While in theory a Seasons Past deck could work, you would probably want to change up the approach a great deal. The advantage of Death Cloud is that it helps control the board AND can finish the game on the spot. The deck also is resilient to various kinds of potential hate (If your game plan is based on gaining card advantage out of the grave yard, modern can be a rough place).
Some changes would need to be made, but as far as I can see I think the 'current' death cloud list would seem like a good place to start for a seasons past deck. Any sugestions or oponions on it would be apreciated.
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Woot! The Death Cloud thread is still going strong. Take that, other decks.
I'm headed to a Modern tournament on Tuesday, so I'll (finally) have an updated list and some results to share soon. I missed posting about one frustrating outing from a few weeks ago: beat Merfolk in three, lost to Jund in two after having to make some tough play calls, DREW in three against Bant KnightFall (my friend got tired of Naya Burn and brewed this up - now it's his main Modern deck) and beat a goofy Boros aggro deck in two. (Cerodon Yearling in Modern? I ask you.) Going to time against a beatable deck like KnightFall was instructive. Threats are important!
More soon. Keep brewing the deck, everyone. The meta is always changing.
Woot! The Death Cloud thread is still going strong. Take that, other decks.
I'm headed to a Modern tournament on Tuesday, so I'll (finally) have an updated list and some results to share soon. I missed posting about one frustrating outing from a few weeks ago: beat Merfolk in three, lost to Jund in two after having to make some tough play calls, DREW in three against Bant KnightFall (my friend got tired of Naya Burn and brewed this up - now it's his main Modern deck) and beat a goofy Boros aggro deck in two. (Cerodon Yearling in Modern? I ask you.) Going to time against a beatable deck like KnightFall was instructive. Threats are important!
More soon. Keep brewing the deck, everyone. The meta is always changing.
How did you go on Tuesday? Would be awesome to see an updated list!
Tuesday at the LGS turned into a chaos draft night instead of Modern - tons of fun, but whatever for our purposes. I did, however, play at the other LGS tonight. I just got home (very late), so I'll post a list and all the matchups and Hot Analysis tomorrow. I have the day off!
Tuesday at the LGS turned into a chaos draft night instead of Modern - tons of fun, but whatever for our purposes. I did, however, play at the other LGS tonight. I just got home (very late), so I'll post a list and all the matchups and Hot Analysis tomorrow. I have the day off!
Waiting eagerly! Think you'll get the list and report up soon?
Very sorry for the wait. My computer charger cord disappeared, o all things, and I haven't been able to use my laptop in days. Here goes with the phone.
Game one saw me biff a complicated situation late in a game I was losing but didn't have to lose right away. He had a Merrow Reejerey, a Master of Waves with six Elemental dorks and a Master of the Pearl Trident, plus a Spreading Seas on my Overgrown Tomb. I had a Kalitas and a Scavenging Ooze at 3/3. He played a second Master of Waves, getting a bunch more dorks and turning the ready-to-attack Elementals into 3/2s. He swung with everything he could, thinking he had the win. Before blockers, I hit Master of the Pearl Trident with Abrupt Decay, eliminating his Islandwalk but missing the Kalitas trigger. Had I remembered to give myself the extra blocker, I would have survived the attack thanks to the extra block plus Kalitas' lifelink. If I topdeck a Damnation there, the game resets in my favor (he had no cards in hand). Oops!
I win game two thanks to a lovely Cloud settling his hash. Game three opens with me casting Inquisition to see Cursecatcher, Merrow Reejerey, Lord of Atlantis, Kira, Great Glass-Spinner and a few lands. I have my Flaying Tendrils in hand from the sideboard and hope I can two-for-one him if he plays Kira into Lord or something along those lines, so I take Cursecatcher. He proceeds to get down Reejerey plus Lord on the same turn, putting both out of reach and giving him a quick win. Not sure how I should have played that, but Reejerey seems like the better pick in retrospect.
He brought in Relic of Progenitus from the sideboard after game one, probably thinking I was Jund or Abzan after seeing the maindeck Scooze. Didn't do him a ton of good, but reasonable given that his deck is nothing but Scooze food, I suppose.
Round Two - Grixis Thing in the Ice
This seems like a great matchup for us, and I wasn't seriously pressured in game one. Three maindeck Abrupt Decay are exactly what you need for this kind of opponent. I didn't Cloud because I didn't need to - I usually try not to give that information away if I can help it. Game two he went off very quickly by playing turn two TiTi, turn three TiTi and then going nuts on cheap spells. If you see someone playing Manamorphose and you don't know why, it's probably a Thing deck these days. Game three was a free win: he missed his third land drop, I landed a turn three Choke and he conceded. Choke just wins games. I wish I'd started playing it in the board sooner.
Anyway, with a decent removal package plus three or four Death Cloud, these decks should not scare us.
Round Three - RG Tron (lost 0-2)
As far as I can tell, this matchup is stone unwinnable. I put the two Rain of Tears and the Witchbane Orb in my board SPECIFICALLY for Tron (not great, but in the neighborhood of being useful), and the Choke is obviously good against U Tron (which a guy at this shop plays). Anyway, game one was a rout, and then game two saw me hit him with TWO Thoughtseize and a Rain of Tears and get my Orb down -- and I still lost. If anyone anywhere has any idea how we beat Tron, please tell me. Karn exiled my Orb and then started shredding my hand, including exiling the Thrun I'd tutored up with Primal Command. (Sort of a dumb desperation move on my part; I should have kept a second card in hand so I could get Thrun down shortly after. Two cards means Karn doesn't nab him!)
Didn't learn much from these games other than mild frustration. Tron was purpose-built to beat BGx midrange decks. This remains a problem.
Round Four - UR Thing in the Ice
This was pretty similar to round two. I was hardly expecting two Thing decks in four rounds, but this shop has more wacky brewers than my other spot (where people tend to play aggro decks and try to run everyone over).
Game one came down to the wire. He got a turn two Thing, then a turn three Thing (which I hit with Abrupt Decay). I had Maelstrom Pulse in hand but no third land; I could have gambled on drawing a land and getting the two-for-one, but his deck was full of cantrips and missing my land seemed dangerous. Anyway, he flipped his remaining Thing the next turn and swung to get me down to 12 (I'd cracked a fetch). I had no play the next turn, so he got me down to five before I took over with Liliana minus to kill his Thing, then Finks to up my life total, then Thragtusk to go to 14 and put the game out of reach.
Interestingly, after seeing some removal in round one he either boarded out the Things or boarded in a transformational sideboard; either way, it became a Pyromancer Ascension combo burn deck. He got a Past in Flames kill and I had visions of going 1-3.
Game three saw me get down a turn three Choke (again, crucial). He tried to play through it for a few turns, but it shut off two Steam Vents when it came down and all he had was a basic Island for a few turns. Eventually I just killed him with damage.
Choke, my friends, is a hell of a card. We're lucky we play green.
Anyway, I'm considering going a little more black-heavy and trying a second Phyrexian Obliterator. Let's see Merfolk get out of that one. The trouble this deck is having lately is due to lacking counter-pressure in the midgame. (The early game should be about Sakura-Tribe Elder and Courser, and those are - ahem - not "pressure.") Instead of going full Cloud-or-bust combo, I'd like to try a hybrid Obliterator Rock/Cloud-Garruk package. This may necessitate a little brewing, but that's fine. I'm not in love with the Reid Duke stock list any more; the meta has changed too much.
As always, please share ideas! Anyone else have a spin on the Death Cloud shell? Since I got third in the IQ a few months ago I've hardly been able to play - me daughter is still only a few months old, and I work full time - so Modern testing is at a real premium. Any insights into recent meta changes and how we can adapt are like gold falling out of a magic rainbow right now.
Short answer: probably a bad idea. They don't survive a Cloud and they're only strong if you happen to draw one post-Cloud/with a full yard. It's worth testing, but I wouldn't suggest you jam it too hard. The post-Cloud beatdown is covered by Garruk beasts and Treetop Village. Having Finks in the deck means we don't lose outright to Burn, Zoo, Death's Shadow Aggro and the like. That's a more important asset than having a one-off beater.
A lot of these kinds of questions are answered very differently when we're talking about a deck without Death Cloud. Something like Obliterator Rock wants Goyf. Our deck wants Finks because of the speed at which we play and because it works well with our payoff card.
Very sorry for the wait. My computer charger cord disappeared, o all things, and I haven't been able to use my laptop in days. Here goes with the phone.
Game one saw me biff a complicated situation late in a game I was losing but didn't have to lose right away. He had a Merrow Reejerey, a Master of Waves with six Elemental dorks and a Master of the Pearl Trident, plus a Spreading Seas on my Overgrown Tomb. I had a Kalitas and a Scavenging Ooze at 3/3. He played a second Master of Waves, getting a bunch more dorks and turning the ready-to-attack Elementals into 3/2s. He swung with everything he could, thinking he had the win. Before blockers, I hit Master of the Pearl Trident with Abrupt Decay, eliminating his Islandwalk but missing the Kalitas trigger. Had I remembered to give myself the extra blocker, I would have survived the attack thanks to the extra block plus Kalitas' lifelink. If I topdeck a Damnation there, the game resets in my favor (he had no cards in hand). Oops!
I win game two thanks to a lovely Cloud settling his hash. Game three opens with me casting Inquisition to see Cursecatcher, Merrow Reejerey, Lord of Atlantis, Kira, Great Glass-Spinner and a few lands. I have my Flaying Tendrils in hand from the sideboard and hope I can two-for-one him if he plays Kira into Lord or something along those lines, so I take Cursecatcher. He proceeds to get down Reejerey plus Lord on the same turn, putting both out of reach and giving him a quick win. Not sure how I should have played that, but Reejerey seems like the better pick in retrospect.
He brought in Relic of Progenitus from the sideboard after game one, probably thinking I was Jund or Abzan after seeing the maindeck Scooze. Didn't do him a ton of good, but reasonable given that his deck is nothing but Scooze food, I suppose.
Round Two - Grixis Thing in the Ice
This seems like a great matchup for us, and I wasn't seriously pressured in game one. Three maindeck Abrupt Decay are exactly what you need for this kind of opponent. I didn't Cloud because I didn't need to - I usually try not to give that information away if I can help it. Game two he went off very quickly by playing turn two TiTi, turn three TiTi and then going nuts on cheap spells. If you see someone playing Manamorphose and you don't know why, it's probably a Thing deck these days. Game three was a free win: he missed his third land drop, I landed a turn three Choke and he conceded. Choke just wins games. I wish I'd started playing it in the board sooner.
Anyway, with a decent removal package plus three or four Death Cloud, these decks should not scare us.
Round Three - RG Tron (lost 0-2)
As far as I can tell, this matchup is stone unwinnable. I put the two Rain of Tears and the Witchbane Orb in my board SPECIFICALLY for Tron (not great, but in the neighborhood of being useful), and the Choke is obviously good against U Tron (which a guy at this shop plays). Anyway, game one was a rout, and then game two saw me hit him with TWO Thoughtseize and a Rain of Tears and get my Orb down -- and I still lost. If anyone anywhere has any idea how we beat Tron, please tell me. Karn exiled my Orb and then started shredding my hand, including exiling the Thrun I'd tutored up with Primal Command. (Sort of a dumb desperation move on my part; I should have kept a second card in hand so I could get Thrun down shortly after. Two cards means Karn doesn't nab him!)
Didn't learn much from these games other than mild frustration. Tron was purpose-built to beat BGx midrange decks. This remains a problem.
Round Four - UR Thing in the Ice
This was pretty similar to round two. I was hardly expecting two Thing decks in four rounds, but this shop has more wacky brewers than my other spot (where people tend to play aggro decks and try to run everyone over).
Game one came down to the wire. He got a turn two Thing, then a turn three Thing (which I hit with Abrupt Decay). I had Maelstrom Pulse in hand but no third land; I could have gambled on drawing a land and getting the two-for-one, but his deck was full of cantrips and missing my land seemed dangerous. Anyway, he flipped his remaining Thing the next turn and swung to get me down to 12 (I'd cracked a fetch). I had no play the next turn, so he got me down to five before I took over with Liliana minus to kill his Thing, then Finks to up my life total, then Thragtusk to go to 14 and put the game out of reach.
Interestingly, after seeing some removal in round one he either boarded out the Things or boarded in a transformational sideboard; either way, it became a Pyromancer Ascension combo burn deck. He got a Past in Flames kill and I had visions of going 1-3.
Game three saw me get down a turn three Choke (again, crucial). He tried to play through it for a few turns, but it shut off two Steam Vents when it came down and all he had was a basic Island for a few turns. Eventually I just killed him with damage.
Choke, my friends, is a hell of a card. We're lucky we play green.
Anyway, I'm considering going a little more black-heavy and trying a second Phyrexian Obliterator. Let's see Merfolk get out of that one. The trouble this deck is having lately is due to lacking counter-pressure in the midgame. (The early game should be about Sakura-Tribe Elder and Courser, and those are - ahem - not "pressure.") Instead of going full Cloud-or-bust combo, I'd like to try a hybrid Obliterator Rock/Cloud-Garruk package. This may necessitate a little brewing, but that's fine. I'm not in love with the Reid Duke stock list any more; the meta has changed too much.
As always, please share ideas! Anyone else have a spin on the Death Cloud shell? Since I got third in the IQ a few months ago I've hardly been able to play - me daughter is still only a few months old, and I work full time - so Modern testing is at a real premium. Any insights into recent meta changes and how we can adapt are like gold falling out of a magic rainbow right now.
Thanks for the excellent write up and new deck list, interesting direction you're taking with DC let us know how it works out. I'm also looking outside the Reid Duke shell and trying a top 8 deck from MTGO: The Rock. It's a bit more on the cloud or bust side of things but I'm liking it so far, will test a bit more than maybe make some changes to it and post my results. Anyone else been testing a similar list recently?
If game 1 is a draw, and then I win game 2, do we still go to game 3?
If so, and if game 3 is a draw, do I still win the match?
I'd imagine if enough games are played, a scenario unfolds where death cloud just burns out both players.
You play until the winner is determined by: first to 2 wins (2-0 or 2-1), whoever has most wins when time is called(1-0-1), draw when time is called(1-1 or 0-0), or someone concedes. Even if you and your opponent drew multiple times, as long as there is time left in the round, keep playing until one of the 4 things happen. You more than likely won't have time for a 4th game while playing Death Cloud though.
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People have been down on the Goyfs, in favor of of stuff you keep through a DC or helps you get up for a bigger better DC. I've been thinking about a bit, not playing much, but pondering it and I think there's kind of two different ways to take Death Cloud. One being the comboish builds with utpoia sprawl and getting big mana quick to lock your opponent off their resources and just be able to survive aggro till you can do that. That build probably goes 3 death clouds, higher garruk count and the sprawl. Then there's also the more mid range, sort of old school rock deck version that runs maybe Kalitas, Oozes, Courser, perhaps, maybe goyfs.
I read through this article, http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/valuable-lessons-wildspeaker-jund/ and I've been trying to work around something based on this. I don't have any of the cards to support the red and honestly, I don't know how worth it is for Lighting bolt, and SB options anyway and yes in the end he swaps outs the clouds for more creatures but I think this more Jund like build is worth a look. I've really felt playing the other version of this deck that have been floating around that I have a really hard time winning. I can pretty often stall and stall and not lose, gain lots of life, kill creatures but I often felt like it would go to top deck and then I would lose that top deck war based on card value since so much of my deck was supporting the cloud. Maybe its just my meta or how I tend to play but I got really frustrated with and have been wanting to try something new. So I started with the original list in that article and made some adjustments to my taste and eeked the red out, although I don't think its bad really, I just don't have the cards for it and having to pick up a goyf and a couple lillys is expensive enough O.O Anyway this is what I am testing now.
It does a little worse vs aggro, I've struggled with affinity and with Infect but honestly post its one less damnation then my old list but other then that actually think has more removal so I think it may just be a fluke? Or a misplay here and there they should still be good MU. Its definitely more aggressive and I just feel like by having the opportunity to drop threats I create a lot more control and more pressure then my previous version. I do still like the Grave titan builds though, that guy's a beast.
thanks, that clears up confusion on "how to win a match"
i'll probably end up throwing finks in there. i still like the idea of running at least 3 cloud and maybe 1 dark petition. its probably better to lower the cloud count, but i feel that defeats the whole purpose of playing the deck in the first place.
this is probably something i'll play a few times a year in between decks just to keep modern interesting.
thanks, that clears up confusion on "how to win a match"
i'll probably end up throwing finks in there. i still like the idea of running at least 3 cloud and maybe 1 dark petition. its probably better to lower the cloud count, but i feel that defeats the whole purpose of playing the deck in the first place.
this is probably something i'll play a few times a year in between decks just to keep modern interesting.
That's fair lol. You could pretty easily drop the damnation for another cloud, that might be better anyways. I just feel awfully naked without any MD. Its definitely a fun deck, I guess I am sort of looking at it like a more control version of Jund, which may not be better in the end but I find a little more fun. I would definitely go Finks in though.
24 LANDS
2 Bojuka Bog
3 Gemstone Caverns
4 Mutavault
13 Swamp
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
14 CREATURES
4 Fulminator Mage
3 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
4 Simian Spirit Guide
3 Solemn Simulacrum
7 INSTANTS and SORC.
3 Damnation
4 Death Cloud
15 OTHER SPELLS
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Guardian Idol
4 Liliana of the Veil
3 Mind Stone
SIDEBOARD
1 Damnation
2 Engineered Explosives
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Night of Souls' Betrayal
2 Ratchet Bomb
4 Thought-Knot Seer
Thats silly but, hey, top 8 lol.
SCG has it as the deck of the day. It's awesome honestly.
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Won a 13 man IQ yesterday, so not that big of a tourney. Went 3-0-1 in swiss with cut to top 4. Hanging with family now, but will have a more detailed write up with decklist later today or tonight when kids are in bed.
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Won a 13 man IQ yesterday, so not that big of a tourney. Went 3-0-1 in swiss with cut to top 4. Hanging with family now, but will have a more detailed write up with decklist later today or tonight when kids are in bed.
So the deck isnt really all that different from the last time I played. Thats how I actually want it to be though. Main core of cards with maybe 5 cards at most that I'd need to switch around...Anyways, it would be 4 rounds with cut to Top 4.
Round 1: Brandon with Oath Tron? (2-1)
No clue if thats the name of the deck, but it's 4-5 color Tron usings Oath of Nissa to cast PWs other than Karn and Ugin.
Game 1: He's on the Play and goes Turn 1 Tron piece, Sphere. Crap...so my first play is Inquisition and thats when I see shenanigans with a new Tamiyo and Nahiri in his hand. Didnt have anything else that I'd take so I took Nahiri. Downhill from there because next turn he ripped an Oath and just started grabbing what he needed. Lasted long enough to fight through a Karn and Ugin, but the Tamiyo and an Elspeth Suns Champion was too much.
Game 2: Steal Oath of Nissas with hand disruption, land kitchen finks, Cloud for 2, ride finks to victory. WooHoo
Game 3: Same as game 2, but add a Hissing Quagmire attack and Garruk Ultimate to seal the deal. Oh thank God
Round 2: Steven with Affinity (2-0)
Game 1: Im on the play, but his turn 1 pretty much emptied his hand. I got down to 8 before I was able to Slaughter Pact and Cloud for 3 to wipe his board and hand completely away except for Springleaf Drum and Mox Opal. Got down a couple of Finks and they took home the win.
Game 2: Turn 3 Creeping Corrosion, Turn 4 Primal Command to gain 7 and search for Kalitas with kill spells in hand. I dropped to 8 life and 5 poison, but I honestly never felt like I was gonna lose that game.
Round 3: Anthony with Naya Zoo/Burn (2-1)
Game 1: Vexing Devil, Take 4. Vexing Devil, Damn it, take 4, Goblin Guide...And I surprisingly stabilized for a bit thanks to Scooze and some removal spells. He was light on burn until the very end where he needed just 3 damage. He whiffed, I pop Garruk's Ultimate with Scooze and friends that were played the turn before. Take the win
Game 2: I'm behind the whole time this game, he has the removal when he needs them and just burns me out.
Game 3: So I drop a Finks, take 12 the next turn to go down to 5. Crap I'm so dead. Next turn, play Kalitas. Stall the board for a bit and land Trinisphere, then go Primal Command, gain 7 and find Witness. Play Witness as blocker, get P Command back. Play Command, gain 7 and find Thragtusk and he scoops. Thank God.
Round 4 Matt with BG Infect (ID) Foooood
So the Cut to Top 4 had me, BG Infect, Naya Zoo/Burn, and Esper Control
Top 4 Anthony with Zoo/Burn again
Both Games I hit below 10 life, but stabilized after Primal Command plus search for Thragtusk. He was short on mana both games never finding a 2nd Red source or White Source. Had creature heavy hands which allowed me to gum up the board and gain life here and there. Plus Trinisphere in Game 2 locked him out until he found a 3rd land.
Finals Matt with BG Infect
He wouldnt be able to make it to any Invitationals so he conceded to me since we are buds. Sweeeet
So, great day of playing MtG and no issues whatsoever as far as drama concerns. Every card in my SB I did/could have used except for Surgical Extractions. Still don't know about those 2 spots as to what they should be yet. And the 3 Trinisphere were/are useful, but no clue if they will stay in or not. Thoughts on those 5 slots? Guess I will have to man up and start thinking about Standard after Kaladesh comes out. Damn dual format tourneys...
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I really like Rolling spoil, its great against affinity and infect. I also would probably go Fulminator mages instead of the spheres. I feel like you need an answer to man lands, since you cant abrupt decay, or maelstrom pulse them. I've lost a lot of games to ragin ravines, or colonnades or inkmoths or whatever. Especially cause they dodge Damnations and what not as well. With the Oozes MD you might not need the extractions or maybe only one? I'd probably like to squeeze another damnation and or another thoughtseize or inquisition.
Yeah, bigger tournament I would prob do 1 Spoil, 3 Fulminators, and maybe 1 Thoughtseize/Duress. Good call...I just had a pretty good guess with the meta after hearing what might be at this location.
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I brought my deathcloud list to our GPT yesterday. 19 players showed up, after 5 rounds I was tied 1st place (going 3-2-0, with the second draw being intentional since we were in top 8 nomatter what).
Ive only played the deck online before, and since Im a student, I had to cut some corners to make my budget (I am planning on adding verdant catacombs, 3 thoughtseize and 3 IoK), but it turned out really well.
I cant give a tournament report since I cant remember the matches properly, but I played against 4cNahiri, Ad naseum (my only loss in the semifinals), jund, and a werewolf tribal deck that I can remember.
Overall, the deck gets a solid 10/10, but I sure wish I knew how to beat the bloody Ad naseum deck..
Im more than happy to recieve critique on the deck!
I'm headed to a Modern tournament on Tuesday, so I'll (finally) have an updated list and some results to share soon. I missed posting about one frustrating outing from a few weeks ago: beat Merfolk in three, lost to Jund in two after having to make some tough play calls, DREW in three against Bant KnightFall (my friend got tired of Naya Burn and brewed this up - now it's his main Modern deck) and beat a goofy Boros aggro deck in two. (Cerodon Yearling in Modern? I ask you.) Going to time against a beatable deck like KnightFall was instructive. Threats are important!
More soon. Keep brewing the deck, everyone. The meta is always changing.
How did you go on Tuesday? Would be awesome to see an updated list!
Waiting eagerly! Think you'll get the list and report up soon?
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Golgari Rot Farm
3 Twilight Mire
2 Overgrown Tomb
4 Swamp
3 Forest
3 Treetop Village
1 Tectonic Edge
CREATURES (15)
2 Scavenging Ooze
3 Sakura-Tribe Elder
2 Courser of Kruphix
3 Kitchen Finks
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1 Phyrexian Obliterator
1 Thragtusk
1 Grave Titan
1 Disfigure
2 Thoughtseize
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Doom Blade
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Maelstrom Pulse
3 Death Cloud
1 Damnation
1 Dark Petition
1 Primal Command
PLANESWALKERS (5)
2 Liliana of the Veil
3 Garruk Wildspeaker
1 Boseiju, Who Shelters All
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Flaying Tendrils
1 Choke
2 Rain of Tears
1 Damnation
1 Creeping Corrosion
1 Witchbane Orb
2 Leyline of the Void
1 Night of Souls' Betrayal
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
2 Obstinate Baloth
Round One - Merfolk (lost 1-2)
Game one saw me biff a complicated situation late in a game I was losing but didn't have to lose right away. He had a Merrow Reejerey, a Master of Waves with six Elemental dorks and a Master of the Pearl Trident, plus a Spreading Seas on my Overgrown Tomb. I had a Kalitas and a Scavenging Ooze at 3/3. He played a second Master of Waves, getting a bunch more dorks and turning the ready-to-attack Elementals into 3/2s. He swung with everything he could, thinking he had the win. Before blockers, I hit Master of the Pearl Trident with Abrupt Decay, eliminating his Islandwalk but missing the Kalitas trigger. Had I remembered to give myself the extra blocker, I would have survived the attack thanks to the extra block plus Kalitas' lifelink. If I topdeck a Damnation there, the game resets in my favor (he had no cards in hand). Oops!
I win game two thanks to a lovely Cloud settling his hash. Game three opens with me casting Inquisition to see Cursecatcher, Merrow Reejerey, Lord of Atlantis, Kira, Great Glass-Spinner and a few lands. I have my Flaying Tendrils in hand from the sideboard and hope I can two-for-one him if he plays Kira into Lord or something along those lines, so I take Cursecatcher. He proceeds to get down Reejerey plus Lord on the same turn, putting both out of reach and giving him a quick win. Not sure how I should have played that, but Reejerey seems like the better pick in retrospect.
He brought in Relic of Progenitus from the sideboard after game one, probably thinking I was Jund or Abzan after seeing the maindeck Scooze. Didn't do him a ton of good, but reasonable given that his deck is nothing but Scooze food, I suppose.
Round Two - Grixis Thing in the Ice
This seems like a great matchup for us, and I wasn't seriously pressured in game one. Three maindeck Abrupt Decay are exactly what you need for this kind of opponent. I didn't Cloud because I didn't need to - I usually try not to give that information away if I can help it. Game two he went off very quickly by playing turn two TiTi, turn three TiTi and then going nuts on cheap spells. If you see someone playing Manamorphose and you don't know why, it's probably a Thing deck these days. Game three was a free win: he missed his third land drop, I landed a turn three Choke and he conceded. Choke just wins games. I wish I'd started playing it in the board sooner.
Anyway, with a decent removal package plus three or four Death Cloud, these decks should not scare us.
Round Three - RG Tron (lost 0-2)
As far as I can tell, this matchup is stone unwinnable. I put the two Rain of Tears and the Witchbane Orb in my board SPECIFICALLY for Tron (not great, but in the neighborhood of being useful), and the Choke is obviously good against U Tron (which a guy at this shop plays). Anyway, game one was a rout, and then game two saw me hit him with TWO Thoughtseize and a Rain of Tears and get my Orb down -- and I still lost. If anyone anywhere has any idea how we beat Tron, please tell me. Karn exiled my Orb and then started shredding my hand, including exiling the Thrun I'd tutored up with Primal Command. (Sort of a dumb desperation move on my part; I should have kept a second card in hand so I could get Thrun down shortly after. Two cards means Karn doesn't nab him!)
Didn't learn much from these games other than mild frustration. Tron was purpose-built to beat BGx midrange decks. This remains a problem.
Round Four - UR Thing in the Ice
This was pretty similar to round two. I was hardly expecting two Thing decks in four rounds, but this shop has more wacky brewers than my other spot (where people tend to play aggro decks and try to run everyone over).
Game one came down to the wire. He got a turn two Thing, then a turn three Thing (which I hit with Abrupt Decay). I had Maelstrom Pulse in hand but no third land; I could have gambled on drawing a land and getting the two-for-one, but his deck was full of cantrips and missing my land seemed dangerous. Anyway, he flipped his remaining Thing the next turn and swung to get me down to 12 (I'd cracked a fetch). I had no play the next turn, so he got me down to five before I took over with Liliana minus to kill his Thing, then Finks to up my life total, then Thragtusk to go to 14 and put the game out of reach.
Interestingly, after seeing some removal in round one he either boarded out the Things or boarded in a transformational sideboard; either way, it became a Pyromancer Ascension combo burn deck. He got a Past in Flames kill and I had visions of going 1-3.
Game three saw me get down a turn three Choke (again, crucial). He tried to play through it for a few turns, but it shut off two Steam Vents when it came down and all he had was a basic Island for a few turns. Eventually I just killed him with damage.
Choke, my friends, is a hell of a card. We're lucky we play green.
Anyway, I'm considering going a little more black-heavy and trying a second Phyrexian Obliterator. Let's see Merfolk get out of that one. The trouble this deck is having lately is due to lacking counter-pressure in the midgame. (The early game should be about Sakura-Tribe Elder and Courser, and those are - ahem - not "pressure.") Instead of going full Cloud-or-bust combo, I'd like to try a hybrid Obliterator Rock/Cloud-Garruk package. This may necessitate a little brewing, but that's fine. I'm not in love with the Reid Duke stock list any more; the meta has changed too much.
As always, please share ideas! Anyone else have a spin on the Death Cloud shell? Since I got third in the IQ a few months ago I've hardly been able to play - me daughter is still only a few months old, and I work full time - so Modern testing is at a real premium. Any insights into recent meta changes and how we can adapt are like gold falling out of a magic rainbow right now.
Short answer: probably a bad idea. They don't survive a Cloud and they're only strong if you happen to draw one post-Cloud/with a full yard. It's worth testing, but I wouldn't suggest you jam it too hard. The post-Cloud beatdown is covered by Garruk beasts and Treetop Village. Having Finks in the deck means we don't lose outright to Burn, Zoo, Death's Shadow Aggro and the like. That's a more important asset than having a one-off beater.
A lot of these kinds of questions are answered very differently when we're talking about a deck without Death Cloud. Something like Obliterator Rock wants Goyf. Our deck wants Finks because of the speed at which we play and because it works well with our payoff card.
Thanks for the excellent write up and new deck list, interesting direction you're taking with DC let us know how it works out. I'm also looking outside the Reid Duke shell and trying a top 8 deck from MTGO: The Rock. It's a bit more on the cloud or bust side of things but I'm liking it so far, will test a bit more than maybe make some changes to it and post my results. Anyone else been testing a similar list recently?
If so, and if game 3 is a draw, do I still win the match?
I'd imagine if enough games are played, a scenario unfolds where death cloud just burns out both players.
People have been down on the Goyfs, in favor of of stuff you keep through a DC or helps you get up for a bigger better DC. I've been thinking about a bit, not playing much, but pondering it and I think there's kind of two different ways to take Death Cloud. One being the comboish builds with utpoia sprawl and getting big mana quick to lock your opponent off their resources and just be able to survive aggro till you can do that. That build probably goes 3 death clouds, higher garruk count and the sprawl. Then there's also the more mid range, sort of old school rock deck version that runs maybe Kalitas, Oozes, Courser, perhaps, maybe goyfs.
I read through this article, http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/valuable-lessons-wildspeaker-jund/ and I've been trying to work around something based on this. I don't have any of the cards to support the red and honestly, I don't know how worth it is for Lighting bolt, and SB options anyway and yes in the end he swaps outs the clouds for more creatures but I think this more Jund like build is worth a look. I've really felt playing the other version of this deck that have been floating around that I have a really hard time winning. I can pretty often stall and stall and not lose, gain lots of life, kill creatures but I often felt like it would go to top deck and then I would lose that top deck war based on card value since so much of my deck was supporting the cloud. Maybe its just my meta or how I tend to play but I got really frustrated with and have been wanting to try something new. So I started with the original list in that article and made some adjustments to my taste and eeked the red out, although I don't think its bad really, I just don't have the cards for it and having to pick up a goyf and a couple lillys is expensive enough O.O Anyway this is what I am testing now.
1x Bloodstained Mire
2x Forest
1x Oran-Rief, the Vastwood
3x Overgrown Tomb
4x Swamp
3x Treetop Village
3x Twilight Mire
4x Verdant Catacombs
3x Windswept Heath
2x Garruk Wildspeaker
3x Liliana of the Veil
4x Kitchen Finks
2x Scavenging Ooze
3x Tarmogoyf
1x Tasigur, the Golden Fang
1x Damnation
1x Death Cloud
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
2x Maelstrom Pulse
3x Thoughtseize
1x Disfigure
1x Slaughter Pact
2x Damnation
2x Extirpate
1x Fracturing Gust
3x Fulminator Mage
3x Obstinate Baloth
1x Rolling Spoil
1x Thoughtseize
2x Thrun, the Last Troll
It does a little worse vs aggro, I've struggled with affinity and with Infect but honestly post its one less damnation then my old list but other then that actually think has more removal so I think it may just be a fluke? Or a misplay here and there they should still be good MU. Its definitely more aggressive and I just feel like by having the opportunity to drop threats I create a lot more control and more pressure then my previous version. I do still like the Grave titan builds though, that guy's a beast.
i'll probably end up throwing finks in there. i still like the idea of running at least 3 cloud and maybe 1 dark petition. its probably better to lower the cloud count, but i feel that defeats the whole purpose of playing the deck in the first place.
this is probably something i'll play a few times a year in between decks just to keep modern interesting.
That's fair lol. You could pretty easily drop the damnation for another cloud, that might be better anyways. I just feel awfully naked without any MD. Its definitely a fun deck, I guess I am sort of looking at it like a more control version of Jund, which may not be better in the end but I find a little more fun. I would definitely go Finks in though.
http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=13155&d=277031&f=MO
24 LANDS
2 Bojuka Bog
3 Gemstone Caverns
4 Mutavault
13 Swamp
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
14 CREATURES
4 Fulminator Mage
3 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
4 Simian Spirit Guide
3 Solemn Simulacrum
7 INSTANTS and SORC.
3 Damnation
4 Death Cloud
15 OTHER SPELLS
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Guardian Idol
4 Liliana of the Veil
3 Mind Stone
SIDEBOARD
1 Damnation
2 Engineered Explosives
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Night of Souls' Betrayal
2 Ratchet Bomb
4 Thought-Knot Seer
Thats silly but, hey, top 8 lol.
SCG has it as the deck of the day. It's awesome honestly.
Cockatrice username: Blackcat77
Nice! Grats. Look forward to your list and recap.
Alright, so like I had said, small turn out for a tournament. Havent played in a while so it didnt bother me, just wanted to play.
1 Marsh Flats
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Ghost Quarter
3 Treetop Village
1 Woodland Cemetery
1 Temple of Malady
2 Twilight Mire
3 Swamp
3 Forest
3 Overgrown Tomb
1 Hissing Quagmire
Creatures
4 Sakura-Tribe Elder
2 Scavenging Ooze
1 Eternal Witness
3 Kitchen Finks
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1 Thragtusk
1 Grave Titan
2 Liliana of the Veil
3 Garruk Wildspeaker
Spells
1 Slaughter Pact
3 Thoughtseize
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Victim of Night
3 Abrupt Decay
1 Maelstrom Pulse
2 Damnation
1 Dark Petition
1 Primal Command
2 Death Cloud
3 Trinisphere
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Kitchen Finks
2 Obstinate Baloth
2 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Abrupt Decay
2 Curse of Death's Hold
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Creeping Corrosion
So the deck isnt really all that different from the last time I played. Thats how I actually want it to be though. Main core of cards with maybe 5 cards at most that I'd need to switch around...Anyways, it would be 4 rounds with cut to Top 4.
Round 1: Brandon with Oath Tron? (2-1)
No clue if thats the name of the deck, but it's 4-5 color Tron usings Oath of Nissa to cast PWs other than Karn and Ugin.
Game 1: He's on the Play and goes Turn 1 Tron piece, Sphere. Crap...so my first play is Inquisition and thats when I see shenanigans with a new Tamiyo and Nahiri in his hand. Didnt have anything else that I'd take so I took Nahiri. Downhill from there because next turn he ripped an Oath and just started grabbing what he needed. Lasted long enough to fight through a Karn and Ugin, but the Tamiyo and an Elspeth Suns Champion was too much.
Game 2: Steal Oath of Nissas with hand disruption, land kitchen finks, Cloud for 2, ride finks to victory. WooHoo
Game 3: Same as game 2, but add a Hissing Quagmire attack and Garruk Ultimate to seal the deal. Oh thank God
Round 2: Steven with Affinity (2-0)
Game 1: Im on the play, but his turn 1 pretty much emptied his hand. I got down to 8 before I was able to Slaughter Pact and Cloud for 3 to wipe his board and hand completely away except for Springleaf Drum and Mox Opal. Got down a couple of Finks and they took home the win.
Game 2: Turn 3 Creeping Corrosion, Turn 4 Primal Command to gain 7 and search for Kalitas with kill spells in hand. I dropped to 8 life and 5 poison, but I honestly never felt like I was gonna lose that game.
Round 3: Anthony with Naya Zoo/Burn (2-1)
Game 1: Vexing Devil, Take 4. Vexing Devil, Damn it, take 4, Goblin Guide...And I surprisingly stabilized for a bit thanks to Scooze and some removal spells. He was light on burn until the very end where he needed just 3 damage. He whiffed, I pop Garruk's Ultimate with Scooze and friends that were played the turn before. Take the win
Game 2: I'm behind the whole time this game, he has the removal when he needs them and just burns me out.
Game 3: So I drop a Finks, take 12 the next turn to go down to 5. Crap I'm so dead. Next turn, play Kalitas. Stall the board for a bit and land Trinisphere, then go Primal Command, gain 7 and find Witness. Play Witness as blocker, get P Command back. Play Command, gain 7 and find Thragtusk and he scoops. Thank God.
Round 4 Matt with BG Infect (ID)
Foooood
So the Cut to Top 4 had me, BG Infect, Naya Zoo/Burn, and Esper Control
Top 4 Anthony with Zoo/Burn again
Both Games I hit below 10 life, but stabilized after Primal Command plus search for Thragtusk. He was short on mana both games never finding a 2nd Red source or White Source. Had creature heavy hands which allowed me to gum up the board and gain life here and there. Plus Trinisphere in Game 2 locked him out until he found a 3rd land.
Finals Matt with BG Infect
He wouldnt be able to make it to any Invitationals so he conceded to me since we are buds.
Sweeeet
So, great day of playing MtG and no issues whatsoever as far as drama concerns. Every card in my SB I did/could have used except for Surgical Extractions. Still don't know about those 2 spots as to what they should be yet. And the 3 Trinisphere were/are useful, but no clue if they will stay in or not. Thoughts on those 5 slots? Guess I will have to man up and start thinking about Standard after Kaladesh comes out. Damn dual format tourneys...
I really like Rolling spoil, its great against affinity and infect. I also would probably go Fulminator mages instead of the spheres. I feel like you need an answer to man lands, since you cant abrupt decay, or maelstrom pulse them. I've lost a lot of games to ragin ravines, or colonnades or inkmoths or whatever. Especially cause they dodge Damnations and what not as well. With the Oozes MD you might not need the extractions or maybe only one? I'd probably like to squeeze another damnation and or another thoughtseize or inquisition.
I brought my deathcloud list to our GPT yesterday. 19 players showed up, after 5 rounds I was tied 1st place (going 3-2-0, with the second draw being intentional since we were in top 8 nomatter what).
Ive only played the deck online before, and since Im a student, I had to cut some corners to make my budget (I am planning on adding verdant catacombs, 3 thoughtseize and 3 IoK), but it turned out really well.
I cant give a tournament report since I cant remember the matches properly, but I played against 4cNahiri, Ad naseum (my only loss in the semifinals), jund, and a werewolf tribal deck that I can remember.
Overall, the deck gets a solid 10/10, but I sure wish I knew how to beat the bloody Ad naseum deck..
Im more than happy to recieve critique on the deck!
2 Eternal Witness
3 Kitchen Finks
1 Thragtusk
1 Grave Titan
SORCERIES
3 Smallpox
4 Death Cloud
1 Maelstrom Pulse
4 Search for Tomorrow
1 Damnation
1 Primal Command
INSTANTS
3 Abrupt Decay
PLANESWALKERS
2 Liliana of the Veil
3 Garruk Wildspeaker
1 Liliana Vess
2 Golgari Signet
LANDS
3 Forest
5 Swamp
4 Overgrown Tomb
2 Golgari Rot Farm
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Woodland Cemetery
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Dakmor Salvage
2 Twilight Mire
4 Treetop Village
1 Putrefy
1 Grafdigger’s Cage
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Krosan Grip
2 Rain of Tears
2 Curse of Death’s Hold
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Pithing Needle
1 Haunting Echoes
2 Duress
1 Thragtusk