Can't help but think that Dismember needs to fill a few slots in the SB. Could have made all the difference in that Infect matchup. Is the 9 card sideboard in Bowmans list correct?
I don't know if he said it in his deck tech, but when I was talking to Adam last night he said he would have liked to play the 4th Sedge Sliver but couldn't find one before the tournament.
If I remember his deck tech correctly, Finding Sedge Slivers was the reason he got his first game loss for registration (he gave up in the end trying to find them and just went with what he had)
There were four 'losses':
1. Infect
2. Showing up late
3. ???
4. ???
Anyone remember the other two? I only caught a small bit of the tournament myself.
I agree that Sedge sliver #4 would be fantastic. I always run 4 of them and absolutely love them.
Quick search reveals Bowmans losses were as follows.
Loss Round 1 - The Elusive Sedge Sliver
Loss Round 10 - Eric Hawkins on Grixis Twin
Loss Round 12 - Jose David Marzuca Lozano on Jund
Loss QF's - Todd Anderson on Infect
Full results below. (no deck names as most of them were outside the top 32, but we know he beat Affinity and Abzan
Tournament: Modern Open - Cincinnati
Round 2 WIN 2 - 0 - 0 VS Brett Feind (0) at Table 319
Round 3 WIN 2 - 0 - 0 VS Asa Snyder (3) at Table 184
Round 4 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS Robby Hayes (6) at Table 75
Round 5 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS Patrick Aguilar (9) at Table 40
Round 6 WIN 2 - 0 - 0 VS Alexander Javed (12) at Table 52
Round 7 WIN 2 - 0 - 0 VS Alex Hon (15) at Table 16
Round 8 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS James Corbett (18) at Table 13
Round 9 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS Joshua Inda (21) at Table 5
Round 10 LOSS 1 - 2 - 0 VS Eric Hawkins (24) at Table 4
Round 11 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS David Rudolph (24) at Table 6
Round 12 LOSS 1 - 2 - 0 VS Jose David Marzuca Lozano (27) at Table 4
Round 13 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS Jack Brush (27) at Table 14
Round 14 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS Chris Andersen (33) at Table 4
Round 15 0 - 0 - 0 VS Kazu Negri (33) at Table 7
The deck almost feels like a mixture of Merfolk, elves and goblins with the lords, ramp and haste but has access to way nastier abilities. The combat tricks were pretty brutal in action. Some spot removal thats easier to cast would definitely help the deck out.
The reason I dont like Sedge Sliver is how it hurts our manabase. I run 4 Path in exchange to the Decays. I can run a lot of hate in the SB, because I have 3 green/white sources MB.
What do you think about Blur Sliver vs Firewake Sliver ? Blur has a bigger body and is easier to cast, but I like Firewake Slivers sac mode.
1. It can push trough those last points of damage.
2. You can sac a less important sliver to save a lord or Galerider Sliver against burn spells.
3. You can block and sac to prevent lifegain against Wurmcoil Engine or a bogle with lifelink. A huge deal in a race situation.
What do you think about Blur Sliver vs Firewake Sliver ? Blur has a bigger body and is easier to cast, but I like Firewake Slivers sac mode.
1. It can push trough those last points of damage.
2. You can sac a less important sliver to save a lord or Galerider Sliver against burn spells.
3. You can block and sac to prevent lifegain against Wurmcoil Engine or a bogle with lifelink. A huge deal in a race situation.
Seems too random to me. A 50/50 chance you sac a sliver for nothing?
Besides, I want the haste ability.
I also run a singleton Cautery Sliver in my list, and I love it so far.
You can shoot down Grim Lavamancer, or an infect creatue.
Or even a Cranial Plated Inkmoth Nexus or Vault Skirge.
You can also sac your team to push trough the last 4-6 damage.
Woot, glad this list is running very similarly to the one I was running, just need 2 more muta's to try the list out (was pretty much running everything else) yay
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Modern: C Serum Eldrazi Legacy: CEldrazi C Mud W Soldier Stompy R Bread (big red stompy) WU Spirit Blade WUG Meat Hooks WUBGR Blue Dredge
This list makes me want to play again. I love slivers.
Bonescythe sliver likes like for boggles or even heavy ago were trading damage gives double strike the advantage. Thos pesky man lands are eaten and poison is overcome. Not the fastes in mana cost, but effective.
Ever thought of using ghostflame sliver for all is dust. Play tested against a tron deck and that was hilarious.
What do you think about Blur Sliver vs Firewake Sliver ? Blur has a bigger body and is easier to cast, but I like Firewake Slivers sac mode.
1. It can push trough those last points of damage.
2. You can sac a less important sliver to save a lord or Galerider Sliver against burn spells.
3. You can block and sac to prevent lifegain against Wurmcoil Engine or a bogle with lifelink. A huge deal in a race situation.
Isn't that what DarkHeart Sliver is for? Sac mode and burn match ups?
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Oath of the Gatewatch; the set that caused the competitive community to freak out over Basic Lands.
Call me an odd one here, but wouldn't something like Chord of Calling work better than Collected Company here? I understand Company is a good card, but people try force it into every deck they can, even sometimes where it is not the best card.
I'd rather pull the exact card I need vs. maybe a 25% chance at a good hit of two useful creatures (the number is a guess, but I see Company miss more than hit personally).
This way you can make sure you get Galerider Sliver if he isn't in your opening hand + draw, or respond with a lord to burn, etc.
I think Chord gives you better silver (sliver) bullet options, even given the slightly higher cost (which can be offset with untapped creatures). To me, the tricks the deck can pull off just by adding another sliver to the table are it's biggest strength, and Company just doesn't give you exactly what you need everytime.
[ADD] OK forgot the GGG cost in Chord, might be a little hard to hit for mana.
Call me an odd one here, but wouldn't something like Chord of Calling work better than Collected Company here? I understand Company is a good card, but people try force it into every deck they can, even sometimes where it is not the best card.
I'd rather pull the exact card I need vs. maybe a 25% chance at a good hit of two useful creatures (the number is a guess, but I see Company miss more than hit personally).
This way you can make sure you get Galerider Sliver if he isn't in your opening hand + draw, or respond with a lord to burn, etc.
I think Chord gives you better silver (sliver) bullet options, even given the slightly higher cost (which can be offset with untapped creatures). To me, the tricks the deck can pull off just by adding another sliver to the table are it's biggest strength, and Company just doesn't give you exactly what you need everytime.
[ADD] OK forgot the GGG cost in Chord, might be a little hard to hit for mana.
i have tested it out in a sliver build and found it to be way too slow
As for whether or not Collected company will hit, there is about a 98% chance of hitting 1 sliver with it (assuming your sliver count is 30), not sure what the stats are for 2 slivers are, but its up there.
Trust me, after much testing and playing slivers for over 3 years in modern, coco gives much more gas that chord couldn't, even before Coco was released.
Also it might just be better to run homing sliver instead of chord of calling since it's easier to cast, and can't be countered (the sliver you fetch for also can't be countered with cavern of souls out.
I don't want to discourage you from testing it out because just maaaybe theres a magic combination of either/or that might make the deck crazy. But overall, you can trust that the lists used in bigger tournaments have tested it out themselves.
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Modern: C Serum Eldrazi Legacy: CEldrazi C Mud W Soldier Stompy R Bread (big red stompy) WU Spirit Blade WUG Meat Hooks WUBGR Blue Dredge
If all the duels in the deck are based around green, maybe chord could work.
What's the best mana base for this deck cause I want to add a godless shrine or temple garden to the net deck mana base. What do I pull in its place.
I wouldn't really say that the manabase is based to support green. What I mean is, the manabase is made to support 1 green (for abrupt, coco, manaweft, etc) but not much more than that (since cavern, sliver hive, muta doesn't support green spells but creatures only).
I wanted to ask why you wanted to add godless shrine? is it strictly for sinew sliver support? I would say breeding pool is the least relevant or the 2nd overgrown tomb. If you are planning to add white for path, its gunna be real rough trying to figure out the numbers because you now have to support black, green, white spells instead of just black, green (all the while maintaining mana support to cast slivers)
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Modern: C Serum Eldrazi Legacy: CEldrazi C Mud W Soldier Stompy R Bread (big red stompy) WU Spirit Blade WUG Meat Hooks WUBGR Blue Dredge
This list makes me want to play again. I love slivers.
Bonescythe sliver likes like for boggles or even heavy ago were trading damage gives double strike the advantage. Thos pesky man lands are eaten and poison is overcome. Not the fastes in mana cost, but effective.
Ever thought of using ghostflame sliver for all is dust. Play tested against a tron deck and that was hilarious.
thanks for the advice!
what would you trade out for it? effectively you will be slowing down the deck by increasing it's manacurve unless you side out Coco itself (which doesn't hit it).
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Modern: C Serum Eldrazi Legacy: CEldrazi C Mud W Soldier Stompy R Bread (big red stompy) WU Spirit Blade WUG Meat Hooks WUBGR Blue Dredge
Sinew sliver, bone scythe, and the vigilance one need white bad. I just want an access to white in the manabase beyond sliver only assistance lands. Path to exile is nice, but I was thinking the artifact hate sliver for needing white. Also, I would like access to Stoney silence, leyline of sanctity, or any direct hate for certain decks.
Homing sliver does look better than chord or collective company, but you get 2 creatures with collective company and removal of lands pockets if bad. Land pockets can kill. Ask any Jund or affinity player.
I kind of like dismember for the control, but play testing has me loosing way to much life for it. Blowing up non-creatures is really important. I tried thoughtsieze and/or IoK in its place and kind of liked it for forcing them to play something or loose it.
Sinew sliver, bone scythe, and the vigilance one need white bad. I just want an access to white in the manabase beyond sliver only assistance lands. Path to exile is nice, but I was thinking the artifact hate sliver for needing white. Also, I would like access to Stoney silence, leyline of sanctity, or any direct hate for certain decks.
Homing sliver does look better than chord or collective company, but you get 2 creatures with collective company and removal of lands pockets if bad. Land pockets can kill. Ask any Jund or affinity player.
I kind of like dismember for the control, but play testing has me loosing way to much life for it. Blowing up non-creatures is really important. I tried thoughtsieze and/or IoK in its place and kind of liked it for forcing them to play something or loose it.
i like the coco build (vs chord or homing) because it offers more flexibility with the side board (ie. hitting spellskite, magus of moon, etc)
I tried white for leylines and thought it wasn't worth it (just instead used chalice of the void) for the same matchups
white for path was really tough and clunky all the time. Test it out and see for yourself, often I found you had to decide whether or not to get godless for path or overgrown for Coco, but hitting both was either difficult (not enough fetches/draw) or too much self inflicted damage (fetch + shock on curve).
It's much easier to just hit your 1 overgrown tomb, and forget about needing to fix for the rest of the game than to keep stressing that you don't hit lands to cast path. I can see adding 1 white source to support the white slivers, but beyond that it gets really really tough. let me know if you end up finding a good ratio that works tho!
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Modern: C Serum Eldrazi Legacy: CEldrazi C Mud W Soldier Stompy R Bread (big red stompy) WU Spirit Blade WUG Meat Hooks WUBGR Blue Dredge
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2 Blur Sliver
1 Darkheart Sliver
3 Diffusion Sliver
4 Galerider Sliver
4 Manaweft Sliver
2 Necrotic Sliver
4 Predatory Sliver
3 Sedge Sliver
2 Sentinel Sliver
4 Sinew Sliver
1 Syphon Sliver
1 Forest
1 Blood Crypt
1 Breeding Pool
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
2 Overgrown Tomb
4 Sliver Hive
2 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
Spells (10)
4 Aether Vial
2 Abrupt Decay
4 Collected Company
2 Bonescythe Sliver
1 Darkheart Sliver
3 Harmonic Sliver
1 Shadow Sliver
2 Syphon Sliver
Modern Warp / UR Control / UR Storm / Naya Breachshift / ElectroBalance
Solidarity / Lands / Sneak and Show / Grixis Delver / Reanimator / Belcher / Storm / Dredge
Deck looked good, getting paired up with Infect can happen and it's difficult at the best of times, especially with a light removal package.
1. Infect
2. Showing up late
3. ???
4. ???
Anyone remember the other two? I only caught a small bit of the tournament myself.
I agree that Sedge sliver #4 would be fantastic. I always run 4 of them and absolutely love them.
Modern Warp / UR Control / UR Storm / Naya Breachshift / ElectroBalance
Solidarity / Lands / Sneak and Show / Grixis Delver / Reanimator / Belcher / Storm / Dredge
Loss Round 1 - The Elusive Sedge Sliver
Loss Round 10 - Eric Hawkins on Grixis Twin
Loss Round 12 - Jose David Marzuca Lozano on Jund
Loss QF's - Todd Anderson on Infect
Full results below. (no deck names as most of them were outside the top 32, but we know he beat Affinity and Abzan
Tournament: Modern Open - Cincinnati
Round 2 WIN 2 - 0 - 0 VS Brett Feind (0) at Table 319
Round 3 WIN 2 - 0 - 0 VS Asa Snyder (3) at Table 184
Round 4 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS Robby Hayes (6) at Table 75
Round 5 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS Patrick Aguilar (9) at Table 40
Round 6 WIN 2 - 0 - 0 VS Alexander Javed (12) at Table 52
Round 7 WIN 2 - 0 - 0 VS Alex Hon (15) at Table 16
Round 8 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS James Corbett (18) at Table 13
Round 9 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS Joshua Inda (21) at Table 5
Round 10 LOSS 1 - 2 - 0 VS Eric Hawkins (24) at Table 4
Round 11 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS David Rudolph (24) at Table 6
Round 12 LOSS 1 - 2 - 0 VS Jose David Marzuca Lozano (27) at Table 4
Round 13 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS Jack Brush (27) at Table 14
Round 14 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 VS Chris Andersen (33) at Table 4
Round 15 0 - 0 - 0 VS Kazu Negri (33) at Table 7
1x Darkheart Sliver
2x Diffusion Sliver
1x Frenetic Sliver
4x Galerider Sliver
4x Manaweft Sliver
4x Predatory Sliver
2x Sentinel Sliver
4x Sinew Sliver
1x Sliver Hivelord
1x Sliver Legion
4x Striking Sliver
4x Syphon Sliver
2x Ancient Ziggurat
4x Cavern of Souls
1x Forest
1x Plains
4x Reflecting Pool
4x Sliver Hive
1x Temple Garden
3x Windswept Heath
Instant (8)
4x Collected Company
4x Path to Exile
2x Choke
3x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Harmonic Sliver
2x Necrotic Sliver
1x Rest in Peace
2x Seal of Primordium
1x Spellskite
2x Stony Silence
This deck is awesome against a lot of decks, mainly aggros/midrange. The main problem is combos, where I try to cover by SB.
1. It can push trough those last points of damage.
2. You can sac a less important sliver to save a lord or Galerider Sliver against burn spells.
3. You can block and sac to prevent lifegain against Wurmcoil Engine or a bogle with lifelink. A huge deal in a race situation.
Use Frenetic Sliver as a sac outlet
[/quote]Use Frenetic Sliver as a sac outlet[/quote]
Seems too random to me. A 50/50 chance you sac a sliver for nothing?
Besides, I want the haste ability.
I also run a singleton Cautery Sliver in my list, and I love it so far.
You can shoot down Grim Lavamancer, or an infect creatue.
Or even a Cranial Plated Inkmoth Nexus or Vault Skirge.
You can also sac your team to push trough the last 4-6 damage.
C Serum Eldrazi
Legacy:
C Eldrazi
C Mud
W Soldier Stompy
R Bread (big red stompy)
WU Spirit Blade
WUG Meat Hooks
WUBGR Blue Dredge
100% agree with you, sedge is a winner
C Serum Eldrazi
Legacy:
C Eldrazi
C Mud
W Soldier Stompy
R Bread (big red stompy)
WU Spirit Blade
WUG Meat Hooks
WUBGR Blue Dredge
C Serum Eldrazi
Legacy:
C Eldrazi
C Mud
W Soldier Stompy
R Bread (big red stompy)
WU Spirit Blade
WUG Meat Hooks
WUBGR Blue Dredge
Bonescythe sliver likes like for boggles or even heavy ago were trading damage gives double strike the advantage. Thos pesky man lands are eaten and poison is overcome. Not the fastes in mana cost, but effective.
Ever thought of using ghostflame sliver for all is dust. Play tested against a tron deck and that was hilarious.
Multiplayer Decks- Memnarch - Animar, Soul of Elements - Zur, the Enchanter - Atraxa, Praetors' Voice - Food Chain Tazri - Teysa Karlov
Modern BUMill and Bant Spirits.
Thank you Xenphire for the signature!
Isn't that what DarkHeart Sliver is for? Sac mode and burn match ups?
I'd rather pull the exact card I need vs. maybe a 25% chance at a good hit of two useful creatures (the number is a guess, but I see Company miss more than hit personally).
This way you can make sure you get Galerider Sliver if he isn't in your opening hand + draw, or respond with a lord to burn, etc.
I think Chord gives you better silver (sliver) bullet options, even given the slightly higher cost (which can be offset with untapped creatures). To me, the tricks the deck can pull off just by adding another sliver to the table are it's biggest strength, and Company just doesn't give you exactly what you need everytime.
[ADD] OK forgot the GGG cost in Chord, might be a little hard to hit for mana.
http://www.cubetutor.com/visualspoiler/20765
What's the best mana base for this deck cause I want to add a godless shrine or temple garden to the net deck mana base. What do I pull in its place.
Multiplayer Decks- Memnarch - Animar, Soul of Elements - Zur, the Enchanter - Atraxa, Praetors' Voice - Food Chain Tazri - Teysa Karlov
Modern BUMill and Bant Spirits.
Thank you Xenphire for the signature!
Multiplayer Decks- Memnarch - Animar, Soul of Elements - Zur, the Enchanter - Atraxa, Praetors' Voice - Food Chain Tazri - Teysa Karlov
Modern BUMill and Bant Spirits.
Thank you Xenphire for the signature!
i have tested it out in a sliver build and found it to be way too slow
As for whether or not Collected company will hit, there is about a 98% chance of hitting 1 sliver with it (assuming your sliver count is 30), not sure what the stats are for 2 slivers are, but its up there.
Trust me, after much testing and playing slivers for over 3 years in modern, coco gives much more gas that chord couldn't, even before Coco was released.
Also it might just be better to run homing sliver instead of chord of calling since it's easier to cast, and can't be countered (the sliver you fetch for also can't be countered with cavern of souls out.
I don't want to discourage you from testing it out because just maaaybe theres a magic combination of either/or that might make the deck crazy. But overall, you can trust that the lists used in bigger tournaments have tested it out themselves.
C Serum Eldrazi
Legacy:
C Eldrazi
C Mud
W Soldier Stompy
R Bread (big red stompy)
WU Spirit Blade
WUG Meat Hooks
WUBGR Blue Dredge
I wouldn't really say that the manabase is based to support green. What I mean is, the manabase is made to support 1 green (for abrupt, coco, manaweft, etc) but not much more than that (since cavern, sliver hive, muta doesn't support green spells but creatures only).
I wanted to ask why you wanted to add godless shrine? is it strictly for sinew sliver support? I would say breeding pool is the least relevant or the 2nd overgrown tomb. If you are planning to add white for path, its gunna be real rough trying to figure out the numbers because you now have to support black, green, white spells instead of just black, green (all the while maintaining mana support to cast slivers)
C Serum Eldrazi
Legacy:
C Eldrazi
C Mud
W Soldier Stompy
R Bread (big red stompy)
WU Spirit Blade
WUG Meat Hooks
WUBGR Blue Dredge
thanks for the advice!
what would you trade out for it? effectively you will be slowing down the deck by increasing it's manacurve unless you side out Coco itself (which doesn't hit it).
C Serum Eldrazi
Legacy:
C Eldrazi
C Mud
W Soldier Stompy
R Bread (big red stompy)
WU Spirit Blade
WUG Meat Hooks
WUBGR Blue Dredge
Homing sliver does look better than chord or collective company, but you get 2 creatures with collective company and removal of lands pockets if bad. Land pockets can kill. Ask any Jund or affinity player.
I kind of like dismember for the control, but play testing has me loosing way to much life for it. Blowing up non-creatures is really important. I tried thoughtsieze and/or IoK in its place and kind of liked it for forcing them to play something or loose it.
Multiplayer Decks- Memnarch - Animar, Soul of Elements - Zur, the Enchanter - Atraxa, Praetors' Voice - Food Chain Tazri - Teysa Karlov
Modern BUMill and Bant Spirits.
Thank you Xenphire for the signature!
i like the coco build (vs chord or homing) because it offers more flexibility with the side board (ie. hitting spellskite, magus of moon, etc)
I tried white for leylines and thought it wasn't worth it (just instead used chalice of the void) for the same matchups
white for path was really tough and clunky all the time. Test it out and see for yourself, often I found you had to decide whether or not to get godless for path or overgrown for Coco, but hitting both was either difficult (not enough fetches/draw) or too much self inflicted damage (fetch + shock on curve).
It's much easier to just hit your 1 overgrown tomb, and forget about needing to fix for the rest of the game than to keep stressing that you don't hit lands to cast path. I can see adding 1 white source to support the white slivers, but beyond that it gets really really tough. let me know if you end up finding a good ratio that works tho!
C Serum Eldrazi
Legacy:
C Eldrazi
C Mud
W Soldier Stompy
R Bread (big red stompy)
WU Spirit Blade
WUG Meat Hooks
WUBGR Blue Dredge