather go the long distance?
Does the deck have a bunch of synergies or is each Card poewrful by itself?
What does the deck do if some pieces get blown out? ( Path to Exile on 'ghast?)
So first put some serious thoughts into this and then put up a decklist
It's tough i know, but a deck relying on a handful shenanigans isn't doing a lot of work these days.
It looks like a Mardu Midrange list where Dark Confidant is replaced with Asylum Visitor.
This doesn't work at all. You need to be heavy on discard - 3 Inquisition of Kozilek are certainly not enough.
Also Faithless Looting is not super great here. You need around 15 Cards in your deck to pitch constantly something to Looting.
Your list hasn't got any relevant Turn 2 play - that's why i ran Tormenting Voice and Terminate. Some Decks doesn't give me a target for my removal, so reconsider what your T2 play should be.
Your manabase is a bit greedy. Expect to loose vs. Blood Moon - that's the reason why i decremented my W Cards to an absolute minimum. If you haven't got the right fetches - don't join them.
I know Nahiri, the harbinger is agreat Card - but how does it develops your gameplan further?
What creature do you find with her ultimate? Emrakul, the Aeons Torn or Progenitus?
Include some Manlands!
Sometimes you'll need a Beater on an empty Board. Which one is up to you and your testings. Vents is great because of lifelink, others maybe viable too.
You need to develop an overall gameplan and stick to it.
A good pile of cards doesn't necessarily summarize into a good deck
Green @ it's best
I should probably stick with something closer to Delverofthemany's list. Or oven Raystack's more classic build. A lot less greedy for sure 😄
It isn't a contender for YP at all, but needs no protection and no more investment for putting up Value.
His concern is that he doesn't do much in the long run except stalling the board for some turns.
From time to time i do also re-think the following "Value Package":
- Tormenting Voice
- Faithless Looting
- Unburial Rites
- Shriekmaw
- Fulminator Mage
- Avalanche Riders
to get maximum Value out of Evoke- / Sacrifice-triggered Creatures.It feels a bit clunky though and it needs to absolutely hit Rites to work out.
Kolaghan's Command puts up work too, but overall it seems slow and not hitting enough relevant Matchups.
Green @ it's best
Is anyone here going to the GP? I wish I could, but oh well. Anyway, I'm switching back to Blitzkrieg Save for Tron, the deck can handle the top tier pretty well. Jund, Affinity and Infect are still great MUs, Jeskai Control is our new U-deck to prey upon (like Twin was) and both Burn and Company are manageable with the right SB cards.
Also, I tested a vampire-ish deck back when SOI came out. It was my stock list, running Falkenrath Gorger, Assylum Vistor and Kalitas instead of Abbot, Pyromancer and Angler. It was OK and I like Visitor the most, but it felt like a win-more card and my stock list felt just a lot better overall. Heh, better late than never they say. I'll keep you guys informed about future tests and results
Frontier: UBR Grixis Control | BRG Jund Delirium
May we see your full deck list, acc95?
I'm planning on going to GP L.A., but I'm not sure which iteration of the deck I wanna run. I'm liking either Raystack's most current list which is heavier on the discard and runs Obliterator(my pet card), or Delverofthemany's more streamlined list.
Frontier: UBR Grixis Control | BRG Jund Delirium
4 Blood Crypt
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Polluted Delta
4 Swamp
1 Mountain
4 Faithless Looting
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Thoughtseize
4 Terminate
4 Wrench Mind
4 Young Pyromancer
3 Gurmag Angler
3 Liliana of the Veil
3 Kolaghan's Command
3 Nyxathid
2 Anger of the Gods
2 Blood Moon
2 Dreadbore
2 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Pharika's Cure
2 Pyroclasm
I wish you good luck at the GP then, Unholy Strenght. I also like Obliterator, which to me fits better in the more controlling versions. Honestly, I like red wipes better, since they are cheaper/faster, but Obliterator doesn't go well with them. I strongly recommend Night of Souls' Betrayal in Oblitzkrieg - huge trump card against Affinity, Infect and Snapcaster decks.
Frontier: UBR Grixis Control | BRG Jund Delirium
Thanks, man. I like the list. Tons of value. Anger AND Pyroclasm in the side, huh?
this deck looks amazing! I was looking for a deck to start playing modern with (mostly FNM's for now) and this suits all my needs.
Except for one, my budget won't allow for many of the allstars (like the obliterator or lily). Which direction would be the way to go for me (aka which direction would be a more budget way)? I've got some dragonskull summits and blood crypts so hopefully that'll save me some money.Let's say that I've got a budget of about 100 euros (and the crypts and summits). Which build would you suggest?
Can't wait to participate in the krieg!
BW Tokens:
BW Buget Tokens
Green @ it's best
However, I do feel that this deck is very friendly for those who want to buy in to modern for the first time (like me). Especially when you ignore the splashes. At the moment here's where I'm at:
Angler / YP / Wrench Mind / Bolt / Terminate are pretty cheap and a good start. Thoughtseize / IoK you can't go without. That leaves 8-10 spots?
But I'm not too sure where to take it from there. Going hard on the discard with Blightning (or Kommand?) and Nyxathid seems like the cheapest way but I want to know if there are other options. Do Bloodghast and Looting need Lily in order to work? Does Angler need the looting?
And after that deciding on those packages where to go? Just go with what the meta needs?
Abbot? Visitor? Affliction?
Landwise;
4 Summit, 4 Crypt, 4 Mire
Rix Maadi?
How many fetchlands does Angler need? Would 4 fetchlands suffice for a start?
Do I need cliffs to start with?
Would love some input from you all
I'll field this one from the "value" standpoint of the easiest/hardest ways to get started for the landbase.
The cheapest lands, in order, that you can get away with playing:
Dragonskull Summit
Sulfurous Springs
Blood Crypt (for a shock land to be less than $10, that's very good)
Graven Cairns (I would never recommend more than 2)
From there, things get tricky. If you have the access to any fetch lands that simply fetch for a black source (Polluted Delta, Bloodstained Mire, Verdant Catacombs, Marsh Flats) then you can easily get away with running a one-of Godless Shrine as a splash out of the sideboard for Wear // Tear.
If you are staying strictly BR and not splashing a third color, then fetch lands are ONLY necessary if you are playing copies of Gurmag Angler or Murderous Cut
There is nothing wrong with large amounts of basic lands. Path to Exile is everywhere right now.
Moving on from the landbase, here are some 'budget' replacements for some of the more expensive cards:
Inquisition of Kozilek and Thoughtseize are pricy.
Duress, Blackmail, and Despise are the best budget replacements.
Liliana of the Veil is pricy.
Her sacrifice effect and discard effects are not the most necessary things in the game at the moment, but I would highly recommend a stable number of planeswalkers. I am a big fan of Koth of the Hammer in the BR budget versions as a replacement, especially with high numbers of Mountains in the deck.
Ensnaring Bridge is pricy.
You still have the option of playing with Shrieking Affliction and even Liliana's Caress without needing bridges. Just make sure you have enough strong removal cards. Terminate, Go For The Throat, Murderous Cut, and even Doom Blade are all good options. If you are on the discard plan, be careful with the Wrench Mind plan because of Thopter Sword being in the format, and stick to the Blightning effects for good measure without being afraid to sideboard out Wrench Minds.
If I wanted to get into Modern and only had maybe 100 bucks to spend, my list would probably look something like this:
1 Gurmag Angler
3 Duress
3 Despise
1 Blackmail
2 Go For The Throat
1 Doom Blade
1 Murderous Cut
4 Terminate
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Blightning
4 Wrench Mind
4 Shrieking Affliction
1 Liliana's Caress
4 Dragonskull Summit
3 Sulfurous Springs
3 Blood Crypt
7 Swamp
5 Mountain
4 Pyroclasm
1 Surgical Extraction
2 Crumble to Dust
2 Nihil Spellbomb
3 Shattering Blow
I'm personally on a much different (and pricier) version of the deck, but for a budget starting point, this is not bad at all.
Standard: Temur Energy RUG
Pauper: Fireball Black B
Commander: Kaervek the Merciless BR
"Always Bolt the Bird."
The list looks pretty good. I will definitely look at that as a starting point. Thanks again!
4x- Bloodghast
3x- Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1x- Goblin Dark Dwellers
2x- Spellskite
4x- Lightning Bolt
4x- Inquisition of Kozilek
4x- Terminate
3x- Faithless Looting
2x- Kolaghan's Command
2x- Thoughtseize
1x- Duress
1x- Darkblast
1x- Murderous Cut
3x- Blood Moon
2x- Liliana of the Veil
3x- Bloodcrypt
1x- Godless Shrine
4x- Bloodstained Mire
4x- Polluted Delta
2x- Dragonskull Summit
7x- Swamp
2x- Mountain
------
2x- Pyroclasm
2x- Nihil Spellbomb
2x- Wear/ Tear
2x- Timely Reinforcements
2x- Kolagahn's Command
1x- Dreadbore
1x- Engineered Explosives
1x- Thundermaw Hellkite
1x- Slaughter Games
1x- Anger of the Gods
UMerfolk
WDeath and Taxes
BRBliztkrieg
GStompy
- - -
"Rock is overpowered. Paper is fine."
-Scissors