Yeah the Affinity matchup without Damnation seems very rough. Are you running any Drown in Sorrow in its place? You need to mulligan VERY aggressively against Affinity, pretty much throwing back any hand without a Darkblast or a sweeper. Lingering Souls+removal can sometimes get there, but the matchup is just so much more in your favor when you have one of those effects in your opener. I have been losing to Affinity more than I am comfortable with recently, and I think it might be time to add some dedicated hate in the board (probably Creeping Corrosion).
While Death Cloud is a powerful card, I don't think it helps any of the problem matchups, and getting it hit by a Remand or Mana Leak feels pretty awful. I think it is very good against nonwhite BGx decks (which are pretty popular right now), but it is too easy to strip out of your hand before you can cast it, seeing as it costs 5+ but is still hit by Inquisition of Kozilek. I also don't really like playing lategame-only cards that don't do anything in the graveyard because our lategame plan is to dredge every turn. This means that, in order to actually cast this card, it had to be in our hand in the early turns of the game before we start dredging. That being said, I really like how this card provides a very powerful effect that we can cast and recover from even through a Grafdigger's Cage.
At the moment I'm running a combination of Nameless Inversion, Darkblast, and Crib Swap as my main board removal. Mostly I wanted to see how far I could push it without using a sweeper effect (Also short one of my Damnation's which was a contributor to that effort lol, even though I have a few Drown's I've been considering using). I think you are probably spot on with Death Cloud though, but I think I'll still toss it in for a few games just to see firsthand if it falls shy of being effective. I don't expect much from it, and will probably move it out as soon as I can get a hold of another Damnation. Or Drown in Sorrow until I get one.
At the moment I'm running a combination of Nameless Inversion, Darkblast, and Crib Swap as my main board removal. Mostly I wanted to see how far I could push it without using a sweeper effect (Also short one of my Damnation's which was a contributor to that effort lol, even though I have a few Drown's I've been considering using). I think you are probably spot on with Death Cloud though, but I think I'll still toss it in for a few games just to see firsthand if it falls shy of being effective. I don't expect much from it, and will probably move it out as soon as I can get a hold of another Damnation. Or Drown in Sorrow until I get one.
Yeah let me know how it goes, I could be completely wrong about it. I'm also a little interested to hear from people who play Crib Swap about how often the token you give them gets in the way of your sac effects (Smallpox, Liliana of the Veil, and in your case Death Cloud). I was always a little wary of playing it because of that, but it might not be as big of an issue as I am making it out to be. Having more outs to a Tarmogoyf is always a good thing.
For me it's mostly come up against Pod, especially on the Voice. Plus following it up with a Darkblast when convenient gets rid of the token. Other than that, I'm honestly not extremely impressed with it and generally wish it were another Nameless Inversion or Darkblast instead.
I really like the points people made with Leyline of Sanctity. I never even thought of burn as I was trying to contemplate a sideboard. I wanted more Ghost Quarter's in the side because they can quickly lock out some decks. Someone mentioned Vault of the Archangel when I was discussing it and the idea seemed solid. I haven't tested yet. I chose to go with 2 more Unburial Rites targets in the form of moving Sun Titan to the side and adding Azusa, Lost but Seeking. I feel that the combination of our main Dredge engine, Life from the Loam combined with the utility lands we have could benefit from Azusa, Lost but Seeking in some match ups.
I think your build lacks focus. Reanimation is a perfectly legitimate and powerful strategy in this style of deck, and a solid Junk-colored list would have a much more reliable manabase than the sketchy 4-color variants that are out there (while regrettably losing Faithless Looting). However, you need to decide if you want it to be your plan A, your plan B, or not in the deck at all. Playing 1 Unburial Rites and 1 Elesh Norn as your only target for it means that you will rarely (if ever) manage to find both pieces before the game ends, and they will usually just get in the way.
If you decide you want to focus more on a reanimation strategy, I would say you want at LEAST 3 Unburial Rites, and at least 2 large monsters (Elesh Norn/Borborygmos Enraged/Sun Titan/Grave Titan). You could also kind of go 2 and a half by adding something like a Thragtusk that is very easily castable yet still a good target to decrease the odds of Rites being completely dead.
I feel like Rites/fatty and Worm Harvest kind of occupy the same slot as game-ending play to dredge into, and you only want just enough of those to be able to find them reliably. The same thing is also kind of true about the Haakon engine, and it's possible that they don't belong in the same deck because of that. I am interested to see how it works out for you though.
Azusa, Lost but Seeking is something I might actually try in the board at some point. It is at its best against decks that don't play a lot of removal and lose hard to recurring Tectonic Edges/Ghost Quarters. Scapeshift and Tron come to mind. I'm curious as to how impactful it is in those matchups.
Nicely done! Any thoughts on the build after the games, or a match report?
I don't really have much of a report, as all the games weren't too difficult. I played against 4 pretty solid matchups, and grinded them down to no resources before playing Haakon followed by 1-3 gigantic Knight of the Reliquarys.
As for thoughts, I had a few.
I have been playing close attention to when I feel like I want another Smallpox, as I'm still not sure 3 is correct. The 4 matchups I happened to play against, Smallpox was insane. Having your Twin opponent Clique you and have to take Smallpox over the Abrupt Decay in your hand is a testament to how powerful of a spell it really is. That being said, against a lot of very popular matchups (read: Affinity and Pod) it is pretty much uncastable as it will barely affect the board while pushing you further away from a crucial Damnation.
I definitely think the more I play the BGx matchup, the better it becomes. Learning how to play postboarded games, and how to board based on what I showed my opponent G1 has made me much more successful. Since most BGx players have never played against this deck, you can kind of determine whether they are going to take out their Thoughtseizes and Inquisition of Kozileks based on how game 1 went. If they got blown out by a timely Damnation, they will probably keep them in. If they Thoughtseize on turn 1 and see Haakon, Life from the Loam, and Lingering Souls, they will probably board them all out. You can use this to your advantage when deciding mulligans and when choosing whether you want your Leyline of Sanctitys in games 2 and 3. As a general rule though, I have been happy with boarding them in against Jund, but not the other flavors (because Jund plays Jund Charm/Rakdos Charm/Slaughter Games).
Also the only graveyard hate I saw for the entire event was Scavenging Ooze. I don't know if I just got lucky, or if people are really trimming down on the real hate, but it has been working well for me either way.
Also the only graveyard hate I saw for the entire event was Scavenging Ooze. I don't know if I just got lucky, or if people are really trimming down on the real hate, but it has been working well for me either way.
This is a really out of date statement, but back when DRS was legal people thought it was the end-all be-all of GY hate. So they didn't pack much else. Once he left the format people panicked and packed so much that it flushed graveyard centric decks basically out of the format. Once people realized that there wasn't a point left for graveyard hate they took it out of their sideboards and here we are in a fairly Gy hate lite meta.
This is a really out of date statement, but back when DRS was legal people thought it was the end-all be-all of GY hate. So they didn't pack much else. Once he left the format people panicked and packed so much that it flushed graveyard centric decks basically out of the format. Once people realized that there wasn't a point left for graveyard hate they took it out of their sideboards and here we are in a fairly Gy hate lite meta.
Yeah I remember that. I was playing 4c Gifts at the time, and I actually STOPPED playing it after DRS got banned because there was just too much overcompensation.
Nowadays, you see almost exclusively Grafdigger's Cage, which doesn't even interact with Life from the Loam. Relic of Progenitus is also kind of common, but it's very easy to play around by forcing them to fire it off early by giving them a choice of taking out a Life from the Loam or the lands it is targeting. Most of the time they let you get the lands, and you can proceed to be the control deck that has guaranteed land drops for the next several turns while you draw to another dredger.
I can't even remember the last time I played against a Rest in Peace or Leyline of the Void (which can't be Abrupt Decayed and is therefore almost unbeatable), and I play this deck a LOT.
You talked about Smallpox and upping to a playset. I have played Assault Loam enough that I would advise against it and instead say play the fourth one in the sideboard if you haven't been doing so. I used to play all four and actually found it rather oppressive and hurting my own tempo too much. Vs some decks it was an all star, but the others I was happy to just discard a copy or two and not be drawing it that often. I'd say play with a fourth for a while and see if this deck is any better suited for it. But in my experience it just isn't worth it. Also on a side note Infect auto-looses to Smallpox.
Another question is that have you been finding it is too much impact on your life if Haakon is getting Bolted? I was finding that you can almost be burned out while they are weakening your board state. What measures have you taken to prevent this, if any?
You talked about Smallpox and upping to a playset. I have played Assault Loam enough that I would advise against it and instead say play the fourth one in the sideboard if you haven't been doing so. I used to play all four and actually found it rather oppressive and hurting my own tempo too much. Vs some decks it was an all star, but the others I was happy to just discard a copy or two and not be drawing it that often. I'd say play with a fourth for a while and see if this deck is any better suited for it. But in my experience it just isn't worth it. Also on a side note Infect auto-looses to Smallpox.
Another question is that have you been finding it is too much impact on your life if Haakon is getting Bolted? I was finding that you can almost be burned out while they are weakening your board state. What measures have you taken to prevent this, if any?
Good to hear someone else agrees with my choice of 3 Smallpox. I played 4 for a while and eventually cut one when I wanted another copy of Darkblast. I feel like the deck has been performing better because of it, but I have had a really hard time justifying it in words. I think your analysis is spot on, and I think a fourth in the sideboard is a good call.
It depends on what stage in the game you are at. If you are trying to just keep playing him as a blocker, I've certainly had that problem. The most common way I lose against BGx is them landing a Tarmogoyf I can't answer and having enough removal spells to clear out the Haakon or Stinkweed Imp I try to throw in the way every turn. However, later in the game, when you have time, it is often correct to take an extra turn clearing out their hand before trying to land him. If I am below ~8 life and my opponent plays enough removal spells, I will usually keep dredging until I can either play Haakon+Knight of the Reliquary on the same turn or just get some Lingering Souls+Gavony Township going. However, it is certainly far and away the most common way for me to lose games I really shouldn't. I guess the important part is learning how to evaluate when you really NEED Haakon in those situations. When I first started playing the deck, I would jam the Haakon from my grave instead of Lingering Souls every time because, ya know, CARD ADVANTAGE. After I played the deck more, I came to really appreciate his drawback as a real drawback that you need to consider when choosing how to sequence your spells.
Also, on another related side note, Infect auto-loses to Darkblast as well. The matchup is good.
I don't think that Damnation is necessary with all of your removal, maybe for the SB. I'd recommend testing out Inquisition of Kozilek, Kitchen Finks, and Tarmogoyf. They all have greaty synergy with Smallpox. Inquisition is good because smallpox can prevent them from getting 4 lands, kitchen finks can be saced for smallpox, and smallpox beefs up Tarmogoyf. Also, 4 loam seems like too many to me because it's a late game play and you can get it back into your hand.
Also, I don't know how you can say Lily is bad. She's one of the best cards in modern, and has great synergy with your deck.
EDIT: I'd also highly recommend Flagstones of Trokair. When you sacrifice it to smallpox, you can put a Godless Shrine or a Temple Garden in play. It makes the mana base trickier, but IMHO it's worth it, especially with Fetid Heath and Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth around.
Just wanted to say thanks to bGnomes for brewing this decklist and sharing it with us. I think I've found my deck for this PTQ season
Today I tried it for the first time in a local 20 people FNM and I enjoyed it very much I used the "PTQ list" in the first page with minor modifications (just changed a fetch for the fourth Abrupt Decay mainboard and tweaked the side for my meta) and went 3-1-1. I defeated Vengevine, Angel Pod and Storm, tied with WURg tempo (If only I had had an additional turn, I would have won the last match) and lost to Bogles.
This deck is tricky and exciting, very fun to play with. Destroying the hand of the WURg player with Raven's crime and the Loam engine was priceless
Finally picked up the last cards I needed in paper. It seems that Haakons are hard to find these days. I jammed out some games and they all went well. Have you made any changes recently? It seems to me that the flex slots of the deck come from the Stinkweed Imps and Damnations. What do you think about them? I was also running 1 less Smallpox and a Stirring Wildwood. Also any advice on if people start baording Rest in Peace just for this deck? I guess it would be similar to Assualt Loam, but more resilient.
Just wanted to say thanks to bGnomes for brewing this decklist and sharing it with us. I think I've found my deck for this PTQ season
Today I tried it for the first time in a local 20 people FNM and I enjoyed it very much I used the "PTQ list" in the first page with minor modifications (just changed a fetch for the fourth Abrupt Decay mainboard and tweaked the side for my meta) and went 3-1-1. I defeated Vengevine, Angel Pod and Storm, tied with WURg tempo (If only I had had an additional turn, I would have won the last match) and lost to Bogles.
This deck is tricky and exciting, very fun to play with. Destroying the hand of the WURg player with Raven's crime and the Loam engine was priceless
Glad you're enjoying it! The deck definitely rewards careful decision making and really learning each matchup in the format. The first time you REALLY Loam/Crime someone is always pretty sweet.
Finally picked up the last cards I needed in paper. It seems that Haakons are hard to find these days. I jammed out some games and they all went well. Have you made any changes recently? It seems to me that the flex slots of the deck come from the Stinkweed Imps and Damnations. What do you think about them? I was also running 1 less Smallpox and a Stirring Wildwood. Also any advice on if people start baording Rest in Peace just for this deck? I guess it would be similar to Assualt Loam, but more resilient.
I am currently at GP Boston/Worcester, and I made day 2. I went undefeated in day 1 except for the last round where I got crushed by Guillaume Wafo-Tapa on Esper control.
The list I am playing has the same maindeck as the PTQ list, with the sideboard having the following changes:
-1 Pithing Needle
-1 Nature's Claim
-1 Leyline of the Void
+1 Unravel the AEther
+1 Damnation
+1 Stony Silence
I'll probably do a more in depth explanation and report from the GP later tonight.
Finally picked up the last cards I needed in paper. It seems that Haakons are hard to find these days. I jammed out some games and they all went well. Have you made any changes recently? It seems to me that the flex slots of the deck come from the Stinkweed Imps and Damnations. What do you think about them? I was also running 1 less Smallpox and a Stirring Wildwood. Also any advice on if people start baording Rest in Peace just for this deck? I guess it would be similar to Assualt Loam, but more resilient.
I am currently at GP Boston/Worcester, and I made day 2. I went undefeated in day 1 except for the last round where I got crushed by Guillaume Wafo-Tapa on Esper control.
The list I am playing has the same maindeck as the PTQ list, with the sideboard having the following changes:
-1 Pithing Needle
-1 Nature's Claim
-1 Leyline of the Void
+1 Unravel the AEther
+1 Damnation
+1 Stony Silence
I'll probably do a more in depth explanation and report from the GP later tonight.
Congrats on the day 2! I feel like this is a pretty powerful deck that isn't putting up results because people aren't playing it because they don't know about it, but it has potential. I'll be playing it in the coming weeks so hearing about your results will probably help.
I am currently at GP Boston/Worcester, and I made day 2. I went undefeated in day 1 except for the last round where I got crushed by Guillaume Wafo-Tapa on Esper control.
The list I am playing has the same maindeck as the PTQ list, with the sideboard having the following changes:
-1 Pithing Needle
-1 Nature's Claim
-1 Leyline of the Void
+1 Unravel the AEther
+1 Damnation
+1 Stony Silence
I'll probably do a more in depth explanation and report from the GP later tonight.
[...] and a deck based around "Haakon, Stromgald Surge" (Emperor Haakon?). We're not kidding when we say you can play whatever you want and win, provided you're willing to put in the hours learning your matchups and polishing your sideboard.
The deck has indeed been spotted, Looking forward to your GP report bGnomes
Edit: Looks like I've been beat to it, so much for not refreshing the page before posting
Cool! Yeah I ended up not doing very well in day 2 at all, mostly due to minor misplays and bad mulligan decisions on my part. I was still very happy with the deck as it is configured now, and look forward to playing it again.
I didn't take super detailed notes about each match, but I'll share some of what I remember. Some details might be mixed up, but it should still give you a good idea of how my days went.
Round 1, 2: Byes that I won with the deck about a month ago at a local GPT.
Round 3 Matt with Mono U Merfolk (1-1): Starting off the day with a draw definitely dampened my mood a little, but I think it was for the best. It pretty much meant I was unable to face Burn for the entire tournament. As for the match, we both mulliganed down to 5 for 2 of the games. Game 1 he ran me over because I didn't have any cards that mattered, and game 2 Darkblast was able to keep him off his Cursecatchers and Silvergill Adepts while I assembled an early Haakon/Inversion. Game 3 was close and could have gone either way. I had the game more or less locked up, but I was at 2 life. On turn 4 of turns, he vialed in a lord, and on turn 5 I was able to Darkblast it to go to 1 and get the draw.
Round 4 George with UW Merfolk (2-1): Very similar to the previous round, with us both mulling very low for most of the games. Again, I got run over in game 1, but this time I was able to assemble Haakon/Inversion in games 2 and 3 to close out the game.
Round 5 Jeff with GR Tron (2-1): Jeff was probably the best Tron player I have had the pleasure of playing against, and he was very careful in his play. In game 1, I didn't know what kind of hand I needed to keep so I ended up keeping a hand with a lot of removal and not much else. Game 2 I was able to play a Stony Silence to stop his Relic of Progenitus from interrupting my Life from the Loam, and Knight of the Reliquary fetched up a Ghost Quarter to Strip Mine lock him. Game 3 I also assembled the Loam/Quarter package, but time in the round was almost up and I really didn't want another draw. I ended up playing too fast and let him resolve a Karn when I tried adding more pressure. I was able to power through it and finished the match with a minute left on the clock.
Round 6 Julien with UWR Twin (2-0): Game 1, I assembled Loam/Crime early and was tearing apart his hand, assuming he was on UWR control. Around turn 4, one of the cards he discarded was a Splinter Twin, which took me by surprise. It ended up not mattering, and he went on the burn plan, taking me down to 3 life before I was able to find a Gavony Township for my growing army of spirits. He had one draw step to find the bolt, and didn't find it. Game 2, he mulliganed to 5 and kept a hand with 2 Collonades, a Leyline of Sanctity, and 2 Snapcasters. The hand I kept had a few Knight of the Reliquarys, a Darkblast, and a Torpor Orb, so I didn't care about the Leyline and proceeded to kill him with giant Knights.
Round 7 Steve with Scapeshift (2-1): Game 1, I kept a hand with a lot of removal, and not a lot of ways to actually interact with his deck. I died the turn he hit 7 lands. Games 2 and 3 I was able to assemble Loam/Crime/Tectonic Edge with the help of Knight of the Reliquary to completely shut him out of the game. After the match, he revealed that he did not play any graveyard hate in his sideboard.
Round 8 John with Affinity (2-0): Game 1, my opponent took me down to 7 life before I was able to cast the Damnation in my hand. After that, I was able to play the Haakon from my graveyard followed by a few Knight of the Reliquarys to close out the game. He was able to find one Galvanic Blast before I killed him, but not a second. In game 2, he mulled to 5 and I kept 7 card hand with Stony Silence, Darkblast, and Damnation. The game was not close.
Round 9 Guillaume with Esper Control (0-2): Guillaume Wafo-Tapa is a much better opponent than I am used to playing against. Game 1, I was unable to assemble anything, and he proceeded to bury me under his card advantage. Game 2, I got Loam/Crime together early, but he played a turn 4 Elspeth, Knight Errant. The pressure from that combined with several Spell Snares for my Loams meant that I was stuck on few lands and unable to pressure the planeswalker except with a few spirit tokens. I had a major misplay where I forgot to fetch a second green source, leaving my only access to Loam vulnerable to his Tectonic Edge. I was unable to dredge Loam because he would take out my green source on my draw step, so I was forced to simply draw instead. I ended up not finding anything of use.
I ended day 1 7-1-1, and was pretty excited to play the next day.
Round 10 Chris with Twin (1-2): We got deckchecked, and Chris ended up getting a game loss for writing his deck down wrong. In game 2, (not knowing what my opponent was playing) I kept a hand with Liliana of the Veil, Darkblast, Lingering Souls, and lands. He proceeded to just jam his combo on an Exarch on turn 4 into Abrupt Decay mana, but I didn't have it. Game 3, I mulled to 6 and kept a reasonable hand with Loam, Crime, Inversion, and lands, figuring that the only way I lose is if my opponent has exactly turn 4 combo on an Exarch. He did. I died having just dredged a Darkblast into my graveyard, meaning the next turn I could have dredged it to prevent an Exarch combo.
Round 11 Jeff (again!) with GR Tron (0-2): I was matched up against Jeff again, who dubbed this matchup his "nightmare matchup". However, he did a fantastic job of playing around Tectonic Edge, and his Relic of Progenitus was able to stave off my Loam/Quarter for long enough to resolve a few threats. Game 2 was pretty much the same.
Round 12 Ben with Goryo Breach (2-0): This was the only match I won in day 2, and it wasn't close. Game 1 I Smallpoxed his second land away and Abrupt Decayed his Pentad Prism before destroying his hand with Raven's Crime. By the time he saw a second land, he didn't have the cards to combo, and I killed him with Spirits and Knight of the Reliquary. Game 2 I led with turn 0 Leyline of the Void, and proceeded to Raven's Crime him out of the game.
Round 13 Ian with Affinity (1-2): Game 1, I didn't have a sweeper or access to green mana, and died quickly. I gave no indication of playing a graveyard deck. Game 2, I used Darkblast and Lingering Souls to stop his attackers before playing a Damping Matrix to disable his Cranial Plating. From there, I assembled Haakon/Inversion and quickly finished the game before he was able to kill me with burn from my 1 life. Game 3, I had Lingering Souls and multiple Abrupt Decays, but he topdecked an Etched Champion and killed me with it and the Arcbound Ravager that I should have Decayed the previous turn before I could find one of my 4 copies of Damnation.
Round 14 William (0-2): I honestly don't remember anything about this match, and I forgot to write down what he was playing.
Overall, I was pretty happy with my performance, but I definitely need to work on avoiding small misplays that end up costing me games. It's actually pretty interesting how in a lot of matchups I end up losing game 1 but continuing to beat my opponent in games 2 and 3. I think a lot of this is due to how extremely matchup dependant hands with this deck are, and not knowing what your opponent is playing often leaves you with the wrong pieces in a given matchup. Games 2 and 3 I know what to mulligan to, and that advantage seems to overcome most graveyard hate my opponents bring in.
I also somehow managed to completely dodge BGx, Pod, and UWR control, which all seem to be fairly common and also pretty good matchups (and one would think would be especially prevalent in the draw bracket).
How would you say this deck compares to 4c Gifts Ungiven (which I play)? Both decks run the Loam/Crime combo, and Gifts sometimes also runs Knight of the Reliquary (and very rarely also runs Haakon/Inversion). Your list looks much more consistent at getting out the combos, but seems less flexible and a bit more vulnerable to graveyard hate.
How would you say this deck compares to 4c Gifts Ungiven (which I play)? Both decks run the Loam/Crime combo, and Gifts sometimes also runs Knight of the Reliquary (and very rarely also runs Haakon/Inversion). Your list looks much more consistent at getting out the combos, but seems less flexible and a bit more vulnerable to graveyard hate.
Thanks! I think your observation is about right. I played 4C Gifts before this deck (and before DRS was banned), and I would say that the best way to describe it is that this deck is more focused while being less versatile. Gifts has a lot of different things going on in it, and you often find yourself drawing half of a certain engine and another half of a different one. Consistently having access to the entire engine you want requires you to resolve a 4 mana spell (which is not trivial). However, the tradeoff is that you get access to a lot more options when you need them, including the Gifts/Rites combo.
Another thing to note is that when you have access to the full Loam plan (Crime/Tec Edge/Loam) in Gifts, the cards you dredge every turn aren't nearly as impactful as they are in this deck. In this deck, when you get a dredge engine going, you rapidly find all the other pieces you want in a way that is incredibly hard to interact with (dredge) rather than needing to rely on resolving more Gifts Ungivens or your draw step.
Also, if you get a piece exiled, there are more copies in your deck. This comes up most frequently games 2 and 3, but it is still a consideration.
Gifts is definitely a solid deck, but I found that the games I enjoyed the most were the ones where I cast Gifts for a Loam package, so I decided to work on a deck with access to that package from turn 1 instead.
I was turned on to this deck from the 'what deck should I play' thread, and I love it. I put it together last night and played a few matches, but I noticed that I was hitting a very precarious life total early, especially against aggro decks. My solution was to add one copy of Blind Obedience to the main and one to the board. I took out one copy of Darkblast in the main and the board copy of Damnation. In the games where I drew it, it really helped stabilize, as Loam and Crime become even more busted with Extort. Closing out the game with BO seems like a potential win-con, so much so that I'm thinking about adding another copy to the main board. Seems like it could have game against control as well as this attacks their life total without doing anything other than what the deck wants to do anyway.
With the Loam engine and problems with life similar to Assault Loam, why not try out Dark Heart of the Wood? Once we stabilize it can just sac a land or 2 every once in a while to cushion our life totals. The lands won't be gone forever thanks to Loam and KotR can find some extra Forests if we need them. Thoughts on 1-2 in the sideboard?
At the moment I'm running a combination of Nameless Inversion, Darkblast, and Crib Swap as my main board removal. Mostly I wanted to see how far I could push it without using a sweeper effect (Also short one of my Damnation's which was a contributor to that effort lol, even though I have a few Drown's I've been considering using). I think you are probably spot on with Death Cloud though, but I think I'll still toss it in for a few games just to see firsthand if it falls shy of being effective. I don't expect much from it, and will probably move it out as soon as I can get a hold of another Damnation. Or Drown in Sorrow until I get one.
Yeah let me know how it goes, I could be completely wrong about it. I'm also a little interested to hear from people who play Crib Swap about how often the token you give them gets in the way of your sac effects (Smallpox, Liliana of the Veil, and in your case Death Cloud). I was always a little wary of playing it because of that, but it might not be as big of an issue as I am making it out to be. Having more outs to a Tarmogoyf is always a good thing.
I think your build lacks focus. Reanimation is a perfectly legitimate and powerful strategy in this style of deck, and a solid Junk-colored list would have a much more reliable manabase than the sketchy 4-color variants that are out there (while regrettably losing Faithless Looting). However, you need to decide if you want it to be your plan A, your plan B, or not in the deck at all. Playing 1 Unburial Rites and 1 Elesh Norn as your only target for it means that you will rarely (if ever) manage to find both pieces before the game ends, and they will usually just get in the way.
If you decide you want to focus more on a reanimation strategy, I would say you want at LEAST 3 Unburial Rites, and at least 2 large monsters (Elesh Norn/Borborygmos Enraged/Sun Titan/Grave Titan). You could also kind of go 2 and a half by adding something like a Thragtusk that is very easily castable yet still a good target to decrease the odds of Rites being completely dead.
I feel like Rites/fatty and Worm Harvest kind of occupy the same slot as game-ending play to dredge into, and you only want just enough of those to be able to find them reliably. The same thing is also kind of true about the Haakon engine, and it's possible that they don't belong in the same deck because of that. I am interested to see how it works out for you though.
Azusa, Lost but Seeking is something I might actually try in the board at some point. It is at its best against decks that don't play a lot of removal and lose hard to recurring Tectonic Edges/Ghost Quarters. Scapeshift and Tron come to mind. I'm curious as to how impactful it is in those matchups.
Played against Infect, Jund, Twin, BGw Midrange.
I don't really have much of a report, as all the games weren't too difficult. I played against 4 pretty solid matchups, and grinded them down to no resources before playing Haakon followed by 1-3 gigantic Knight of the Reliquarys.
As for thoughts, I had a few.
I have been playing close attention to when I feel like I want another Smallpox, as I'm still not sure 3 is correct. The 4 matchups I happened to play against, Smallpox was insane. Having your Twin opponent Clique you and have to take Smallpox over the Abrupt Decay in your hand is a testament to how powerful of a spell it really is. That being said, against a lot of very popular matchups (read: Affinity and Pod) it is pretty much uncastable as it will barely affect the board while pushing you further away from a crucial Damnation.
I definitely think the more I play the BGx matchup, the better it becomes. Learning how to play postboarded games, and how to board based on what I showed my opponent G1 has made me much more successful. Since most BGx players have never played against this deck, you can kind of determine whether they are going to take out their Thoughtseizes and Inquisition of Kozileks based on how game 1 went. If they got blown out by a timely Damnation, they will probably keep them in. If they Thoughtseize on turn 1 and see Haakon, Life from the Loam, and Lingering Souls, they will probably board them all out. You can use this to your advantage when deciding mulligans and when choosing whether you want your Leyline of Sanctitys in games 2 and 3. As a general rule though, I have been happy with boarding them in against Jund, but not the other flavors (because Jund plays Jund Charm/Rakdos Charm/Slaughter Games).
Also the only graveyard hate I saw for the entire event was Scavenging Ooze. I don't know if I just got lucky, or if people are really trimming down on the real hate, but it has been working well for me either way.
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
Yeah I remember that. I was playing 4c Gifts at the time, and I actually STOPPED playing it after DRS got banned because there was just too much overcompensation.
Nowadays, you see almost exclusively Grafdigger's Cage, which doesn't even interact with Life from the Loam. Relic of Progenitus is also kind of common, but it's very easy to play around by forcing them to fire it off early by giving them a choice of taking out a Life from the Loam or the lands it is targeting. Most of the time they let you get the lands, and you can proceed to be the control deck that has guaranteed land drops for the next several turns while you draw to another dredger.
I can't even remember the last time I played against a Rest in Peace or Leyline of the Void (which can't be Abrupt Decayed and is therefore almost unbeatable), and I play this deck a LOT.
You talked about Smallpox and upping to a playset. I have played Assault Loam enough that I would advise against it and instead say play the fourth one in the sideboard if you haven't been doing so. I used to play all four and actually found it rather oppressive and hurting my own tempo too much. Vs some decks it was an all star, but the others I was happy to just discard a copy or two and not be drawing it that often. I'd say play with a fourth for a while and see if this deck is any better suited for it. But in my experience it just isn't worth it. Also on a side note Infect auto-looses to Smallpox.
Another question is that have you been finding it is too much impact on your life if Haakon is getting Bolted? I was finding that you can almost be burned out while they are weakening your board state. What measures have you taken to prevent this, if any?
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
Good to hear someone else agrees with my choice of 3 Smallpox. I played 4 for a while and eventually cut one when I wanted another copy of Darkblast. I feel like the deck has been performing better because of it, but I have had a really hard time justifying it in words. I think your analysis is spot on, and I think a fourth in the sideboard is a good call.
It depends on what stage in the game you are at. If you are trying to just keep playing him as a blocker, I've certainly had that problem. The most common way I lose against BGx is them landing a Tarmogoyf I can't answer and having enough removal spells to clear out the Haakon or Stinkweed Imp I try to throw in the way every turn. However, later in the game, when you have time, it is often correct to take an extra turn clearing out their hand before trying to land him. If I am below ~8 life and my opponent plays enough removal spells, I will usually keep dredging until I can either play Haakon+Knight of the Reliquary on the same turn or just get some Lingering Souls+Gavony Township going. However, it is certainly far and away the most common way for me to lose games I really shouldn't. I guess the important part is learning how to evaluate when you really NEED Haakon in those situations. When I first started playing the deck, I would jam the Haakon from my grave instead of Lingering Souls every time because, ya know, CARD ADVANTAGE. After I played the deck more, I came to really appreciate his drawback as a real drawback that you need to consider when choosing how to sequence your spells.
Also, on another related side note, Infect auto-loses to Darkblast as well. The matchup is good.
Also, I don't know how you can say Lily is bad. She's one of the best cards in modern, and has great synergy with your deck.
Here's the junk smallpox build that I run.
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Tragic Slip
4 Smallpox
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Lingering Souls
Creatures - 15
4 Bloodghast
4 Dark Confidant
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Kitchen Finks
Planeswalkers - 3
3 Liliana of the Veil
4 Flagstones of Trokair
4 Fetid Heath
4 Godless Shrine
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Temple Garden
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Swamp
1 Forest
1 Plains
3 Auriok Champion
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Wrench Mind
3 Fulminator Mage
EDIT: I'd also highly recommend Flagstones of Trokair. When you sacrifice it to smallpox, you can put a Godless Shrine or a Temple Garden in play. It makes the mana base trickier, but IMHO it's worth it, especially with Fetid Heath and Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth around.
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
Just wanted to say thanks to bGnomes for brewing this decklist and sharing it with us. I think I've found my deck for this PTQ season
Today I tried it for the first time in a local 20 people FNM and I enjoyed it very much I used the "PTQ list" in the first page with minor modifications (just changed a fetch for the fourth Abrupt Decay mainboard and tweaked the side for my meta) and went 3-1-1. I defeated Vengevine, Angel Pod and Storm, tied with WURg tempo (If only I had had an additional turn, I would have won the last match) and lost to Bogles.
This deck is tricky and exciting, very fun to play with. Destroying the hand of the WURg player with Raven's crime and the Loam engine was priceless
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
Glad you're enjoying it! The deck definitely rewards careful decision making and really learning each matchup in the format. The first time you REALLY Loam/Crime someone is always pretty sweet.
I am currently at GP Boston/Worcester, and I made day 2. I went undefeated in day 1 except for the last round where I got crushed by Guillaume Wafo-Tapa on Esper control.
The list I am playing has the same maindeck as the PTQ list, with the sideboard having the following changes:
-1 Pithing Needle
-1 Nature's Claim
-1 Leyline of the Void
+1 Unravel the AEther
+1 Damnation
+1 Stony Silence
I'll probably do a more in depth explanation and report from the GP later tonight.
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
Seems like you have been paid attention! ("The Rogue's gallery")
The deck has indeed been spotted, Looking forward to your GP report bGnomes
Edit: Looks like I've been beat to it, so much for not refreshing the page before posting
Cool! Yeah I ended up not doing very well in day 2 at all, mostly due to minor misplays and bad mulligan decisions on my part. I was still very happy with the deck as it is configured now, and look forward to playing it again.
I didn't take super detailed notes about each match, but I'll share some of what I remember. Some details might be mixed up, but it should still give you a good idea of how my days went.
Round 1, 2: Byes that I won with the deck about a month ago at a local GPT.
Round 3 Matt with Mono U Merfolk (1-1): Starting off the day with a draw definitely dampened my mood a little, but I think it was for the best. It pretty much meant I was unable to face Burn for the entire tournament. As for the match, we both mulliganed down to 5 for 2 of the games. Game 1 he ran me over because I didn't have any cards that mattered, and game 2 Darkblast was able to keep him off his Cursecatchers and Silvergill Adepts while I assembled an early Haakon/Inversion. Game 3 was close and could have gone either way. I had the game more or less locked up, but I was at 2 life. On turn 4 of turns, he vialed in a lord, and on turn 5 I was able to Darkblast it to go to 1 and get the draw.
Round 4 George with UW Merfolk (2-1): Very similar to the previous round, with us both mulling very low for most of the games. Again, I got run over in game 1, but this time I was able to assemble Haakon/Inversion in games 2 and 3 to close out the game.
Round 5 Jeff with GR Tron (2-1): Jeff was probably the best Tron player I have had the pleasure of playing against, and he was very careful in his play. In game 1, I didn't know what kind of hand I needed to keep so I ended up keeping a hand with a lot of removal and not much else. Game 2 I was able to play a Stony Silence to stop his Relic of Progenitus from interrupting my Life from the Loam, and Knight of the Reliquary fetched up a Ghost Quarter to Strip Mine lock him. Game 3 I also assembled the Loam/Quarter package, but time in the round was almost up and I really didn't want another draw. I ended up playing too fast and let him resolve a Karn when I tried adding more pressure. I was able to power through it and finished the match with a minute left on the clock.
Round 6 Julien with UWR Twin (2-0): Game 1, I assembled Loam/Crime early and was tearing apart his hand, assuming he was on UWR control. Around turn 4, one of the cards he discarded was a Splinter Twin, which took me by surprise. It ended up not mattering, and he went on the burn plan, taking me down to 3 life before I was able to find a Gavony Township for my growing army of spirits. He had one draw step to find the bolt, and didn't find it. Game 2, he mulliganed to 5 and kept a hand with 2 Collonades, a Leyline of Sanctity, and 2 Snapcasters. The hand I kept had a few Knight of the Reliquarys, a Darkblast, and a Torpor Orb, so I didn't care about the Leyline and proceeded to kill him with giant Knights.
Round 7 Steve with Scapeshift (2-1): Game 1, I kept a hand with a lot of removal, and not a lot of ways to actually interact with his deck. I died the turn he hit 7 lands. Games 2 and 3 I was able to assemble Loam/Crime/Tectonic Edge with the help of Knight of the Reliquary to completely shut him out of the game. After the match, he revealed that he did not play any graveyard hate in his sideboard.
Round 8 John with Affinity (2-0): Game 1, my opponent took me down to 7 life before I was able to cast the Damnation in my hand. After that, I was able to play the Haakon from my graveyard followed by a few Knight of the Reliquarys to close out the game. He was able to find one Galvanic Blast before I killed him, but not a second. In game 2, he mulled to 5 and I kept 7 card hand with Stony Silence, Darkblast, and Damnation. The game was not close.
Round 9 Guillaume with Esper Control (0-2): Guillaume Wafo-Tapa is a much better opponent than I am used to playing against. Game 1, I was unable to assemble anything, and he proceeded to bury me under his card advantage. Game 2, I got Loam/Crime together early, but he played a turn 4 Elspeth, Knight Errant. The pressure from that combined with several Spell Snares for my Loams meant that I was stuck on few lands and unable to pressure the planeswalker except with a few spirit tokens. I had a major misplay where I forgot to fetch a second green source, leaving my only access to Loam vulnerable to his Tectonic Edge. I was unable to dredge Loam because he would take out my green source on my draw step, so I was forced to simply draw instead. I ended up not finding anything of use.
I ended day 1 7-1-1, and was pretty excited to play the next day.
Round 10 Chris with Twin (1-2): We got deckchecked, and Chris ended up getting a game loss for writing his deck down wrong. In game 2, (not knowing what my opponent was playing) I kept a hand with Liliana of the Veil, Darkblast, Lingering Souls, and lands. He proceeded to just jam his combo on an Exarch on turn 4 into Abrupt Decay mana, but I didn't have it. Game 3, I mulled to 6 and kept a reasonable hand with Loam, Crime, Inversion, and lands, figuring that the only way I lose is if my opponent has exactly turn 4 combo on an Exarch. He did. I died having just dredged a Darkblast into my graveyard, meaning the next turn I could have dredged it to prevent an Exarch combo.
Round 11 Jeff (again!) with GR Tron (0-2): I was matched up against Jeff again, who dubbed this matchup his "nightmare matchup". However, he did a fantastic job of playing around Tectonic Edge, and his Relic of Progenitus was able to stave off my Loam/Quarter for long enough to resolve a few threats. Game 2 was pretty much the same.
Round 12 Ben with Goryo Breach (2-0): This was the only match I won in day 2, and it wasn't close. Game 1 I Smallpoxed his second land away and Abrupt Decayed his Pentad Prism before destroying his hand with Raven's Crime. By the time he saw a second land, he didn't have the cards to combo, and I killed him with Spirits and Knight of the Reliquary. Game 2 I led with turn 0 Leyline of the Void, and proceeded to Raven's Crime him out of the game.
Round 13 Ian with Affinity (1-2): Game 1, I didn't have a sweeper or access to green mana, and died quickly. I gave no indication of playing a graveyard deck. Game 2, I used Darkblast and Lingering Souls to stop his attackers before playing a Damping Matrix to disable his Cranial Plating. From there, I assembled Haakon/Inversion and quickly finished the game before he was able to kill me with burn from my 1 life. Game 3, I had Lingering Souls and multiple Abrupt Decays, but he topdecked an Etched Champion and killed me with it and the Arcbound Ravager that I should have Decayed the previous turn before I could find one of my 4 copies of Damnation.
Round 14 William (0-2): I honestly don't remember anything about this match, and I forgot to write down what he was playing.
Overall, I was pretty happy with my performance, but I definitely need to work on avoiding small misplays that end up costing me games. It's actually pretty interesting how in a lot of matchups I end up losing game 1 but continuing to beat my opponent in games 2 and 3. I think a lot of this is due to how extremely matchup dependant hands with this deck are, and not knowing what your opponent is playing often leaves you with the wrong pieces in a given matchup. Games 2 and 3 I know what to mulligan to, and that advantage seems to overcome most graveyard hate my opponents bring in.
I also somehow managed to completely dodge BGx, Pod, and UWR control, which all seem to be fairly common and also pretty good matchups (and one would think would be especially prevalent in the draw bracket).
How would you say this deck compares to 4c Gifts Ungiven (which I play)? Both decks run the Loam/Crime combo, and Gifts sometimes also runs Knight of the Reliquary (and very rarely also runs Haakon/Inversion). Your list looks much more consistent at getting out the combos, but seems less flexible and a bit more vulnerable to graveyard hate.
Thanks! I think your observation is about right. I played 4C Gifts before this deck (and before DRS was banned), and I would say that the best way to describe it is that this deck is more focused while being less versatile. Gifts has a lot of different things going on in it, and you often find yourself drawing half of a certain engine and another half of a different one. Consistently having access to the entire engine you want requires you to resolve a 4 mana spell (which is not trivial). However, the tradeoff is that you get access to a lot more options when you need them, including the Gifts/Rites combo.
Another thing to note is that when you have access to the full Loam plan (Crime/Tec Edge/Loam) in Gifts, the cards you dredge every turn aren't nearly as impactful as they are in this deck. In this deck, when you get a dredge engine going, you rapidly find all the other pieces you want in a way that is incredibly hard to interact with (dredge) rather than needing to rely on resolving more Gifts Ungivens or your draw step.
Also, if you get a piece exiled, there are more copies in your deck. This comes up most frequently games 2 and 3, but it is still a consideration.
Gifts is definitely a solid deck, but I found that the games I enjoyed the most were the ones where I cast Gifts for a Loam package, so I decided to work on a deck with access to that package from turn 1 instead.
Thoughts?
RBGLiving EndRBG
EDH
UFblthpU
BRXantchaRB
BGVarolzGB
URWZedruuWRU
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge