hey gang. I apologized to StevomatUWR awhile back via messager cuz i kinda called him out for no reason and acted like a complete douche. So just apologizing here just to clean the air. Now moving on...
This is my list! I've been getting deSTROYED online via xmage ( Ruthejc19 is my name, friend me! )
Ive been learning a lot about my playstlyle. I made a lot of misplays throughout this xmage journey. Heres my record... not a lot of wins to be warned... i have to get used to when to lean on pressure vs my counter magic. sometimes I realized I should have played my burn spell vs counter magic and sometimes vice/versa.
0-2 Cheerios (new puresteel paladin build)
2-0 Through the breach
1-2 Burn
1-2 R/W control (dont remember the record... its possible a 2-1)
0-2 Amulet Titan
0-2 Mill
1-2 U/W control (w/ sphinx's revelation)
Notes about the deck:
-I have never been able to cast Elspeth, every single time ive had it in my hand ive been stuck on lands. May drop her.
-I like Negate Mainboard
-I kinda want more spell pierce, it has been good.
-delver is great when it flips and is terrible when it doesnt lol
-there was only 1 game where i couldnt cast cryptic command (when i got to 4 mana)
-im thinking for the online thing i need to fix the manabase with another fetch and more basics + check lands like sulfur falls. its annoying when i get those fast lands on t4 lol
-i think geist has to go up to 4, just not seeing it enough to play it on curve.
-Vapor snag was in the place of path, and every single time... i absolutely hated it. so i dropped it for now lol
im getting my ass handed to me out here guys so anything you can say to help, i will greatly appreciate it lol will probably put sahili in the place of elsepth to test, or another geist. we will see!
*edit* went 1-0 against a bant exaulted deck (random casual player)
Got disconnected against infect but I would have 1-0'ed him. He had 1 card left iin hand with no infector on the field and i was about to slam geist and he was aat 12.
That's very big of you to apologize. It shows your a man of high character. I totally understand your original frustration. It's against the rules to talk about another topic inside of a forum topic. I typically let one or two posts slide without making a big deal out of it, especially if the person is talking about the jeskai prowess/tempo matchup against a certain deck. Even though you were warranted, it's very cool that you took the time to apologize if you felt like you went to far. I'm sure Stevo appreciated it. You two are both great members of our jeskai clan.
First, I do have to say those are some really strange and very tough matchups. I wouldn't really worry too much about Mill and Amulet Titan too much because they are such a small percentage of the meta. I'm pretty sure I have lost to mill every single time I have played against it. I have thought about running [c]Monastery Siege[/] in my sideboard for mill, burn, and 8-rack. However, I just don't play against those decks (except burn) often enough.
Titan breach, cheerios, and burn are also somewhat tough matchups, but definitely winnable. I think with a larger sample size of games against more prevalent decks your win percentage will be higher.
As for the deck, I am at a crossroad with a lot of the ideas I have seen. I have seen several decks with Cryptic Commands and Spell Quellers in the main deck which rely slightly more on counter magic. Because so many good players have come to this conclusion it can't be a bad idea. However, I personally think Bedlam Reveler is a must right now in a jeskai delver build. He single handily changes our matchup with grindy decks and makes our top end so much better. Cryptic Command is an amazing card and can buy tons of time, but buying time late in the game is really not what we are trying to do. On turn 6-8 (if the game goes that far) we are trying to end the game with burn/reach. I have also not been impressed with Spell Queller. Again, the card is great and flash is amazing in a instant speed deck, however he doesn't hit very hard and he is often held up to get maximum value and this too drags the game on longer than we would like.
I do like negate maindeck. We have a ton of answers for creatures so negate is great in our deck. However, I don't like Elsepth, Knight Errant. I have always felt like she is a win more card. I would rather have Chandra, Torch of Defiance at the top end because she can finish games we are ahead in and can get us back in games we are behind in. In addition, Vapor Snag fits much better in the more proactive/aggressive versions of the deck because the game is much shorter. I think you are correct in replacing a vapor snag or two with possibly Blessed Alliance and/or additional counter magic.
My love of Bedlam Reveler does come with some deck building restrictions. Much like Monastery Swiftspear, reveler makes us build the deck in with more proactive cards and limits our counter magic maindeck. He also basically calls for 6-8 cantrips to be extremely effective. The good news is that Reveler, swiftspear, and geist work very well together with the cantrips and proactive spells. After game one we can side into the more reactive deck if that is what the matchup calls for.
You can also go the other way around and keep the deck similar to what you have and then side into the more aggressive version if necessary. Bedlam Reveler can be in your sideboard for the grindy GBx matchups. All-in-all I think your deck construction looks just fine for the more tempo oriented version of the deck and it looks very similar to what some very great players have also come up with. I think you may have just had a bad run of matchups. I would suggest putting a bedlam reveler or two in the sideboard or giving the more proactive version a try. Here is my suggestion for your deck if you want to stick with tempo.
I know not much has changed, but the deck already looked pretty good as it was. I am not super practiced with this version, but I know Caleb Durward plays a very similar version of the deck and has some videos up that could really help.
Caleb is actually where i got my inspiration for the deck lol
Those are some great tips. I haven't seen queller enough to speak for it. Only about 3 games i have seen it lol
1 time it grabbed a timely summoner's pact,
2nd time it got a resto angel, 3rd time it got a burn spell i believe.
All ok, nothing great but a counter on a body isnt shabby, and with remand and stuff i dont mind holding the mana open most of the time.
My plays are getting better, and im getting more comfortable and familiar. Sometimes i just need to stream my thinking into,
"Am i the aggressor, or the control"? Then go from there.
I do wanna try ancestral in the sides though for all this control bs running around lol
The deck of the day on Channel Fireball today is jeskai aggro and is somewhat similar to your version. I really like his sideboard. the deck is very near midrange but has a low curve and plays a tempo game rather than control. Great Nate is a long time jeskai geist player and is really well versed in the "flash" style Geist decks. Maybe there is some inspiration there too.
I went to the top 8 of the last rptq with Jeskai aggro in montreal. The cfb deck is more on the lines of jeskai geists, but Geist feels great in this meta. I didn't have a lot of time to prepare for today's scg regional, but I'm basically going in with geists and spell quellers at the 3 slot instead of the all out mantis rider plan. I love how mutagenic growth In the Geist plan . There is something very true to being able to be aggressive/tempo/controlling all in the same game. I will report back with my list and results later.
I went to the top 8 of the last rptq with Jeskai aggro in montreal. The cfb deck is more on the lines of jeskai geists, but Geist feels great in this meta. I didn't have a lot of time to prepare for today's scg regional, but I'm basically going in with geists and spell quellers at the 3 slot instead of the all out mantis rider plan. I love how mutagenic growth In the Geist plan . There is something very true to being able to be aggressive/tempo/controlling all in the same game. I will report back with my list and results later.
That's awesome. Congrats on the great finish!
Best of luck in the tournament. I know I'm a bit late but wanted to wish you luck anyways. I can't wait to hear how it went.
Hi, after getting a negative record at FNM two times in a row I have decided to play without Monastery Swiftspears (I used 3-4) since they're always underperforming. I want to play a list that is bit more controlling. I still want to keep everything within CMC3 range, so no 4-drops. I also want to keep the creature count at 15 but I am not sure about the last creature(s). Please have a look:
Notes:
- I'd like to add Mana Leak but I don't know what to cut
- I have to splits: Pillar is Bolt no.5, Sleight is SV no.5
- I had to cut both Boros Charms because there is no space when I use more disruption
??? could be
2x Aven Mindcensor
Pros: Good against Tron & Scapeshift, which are tough match-ups, Cons: Only 2 dmg for 3 mana, dies to everything
2x Vendilion Clique
Pros: Good against combo & control, which are on the raise, Cons: UU cost, can be removed in response
2x Jötun Grunt
Pros: aggressive 4/4 body, good with Saheeli, awesome vs graveyard decks, Cons: Logic Knot would have to go, maybe Lavamancer too
2x Baral, Chief of Compliance
Pros: could be good when I also add 2 Mana Leaks, Cons: dies to Bolt, applies no pressure
2x Soltari Priest
Pros: hard to remove, can't be blocked in Modern :), Cons: WW cost (would switch Cavern for Eiganjo), 2 dmg/turn might not be enough
2x Thing in the Ice
Pros: can win a game on it's own, opponent needs to deal with it, Cons: nonbo with Geist
2x Kiln Fiend
Pros: kills quickly, Cons: dies even quicker...
1x Sygg, River Cutthroat
1x Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
Pros: lot's of card advantage, Cons: both are fragile and don't pressure the opponent immediatly
Please tell me what you think. Which option seems best to you?
Rd 1 vs Naya Allies (2-0)
Lifegain on my opponent's side was annoying, but Mentor and combat tricks stole the show.
Rd 2 vs Eldrazi (0-2)
Game 1: I couldn't get enough pressure before TKS and Smasher sealed the deal for my opponent
Game 2: EE on 0 with Mentor in my opening 6 (after a mulligan) wasn't ideal. Deflecting Palm on Ulamog almost got me there, but just couldn't find the Burn spell of the top.
Rd 3 vs Budget infect (2-1)
Gm 1: I get blown out by pump + counter backup
Gm 2: I have a hand with removal + countermagic, which I ride until I find a Delver that slowly gets me there
Gm 3: Spellskite + removal + countermagic makes me keep my hand. My opponent doesn't play removal, so Spellskite seals the deal
Rd 4 vs Esper Gifts (ID)
we played some games for fun, and he got me each game with timely removal.
Overall, I am hit and miss on peek. In some games, information can be crucial, but it is definitely not always a greet card. Didn't see Saheeli all night long, but I feel there was never a moment where I would have wanted her (Clique just seems better). I really like Mentor, but Aggro doesn't seem like the right shell for him. He can absolutely take games on his own, but more countermagic and a midrange seems more appropriate for him.
I had fun playing the deck, and feel that Ceremonius Rejection could be an option in the SB (I'll likely keep seeing Eldrazi/Tron at my LGS).
Thanks for the feedback I got from you all. I feel that some of the minor changes I made before playing definitely improved the deck.
Ebur0n- I think you are exactly right about Ceremonious Rejection. With Eldrazi and Tron gaining in meta share lately this is a great sideboard card especially for those who are in a meta with a lot of Tron/Eldrazi.
Do you side in Deflecting Palm against Eldrazi? I have found this strategy to be pretty good against them. I start by whittling down their life total with early aggresssion and then deflecting palm/Kari Zev's Expertise them with their own fatties. This strategy has been working very well for me and I wondered if you used a similar strategy post sideboard?
Also, without Bedlam Reveler as a target for saheeli, Vendilion Clique may just be better in your deck. In addition, you have a better GBx matchup than I do with jeskai charm and mentor and that's where Saheeli really shines for me. Therefore, you probably don't need her, especially not maindeck. Vendilion Clique may be a better main deck option.
StevoMat- I have seen a lot of people going that route in the new meta. Many people are going to the more "flash" oriented style deck as the meta slows down. Fatal Push does put a big dent in the viability of Monastery Swiftspear, but she is still our best secondary option at a one drop after delver. If you do want to go more controlling, you are correct that swiftspear would be the best card to cut.
Of all your suggestions I like Aven Mindcensor, Vendilion Clique, and Jace the best. Now it comes down to what to cut. I think Aven Mindscensor is highly underrated in a more controlling style deck. If he can stick they basically can't fetch lands after turn 3. In addition, the evasion makes him a decent attacker.
Like Ebur0n above, Saheeli may be better out of the sideboard for your deck. She really is only great if you can take advantage of her -2 ability with something like reveler, mentor, clique, snapcaster, etc. Since your only running snap as a great target she may not be great in the main deck. Unless you decide to run clique or mentor then she would be fine. You could try something like this:
Cut- Pillar of Flame, Saheeli Rai and Sleight of Hand/Emerge unscathed (since your not as aggro anymore)
Add- 2x Vendilion Clique, 2x Cryptic Command, 1x Echoing Truth/Detention Sphere (for additional removal and catch all). You could also use a Restoration Angel and clique.
If you want to keep the more prowess oriented style deck you could add two Monastery Mentor in the two slots and see how that works out.
Either option would be interesting to try. I like the more tempo oriented control decks right now. I think this is definitely a great way to adjust
I will be adding 2 Ceremonius Rejection to my SB. It can hit a lot of things (Eldrazi, Ugin/Karn, Artifacts).
I did bring in Deflecting Palm against Eldrazi, and used it on Ulamog. Unfortunately, I never got enough early pressure to take advantage of it. I may want to try Kari Zev's Expertise too.
I agree that Saheeli doesn't make much sense for me. I'd rather have the extra creature.
I will be adding 2 Ceremonius Rejection to my SB. It can hit a lot of things (Eldrazi, Ugin/Karn, Artifacts).
Hi, if you ask me 2 is too much. I think 1 Ceremonius Rejection is great in a package with 2 Stony Silence. You board these 3 cards in against Tron and Affinity (plus Wear/Tear vs Affinity) and you could also use these 3 cards against Ad Nauseum to stop Lotus Bloom. Ceremonius Rejection against Karn and Cranial Plating saved me more than once.
I don't see it that strong vs Eldrazi decks since they use Cavern. You could try to use a split of 1 Ceremonius Rejection & 1 Disdainful Stroke just to have an answer to more different decks. Both are good against Tron and Eldrazi (without Cavern) but Disdainful Stroke can also be used against Scapeshift and other ramp decks. You can also use it against Control decks but Dispel might be better there.
Hello fellow Jeskai players. Decided to go back to this style of deck as it's always been a good choice for my play style and performed well for me. Played in the SCG Modern Regional this past weekend in Columbus, OH. Event capped at 250 players, setting us up for 9 rounds of Modern goodness. Here's what I sleeved up, based on many of the decks listed here:
A couple of comments on the build of the deck...the MD is pretty much the same one as Cronax posted a while back, so the credit goes to him for the MD. The SB is a bit more me as I've always had a pet fascination with dropping Scepters on the table and watching my opponents eyes bug out when they realize what's about to happen to them...happened 3-4 times this past weekend and had many players talking about the great call for the deck, so I'm sticking with it. A couple of things I didn't like about the deck....and this is all with no play testing going into the tournament:
- Slip Through Space under performed the entire day. Sided it out almost every match. I think this should be Peak or Sleight of Handinstead.
- The Dissolve in the SB should likely be Negate, Dispel, Ceremonious Rejection
- Stony Silence was a mistake on my part for dropping at the last second for no good reason.
- Silence, while cute to think of getting someone on a Silence lock, never happened and took up equally valuable SB slots, should have just been 1.
Anyway, on to the report. I
ll provide detail where I can, but didn't take great notes:
Rd 1 - vs Elves: 1-0 (2-1 games)
He blows me out game 1 with Elves and the 'shock' Druid. Wishing I had left Anger of the Godsin the SB. Game 2 is more my style, landing a T1 Delver, T2 Swiftspear and Bolting his Elf, and cruised to the win. Game 3 was a bit more of a slug fest, with me winning while sitting on 2 life and burning him out from 10.
Rd 2 - vs Jund: 1-1 (1-2 games)
Slug fest game one, with him as low as 7 at one point, but he bounced back with lifegain to end at 10 while beating me down slowly. Game 2 he faces down a Scepter on Path and a Scepter on Deflecting Palm and I cruise to the win. Game 3 my removal was no where to be fond and I was run over by Tasigur and friends.
Rd 3 - vs Bushwacker RG 2-1 (2-1 games)
He does some quick damage, but bolts and paths do their thing and Delver and friends take him down in nice chunks. Game 2 my life total goes 20-18-16-8-6-0 while he stays at 14...I think I was trying to burn out his creatures, but they just came too fast. Game 3 I get a Scepter on Healix and end the game at 26 while he dies pretty quickly.
Rd 4 - vs MonoU Tron 3-1 (2-1 games)
We both mulligan and he scoops quickly with a T1 Delver, T2 Delver, both flip on T3 with a Swiftspear and Bolt for good measure. I get a slow start in game 2 and he's able to accelerate into all the viscous stuff that Tron does. Game 3 he floods on land and I'm able to beat him down over 6 turns chipping away with Swiftspears and burn spells, holding back counter magic for anything big he may draw.
Rd 5 - vs Bg Tron 3-2 (0-2 games)
This wasn't even close...he curved perfectly, with Fatal Push doing some heavy lifting for him...he made T8 with the deck, so it has the juice in the current meta.
Rd 6 - vs Jeskai Control 4-2 (2-1)
Nice guy, though he complained of getting mana flooded game 3 and loosing because of it. We tossed removal spells like they were going out of style at each other, with a Geist finally sticking on my side and doing the final chunk of damage G1. He was able to win game 2 with both of us sitting on bolt-snap-bolt to finish the game, his connected first to take me out. G3 was a bit of a slugfest, but Helix kept my life total above 18 and I was able to whittle him down.
Rd 7 - vs Grixis Delver 5-2 (2-0)
My first 2-0 win of the day...Geist did great work both games and I ended both games at 14-15 life.
Rd 8 - vs Grixis Delver 6-2 (2-0)
Pretty much a repeat. Helix and Geist are really good in this match-up. Burned him out from 10 on Game 1, Delvers and burn spells did the trick in game 2.
Rd 9 - vs Affinity 6-3 (0-2)
I was ranked 11 going into this round and my opponent was 12...we watched the top tables draw in so we were basically playing for the cash difference of T16 vs T32 ($50 difference). Game 1 he drops 6 cards on the table T1 and I'm not long for the world as I had a good creature aggressive hand for a fair deck, but no removal to slow him down. Game 2 was similar and we traded beats. I tried to swing the game in my favor with a Deflecting Palm on a Plated up critter, but he sacked the Plating in response and only took 2 instead of 9...bought me a turn or two, but he found another and crashed in for the win.
No complaints at all and I'll keep this one sleeved up for awhile. Comments welcome.
Hello fellow Jeskai players. Decided to go back to this style of deck as it's always been a good choice for my play style and performed well for me. Played in the SCG Modern Regional this past weekend in Columbus, OH. Event capped at 250 players, setting us up for 9 rounds of Modern goodness. Here's what I sleeved up, based on many of the decks listed here:
A couple of comments on the build of the deck...the MD is pretty much the same one as Cronax posted a while back, so the credit goes to him for the MD. The SB is a bit more me as I've always had a pet fascination with dropping Scepters on the table and watching my opponents eyes bug out when they realize what's about to happen to them...happened 3-4 times this past weekend and had many players talking about the great call for the deck, so I'm sticking with it. A couple of things I didn't like about the deck....and this is all with no play testing going into the tournament:
- Slip Through Space under performed the entire day. Sided it out almost every match. I think this should be Peak or Sleight of Handinstead.
- The Dissolve in the SB should likely be Negate, Dispel, Ceremonious Rejection
- Stony Silence was a mistake on my part for dropping at the last second for no good reason.
- Silence, while cute to think of getting someone on a Silence lock, never happened and took up equally valuable SB slots, should have just been 1.
Anyway, on to the report. I
ll provide detail where I can, but didn't take great notes:
Rd 1 - vs Elves: 1-0 (2-1 games)
He blows me out game 1 with Elves and the 'shock' Druid. Wishing I had left Anger of the Godsin the SB. Game 2 is more my style, landing a T1 Delver, T2 Swiftspear and Bolting his Elf, and cruised to the win. Game 3 was a bit more of a slug fest, with me winning while sitting on 2 life and burning him out from 10.
Rd 2 - vs Jund: 1-1 (1-2 games)
Slug fest game one, with him as low as 7 at one point, but he bounced back with lifegain to end at 10 while beating me down slowly. Game 2 he faces down a Scepter on Path and a Scepter on Deflecting Palm and I cruise to the win. Game 3 my removal was no where to be fond and I was run over by Tasigur and friends.
Rd 3 - vs Bushwacker RG 2-1 (2-1 games)
He does some quick damage, but bolts and paths do their thing and Delver and friends take him down in nice chunks. Game 2 my life total goes 20-18-16-8-6-0 while he stays at 14...I think I was trying to burn out his creatures, but they just came too fast. Game 3 I get a Scepter on Healix and end the game at 26 while he dies pretty quickly.
Rd 4 - vs MonoU Tron 3-1 (2-1 games)
We both mulligan and he scoops quickly with a T1 Delver, T2 Delver, both flip on T3 with a Swiftspear and Bolt for good measure. I get a slow start in game 2 and he's able to accelerate into all the viscous stuff that Tron does. Game 3 he floods on land and I'm able to beat him down over 6 turns chipping away with Swiftspears and burn spells, holding back counter magic for anything big he may draw.
Rd 5 - vs Bg Tron 3-2 (0-2 games)
This wasn't even close...he curved perfectly, with Fatal Push doing some heavy lifting for him...he made T8 with the deck, so it has the juice in the current meta.
Rd 6 - vs Jeskai Control 4-2 (2-1)
Nice guy, though he complained of getting mana flooded game 3 and loosing because of it. We tossed removal spells like they were going out of style at each other, with a Geist finally sticking on my side and doing the final chunk of damage G1. He was able to win game 2 with both of us sitting on bolt-snap-bolt to finish the game, his connected first to take me out. G3 was a bit of a slugfest, but Helix kept my life total above 18 and I was able to whittle him down.
Rd 7 - vs Grixis Delver 5-2 (2-0)
My first 2-0 win of the day...Geist did great work both games and I ended both games at 14-15 life.
Rd 8 - vs Grixis Delver 6-2 (2-0)
Pretty much a repeat. Helix and Geist are really good in this match-up. Burned him out from 10 on Game 1, Delvers and burn spells did the trick in game 2.
Rd 9 - vs Affinity 6-3 (0-2)
I was ranked 11 going into this round and my opponent was 12...we watched the top tables draw in so we were basically playing for the cash difference of T16 vs T32 ($50 difference). Game 1 he drops 6 cards on the table T1 and I'm not long for the world as I had a good creature aggressive hand for a fair deck, but no removal to slow him down. Game 2 was similar and we traded beats. I tried to swing the game in my favor with a Deflecting Palm on a Plated up critter, but he sacked the Plating in response and only took 2 instead of 9...bought me a turn or two, but he found another and crashed in for the win.
No complaints at all and I'll keep this one sleeved up for awhile. Comments welcome.
Hi Mvilla888 and welcome to the board! Thanks for the awesome tournament write up. After reading through it, it doesn't appear there is much you could have done about some of the games you lost. Sometimes Tron just turn 3 trons both games and there isn't much any deck can do about it. Affinity can also have these types of hands as well. You beat all of the matchups that you are even or favored against (except affinity) and even beat Mono U tron which can be very tough. Well done.
As for the deck, I think it looks great. Someone else in the past also liked sceptor, but I can't remember who it was. I haven't seen them in a while, but in the new slower meta they could be a great sideboard option. Against jund/abzan they are probably amazing. Since you side in the sceptor you are likely correct that you may not need the slip through spaces. They are more for the matchups where you want to finish the opponent off quickly or matchups where geist is bad like GBx. If you have a package in your sideboard that allows near infinite burn/removal you may not need them. Its a pet card of mine so I love them in the deck, but it really comes down to personal play style. You never want to draw a card that makes you feel badly about drawing it. I do like the Sleight of Hand because they smooth out game one and can easily be replaced in games 2 and 3 without really harming the deck's plan.
I love the inclusion of Aven Mindscensor too. Super underrated and great against some of our worst matchups.
Very cool list and thanks again for posting. Keep us posted on how the deck evolves and how you do.
Mazeron your deck is awesome. It had to take forever to find all those japanese(?) and other foreign cards. Those are tougher to come by than foils most of the time. You can safely say you have a one of a kind deck. I just love "pimping" out my deck. Since I play almost zero standard, I spend most of my magic funds on my personal modern deck. People know you're well versed with a deck when you're playing alters/foils/foreign cards/etc. Thanks for sharing the pictures. I may be wierd but I love seeing the pics of people's decks even if they aren't pimped out. Happy hunting for the foils etc in the future. That's part of the fun of magic for me. I love playing the game but I also love the collecting part too.
CrudBros & Mazereon, thanks for your feedback! Mazereon, our decks really look very similar now. I would definately run 20 lands in your deck but 19 somehow seem to work for you. How often do you have to mulligan?
I am testing different builds on Xmage right now. Tomorrow I can test at FNM but I don't have the Cliques yet. (had one before but I sold it over a year ago) If the online testing continues going well with 2 Cliques I'll order them. Thankfully they're not that expensive anymore. I like that I can set the Cavern to Wizards then, playing 11 Wizards in total
Tomorrow I might try 21 lands with an added Eiganjo Castle and run 4 Geists and 1 Resto Angel. Let's see how that goes...
Thanks for the feedback on my deck, I really appreciate it!
@Curdbros:
Actually I have no problem getting a hold of those japanese and chinese cards. I am buying 90% of my cards online on a trading/selling website called magiccardmarket and if I want a specific card I just look for it online.
@DPS:
The playmat is so sweet! I just got it a few weeks ago and being able to flip it alongside my delvers is awesome, at least when I am testing with my friends, in FNMs and tournaments not so much.
@Stevomat:
I don't really run into manaproblems that often, with the spell snares my curve is actually very low and I only have chandra as my 4cmc card. The deck functions best on 4 lands in my opinion but with the right cards 3 are perfectly fine and even 2 are doable sometimes, I rarely keep one-lander hands but with 2 lands it is must likely a keeper.
I got to test against grixis delver, jund and Eldrazi aggro last night and I was pretty impressed by some cards and some didn't do that much.
Spell snare did really well, except for 1 game against jund and against eldrazi it didn't really do anything, but most counters arent doing much against this deck.
Clique was doing some serious work as well and I was happy everytime I drew it, against jund it got rid of a LotV and against Eldrazi it did hit a smasher (those are the most notable ones). And the clock it presents can't be disregarded as well.
I really liked lavamancer against grixis delver, dealing with every creature except for angler and tasigur, but making them boltable.
The cards that kind of underperformed were the 2 boros charms, drawing one seems fine, but the second one always felt clunky. I did draw both of them a number of times and most of the time I wanted it to be some kind of threat or another kind of interaction.
So I think I will try to fit another threat in there, I don't want to play 4 geists as multiple aren't really what I want to draw most of the time, maybe I am going to try Sygg or 1 copy of resto angel. Are there any Threats, except for spell queller that I could try as well, thoughts?
Ah chandra did really well as well, she did some serious work in a game against Eldrazi dealing about 8 dmg over the course of the game.
And vapor snag stole a game against jund with him getting down to 1 from his own Bob and my burn. He wouldn't have died on his upkeep as he would have drawn a land with Bob.
Thanks for the play notes Mazeron. Several people have been extolling the power of Vendilion Clique lately. I have a feeling you guys are all on to something that works extremely well in the new meta. I'm going to see if I can squeeze one or two V.Cliques in for testing.
As you probably know because your one of the long term members of this forum topic, I have always recommended 2 or less Boros Charms. I used to play 2 and at one point tried 3, but it is just not a card that is good in multiples. It's a great effect one time in a game where the 4 damage is needed or kills a planeswalker, or when you can save an attacker/blocker/or protect your whole team from a sweeper, but it's not that useful all the time. I had two in my deck when I was running Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest (more for fun) because the double strike worked sometimes, but I will probably keep Boros Charm as a one of indefinitely, especially given that we have so many other burn spells at our disposal.
Spell Snare is one I am always up and down on. Some people love it and have to have 4 like Ryan Overturf and some people hate it. I'm closer to the hate side. It is one of those cards that is amazing in some matchups and almost dead in others. I always end up having multiple copies in my hand. With that said, it seems to be really really well positioned right now. Spell snare is great against jund, burn, affinity, grixis delver and is suprisingly good against combo decks like cheerios and goryo's vengeance. It's also good against snapcaster decks. I prefer spell pierce, but I can't fault anyone for running a couple of snare's right now.
I have my Tuesday night play notes to post and will do that when I get back from dinner. I will also try to think of some threats for your deck.
Game 1- This was a friend of mine who actually borrowed most of the deck from me. I was on the play and landed a turn one Delver that flipped on turn two. I think the player was fairly inexperienced with the deck or wasn't aware what I was playing because he played a turn two puresteel paladin to try to draw cards, but I helixed his paladin after he cast a one saw. He landed a Sram later in the game that was pathed and he didn't do much else and I was able to finish him off over a couple of turns.
Game 2- This game showed the power of the deck. He played a turn two sram and drew a couple of cards and then turn three he cast retract and basically went off. I think I played a serum visions and a swiftspear, but I really could have just passed the turns because he ran over me.
Game 3- I had a hand full of removal and a Geist so I kept. He had to mull to 5. In addition, I also drew stony silence which worked out very well. He again played a threat, but this time it was Sram and he had played silence before playing Sram. He was able to draw a couple of cards, but they were mox opal and a land. I was able to remove Sram and had a stony silence on board. He was basically out of cards so the game ended rather unceremoniously.
Takeaway- I think this is the reason we haven't seen too many results posted with this deck in paper magic tournaments. I don't think it's a hard deck to play, but I think it's a very hard deck to play extremely well. It's god hands are neigh unbeatbale but it's average hands really have to be played at the perfect time because any push back from the opponent can really cause a major road bump. From the times I have seen it played it was retract or bust. Let me know if you have any experience against this deck and what you think.
Round 2- Bant Eldrazi
Game 1- It's my lucky night because I am on the play again. The play is super important in this matchup. I played an early army of threats with turn 1 delver, turn two delver and swiftspear. The delvers flipped on turn three to a lightning bolt. He was able to path both delvers but this gave me mana for a Geist. He was able to slow me down slightly a skyspawner and landed a reality smasher, but it was to little to late and I helixed him for lethal.
Game 2- This game was awesome. It was a much slower game. He started with a noble heirarch which I bolted. He then played a turn three thought-knot seer taking a snapcaster mage. I drew a path to exile off the top which probably saved my game. I was able to path the thought knot on his turn before he landed the displacer (which I helixed). He played another skyspawner which hit me a couple of times. I was basically drawing all removal/burn and lands. I was able to kill the skyspawner, but was flooding slightly. He then landed a reality smasher and hit me down to 5 life. I had to snap path the smasher ditching Geist or I would just die. We were both out of cars however this is a much better position for him. He drew a land and passed and I attacked with my snapcaster and played the serum visions I drew drawing another land and leaving Saheeli Rai on top. He drew another noble and played it and I drew Saheeli Rai. I copied the snapcaster and helixed his noble and got in for 4. He played a displacer. I drew a delver and scryed seeing a Bedlam Reveler on top. After playing and copying the bedlam reveler for infinite cards that was basically all she wrote.
Takeaway- This is a rare 2-0 for me. Bant Eldrazi can be a very tough matchup. For some reason this is probably the most played deck a lot of weeks (that and Jund) so I typically see this deck at least once. I have gotten fairly good at playing against it and I think my sideboard has a bit more hate for the deck than the average jeskai deck. The Lighting Helixs continued to be very good for me. I'm glad you all talked me into a third copy. In the second eldrazi game, the 6 life I gained was the only reason I was able to come back after getting down to 5 life. Also Bedlam Reveler continues to do a ton of work in the grindy midrange matchups. I don't know what I did without him. I have noticed that this deck has been on the decline lately. That's probably due to the increase in cheerios, goryo's vengeance, scapeshift, etc. We will see.
I'm quite fond of Spell Snare since Modern has so many juicy targets for it, but I don't want to play more than 2 mainboard as it's so situational. I agree that Vendilion Clique is probably what the deck needs. It's an evasive threat with an effect that makes it relevant later on. I'll be picking up 2 copies as soon as I free up some funds again, which might not be for a while since I have a move coming up...
Combined with 2-3 copies of Negate mainboard I think it will make the deck a lot stronger.
Boros Reckoner is probably too expensive for what it does. For removal, the decks I have trouble dealing with mainly use Path to Exile or some form of black removal like a destroy effect or a -n/-n effect.
Game 1- On the draw. Affinity is one of the decks I always love to see across the table. We have an excellent matchup against them. So it to the opponent no time at all to destroy me in game 1 :). We actually do have an excellent matchup against them, but when they play six cards on turn 1 and follow that up with a Cranial Plating there isn't much we can do. I was able to path his vault skirge that was equipped, but an equiped inkmoth a few turns later was able to finish me off with infect. I hate inkmoth nexus because it's basically a back up plan for these supper aggressive decks like affinity and infect. As soon as you have answered all their threats they attack you with the cheapest manland in all of magic (costs 1 to activate a 1/1 flier with infect!). But that is a topic for a later date.
Game 2- I was on the play this time. This game went more to plan. He was able to drop 4 permanents on turn one, but they were easily dealt with. I bolted a ornithopter and pathed his vaulte skirge and attacked with swiftspear. He we left with a land and springleaf drum. He showed me the he also had two more lands which made the path a good move (it wasn't the best idea at the time, but I wanted to be aggressive). So the path paid off lucky. I landed a Geist a turn later and drew wear/tear and shattering spree and the game was a fairly easy win. He did have some nice plays be sacrificing the cranial plating and master of etherium to an archound ravager when I destroyed them, but it wasn't enough.
Game 3- This game is why I can't play a deck that has extreme hate. I mulled to 5, but had a turn two Stony Silence. Luckily he had a somewhat slow start. He played turn 1 land springleaf drum go. I passed back and he landed the dreaded etched champion and I realized why he kept that hand. I have played against him before and he knew that etched champion is the worst card for me and I can't deal with it very easily. I played the stony silence and passed back. The stony silence did a ton of work. He drew two cranial plating and couldn't attach them and also was strained on mana with mox opal and springleaf drum. However, he was able to attack me down to 6 with the etched champion. I was able to deflecting palm one attack and two lightning helix put me back at a healthy total and I slowly chipped away with snapcaster mages and burn. In the end he was forced to block with the etched champion towards the end of the game and an arcbound ravager. A vault skirge was able to get some life back for him and a timely whipeflare cleared my board of 2/1's and 1/2's, but the game was really never in doubt because he was strained on mana and couldn't equip.
Takeaway- Like I said earlier, affinity is a matchup I am fairly confident in. We have tons of removal for their little guys and post board we have a ton of answers to the bigger problem cards. Etched Champion and inkmoth nexus are the problem cards for me typically. I used to have a spreading seas in the board for problem lands, but it has since been removed. The artifact destruction really helps when the activate inkmoth as well. Lightning helix did a surprising amount of work keeping my life total high enough to stay aggressive. I likely would have lost game three without them. In the end, if you can land an early stony silence you will probably win. I had the advantage of knowing stony was very good against this particular players list from playing them before, but it's extremely good against most affinity lists. If I have a borderline keepable hand post board I typically mulligan if I know I have silver bullets in my deck.
Round 4- GW Tron (kind of)
Game 1- I'm on the play again. It was getting late and my opponent couldn't stay so we just played one game with nothing on the line. He kept a with only one tron land and I kept a hand with delver and swiftspear. Delver flipped on turn three and he spent his first three turns looking for tron lands. I cast serum visions and sleight of hand looking for more burn to back up my swiftspear. Delver and swifspear put a huge dent in his life total. He pathed the delver and tried to land a karn which I remanded. He tried again the following turn to land karn which I unsubstaniated. He was able to top deck an oblivion stone, but I was able to draw enough burn to finish him off. It was an anti-climatic end to the night, but a good night none the less.
Takeaway- not much here. There are so many new versions of tron going around that I am not really sure where we stand. I was fairly happy with my GR Tron matchup and rarely ever see UW tron. I also haven't gotten to play much against the B version with fatal pushes yet, but I assume many of the tron players in the area with by trying it and I will play against it in my test group. There is a new Trondrazi list going around online that looks terrifying with Batterskulls and main deck Chalice of the Void and Spellskites. I haven't played against it yet, but I can only assume it's a terrible matchup. Has anyone played against it yet?
I will be testing with my group tonight and will play against some of the newer decks popping up like the traverse the uvenwald death shadow deck and the trondrazi deck and will let you know how that goes.
As for the boros reckoner topic, I haven't tested him before. In very grindy creature based matchups he could be a very solid sideboard card. I think he would be tough to maindeck because he is a three drop 3/3, but if a deck had enough tools to utilize his abilities he can be very strong. I would be interested to see how he would do against GBx decks. In addition, if you really wanted to make an entire package with him you could include some blasphemous act and go aggressive with one drops and just and go 13 to the opponent face.
It's been kind of quiet in here lately. Is everyone excited for modern weekend this weekend? I am.
I was able to play against the EldraziTron deck and I have to admit it really felt like the deck was not good at all. Maybe it had a bad run or the person playing it wasn't great at piloting it yet, but it often cast one or two things that were easy to deal with. I even beat a chalice of the void on 1 which he cast on turn two when he was on the play (flipped delver, helix, snapcaster, geist). The deck really relied on having a chalice of the void in play. Post board I felt heavily favored with Shattering Spree, Deflecting Palm, Kari Zev's Expertise, Wear // Tear, etc.
I also played against the new Death Shadow deck. It too felt a bit underwhelming. Again, it is definitely a deck that takes a lot of practice to really pilot well, but it felt helpless against a deck with a lot of burn like ours. I often just burnt them out when they got down to like 5-6 and just saved path, vapor snag, unsubstantiate for the big dummies. Again, deflecting palm makes this matchup really good. The only games I lost were the games when they drew 4-6 hand disruption spells and were able to remove my entire hand. They run a ton of those style cards.
Anyone else play against any cool matchups lately? I haven't had a chance to play against the Baral Storm deck yet, but it looks really cool.
I took advantage of a couple of sick days this week to dust off the deck on MTGO and get some games played. Started out 0-5 with it in a league as I was getting used to the interface and such...saw 3-4 games against Tron decks which is not an easy match to say the least. Once I finished fixing the SB from what I had started with, games have been much better, beating Affinity a couple of times, Through the Breach combo, Grixis Contol, etc. Tron still gives me problems, so I need to look into what can be done with that match-up with my deck. Peek has been good, but I think it needs to be something that interacts with the board or my opponents life total, possibly Electrolyze or Deflecting Palm. Scepter is still doing a ton of good work out of the SB, especially if I can hide it until G3. Any suggestions against Tron for the deck?
Sideboard into Infect? Sorry, Lol, I play midrange a lot so turn 1 urza land evokes a deep sigh from me. The most success I've had against Tron, midrange or tempo, is to interrupt their tutors as much as possible. Spell Pierce the Sylvan scrying, counter/destroy the map, Stony Silence or Leon arbitor (spicy, I know) on turn 2. Thing is, without pressure, they WILL come back eventually. Good news is, Jeskai is pretty good at pressure.
I replaced my basic Mountain with Shinka, which has been really good online in combination with Geist and Clique so far.
Basic Plains and Island will never get cut though since they're the only out against Blood Moon strategies. Cavern still works fine with 11 Wizards. Blessed Alliance is surprisingly good in the mainboard as hard removal no. 5 (next to my four Pathes) to deal with everything that I can't bolt.
I added Mana Leaks again to get rid of pesky cards for good instead of just remanding them and so far I like them a lot. I think the 50/50 split between Remands and Mana Leaks is the best solution for my deck which is not as aggressive as some other lists here.
The deck has a very high win percentage online and at FNM and runs really good against Abzan (beat Abzan 4 times in the last week with no losses). However, Titanshift is still the deck that is most troublesome. I can't find an efficient way to deal with both Scapeshift and Titans. Maybe I'll add Disdainful Stroke back to the sideboard for that match-up.
I replaced my basic Mountain with Shinka, which has been really good online in combination with Geist and Clique so far.
Basic Plains and Island will never get cut though since they're the only out against Blood Moon strategies. Cavern still works fine with 11 Wizards. Blessed Alliance is surprisingly good in the mainboard as hard removal no. 5 (next to my four Pathes) to deal with everything that I can't bolt.
I added Mana Leaks again to get rid of pesky cards for good instead of just remanding them and so far I like them a lot. I think the 50/50 split between Remands and Mana Leaks is the best solution for my deck which is not as aggressive as some other lists here.
The deck has a very high win percentage online and at FNM and runs really good against Abzan (beat Abzan 4 times in the last week with no losses). However, Titanshift is still the deck that is most troublesome. I can't find an efficient way to deal with both Scapeshift and Titans. Maybe I'll add Disdainful Stroke back to the sideboard for that match-up.
Very cool list. Let us know how it goes. Shinka is a really cool addition and looks really great in your deck.
Titanshift is a tough one. I typically go aggro/burn and try to get their life total low as quickly as possible and utilize deflecting palm to finish them off. It's just a really tough matchup but it can be beat. In modern, sometimes that is the best we can do.
On the tron topic from above, I think Twinacus is on it. Similar to titanshift, I try to kill them as quickly as possible and counter every early spell I can. I normally keep the remands for the big spells. Post board I have had a lot of success with Spreading Seas, Stony Silence, Molten Rain, Negate, and Deflecting Palm on their big fatties. I have also seen packages of molten rain/surgical extraction to get rid of tron, but that only seems necessary in the midrange decks with a ton of tron in their meta. The more midrange your deck gets, the harder the tron matchup gets. Like Twinacus said, the good news is that jeskai is a very aggressive color shard.
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That's very big of you to apologize. It shows your a man of high character. I totally understand your original frustration. It's against the rules to talk about another topic inside of a forum topic. I typically let one or two posts slide without making a big deal out of it, especially if the person is talking about the jeskai prowess/tempo matchup against a certain deck. Even though you were warranted, it's very cool that you took the time to apologize if you felt like you went to far. I'm sure Stevo appreciated it. You two are both great members of our jeskai clan.
First, I do have to say those are some really strange and very tough matchups. I wouldn't really worry too much about Mill and Amulet Titan too much because they are such a small percentage of the meta. I'm pretty sure I have lost to mill every single time I have played against it. I have thought about running [c]Monastery Siege[/] in my sideboard for mill, burn, and 8-rack. However, I just don't play against those decks (except burn) often enough.
Titan breach, cheerios, and burn are also somewhat tough matchups, but definitely winnable. I think with a larger sample size of games against more prevalent decks your win percentage will be higher.
As for the deck, I am at a crossroad with a lot of the ideas I have seen. I have seen several decks with Cryptic Commands and Spell Quellers in the main deck which rely slightly more on counter magic. Because so many good players have come to this conclusion it can't be a bad idea. However, I personally think Bedlam Reveler is a must right now in a jeskai delver build. He single handily changes our matchup with grindy decks and makes our top end so much better. Cryptic Command is an amazing card and can buy tons of time, but buying time late in the game is really not what we are trying to do. On turn 6-8 (if the game goes that far) we are trying to end the game with burn/reach. I have also not been impressed with Spell Queller. Again, the card is great and flash is amazing in a instant speed deck, however he doesn't hit very hard and he is often held up to get maximum value and this too drags the game on longer than we would like.
I do like negate maindeck. We have a ton of answers for creatures so negate is great in our deck. However, I don't like Elsepth, Knight Errant. I have always felt like she is a win more card. I would rather have Chandra, Torch of Defiance at the top end because she can finish games we are ahead in and can get us back in games we are behind in. In addition, Vapor Snag fits much better in the more proactive/aggressive versions of the deck because the game is much shorter. I think you are correct in replacing a vapor snag or two with possibly Blessed Alliance and/or additional counter magic.
My love of Bedlam Reveler does come with some deck building restrictions. Much like Monastery Swiftspear, reveler makes us build the deck in with more proactive cards and limits our counter magic maindeck. He also basically calls for 6-8 cantrips to be extremely effective. The good news is that Reveler, swiftspear, and geist work very well together with the cantrips and proactive spells. After game one we can side into the more reactive deck if that is what the matchup calls for.
You can also go the other way around and keep the deck similar to what you have and then side into the more aggressive version if necessary. Bedlam Reveler can be in your sideboard for the grindy GBx matchups. All-in-all I think your deck construction looks just fine for the more tempo oriented version of the deck and it looks very similar to what some very great players have also come up with. I think you may have just had a bad run of matchups. I would suggest putting a bedlam reveler or two in the sideboard or giving the more proactive version a try. Here is my suggestion for your deck if you want to stick with tempo.
4x Delver of Secrets
3x Geist of Saint Traft
3x Monastery Swiftspear
4x Snapcaster Mage
1x Spell Queller
1x Bedlam Reveler
Instant (19)
2x Cryptic Command
4x Lightning Bolt
4x Lightning Helix
1x Negate
3x Path to Exile
4x Remand
1x Spell Pierce
4x Serum Visions
2x Sleight of Hand
Land (20)
2x Arid Mesa
2x Flooded Strand
1x Hallowed Fountain
2x Inspiring Vantage
1x Island
1x Mountain
1x Celestial Colonnade
1x Plains
1x Sacred Foundry
3x Scalding Tarn
3x Spirebluff Canal
2x Steam Vents
2x Deflecting Palm
1x Dispel
1x Echoing Truth
1x Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1x Kari Zev's Expertise
1x Bedlam Reveler
1x Negate
1x Pithing Needle
1x Rest in Peace
1x Spell Pierce
2x Stony Silence
2x Wear / Tear
I know not much has changed, but the deck already looked pretty good as it was. I am not super practiced with this version, but I know Caleb Durward plays a very similar version of the deck and has some videos up that could really help.
Those are some great tips. I haven't seen queller enough to speak for it. Only about 3 games i have seen it lol
1 time it grabbed a timely summoner's pact,
2nd time it got a resto angel, 3rd time it got a burn spell i believe.
All ok, nothing great but a counter on a body isnt shabby, and with remand and stuff i dont mind holding the mana open most of the time.
My plays are getting better, and im getting more comfortable and familiar. Sometimes i just need to stream my thinking into,
"Am i the aggressor, or the control"? Then go from there.
I do wanna try ancestral in the sides though for all this control bs running around lol
Thanks you very much DarkNightCavalier for the Sig.
That's awesome. Congrats on the great finish!
Best of luck in the tournament. I know I'm a bit late but wanted to wish you luck anyways. I can't wait to hear how it went.
2x Arid Mesa
3x Flooded Strand
3x Scalding Tarn
1x Hallowed Fountain
1x Steam Vents
1x Sacred Foundry
1x Island
1x Mountain
1x Plains
1x Seachrome Coast
1x Spirebluff Canal
1x Inspiring Vantage
1x Wandering Fumarole
1x Clifftop Retreat
1x Cavern of Souls
Burn/Removal (12)
1x Electrolyze
1x Jeskai Charm
4x Lightning Bolt
1x Pillar of Flame
2x Lightning Helix
3x Path to Exile
2x Remand
4x Serum Visions
1x Sleight of Hand
1x Saheeli Rai
Protection/Disruption (5)
1x Negate
1x Logic Knot
2x Spell Pierce
1x Emerge Unscathed
Creature (15)
4x Delver of Secrets
4x Geist of Saint Traft
1x Grim Lavamancer
4x Snapcaster Mage
2x ???
1x Leyline of Sanctity
2x Surgical Extraction
1x Pithing Needle
1x Dispel
1x Ceremonious Rejection
2x Stony Silence
1x Wear///Tear
1x Blessed Alliance
1x Celestial Purge
1x Deflecting Palm
1x Stone Rain
1x Anger of the Gods
1x Sulfur Elemental
Notes:
- I'd like to add Mana Leak but I don't know what to cut
- I have to splits: Pillar is Bolt no.5, Sleight is SV no.5
- I had to cut both Boros Charms because there is no space when I use more disruption
??? could be
2x Aven Mindcensor
Pros: Good against Tron & Scapeshift, which are tough match-ups, Cons: Only 2 dmg for 3 mana, dies to everything
2x Vendilion Clique
Pros: Good against combo & control, which are on the raise, Cons: UU cost, can be removed in response
2x Jötun Grunt
Pros: aggressive 4/4 body, good with Saheeli, awesome vs graveyard decks, Cons: Logic Knot would have to go, maybe Lavamancer too
2x Baral, Chief of Compliance
Pros: could be good when I also add 2 Mana Leaks, Cons: dies to Bolt, applies no pressure
2x Soltari Priest
Pros: hard to remove, can't be blocked in Modern :), Cons: WW cost (would switch Cavern for Eiganjo), 2 dmg/turn might not be enough
2x Thing in the Ice
Pros: can win a game on it's own, opponent needs to deal with it, Cons: nonbo with Geist
2x Kiln Fiend
Pros: kills quickly, Cons: dies even quicker...
1x Sygg, River Cutthroat
1x Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
Pros: lot's of card advantage, Cons: both are fragile and don't pressure the opponent immediatly
Please tell me what you think. Which option seems best to you?
4 delver of secrets
4 snapcaster mage
4 Monastery Swiftspear
3 Monastery Mentor
Sorceries:
4 serum visions
Instants:
4 lightning bolt
4 lightning helix
2 boros charm
2 vapor snag
2 jeskai Charm
4 Peek
2 Mutagenic Growth
2 Path to Exile
1 Saheeli Rai
Lands:
1 scalding tarn
1 Arid Mesa
4 flooded strand
1 Steam vents
1 sacred foundry
1 hallowed fountain
4 spirebluff canal
1 Inspiring Vantage
1 seachrome coast
2 island
1 mountain
1 plains
3 Deflecting Palm
2 Rending Volley
2 wear//tear
2 negate
2 Spell Pierce
2 Spellskite
1 Swerve
1 Vendilion Clique
Went 2-1-1
Rd 1 vs Naya Allies (2-0)
Lifegain on my opponent's side was annoying, but Mentor and combat tricks stole the show.
Rd 2 vs Eldrazi (0-2)
Game 1: I couldn't get enough pressure before TKS and Smasher sealed the deal for my opponent
Game 2: EE on 0 with Mentor in my opening 6 (after a mulligan) wasn't ideal. Deflecting Palm on Ulamog almost got me there, but just couldn't find the Burn spell of the top.
Rd 3 vs Budget infect (2-1)
Gm 1: I get blown out by pump + counter backup
Gm 2: I have a hand with removal + countermagic, which I ride until I find a Delver that slowly gets me there
Gm 3: Spellskite + removal + countermagic makes me keep my hand. My opponent doesn't play removal, so Spellskite seals the deal
Rd 4 vs Esper Gifts (ID)
we played some games for fun, and he got me each game with timely removal.
Overall, I am hit and miss on peek. In some games, information can be crucial, but it is definitely not always a greet card. Didn't see Saheeli all night long, but I feel there was never a moment where I would have wanted her (Clique just seems better). I really like Mentor, but Aggro doesn't seem like the right shell for him. He can absolutely take games on his own, but more countermagic and a midrange seems more appropriate for him.
I had fun playing the deck, and feel that Ceremonius Rejection could be an option in the SB (I'll likely keep seeing Eldrazi/Tron at my LGS).
Thanks for the feedback I got from you all. I feel that some of the minor changes I made before playing definitely improved the deck.
Do you side in Deflecting Palm against Eldrazi? I have found this strategy to be pretty good against them. I start by whittling down their life total with early aggresssion and then deflecting palm/Kari Zev's Expertise them with their own fatties. This strategy has been working very well for me and I wondered if you used a similar strategy post sideboard?
Also, without Bedlam Reveler as a target for saheeli, Vendilion Clique may just be better in your deck. In addition, you have a better GBx matchup than I do with jeskai charm and mentor and that's where Saheeli really shines for me. Therefore, you probably don't need her, especially not maindeck. Vendilion Clique may be a better main deck option.
StevoMat- I have seen a lot of people going that route in the new meta. Many people are going to the more "flash" oriented style deck as the meta slows down. Fatal Push does put a big dent in the viability of Monastery Swiftspear, but she is still our best secondary option at a one drop after delver. If you do want to go more controlling, you are correct that swiftspear would be the best card to cut.
Of all your suggestions I like Aven Mindcensor, Vendilion Clique, and Jace the best. Now it comes down to what to cut. I think Aven Mindscensor is highly underrated in a more controlling style deck. If he can stick they basically can't fetch lands after turn 3. In addition, the evasion makes him a decent attacker.
Like Ebur0n above, Saheeli may be better out of the sideboard for your deck. She really is only great if you can take advantage of her -2 ability with something like reveler, mentor, clique, snapcaster, etc. Since your only running snap as a great target she may not be great in the main deck. Unless you decide to run clique or mentor then she would be fine. You could try something like this:
Cut- Pillar of Flame, Saheeli Rai and Sleight of Hand/Emerge unscathed (since your not as aggro anymore)
Add- 2x Vendilion Clique, 2x Cryptic Command, 1x Echoing Truth/Detention Sphere (for additional removal and catch all). You could also use a Restoration Angel and clique.
If you want to keep the more prowess oriented style deck you could add two Monastery Mentor in the two slots and see how that works out.
Either option would be interesting to try. I like the more tempo oriented control decks right now. I think this is definitely a great way to adjust
I did bring in Deflecting Palm against Eldrazi, and used it on Ulamog. Unfortunately, I never got enough early pressure to take advantage of it. I may want to try Kari Zev's Expertise too.
I agree that Saheeli doesn't make much sense for me. I'd rather have the extra creature.
Hi, if you ask me 2 is too much. I think 1 Ceremonius Rejection is great in a package with 2 Stony Silence. You board these 3 cards in against Tron and Affinity (plus Wear/Tear vs Affinity) and you could also use these 3 cards against Ad Nauseum to stop Lotus Bloom. Ceremonius Rejection against Karn and Cranial Plating saved me more than once.
I don't see it that strong vs Eldrazi decks since they use Cavern. You could try to use a split of 1 Ceremonius Rejection & 1 Disdainful Stroke just to have an answer to more different decks. Both are good against Tron and Eldrazi (without Cavern) but Disdainful Stroke can also be used against Scapeshift and other ramp decks. You can also use it against Control decks but Dispel might be better there.
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
3 Geist of Saint Traft
Spells
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lightning Helix
4 Path to Exile
4 Serum Visions
3 Remand
2 Boros Charm
2 Mana Leak
2 Vapor Snag
2 Slip Through Space
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Arid Mesa
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Hallowed Fountain
2 Steam Vents
3 Spirebluff Canal
1 Seachrome Coast
1 Mountain
1 Island
1 Plains
3 Deflecting Palm
2 Dispel
1 Wear // Tear
2 Dissolve
2 Silence
3 Isochron Scepter
2 Aven Mindcensor
A couple of comments on the build of the deck...the MD is pretty much the same one as Cronax posted a while back, so the credit goes to him for the MD. The SB is a bit more me as I've always had a pet fascination with dropping Scepters on the table and watching my opponents eyes bug out when they realize what's about to happen to them...happened 3-4 times this past weekend and had many players talking about the great call for the deck, so I'm sticking with it. A couple of things I didn't like about the deck....and this is all with no play testing going into the tournament:
- Slip Through Space under performed the entire day. Sided it out almost every match. I think this should be Peak or Sleight of Handinstead.
- The Dissolve in the SB should likely be Negate, Dispel, Ceremonious Rejection
- Stony Silence was a mistake on my part for dropping at the last second for no good reason.
- Silence, while cute to think of getting someone on a Silence lock, never happened and took up equally valuable SB slots, should have just been 1.
Anyway, on to the report. I
ll provide detail where I can, but didn't take great notes:
Rd 1 - vs Elves: 1-0 (2-1 games)
He blows me out game 1 with Elves and the 'shock' Druid. Wishing I had left Anger of the Godsin the SB. Game 2 is more my style, landing a T1 Delver, T2 Swiftspear and Bolting his Elf, and cruised to the win. Game 3 was a bit more of a slug fest, with me winning while sitting on 2 life and burning him out from 10.
Rd 2 - vs Jund: 1-1 (1-2 games)
Slug fest game one, with him as low as 7 at one point, but he bounced back with lifegain to end at 10 while beating me down slowly. Game 2 he faces down a Scepter on Path and a Scepter on Deflecting Palm and I cruise to the win. Game 3 my removal was no where to be fond and I was run over by Tasigur and friends.
Rd 3 - vs Bushwacker RG 2-1 (2-1 games)
He does some quick damage, but bolts and paths do their thing and Delver and friends take him down in nice chunks. Game 2 my life total goes 20-18-16-8-6-0 while he stays at 14...I think I was trying to burn out his creatures, but they just came too fast. Game 3 I get a Scepter on Healix and end the game at 26 while he dies pretty quickly.
Rd 4 - vs MonoU Tron 3-1 (2-1 games)
We both mulligan and he scoops quickly with a T1 Delver, T2 Delver, both flip on T3 with a Swiftspear and Bolt for good measure. I get a slow start in game 2 and he's able to accelerate into all the viscous stuff that Tron does. Game 3 he floods on land and I'm able to beat him down over 6 turns chipping away with Swiftspears and burn spells, holding back counter magic for anything big he may draw.
Rd 5 - vs Bg Tron 3-2 (0-2 games)
This wasn't even close...he curved perfectly, with Fatal Push doing some heavy lifting for him...he made T8 with the deck, so it has the juice in the current meta.
Rd 6 - vs Jeskai Control 4-2 (2-1)
Nice guy, though he complained of getting mana flooded game 3 and loosing because of it. We tossed removal spells like they were going out of style at each other, with a Geist finally sticking on my side and doing the final chunk of damage G1. He was able to win game 2 with both of us sitting on bolt-snap-bolt to finish the game, his connected first to take me out. G3 was a bit of a slugfest, but Helix kept my life total above 18 and I was able to whittle him down.
Rd 7 - vs Grixis Delver 5-2 (2-0)
My first 2-0 win of the day...Geist did great work both games and I ended both games at 14-15 life.
Rd 8 - vs Grixis Delver 6-2 (2-0)
Pretty much a repeat. Helix and Geist are really good in this match-up. Burned him out from 10 on Game 1, Delvers and burn spells did the trick in game 2.
Rd 9 - vs Affinity 6-3 (0-2)
I was ranked 11 going into this round and my opponent was 12...we watched the top tables draw in so we were basically playing for the cash difference of T16 vs T32 ($50 difference). Game 1 he drops 6 cards on the table T1 and I'm not long for the world as I had a good creature aggressive hand for a fair deck, but no removal to slow him down. Game 2 was similar and we traded beats. I tried to swing the game in my favor with a Deflecting Palm on a Plated up critter, but he sacked the Plating in response and only took 2 instead of 9...bought me a turn or two, but he found another and crashed in for the win.
No complaints at all and I'll keep this one sleeved up for awhile. Comments welcome.
Hi Mvilla888 and welcome to the board! Thanks for the awesome tournament write up. After reading through it, it doesn't appear there is much you could have done about some of the games you lost. Sometimes Tron just turn 3 trons both games and there isn't much any deck can do about it. Affinity can also have these types of hands as well. You beat all of the matchups that you are even or favored against (except affinity) and even beat Mono U tron which can be very tough. Well done.
As for the deck, I think it looks great. Someone else in the past also liked sceptor, but I can't remember who it was. I haven't seen them in a while, but in the new slower meta they could be a great sideboard option. Against jund/abzan they are probably amazing. Since you side in the sceptor you are likely correct that you may not need the slip through spaces. They are more for the matchups where you want to finish the opponent off quickly or matchups where geist is bad like GBx. If you have a package in your sideboard that allows near infinite burn/removal you may not need them. Its a pet card of mine so I love them in the deck, but it really comes down to personal play style. You never want to draw a card that makes you feel badly about drawing it. I do like the Sleight of Hand because they smooth out game one and can easily be replaced in games 2 and 3 without really harming the deck's plan.
I love the inclusion of Aven Mindscensor too. Super underrated and great against some of our worst matchups.
Very cool list and thanks again for posting. Keep us posted on how the deck evolves and how you do.
Your playmat is awesome too!
Active thread contributor of Jeskai Prowess Tempo
I am testing different builds on Xmage right now. Tomorrow I can test at FNM but I don't have the Cliques yet. (had one before but I sold it over a year ago) If the online testing continues going well with 2 Cliques I'll order them. Thankfully they're not that expensive anymore. I like that I can set the Cavern to Wizards then, playing 11 Wizards in total
Tomorrow I might try 21 lands with an added Eiganjo Castle and run 4 Geists and 1 Resto Angel. Let's see how that goes...
Thanks for the play notes Mazeron. Several people have been extolling the power of Vendilion Clique lately. I have a feeling you guys are all on to something that works extremely well in the new meta. I'm going to see if I can squeeze one or two V.Cliques in for testing.
As you probably know because your one of the long term members of this forum topic, I have always recommended 2 or less Boros Charms. I used to play 2 and at one point tried 3, but it is just not a card that is good in multiples. It's a great effect one time in a game where the 4 damage is needed or kills a planeswalker, or when you can save an attacker/blocker/or protect your whole team from a sweeper, but it's not that useful all the time. I had two in my deck when I was running Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest (more for fun) because the double strike worked sometimes, but I will probably keep Boros Charm as a one of indefinitely, especially given that we have so many other burn spells at our disposal.
Spell Snare is one I am always up and down on. Some people love it and have to have 4 like Ryan Overturf and some people hate it. I'm closer to the hate side. It is one of those cards that is amazing in some matchups and almost dead in others. I always end up having multiple copies in my hand. With that said, it seems to be really really well positioned right now. Spell snare is great against jund, burn, affinity, grixis delver and is suprisingly good against combo decks like cheerios and goryo's vengeance. It's also good against snapcaster decks. I prefer spell pierce, but I can't fault anyone for running a couple of snare's right now.
I have my Tuesday night play notes to post and will do that when I get back from dinner. I will also try to think of some threats for your deck.
Round 1- Cheerios (the new hotness)
Game 1- This was a friend of mine who actually borrowed most of the deck from me. I was on the play and landed a turn one Delver that flipped on turn two. I think the player was fairly inexperienced with the deck or wasn't aware what I was playing because he played a turn two puresteel paladin to try to draw cards, but I helixed his paladin after he cast a one saw. He landed a Sram later in the game that was pathed and he didn't do much else and I was able to finish him off over a couple of turns.
Game 2- This game showed the power of the deck. He played a turn two sram and drew a couple of cards and then turn three he cast retract and basically went off. I think I played a serum visions and a swiftspear, but I really could have just passed the turns because he ran over me.
Game 3- I had a hand full of removal and a Geist so I kept. He had to mull to 5. In addition, I also drew stony silence which worked out very well. He again played a threat, but this time it was Sram and he had played silence before playing Sram. He was able to draw a couple of cards, but they were mox opal and a land. I was able to remove Sram and had a stony silence on board. He was basically out of cards so the game ended rather unceremoniously.
Takeaway- I think this is the reason we haven't seen too many results posted with this deck in paper magic tournaments. I don't think it's a hard deck to play, but I think it's a very hard deck to play extremely well. It's god hands are neigh unbeatbale but it's average hands really have to be played at the perfect time because any push back from the opponent can really cause a major road bump. From the times I have seen it played it was retract or bust. Let me know if you have any experience against this deck and what you think.
Round 2- Bant Eldrazi
Game 1- It's my lucky night because I am on the play again. The play is super important in this matchup. I played an early army of threats with turn 1 delver, turn two delver and swiftspear. The delvers flipped on turn three to a lightning bolt. He was able to path both delvers but this gave me mana for a Geist. He was able to slow me down slightly a skyspawner and landed a reality smasher, but it was to little to late and I helixed him for lethal.
Game 2- This game was awesome. It was a much slower game. He started with a noble heirarch which I bolted. He then played a turn three thought-knot seer taking a snapcaster mage. I drew a path to exile off the top which probably saved my game. I was able to path the thought knot on his turn before he landed the displacer (which I helixed). He played another skyspawner which hit me a couple of times. I was basically drawing all removal/burn and lands. I was able to kill the skyspawner, but was flooding slightly. He then landed a reality smasher and hit me down to 5 life. I had to snap path the smasher ditching Geist or I would just die. We were both out of cars however this is a much better position for him. He drew a land and passed and I attacked with my snapcaster and played the serum visions I drew drawing another land and leaving Saheeli Rai on top. He drew another noble and played it and I drew Saheeli Rai. I copied the snapcaster and helixed his noble and got in for 4. He played a displacer. I drew a delver and scryed seeing a Bedlam Reveler on top. After playing and copying the bedlam reveler for infinite cards that was basically all she wrote.
Takeaway- This is a rare 2-0 for me. Bant Eldrazi can be a very tough matchup. For some reason this is probably the most played deck a lot of weeks (that and Jund) so I typically see this deck at least once. I have gotten fairly good at playing against it and I think my sideboard has a bit more hate for the deck than the average jeskai deck. The Lighting Helixs continued to be very good for me. I'm glad you all talked me into a third copy. In the second eldrazi game, the 6 life I gained was the only reason I was able to come back after getting down to 5 life. Also Bedlam Reveler continues to do a ton of work in the grindy midrange matchups. I don't know what I did without him. I have noticed that this deck has been on the decline lately. That's probably due to the increase in cheerios, goryo's vengeance, scapeshift, etc. We will see.
Rounds 3 and 4 to follow.
Combined with 2-3 copies of Negate mainboard I think it will make the deck a lot stronger.
Boros Reckoner is probably too expensive for what it does. For removal, the decks I have trouble dealing with mainly use Path to Exile or some form of black removal like a destroy effect or a -n/-n effect.
Game 1- On the draw. Affinity is one of the decks I always love to see across the table. We have an excellent matchup against them. So it to the opponent no time at all to destroy me in game 1 :). We actually do have an excellent matchup against them, but when they play six cards on turn 1 and follow that up with a Cranial Plating there isn't much we can do. I was able to path his vault skirge that was equipped, but an equiped inkmoth a few turns later was able to finish me off with infect. I hate inkmoth nexus because it's basically a back up plan for these supper aggressive decks like affinity and infect. As soon as you have answered all their threats they attack you with the cheapest manland in all of magic (costs 1 to activate a 1/1 flier with infect!). But that is a topic for a later date.
Game 2- I was on the play this time. This game went more to plan. He was able to drop 4 permanents on turn one, but they were easily dealt with. I bolted a ornithopter and pathed his vaulte skirge and attacked with swiftspear. He we left with a land and springleaf drum. He showed me the he also had two more lands which made the path a good move (it wasn't the best idea at the time, but I wanted to be aggressive). So the path paid off lucky. I landed a Geist a turn later and drew wear/tear and shattering spree and the game was a fairly easy win. He did have some nice plays be sacrificing the cranial plating and master of etherium to an archound ravager when I destroyed them, but it wasn't enough.
Game 3- This game is why I can't play a deck that has extreme hate. I mulled to 5, but had a turn two Stony Silence. Luckily he had a somewhat slow start. He played turn 1 land springleaf drum go. I passed back and he landed the dreaded etched champion and I realized why he kept that hand. I have played against him before and he knew that etched champion is the worst card for me and I can't deal with it very easily. I played the stony silence and passed back. The stony silence did a ton of work. He drew two cranial plating and couldn't attach them and also was strained on mana with mox opal and springleaf drum. However, he was able to attack me down to 6 with the etched champion. I was able to deflecting palm one attack and two lightning helix put me back at a healthy total and I slowly chipped away with snapcaster mages and burn. In the end he was forced to block with the etched champion towards the end of the game and an arcbound ravager. A vault skirge was able to get some life back for him and a timely whipeflare cleared my board of 2/1's and 1/2's, but the game was really never in doubt because he was strained on mana and couldn't equip.
Takeaway- Like I said earlier, affinity is a matchup I am fairly confident in. We have tons of removal for their little guys and post board we have a ton of answers to the bigger problem cards. Etched Champion and inkmoth nexus are the problem cards for me typically. I used to have a spreading seas in the board for problem lands, but it has since been removed. The artifact destruction really helps when the activate inkmoth as well. Lightning helix did a surprising amount of work keeping my life total high enough to stay aggressive. I likely would have lost game three without them. In the end, if you can land an early stony silence you will probably win. I had the advantage of knowing stony was very good against this particular players list from playing them before, but it's extremely good against most affinity lists. If I have a borderline keepable hand post board I typically mulligan if I know I have silver bullets in my deck.
Round 4- GW Tron (kind of)
Game 1- I'm on the play again. It was getting late and my opponent couldn't stay so we just played one game with nothing on the line. He kept a with only one tron land and I kept a hand with delver and swiftspear. Delver flipped on turn three and he spent his first three turns looking for tron lands. I cast serum visions and sleight of hand looking for more burn to back up my swiftspear. Delver and swifspear put a huge dent in his life total. He pathed the delver and tried to land a karn which I remanded. He tried again the following turn to land karn which I unsubstaniated. He was able to top deck an oblivion stone, but I was able to draw enough burn to finish him off. It was an anti-climatic end to the night, but a good night none the less.
Takeaway- not much here. There are so many new versions of tron going around that I am not really sure where we stand. I was fairly happy with my GR Tron matchup and rarely ever see UW tron. I also haven't gotten to play much against the B version with fatal pushes yet, but I assume many of the tron players in the area with by trying it and I will play against it in my test group. There is a new Trondrazi list going around online that looks terrifying with Batterskulls and main deck Chalice of the Void and Spellskites. I haven't played against it yet, but I can only assume it's a terrible matchup. Has anyone played against it yet?
I will be testing with my group tonight and will play against some of the newer decks popping up like the traverse the uvenwald death shadow deck and the trondrazi deck and will let you know how that goes.
I was able to play against the EldraziTron deck and I have to admit it really felt like the deck was not good at all. Maybe it had a bad run or the person playing it wasn't great at piloting it yet, but it often cast one or two things that were easy to deal with. I even beat a chalice of the void on 1 which he cast on turn two when he was on the play (flipped delver, helix, snapcaster, geist). The deck really relied on having a chalice of the void in play. Post board I felt heavily favored with Shattering Spree, Deflecting Palm, Kari Zev's Expertise, Wear // Tear, etc.
I also played against the new Death Shadow deck. It too felt a bit underwhelming. Again, it is definitely a deck that takes a lot of practice to really pilot well, but it felt helpless against a deck with a lot of burn like ours. I often just burnt them out when they got down to like 5-6 and just saved path, vapor snag, unsubstantiate for the big dummies. Again, deflecting palm makes this matchup really good. The only games I lost were the games when they drew 4-6 hand disruption spells and were able to remove my entire hand. They run a ton of those style cards.
Anyone else play against any cool matchups lately? I haven't had a chance to play against the Baral Storm deck yet, but it looks really cool.
2x Arid Mesa
3x Flooded Strand
3x Scalding Tarn
1x Hallowed Fountain
1x Steam Vents
1x Sacred Foundry
1x Island
1x Plains
1x Seachrome Coast
1x Spirebluff Canal
1x Inspiring Vantage
1x Wandering Fumarole
1x Clifftop Retreat
1x Cavern of Souls
1x Shinka, the Bloodsoaked Keep
Burn/Removal (13)
1x Electrolyze
4x Lightning Bolt
3x Lightning Helix
4x Path to Exile
1x Blessed Alliance
2x Remand
4x Serum Visions
1x Sleight of Hand
1x Saheeli Rai
Protection/Disruption (5)
2x Mana Leak
2x Spell Pierce
1x Emerge Unscathed
Creature (14)
4x Delver of Secrets
1x Grim Lavamancer
4x Snapcaster Mage
3x Geist of Saint Traft
2x Vendilion Clique
1x Leyline of Sanctity
2x Surgical Extraction
1x Pithing Needle
1x Dispel
1x Ceremonious Rejection
1x Negate
2x Stony Silence
1x Wear///Tear
1x Celestial Purge
1x Deflecting Palm
1x Stone Rain
2x Anger of the Gods
I replaced my basic Mountain with Shinka, which has been really good online in combination with Geist and Clique so far.
Basic Plains and Island will never get cut though since they're the only out against Blood Moon strategies. Cavern still works fine with 11 Wizards.
Blessed Alliance is surprisingly good in the mainboard as hard removal no. 5 (next to my four Pathes) to deal with everything that I can't bolt.
I added Mana Leaks again to get rid of pesky cards for good instead of just remanding them and so far I like them a lot. I think the 50/50 split between Remands and Mana Leaks is the best solution for my deck which is not as aggressive as some other lists here.
The deck has a very high win percentage online and at FNM and runs really good against Abzan (beat Abzan 4 times in the last week with no losses). However, Titanshift is still the deck that is most troublesome. I can't find an efficient way to deal with both Scapeshift and Titans. Maybe I'll add Disdainful Stroke back to the sideboard for that match-up.
Very cool list. Let us know how it goes. Shinka is a really cool addition and looks really great in your deck.
Titanshift is a tough one. I typically go aggro/burn and try to get their life total low as quickly as possible and utilize deflecting palm to finish them off. It's just a really tough matchup but it can be beat. In modern, sometimes that is the best we can do.
On the tron topic from above, I think Twinacus is on it. Similar to titanshift, I try to kill them as quickly as possible and counter every early spell I can. I normally keep the remands for the big spells. Post board I have had a lot of success with Spreading Seas, Stony Silence, Molten Rain, Negate, and Deflecting Palm on their big fatties. I have also seen packages of molten rain/surgical extraction to get rid of tron, but that only seems necessary in the midrange decks with a ton of tron in their meta. The more midrange your deck gets, the harder the tron matchup gets. Like Twinacus said, the good news is that jeskai is a very aggressive color shard.