We don't know, but probably not. The commons that are leaked so far haven't mentioned any common slivers at the moment. I wouldn't bet anything on Slivers being in the Core set.
I am not expecting any now that so many have been leaked without any mention of slivers. Also, since we know where the next 3 sets take place there will not be any new slivers in any of those sets either. The next possible place is Core 2020.
I gave it a quick test online, and found out much of what Worldsaverinc is talking about. The 1 drops came out too late and once behind you are done, there is no catching back up. Sure a few matches wont tell all but I feel the deck didnt perform well at all without CoCo.
Please wish me luck guys, on Saturday I will be playing traditional list in Kansas City at SCG regionals.
Yea, that it's what I believed before, and its absolutely true that, without CoCo, the deck grinds worse... but I found that is only "worse", and not "bad" at all!
Since the deck it's faster, the pressure we put on the oponent give us chances in the late game, where drawing only one or two slivers could be lethal. After sideboarding, with Frenetic and Homing, late game even improves.
(I could explain all day how good it feels when a Frenetic sliver saves half of my party against boardwipes).
I played again last sunday on a local league, and I ended 3-1, beating Jund, UW Teferi, and Jeskai Control, losing only to Monoblue Turns due to a bad sideboard choice. I'm now testing Cautery and Bonescythe Sliver, and they have performed very well the few matches I played with them.
The mana basse is a big issue, however, and need some work.
I'm pretty optimistic with my version. I miss the Collected and Necrotic for the fun, but the CoColess version have been better to me.
It's not impossible that I'm biased, so I would appreciate if someone test this version, to see if I'm going in the right direction
I've sleeved my Slivers up again for tonights FNM and a MKM trial tomorrow. I've gone with 3 vials, 4 cocos.
Taking a look at the coco-less slivers, wouldn't you rather play Dismembers or Abrupt Decay mainboard for them?
In fact, I play two dismembers that have been proved worth.
Abrupt Decay is thought due to the doube-color requeriment. I would rather try Fatal Push if I need another removal
I have found a list that made top 8 in a scg qualifier: http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/121878
Probably I will give it a shot. I'm a little tired of the CoColess linearity.
Looks like a solid list, why no life gain slivers? Not much burn in your meta? Also no Sedge package leads me to believe you dont have much control around your meta either. How has Descendant's Path worked for you?
Yea I don’t really see a ton of burn and descendants path is actually mainly a card for control and value decks as a way of outvaluing opponents if i can get one sliver to stick (usually via vial) there is one syphon, and i used to play two but I don’t see tons of burn so i put in a third path. Since there are 30 slivers in the deck, getting a free extra card every other turn really helps in even semi-stalled boards and if you ever get 2 down it’s unbeatable.
I think you are probably going to be gassed or draw the 1 drops later. Humans and Merton can get away with it to some extent due to card quality with humans and cantrips for merfolk. They also provide a measure of disruption that Slivers can't match. Coco is primarily there as a card advantage tool that Slivers desperately i think needs. It's awkward and clunky, but unless you are low fast slivers racing, you will need it.
I think you are probably going to be gassed or draw the 1 drops later. Humans and Merton can get away with it to some extent due to card quality with humans and cantrips for merfolk. They also provide a measure of disruption that Slivers can't match. Coco is primarily there as a card advantage tool that Slivers desperately i think needs. It's awkward and clunky, but unless you are low fast slivers racing, you will need it.
I think that descendants path works better as a card advantage tool, as it gets many more cards over the game. I for one find myself much happier casting a path than a coco, so i may eventually cut the coco.
Also I’m starting to think 6 value cards is a little much for an aggro deck so i may go down to 1-2 cocos and add another lifegain or put the quilled sliver in the main
Round 1, UW Control 2-1. Got off to a fast start in game 1 and it turned out he didnt have a very good hand to resist my horde. Opponent didnt shoe much of his deck so wasnt able to see much but assumed it was a typical UW control. Sideboard: +2 frenetic +1 hivelord, -2 dismember -1 necrotic. Game 2 I was able to get several lords out and at the height I had 23 power on the board, however cryptic command can tap down the team (overpowered). My opponent crypticed 3 times to keep my team tapped and swung with a Lyra dawnbringer for the win. Sideboard, brought the dismembers back in, took out 1 blur and 1 vial. Game 3 opponent was on a mulligan to 6, I managed to drop a diffusion early and keep it alive long enough to hard cast the hivelord on turn 6 and that was all I needed.
Round 2, big zoo 1-2. Game 1 was really good, turned out dropping diffusion turn 2 was really important since my opponent was hampered on mana and couldnt afford to keep pathing and bolting my guys. Pretty much curved out very well in game 1 and won with plenty of life to spare. Sideboard: +2 syphon +2 darkheart -2 dismember -2 necrotic, was going with the idea that I just win in combat. Game 2 started poorly with a mulligan to 5 cards and ended much the same with drawing 5 lands in a row and flooding out horribly. Game 3 was similar but I had a good start, before the turn in the game the life totals were 20-3 in my favor but then the flood began, all I needed was a galerider or a coco and it would have been game but neither came, just more lands for 4 turns in a row.
Round 3, G tron 2-1. Game 1 was a perfect curve out into victory, galerider, predatory, sedge, etc. Sideboard: +2 damping sphere +3 harmonic -3 diffusion -2 dismember. Game 2 mulligan to 5 and lost to turn 3 Karn. Game 3, saw the spheres, both of them... started off vial, sphere, into pressure. My opponent never was able to assemble tron in game 3 so the sphere didnt have much affect but was nice to have.
Round 4, W eldrazi and taxes 1-2. The story of game 1 was getting blown out by a Settle the wreckage, swung for 18 with 5 slivers into a settle and it pretty much ended the game. Didnt have any sideboard ideas for the matchup so shuffled up as was. Game 2 got in the air and played much tighter to play around a settle, but he still managed to settle for 3 sliver deaths. Game 3 was horrible, mulliganed to 6 but kept a suspect 6. Opponent managed to thoughtnot seer to take the coco I was leaning on the turn before I could deploy it. The card disadvantage of mulligans is simply too much to overcome.
Round 5, jeskai control 1-2. Game 1 was really good, I dropped double diffusion to completely stifle his removal, and it didnt take long to take the win. Sideboard: +2 frenetic +1 hivelord. Game 2 was simply not good, no diffusions and that meant no slivers lived long. Game 3 was carbon copy of game 2, no diffusion so no slivers lived long.
So I have been making several changes to my list lately, for this event I brought in 1 copy of urborg, tomb of yawgmoth in main, 1 copy of gut shot in side and a 3rd blur in main. The added blur was very good, thinking that will be permanent. Didnt get to use the gut shot so to be determined. Urborg made 3 appearances during the night, only 1 time was it irrelevant so I am thinking that may stay as well.
I am somewhat pleased that each match went 3, there were no 0-2's. No match was completely a blowout, just need better variance.
Is Sliver hivelord still worth it? I found it hard to cast, and irrelevant in white based matchups.
And, don't you have a lot of color troubles? I found myself putting three more rainbow lands due to good hands with wrong color
The few times I see the Hivelord, he is usually pretty good. Its takes a while to get him out as well too so the opponent has a chance to use up all of their Paths ahead of time. I will admit there have been a few times where I got him out only to be met with an immediate Path, but those times shouldn't discourage our use of him. Strategic deployment of the Hivelord is required to play him correctly. You dont want to throw him out there knowing they have the Path ready. The opportunity I had to cast him last night, I had 2 Caverns forest swamp and a hive that had been spreading seas'd on top of Urborg.
Had another chance to test last night. 16 players 4 rounds.
Sub-par results but in no match was there a glaring deficiency.
Round 1 1-2 vs jeskai thing in the ice/pyromancers ascension. Got game 1 with a timely necrotic taking out his pyromancers ascension. Lost both games 2 and 3 because I failed to find Dismember or warping wail to take out Things.
Round 2 1-2 vs affinity. Game 1 was a blowout, had to mulligan down too far to compete. Game 2 T1 cast vial, T2 cast sinew, vial in galerider, T3 cast sinew, vial in sinew swing 8, T4 swing 16, game. Game 3 looked really bad early, had to mulligan to 6, opponent had a great start, had to strategically block in order to see the turn 4 CoCo, luckily hit it and landed a harmonic and with 2 triggers popped a karn token and a drum but I was out of cards and in top deck mode with a champion on the other side, I suicided my mutavault into it to buy more time, top decked a 2nd harmonic and was only able to pop a couple small support pieces. Eventually Karn drew him a galvanic blast and finished me off.
Round 3 bye.
Round 4 2-1 vs living end. I just knew game 1 was a lost cause I played as hard and fast as I could but he landed a cascade spell as I went to combat on my turn 3. Brought in 8 cards from side 2 wail 2 damping sphere 2 frenetic 2 darkheart. Game 2 dropped a turn 3 frenetic and it was enough especially since he couldnt cascade. Game 3 was very similar to 2 saw frenetic but opponent didnt have cascade. I love frenetic in this matchup, either way the flip goes, you get your creature back either by blink or return from graveyard.
I feel like the changes I've made recently are working just have to have better variance/luck.
Hope you have better luck in next tournaments.
I am curious about your sideboarding strategy. In particular, about what do you take out the deck.
Do you take Sedge Sliver against white-based decks? (I did due to path and Wrath of God)
Why do you take out Aether Vial and Necrotic against control?
To tell the truth, after the last batch of recent changes I am still trying to figure out sideboarding. When I have definite answers I'll be sure to elaborate, but for now I'm just making educated guesses.
Played again Friday, however I feel the results were tainted by extreme fatigue. Went 2-3 Friday, Victories over Goblins and Jeskai and losses to Abzan traverse, GW valuetown and Dredge.
If my opinion is of any value for you, I usually bring out one or two mana slivers and/or Blur Slivers against control;and 1 or 2 Sedge Slivers against very fast decks or white-based control.
I only side Vial out against Jund and Death Shadow, and Necrotic against fast, go-wide decks (like burn and affinity).
Better luck in next tournaments. How is your sensations against dredge? I feel like is not the horrid matchup I thought it will be.
WUBRGCoco/Vial Slivers
WUBRGSlivers of the Void
Pioneer
WUBRGCoco Slivers
Legacy
WUBRGAll in Slivers
Yea, that it's what I believed before, and its absolutely true that, without CoCo, the deck grinds worse... but I found that is only "worse", and not "bad" at all!
Since the deck it's faster, the pressure we put on the oponent give us chances in the late game, where drawing only one or two slivers could be lethal. After sideboarding, with Frenetic and Homing, late game even improves.
(I could explain all day how good it feels when a Frenetic sliver saves half of my party against boardwipes).
I played again last sunday on a local league, and I ended 3-1, beating Jund, UW Teferi, and Jeskai Control, losing only to Monoblue Turns due to a bad sideboard choice. I'm now testing Cautery and Bonescythe Sliver, and they have performed very well the few matches I played with them.
The mana basse is a big issue, however, and need some work.
I'm pretty optimistic with my version. I miss the Collected and Necrotic for the fun, but the CoColess version have been better to me.
It's not impossible that I'm biased, so I would appreciate if someone test this version, to see if I'm going in the right direction
Taking a look at the coco-less slivers, wouldn't you rather play Dismembers or Abrupt Decay mainboard for them?
Affinity, Slivers, TurboFog
Standard
R/B Aggro
In fact, I play two dismembers that have been proved worth.
Abrupt Decay is thought due to the doube-color requeriment. I would rather try Fatal Push if I need another removal
http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=19223&d=321849&f=MO
It's pretty similar to my list.
Thoughts on manabase and side?
WUBRGCoco/Vial Slivers
WUBRGSlivers of the Void
Pioneer
WUBRGCoco Slivers
Legacy
WUBRGAll in Slivers
This is a specific card for 1 matchup.
http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/121878
Probably I will give it a shot. I'm a little tired of the CoColess linearity.
Creatures:30
4 Galerider Sliver
2 Striking Sliver
1 Gemhide Sliver
4 Manaweft Sliver
4 Predatory Sliver
2 Sentinel Sliver
4 Sinew Sliver
2 Blur Sliver
2 Mirror Entity
2 Necrotic Sliver
1 Syphon Sliver
2 Bonescythe Sliver
Spells:10
4 AEther Vial
3 Descendants' Path
3 Collected Company
Lands:20
2 Cavern of Souls
7 Forest
4 Mutavault
4 Sliver Hive
3 Unclaimed Territory
Sideboard:15
1 Quilled Sliver
2 Spellskite
2 Frenetic Sliver
2 Harmonic Sliver
3 Relic of Progenitus
3 Damping Sphere
2 Defense Grid
Edit- I previously put 2 path, 4 coco and it was supposed to be 3-3
I like damping sphere a lot better because it also beats tron.
WUBRGCoco/Vial Slivers
WUBRGSlivers of the Void
Pioneer
WUBRGCoco Slivers
Legacy
WUBRGAll in Slivers
I think that descendants path works better as a card advantage tool, as it gets many more cards over the game. I for one find myself much happier casting a path than a coco, so i may eventually cut the coco.
30+ players
5 rounds
2-3 match record
7-8 game record
Round 1, UW Control 2-1. Got off to a fast start in game 1 and it turned out he didnt have a very good hand to resist my horde. Opponent didnt shoe much of his deck so wasnt able to see much but assumed it was a typical UW control. Sideboard: +2 frenetic +1 hivelord, -2 dismember -1 necrotic. Game 2 I was able to get several lords out and at the height I had 23 power on the board, however cryptic command can tap down the team (overpowered). My opponent crypticed 3 times to keep my team tapped and swung with a Lyra dawnbringer for the win. Sideboard, brought the dismembers back in, took out 1 blur and 1 vial. Game 3 opponent was on a mulligan to 6, I managed to drop a diffusion early and keep it alive long enough to hard cast the hivelord on turn 6 and that was all I needed.
Round 2, big zoo 1-2. Game 1 was really good, turned out dropping diffusion turn 2 was really important since my opponent was hampered on mana and couldnt afford to keep pathing and bolting my guys. Pretty much curved out very well in game 1 and won with plenty of life to spare. Sideboard: +2 syphon +2 darkheart -2 dismember -2 necrotic, was going with the idea that I just win in combat. Game 2 started poorly with a mulligan to 5 cards and ended much the same with drawing 5 lands in a row and flooding out horribly. Game 3 was similar but I had a good start, before the turn in the game the life totals were 20-3 in my favor but then the flood began, all I needed was a galerider or a coco and it would have been game but neither came, just more lands for 4 turns in a row.
Round 3, G tron 2-1. Game 1 was a perfect curve out into victory, galerider, predatory, sedge, etc. Sideboard: +2 damping sphere +3 harmonic -3 diffusion -2 dismember. Game 2 mulligan to 5 and lost to turn 3 Karn. Game 3, saw the spheres, both of them... started off vial, sphere, into pressure. My opponent never was able to assemble tron in game 3 so the sphere didnt have much affect but was nice to have.
Round 4, W eldrazi and taxes 1-2. The story of game 1 was getting blown out by a Settle the wreckage, swung for 18 with 5 slivers into a settle and it pretty much ended the game. Didnt have any sideboard ideas for the matchup so shuffled up as was. Game 2 got in the air and played much tighter to play around a settle, but he still managed to settle for 3 sliver deaths. Game 3 was horrible, mulliganed to 6 but kept a suspect 6. Opponent managed to thoughtnot seer to take the coco I was leaning on the turn before I could deploy it. The card disadvantage of mulligans is simply too much to overcome.
Round 5, jeskai control 1-2. Game 1 was really good, I dropped double diffusion to completely stifle his removal, and it didnt take long to take the win. Sideboard: +2 frenetic +1 hivelord. Game 2 was simply not good, no diffusions and that meant no slivers lived long. Game 3 was carbon copy of game 2, no diffusion so no slivers lived long.
So I have been making several changes to my list lately, for this event I brought in 1 copy of urborg, tomb of yawgmoth in main, 1 copy of gut shot in side and a 3rd blur in main. The added blur was very good, thinking that will be permanent. Didnt get to use the gut shot so to be determined. Urborg made 3 appearances during the night, only 1 time was it irrelevant so I am thinking that may stay as well.
I am somewhat pleased that each match went 3, there were no 0-2's. No match was completely a blowout, just need better variance.
WUBRGCoco/Vial Slivers
WUBRGSlivers of the Void
Pioneer
WUBRGCoco Slivers
Legacy
WUBRGAll in Slivers
And, don't you have a lot of color troubles? I found myself putting three more rainbow lands due to good hands with wrong color
WUBRGCoco/Vial Slivers
WUBRGSlivers of the Void
Pioneer
WUBRGCoco Slivers
Legacy
WUBRGAll in Slivers
Sub-par results but in no match was there a glaring deficiency.
Round 1 1-2 vs jeskai thing in the ice/pyromancers ascension. Got game 1 with a timely necrotic taking out his pyromancers ascension. Lost both games 2 and 3 because I failed to find Dismember or warping wail to take out Things.
Round 2 1-2 vs affinity. Game 1 was a blowout, had to mulligan down too far to compete. Game 2 T1 cast vial, T2 cast sinew, vial in galerider, T3 cast sinew, vial in sinew swing 8, T4 swing 16, game. Game 3 looked really bad early, had to mulligan to 6, opponent had a great start, had to strategically block in order to see the turn 4 CoCo, luckily hit it and landed a harmonic and with 2 triggers popped a karn token and a drum but I was out of cards and in top deck mode with a champion on the other side, I suicided my mutavault into it to buy more time, top decked a 2nd harmonic and was only able to pop a couple small support pieces. Eventually Karn drew him a galvanic blast and finished me off.
Round 3 bye.
Round 4 2-1 vs living end. I just knew game 1 was a lost cause I played as hard and fast as I could but he landed a cascade spell as I went to combat on my turn 3. Brought in 8 cards from side 2 wail 2 damping sphere 2 frenetic 2 darkheart. Game 2 dropped a turn 3 frenetic and it was enough especially since he couldnt cascade. Game 3 was very similar to 2 saw frenetic but opponent didnt have cascade. I love frenetic in this matchup, either way the flip goes, you get your creature back either by blink or return from graveyard.
I feel like the changes I've made recently are working just have to have better variance/luck.
WUBRGCoco/Vial Slivers
WUBRGSlivers of the Void
Pioneer
WUBRGCoco Slivers
Legacy
WUBRGAll in Slivers
I am curious about your sideboarding strategy. In particular, about what do you take out the deck.
Do you take Sedge Sliver against white-based decks? (I did due to path and Wrath of God)
Why do you take out Aether Vial and Necrotic against control?
Played again Friday, however I feel the results were tainted by extreme fatigue. Went 2-3 Friday, Victories over Goblins and Jeskai and losses to Abzan traverse, GW valuetown and Dredge.
WUBRGCoco/Vial Slivers
WUBRGSlivers of the Void
Pioneer
WUBRGCoco Slivers
Legacy
WUBRGAll in Slivers
I only side Vial out against Jund and Death Shadow, and Necrotic against fast, go-wide decks (like burn and affinity).
Better luck in next tournaments. How is your sensations against dredge? I feel like is not the horrid matchup I thought it will be.
WUBRGCoco/Vial Slivers
WUBRGSlivers of the Void
Pioneer
WUBRGCoco Slivers
Legacy
WUBRGAll in Slivers
WUBRGCoco/Vial Slivers
WUBRGSlivers of the Void
Pioneer
WUBRGCoco Slivers
Legacy
WUBRGAll in Slivers