One more thing--Faith's Shield kicks Grapeshot's butt if timed properly (UR Storm has a slight tendency to bounce back the very next turn, though). Brave the Elements cannot do the same.
I think I might be starting to lean more in favor of Faith's Shield, I did notice that it can stop Grapeshot, and I think the Fateful Hour ability can be useful in other situations as well. I think I might put Faith's Shield in over BtE. I will miss my full art Player Rewards Brave the Elements, though.
One more thing: I did manage to get a match in against a casual B/G Elf deck, and Silverblade Paladin was a house. He made my KotWO swing for 4 on turn three and then they swung for 8 on turn 4. I'm not sure how well Paladin would have held up against a more competitive deck, but I did have BtE in hand ready in case of removal, which my opponent didn't play.
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One more thing--Faith's Shield kicks Grapeshot's butt if timed properly (UR Storm has a slight tendency to bounce back the very next turn, though). Brave the Elements cannot do the same.
Hmm, that is a good point. A stormed Grapeshot would finish us (the player) off, but Faith's Shield would give us another turn.
Hello everybody, I am getting back to MTG and want to play modern because this seems like a format that does not change too much so I will not have to spend too much money for updating. I was extremely surprised knights were actually playable especially Nabbydian knight decks. That was a major reason I decided to play them. This is my modded version of his deck on the front page hopefully members can give me some feedback on it. I was wondering why this deck does not have Flagstones of Trokair because it is a super +++ with Knight of the Reliquary.
I'm always keen to try Bloodbraid Elf. Cascade is a crazy mechanic and why not have a build with BBF? I even tried out BBF in my RGW Slivers deck before with moderate success.
It plays nicely, and lightning bolt is a really nice addition. I am not sure where I will put Cavern of Souls when it is released on MTGO, but probably just ditch a couple of Flagstones, and I will try out Silverblade in place of Legionnaire at that time as well. The slot I am most ambivalent about is Elspeth. It sometimes gets the alpha strike in, but most often I would rather it was almost any of my Knights. I might ditch it and lower my curve slightly with a protection spell.
I find that if the Fateful Hour ability of Faith's Shield is active, the game is pretty much over for me. The deck just doesn't have enough to stage a comeback unless it is a close game where my opponent is doing an alpha strike to try to win. When I use Faith's Shield, I treat as if it didn't have Fateful Hour, and even then, it still has its uses.
Hmm, that's hard to say really. We could be in Fateful Hour mode due to various reasons such as opponent's flying creatures/unblockable creatures or burn - but may well have the means to win next turn. But you did pointed out correctly it usually gives us only one more turn afterwards.
One more thing--Faith's Shield kicks Grapeshot's butt if timed properly (UR Storm has a slight tendency to bounce back the very next turn, though). Brave the Elements cannot do the same.
Thanks for this input. We found another use for Faith's Shield! Which can only be good.:)
I think I might be starting to lean more in favor of Faith's Shield, I did notice that it can stop Grapeshot, and I think the Fateful Hour ability can be useful in other situations as well. I think I might put Faith's Shield in over BtE. I will miss my full art Player Rewards Brave the Elements, though.
One more thing: I did manage to get a match in against a casual B/G Elf deck, and Silverblade Paladin was a house. He made my KotWO swing for 4 on turn three and then they swung for 8 on turn 4. I'm not sure how well Paladin would have held up against a more competitive deck, but I did have BtE in hand ready in case of removal, which my opponent didn't play.
Nice art on the BtE Players reward. Anyway do let us know your opinions on them when you get around to trying both of them out.
Silverblade Paladin can put out a very fast clock for Knights. I have decent hopes for him(compared to earlier when I misunderstood the Soulbind mechanic) to succeed. Let's hope that Mirran Crusader won't be missed by playing him.
Hello everybody, I am getting back to MTG and want to play modern because this seems like a format that does not change too much so I will not have to spend too much money for updating. I was extremely surprised knights were actually playable especially Nabbydian knight decks. That was a major reason I decided to play them. This is my modded version of his deck on the front page hopefully members can give me some feedback on it. I was wondering why this deck does not have Flagstones of Trokair because it is a super +++ with Knight of the Reliquary.
Welcome back to Magic and a big welcome to MTGS!
Knights are not tier-one, but it's reasonably competitive and able to hold it's own against quite a number of decks. However as a honest aggro deck without much of tricks(other than combat tricks with Knight Exemplar and Aether Vial) - it does tend to struggle against combo decks etc.
I looked at your decklist - the deck has all the essentials, just that there are 16 spells that are 3cc and above - that's a tad too high. As such, there might be mana curve issues here. I would try to replace some of the higher casting cost spells. You might want to take out Ajani Goldmane for a start.
As you pointed out, Flagstones of Trokair works great with Knight of the Reliquary, but being struck with a few of them during the early game is detrimental to our tempo(the second flagstone which comes into play cannot be tapped for mana), therefore if you really want to play it, 2-3 should be fine.
Temple Garden, we don't really need 4 of them. 2 would be enough. There isn't any spells in the deck that require GG, and KotR and Pridemage can be casted with a single G.
It plays nicely, and lightning bolt is a really nice addition. I am not sure where I will put Cavern of Souls when it is released on MTGO, but probably just ditch a couple of Flagstones, and I will try out Silverblade in place of Legionnaire at that time as well. The slot I am most ambivalent about is Elspeth. It sometimes gets the alpha strike in, but most often I would rather it was almost any of my Knights. I might ditch it and lower my curve slightly with a protection spell.
Good to hear that it's playing well, for me, I'm a little concern on the curve issues and Elspeth relevance here.
I'm also not sure if Mirran Crusader needed to be play as a 4-ofs. The curve is really high, it might be better to cut 2 of the Crusader for a 2 drop knight. How about White Knight for it's pro-B?
No space at all for Lightning Helix (it might be difficult to cast with Thalia around but there's cascade and Helix is a great card)? I might take out Elspeth, Knight-Errant for them.
Good to hear that it's playing well, for me, I'm a little concern on the curve issues and Elspeth relevance here.
I'm just wondering if Elspeth is helping other players, and perhaps I have just been unlucky. If I were to drop it I would probably add one more bolt and path. Helix is hard with Thalia, and does not deal with a turn one Confidant/Delver, so while it is a great card it just is not a great meta choice right now.
If I lowered my 3cmc cards a bit I have almost been tempted to try Hand of Honor, but that is probably out of some love for bushido from back in the day. The issue about lowering the curve that complicates things is the presence of Vial. While we are bloated at 3cmc, that is not a huge issue due to the fact that we can safely stay at 3 counters on Vial. I have found that if your curve is too "perfect" it makes for difficult compromises when deciding where to leave your Vial.
I'm just wondering if Elspeth is helping other players, and perhaps I have just been unlucky.
Elspeth has not helped me. It feels like a "win-more" card. If I'm behind on against an aggro deck, I never cast it, since my opponent can attack with enough creatures to get through to Elspeth despite the initial 1/1 soldier token. It doesn't do anything against combo.
However, Elspeth's second ability is helpful to break a ground war deadlock with another aggro deck. It's good against a control or an otherwise slow deck. I would use Elspeth if there were more control decks in the meta (even against opposing Elspeths).
Most times, Elspeth feels like a 4 CMC spell: put a 1/1 soldier token onto the battlefield. I would rather cast Wrath of God to stop opposing creatures.
I'm just wondering if Elspeth is helping other players, and perhaps I have just been unlucky. If I were to drop it I would probably add one more bolt and path. Helix is hard with Thalia, and does not deal with a turn one Confidant/Delver, so while it is a great card it just is not a great meta choice right now.
If I lowered my 3cmc cards a bit I have almost been tempted to try Hand of Honor, but that is probably out of some love for bushido from back in the day. The issue about lowering the curve that complicates things is the presence of Vial. While we are bloated at 3cmc, that is not a huge issue due to the fact that we can safely stay at 3 counters on Vial. I have found that if your curve is too "perfect" it makes for difficult compromises when deciding where to leave your Vial.
In your BBF Knights, I would actually drop Elspeth. She's too controlish and slow in such an aggro pack list.
Hand of Honor is a very nice card. The art, ability and name is awesome. I almost wanted to build a Samurai deck so I can play 4 of this.:rolleyes:
You brought up a good point with curving for Aether Vial. Many a times I made the unfortunate decision of upping the vial counter to 3, only to keep drawing into 2cc knights later. Well, luck is one thing, on the other hand perhaps this is what prevents Vial from being broken. Anyway, back to topic about the Vial curve, it's a nightmare when there is a clutch of 3cc knights and Oblivion ring in the opening hand and no Vial (even with Vial it's a bad situation). All said, I'm still sticking with setting a prefect curve. I'm an advocate for consistent draws and I find setting a good creature curve ensures I can drop a threat or cast a spell every turn.
Elspeth has not helped me. It feels like a "win-more" card. If I'm behind on against an aggro deck, I never cast it, since my opponent can attack with enough creatures to get through to Elspeth despite the initial 1/1 soldier token. It doesn't do anything against combo.
However, Elspeth's second ability is helpful to break a ground war deadlock with another aggro deck. It's good against a control or an otherwise slow deck. I would use Elspeth if there were more control decks in the meta (even against opposing Elspeths).
Most times, Elspeth feels like a 4 CMC spell: put a 1/1 soldier token onto the battlefield. I would rather cast Wrath of God to stop opposing creatures.
Elspeth might seems like a win more card, however my rationale for playing her is also based on the card advantage perspective. With Knights lacking card draw, Planeswalkers like Elspeth allows us to generate virtual card advantage every turn via a 1/1 token, and by forcing opponents to attack Elspeth - we could set up combat situations which could cost them to lose some creatures.
Elspeth might seems like a win more card, however my rationale for playing her is also based on the card advantage perspective. With Knights lacking card draw, Planeswalkers like Elspeth allows us to generate virtual card advantage every turn via a 1/1 token, and by forcing opponents to attack Elspeth - we could set up combat situations which could cost them to lose some creatures.
I agree that with Aether Vial, you could probably trick your opponent into attacking Elspeth. Personally, in a vacuum, I find Elspeth's token generator ability a little slow.
Elspeth might seems like a win more card, however my rationale for playing her is also based on the card advantage perspective. With Knights lacking card draw, Planeswalkers like Elspeth allows us to generate virtual card advantage every turn via a 1/1 token, and by forcing opponents to attack Elspeth - we could set up combat situations which could cost them to lose some creatures.
Yea, I am not sure I can get behind the "virtual card advantage through diversion principle. I'm not saying the effect does not exist, but I am not sure it is worth paying 4 mana for.
I agree that with Aether Vial, you could probably trick your opponent into attacking Elspeth. Personally, in a vacuum, I find Elspeth's token generator ability a little slow.
With or without Aether Vial, opponent would still be forced to attack Elspeth eventually - that's what planeswalkers in general bring to the table. If Elspeth's token generator ability is faster she would be broken...
Yea, I am not sure I can get behind the "virtual card advantage through diversion principle. I'm not saying the effect does not exist, but I am not sure it is worth paying 4 mana for.
It does seems costly, 4cc to create this situation or scenario. However, isn't that what keep Elspeth balanced? I think it depends if the deck is setup properly to make better use of Elspeth. I tend to use Elspeth as a means to improve the mid-game or step up board position.
Knight fans must be patient. Wizards will print us another good knight card. Then, we can forget about 4 CMC cards.
I'm already happy we have 5 knights from Avacyn Restored.
Below is a link to a short review I made on how the new knights fare in legacy, I suppose it's quite similar to in Modern so I'm not going replicate the post here.
With or without Aether Vial, opponent would still be forced to attack Elspeth eventually - that's what planeswalkers in general bring to the table. If Elspeth's token generator ability is faster she would be broken...
I guess my problem is with other aggro decks. I'm close to losing by the time I can use Elspeth, which is why I took her out to put something faster or Wrath of God (I continue to change the cards in and out)
Below is a link to a short review I made on how the new knights fare in legacy, I suppose it's quite similar to in Modern so I'm not going replicate the post here.
I guess my problem is with other aggro decks. I'm close to losing by the time I can use Elspeth, which is why I took her out to put something faster or Wrath of God (I continue to change the cards in and out)
If that is the case, board wipe is definitely better, as Elspeth will be too clumsy here. You could also take a second look at Knight of the Holy Nimbus - he could slow down your opponent, and survive a Exemplar-less Wrath of God.
My biggest problem with the knight decks are tron based decks. They are so annoying!
Would a full playset of Path to Exile & Despatch helps here? I recall seeing at least 4-6 creature exile spells in your puresteel knight deck. Oblivion Ring could be useful too.
If that is the case, board wipe is definitely better, as Elspeth will be too clumsy here. You could also take a second look at Knight of the Holy Nimbus - he could slow down your opponent, and survive a Exemplar-less Wrath of God.
Wrath of God says, "Destroy all creatures. They can't be regenerated." I believe the "can't" wording takes precedence, so Knight of the Holy Nimbus gets destroyed anyway.
Wrath of God says, "Destroy all creatures. They can't be regenerated." I believed the "can't" wording takes precedence, so Knight of the Holy Nimbus gets destroyed anyway.
Yup, forgot about it. My bad. Must have seen too much of Day of Judgment. Somemore, all the copies of Wrath I have is from Revised edition. Tend to forget about things like this.
Yup, forgot about it. My bad. Must have seen too much of Day of Judgment. Somemore, all the copies of Wrath I have is from Revised edition. Tend to forget about things like this.
We all make mistakes from time to time. No biggie.
It is pretty uncommon, I use it to my advantage in my Rock build that plays Loxodon Hierarch, but there are several decks that can play creatures from the graveyars, and that is about the same thing.
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That is definitely an idea, but I haven't tried it. I used to be a lousy control player, so I'm used to wiping all creatures unconditionally. lol
Lolz I was a bad control player, and I don't think I have made any progress.
Anyway, I'm treating you as my guinea pig here. Honesty I like Knight of the Holy Nimbus, but have never really got down to playing him in my decks. I have been playing the likes of Knight of the White Orchid and Knight of Meadowgrain for the longest time, and have even considered White Knight over KotHN in the past. I did play against KotHN in mirror knight games in Cockatrice, and saw a guy tried him before against Jund, KotHN was quite decent during those matches.
It is pretty uncommon, I use it to my advantage in my Rock build that plays Loxodon Hierarch, but there are several decks that can play creatures from the graveyars, and that is about the same thing.
Day of Judgment is usually going to be a sideboard card for me, and together with some graveyard hate spells I think we should have a good chance against them.
Are there any other ways to handle these decks other than the abovementioned?
Day of judgment would be good against living end or dredge decks, on top of the usual graveyard hate cards that is played.
Yeah, it would be beneficial to play both type of spells. And they are probably stuffs we have in the sideboard in the first place so we don't need to change much.
Anyway, I'm treating you as my guinea pig here. Honesty I like Knight of the Holy Nimbus, but have never really got down to playing him in my decks. I have been playing the likes of Knight of the White Orchid and Knight of Meadowgrain for the longest time, and have even considered White Knight over KotHN in the past. I did play against KotHN in mirror knight games in Cockatrice, and saw a guy tried him before against Jund, KotHN was quite decent during those matches.
I need to find room for Knight of the Holy Nimbus (KofHN) in a future game. I can remove Thalia x2 from my deck, but I don't really have room for the other 2 KotHN. I have to look at this later. Don't expect me to post any feedback on this configuration for a while.
I need to find room for Knight of the Holy Nimbus (KofHN) in a future game. I can remove Thalia x2 from my deck, but I don't really have room for the other 2 KotHN. I have to look at this later. Don't expect me to post any feedback on this configuration for a while.
lolz, no problem. I still think you will probably end up testing on KotHN before me, anyway, my focus at the moment is on Esper Hakkon Knights (http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=8132272&postcount=423) which I'll be sleeving up by next week so I can playtest it in 2 weeks time. I will be having an overnight Modern session with my friends so hopefully it be good enough to justify adding into the primer(like the Puresteel Knights decklist).
No, not against Karn or Mindslaver.
Maybe I should add Oblivion Ring to the main board. But I don't know for what.
I don't know. Seems like there is no decent solution here.
They usually play Mindslaver when they can activate them on the same turn so I'm not sure what Oblivion Ring brings to such a matchup. I also never liked O'ring on Karn, trying to kill him with creatures is still the best way out IMO. That's when Aether Vial can make a difference here - in making the opponent's get their calculations wrong towards protecting Karn.
If we can't stop Mindslaver from controlling our turn, we can try to stop them from recycling Mindslaver via Academy Ruins by Tectonic Edge, Knight of the Reliquary gives us better consistency in getting Tectonic Edge into play for this purposes. At least it stops them from winning with infinite turns.
One more thing: I did manage to get a match in against a casual B/G Elf deck, and Silverblade Paladin was a house. He made my KotWO swing for 4 on turn three and then they swung for 8 on turn 4. I'm not sure how well Paladin would have held up against a more competitive deck, but I did have BtE in hand ready in case of removal, which my opponent didn't play.
In Modern:
:symu::symw::symr: Holy Rollers (Geist Tempo)
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Hmm, that is a good point. A stormed Grapeshot would finish us (the player) off, but Faith's Shield would give us another turn.
4 Knight Exemplar
4 Knight of Meadowgrain
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Knight of the White Orchid
3 Silverblade Paladin
2 Qasali Pridemage
4 Student of Warfare
2 Oblivion Ring
4 Path to Exile
Artifacts [7]
4 AEther Vial
2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Ajani Goldmane
Lands [22]
4 Plains
2 Forest
4 Flagstones of Trokair
4 Marsh Flats
3 Horizon Canopy
1 Sejiri Steppe
4 Temple Garden
Hello everybody, I am getting back to MTG and want to play modern because this seems like a format that does not change too much so I will not have to spend too much money for updating. I was extremely surprised knights were actually playable especially Nabbydian knight decks. That was a major reason I decided to play them. This is my modded version of his deck on the front page hopefully members can give me some feedback on it. I was wondering why this deck does not have Flagstones of Trokair because it is a super +++ with Knight of the Reliquary.
4 Student of Warfare
4 Knight Exemplar
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Knight of the Meadowgrain
4 Mirran Crusader
4 Bloodbraid Elf
3 Skyknight Legionnaire
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Path to Exile
2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
Land:
4 Forest
1 Mountain
3 Plains
4 Flagstones of Trokair
4 Arid Mesa
2 Marsh Flats
3 Sacred Foundry
1 Temple Garden
It plays nicely, and lightning bolt is a really nice addition. I am not sure where I will put Cavern of Souls when it is released on MTGO, but probably just ditch a couple of Flagstones, and I will try out Silverblade in place of Legionnaire at that time as well. The slot I am most ambivalent about is Elspeth. It sometimes gets the alpha strike in, but most often I would rather it was almost any of my Knights. I might ditch it and lower my curve slightly with a protection spell.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
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Hmm, that's hard to say really. We could be in Fateful Hour mode due to various reasons such as opponent's flying creatures/unblockable creatures or burn - but may well have the means to win next turn. But you did pointed out correctly it usually gives us only one more turn afterwards.
Thanks for this input. We found another use for Faith's Shield! Which can only be good.:)
I presume it can stop Tendrils of Agony as well? With Leyline of Sanctity and Faith's Shield could we increase our odds against Storm combo?
Nice art on the BtE Players reward. Anyway do let us know your opinions on them when you get around to trying both of them out.
Silverblade Paladin can put out a very fast clock for Knights. I have decent hopes for him(compared to earlier when I misunderstood the Soulbind mechanic) to succeed. Let's hope that Mirran Crusader won't be missed by playing him.
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[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
Welcome back to Magic and a big welcome to MTGS!
Knights are not tier-one, but it's reasonably competitive and able to hold it's own against quite a number of decks. However as a honest aggro deck without much of tricks(other than combat tricks with Knight Exemplar and Aether Vial) - it does tend to struggle against combo decks etc.
I looked at your decklist - the deck has all the essentials, just that there are 16 spells that are 3cc and above - that's a tad too high. As such, there might be mana curve issues here. I would try to replace some of the higher casting cost spells. You might want to take out Ajani Goldmane for a start.
As you pointed out, Flagstones of Trokair works great with Knight of the Reliquary, but being struck with a few of them during the early game is detrimental to our tempo(the second flagstone which comes into play cannot be tapped for mana), therefore if you really want to play it, 2-3 should be fine.
Temple Garden, we don't really need 4 of them. 2 would be enough. There isn't any spells in the deck that require GG, and KotR and Pridemage can be casted with a single G.
Good to hear that it's playing well, for me, I'm a little concern on the curve issues and Elspeth relevance here.
I'm also not sure if Mirran Crusader needed to be play as a 4-ofs. The curve is really high, it might be better to cut 2 of the Crusader for a 2 drop knight. How about White Knight for it's pro-B?
No space at all for Lightning Helix (it might be difficult to cast with Thalia around but there's cascade and Helix is a great card)? I might take out Elspeth, Knight-Errant for them.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
If I lowered my 3cmc cards a bit I have almost been tempted to try Hand of Honor, but that is probably out of some love for bushido from back in the day. The issue about lowering the curve that complicates things is the presence of Vial. While we are bloated at 3cmc, that is not a huge issue due to the fact that we can safely stay at 3 counters on Vial. I have found that if your curve is too "perfect" it makes for difficult compromises when deciding where to leave your Vial.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
Elspeth has not helped me. It feels like a "win-more" card. If I'm behind on against an aggro deck, I never cast it, since my opponent can attack with enough creatures to get through to Elspeth despite the initial 1/1 soldier token. It doesn't do anything against combo.
However, Elspeth's second ability is helpful to break a ground war deadlock with another aggro deck. It's good against a control or an otherwise slow deck. I would use Elspeth if there were more control decks in the meta (even against opposing Elspeths).
Most times, Elspeth feels like a 4 CMC spell: put a 1/1 soldier token onto the battlefield. I would rather cast Wrath of God to stop opposing creatures.
In your BBF Knights, I would actually drop Elspeth. She's too controlish and slow in such an aggro pack list.
Hand of Honor is a very nice card. The art, ability and name is awesome. I almost wanted to build a Samurai deck so I can play 4 of this.:rolleyes:
You brought up a good point with curving for Aether Vial. Many a times I made the unfortunate decision of upping the vial counter to 3, only to keep drawing into 2cc knights later. Well, luck is one thing, on the other hand perhaps this is what prevents Vial from being broken. Anyway, back to topic about the Vial curve, it's a nightmare when there is a clutch of 3cc knights and Oblivion ring in the opening hand and no Vial (even with Vial it's a bad situation). All said, I'm still sticking with setting a prefect curve. I'm an advocate for consistent draws and I find setting a good creature curve ensures I can drop a threat or cast a spell every turn.
Elspeth might seems like a win more card, however my rationale for playing her is also based on the card advantage perspective. With Knights lacking card draw, Planeswalkers like Elspeth allows us to generate virtual card advantage every turn via a 1/1 token, and by forcing opponents to attack Elspeth - we could set up combat situations which could cost them to lose some creatures.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
I agree that with Aether Vial, you could probably trick your opponent into attacking Elspeth. Personally, in a vacuum, I find Elspeth's token generator ability a little slow.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
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PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
With or without Aether Vial, opponent would still be forced to attack Elspeth eventually - that's what planeswalkers in general bring to the table. If Elspeth's token generator ability is faster she would be broken...
It does seems costly, 4cc to create this situation or scenario. However, isn't that what keep Elspeth balanced? I think it depends if the deck is setup properly to make better use of Elspeth. I tend to use Elspeth as a means to improve the mid-game or step up board position.
I'm already happy we have 5 knights from Avacyn Restored.
Below is a link to a short review I made on how the new knights fare in legacy, I suppose it's quite similar to in Modern so I'm not going replicate the post here.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=8377075&postcount=202
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
I guess my problem is with other aggro decks. I'm close to losing by the time I can use Elspeth, which is why I took her out to put something faster or Wrath of God (I continue to change the cards in and out)
The card links to three of the cards include the bold tag in the names, so it is messing up the search. Please correct.
If that is the case, board wipe is definitely better, as Elspeth will be too clumsy here. You could also take a second look at Knight of the Holy Nimbus - he could slow down your opponent, and survive a Exemplar-less Wrath of God.
No problem! Corrected!
Would a full playset of Path to Exile & Despatch helps here? I recall seeing at least 4-6 creature exile spells in your puresteel knight deck. Oblivion Ring could be useful too.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
Wrath of God says, "Destroy all creatures. They can't be regenerated." I believe the "can't" wording takes precedence, so Knight of the Holy Nimbus gets destroyed anyway.
Yup, forgot about it. My bad. Must have seen too much of Day of Judgment. Somemore, all the copies of Wrath I have is from Revised edition. Tend to forget about things like this.
How about playing Day of Judgment over Wrath of God if you are playing 4x Knight of the Holy Nimbus? Other than Thrun, the Last Troll, I can't recall other creatures with regeneration which is frequently seen in Modern.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
We all make mistakes from time to time. No biggie.
That is definitely an idea, but I haven't tried it. I used to be a lousy control player, so I'm used to wiping all creatures unconditionally. lol
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
Lolz I was a bad control player, and I don't think I have made any progress.
Anyway, I'm treating you as my guinea pig here. Honesty I like Knight of the Holy Nimbus, but have never really got down to playing him in my decks. I have been playing the likes of Knight of the White Orchid and Knight of Meadowgrain for the longest time, and have even considered White Knight over KotHN in the past. I did play against KotHN in mirror knight games in Cockatrice, and saw a guy tried him before against Jund, KotHN was quite decent during those matches.
Day of Judgment is usually going to be a sideboard card for me, and together with some graveyard hate spells I think we should have a good chance against them.
Are there any other ways to handle these decks other than the abovementioned?
Yeah, it would be beneficial to play both type of spells. And they are probably stuffs we have in the sideboard in the first place so we don't need to change much.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
I need to find room for Knight of the Holy Nimbus (KofHN) in a future game. I can remove Thalia x2 from my deck, but I don't really have room for the other 2 KotHN. I have to look at this later. Don't expect me to post any feedback on this configuration for a while.
lolz, no problem. I still think you will probably end up testing on KotHN before me, anyway, my focus at the moment is on Esper Hakkon Knights (http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=8132272&postcount=423) which I'll be sleeving up by next week so I can playtest it in 2 weeks time. I will be having an overnight Modern session with my friends so hopefully it be good enough to justify adding into the primer(like the Puresteel Knights decklist).
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
I don't know. Seems like there is no decent solution here.
They usually play Mindslaver when they can activate them on the same turn so I'm not sure what Oblivion Ring brings to such a matchup. I also never liked O'ring on Karn, trying to kill him with creatures is still the best way out IMO. That's when Aether Vial can make a difference here - in making the opponent's get their calculations wrong towards protecting Karn.
If we can't stop Mindslaver from controlling our turn, we can try to stop them from recycling Mindslaver via Academy Ruins by Tectonic Edge, Knight of the Reliquary gives us better consistency in getting Tectonic Edge into play for this purposes. At least it stops them from winning with infinite turns.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W